I have this Seiko modded with a domed sapphire crystal and a strapcode bracelet.I have regulated the 4R35 and it is running 2 seconds fast, they aren't regulated at the factory hence why so many display poor accuracy. It won't match the Swiss in terms of case finishing but we're talking increments, and it is a very good watch that can be vastly improved with a few relatively inexpensive tweaks.
@@garethhanna9173 Agreed, I didn't like my older Seiko 5 that much once I got it, it ran about -10s/day. But after I took the movement out, cleaned up some micro dust on the dial, swapped out the crystal for sapphire and regulated it so it does about +30s/week am I very happy with it. Then again, I also have the same mentality with old cars, "preferring fixer uppers" I can take apart and properly put together 😂 So it's all about the mentality I guess. Some people's comment is just "why would I buy myself more work" so depends if you like it or not
Have the exact same seiko , ran out of the box at +3 seconds a day. Regulated it to 0 , upgraded crystal to dd sapphire and long island watches bracelet, Fantastic watch . Total cost £360
I have the same Tag Heuer. Bought it about 2 years ago. I have her on a blue crocodile strap. Until shortly it was my almost my daily watch. I have several watches that I wear on and off. But the Tag really was my daily. Until……… I bought a Seiko SSK 001 GMT two month ago and took her never off my wrist since then. And the funny thing is that I actually don’t like Seiko. But this SSK is one of the most beautiful, comfortable watch I own now. Due to frequent travel and my family living in another country I actually use the GMT function for the 3 time zones daily. And regarding time keeping, worn now two month straight and the watch keeps perfect time keeping. Not a minute fast or slow. Really an absolute amazing watch.
Funny you mention that, as I have a de-magnetiser and it made no difference. So I think the movement just needs a service as it's just over 4 years old.
Why would you service a modern watch like that after only 4 years? It will probably cost you more than the watch. I wouldn't service it even after 40 years. I'm sure all it needs is a bit of regulating and it will run just fine.
So your saying my orient star will not be worth servicing 20 years from now?. Rediculous outlook on these watches. my orient star is well built watch. An will be a very collectible orient watch. All watches need servicing no matter what the cost/value. If the watch means alot to you, its worth it. Or its a rare seiko or orient it is worth servicing.
I have 2 Seiko 5 ..the old 7s movement and the other with a 4r35…I have recently got a Hamilton khaki automatic…my primary observations…1. Accuracy 2. Power reserve 3. When I wind the Hamilton watch…it feels butter smooth😂 idk why
I absolutely love ur videos and the constant battles u have with birds . I think that seiko is a great starter watch I started out straight to the big boys my 1st was the smp 300 diver and then I went to Rolex . I bought a Hamilton field khaki kinda as a beater and the quality is obviously miles behind omega and Rolex but it’s just deciding if that difference is worth the 10x or sometimes 25x just kinda depends on your financial situation and how crazy u wanna dig down the hole .. cheers mate
@iandonahue7732 thanks for the feedback. The birds are a privilege to be amongst and I personally love making my videos outdoors with them. I genuinely think the best collection of watches is to have a broad range of watches in different price points. Seiko, Hamilton, Tag, Omega, Rolex.
@ i absolutely agree .. I’ll continue to watch your videos it’s definitely full of knowledge and I enjoy your sense of humor keep up the great content !!
FWIW. your Seiko's accuracy is outside of Sekio's accuracy spec. You can probably take it back to the seller and have it regulated under warranty. Again, FWIW, my Seiko NH35, which is the outsourced version of yours, looses 4 seconds per day, unless I walk for 5+ miles (8+ km). Then it is close to perfect.
You can regulatie it yourself using that app. Minutely shift two levers above the balance spring for seconds and amplitude using little screwdrivers. I set my NH34/35/36/72 to +6 seconds a day on dial up, with amplitude around 275, then usually the watch runs great for about a week or so with daily wear. (I wear my Seiko mods a week and the I change).
Ive got tudors , rados , edox , tag heuer , etc , but i still love seiko. My sla043 which cost £4080 new , is up there with omega and rolex in build quality. The one thing that lets it down is accuracy though. Gains 2 mins a week . Thats really poor , my tudor is like 2 secs a week. Seiko need to address this , because for 4k , it should be accurate. Its an 8L35 movement , but it performs no better than a 6R movement. But after saying all that , its still one on my favorite watches in my collection. Seiko have their own charm , its hard to put into words , but theres something about them , whatever pricepoint , that just makes you smile.
Ive had a few 8L35 movements in my MM300s and they've been ok but not great. I think Seiko is pretty much 100% machine assembled and manual regulation just isn't efficient enough for them. Even Grand Seiko can be hit and miss. And I agree with you that Seiko has some weird draw to it. It shouldn't have, but it does!
