It's funny how everyone cheats Devon Larratt's lift to say they can do more. Yet their form is always worse. Says a lot for how strong Devon Larratt's pronation is.
It's ok if ur much different on this lift the only thing needs is to replicate the training u do on center of table for example u do it like voevoda does it means ur training for high hook If u do it like devon does u do it like kings move or open toproll it doesn't matter only matters is when you replicate ur technique in table while ur training get it?
@nonamenxb6694 I disagree. Devons way of the pronation/back pressure allows for more muscles in the chain to be used. The other lift is more isolated and focuses on less muscles in the chain to be used or engaged. Devonshire lift is more versatile also, imo.
Devon's lift is unreal, I can't imagine having that much weight on my thumb & wrist. Form is everything when working out and his form was perfect, everyone else so far have not replicated his lift.
@@zGJungle Exaaaacttly! For Ermes this Lift would be much easier even if he would replicate Devons Form 1 to 1. For Vitaly it actually would be much harder than for Devon. So you can only compared the weight for pullers with similar formarm (lever) length.
This is great to talk about. All of your points are exactly right. The more people understand these fine details, the better we all get. If you guys go full bio on us, it will be fun. 💪
Thats true. The basic principle is when the weight close to ur weight point (your joint) so the the weight load will be heavier. Thank you coach ray 👌🏽
The Coach! Thank you for taking the time to explain & share valuable information to us. Have a good day & hope to see you on the table again very soon ❤
Thanks so much coach Ray. Super useful. I'm not an armwrestler, but I love the sport and how it is growing. As an older dude (57) I am inspired by Devon and other older strength athletes. It is the power of UA-cam that nudged me into some of this unique training. Maybe you can touch on the differences between tendons and muscles sometime.? Stay massive!
Exactly what I wrote on Alexey's video yesterday, he is not working on the same strength scenario than Devon was, due to the narrower angle he took. Devon's exercise is obviously open arm focused, when the match starts, and Alexey's is when he is arguably already in a good position or hook in his match.
And then we have Ermes who doesnt even know the difference between a pronator based lift and a back pressure based lift... he didnt even wrap belt around the thumb but bragged about doing more weight than devon. Pasta brain :D
Cool maybe inserting those video clips of them again in the middle and pausing to show the difference in angles and grip would be good (and explaining how each is doing it differently)
As the arm angle decreases as the hand rises above the elbow, it seems like some of the tension is transferred off the muscle onto the bone structure. The forearm bones (radius/ulna) become a tent pole that helps support the weight. The more upright the the forearm angle, the greater the effect.
Simple and concise description of levers and moment arms. This is why shorter lever arm wrestlers are able to generate more torque than their long lever counter parts. Where longer lever pullers compensate for this is the increased coverage associated with bigger and longer hands, fingers etc (on average). This is where training smart and making lifts more optimal for what you are targeting will allow for better transfer to the table.
Think of it like a crane picking up something heavy. They wouldn’t lay the boom out straight in front of the crane to lift because the crane would literally tip over . They point the broom up for stability and leverage before cabling up and lifting.
My old "mechanic" brain went into overdrive on the strap position, because you're basically describing torque. The further the weight is from the point of energy, the more torque required to move it. Thats why we have 19 different length ratchets in the garage, depending on how big or tight the nut is. Thats why the "over the knuckles" position is the hardest, because it's furthest from the point that the weight is trying to move. Throw in the rotational/pronator aspect and thats an insane amount of leverage required. Great video
Devon's lift is as strict as strict can be. The direction of force that the weight applies is inversely proportional to the angle of the arm from the elbow to the wrist. The more your hand starts to get into the 'uppercut' position, the easier it becomes to lift the weight. Devon's exercise was very tough. Even if guys like Ermes or Voevoda can move more weight than Devon, their arm angle was different.
@@kmb957 Ok. They think people are stupid and don't realize its different lift. Videos taken for social media buzz. The way they really train might be different.
