257 Roberts: The Second Chance Cartridge
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- Опубліковано 10 жов 2022
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years, I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, become an integral part of our ecosystem, and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see and survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish, or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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Good review, Ron. I am a dedicated .257 Roberts aficionado (nut), who has done much reloading, chronographing, and accuracy testing with it. My fond interest in the round was fed by my late friend who lived near, and was very close to Ned Roberts, and who spent much time shooting with him on his Goffstown, NH farm. Ted told me that he would stand beside Ned's 200 yard target and point to the bullet holes for him when they came slamming in with a crack!!! It was many years later when he realized how risky that was in the day when mid air bullet failures very frequently occurred. Ned made many of his own bullets.
I was extremely fortunate to acquire a Winchester Model 70 Featherweight 2011 Shot Show Special Edition series. I'll tell you about that rifle's accuracy.
My dad's strong Ruger No. 1 was capable of stunning 25-06 velocities with every bullet weight we put through it, though it suffered from typical No. 1-itus that was true of all the beautiful No. 1 rifles I played with. It was adequately accurate, but it just struggled to get an occasional sub-MOA group, with 1.5 MOA being typical.
My US manufactured FN made Model 70 is quite another story! It seems like it can't shoot worse than MOA, no matter what I feed it, and I have established loads with 75 grain through every bullet weight up to 120 grain that consistently hold five shot groups under 1/2 MOA. The accuracy of the Sierra 100 grain Match King is simply jaw dropping in the .3s or less with that incredibly accurate rifle.
I can offer some conclusions that I've reached from the nearly 35 years of playing with it that do dovetail with some of your comments. As a veteran accuracy handloader of over 50 years with more calibers than I can recall, I can tell you that it's possibly THE most accurate round I have ever worked with, across the board with all bullet weights, bar none.
Remington made the round way too short, and frustrated handloaders with a short action. My Winchester Model 70 is correctly paired with a long action that allows me to seat the overall length out where it belongs, and frees up case capacity with longer bullets. Properly loaded with a long action seating, it actually beats Ackley published velocities. As you know, it takes up to 20 percent more powder to realize a mere 10 percent of velocity, which Ackley's didn't give it.
I've weighed and cross sectioned both +P and standard cases. Despite the various claims, they are identical, with identical capacity. Only the headstamp is different. The Mauser case is very strong, as with all its brethren.
As I made mention of in my UA-cam video, the Roberts was terribly mismanaged by Remington, for whatever reason. It had so much more potential that was never commercially given it. On top of bad chamberings and short overall length, it was so very commonly offered with only round nose bullets.
I first learned of the Bob from your channel, and I've wanted one ever since. Now, I have the opportunity to build one. You mentioned bad chamberings; I have a colleague who's currently working with a long action (Rem 700) and a Shaw barrel, and he's having an issue where the cartridge angles on chambering and it gouged the bullet near the tip. I plan to build a long action (also a Remington 700) Roberts as well. For bullets from 75 to 120 grain, would you suggest chambering to a 3" overall length?
Remington had SAAMI hamstring the BOB by giving it an enemiac chamber pressure rating, so as not to compete with Remington's 25-06. A properly loaded BOB is a better performing, sweeter shooting round than the 25-06!
@@nomennescio6209 Yes, 3" is where it should be.
I have 3 rifles in .257 Roberts. An older Remington 700 that I hunt with,a Winchester model 70 featherweight like yours and a Remington CDL which has never been shot. Also I have not personally shot the Winchester. I did not realize the Winchester has the longer action. I have a soft spot for the .257 because that’s what my Dad and Uncle used for deer and Jackrabbits in the ‘50s and ‘60s. Dad wrote to Jack O’Conner back in the day and asked him recommendations for handloads. I still have Jack’s signed reply letter. Unfortunately, Dad fell for .243 craze and traded his .257 for one. Always said that was a mistake and wished he had it back.
Sounds like I better get a scope on my Winchester and see what it will do!!!
I became a fan of the .257 Roberts after watching your video. I purchased a Ruger M77 Mark 2 chambered in it. What a wonderful rifle!
.257 Roberts is a good cartridge for deer. Had a friend kill 25 whitetails with the first and only rifle that he owned, a .257 Roberts. I was with Him when He killed # 25. He said "25 for 25 caliber, I'm done." He had to quit hunting for health reasons. RIP Wendall.🙂
Does any company still have a rifle in that caliber,I’ve heard nothing but good about that cartridge over the years
@@Alien300Blackout Try Kimber or Ruger, that should get you started.🙂
@@58harwood In the military we found the humble .223 quiet effective against the enemy, I guess that's a woman's cartridge also.