@TheRandomWatchDude hi , the seiko sla043 , is made in the grand seiko factory , along with the movement, although its not decorated. Its a proven movement thats capable of lasting decades , but seiko can't be bothered to regulate it. Its capable to run in cosh specs , but they don't deem it necessary ? That seems very strange as the Japanese are all about perfection.
@@TheRandomWatchDude youd think for 4k , they would regulate it at least. No bracelet for that price too. Tudors new monochrome bb on the t fit bracelet is metas certified , yet only 4k too. If the swiss can do it , then seiko should too.
Great video! Buy what you like and hold the urge to buy a cheaper replacement watch. Having said that, there are so many amazing watches under 1000, it’s a tough sell for me going over that threshold…
@micheldepaula8733 so many nice watches under 1000 bucks and all easy to buy with no groveling. I do think Seiko is a fun place to be in the watch hobby albeit one needs lots of strap options!
I also have had bad luck with the e4 movements, did however regulate a 7s26 movement in my seiko 5 and even if its all over the place over the 6 positions using the app to messure it, I do get about +30s/ week, I reset it every sunday. Meaning my seiko is beating out my Tissot's ETA powermatic 80...
I have the black dial version of the Dress KX and I love it…though I had to put it on a leather strap as I couldn’t get a good fit with the bracelet. It runs a little fast-which I like actually- but it is a little odd that when brand new it ran almost twenty seconds fast and now it’s often only a second or two.
@FlatcapHobbit i think they do slow down a bit after a few weeks. But how long they remain consistent I'm not sure. Uncle Straps makes some top bracelets for the Seiko models. I just got one for my Alpinist. It's very high quality.
Youngins nowadays don't even start with Seiko , they start with Microbrands and AliExpress brands, which I think is better from a value perspective. You can even get a Sellita movement in a San Martin , the same movement found in 2K Orises. So what's the point of mid-range swiss watches?
@TheRandomWatchDude They work. I own everything from Steeldive and Seestern to Longines and 6r35 Seiko and the affordable Chinese watches give me the same happiness but less of a financial loss.
I got the Tag Twin Time (GMT). Looks almost the same as your Tag. I do love day dates though. I also have a few other swiss, Seiko, Bulova.. etc. The Tag, Tissot and Tudor i own feel so much more solid then the others with one exception. an ALiExpress San Martin Sn0005, black dial, non-vintage with a SN200 (28800) movement on a jubilee. i know it shouldnt be my favorate watch... but it is.
@scottbollinger3641 not my cup of tea to be honest. I think they're a good watch for the money but for me, their watches lack a bit of X factor in the design
Seiko 5 series are their entry level watches a much better value than the Tag heuer, for the price of the TG you could get a Grand Seiko which is a fantastic watch!
The seiko uses mineral glass vs sapphire for the tag. This makes a difference cause I have a few scratches in the mineral glass of my seiko (I own the same model), while I never saw a scratch on a sapphire. The bracelet of my seiko is really nothing special and while you could regulate the seiko movement, I always feel like variations (due to temperature, winding, position etc) remain more present. But for this kind of money, the seiko is just a great "do it all" watch.
By the way, the movement is not an 4R15 like you said, but well a 4R36. When there's the "5" logo like a superman, it is the new movement the 4R36. I don't where you got your numbers, but mine is 6 seconds fast a day and I have 3 Seiko of them with same movement and same performance. The bracelet argument is bunch of crap. Once it's on your wrist, it doesn't jingly jangly and nobody takes of the watch and plays jingle bells with the watch. So what's the point of mentioning it? Furthermore, I've never seen a Seiko bracelet break not more than a Tag Heuer or rubber bracelet they put on luxury watches. So you can scratch that argument too. The only valid argument you pointed out is the hype around the brand. The logo on the watch is what you're paying for. It is to flex and eventually it's brand heritage and innovations.
@cougarbatterie I'm a Seiko Fan too by the way, so don't be offended! It's just a video pointing out the differences. I just bought an Alpinist which I will be reviewing shortly. The strap it comes with is a disaster, and I put it straight on a NATO
Ive got a couple of seiko watches, turtle and a orange dial 5, and theyre incredible value for money much more so than my tag Heuer watches i have a caliber 6 and an aquracer c.16 and love them also but they cant be considered better for value than the seiko ,but obviously tag Heuer is better quality,better made clasps , bracelets etc.
Must admit, I don't know how Aliexpress works. I thought it was just another online shopping platform like ebay? Can't microbrands sell their watches on Aliexpress?
Aliexpress is based in China. They feature watches with incredible specs and build quality (sapphire crystals, ceramic bezels, solid bracelets with milled clasps) at a fraction of the price. They feature brands like San Martin, Baltany, Addiesdive, etc. Many enthusiasts don’t care about Swiss made or brand heritage anymore so they opt for these Aliexpress brands. Hard to justify paying $1000+ for Swiss made when you can get the same specs for
About 15 years ago I bought a Seiko 5, not unlike yours, new, for around 50 UK pounds. Yours, converted, comes to around 230 UK pounds. I would say it just isn't worth it to buy a Seiko 5 for that kind of price, today. A few months ago I bought a quartz Seiko JDM chronograph for around 130; it had minimal rattle in the bracelet (about as much as that Tag) and the end-links, though hollow, fit tightly with no play at all. Seiko pricing is wildly inconsistent, and the price tag is no indicator of the quality you'll receive, it seems.