Sir, please make a proper video for weekly training of toproll for beginners... In Which clearly you clearly describe that what should a beginner do in a week to get a stronger toproll
Great video. People think Devon is weak because other guys are lifting huge numbers, but they are lifting in a much easier position and method. Devon is strong, real fuckin strong. Obviously Levan is stronger, and Ermes we shall see, but the point is you can't compare the numebrs on the lifts unless they are done the exact same with arm position, strap placement, etc.
Devon eats breaths and sleeps arm wrestling! I trust he knows what he’s talking about just like I trust you Ray! Thank you for your training videos keep up the good work brother 💪💪
Devon fights with arm open though. So it is the same lift. That is the position they will both be at the table. If any one had Voevoda on the table with his arm as open as Devon has it in training and the same angle of attack - Voevoda would get pinned. So it is the same lift for arm wrestling purposes. Kings move vs no kings move
because it doesnt matter, only the angles matters, The distance from the weight to the fulcrum and such, Creates torque, wether he uses his legs or not doesnt matter on a static lift.
Simply looking at the physics aspect it is simple high school stuff. The moment of force is greater when you increase the distance from the fulcrum. Same reason we use a longer spanner or wrench for something that is difficult to loosen.
Good video Ray, but I think TORQUE at the elbow/wrist fulcrums is a better term than tension. . Torque equals force(weight of the resistance) x distance(distance between elbow and resistance where gravity is applied).
It's funny how everyone cheats Devon Larratt's lift to say they can do more. Yet their form is always worse. Says a lot for how strong Devon Larratt's pronation is.
Raise your hand ✋️ for people who didn't cheat in the lift
I say let them cheat, that way when they grip with Devon and feel how strong his wrist/hand is then they'll be able to understand why.
@@JBtheWARVillain Yeah just let them have the consequence of ego lifting, they will soon learn lol
It's ok if ur much different on this lift the only thing needs is to replicate the training u do on center of table for example u do it like voevoda does it means ur training for high hook
If u do it like devon does u do it like kings move or open toproll it doesn't matter only matters is when you replicate ur technique in table while ur training get it?
@nonamenxb6694 I disagree. Devons way of the pronation/back pressure allows for more muscles in the chain to be used. The other lift is more isolated and focuses on less muscles in the chain to be used or engaged. Devonshire lift is more versatile also, imo.
Finally someone makes a video explaining the differences, thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
voevoda also uses toes and hip
@@ggs5628 Don't forget his knees as well
Devon's lift is unreal, I can't imagine having that much weight on my thumb & wrist. Form is everything when working out and his form was perfect, everyone else so far have not replicated his lift.
Especially when you consider how long his forearm is, all the leverage working against him.
@@zGJungle Exaaaacttly! For Ermes this Lift would be much easier even if he would replicate Devons Form 1 to 1. For Vitaly it actually would be much harder than for Devon. So you can only compared the weight for pullers with similar formarm (lever) length.
Great explanation Coach Ray!
Appreciate it!
This is great to talk about. All of your points are exactly right. The more people understand these fine details, the better we all get. If you guys go full bio on us, it will be fun. 💪
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@voiceofarmwrestlingyou guys should make more arm-wrestling training videos because they are really cool thanks for the training videos
8 minutes of Ray trying to not say vectors
😂😂😂
Great explanation. Hoever, this is still far beyond the understanding of Devon haters.
Someone should make posters out of that shot of Devon cracking that lift off the floor. It's iconic and classic classic Devon.
Solid video. Might have damaged a lot of egos though 😂
Probably
Thats true.
The basic principle is when the weight close to ur weight point (your joint) so the the weight load will be heavier.
Thank you coach ray 👌🏽
Thanks for sharing
Yes more of these physics and bio-mechanics vids. I learned a lot today
To anyone who has never done the lift the difference might seems trivial. But the small changes make a big difference. Great explanation!
The Coach! Thank you for taking the time to explain & share valuable information to us. Have a good day & hope to see you on the table again very soon ❤
Thank you! You too!
Great video coach 👍.
Micro adjustments with this lift are what sets them apart
Yes they are
This is something about all the back pressure cable comparisons that nobody seems to correctly take into account.
I cant believe Alexey did a Ryan Blowen maneuver.
