Superbike Vs E Bike: What Makes You Faster?
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- Опубліковано 20 вер 2024
- Are e-bikes really not ‘proper’ cycling or only only for lazy people? We don’t think so! E bikes are becoming more and more popular and, despite motor assistance being limited to 25kph in the UK, they are fun, fast, and can help burn calories! But are they better than your traditional road bike? Alex has decided to put this to the test. You may be surprised by the results!
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What would you choose: a superbike or an e-bike?
Superbike. I can't afford either of those 2, but that would be my choice.
I see the value to ebikes and if they get more people riding that's great. But if they move people from full cycling to ebiking, not so much.
Some would look at hills and say that was a reason not to use a bike, but ebikes take that fear away in some of them. That has to be good.
Personally I like knowing it was me doing it. It also gives me an outlet for 'issues.'
I ride to replace car trips, so an e-bike is the right solution, IMO. On those climbs, especially long ones, I've had occasion to pass commuters at a redonkulous speed differential, and it highlights the factor that would dissuade many from cycling for transportation. Plus the speeds are not carefully policed here, and where it is safe, (on open roads with traffic going 45 mph next to me, for example), I can operate my e-bike at 22-32 mph on the flats, making up time even wen not climbing.
Even if riding for fitness and clearing your head, the e-bike allows for more range from your home, so your rides can be much more varied.
Ebike. I want something I would always use for every condition. And I dont race
I think you need a superbike compared with ebike with the assistance, without any assistance and with no battery. I think your sponsors can provide the empty shell to fill the gap on the frame when you remove the battery
I do commute on an ebike once or twive a week. With a superbike i couldn't take all the gear i'd need. If it was summer all year round and if there was proper cycling infrastructure where i live i might give it a second thought, but with the slightest climbs on the way and the need for carry-on weight the ebike wins.
I have gone from being a fit road rider, to having long covid and thinking I would never be able to keep up with my old ride group again, 2 months ago I sold my trek madone (which was on the bike volt A couple of years ago) and got my self a Wilier Cento1 Hybrid e-road bike. Now I’m back out and riding I can’t do the long rides that I use to due to the battery life. But I’m riding again! On the flats it’s all me as the pace is high and the motor cuts out, but when we hit a hill I don’t have a full on asthma attack and have to give up and go home.
🤘
Sorry to hear about the COVID, but I'm pleased to see you're back out and riding again 👍
Similar to my experince. I already had asthma but then TBC got me.
I almost died twice from Covid, 8 months apart & as a parting gift, I also got Long Term Covid, & was basically bed ridden for months because my lungs are so bad, & with having to retire working because my health & the financial issues it brought on, it sent me into a terrible depression, so laid in bed letting myself go for a year, well ever since I got an e-Bike I'm back outside again, I ride 20+miles a day here in Reno, I lost 25lbs, & my lungs are greatly improved, I really believe getting an e-Bike SAVED MY LIFE, I also use it to run most of my errands, I can even take my son with me on errands, because the bike takes care of most of the hard work! 👍
That sucks sorry for your loss ✊
I have both an e-road bike and a carbon frame road bike ... The e-road's main advantage for me is that it enables me to keep up with my group of mates on rides with climbs. I'm a fit 63 year old, but heavier rider. Its the climbs where most of us heavier riders lose time against the lighter riders.
A second advantage for me is that where I live (NSW, Australia) we get a lot of days with high winds ... on those days I ride my e-road bike which makes life easier driving into a headwind with the pedal assist. I love both and don't believe riding an e-road is cheating ... Its about looking after our health and wellbeing as we get older and slower. I have ridden over 7,000km this year with more km's on my carbon frame than e-road. Also ... I only use the lower and middle pedal assist settings on my e-road ... The top assist setting isn't necessary most of the time. My main reason for buying an e-road bike .... I had heart attacks and 3 stents 5 years ago ... it makes sense.
Yes! As you get 'older and slower' - that's it exactly. I live in a very hilly area, and over the last few years those hills have mysteriously got steeper and longer, causing me to look for flatter terrain which limited my ride options considerably. So finally, for my 90th birthday I went electric and it's great. I'm hoping now to be able to revisit most of my old routes, and to keep it up for a while longer. Horses for courses is the expression which comes to mind.
Nice to see Alex’s remarkable growth in confidence over this last year. Still got bloke-next-door charm but now a slick presenter with it. 👏👏👏
I use an e-bike for commuting to work and when "going somewhere", and a regular gravel bike when I go out to enjoy some time on the bike. The benefit to me is that I can last longer on an e-bike and I can choose how much assistance I want or need depending on mood and energy levels (or distance).