Er, to me, the hour hands on both are too short , esp on the Seiko; from some angles on the TAG (Why?!) This kind of watch with day/ date would be ideal ( perfect salaryman type). I'm v.happy with ny Hamilton Jazzmaster, plus it's 34mm. If not a diver, I think both would be flying saucers on my wrist.
Hi Mark interesting to see you do a video on entry level watches.i only own one tag watch it's the Carrera 2 skeleton at 5k it's not the cheapest tag watch but it's a good looking watch. but if you want the best value for quality out there it's got to be Christopher ward the trident c60 at around 1k is a far better watch quality wise.the bracelet is better than most 5k watches better than Tudor bracelet s(not the new easylink jubilee bracelet) have you tried a Christopher ward? Great video thanks John.
Thanks John. I keep seeing Christopher Ward being pushed on YT, and I've kind of ignored them as I don't find the name very alluring! I need to give this brand a look!
Another interesting video - thank you. I think Seiko has interesting dials. Your comments about movement & bracelet quality are spot on. I also think essentially all Seiko’s, and Grand Seiko, are thicker than need be. Seiko fit & finish is notoriously inconsistent. Entry level Swiss, in my view, is Hamilton, Tissot, Certina & Mido. Each offer lots in $600 to $1200 USD that are very good. I like a number of Tag’s, and have an F1 quartz, but think they are all 25% too much at regular price.
An interesting video but you have to consider you're comparing the lower end of the Swiss luxury market with a low end Seiko. What would have been interesting is to compare the Tag with something like the Seiko Alpinist which is still only about a third of the price of the Tag but still a step up from the Seiko here. As you say there are subtle differences. It seems the Swiss tend to put a higher level of finish on their movements and they're more aesthetic. I think Swiss watches today are far too expensive for what they are. When I started work in 1980 in the UK just about to turn 18 you could buy a Rolex submariner for £360. My take home monthly pay was about £300 so even an 18 yo office junior could stretch to a Rolex or an Omega speedmaster £300. I decided on a Tudor snowflake submariner £210. Nowadays these types of watches are around £6 - 10k although Tudors are around £4k. I think these prices are way beyond inflation. Even if I could afford it I wouldn't buy one as there's so many people around who would happily rob you. Also I think in these times it's immoral to spend that kind of money on an overpriced wristwatch. Regarding timekeeping most people I know who've had Seikos are very happy with them. I bought a vintage Seiko Speedtimer 6 months ago. For the first few months it kept time to about a second a day but nowadays it's more like 12 seconds a day. Not bad for a 54 yo watch. I'm fairly confident that if you have a mid range or above Seiko they can be regulated to keep time within chronometer specs.
@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv thanks for the comments. I wish I had the foresight to buy a Rolex, Omega and Tudor even 10 years ago at retail but I was in a different place then. I hear you about the morality of spending money on watches. I have no vices such as alcoholism, drugs, infidelity etc. so I'm happy with my moral choices, but I get what you mean.
@TheRandomWatchDude I made some howling mistakes with my watches. My first watch was a Tudor snowflake submariner which I bought in 1980 for £210. I sold the Tudor 2 years later and bought a Rolex submariner date for £500. It was the very first 300m model with the sapphire crystal but still had a matte dial. I sold it in 84 because I wanted to buy my first car. I bought another submariner date in 1988 for £1000. This model now had the glossy dial. I sold that watch in 2000 for £1400. I then bought a by then vintage Tudor submariner in 2005 for £750. It was a 1970 date model the first of the submariners with the square indices. I sold it a couple of years later for a £1000. Since that time the value of these what are now vintage pieces has soared. We're talking watches if I still owned them being collectively worth £40k. I had nothing against buying expensive watches because back then they were relatively attainable. I'm just astounded by today's prices which I put down partly to greed.
The other consideration is the cost of servicing. Many cheaper seiko movements are just replaced. I was considering purchasing a used High end mechanical Chrono until I found out a servicing could cost $700 CAD, gulp!!!
@terrylarson7596 Most people flick the watch once it gets near to service time for that very reason, and just go and buy another new one. So the money they saved on the service is spent 3 fold on buying a new one! We watch addicts are a strange breed!
Have a Seiko which serves as a decoy in my burglar decoy watch box in the living room (also contains 4 quartz shitters). As for my Heuer Carrera (not a TAG) it sits in the bank safe. At some point, my Breitling SuperOcean Abyss on Ocean Racer rubber strap with glidelock deployant replaced my Seiko Sawtooth diver as my holiday watch. As for the 35 mm silver colour two register Carrera chrono 3647 from the 1960s, I dont wear it much... Too many watches.