@@kevinknight470 actually the “Military” uses 5.56, not .223! And they’ve decided to move on and are changing/upgrading calibers too!
It really should be more popular. Hard to believe it will make a comeback, with the 6s and 6.5s so popular. Thanks for sharing your story.
My granddad built all his children rifles based on military Mauser surplus actions. Being the son of his only daughter she gave me the 257 Rob. he built her from a 1909 Argentine Mauser. It’s done a fine job on Kansas deer so far! Thanks for the great content Ron.
That's a classy rifle!
You are a lucky guy to get that handed down.Great story.Thanks for sharing it.
I built a 257 BOB on a 1909 Argentine Mauser too.I shot outthe barrel ,And then rechambered it to a 308 Win and shot it in F-Class competition.When I went to another range and had to qualify at 1000yards they looked at my rifle and wondered what and odd looking rifle I had.I had cut off the handle andnwelded on a different one.When I got finished all the guys wanted to check itout.Its a cool rifle,
@@TexasTrained you did what to the “handle”
@@lebthot5787 Cut and rewelded
man that is some great family history! I love individual history stories like that. Very cool. An heirloom to be treasured and the history preserved!
My grandfather used a Remington pump-action in .257 Roberts to kill every deer he got since the 1960s. He bought five boxes of shells in 117gr round nose when he got it and that's all he ever used. I offered to work up some more modern spire-point loads for it and he said there was no reason to. He's gone now, but this episode triggered some good memories of him. Thanks!
By far the best shot I've ever made was on a skunk with a .257 Roberts. 450 yards offhand. I probably wouldn't even be able to see that skunk these days.
👍 Did you smell him after you hit him that far away?
As a younger guy (late 20s) I discovered a Ruger M77 ultralite in this Roberts round in the Cabelas Gun Library I was running at the time. After a great deal of research I picked it up and have taken several animals with it and can say light recoil and less boom and ear ringing than other rifles Ive shot in the past. I hunt in East Texas which is close in shooting and throw 100 grain Nosler Partitions and absolutely love it!
722 and 257 are like peanut butter and jelly. Perfect! Thanks Ron for all the work making this
Man, if I could get a Savage 99 in .257 Roberts....life would be complete.
Back in the 1950s my father and his best friend bought M70 featherweights in .257 Roberts for woodchucks, deer, and pronghorns. Both were chambered by the same gunsmith on the same day, per Winchester. The chambers were so exact that they could interchange neck sized brass between the two guns. 1 moa with iron sights. In the early 1970s my dad offered his rifle to me. I declined because I lived in San Francisco at the time and had no need for a rifle. Sadly he sold it before I moved to Colorado in 1973. I sure wish I had today so I could just hold it like he did so many times.
First rifle was a 257 Roberts,,,,,deer, antelope and elk all taken with it,,,easy to shoot, so it was easy to put the bullet where it needed too be,,,fantastic cartridge
I have a .244 (6 mm) Remington semi auto
25 caliber is the ultimate medium size game rifle and gives up nothing to the 6mms
25 caliber is the ultimate medium size game rifle and gives up nothing to the 6mms
And less wear and tear on my 257 weatherby.berrel and that being said this is the only way I could have all of them is by reloading.
Something really neat about watching your videos (maybe as opposed to just listening to your podcasts) is that you can SEE that you're not referencing any notes when you list off a half-dozen ancient cartridge types as examples, entirely from memory. Love your videos. Your knowledge is such a treasure.
Great story of a truly great cartridge. Gonna keep my eyes open for a bargain .257 Bob 👍 Why not ?
Yes,get a 257 Roberts
Truly a proven cartridge in all aspects. The most impressive shot I ever witnessed was with the 257 Bob. 900 yards on a coyote shot by a friend of my dad's. Maybe more the capability of the shooter, luck or Devine intervention but that will always stick with me.
I've been voting for this one! Can't wait!
Me too! Been voting for it every time.
I’ve always wanted a 257 Roberts and a 25/06 also. One of these days when I get tired of getting my brains kicked loose with the dangerous game rifles I’ve been hooked on, I’ll come back to my senses and get me a good medium bore lol.
I love the way you celebrate both new and old cartridges alike. It is nice to hear someone touting the oldies!
I feel like I've voted for this video to happen 10 times! Glad to finally see it!
I used to deer hunt with an older man who LOVED his .257 Roberts. And what a shot he was with it. Running deer, long distance deer, running long distance deer... He just did not miss.
The heavy marketing of the .243 as a good all rounder for both varmint and deer is what made it a success. Add to that the amount of manufacturers of .243 ammo (often on special) and rifle makers who include this cartridge today. The 257 Bob is however today a classic (and extremely popular in the AI version) that traditionalists will take this round over any 6mm or 6.5mm hands down. Thanks for sharing Ron!