Thanks so much coach Ray. Super useful. I'm not an armwrestler, but I love the sport and how it is growing. As an older dude (57) I am inspired by Devon and other older strength athletes. It is the power of UA-cam that nudged me into some of this unique training.
Maybe you can touch on the differences between tendons and muscles sometime.?
Stay massive!
Yes Truee, Devon move with Letter L, and of course its more hard, and Alexey move with Letter V, yes i know its not easy too, but its not same
Very informative video. Explaining a lot.
My god this channel is gold.
Big difference 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Simply the leverage topic of physics (Im talking about placing the weight on your arm), thanks!
Welcome!
Lifting parallel to the body vs perpendicular to it is also a key difference. It's tougher when you do it parallel to your body body.
Exactly what I wrote on Alexey's video yesterday, he is not working on the same strength scenario than Devon was, due to the narrower angle he took. Devon's exercise is obviously open arm focused, when the match starts, and Alexey's is when he is arguably already in a good position or hook in his match.
VERY insightful and informational, thank you for the info!
Glad it was helpful!
Now this was a good, constructive video. 💪
If your arm is longer then the extra leverage will make this lift harder. Would love to see a video that goes a bit deeper into biomechanics Ray
Devon proved himself
And then we have Ermes who doesnt even know the difference between a pronator based lift and a back pressure based lift... he didnt even wrap belt around the thumb but bragged about doing more weight than devon. Pasta brain :D
Cool maybe inserting those video clips of them again in the middle and pausing to show the difference in angles and grip would be good (and explaining how each is doing it differently)
Perfect video 💪🏽 was getting real tired of seeing all the ignorant comments on not understanding how physics works 😅
Please bro I loved this video. We need more biomechanics
Coach Ray is one smart dude. He knows his sport well and he speaks such fluent english and can articulate well
Spot on !! Hence every Armwresrler has different strengths in different angles 😊👍
I like your explaining my friend
👌👌👌
Thank you so much 🙂
As the arm angle decreases as the hand rises above the elbow, it seems like some of the tension is transferred off the muscle onto the bone structure. The forearm bones (radius/ulna) become a tent pole that helps support the weight. The more upright the the forearm angle, the greater the effect.
Good content
Devon is such a deep student/master of the art of strength. Impressive local strength and good form. And what about that Squat?
amazing bro 🔥
Thanks 🔥
Awesome analytical breakdown, love it! …Voyevoda has probably also seen it and immediately changed his technique 😊
You can put a short insert vid of both lifts would make this even better.
I did that on 1s of the video
Simple and concise description of levers and moment arms.
This is why shorter lever arm wrestlers are able to generate more torque than their long lever counter parts. Where longer lever pullers compensate for this is the increased coverage associated with bigger and longer hands, fingers etc (on average).
This is where training smart and making lifts more optimal for what you are targeting will allow for better transfer to the table.
I can see where a lot of people would make use of these type of videos, more of these would be appreciated 💪
Think of it like a crane picking up something heavy. They wouldn’t lay the boom out straight in front of the crane to lift because the crane would literally tip over . They point the broom up for stability and leverage before cabling up and lifting.
Excellent video!
The video we all knew we needed 😅
Thanks Ray
My old "mechanic" brain went into overdrive on the strap position, because you're basically describing torque. The further the weight is from the point of energy, the more torque required to move it. Thats why we have 19 different length ratchets in the garage, depending on how big or tight the nut is. Thats why the "over the knuckles" position is the hardest, because it's furthest from the point that the weight is trying to move. Throw in the rotational/pronator aspect and thats an insane amount of leverage required. Great video
Devon's lift is as strict as strict can be. The direction of force that the weight applies is inversely proportional to the angle of the arm from the elbow to the wrist. The more your hand starts to get into the 'uppercut' position, the easier it becomes to lift the weight. Devon's exercise was very tough. Even if guys like Ermes or Voevoda can move more weight than Devon, their arm angle was different.
Enjoyed a lot. Please do more with Janis on biomechanics and physics.
I am amazed that pro's do not know this basic things about mechanics of these lifts. Very good video Ray.