@@TheRandomWatchDude The big watchbox is right in plain view in the living room. Maybe I should put it in the bedroom behind the socks... In plain view in the living room may be a little too obvious 😅
Very good review Mark. For me, I have a large Seiko collection from $250 to $1,500 USD and find them quite good. I admit that on the lower end models, I do replace the stock brackets with Strap Code or Uncles which seem to bring the comfort and quality up a bit. I have several that are reasonably accurate even the 7S26 that don't offer hand winding or hacking features. Overall, I think Seiko makes very good watches for the price. I have been considering Oris lately and Tudor as well. Thank you for the content.
@swkohnle08 hey thanks for the measured response. I am a Seiko fan too, and tour comment about the straps is very appropriate. I just bought a ln Alpinist and the stock strap is woefully short of the quality thrbwatch deserves. I'm literally buying some straps from Uncle now as I write this!
I started with Tissot and then went to Seiko years later. I have a couple of Tissots, and compared to my Seikos at the same price point, I have a hard time saying one is better than the other. I would say Tissot tends to try take more of a shortcut on machining towards the lugs on cases that come with a bracelet. Seiko polishing tends to be worse than Tissot in how it ages. Machining tends to be good on both at > 400 eur. Dials, I kinda have to go to Seiko, but both great quality. Movements I won't even get into, they both have massive pros and cons.
@chun-sunchan6106 well the advantage with Rolex is that it holds value whereas the TAG drops like a stone. Seiko vs Citizen would start a civil war with that video wouldn't I LOL
Hi there! I agree with you on pretty much everything you mentioned on the video. And I really enjoyed both the “conversation” as well as the comparison between those two pieces (and oh so happy to see you wear them often!). But the video seems to end so abruptly and unexpectedly… I actually think you never even gave your answer to the question on the title. To me, yes: it is worth paying more because you get more. But do you get 10 times more on specific scenario? No. Not at all. Maybe 4 times more…
@RuinasDomi thank you for the feedback. Yes the video did end a bit abruptly, and I think that's because I could have ranted on a lot more about the intangibles, and was keen to keep the run time lower! Sometimes when I'm talking like this I actually change my viewpoint mid conversation! It's authentic if nothing else!
@@TheRandomWatchDude I imagined so! But thought it might be worth pointing it out regardless. Apologies if I seemed redundant. Anyway, Seiko are great; they really are. But Tag Heur are, for the most part, so underappreciated. I recently purchased a brand new, heavily discounted, Autavia Automatic Chronometer in bronze, and it is absolutely sublime. Spectacular piece for the money. Cheers and keep those videos coming!
@tariqkhonji6556 I agree Seiko make much better watches, but there are also much better Swiss watches out there. So the comparison was more entry level vs entry level
@holgermuller3597 You like rattley bracelets, loose tolerances and unregulated movements? YES! It's very much a personal choice and value disproportionality is also subjective
Almost all Swiss brands are all overpriced and overrated… Seiko is also getting very greedy as well… you want real value. Go microbrands or Chinese brand. TAD Heuer is a joke only fool will buy it. Sorry Especially any modern day TAD, waaaay overpriced and overrated and Swiss made name only, mostly made in China anyway….
I have this Seiko modded with a domed sapphire crystal and a strapcode bracelet.I have regulated the 4R35 and it is running 2 seconds fast, they aren't regulated at the factory hence why so many display poor accuracy. It won't match the Swiss in terms of case finishing but we're talking increments, and it is a very good watch that can be vastly improved with a few relatively inexpensive tweaks.
@@garethhanna9173 Agreed, I didn't like my older Seiko 5 that much once I got it, it ran about -10s/day.
But after I took the movement out, cleaned up some micro dust on the dial, swapped out the crystal for sapphire and regulated it so it does about +30s/week am I very happy with it.
Then again, I also have the same mentality with old cars, "preferring fixer uppers" I can take apart and properly put together 😂 So it's all about the mentality I guess.
Some people's comment is just "why would I buy myself more work" so depends if you like it or not
Have the exact same seiko , ran out of the box at +3 seconds a day. Regulated it to 0 , upgraded crystal to dd sapphire and long island watches bracelet, Fantastic watch . Total cost £360
The missing part in this comparison is the aliexpress special making the contenders blush for the price they are asking.
I have the same Tag Heuer. Bought it about 2 years ago. I have her on a blue crocodile strap. Until shortly it was my almost my daily watch. I have several watches that I wear on and off. But the Tag really was my daily. Until……… I bought a Seiko SSK 001 GMT two month ago and took her never off my wrist since then. And the funny thing is that I actually don’t like Seiko. But this SSK is one of the most beautiful, comfortable watch I own now. Due to frequent travel and my family living in another country I actually use the GMT function for the 3 time zones daily. And regarding time keeping, worn now two month straight and the watch keeps perfect time keeping. Not a minute fast or slow. Really an absolute amazing watch.