.257 Roberts is a dandy cartridge, holds its own among the many "reinventing-the-wheel" cartridges of today. Bob Milek, a gunwriter from yesteryear helped me to fall in love with the Roberts cartridge. I bought a Winchester Mod 70 Featherweight that was possibly the best true deer rifle I have ever owned. Milek went on to say it was just at home on varmints with handloads as it is with deer in factory loads, plus you can coax more as deer rifle with handloads for that. My experience with handloads in that caliber proved the truth of his words, and it was one of my favorites to handload for... but then, I think the .280 Remington trumps the .270 Winchester, mainly because of bullet selection and handloads, so you kind of see where my tastes gravitate toward 😂😂
I own several hunting rifles, well maybe more than several. From 223 to 45-70 with few gaps, they all have a place. The first rifle that I bought when I moved from SoDak to Wyo.in 1981 was a Ruger 77 in 257 Roberts. I have shot pasture poodles, deer, and a grundle of speed goats with that rifle. I have used others but it is my favorite. There are many fine calibers to choose from, even the 270 win. ( which I feel about in the same way as you feel about the 308 Content! But I haven't found anything that my "Bob" and my remaining stock of Nosler 120 grain solid base bullets weren't capable of putting to earth. Thanks from one old Dakota kid to another for the continued great content!
The 15 degree shoulder, low popularity of 25 Cal and proximity to the .243 and 6.5 will never allow it to be popular again. Collectors and Old Timers will always love it. Personally for nostalgia I'd rather have rifle labeled 250-3000!
I have a 1957 Savage 99EG 250-3000 with the 24 inch barrel and its original K-4 Weaver. Of course it's the old 1/14 twist, but it shoots under one inch groups at 100 yards with Remington 100 grain Core-Lokt factory ammo. There's a load for that 24 inch barreled 99 in the Hornady manual fourth edition, volume one using Reloader 15 that says it will push the 100 grain 250-3000 to 3000 fps. I haven't tried it yet, but I'm going to.
I love the .257 Roberts, A truly great cartridge. I have a Ruger M77 MKII in .257 Roberts and .25-06. I also have a 1984 addition Remington 700 Classic in .250 Savage. I love the quarter bore rifles. They are all great rifles. The .250 Savage in Remington 700. Will shoot 100 grain ballistic tips into one ragged hole at 100 yds. Most accurate rifle I own.
Ron, all the guys my age in my area of Texas know about the 257. Many use this round for general purpose hunting of hogs and deer and varmints. You are correct about the 243, 6mm, 257 being darn near the same. They are. Our deer down here are not monsters. If you handload, all three cartridges will perform even better. I have a 6mm that shoots tiny groups that really delivers game. I gave my nephew a pawn store 257 I refurbished over 30yrs ago. He brings home the game every time. Lots of old cartridges out there that may not be made any longer, but should. They still work fine.
WOW! That’s the first time I’ve heard anyone use the term “point blank” correctly. Thank you Sir!
Good job on the 257 Bob. It has had a small resurgence, Kimber makes a few rifles for it and Ruger has a distributor special. Remington is supposed to put ammunition back into its catalog eventually, Winchester still catalogs it, so does Hornady, though Federal no longer does. There is a host of the smaller ammunition companies offering it. I personally think the 257 Roberts will be around for a while. Of course, now that I've said that...
Hope more factory 257bob ammo increases because that gives me more sources for 6mmrem and 6.5swede
Don't forget, 7mm Mauser or 275 Rigby (same thing, Rigby was not going to put Mauser on their rifles) is the parent case.
The .257 Roberts is my father-in-law's favorite deer cartridge. For many years he hunted with a custom rifle built on an old Mauser action. Many years ago he bought a new Ruger M77 Mark 2. He is still hunting with that rifle. I doubt he would ever use any other caliber. He does handload. I recently purchased a beautiful used Ruger M77 in 6mm Remington. I have the components to handload and will probably have to. 6mm Rem ammo just isn't out there.
257 Roberts is an outstanding cartridge long barrel life good accuracy as with its parent cartridge the 7x57 Mauser. Ackley improved both turning fine cartridges into better performers.
My first (and current) deer rifle is a .257 Roberts. Great round when you can find the ammo!
Thanks so much for finally addressing this one Ron. Loves me some .257 Roberts.
Thanks for the reload on the. 257! I have an old box of Remington 257 Roberts ammunition. It is 117 grain round nose core lokt. My guess is that Remington was using the same bullet that they made for the .25 Remington cartridge. Remington has a habit of bringing out a cartridge and just expecting the public to discover it on their own. That doesn't always work. When Winchester brought out the .243, they wrapped it up in some eye candy. Namely the model 70 featherweight. The .244 and .257 were chambered in the model 722. Not so pretty. Dad and grandpa thought the .257 was plenty of medicine for deer, even with anemic factory loads as do I. Thanks again. Cheers!