I think an e-bike helps a lot of people get out the door to begin with, and for me it's also a way to get out during our miserable winters since the e-bike is better prepared with studded winter tires etc.
Well said Patrick!
Crazy thought but if you could ride E-bikes without the limiter so long as you had a moped license and stayed off the public pathways when the limiter is off?
Would that be a way to ease the limiter issue a bit?
I love my Orbea gain even though its the lowest spec with Tiagra. At 73 enables me to go out and keep up.
Truth is the majority of us do not need anything near the spec of Ultegra and Dura-ace, 105 being probably the absolute max us regular joes will beenfit from. If you're out and cycling that's all that matters
And that's what it's all about 👍
Why keep up? Go out with people of your own age but on bicycles not two wheeled vehicles.
@@petermckie7644 the trouble is that the people in my age group 70+ now all have e-bikes.
@@SWatchik if Shimano just erase all the lower groupsets and just have ultegra and Dura ace, they can lower the price to 1/5th and still profit.
In terms of fitness, the ebikes have multiple settings. There is usually the eco, some help, a lot of help and turbo. But everyone forgets to mention off. When I'm on an ebike I most often ride with no assistance. Only use it for getting over hills, cutting down a headwind or keeping up when traffic is heavier. Many would say this defeats the purpose, but it helps me commute by bike most days instead of just 1 or 2 days a week.
Same! My power is off for a large portion of my rides, and minimal assist for high altitude hill climbing. I think people don’t realize that e-bikes are significantly heavier as well. I get a great workout.
This is encouraging for me. I just bought an Orbea Gain mainly for a 56km round commute. I wanted something to get me there and back quicker and in better shape when facing a headwind. This test has proved the principle - bike comes next week.
Bloody hell fella!! That's one hell of a commute. Fair play 👍
@@Biking360 It is, longest I've attempted. Wish me luck. Bike pickup next week.
@@NeilLavitt Good luck!!
I have hybrid Ebike and use it purely for recovery rides I find it great for keeping the heart rate down especially when it’s windy or undulating, my age 71
I am not sure which makes you faster but I know which makes you healthier! That being said I get it why some people who need some assistance ride them! I am 66 and still only ride my regular bikes but as I get older my choices may change! Anything is better than sitting on the couch!
I‘d love to see an e-bike which you can pair up to your head unit and tell „only help me exactly that much so I don‘t leave my power zone“.
For commuting it‘s no question. A ride to work and back is 60km/900m uphill for me. It saves so much time.
Orbea Gain will connect to your HR monitor and provide assist depend on HR Zones you set it at. A bit more delayed than power meter but still pretty cool way of ensuring you get a workout but not arrive at work knackered.
@@StevenDrewitt And only a small step to connecting to a powermeter. Could be done with a software update I guess.
In reality, e bike pedal assist is a pretty laggy sensor. Every one I've tried has taken about a half second to start after I began pedalling and a half second to stop once I coasted. On a consistent effort you could try to use it as a dyno but in the real world I think it'd be hard to get ut tuned.
Where ebikes are awesome is turning up to say an office job not completely drenched in sweat. Especially if your a 65year old or just starting out on the excercise from a sedentary lifestyle.
Great you did this experiment and interesting results but the calorie count doesn’t make sense to me. An all-out effort for about 30mins should be around 500 calories burnt
Yeah it is very off. Super-bike is 167*.85*3.6 is 511 calories. So he was using the formula for calories, thinking it was kJs and then going backwards.
He's converting useful work (power*time) in joules to useful work in calories, but calling the latter burned energy. He didn't to take into account the efficiency of the human body (~25%), so all numbers are 4 times too low.
@@lazylizard6705 This is a dark art indeed. My Garmin only moderately overestimates work done, but when I use a power meter, it's very similar. On my morning commute I burn, according to my power meter, approx 1200 kcals (100 mins). I have asked many people and never got an answer about "actual" energy burned
I live in southern California in an area with lots of hills and mountains. Since I'm in the U.S. where they're legal I have a Level 3, assist to 45 kph, Giant commuter bike.
I did a lot of road and mountain biking into my early 50s, then my knees got iffy so I quit riding for about 10 years. I started doing a short, flat commute a few years ago where a bike was the most practical form of transportation and it didn't hurt my knees, so I started riding my old mountain bike again. But I still couldn't handle any kind of serious hill before my knees and lack of fitness had me walking.
My retirement present to myself two years ago was the the e-bike. The biggest thing it gives me is confidence. So far even on the steepest hills I stay in the saddle thanks to the motor. It also helps get me out the door. Sore legs? So what, you've got a motor. Try another excuse. Finally, instead of sitting around counting new wrinkles I'm outside moving, getting a few hours of cardio every week and looking forward to my next ride. Best purchase I've made in a long time.
