"THIS IS SUPER SCARY" Dr K Shares His Very Controversial Take
Вставка
- Опубліковано 24 вер 2024
- Dr K: "There Is A Crisis Going On With Men!", “We’ve Produced Millions Of Lonely, Addicted Males!”
► • Dr K: "There Is A Cris...
Date: 17 Mar, 2024
▼Follow Destiny▼
►STREAM - www.destiny.gg/...
►TWITTER - / theomniliberal
►DISCORD - discordapp.com...
►REDDIT - / destiny
►INSTAGRAM - / destiny
►MERCH - shop.destiny.gg/
Check Out My Amazon: www.amazon.com...
Buy My Merch: shop.destiny.gg/
#destiny
#politics
#debate
Hasan Gaslights His Own Fans, Changes Story For Insane Interview
►ua-cam.com/video/ztnlbXBoGmo/v-deo.html
ooooOoooOoooo i learnt ffviii intro song w flute by myself in middle school, (instead choosin one from the book) its the only one i still remember how2play tho
weeeeee
Unfortunately, Destiny you're wrong again. We can take this parallel to the gender identity and suicidal tendencies when not given care or having a decent support circle. The care alone can be helpful but the biggest contributing factor is social support. So there's this notion of a loving and accepting social circle that important for the level of self acceptance trans people need to continue living. Similarly, people especially with a lot of self and social awareness suffer of a level of disconnection and dissatisfaction. There's a level of willful ignorance required to maintain the "happy" or "blissful" life which the say "ignorance is bliss" often reaffirmed by society. This is also why people say "thinking too much is dangerous for your health." There's a social association with thinking and awareness that creates this sullen, dissatisfied and sometimes Black pilled ideology. So much so it's a trope in our media series and why we find them so appealing and relatable. There's an association also with nihilism and risky behaviors. Happy people aren't as willing to throw their life away and thus crave stability. So there's a pattern occurring across identity groups of dissatisfaction and awareness. This is true for all classes, races, beliefs and identities. The biggest contribution is "lack of meaningful purpose." We see this with Japanese Corporate culture where despite having high demanding job and well paying salaries, the lack of a meaningful social circle and meaningful purpose within and outside their jobs still drive the suicidal tendencies. We've seen this even with high class never having to work and all needs and wants covered still driven to drugs, escapism and suicide due to poor support circles. Let's look at two huge figures battling depression, Robert Williams and Chester Bennington.
Rober Williams was comedian and light of the world. Loving family with a solid connection especially with his daughter Zelda. However, He battled a long history of alcohol abuse which not only stemmed from his family and upbringing but his need to be "ON" all the time. He spoke about the struggles of staying sober and in society, he often tried to make others laugh to fight the darkness and depression within him. See he wasn't just someone with mal-adaptation. He was the most successful comedian, loved by his family and society, and far from poor. His brain was incredibly quick and had a level of both intelligence and empathy beyond average. He was no genius but he wasn't mentally damaged or lacking. The opposite is true. It was due to his social and self awareness which made him a comic Legend. He spoke with irony and nuance. He sought to express heavy real world philosophical issues with his movies and how to have HOPE through it all. And yet he still killed himself. Supportive daughter and successful career, overcoming trauma and addiction, beloved by society and colleagues. However, his support circle, the intimate relationships he had weren't many. What he had with his daughter, was probably vital for keeping him from doing it sooner until she was old enough to take care of herself. Where his purpose was again left for him to figure out beyond being a dad. You hear it from plenty of parents, if not for my kids I'd probably be dead. But what happens when being a parent isn't self fulling as society suggests it is?
Chester Bennington was a great family man. Adopted his first born son's half brother, and had a bunch of kids. He advocated against brutality, Trump, and often wrote about overcoming depression. He wasn't a genius by normal means but highly successful and above average intellect. He took struggled with substances caused by his depression and early childhood trauma. Despite his love for family, his affect on music communities and even bridging genres and demographics that brought communities together, he still killed himself. This ideal that depression is solely the effects of a poorly functioning brain failing to adapt to society is in fact false and even ignorant to the real world applications. See many people commit suicide through other means. Sometimes it's by overworking yourself so your family can live well, sometimes it protecting your love ones or friends and sometimes it's for greater good of ideas and morality.
The need for self preservation diminishes when you go beyond yourself. You look towards the greater good of the world. Like the Bushnell, who took weight of his involvement with the Genocide in Gaza over his life. You hear parent willing to die for their kids out of love for the greater good, the future of their kids. When you're selfish or unaware, you're not willing to die in protest, that's "Stupid" for them. I can always have "another" kid is a selfish way of preserving yourself over the life of your child. It takes alot of self awareness to recognize the important of someone else's life. These people aren't unwell. They're literally the opposite over coming their addictions, over coming their egos, over coming their habits and self doubts putting real action and effort to combat the social harm that creates trauma. These people aren't ill but saints. They're aware beyond their selfish selves. I take a lot of empathy and intelligence to recognize society and life for what it is and do what you can to fight it. They fought knowing it was a losing battle because they hope to change it for someone or for everyone. They acted in the highest form of selflessness while they battled the urge to give up. It was only after they grew tired of fighting did they give in the call.