I love my 257 Roberts, I named it Ole Bob.
Well done. Couldn't agree more. Thanks
Great round
My son was about 13 and when he wanted to go deer hunting (actually shoot a deer), I had to think about a cartridge/rifle that wouldn’t have that kick like my 7mm Remington Magnum. My brother had a 257 Roberts in Ruger Hawkeye. Nice smaller rifle and the 257 Roberts had a good variety of bullet weights from Hornady. That first year he loaned us his rifle and then later I found one at Cabelas and picked it up for my son. Turned out to be a really nice round and rifle for my son or myself (not giving up my 7mm). It has been good to get my son’s first Buck and 10 seconds later he took a Doe the Buck was chasing (he did have a permit for two deer as a youth permit). Real happy with the round, just not very common chambering, however you can find them if you shop. Nice to see someone mentioning the round.
Picked up my NULA in 257 AI just before Melvin sold out. Super lightweight and accurate
I just got 30 cases in a batch of brass and had been wanting more info on it. Great timing thank you
I've got a Model 70 Featherweight in.257 Roberts. Mounted a Leopold compact 3X9 scope on it and it's a beautifully balanced little deer rifle. The 7x57 Mauser and all it's derivatives have always been and always will be excellent rounds.
Way Back When the Ruger m-77 UL was chambered for the BOB. 20-inch barrel, 6 pounds, sliding tang safety. About the best woods rifle for whitetails ever made commercially.
Recently bought a Remington 722 in 257 Roberts at a gun show from a gentlemen walking around, for $350, w/70 rounds of ammo and a bushnell scope. Gun is pristine. Planning on hunting deer with it this fall.
I have a pre64 model 70 in 257 rbts. It’s a very handy light weight rifle that just about everyone that’s ever shot it has fallen I love with.
I have a Browning BLR in .257 Roberts. Sweet handling deer rifle.
My one and only experience with the 257 Roberts was fantastic. Never will forget it. Wanted one ever since.
Another great video Ronald!
I've been shooting and handloading 257 Roberts since the 1970s and just bought a brand new old stock Wichester model 70 in 257 Robert's. With the new +P powder tables the 6mm Rem, 243 Wimchester And the 2506 don't have anything to brag about.
I purchased a Ruger M77 in .257 Roberts last fall and finally got it sighted in this year. I’m looking forward to using it this season as well as educating myself further on the cartridge’s history. Thanks for the video.
The gentlemen's rifle., the 257 Roberts, efficient, and more accurate than the 25-06 in my exp. Usually just a 100 fps. behind the 25-06., Does really well with the 110 Nosler. at 3000 fps. Great Show. Update 11 months have gone by, the 257 Roberts is more accurate. I am just liking it more these days, both great cartridge, but the 257 Roberts is becoming a fav. or mine.
I'll take the 25-06 any time.
@@barrymantei7795 I think you said it best, it is a personal choice, I own both, the 257 Roberts uses less powder, less recoil and longer barrel life...BUT, if you get a 25-06 with a long enough barrel, ..etc. The A.I. versions of both are quite impressive. Hunting distance with light recoil, hard to beat any of the "06" family.
Great information. My interest in the 257 Roberts grew out of my inheriting my grandma's old model 70.
Oh yeah!!! Been waiting on this one!
Love my .257 Roberts. I've taken most of my deer with my .257 Roberts. I've gone bigger as I've gotten older, shoot my 7mm weatherby and 300 win mag more now but I have a soft spot for my .257, great cartridge for deer, 120 gr nosler partition shoots best out of my rifle.
Have hunted with a Ruger M77 in .250 Savage for thirty years. This year I put together a .257 Roberts for my T/C Encore, and looking forward to putting it to work starting this week here in the TX whitetail season.
Was lucky 5 yrs ago when I scored a steal of a Win Model 70 in 257 Roberts on a used rack in a gunshop. What a great little setup. Glad I reload b/c I never see factory ammo for it. Plan on taking it out west one day!
Great video Ron 👍🏻 25’s have never been popular here in Sweden due to the overwhelming popularity of the 6,5 mm / .264” over here. Still I have an unused reamer in 250 Savage Ackley Improved that I ordered about 10 years ago for “the ultimate roe deer rifle” 😁 I wanted blue tips on the Ballistic Tips instead of brown ones you find on the 6,5mm Ballistic Tips (another conspiracy there to make people shy away from the 6,5mm calibers 😂).