Excellent video Alex - I've been waiting for this for a while now! Interesting results, too...
Good and interesting tests. I think the important thing here is that on the e-bike you don't get a 'free ride'. So many look at them and scoff, and as you mentioned at the start say it's cheating. But, if e-bikes get folks out riding and exercising then that has to be a BIG thumbs up! On the e-bike you were still burning calories and for the average person that has to be really good. Not everyone aspires to ride at TDF levels, it's surely about getting out there in the fresh air, enjoying the countryside and most importantly 'the Coffee Stops'!! Thanks again - cheers.
The calories seem to be way off. One hour at an average of 240W gives me like 800kcal burnt?
1 Wh is 0.86 kcal, 240 Wh is 206.4 kcal.
So that means that our body is about 25% efficient when it comes to cycling in this particular scenario, which is reasonable. It's about what you get from a combustion engine.
Edit: Wrote that comment before watching the vid. Yeah, if those numbers in the vid were accurate, I'd weigh about 50kg more right now...
Ron how do you measure the energy burned? Your app shows you an estimate based on some kind of model that’s about the average for most people. However if you take just the pedal energy the test is much more repeatable…
Alex Took the kilo joule number ( 1 Watt secound is 1 joule). So 300w for about 30 min is 300w for 1800s, thats 540000 joule or 540 kilo joule. Thats correct so far that is the work done at the crank. His Calculation factor of 4.2 is also correct but he forgot biomechanical effiziency. It is a bit lower that 25% so 1 joule at the crank is one cal on the spoon. So to produce 300w for 30 min you should eat about 540kcal.
@@mattschm5486 sure there is no actual way to measure burnt calories. I just trust, that Wahoo, Tacx and Strava know what to make off my body numbers, the heart rate and the power sensor in my crank.
This is what I was thinking, even walking burns around 300 calories an hour. Only 100 calories burnt in 51 minutes of cycling? No chance.
Should do it on a bike in USA. A lot of e bikes offer assistance up 45kph or 28 mph. You’d probably blow the super bike out of the water.
One of the best comparisons that I've seen, thanks.
I don't understand how cycling professionals/journalists can mess numbers up this much. How do you burn 138kcal in 32 minutes @ 300W? That should at least be 400-500 kcal.
I believe they used the pedal power values. So it’s the energy the body had to generate for the ride without the overhead for other bodily functions which is quite hard to measure to the same accuracy than the actual pedal power which is comparably easy to measure. To get reliable results on how much energy the body burned to a similar accuracy than measuring the pedal power you would need to accurately measure the oxygen consumption of the body for the ride than calculate how much energy your body can produce using this oxygen. Then you would have the specific values for one rider on this specific road. Someone with a different metabolism might need more or less energy to do the same. why does it matter for the outcome of the test. You can assume that the same body at the same heartrate and pedal power will probably use a similar amount of energy. So by taking 300W power at the pedals for a bit more than 30 minutes. The energy for moving the bike is right in the 130 kcal range. …. This is the actual easily measurable value everything else is depending on your metabolism, system weight ( you plus baggage+bike weight…) etc. Since he is comparing 2 bikes at similar exertion levels the absolute amount of energy the body burns doesn’t matter. The factor between the values is interesting
I have a Pivot E Vault gravel bike which gives assistance to 45 KPH. I am 71 and enjoy riding much more with assist. This bike puts a smile on my face. I've had the bike for two weeks and have ridden 375 kilometers on it. The Fazua system allows me to customize the assist level through an app and I can hardly wait for my next ride.
I have used an e-bike for over 6 years and 8,800 miles, mostly to go to work (10 to 13 miles away). I also have done the same commute with a regular faster hybrid bike, but the e-bike on a long ride with many steep climbs along the way, still gets me to work faster overall and without sweating. A regular bike is more fun to ride but requires more effort and some sweat, which makes it hard to dress for work. My e-bike feels a little like riding a bus -- it is heavy, and racing bikes are always passing me. Nonetheless, it gets the job done better than any lighter faster bike. And it saves a lot of time because even a small motor with 40 nanometers of torque still makes quick work of all the hills.
10:51 what is going on with those numbers.
300 Watt average at only 152 bpm, while burning a grand total of 138kcal in half an hour? Did you convert watts to kcal without accounting for how many watts your body actually goes through to put that power to the pedals? (ballpark factor x4)
I came to make the same comment. They've completely neglected to account for the efficiency loss of the human body. I've know idea how that could slip past an editing and review process. Most cyclists should pick up that error in a heart beat.
I think they took the pure work put out in kJ, converted to kcal, without accounting for anything else. Since it is a pure comparison those factors can pretty much be put aside.