@floriandurre4953 wonderful to hear that you like your new Seiko so much. That's a very nice looking model
Excellent comparison that really has helped me to understand the difference. Well done mate
@@anasNCDEG thank you 😊
Can probably buy a seiko put sapphire glass and strap code bracelet have it serviced and regulated and it's still 5x cheaper than a swiss watch
Yes that's the answer isn't it
If it’s a minute fast it’s most likely just magnetized. All the 4R movements I have seen have been around +/- 10seconds a day.
Funny you mention that, as I have a de-magnetiser and it made no difference. So I think the movement just needs a service as it's just over 4 years old.
Why would you service a modern watch like that after only 4 years? It will probably cost you more than the watch. I wouldn't service it even after 40 years. I'm sure all it needs is a bit of regulating and it will run just fine.
Perhaps but regulation won't improve the amplitude. But yes you're right, it's not worth servicing
@@TheRandomWatchDude I think amplitude above 200 for 4r is OK.
So your saying my orient star will not be worth servicing 20 years from now?. Rediculous outlook on these watches. my orient star is well built watch. An will be a very collectible orient watch. All watches need servicing no matter what the cost/value. If the watch means alot to you, its worth it. Or its a rare seiko or orient it is worth servicing.
It’s about the feeling a certain watch gives you when wearing it, regardless of its price.
Very much so!
I have 2 Seiko 5 ..the old 7s movement and the other with a 4r35…I have recently got a Hamilton khaki automatic…my primary observations…1. Accuracy 2. Power reserve 3. When I wind the Hamilton watch…it feels butter smooth😂 idk why
I absolutely love ur videos and the constant battles u have with birds . I think that seiko is a great starter watch I started out straight to the big boys my 1st was the smp 300 diver and then I went to Rolex . I bought a Hamilton field khaki kinda as a beater and the quality is obviously miles behind omega and Rolex but it’s just deciding if that difference is worth the 10x or sometimes 25x just kinda depends on your financial situation and how crazy u wanna dig down the hole .. cheers mate
@iandonahue7732 thanks for the feedback. The birds are a privilege to be amongst and I personally love making my videos outdoors with them. I genuinely think the best collection of watches is to have a broad range of watches in different price points. Seiko, Hamilton, Tag, Omega, Rolex.
@ i absolutely agree .. I’ll continue to watch your videos it’s definitely full of knowledge and I enjoy your sense of humor keep up the great content !!
FWIW. your Seiko's accuracy is outside of Sekio's accuracy spec. You can probably take it back to the seller and have it regulated under warranty. Again, FWIW, my Seiko NH35, which is the outsourced version of yours, looses 4 seconds per day, unless I walk for 5+ miles (8+ km). Then it is close to perfect.
You can regulatie it yourself using that app.
Minutely shift two levers above the balance spring for seconds and amplitude using little screwdrivers.
I set my NH34/35/36/72 to +6 seconds a day on dial up, with amplitude around 275, then usually the watch runs great for about a week or so with daily wear. (I wear my Seiko mods a week and the I change).
It's 4 years old so I will get it serviced soon. They'll regulate it better than it ever was!
Ive got tudors , rados , edox , tag heuer , etc , but i still love seiko. My sla043 which cost £4080 new , is up there with omega and rolex in build quality. The one thing that lets it down is accuracy though. Gains 2 mins a week . Thats really poor , my tudor is like 2 secs a week. Seiko need to address this , because for 4k , it should be accurate. Its an 8L35 movement , but it performs no better than a 6R movement. But after saying all that , its still one on my favorite watches in my collection. Seiko have their own charm , its hard to put into words , but theres something about them , whatever pricepoint , that just makes you smile.
Ive had a few 8L35 movements in my MM300s and they've been ok but not great. I think Seiko is pretty much 100% machine assembled and manual regulation just isn't efficient enough for them. Even Grand Seiko can be hit and miss. And I agree with you that Seiko has some weird draw to it. It shouldn't have, but it does!
@TheRandomWatchDude hi , the seiko sla043 , is made in the grand seiko factory , along with the movement, although its not decorated. Its a proven movement thats capable of lasting decades , but seiko can't be bothered to regulate it. Its capable to run in cosh specs , but they don't deem it necessary ? That seems very strange as the Japanese are all about perfection.
@martinharrison4245 yes perfection as long as it's on budget. They must not go over budget!
@@TheRandomWatchDude youd think for 4k , they would regulate it at least. No bracelet for that price too. Tudors new monochrome bb on the t fit bracelet is metas certified , yet only 4k too. If the swiss can do it , then seiko should too.