For me, the main connection to the 257 Bob is the fact that Jack O’Connors wife Eleanor used it quite extensively 👍🏻
I wish I could find a Ruger #1 chambered in 257 Roberts , I’d definitely break out the Cash.
Great history lesson on a great cartridge. I'm sure there are some fine factory loadings but handloading really makes this cartridge shine. Easy on the shoulder, easy to reload, and easy to bring out the inherent accuracy. Have been loading and shooting whitetails with mine for 30 years now and still am in awe at how effective it is. Choosing the proper bullet is vital though. Have experimented with most hunting bullets and there are major differences in effectiveness. You will never go wrong with a 115 or 129 grain Nosler Partition.
Partitions are very good bullets, no question. I have a 308 that fires a 150gr like the cat's meow. I have a 6.5x55 that hates them. Depends upon the gun. As a cartridge, the 257 is absolutely fantastic on deer. I gave a Win 70XRT I found in a pawn shop to a nephew in 1989. It had bounced around a lot in a pickup. After refinishing the stock and re-blueing, I put a Leupold scope on it and it was good. That gun is a real tack driver. Aim well and the deer are done, period. He still uses that gun today.
I know a 16 year old girl that loves to deer hunt with the 257 roberts and eagerly chooses it over other calibers including the 243 win. It’s a neat little cartridge for sure.
129 grain? Or did you mean 120? 🤔
@@jacktrout5807 Good eye on catching that, yes 120 grain is what I meant. I should proofread better before I submit, thanks.
@@keithfisher9047 no your good. I'm just new to 25 cal and just ordered 300 120 grain nosler partitions . I was just clarifying there is no 129 grain. I know berger makes some into the 130s
Thanks Ron Lots of Info on The 257 Robert’s 😀😳😊
You didn't mention the 257 Weatherby, which is a great accompanying cartridge to the Roberts. I have both. Have had 2 Ruger 77 and now a Win M70 in 257Roberts. Stopped every deer I shot with it over the last 20 years or so. I think it's more versatile than the 243 because you can shoot bullets up to the 120g and down to 70g, if you want or need the heavier bullet. The Rugers and Winchester are long actions so not hindered by overall cartridge length like the Remingtons that used short actions. Handloading does bring the Roberts to life. Most of the deer I've killed was with the 115 Nos BT and now with the Barnes 100TSX.
I finally got a 257 Robert's in model 70 love that gun
Have a Winchester Featherweight in the 0.257 Roberts. With minimal reload, the combination shoots 1/2" groups at 200 yds. Love the thing. Oldest son harvested his first pronghorn with it and it was a one shot kill at 300 yds.
Great video. I bought a 257 r in a No. 1 V. and learned to reload with it. It is sub. MOA at 200 yards. Great caliber.
Great information! I always wanted a .257 Roberts but didn't realize how close the 6mm and the .243 was, Grat video!
Col. Whelen had an affection for the .257 Roberts, knowing it could be loaded to higher potential. When built around a solid action with enough magazine length and deep enough throat to allow a 3.00" overall loaded length (Win. Model 70, 98 Mauser, etc.), it allowed more powder capacity and therefore velocity potential. The Remington 722 limited loaded length to 2.75" length, which was a handicap to the .257. The round nosed 117-grain used in factory loads was not the most desirable for varmints or open country game like antelope. Still very good for deer. Whelen referred to a properly built and loaded .257 as "a vicious understudy of the great .270," as I remember reading. Also, many .257's were built around a barrel with 1-12" rifling twist, which was OK for 100-grain spitzers or 117-grain round nose, but a 1-10" twist was needed to stabilize 120-grain spitzers. If these blunders of design had been avoided, the .257 Roberts may not have been "sold short" as it was.
You got it right. See my very long comment. I'm having an already sporterized 1913 Kar. 98 8x57 re-barreled to a BOB. In my comment I did not mention the advantage of being able to increase COAL length in 98 Mauser action. The same applies to 7x57 vs the short action 7mm-08.
Thank you sir for the 257 Robert's review. I have owned one for over 35 years and have taken over a hundred deer and a couple dozen pigs with it out to 310 yards. I have not lost a single animal to Bob and never had to shoot one more than once. I have a 6mm, couple of 243's and a 25-06 neither of them does any better job than Bob. It is an excellent starter cartridge for a beginning sportsman or sportswoman. I say that because my daughter used it to harvest her first 3 deer before moving on to taking her fourth deer with another almost forgotten great, the 284 Winchester.