I believe they used a power meter on the pedals. Let me ask you another question back how do you measure the exact power your body needed? Without using a mask to measure your oxygen use. You can maybe estimate the value but then it’s only an estimate with the power meter you get precise measurements which are repeatable with a known error range. So your results are directly comparable.
@@my_obscure_epoch9346 what difference does it make to the result of the video. He was comparing 2 rides at mostly comparable pedal power and heartrate levels. Yes probably the amount of calories his body burned is quite higher than the given numbers however you can only estimate these numbers and for a similar power output at a similar heart rate the factor between peral power and how much energy your body actually used should be similar. So if you insist multiply the values by 4 but it doesn’t change much about the outcome
@@mattschm5486 The difference is; 1) given the comments on this video, apparently it's confusing to reference calories used on a ride that don't correlate with what people commonly understand the energy consumption should be, 2) at 9:40 he literally compares the calories he burnt between the two rides in a real world context about food consumption and states it was about 40 calories less on the ebike, this is just plain wrong and leads me to believe the whole thing was just a mistake.
It’s really hard not to recommend an ebike for almost everyone now. Even people who are relatively fit if they live in a particularly hilly area or want to go on longer rides than they previously did; while also having the peace of mind that the motor will be there for them if they overdo it.
And even the most fit people might ride regular bikes and possibly race them. But in their day to day lives, an E-cargo bike could replace their car and help them carry quite a lot when they need to do that.
I have a Gravel e-bike and use the assist periodically for those tougher climbs and when I am in a long distance ride. I really enjoyed the comparison as I am contemplating the next bike I want to buy. A standard gravel bike for the lesser weigh and let my wife have the Gravel bike or get her a touring e-bike and keep the gravel bike and only use assist when needed. Oh the dilemma. Thanks Alex for this. Only stellar video by Alex and GCN.
The main use case that ebikes have a hard time fulfilling is long distance bikepacking. I take my road bike and a backpack a ways down the road, camp in some woods, and keep going the next day. After about 4-6h most ebikes are out of juice and become a really heavy regular bike and unless you pay to stay somewhere with power it stays that way the rest of your trip.
A good quality gas powered bike would do alright here. I reckon gas is probably cheaper than food.
If someone offered me a a choice between a free e-bike or a free super bike, I'd take the super bike. But, I'm only 64 now. Maybe in 10 or 20yrs I'll feel different about assisted riding.
You did the calorie calculation wrong. Here’s what I think you messed up. There are approx 4 kCal in one kJ, but the kJs measurement you are getting is power AT THE CRANKS while the calorie count we care about is the energy used by your whole body. Since your body is about 25% efficient it cancels out the 4x multiplier. So if your used 500kJ according to your power meter then you also burned about 500kCal (actually a bit less but it’s close).
Yes! Totally agree.
I see it that way. You can GUESS a burned calorie value or you can MEASURE the output power. Why do you care about an estimate if you can use measurable values.
My cycling buddy is 75 years old and rides a s works creo turbo. It gives him the chance to get out on group rides and can sustain an 80 mile sportive. So I would say if I gets you out in the fresh air and cycling , get an E bike. 👍🚴👍🚴
Those KCAL per hour figures seem pretty low, regardless of which bike you were on. Especially for the 'full gas' effort, approximately 250KCAL per hour at full gas?
Yupp , the values he mentioned looks to be too low... I reckon we as a normal average human would spend around 30 calories per kilometre. The kilo joules value he read first seems to be right value
They werent. You are thinking of something else
They're kcal in terms of the energy that was put into pushing the pedals, not the kcal he actually burnt. (Roughly 4x higher, most head units will just report the kJ readings as kcal burnt for this reason) Pretty poor oversight by GCN
I have an e-mtb and e-hybrid. Living at moderate altitude (7,000 feet), and being an older cyclist, they are equalizers for me to attain distances and altitudes that would otherwise be unattainable. I only use minimal assist to get up steeper inclines, and I use my gears in the same way that I would my analog bikes. I do see many fellow e-bikers using them more like scooters….to each his own. That’s not my particular strategy. I’ve found that I’m way more fit because of the e-bike options, and I ride on days, and in locations, that would have been off my list before.
Pretty much as expected. I’ve demoed ebikes here in the U.S. where they are restricted to either 20 or 28 mph (32 to 45 kph) and you can pretty much go flying up any hill. I was chasing some guy on an ebike down the local trail here today and could stay with him even while riding my 35 year old steelie as long as the road stayed flat. But as soon as the climb started I let him go. I already knew I wouldn’t be able to stay with him even on a modern race bike.
Your presenting is so much better now !!
The three take home messages are these:
1) Just as a 4800 lb Tesla Plaid is much faster than a 3200 lb Lamborghini or Ferrari, electric torque trumps added weight EVERY time.