The pros do know. They think you don't.
@@kmb957 Ok. They think people are stupid and don't realize its different lift. Videos taken for social media buzz. The way they really train might be different.
This channel is one of the best out there. Thank You for your time and effort
Little Devon making sense again 🟢💪
make more of this type of video! but with white boards and trigonometry!!
Man this is a great video
That was awesoome insight into the technical part of training. Thank you for this it explained alot.
Great video brother! Your training content for arm wrestling is top notch.
I appreciate that!
Trust the coach to clear this debate up! 💪🏼
Thank you !
Excellent video! Perfect articulation and the details needed are very useful... something almost nobody does. Well done my friend !
Thanks coach
make a video top10 specific exercises for armwrestling
keep doing these type of videos 🙂
Good video. Someone had to do it !!
Janis: Biomechanics
Ray: Biomehanics
Amazing points Coach Ray appreciate all the content. Great deep dive into the complexity of arm wrestling out of the table.
Great video Ray. You forgot to mention how Alexey had a cupped wrist and kipped up the weight with his legs as well though
Great video 👍
Thanks 👍
Great content
Sir, please make a proper video for weekly training of toproll for beginners... In Which clearly you clearly describe that what should a beginner do in a week to get a stronger toproll
BRAVO 👏🏻
I respect Voevoda a lot, but you are right, the excercise isn't the same
Thanks a lot Coach. Devon has improved so much. I thought Ermes was going to crush him. Im a huge Devon fan and literally was like holy crap... 3-0
Lately Your videos have been just 🔥
Great video. People think Devon is weak because other guys are lifting huge numbers, but they are lifting in a much easier position and method. Devon is strong, real fuckin strong. Obviously Levan is stronger, and Ermes we shall see, but the point is you can't compare the numebrs on the lifts unless they are done the exact same with arm position, strap placement, etc.
Would love a video series on this!
Devon eats breaths and sleeps arm wrestling! I trust he knows what he’s talking about just like I trust you Ray! Thank you for your training videos keep up the good work brother 💪💪
💪💪💪Thanks bro! *Quality* Video 💯
Great content!!! 👍Devon always is called a "Cheater" but he isn't fool himself like others for sure 😅💪
devon🔥🔥🔥
Great video! Thx
One thing no one is talking about is that Alexys hand was more supinated than Devon’s, changing the lift in that way as well
Devon fights with arm open though. So it is the same lift. That is the position they will both be at the table. If any one had Voevoda on the table with his arm as open as Devon has it in training and the same angle of attack - Voevoda would get pinned. So it is the same lift for arm wrestling purposes.
Kings move vs no kings move
You forgot to mention that Vevoda also is lifting with his leg
because it doesnt matter, only the angles matters, The distance from the weight to the fulcrum and such, Creates torque, wether he uses his legs or not doesnt matter on a static lift.
thanks Coach!! always love your videos, keep teaching us and keep kicking ass buddy!
Love me some biomhammocks
More of these videos would be welcomed!
Simply looking at the physics aspect it is simple high school stuff. The moment of force is greater when you increase the distance from the fulcrum. Same reason we use a longer spanner or wrench for something that is difficult to loosen.
Thanks for explaining this. The reddit comments "ITS NOT THE SAME LIFT" weren't really shedding enough light on this :)
Glad it was helpful!
Great video Ray.
Explaining that to a 40 years old with years of armwrestling is very funny to me… looks like only Devon knows what he is doing
Ray, it would be interesting to demonstrate some excersises with bands.
Thanks for for the tutorial vids.
preach, Coach, preach
Good video Ray, but I think TORQUE at the elbow/wrist fulcrums is a better term than tension. . Torque equals force(weight of the resistance) x distance(distance between elbow and resistance where gravity is applied).
Thank You will work on my specific terms on this.
Nice video
Great
Yea man, perfect explanation to those ones think they can do the lift thing weight more than Devon did.
More videos about biomechanics please!
Using a lever calculation at 90° you are lifting 100% of the weight. At 45° it drops to 70%, at 30° its 50%.
maths