Back in the '70s and '80s my cousin used that round. I didn't know much about it but I watched him take several deer and coyotes and it was a great little round
Nice video, Shoutout to Gunblue490 he loves the 257 Roberts. He is a wealth of knowledge and might be able to answer some questions that you have about its loss of popularity. I recall that the 257 Roberts is very very similar to the 6.5 Swede ballistically. Both of them are highly regarded, the Roberts a little less powerful. In Scandinavia 6.5 Swede is used for Moose as well and always has been. Good shot placement and there are usually no problems. Please make more videos with cartridge history.
The veins in this dudes arms! He is jacked!
I had a Bob a long time ago. Mine was Rem700 action chambered for .257AI. It's a fantastic cartridge. I used 87 grain HP for everything up to a Sika deer. I won't say how hot my loads were but my gun was built for it. I wish I still had it. Sadly it was one of a few guns that were stolen.
My 93 year old neighbor who has tinkered with about everything just picked up a .257 Robert’s at a local gun show. We are heated to the range tomorrow…we shall see how it shoots. Thanks for the education…at least I can seem to know what I’m talking about dating our BS session! Thanks again! I’m glad I found your channel…
I inherited a 50s era Remington model 722 from my dad several years ago. It got me started reloading due no ammo availability. I’ve acquired enough brass to last me awhile. I love this gun and currently using it with much success.
The 250 Savage, and the .257 Roberts are great low-recoiling deer cartridges. Think of it as a .270 Win with less blast and recoil.
I have the Remington in 257. It’s my favorite rifle
I love your videos Ron. A close childhood friend had a m77 ultralight in .257 roberts and he was VERY successful in the deer woods. My dad had a 6mm Remington. I have found memories of both calibers as they both hold great memories for me. I currently have a 6mm Remington in a custom rifle with a fast twist rate. I think it gives the 25-06 a run for its money beyond 300 yds with high BC bullets. Both cartridges (along with the parent 7x57mm) are severely under-appreciated.
I’ve got 3 rifles chambered for the .257 Roberts. A Ruger #1 single shot, a Ruger ultralight Model 77 MK II and a truly beautiful custom Mauser actioned built by a renowned western gunsmith for his own use that has a beautifully figured high grade stock on it. They are all extremely accurate and I appreciate the light recoil. They’ve been very successful deer hunting companions and have also shot a number of prairie dogs back in the way back days.
I bought a Ruger 77, made in 1979, chambered in 257 Roberts. The rifle is brand new. it loves the Speer 87 gr. SP, 1/2" at 100 yards, with my handloads. Always wanted a 257. Great video! I was lucky to acquire 6 boxes of original Speer bullets from that time period. Also was lucky to find 300 new Winchester cases for it.
I have a .257 Robert’s story I was a teenager in the late 1970’s and two Retired Military Officers were hunting the same Ranch as us and they were hunting Antelope with the .257 Robert’s and they saw a three wheeler going across the sage flats and the one said how much would you have to lead it to hit the Rider and the other one said shoot the first shot right at him then add a little extra on the next shot as he would speed up.
Gotta love those Vietnam Vets humor, they were just joking.
I have a Rem 700 257 Roberts that was the first deer rifle for myself, two brothers, a cousin, and now my son, its harvested many kids first, second and third deer and antelope over the years. My son used it this week at 10 years old to harvest his first mule deer on his birthday! Fantastic little cartridge, I have always had a soft spot in my heart for the 243 as its one I picked up years ago to start learning to reload (because it was so cheap to find components for then). If you look back at what bullets were used when the 243 was starting out, the Ballistic tip with a decent B.C. wouldn't have been around. If you compare a 100 Partition 243 and a 120 Partition 257 you'll find the 243 wins in drop AND energy. Not by a meaningful amount, but it does produce more, the S.D of the 257 is better by a smidgen, but really they are so comparable, the differences at their useful ranges are meaningless. Funny though how some things take off, and others don't. Always great content sir!
Ron I just got a never fired ruger M77 mkii ultralight in 257 bob. It's a super beautiful rifle and I can't wait to shoot it. I looked up the serial number and it was shipped in 1999. I've always wanted one and now my dream has come true. Excellent video as always!
I have a 257 Roberts in a Kimber rifle that is a pleasure to shoot. As you mentioned this is a cartridge with mild recoil which sure can improve a shooter's marksmanship. I think it is worth mentioning that many of us older shooters have worn out shoulders that do not take kindly to the wallop of heavier rounds. The 257 Roberts and its parent cartridge the 7 X 57 Mauser, which is also a mild recoiling round, are just what the doctor ordered. I want to be able to throw a saddle on my horse when I am eighty so out with my larger bore rifles.
I have an 1891 Argentine Mauser rechambered in the Bob and it's incredibly accurate.