2) Races are won by minutes saved on the climb, not seconds saved on the flats or descents
3) The gains saved by the class 1 e-bike (20 mph max assist) available in Europe are greatly increased by a class 3 e-bike (28 mph max assist) available in the USA. This comparison using a very capable rider on an expensive aero bike seems to confirm my real world experience that only the most extraordinary cyclist would be able to leave me behind on a hilly ride on my Trek Domane+ with 28 mph Bosch motor. I fear no rider 😉 (All praise to the bike, not me as a rider).
Faster in a straight line not around a track. Poor analogy.
I'm 63, have evo super six e bike and a synapse aluminium , I live on a large flat area called the Vale of York. Its surrounded by hills. So e bike comes out for Hilly rides otherwise stick to good old synapse. Some of said hills are 20% plus gradients which at 13 stone and being a FOSSIL (Fella Over Sixty Still In Lycra) are now impossible without e. E has put the grin factor back into cycling for me . As far as workouts are concerned I train on the turbo and at the gym but outdoor cycling is about the grin. See you all out there!
Sorry...being happy while riding your bike is not allowed. You must be miserable and look down on people who ride e-bikes. Please start your self loathing now and beg your fellow non e-bike cyclist for forgiveness. :P
I've found that simply using a lower power-assist setting allows me to get the workouts I like to achieve. My ebike has 3 power settings and I rarely use the highest (turbo) mode at all. Even at 16% gradients the middle setting provides plenty of assistance while forcing me to work nice and hard.
I've also found that the slightly faster speeds the ebike provides on steep climbs makes me feel steadier and more secure. It is much easier to keep a solid upright position when going uphill at 5.5 - 6.5 mph as opposed to 4 - 5 mph. It's not much difference but seems to make a big improvement in my riding safety.
And on steep descents the added weight of the ebike seems to provide more stability. On a really light bike I experience a bit of speed wobble, which I REALLY don't like. I don't experience any of that with the heavier ebike.
I use an ebike for shopping and going to the scrapyard. A non ebike for fitness and faster rides, sometimes it nice to ride a lighter bike.
Alex I did this myself. The only difference was I rode over 26 miles on each bike a 2017 year old Orbea Gain 20 vs a 2019 Scott Foil 20 over the Rhigos mountain then down to Pontypridd then back up the valley. I did get a 18 minute gain over the non ebike but burnt over 100kcal moee on the ebike and was sweating like Gary Glitter in a playground at the end of it.
It weighed in at 13kg vs my 8kg foil. Definitely over than the mountain where I got my best time ever, the remainder was either flat or slightly uphill I was riding at around 18 to 20mph in those areas so no assistance therefore I was pushing more weight for longer. I'm an enthusiastic 52yr old weakling but I'll not be swapping out yet but you'll not catch me saying ebikes are for cheaters that's for sure.
Great video BTW nice to see a objective video on this subject.
Great content and shows both sides - for me personally , most riding is above 25kph so I’m just carrying the extra weight of the x35 unit around so working hard there and if I use it on say, anything above 5% it’s like getting a good cardio spin session done - either way it’s a win win scenario
Really interesting video. I do have a gain m30 and absolutely love it.
Great video! I don't own an e-bike (yet) but i'm a big advocate for the reasons Alex alluded to. I have a certain amount of time for my rides in between life and work and would get much more enjoyment from going further and seeing more things - which an e-bike would allow. It would also mean i could do more varied routes because a single big hill wouldn't end my ride by taking all i had so i could keep going once i reach the top
Riding Alex had an asymmetrical stache. That drove me crazy. I have no idea about the content of the video around these scenes 😅
@@liam4686 Thanks for the heads-up on this 👌
Really interesting video and analysis. Thank you. (e-bike commuter)
Very interesting. At 68 I don’t feel like struggling up hills like I used to. My speed profile for an 80km ride shows only 5 brief periods below 25km/h where my motor assisted. Love my Gain.
Why get hung up on speed? Get easier gears or s triple chain set. Need speed? Buy a motorbike.
@@petermckie7644 perhaps because you don’t get and keep fit on a motorbike. I’m not hung up on speed, you don’t even know me.
Well having an e-bike get people out riding. I have seen that for my self not being very active for 10+ years and then seeing myself going out for 20km rides 4-5 times a week. So even if you burn a bit less calories riding the ebike I think thats better than not riding at all at least from a health perspective. On another note this has lead me to buy a road bike that I really look forwards to riding outdoors when the spring comes. Will try to combine both e-bike and roadbike next season :)
The best workout is the one you do.....so many people forget this and you seemed to have figured it out.
At the age of 73, I need one for my group rides. But can't afford one.