As a suicide survivor myself, I didn't have the same conviction they did. It was when I was at my lowest and with no one in sight, I felt that I was doing the world a service by killing myself. Many do. You read their words of how it would help those around them. We isolate to let those people stay in their illusions. Let them be blissfully unaware of everything beyond themselves. We can't unsee the world for what it is. We cannot lower our vibrations just for survival. We can't turn our blind eye to other's suffering or take joy in it. That's the unfortunate truth of our society. We fight to see others smile so that their joy might not drown in the darkness. We stand on edge of an abyss whispering to let go and stop fighting. It's the light of our loved ones that keep us going. We're not here to shit on others or assert our self importance. Truth is we know we're just another drop in the bucket. We feel the powerlessness and helplessness not only within society but within a divine creed that choice is all we have. Some choose to be selfish, egotistical, greedy cruel beings searching to validate themselves. We, too, look to validate ourselves by those we can help and possibly navigate from the edge. Who else knows it better than those who fell from it? Somehow we're here. Somehow we try to find a meaningful purpose. Beyond hedonism. Beyond legacy. Beyond praise or acknowledgement. We're trying to prove to ourselves that our life and consciousness is worth living. Worth experiencing. Not for or to anyone else but know deep within ourselves, this is what it's all for. No one else has to know or understand. Our journey are all different for each of us to figure out. However, we're looking for something that resonates with our very core of existence. So no, it's not that "we're incapable of adapting." We CHOOSE to no become lesser of ourselves. We choose to help, not hurt others. We choose to bring joy even while we're aching inside. We pretend to be ok, to be happy, to care about sunday brunch and how Monday's suck. What we really care for is how to make it better even if we'll never experience it ourselves. If we can only bring it for others. Many then it'll be meaningful.
**HEY LEFTY'S, WOULD YOU ACCEPT A BIDEN / PENCE TICKET? CHRISTIANS ON THE RIGHT ARE LOOKING FOR A CHRISTIAN TO VOTE FOR. BIDEN HAS BEEN A CHRISTIAN ALL HIS LIFE** YOU JUST NEED TO "CUT THE WAKY STUFF", AND THE CHRISTIANS WILL VOTE FOR THE CHRISTIAN IN THE RACE! ---BUT, YOU HAVE TO USE THE WORD "CHRISTIAN", OR IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK! --ASKING FROM THE RIGHT.
😮😢😢@@ekysnoir😮😢the 😮
Destiny doesn't seem to grasp relativity in the most basic way. If you went from being a demi-god to even the smartest most handsome healthy human being, you'll be miserable, because of your past experiences of being a demi-god. If you go from 3rd world to 1st world lower middle class, you'd be ecstatic. If you live in an environment where everyone else has more than you, you suffer the constant pain of your brain telling you you're doing something wrong and you're lesser than others. Whereas if you live in the same environment but everyone else has the same or less than you, you feel better because you don't have that emotion deep inside beating down on you for being less than and you feel understood/related to by your peers; you have community. It's the ol "why are you crying over breaking your arm? There are some people who have broken both their arms and legs!". That's not how pain and suffering works. Hell it might even likely be that we are evolutionarily tuned to doing certain work even if it is societally deemed "menial labor" as opposed to sitting in the same place for hours on end every day staring at a computer screen. We already know living without proper exercise alone can make you miserable. There's way more to this than "only mentally ill people are so miserable they want to die because some people survive and are ok under X conditions that are making you suicidal". It's almost a tautological definition at that point. Like "only mentally ill people want to kill themselves", "how do you define mental illness?", "people who want to kill themselves".t
0 views in 5 years Destiny fell off
yo anyone remember dramaalert? wtf happened to that old man
you got trolled lil bro
honestly so true king
You’re the worst.
true king
The crux of his argument is that not wanting to live in an externally hopeless situation is not a mental illness because it CAN be fixed by adjusting the external factors. Where as mental illness once it has manifested can not be easily addressed simply by adjusting the external factors. To put another way - being in poor mental health is NOT equivalent to being mentally ill.
Ya, I have Bipolar disorder and my life can be going great and I will still sink into a deep depression. Or my life can seem like it’s going downhill and I will seem like I am on top of the world (either in hypomanic state or the beginning of a full manic state). Plus, I can take some pills and those episodes basically won’t happen anymore (okay, it’s way more complicated than that, but they significantly reduce the severity of my disorder).
Think a lot of people try to apply mental illness to too many things at once. Some things can be fixed by external factors, not everyone is clinicaly depressed they just don't see a good way out of their bad situation of not having any money, love or friendships.
Exactly. It should be an empowering, emancipatory notion that wanting to die does not mean that you're broken, but that you're in a situation that should and can be remedied. Instead we treat it as 'dangerous'm chalk it up to illness and treat the symptoms of what's rather a social issue.
Bullshit. You can cure mental illness with lifestyle adjustments sometimes
If you're living in a first world country, there's almost no such thing as a "hopeless situation"
It's interesting that within the first 6 minutes or so, Destiny kinda proved Dr. K's point: men can't have bad things happen to them because objectively there's worse things, so stop complaining.
@Alesti5 I could see it also being a remnant of being in the Red pill space for so long. It'd be hard to not dislike hearing men complain about life and its aspects when they are actively making those degenerate choices and spreading that kind of brain rot.
@@asimhussain8716 exactly, Destiny is a whataboutism machine.
He's not saying stop complaining. He's saying, rationally speaking, bad things happening to you shouldn't be enough to kill yourself. And if they are, then it's likely that the affected person has some kind of an undiagnosed mental disorder.