Great video! Buy what you like and hold the urge to buy a cheaper replacement watch. Having said that, there are so many amazing watches under 1000, it’s a tough sell for me going over that threshold…
@micheldepaula8733 so many nice watches under 1000 bucks and all easy to buy with no groveling. I do think Seiko is a fun place to be in the watch hobby albeit one needs lots of strap options!
I also have had bad luck with the e4 movements, did however regulate a 7s26 movement in my seiko 5 and even if its all over the place over the 6 positions using the app to messure it, I do get about +30s/ week, I reset it every sunday.
Meaning my seiko is beating out my Tissot's ETA powermatic 80...
I have the black dial version of the Dress KX and I love it…though I had to put it on a leather strap as I couldn’t get a good fit with the bracelet. It runs a little fast-which I like actually- but it is a little odd that when brand new it ran almost twenty seconds fast and now it’s often only a second or two.
@FlatcapHobbit i think they do slow down a bit after a few weeks. But how long they remain consistent I'm not sure. Uncle Straps makes some top bracelets for the Seiko models. I just got one for my Alpinist. It's very high quality.
I like German watches. In a one on one fight my German watch would kick your Swiss watches ass.
Thanks for the content.
@Hipnosis65 depends what German watch you're referring to. If it's a Damasko yes, or a fully tegimented Sinn, but not all German watches are equal
Youngins nowadays don't even start with Seiko , they start with Microbrands and AliExpress brands, which I think is better from a value perspective. You can even get a Sellita movement in a San Martin , the same movement found in 2K Orises. So what's the point of mid-range swiss watches?
@RadicallyGreen interesting point. I have no idea what these watches are like from Aliexpress, but each to their own I suppose.
@TheRandomWatchDude They work. I own everything from Steeldive and Seestern to Longines and 6r35 Seiko and the affordable Chinese watches give me the same happiness but less of a financial loss.
I got the Tag Twin Time (GMT). Looks almost the same as your Tag. I do love day dates though. I also have a few other swiss, Seiko, Bulova.. etc. The Tag, Tissot and Tudor i own feel so much more solid then the others with one exception. an ALiExpress San Martin Sn0005, black dial, non-vintage with a SN200 (28800) movement on a jubilee. i know it shouldnt be my favorate watch... but it is.
What do you think of Tissot ?
@scottbollinger3641 not my cup of tea to be honest. I think they're a good watch for the money but for me, their watches lack a bit of X factor in the design
Seiko 5 series are their entry level watches a much better value than the Tag heuer, for the price of the TG you could get a Grand Seiko which is a fantastic watch!
The seiko uses mineral glass vs sapphire for the tag. This makes a difference cause I have a few scratches in the mineral glass of my seiko (I own the same model), while I never saw a scratch on a sapphire. The bracelet of my seiko is really nothing special and while you could regulate the seiko movement, I always feel like variations (due to temperature, winding, position etc) remain more present. But for this kind of money, the seiko is just a great "do it all" watch.
By the way, the movement is not an 4R15 like you said, but well a 4R36. When there's the "5" logo like a superman, it is the new movement the 4R36. I don't where you got your numbers, but mine is 6 seconds fast a day and I have 3 Seiko of them with same movement and same performance. The bracelet argument is bunch of crap. Once it's on your wrist, it doesn't jingly jangly and nobody takes of the watch and plays jingle bells with the watch. So what's the point of mentioning it? Furthermore, I've never seen a Seiko bracelet break not more than a Tag Heuer or rubber bracelet they put on luxury watches. So you can scratch that argument too. The only valid argument you pointed out is the hype around the brand. The logo on the watch is what you're paying for. It is to flex and eventually it's brand heritage and innovations.
@cougarbatterie I'm a Seiko Fan too by the way, so don't be offended! It's just a video pointing out the differences. I just bought an Alpinist which I will be reviewing shortly. The strap it comes with is a disaster, and I put it straight on a NATO
Ive got a couple of seiko watches, turtle and a orange dial 5, and theyre incredible value for money much more so than my tag Heuer watches i have a caliber 6 and an aquracer c.16 and love them also but they cant be considered better for value than the seiko ,but obviously tag Heuer is better quality,better made clasps , bracelets etc.
Aliexpress is going to cause so many micro brands and Swiss brands to go under. It’s gonna be the Aliexpress crisis
Must admit, I don't know how Aliexpress works. I thought it was just another online shopping platform like ebay? Can't microbrands sell their watches on Aliexpress?