Even if you strap a turbo-fan onto it, a bike is still a bike. If I didn't know my lazy arse too well, I'd already have an e-bike
That's not just your regular e-bike, that's a super-e-bike
I love my e-bike, even though I have 2 Road bikes, and even though its a low-end Carrera rear-wheel motor.
If your NP on the fast super bike run is 298w then this roughly for calories is 1000 cal per hour, 298*3600/1000 is work done - 1073KJ then convert this to calories will be around 1000, the difference being heat/energy used in conversion.
I'm confused? 4.183kj = 1 kcal. So how can 1073kj equate to 1000kcal.
I use an ebike as a mode of transport. I've adjusted my style not to ride as fast as I can but right more efficiently and as close to the 25kph where practical to get the most out of the assistance.
did Alex only shave the left stash?
In NZ ebikes are limited to 32kph which is much more sensible because the average speed on the flat for most of us is around that 27 to 33kph range. I commute over a large hill on my ride to work and back. On the homeward leg it starts with a steep ramp of around 13%. Its amazing how fast ebike riders go past. Quickly putting minutes into you. It takes me just over an hour each way. With an ebike it'd probably take 15mins off each way which is quite tempting!
I do get the e-bike for the courier services but I don't get it for the training purposes. I mean why would Orbea make an e-bike? If you look for a leisure bike rather than training one probably, but then what is the reason to buy such a performance-ish one?
Totally agree
IMO because a performance e-bike looks better - I think there's a significant group of people who want/need the accessibility and convenience of an e-bike, but don't want to look like they are riding an e-bike. It's not that different from the many people who buy an aero road bike, but don't race.
When you look at the numbers of ebikes sold, manufacturers will build what people want to buy, but I couldn't really see Orbea doing a step through frame with paniers, the one in the test fits their ethos better.
These ebikes are aimed at those who want a bike that looks like a road bike and rides like one. Some pedal assist helps. Great for a less fit or capable rider to keep up on a club ride and to take the sting out of hills and headwinds. They certainly make no sense for training but do a great deal to level the game for more to enjoy. For me, it’s a big commute made easier on days I feel done and when facing a nasty headwind. Still out on a great bike.
IMO ebikes are ok for the old, the broken, or the unhealthy, or for commuting. They're pretty lame for "training" or anything related to sport or sense of accomplishment though. People like to talk about how far they ride on ebikes etc, but its a completely different sport and anything you do on it is a major * compared to a standard(real)bike. I think the rise of ebikes is another sign of the times and society wanting to make everything easy with faster results for the lazy.
Takeaway for me is this....Buy an Ebike (motorbike) without a speed limiter.
50kph (30mph) is a reasonable speed for road riding....buy, or modify it, to do that!
Otherwise youre just buying a stupidly expensive and heavy bike.
E bikes are very much misunderstood. I'm a huge fan and applaud their growing popularity.
Isn't about time you did a comparison of similarly specced bikes so we can judged which one is better.
I recently sold my mid-tier Synapse 105 for a similarly equipped, but newer Domane+. It's been great for commuting and general road riding, and I've even done a few TTs (unassisted, obvs) on it.
Overall, it's been a fantastic purchase and has allowed me to not ride easier, but to ride just as hard for much longer.
11kg is still tolerable weight so that makes the results so even on flat sections. Plus it's pretty are anyways. Try the same with more fluffier battery bike that weighs 15kg or more :D I just tried today with my riding buddy. The swearing started right after I took the speed at 26kph and blew up when I took the effort and made that fast heavy sprint uphill :D I have a Rose Backroad gravel bike and my mate has a Kona Remote hard tail.
Really interesting results 👌 For me, a faster rider may not want an ebike, a slower rider may do. Either way, if we're all out enjoying riding, what's the problem?
It does not matter how you dress it up. The beauty of a bicycle is that it is a mechanical tool. It uses levers and cogs to complement the human body. An ebike is a machine which uses a power source to help it along. Just because your sponsors are pushing the ebikes doesn't mean to say you can dis viewers who don't buy into it.
Amen. I'm tired of the fascination with ebikes on this channel. Its almost like if a channel about kayaking started talking about jetskis and acted like its almost the same thing, only you can go further with less fatigue. You win! Immediate gratification culture.
@@daryl4841 You can get small electric motors for Kayaks, and they are regularly mentioned on Kayaking/Fishing channels :P.
Because a lot of people ride for recreation. Consumer interest drives sales that drives channel content. Not everyone wants to pose with their $10k carbon bike with deep dish rims. There are far more people interested in the social and mental benefits of cycling.
As for assistance technically using a bike is machine that makes travel easier by the very levers and cogs you mentions. Gears also assist in making hills easier. So perhaps we all should be riding fixies or even better running and getting no assistance at all.