A part of the story you did not get to was the rise of the 270 Winchester starting in 1925. About half of the Bob's users moved up to the 270 including Jack O Conner. Then the other half were taken in by the advertising hype for the 243. And some old fuddy dudies like myself just kept our 7X57s shooting 120 varmint bullets at 3000 fps.
Always wondered about the .257 Roberts but never saw anything more than the Chuck Hawks write-up on it. Super cool to hear your take on it. 👍
Gunblue490 loves the roberts
Damn good killer of deer and antelope. Elegant in it's sufficiency without question. Gentle on the shoulder but highly effective.
Having killed 176 head of big game and seen at least that many more, shot with everything from .22lr to .375 H&H, I can say the the .257Bob seems to be the minimum threshold of that "Boom, Flop, DRT" quality we all like to see.
Thanks Ron great video now I want to build a 257 Bob have a 280 AI and 6.5-06 in the works right now but after those this is going to get serious consideration
I have a model 70 featherweight 257 Bob and handload 100 gr Sierras at 3100 fps. Never had a deer run yet. Absolutely love it.
I notice quite a variation in reported velocities achieved w/ the .257 & the 257AI. I have a Win M70 FW chambered in the AI version.With a 22in barrel it's chrono'd 3150 + or minus w/ 100 grain Nosllers & Sierra's. I suppose often the difs are brl lengths which aren't noted? In the FW 22" brl the rifle is a joy to handle!! Purchased new, circa 1993 for pronghorn, it was used for 2 of them. Each was anchored w/ 1 shot. I was anxious to shoot it more so I hunted woodchucks w/ it using 75 gr ballistic tips chrono'd at 3650+. I killed about 300 of them in 4 yrs of hunting. Needlees to say I love the rifle though haven't used it since the 90's. The guy who referred to it as womans' gun cracked me up!!
Never seen one. Looks like a pleasant little cartridge that'll still drop a deer no sweat.
RON, The .257 Roberts was a favorite of old friend J.D. Jones. We made up a Remington XP 100 in .257 ROBERTS. We got the deal of a life time on 10 cases of 117 grain loaded rounds for testing. With LYMAN GLOBE front site with cross hair wire shot my first 40x40. ( 1979) The recoil was much more present than many of the other rifle cartridges being shot at the time. Shot several sighting groups on a Turkey Metallic Silhouette target at 150 meters aiming at leg/body resulting in 2-3 inches. Still have the gun. ( 15 in bb. Less than 48 oz.) RON appreciate your practical insights. How about 357 Maximum to .350 Legend in HENRY SS.
I use a Kimber 84m in 257 and love it.....Hornady superperformance ammo is awesome in this gun
There has been a 1 in 7.5 inch fast twist barrel sitting in my cabinet for a few years waiting to build another 257 Ackley for the 131grain BlackJack bullets. My first 257 Ackley I had built from Fox ridge back in the day for my custom encore. Now my nephews have it. I've grown up with 25 calibers in my family and there are 4 .25-06s, a Savage 99 in .250-300, a custom Bob, a Remington pump in Bob, the Encore in Ackley and will some day have the Fast twist Ackley. I've ran everything from 60 gr RN up to 120 grain Sierras and Nosler Partions. Best accuracy across most is a toss up between Sierra 90 HPs and the Berger 115 VLDs.
Always enjoy your reviews and topics Ron . It's like chicken soup for the rifleman .
Just finished a 257 for my grandson we took it out it was a joy to shoot and I expect it will serve him well for years
I've been hand loading for 45 years and have been enamored with the BOB for many of those years but have only recently been able to afford and acquire a rifle that I'm going to have turned into a BOB by a very knowledgeable and talented gunsmith. It's a nicely sporterized 1913 Kar. 98 Mauser in 8x57 with a beautiful "graft line" walnut stock. I got it dirt cheap because who ever sporterized it left the original stepped military barrel on it which has some rust and surface pitting with an Ok but not great bore, but that Kar. 98 action is in great shape so it's just matter of re-barreling and bedding.
The BOB, like the 7x57 and 300 Savage has a low SAAMI MAP because of largely unfounded fears about so-called old rifles being able to safely handle the pressures. The original 1892 7x57 was loaded to much higher pressures than the SAAMI standard. The main reason the SAAMI MAP is so low is because the lawyers are doing their job of protecting the manufacturers of arms and ammunition AND publishers of reloading data from idiots who don't really understand the reloading process and careful load development and their lawyers.
Ron I think you said the maximum pressure for standard 257 Roberts is 51,000 PSI. Please forgive me if I didn't hear that correctly. Actually the current SAAMI MAP for standard 257 Roberts is 54,000 PSI using the piezo pressure transducer and 58,000 PSI for 257 Roberts+P. That is only a 7.4% increase above the standard loadings.