@Alesti5 It's the beta in him.
@@Arcana_Veritas_EN And I understand the line of reasoning you're presenting. But, a topic that wasn't discussed within the first 6 minutes as referred to is that everyone will experience hardship differently. Some men handle family death incredibly well, others become absolutely inconsolable. The nature of the topic itself is objectively subjective. Anything less than compassion and sympathy/empathy is kinda off-beat. And those first 6 minutes were anything but compassionate or sympathetic/empathetic.
Edit: *Understand and generally agree with the line of...
You can 1000% deem life is not for you without any form of mental illness. Dr. K is spot on with his take actually. Mental health councilor here, ive seen the same things in practice & various research studies on the topic.
i feel so validated hearing him
Yeah, I've been feeling that way recently too. I don't feel like I'm worthless or have no value, I don't have any resentment or need to seek attention. I just want to die because I know that I won't find what I'm looking for here. Might as well try with the afterlife since I know my life here will amount to nothing and I'll never be truly happy.
@@Stormzy2heaven Did a crystal ball tell you this?
@@Stormzy2heaven Your society is what's ill not you. Masculinity does have worth and if you moved somewhere more traditional you would start to see that in the difference in how you're treated.
@@sticks7857 Do you know this guy? Seriously, judging your whole life based on how you feel now, or have been feeling recently is mentally redacted. Don't so it. Go seek therapy.
I may be part the problem but I just don’t see the controversy in saying that some peoples lives actually do suck and they’re not just suffering a chemical imbalance. He’s not advocating these people commit suicide, he’s explaining the situation.
Yeah, I feel like I'm witnessing a large portion of the internet collectively have a comprehension/empathy problem, and it's wild to me.
@@talkingtakotaco8611 Exactly. These people aren’t having a chemical imbalance that throws off their lives. They’re looking at their situation, realizing it’s sucks and not seeing any way to fix it. Telling these folk that it’s all in their heads and they can just medicate it away isn’t helping them at all.
The chemically imbalance thing is a scam anyway
@@asimhussain8716 Good point!
Because it’s just arguing semantics. He’s saying it’s not mental illness but the definition of mental illness is so general it may very well BE mental illness of some form. He’s just saying it’s not to sound different as if he “cracked the code”. It sounds good and makes suicidal peoples lives less complicated because now they don’t have to worry about a “mental illness” or label.
He’s just arguing semantics and tacks “well I’m a clinician” so it’s sounds 100% true. This is what self help gurus do
Destiny’s argument was literally a mom’s argument when her kid snubs her food.
“There are children in Africa who would love to have this food!”
Doesn’t change the fact that Brussels sprouts taste like shit, ma.
"Send it to Africa then."
Your mom just sucks at cooking. Sorry kid
It actually taste good when your really hungry
The point is that the taste doesn’t matter and to shove in your face
It's not your mom's fault that American and western european food sucks.
>be me
>35
>no kids
>no gf
>single for 16 years
>sexless for 16 years
>tiny 1 bedroom
>dead end job
>low income
>on ssri
>no friends
>no close relationships except mother
>no goals in life
He is like me fr fr
You had sex?
How are you dealing with it bro?
I'm 25, no gf/sex (EVER), in pretty big debt from gambling (probably was coping mechanism), BUT I have high aspirations for the future & I am moving up with my career, so that helps me. Idk how I would deal, if I was completely stuck
@@ShmOGYou have one huge advantage he doesn't. You have the motivation, the aspirations and something to live for. He believes he has nothing like that.
@@ShmOG ur literally me. Except, I cope with my gambling addiction by playing gacha games as a pseudo f2p (I give my 5 euro per month ok). Except I don't have any chance with career since while I managed to complete college, every goddamned IT support job tells me that they found someone better for the job.
Yeah, dr K is right, Destiny doesn’t know wtf he is talking about. He took that quote about being too open minded from his mother and applied it to a pathological extreme.
Destiny is a virgin in just about everything he talks about. And he calls experts stupid. He's got an ego and is trying to inflate it to the professional's sizes because he lacks self-awareness and self-esteem.
He literally hates virgins who talk about sex because Desitny is supposedly an expert on sex because he's had more sex. But does he give the same respect and benefit of doubt to experts? No. He's quick to disagree with them and call them stupid or tell them they're wrong. It's a constant contradiction with Destiny. And if you call him out for it, he just bans you because he needs an echo chamber to survive or else he will lose his mind and he can't lose his mind because of years of dismissing mentally ill people as crazy, so if he lost his mind and showed how mentally ill he was, he'd have a meltdown and existential crisis. His ego of always being right is too big to pop or else he loses everything. He has no humility. He's extreme fake and he doesn't even recognize it. The biggest glimpses we've gotten into Destiny's real personality was when he was having a mentally ill episode over taking ADHD meds and when Brittany Simmon said Destiny wasn't open minded and compared him to Sneako. Brittany Simmon was right about Destiny. He isn't open minded. To be open minded, you need an uninflated ego and have humility, which Destiny has none of.
I think dr k is right about the fenomena but wrong about the problem. It's not that men aren't allowed to talk about their problem. That is the reality since the dawn of humanity. What makes men feel helpless is ironically not the lack of help. It's the opposite, men need to help. To be useful and to feel useful. Without it they lose the reason lo live. That word "reason to live" is actually literal for many men.