Aliexpress is based in China. They feature watches with incredible specs and build quality (sapphire crystals, ceramic bezels, solid bracelets with milled clasps) at a fraction of the price. They feature brands like San Martin, Baltany, Addiesdive, etc. Many enthusiasts don’t care about Swiss made or brand heritage anymore so they opt for these Aliexpress brands. Hard to justify paying $1000+ for Swiss made when you can get the same specs for
What is the app that you used as a “timegrapher”
@@anthonytomlinson3311 Watch Accuracy Meter
About 15 years ago I bought a Seiko 5, not unlike yours, new, for around 50 UK pounds. Yours, converted, comes to around 230 UK pounds. I would say it just isn't worth it to buy a Seiko 5 for that kind of price, today. A few months ago I bought a quartz Seiko JDM chronograph for around 130; it had minimal rattle in the bracelet (about as much as that Tag) and the end-links, though hollow, fit tightly with no play at all. Seiko pricing is wildly inconsistent, and the price tag is no indicator of the quality you'll receive, it seems.
@@han_pritcher totally agree that the Seiko range is not priced consistently. The lesser known models are much better value!
Er, to me, the hour hands on both are too short , esp on the Seiko; from some angles on the TAG (Why?!)
This kind of watch with day/ date would be ideal ( perfect salaryman type).
I'm v.happy with ny Hamilton Jazzmaster, plus it's 34mm. If not a diver, I think both would be flying saucers on my wrist.
I much prefer the Seiko by a long shot!
@@maxinahunt8652 it is an awesome model for the price!
Hi Mark interesting to see you do a video on entry level watches.i only own one tag watch it's the Carrera 2 skeleton at 5k it's not the cheapest tag watch but it's a good looking watch. but if you want the best value for quality out there it's got to be Christopher ward the trident c60 at around 1k is a far better watch quality wise.the bracelet is better than most 5k watches better than Tudor bracelet s(not the new easylink jubilee bracelet) have you tried a Christopher ward? Great video thanks John.
Thanks John. I keep seeing Christopher Ward being pushed on YT, and I've kind of ignored them as I don't find the name very alluring! I need to give this brand a look!
Another interesting video - thank you. I think Seiko has interesting dials. Your comments about movement & bracelet quality are spot on. I also think essentially all Seiko’s, and Grand Seiko, are thicker than need be. Seiko fit & finish is notoriously inconsistent. Entry level Swiss, in my view, is Hamilton, Tissot, Certina & Mido. Each offer lots in $600 to $1200 USD that are very good. I like a number of Tag’s, and have an F1 quartz, but think they are all 25% too much at regular price.
@EdmundPorter-ju8kd Thank you, and yes, as much as I love Seiko and always will, there are a lot of flaws. I didn't even get started on alignment!
An interesting video but you have to consider you're comparing the lower end of the Swiss luxury market with a low end Seiko. What would have been interesting is to compare the Tag with something like the Seiko Alpinist which is still only about a third of the price of the Tag but still a step up from the Seiko here. As you say there are subtle differences. It seems the Swiss tend to put a higher level of finish on their movements and they're more aesthetic. I think Swiss watches today are far too expensive for what they are. When I started work in 1980 in the UK just about to turn 18 you could buy a Rolex submariner for £360. My take home monthly pay was about £300 so even an 18 yo office junior could stretch to a Rolex or an Omega speedmaster £300. I decided on a Tudor snowflake submariner £210. Nowadays these types of watches are around £6 - 10k although Tudors are around £4k. I think these prices are way beyond inflation. Even if I could afford it I wouldn't buy one as there's so many people around who would happily rob you. Also I think in these times it's immoral to spend that kind of money on an overpriced wristwatch. Regarding timekeeping most people I know who've had Seikos are very happy with them. I bought a vintage Seiko Speedtimer 6 months ago. For the first few months it kept time to about a second a day but nowadays it's more like 12 seconds a day. Not bad for a 54 yo watch. I'm fairly confident that if you have a mid range or above Seiko they can be regulated to keep time within chronometer specs.
@MichaelWilliams-mo1vv thanks for the comments. I wish I had the foresight to buy a Rolex, Omega and Tudor even 10 years ago at retail but I was in a different place then. I hear you about the morality of spending money on watches. I have no vices such as alcoholism, drugs, infidelity etc. so I'm happy with my moral choices, but I get what you mean.
@TheRandomWatchDude I made some howling mistakes with my watches. My first watch was a Tudor snowflake submariner which I bought in 1980 for £210. I sold the Tudor 2 years later and bought a Rolex submariner date for £500. It was the very first 300m model with the sapphire crystal but still had a matte dial. I sold it in 84 because I wanted to buy my first car. I bought another submariner date in 1988 for £1000. This model now had the glossy dial. I sold that watch in 2000 for £1400. I then bought a by then vintage Tudor submariner in 2005 for £750. It was a 1970 date model the first of the submariners with the square indices. I sold it a couple of years later for a £1000. Since that time the value of these what are now vintage pieces has soared. We're talking watches if I still owned them being collectively worth £40k. I had nothing against buying expensive watches because back then they were relatively attainable. I'm just astounded by today's prices which I put down partly to greed.
The other consideration is the cost of servicing. Many cheaper seiko movements are just replaced. I was considering purchasing a used High end mechanical Chrono until I found out a servicing could cost $700 CAD, gulp!!!