Far more shades of gray than your narrow view.
@@StevenDrewitt I agree that there is no reason not to embrace the technology of electric bikes, if you want to. My view is that it is the power input that is the defining difference between a bicycle and an Electric Bike. I personally dislike the idea of the two being listed under the same heading.
great and objective review. I am convinced that we will see many cool e-road bikes in 2022 that our previous e-bike opponents will also like.
Great vid Alex....most of the ebikes here iare pretty clunky, fat tyres or really heavy and slow. Nice to see an ebike that is so light.
Try E-gravel vs Superbike, that would make a better comparison for regular commuters
152bpm seems pretty low for an over 30min all out effort on a "normal" bike.
It might be but especially running on normal roads i get into situations where the road conditions limit my speed even though I could possibly pedal faster
hm, you wont do 300watts on your way down a wet winding road with traffic. at least not when you have some sense of self preservation. guess the road was the limiting factor there.
I agree, and that's definitely low for me, but everyone is different - Alex has done a number of tests on this channel and he rarely pips into the 170s, even on the highest intensity efforts I believe. So this seems believable for 30 minutes on open roads I guess
Could you also tell us the level of assistance you used for each section-this would surely affect the result. Thanks,
I got the e bike (Ribble) so I could ride more as I live by the coast and the head winds can be fairly strong which is a nightmare but with the e bike it helps negate that so I exercise more and for longer, so it's a win win. It's just a pity the e bikes are so expensive but I thought it was worth it.
biggest problem here is that you compared a super bike with a super e-bike, not a mid or low range e-bike
You should have tested with the orbea gain with aluminium frame and shimano tiagra or 105 as maximum.
I can not see, why burning slightly less calories is any subject with regards to training. It is only a subject, if you are trying to loose weight. The quality of training can be as good, on an e-bike, as it is on the normal road bike. That is dependent on the training stress and HR and how you super compensate after training. Besides, the individual position, on each bike, can attribute to different aerodynamic drag. So even though the superbike should be more aerodynamically made, the position of the rider can attribute to more drag than the e-bike. This can only be determined in a windtunnel.
Great video, but the Kiss half way through kinda took me back for a moment 😁
I have the Williet Centro Hy E road. I gotta say it's has saved mea few times for not walking and it's great as a wind stabilizer. I the e when I need it and it's off when I don't. I think the key is the weight of the bike because not all E bikes are lightweight
I also have a heavier E folding commuter that's is only for that purpose as it's heavier and a carbon light Gravel bike that I use when E isn't needed
Depends on your fitness, terrain and speed .. today I road with my bro ..I’m in road bike. He’s in e bike,
Doing 15mph on a road His HR is 130…140… mine is 70.
Picking up bikes and taking over gates… my bike weights 11kg. His is 25kg… his HR is in heart attack mode, mine is fine
please post your TCX file of that 70 BPM ride....because my BS meter is going off.
Moral of the story. Get an e bike if you have a super hilly commute.
Get a TT or aero bike if you have a super flat commute.
Im 68 and I go slower than Iused to be but that's ok . Why the obsession with going as fast as younger or even professional riders?
Kudos to you sir. When I get older I also plan on just accepting how far and fast I can go. If I need a motor to keep up with others then I'm not really keeping up, I'm just cheating.
E-bikes are also great for people with certain disabilities who otherwise would not be able to ride at all. Nice option.
Gasoline mopeds and small motor scooters have been around for many decades. What makes battery powered mopeds any different?
It's interesting how much worse ebikes are in Europe than North America. 250W and 25 kph is something most cadual cyclists can beat. 500W and 32 kph is a whole lot harder. On a long climb you'd need a 400W FTP to keep up.
122/88kcal for that distance? Something doesn't add up here. For Alex's body at that speed it would mean AT LEAST 400/290kcal for that sort of ride. I'd burn 122kcal by walking for half an hour.
You are right for whatever reasons he took the KJ and divided them by 4... In reality he has burnt 4 times more than what he said.
I have an ebike so was particularly interested to see how it turned out, I normally ride on minimum assist(only increasing on hills) so can you run the whole test again to see how that turns out. Top speed on my "Acoustic " bike is about 5mph higher than the ebike but average speed on a run is about 1mph higher on the ebike which I put down to the gearing. How does the gearing on the two bikes in the test compare?
In Canada e-bikes are governed at 32kph which makes more sense than 25 imho. I wa surprised that the Superbike did not beat the e-bike on the all-out test. Anyway for most of us aero bikes don't make much sense as the gains over a endurance or climbing bike are only realized at higher speeds, so the cost/ benefit doesn't work out. How would a light weight climbing bike have worked out? Also if you use the e-bike at full power your range is severely limited. The best use of an e- bike is at low, or power off, except on climbs or Into the wind and as e-bikes continue to come down in weight they will be much better all around.