@@Jake38nine You hit the nail in the head
It's ironic because Destiny's inability to understand this argument is probably because of some personality disorder he has
He is highly disagreeable. The competitiveness from disagreeableness manifests as narcissistic self preservation
I never understood why this is such a foreign concept. If we can place value on other people's lives based on their criminal behavior or achievements, why is it so hard to believe that someone could value their own life as not worth living without saying they definitely had a mental illness? Maybe they just valued things differently (albeit wrong and messed up) then you do, the challenge is to figure out how to change that in someone, but I don't know how you get someone to value something they don't think is valuable?
Do you tell someone who doesn't want kids how valuable or fulfilling having kids would be? Is that required or would you say that there is something definitively wrong with them if they thought otherwise?
How about loads of money? Possessions? You can attribute this to yourself in many ways, and it would all still be objective. Once we realize that, hopefully we can begin to crack some root causes that could lead someone to value there life that way.
One way is to get people to question what they’re thinking and believing, which may include the most basic, fundamental beliefs they have about themselves, other people and their concepts about life/existence/the universe.
@@onepartyroule I think it comes down to the person's core belief and value system. What your suggesting gets to the root of the matter, but could give false positive results.
When your questioning how someone is thinking, I believe (totally my opinion here) that many do it in hopes of convincing the other person to change said value or belief, or hope that you bring up something they didn't consider and that then leads them to a different feeling about it.
The problem is what do you do to someone who genuinely considers that self-deletion is a viable option through 100% logical (work with me here, cause you may not think it is, but to them, they do, and that's all that matters) determinations? All the other methods of trying to convince the person becomes null and void in affecting any change, cause in the end, what can make you bound yourself to this world if you believe nothing has value in it?
This is such a challenging thing to hash out, cause I do believe there are widespread things society can do to alleviate this, they are just untenable when it comes to providing immediate relief/benefit to the person in front of you at that moment. All you can hope for is that the person is NOT one of those people that DOES have that form of conclusion. I have no statistics for this, but I would like to think that when you include everyone who does have a mental disease, or are being pushed to the point through external factors that could be immediately relieved in some way, that the number of self-deleting people that do so from a place of the logical conclusion is hopefully 10% or less.
because the definition of "disease" is tricky, you realize that if you consider if things like being gay or trans should be a disease, and why not. Because those people ARE suffering, but at some point we started to blame society for that, and probably rightly so. But you can easily see the other side of that argument, why should the rest of the world change to accomodate them? It's a question of what you believe in, really.
Yeah, but it's not an objective analysis. It's pure subjective analysis
That also doesn't work as a statement though. All analysis is subjective, and only can go as far as the amount of elements that a human can make. We aren't capable of objectively analysing, if you're gonna discount subjective analysis like that.
The only analysis that matters here, is the subjective one.
I think people fail to make distinctions between the philosophy and mental health.
Nihilistic depression isn't a mental health problem, it's a fulfilment problem.
It's distinct from clinical depressions
Maybe... or maybe there is no distinction. It's a chicken and egg problem that can be interpreted either way. Not saying I firmly believe either way but mind/body causation is still mysterious enough to warrant uncertainty on the matter.
@@antirealist that's rather naive.
There's a qualitative difference between the two experiences.
They exist at entirely different framing scopes.
Clinical depression caused by your brain chemistry is clearly different than someone losing belief in their God and the foundation it brings.
They may be the same in the sense you are having the life you're have but are literally just atoms bouncing around.
Your experience of redness vs the photons of a specific bounce pattern hitting your sensors.
@@antirealist they are very different issues with very different solutions
@@Jay-kx4jf
Nihilistic depression is actually a form of depression. TLDR it’s a specific type psychotic depression where the individual’s delusions revolve around nihilism.
@@Jay-kx4jf Nihilistic depression is a symptom of clinical depression, nothing to do with not believing in god.
I think the middle/ upper class suicidal thing is feeling like comparing yourself to your parents and people around you. If you're poor and work at Wendys that's fine because your parents work at Wendys too, they got you the job there, you're a Wendys family. But if you're parents are lawyers and you work at Wendys you're considered a failure.
Downward mobility and regression to the mean hit hard.
Your parents don't get you in a Wendy's job. 💀 I’ve never seen a poor family have multiple generations working at Wendy’s.
@@JoyfulSeal-sh9cw Joining the family business
@@amorfati6728 IMO, this is the primary driver of online leftism.
Thank you for this thought. I am the first classical “success” in my family. It’s unlikely that all 5 of my kids will match or surpass my level of function.
The best in me serving the best in you is a quote I’ve always been able to get behind. I need to start establishing this mantra better for my kiddos. For my kids to feel inferior and like they don’t matter when everything I became was done because of how valuable I see them… it’s horrendous to imagine 😢.
You can acclimate to a terrible situation and still come to the conclusion that it isn't worth living.
But there is also the possibility that you misscalculate, and there's things worth living you didn't consider and would change your opinion.
no if i am faced with a terrible situation and say to myself what are the options i have to overcoming this terrible situation i'm in and become better stronger and more tough because of it.
That's basically the entire point Dr.K is making.@@platinummad4701
@user-rr6zc6dy1o "I would simply overcome ANY situation."
Someone has been listening to their daily Sigma Male Affirmations.
yea, every mentally healthy person is literally Sisyphus. @@cicolas_nage
3 Views in 42 seconds blud fell off
Zero likes in 52 seconds, this comment fell off
bro came straight from turkey tom’s comment section 💀
@@JohnDoe-ev8fk errrm ratio🤓
🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
l ratio but at least you're consistent!