@terrylarson7596 Most people flick the watch once it gets near to service time for that very reason, and just go and buy another new one. So the money they saved on the service is spent 3 fold on buying a new one! We watch addicts are a strange breed!
Have a Seiko which serves as a decoy in my burglar decoy watch box in the living room (also contains 4 quartz shitters). As for my Heuer Carrera (not a TAG) it sits in the bank safe. At some point, my Breitling SuperOcean Abyss on Ocean Racer rubber strap with glidelock deployant replaced my Seiko Sawtooth diver as my holiday watch. As for the 35 mm silver colour two register Carrera chrono 3647 from the 1960s, I dont wear it much... Too many watches.
@@robynsjp a burglar decoy! What a genius idea!
@@TheRandomWatchDude The big watchbox is right in plain view in the living room. Maybe I should put it in the bedroom behind the socks... In plain view in the living room may be a little too obvious 😅
Very good review Mark. For me, I have a large Seiko collection from $250 to $1,500 USD and find them quite good. I admit that on the lower end models, I do replace the stock brackets with Strap Code or Uncles which seem to bring the comfort and quality up a bit. I have several that are reasonably accurate even the 7S26 that don't offer hand winding or hacking features. Overall, I think Seiko makes very good watches for the price. I have been considering Oris lately and Tudor as well. Thank you for the content.
@swkohnle08 hey thanks for the measured response. I am a Seiko fan too, and tour comment about the straps is very appropriate. I just bought a ln Alpinist and the stock strap is woefully short of the quality thrbwatch deserves. I'm literally buying some straps from Uncle now as I write this!
I started with Tissot and then went to Seiko years later.
I have a couple of Tissots, and compared to my Seikos at the same price point, I have a hard time saying one is better than the other.
I would say Tissot tends to try take more of a shortcut on machining towards the lugs on cases that come with a bracelet.
Seiko polishing tends to be worse than Tissot in how it ages.
Machining tends to be good on both at > 400 eur.
Dials, I kinda have to go to Seiko, but both great quality.
Movements I won't even get into, they both have massive pros and cons.
Oh dear… you could argue Seiko vs Rolex… they might live worlds apart but then is a Rolex worth over twenty times more than a Seiko? 😮
@chun-sunchan6106 well the advantage with Rolex is that it holds value whereas the TAG drops like a stone. Seiko vs Citizen would start a civil war with that video wouldn't I LOL
Hi there! I agree with you on pretty much everything you mentioned on the video. And I really enjoyed both the “conversation” as well as the comparison between those two pieces (and oh so happy to see you wear them often!). But the video seems to end so abruptly and unexpectedly… I actually think you never even gave your answer to the question on the title. To me, yes: it is worth paying more because you get more. But do you get 10 times more on specific scenario? No. Not at all. Maybe 4 times more…
@RuinasDomi thank you for the feedback. Yes the video did end a bit abruptly, and I think that's because I could have ranted on a lot more about the intangibles, and was keen to keep the run time lower! Sometimes when I'm talking like this I actually change my viewpoint mid conversation! It's authentic if nothing else!
@@TheRandomWatchDude I imagined so! But thought it might be worth pointing it out regardless. Apologies if I seemed redundant. Anyway, Seiko are great; they really are. But Tag Heur are, for the most part, so underappreciated. I recently purchased a brand new, heavily discounted, Autavia Automatic Chronometer in bronze, and it is absolutely sublime. Spectacular piece for the money. Cheers and keep those videos coming!
I’d get a certina gmt for 1000 instead of the Seiko
Grand Seiko Quartz.
Seiko make high end watches too though Soto so to say Seiko vs is not right… Seiko 5 vs makes more sense
@tariqkhonji6556 I agree Seiko make much better watches, but there are also much better Swiss watches out there. So the comparison was more entry level vs entry level
"SEIKO vs Swiss Luxury - WORTH paying more?" --- No. Next video.
@holgermuller3597 You like rattley bracelets, loose tolerances and unregulated movements? YES! It's very much a personal choice and value disproportionality is also subjective
@@TheRandomWatchDude No, I hate SEIKO.
Rubbish! You can set the movement and the Seiko is dead on!
@@bernardkoppes4401 straight from the factory running dead-on? Very very rare fluke
for someone doing watch vids. you should know to wear your watch above your wrist bone not below
@@xtr1092 for someone into watches you should know that people wear their watch however they like 👍
Below any day
@sufiveritas7375 I wear my watches a little on the loose side so they move around sometimes above, sometimes below
Almost all Swiss brands are all overpriced and overrated… Seiko is also getting very greedy as well… you want real value. Go microbrands or Chinese brand. TAD Heuer is a joke only fool will buy it. Sorry Especially any modern day TAD, waaaay overpriced and overrated and Swiss made name only, mostly made in China anyway….