People don’t expect bicycles going that fast especially uphills. Also the braking performance is not as good as a car. I got into a few bad situations because people underestimated my speed on my road bike and to be honest with the slim tires the braking performance also isn’t ideal
I live near the course it's so steep that my unfit newby workmate got 6th place on Strava on his Ebike. Not really a fair test
As my 10 yr old boy grows and eventually says, 'come on old man, keep up'........That's when I buy an ebike!
It would be nice to see which setting you used on the ebike. We always get these tests and we don’t get the here about the settings and it makes a massive difference. I tend to ride in eco for everything unless I’m exhausted from work.
It’s great to see that e-bikes are getting lighter, under 12kg is pretty cool. I see people that I ride with that really have to wrestle their heavier bikes any time they have to wheel the bike about. I’d still like to see the rules changed just to allow a few kph more to help me in traffic if I was going to commute on one because the cycling infrastructure in most of Yorkshire is laughable
yes .. have to do more miles on ebike , even in eco .
Tremendously good show. You bikers are beautiful guys. I am 68 my beautiful guy days are long gone.
The calories burnt can't be correct.
It's closer to 530 kcal in 30min going at 289 watts on average.
Gloves in one shot none in the other. Warmer temps mean faster speeds, that will skew the results. That’s why you need a ABABAB… test method not just AB
Many comments about the rather low calorie count. I had the same thought. I think this would actually make for a very good GCN video about calorie calculation and how accurate it is for different types of exercise (cardiovascular like cycling versus weight or functional weight training/CrossFit type workouts) based on the formulas that Wahoo, Strava and others use and compare to more scientific measurements in a lab.
Also, accuracy of HRM versus power meter.
I know that my wife and I have been using our HrM to guide diet choices. Generally seems to be working but I have a pretty strong suspicion that these formulas overestimate, especially for people at higher body weight. I haven’t broken down the formulas the different companies use and I’m curious what sort of multiplier is used for body weight and whether it skews the tails of the distribution.
I also know that the whoop I was wearing reported significantly lower calorie burn than my Wahoo.
This would be a very cool project and has Ollie Bridgewood written all over it.
Those calories seem way off. I did 1:45 today at 210 watts average and 144 HR and it was nearly 1300 calories.
You at least don't need to refilm the entire video, but redo all the numbers because they're laughably inaccurate.
I can't speak for other e-bike riders, but the effort I exert is relatively constant, whether on my "regular" bike or my e-bike. I just do it faster on the latter.
Shock horror - bikes with motors are faster than bikes without them. Great work - Earth shattering results here.
In the end....simply put, its not you the rider producing the speed. It's a motor, and for most cyclists it will only show it's worth on the climbs where speeds are slower.
Otherwise, if your group rides average speeds are 30-35kph, and its fairly flat, you will absolutely see ZERO benefit, and actually you'll see a weight penalty.
If you're on the climbs for a decent portion of the ride, sure.
I would take the superbike all day long.
If I could get my wife to ride with me, I'd buy her an e-bike but even 25kph is outside her comfort level.
There's this thing called "gravity".
What is the difference between an "e-bike" and a "moped"? Other than not having to deal with two-stroke brew, it seems like just marketing (except that by co-opting the label "bike" somehow electric mopeds can sneak where "no motor vehicles allowed"). That fine, but let's just not sugarcoat what's going down.
I visited Bermuda in the sixties and four stroke mopeds were their most common transport. You could pedal those as well but like modern ebikers they didn't.
Yes, they go straight to the "No Motorized Vehicles" bicycle/pedestrian paths.
Its a symptom of instant gratification culture and wanting to make everything easy. Then they act like going on a long ride is still an accomplishment and like they did it all on their own.
That orbea ebike looks so much like canyon ultimate
Great concept but, constructive feedback incoming, I completely turned off during the results presentation - didn't land the 'so what' at all, maybe show the different bikes results on the screen next to one another for a start?
If the ride had finished back at the starting point the aero bike would have been the fastest. Good video and numbers, especially the split times. Too bad the route was designated for the e-bike to win. Would the result have been the same if he had switched the bikes around on the second day? My guess is that it would have been a very close race. Conclusion: Aero bikes for the win.
If only we had battery technology that was good enough to combine e-Bikes with Superbikes and get the best of both worlds.
The calculation from kilojoules to kilocalories is quite off. In cycling the conversion factor is generally about 1:1
Geez, who the hell thought that playing music in the background as Alex talked was a good idea? Damn, that was annoying. Everything doesn't have to have background music.