I love how you can have an expert of Dr K's level- who knows this shit inside and out (to a level far greater than Destiny). And Destiny just starts theory crafting with no evidience- just 100% anecdotal "I disagree" because I don't think so.
I get what u mean, but Dr K says it is controversial. We should not say that u can not disagree because u lack the credentials. In the study they also mentions contrary opinions from experts.
@@Davvefuling Indeed- but I'm talking more about the automatic behaviour- not the ability to disagree. By all means have your own take and disagree. But what cracks me up is how he'll hear it and immediately dismiss it without doing any research.
@@Hyperdriveuk he does that a lot
Yeah he somehow knows what "All the data says" without doing a second of research, likely because he saw a headline about one study years ago.
DrK has cited horrible sources before and has said things that are just wrong. He’s human. There are TONS of professionals who have said and done wrong things because guess what they’re human.
Dr.K has misused stats before and saying “the data shows” doesn’t actually mean the data shows that especially when we have not stats to go off of. Welcome to reality.
Hell Ben Carson has a PHD and he doesn’t believe in evolution. Like please we can use our brains here
Someone with an incredibly lucrative career that requires absolutely no physical labor telling men "hey if youre suicidal it can only be because the brain demon is sucking up your dopamine" when men are living the most futile lives. I'm extremely optimistic and i dont really understand suicidality, but i can imagine and have seen many men in situations that are simply hopeless. Men need purpose and it's been stolen from us by technology and changing social climates.
He's acting like Hasan and Asmondgold when they claimed their lives are tougher than anyone else who works customer service. He's 100% delusional and dsimissive. That's become his personality. He's way too far gone.
um streaming is the msot soul-sucking job actually
@@humanmerelybeing1966 so true 😱
men these days are obsessed with women and alot of them genuinly believe they need a wife to be happy.. its an insane and entitled take now that women are considered full class citizens.
suicide isn't good metric for well being, u assumption that not doing so mean better well being is a flaw and a hindsight on ur end.
u can kill one whole family and send him in never ending revenge miserable thirst if he stopped on the way and end it is he worse off?
one can only say yes if he was able to overcome his misery otherwise he was tormenting himself solely to not give up on hope, that not a good metric for well being.
someone who is poor and lived a shit life is more then welling to keep living such shit and miserable life, the fact that someone richer ended himself doesn't mean he had less well being but rather he had less threads forcing to keep dancing like a puppet in his never ending torment.
Growing up middle class feels like you have something to lose and alot to sacrifice if you want to gain anything, but we are pushed and promised so much more. Then it feels shitty and like we are failures when reality comes crashing down upon us. That mixed with the guilt of disappointing the family that sacrificed so much for you and had such high expectations of you.
As a young child I watched my parents work so hard to climb into the middle class and by the time I was an adult they had done it. So now all the pressure falls upon me and my brother to at least maintain this position of safety for our future family. It is a crushing feeling to know there is so much to lose. It’s an intense feeling of obligation to maintaining a somewhat precarious status. But then again, my parents took on an immense burden and who am I to complain about appreciating and working to insure such effort was not made in vein.
@@HeatMiserrits hard to learn not to give a fuck, but it’s relived so much pressure off of me. I used to be in that exact same situation, where my parents who were immigrants wanted me to be successful and pursue a normal life. I was ‘gifted’ which made it all the worse. I felt like I had all the pressure on me, but learning to stop caring was so liberating. We should all strive to care less, and do more.
@@HeatMiserr
It's crazy to see people with your mindset...
@@justinkozak7779 Dude is creating arbitrary grand narratives to fail by. Where does this goofy mentality come from?
@soccerplayer922 it doesn't sound likes he's doing this to fail by. He was describing the pressure and acknowledged that he'd ensure his parents efforts were not in vain
I'd agree this is a fulfillment problem. When you feel you have no higher purpose you lose the motivation to do anything.
When you work 9-5 there is a boredom that sets in. You feel like you'll be there your whole life and never have anything worth caring about.
When you don't work at all you are hopeless to do anything, because you have no money.
People 20-40 these days are waiting for someone/something to come in and save them. Logically they know it won't happen - that they will have to suffer or do something about it - and the energy it takes to do something becomes too much to stay consistent and reliable on it.
They need a real goal and that doesn't get formed when you feel you have no point to living - no higher purpose or thing to fulfill.
one can counter that and say that need itself is an illness and u should learn to overcome that and be happy with whatever u get in life.
The modern western lifestyle is such a small blip in human evolution. It's something we weren't really wired for.
And yet many people seem to be able to lead rewarding, contented lives, so we’re clearly _capable_ of this level adaptability as a species, but many - if not most - struggle under modern social conditions. If we can figure out what biological and environmental conditions the thriving people seem to be benefiting from we stand a chance of increasing their number.
@@onepartyroule Many people would be able to live rewarding lives in complete anarchy. That doesn't mean the solution is to maximize that number and continue living in anarchy. Society should fit the needs of the populace, not the other way around.
@@sticks7857 you misconstrued. By “increase their number” I’m suggesting we find out why they’re thriving and use that info to help those that aren’t thriving adapt better, thus increasing the number of those who are striving, which may well mean changing society to change the conditioning people are subject to.