My Nosler reloading manual number five has eight different 257 Roberts powder loadings for four bullet weights; 85, 100, 115 and 120 grains. None are labeled as +P. In their most recent number nine manual with the exception of dropping RL15 and adding H4895 and BIG GAME to their powder lineup, the loads are EXACTLY THE SAME for those bullet weights but all labelled +P. They do not list any standard 257 Roberts data. The standard CYA warnings, modern rifles, approach maximum loads with caution etc are the same.
In a 98 Mauser, Winchester Model 70, Remington 700, Ruger 77 or any other "modern" action a careful hand loader who knows how to read pressure signs should have no problems using the published data regardless of whether or not his or her cases are head stamp +P. There is much discussion as to if there is really any difference in those cases except for the head stamp. Lawyers at work again.
Another interesting FYI: In the latest Lee reloading manual, which is supposed to get its data from the powder companies and shows maximum pressure readings if they are available, many of the starting loads in a given bullet weight are higher than the maximum loads for a given powder in the Nosler manual AND none of those loads come close to 58,000 PSI. They range from a little over 50,000 to a little under 55,000.
Hand loaded up to its real potential, the BOB can be a great 300 yard plus cartridge for varmints, deer, Prong Horns or other similar sized game. In the right hands with the right bullet it's perfectly capable of taking elk or moose. If you want a super fast "long range" quarter bore, just get a 25-06 or 257 Weatherby Magnum. They are both over bore cartridges that will burn out their barrels and your pocket book and leave you deaf with probably no more game in hand. Happy hunting boys and girls.
The BOB was sabotaged by Remington until modern powders could catch up with their darling, the 25-06. They knew it was just as good as the 25-06, without the overbore issues. They put it in a short action to cripple it's potential.
By weird coincidence I'm thinking about having a custom rifle chambered in this calibre! Looking forward to the video.
Get a 6 mm Remington you won't be disappointed
Got a Reminton 700C, 24"BBL in .257 Bob for my wife. Loading Barnes 115grn for her at a shade over 2800fps. The manual shows we could possibly go as high as 2900fps. She loves it. I see a 87grn TSX load at almost 3440Fps, 100grn @ 3152fps, 75grn varmint @3550fps. We are only currently using the 115grn load. It is very accurate and so far she had no bullets stay in a deer. The stock was cut to fit her.
I feel the same way about the 6mm Remington, an amazing cartridge, superior to the 243 gone to the wayside
I hunt with a 7mm Mauser, this cartridge's big daddy. I'm a reloader, but ammo logistics for most shooters is a major consideration. Good oddball cartridges like the one Ron talks about here and the 7- and 8-mm Mausers are excellent cartridges, but since the ammo drought, good luck on finding factory loads for any of these that don't cost a fortune. Much easier to find .243 almost anywhere.
My 2 cents on the Bob: 25 plus years ago I got a Spanish 95 Mauser short action and had a gunsmith build me a custom yote/, deer rifle. His advice to me on completion of the project was to not hot rod my hand loades because the steel used in the 95 was softer than in the long action Mauser 98s. Great video on the Bob. Thanks again Gene H.
I built a nice rifle in 257 Roberts using a Chilean Mauser action. It wasn't the best choice of action. My wife's uncle had given me a Chilean 95 Mauser rifle that had a rust pitted bore. When the rifle was completed it was nice an light. I had installed an Adams and Bennett barrel that turned out the very accurate. Because of the pressure limitations of the 95 Mauser action I loaded my own ammo for it. I only used it for one deer season and shot a nice buck with it. I sold it at the end of deer season to a guy who wanted a light recoiling rifle in 257 Roberts. Because the buyer also loaded his own ammo I gave him the loading dies for the rifle, too.
My brother and I have run a .257AI and a .257R for 30 years. You must handload to do them justice. A .257 Roberts can achieve 4000 fps with a 60 grain slug and 3000fps with a 120 grain bullet if loaded to the same pressures as a .243. Sierra said this about the .257AI "We consider the particular combination we tested to be ballistically superior to the .25-06.
The 257 bob really needs a long action to really reach its potential. I’m confident it can be loaded to well over 60k psi.
Years ago I re-barrelled one of my Mausers to .257 Roberts
Ron...You covered the basses WELL! I have never owned a .257 Bob...one of my regrets. I am now 80...but have to say...my overall favorite is the 6mm Rem. At one time I owned three of them...Now...I am down to one...I found a Dumoulin made in the early sixty's chambered in 6mm Remington. (The Dumoulin is a custom made FN Mauser 98)...A truly beautiful rife...found it on Gun Broker about ten years ago for $475.00!!! Some Dumoulin's go for THOUSANDS!!! :)