@@onepartyroule The solution isn't to condition people to cope with living under a sick society, the solution is to treat the societal sickness. Then it will naturally conform to the will of the people as societies should do.
Yeah, and we are probably gonna fi gure out how important meaning is, so in a few generations it wont be an issue at all, and in the past it mostly wasnt either. So we will be seen as ''that wierd time were we thought feeding people well was enough to make them happy'' and well be talked about with some contempt like woke story teachers talking about ''the dark ages'' ''how could they be so dumb and dogmatic''
A real man punches a couch when he's angry
Or that drywall when it looks at me funny
Sounds like that’s a man with a stable mental state
the couch always bounces back. its unfair
Steven needs to realize tgat fighting is seen as the end all be all life. There's a reason we created nukes, because at the end of the day the bigger stick wins
Nobody picking up on the RedactedFromPA reference 😢
As cliche as it sounds, people need a sense of purpose. Where people find that is up to them. Sometimes it takes a little more than having a family or a job to feel relevant
Indeed, it's become more challenging in an era where most people's basic needs are met. Efficiency has redefined daily tasks; banking, mailing, and shopping are now effortlessly done online. With sufficient financial resources, one can even bypass the need to step out for groceries or meals. This shift leads to a peculiar situation: what is our ultimate objective? When basic needs are satisfied and tasks are increasingly automated, freeing us from physical errands, we are left with an abundance of time, which can sometimes make us feel aimless and redundant.
Ya
You need to feel like whatever you're doing matters. Nobody can convince you of that. You just have to believe it.
@@alexia964 When I'm done satisfying the essentials, I like to talk to people face to face. Doesn't everybody?
@@avivastudios2311 uhuh lmao sure
Men who unknowningly have aspergers and are very adept at masking can go through their entire lives in a masked state doing what they think they are supposed to do but at the same time eroding from not being themselves and eventually hit a breaking point, I got diagnosed at 22 and I was very much ready to die because nothing made sense up until that point and everything anyone else was doing made me miserable. For some that might come well after establishing a family and having kids
Hot take but I don't think the proliferation of the Internet is just a contributing factor here, I think it is *the* primary contributor to our generation's "depression" and middle-class malaise. Specifically, I think it has desensitized us to life in ways we simply weren't prepared for.
In the span of a decade or two, our generation was given absurd convenience, infinite information, and an always-on mirror through which we can compare our lives to everyone else's, without the tools to navigate any of it. *Of course* being sent off into this void -- to compare and consume and react endlessly without moderation or restraint -- would break more than a few of us.
I think that's what Dr. K is getting at: these people aren't mentally ill, they were pushed from a plane without a parachute and (kind of logically) concluded the only thing left for them to do is hit the ground.
Before I even started watching, I knew I wasn't going to appreciate Destinys take on this. 3 minutes in and my fears are confirmed.
"...I *feel* like there has to be a mental illness at play except for in exceptional circumstances" 2 problems already.
First, is the highlighted bit. I don't care how Destiny feels, what matters is what does the most current literature and studies on the subject indicate? Dr K is clear about where he stands on this, and claims of mental illness as the core problem are at least disputable.
Secondly, "exceptional circumstances" kind of IS the thing. More and more men are losing prospects in at least some major aspect of their lives, particularly in work or love. More and more men aren't graduating, can't get a job, can't attract women, can't quit drug or porn habits, and inundated with social media telling them that men _like them_ are worthless and unwanted.
For now, it's a male suicide problem which society deems acceptable to ignore, but history is clear that leaving this alone permits horrible leaders like Hitler and Stalin to emerge and Trump is already here and is just an election away from being reinstated.
You yanks really can't help associating Trump with Hitler or Stalin...huh? It's like a sickness at this point. The Dems and the neo Cons have been doing their damned best to help push him back into power. He'll do those four years and be gone. It's not like he's a spring chicken. So try to calm down with the doomsday scenario rhetoric.
Not to speak of Andrew Tate for example.
Very good take imo
This.
@@erikvaldes4293 I've also heard female suicides have gone up, and I think there is plenty of fruitful discussion to be had about that but I don't want to veer off topic by getting into the weeds on that, especially while I'm still ignorant to the literature and rhetoric surrounding it and don't have time right now to get into it.
On topic, you certainly raise very good points which basically support and extend my 2nd point, I was just thinking of the angles that are close to me personally, as I have legit unemployed incel and highly drug addicted friends who are seriously struggling, and you don't have to turn on the TV or social media for long to see new examples making the news every day.
The problem is that a lot of guys just don't have a lot of options and the point Dr K has made is that running out of options can be fatal and as a general issue, it's becoming endemic.
My issue with Destiny's takes regarding men in general are that his advocacy is ultimately for society to do nothing and that men just need to step up. It's very much in line with the right-wings "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" rhetoric and ignores the realities facing these people who have diminishing prospects, either due to health, relationship or financial issues that are well beyond their control.
You have basically summed up the really tiny corner of the "Red Pill" argument that has actual value. All of the Andrew Tate type garbage, and the entire rest of the Red Pill nonsense is a reactionary response to this very real fact. A lot of young men feel hopeless, and that hopelessness is empowering a steady stream of toxic grifters and OF girls that are willing to lie in order to sell them some small measure of hope.
When you think about it logically, our bodies and mind have evolved to fit well with a lifestyle that most of us don't have anymore. When the environment changes too fast for people to keep up, evolutions can mean people that can't adjust don't reproduce. Suicide can also be part of that. You can call it a illness, but I think it's simply a problem with society and culture, since nature just does its thing, and making a abnormal reaction to an abnormal change(relative to our historical evolution) into a pathology is just a case of modern cultural exceptionalism imo.
This is only controversial because Dr. K is talking about men. Had he said all the exact same things but about women instead and folks would be pointing to his statements as a source of truth to enforce how women have it so bad.
in most areas of life women have it bad compared to men
@@PreetvndNot true, men are more likely to be the victim of every form of crime except sexual assault. Men are twice as likely to be the victim of a crime walking down the street at night. Men are more likely to be physically abused as children. They are consistently more then 40% of the victims of domestic violence. Its more expensive to go to college on average if you are a man because there are less grants and scholarships for them. Men die younger, have more health problems and less access to health care. Men kill themselves 4 times as much. Men are the overwhelming majority of homeless people. Men have less legal rights then women. Men get there genitals mutilated at birth and never get to experience sex fully as a result. Men have to sign up for the draft to get the right to vote. Men do not have reproductive rights, they do not have the right to know who there children are. A women can hide a pregnancy from a man because she wants to raise the child without his input and its perfectly legal for her to do that. Lets not forget that when a man has a problem nobody supports him and instead blame him and shame him whereas women get infinite support from everyone regardless of how bad her decisions are.
@@Preetvnd"most areas of life" can you give some examples?
"All the data shows that eventually you get used to it" That's true for the people that choose to live because they most likely have people that support them. Dr K is talking about the people that don't have that in their lives.
No he’s not lmao if he was talking about that he’d mention those things. He specifically didn’t mention those things because people CAN still be in a huge suicidal rut even with people around them who want to support them.
Stop glazing drk by putting words in his mouth he didn’t even say lmao
I had a colleague in school who was a really jolly dude. We went to parties, out with friends skipping classes to drink coffee and smoke ciggaretes behind the school gym. He had good grades, an ok family life. Than we all went off to different colleges, still met from time to time. Than Covid hit, we talked through discord and all was good - he h*ng himself after the restrictions (in Romania) stopped. To this day no one knows why he did it. We asked his sister and she had no idea... A year after that my dad died from Covid caused pneumonia. It was a shit time, gotta say, but I dealt with it and now I am better than I was before. It's really weird, but yeah... That 2 and a half years of being locked in the house must have scrambled the social brain of the poor dude. I have no idea how I got trough that. Guess I am so much of an introvert that my batteries are on airplane and power saving mode all the time 😂
You coped well....remain strong and all the best.
It sounds like he was suffering in silence. Ive heard so many stories like this. Dr K said 50% of men who kill themslves have no prior mental health issues. How can we realistically know this to be true when men suffer in silence.
salut frate
I have a coffee mug that says "Born to social distance". My kids mother got it for me and it is very true. Some people can be alone and some cant.
Yea. From 2020 - early 2022 I spent in almost complete isolation.
Why do we all assume that suicide can’t be a rational decision? Why do we think that existing is always the best choice, when not existing is always an alternative option? What is that assumption based on? It makes sense for religious people who think suicide is a sin and human life is literally sacred, but I’ve never understood why this default position is shared by secular people. I’ve never understood the logic of telling somebody who isn’t you that their life is worth living. How the hell would you know?
Likely because it goes against our instinct not only as human but as a creature. Survival is hardwired into our gene/brain and once you are born you have the instinct to keep on living. Even the most staunch anti-natalist will concede this point, but I do see where you are coming from.
"I want to die" never means i want to die. It means i do not want to deal with the situation.
Some situations are bad. Some aren't. But suicide isn't what they are really seeking. If the situation really is that bad,then ok. But Thought should really her put into it.
Prepare,provide,protect. Most men need to live by this to be happy. Unfortunately, that is hard in today's society.
Its not that existing is the best option. It's that patience and preparedness leads to opportunity. Maybe for a better tomorrow or another chance.
Tldr; suicide can be rational, but almost never is.
@@Breggo1 How on earth could you possibly know if “I want to die” does of doesn’t mean “I want to die” if the person saying it is anyone other than yourself? The answer is, you couldn’t, and it’s incredibly arrogant and patronising to imagine that you ever could. You don’t know anyone’s mind better than they know it themselves.
@@fromchomleystreet @fromchomleystreet ask the person: If they could change things, would they?
Ita not like 99.9999% people are suicidal from birth.
Youre trying to over complicate something simple. People lose hope. If they had a magic wand and could change things, they would.
If I'm not having fun in a game I just alt f4.
You can 100% deeem life not worht living in a rational way.
Imagine an extreme charicature of an incel, but a very rational one.
''All i want is to look like a chad'' > ''ill never be six feet tall'' > ''i know people have fun and good lives while being under 6 feet tall'' > '' i cant have fun in that situation, my standards are different'' > ''i cant achieve my happy life so life is not worth living''.
Now sure, ''just change your standards bro'', specially easy to say to an incel since everyone hates them. But could Destiny accept getting an injury that made him dumb? not disabled, but just no longer able to be good in his field. Could he change his standards for himself, and accept that now getting a 300 at got rythm is what he aspires to in a good day? Or would he think life is no longer worth living because im now just useless compared to what i was?
I think its the feeling of loss, knowing what youre missing, or feeling like you should be or have more tahts the problem, and thats not a mental illness, thats a personal decision. Some people accept mediocre lives, others strive to change their lives because if they cant they would rather die, not in a cool sigma grindset fake way, but actually.
And i get that Destiny doesnt get it because even if he has been poor and in bad situations, hes never really been pathetic, hes always done decnet be it at studies, social relations, even at his first shitty jobs he was competent, and now ofc hes one of the biggest streamers. I doubt he could bear to be avarage at this point, and thats the issue with most suicidal men imo, its an ambition/ability problem.
5:30 but thats the point, if youre some immigrant from a war torn country were you actually had a shitty life, managing to get the avarage US citizens life is fucking dope. But for a guy whos been born into it and never achieved anything beyond that he just feels useless, because objectively, rationally, he is, he hasnt created any improvement, the only good things he has he has been given.
The immigrant thinks hes happy because he can finally eat as much as he wants, and thats mostly true, but hes also happy because he has earned that, he has gone from a shit life to a better one.
If you cant create an improvement you feel like you dont deserve anything, and right now we just tell people who think like that ''nooo you deserve the world baby'' ''nooo dont kill yourself youre so sexy aha'' or in some cases ''your life is good, if you think its so bad that you want to die youre mentally ill, go get some meds prescribed your brain is broken, its just undiagnosed'', but i think we just think about comfort to measure peoples quality of life, not shit like glory and fullfillment.
It almost sounds cringe to say, ''you live in a first world country, better than 99,9999% of lives in history, and you want glory? what are you a child, do you think this is some fantasy story or something?'' But the truth is i think alot of people, maybe specially men, need that. Sure you die without food, but you might also die without something to be proud of
I've had ideations. Under it all, I just don't find life particularly interesting. It's a long meandering existence of work-work-work, get old, and die. All the advice that people give leads back to that, and I don't want to play that out. I guess ultimately, it's a lack of passion for life without foreseeable change.
(Not looking for sympathy or anything; just giving my perspective.)
i get you. Think of this tho. If you really dislike the mediocry shitty life, so much so that dying seems preferable at points, why not say fuck it and just go all out on having an actually cool life? Whats there to lose? your life? not really right, since mediocrity feels worse than death?
Yes most peoples advice just help you deal with a shitty mediocre life, then ignore those, go out and build a life thats not just ''proper'', build a life that fits the adjectives we deem childish and whimsical, ''glorious'' ''legendary'' ''vibrant'' whatever words represent that the best for you.
It doesnt have to be easy, it probably wont be, but it wont be boring, and it wont feel meaningless.
I dont know you, or what prevents you from a truly epic life, maybe you dont even know what that would look like, or maybe you do but think its unatainable from your current situation. I cant speak to that, but i know that trying, truly trying and accepting nothing else will make you happier than you are now.
Fuck having a ''decent'' life, if it doesnt make you happy its not good enough.
@@aguspuig6615wym a cool life? In the modern world that means work a fuck ton. You want to be an artist or do anything not wage slave? Thats actually the ultimate wage slave because youll be putting in thousands of hours before you even make a dollar.
If i lived in the us i would personally take advantage of the foreign work programs you guys have, but many people dont have access to those luxuries
@@yoututiitdlrlrkrkr560I felt like this so I quit my job, sold my shit and traveled the country out of a backpack. I slept outside and hitched rides. It turned out pretty good. I'm not saying that's an option for everybody I'm just saying that there's stuff. I think part of the problem people run into is that they're too afraid to deviate from their normal, boring life. GO FUCKING DO SOMETHING. No shit life is mediocre and sad when all you do is work and stay home and sometimes act stupid in a bar.
@@aguspuig6615 You're looking at this from the perspective of someone who finds certain things in life cool enough to want or strive for. Some of us don't have that. As the OP said, nothing in life seems particularly interesting to them. I'm in a similar boat where I'll find things interesting for a short while and then get bored by them. Eventually, you run out of things to find cool, if they existed in the first place.
@@proudtobeme1ashkente Well that is a mental illness then. You will find things interesting if you expose yourself to them. OR you have to stop abusing some other things that mess up your brain chemistry like drugs and othe addictions. I understand having no motivation but thinking that things won't be interesting is just a cope to keep that low motivation. Motivating yourself should be high priority in these situations
between a college drop out who was going for a music degree and a guy who did his residency at Harvard medical school, Im more apt to listen to the psychiatrist with a degree. To claim suicide has to have a mental illness attached to it just seems logically not true
Pro tip to anyone out there who knows someone who is suicidal:
Telling them they need to stick around to "help others" is probably one of the worst lines you can use and may even make them feel worse, a lot of people with suicidal thoughts feel they're keeping themselves alive for other people and need reasons to stay alive for themselves, not to "help others"
Yeah, those reasons and what not are the exact reasons I became resentful for years before getting therapy. I needed people to listen to me and understand me and empathize with me and take my needs seriously. But nooooooooooooooooooooooooo, it's ALL ABOUT THEM.
Destiny show cases these abusive, toxic, passive aggressive, selfish traits.
Destiny is NOT self-aware and lacks self-reflection and accountability.
@@Jake38nine Destiny disagreed with someone in chat who said "help others" he didn't say that
@@NageekNoohac Huh? What are you talking about? Give context.
For some people thats the only reason to stay alive and if you told them they don't have to live for others theyd off themselves
@@connorp3030 I'll take your word for it because different people have different experiences, I've met multiple people who were suicidal who were sick of living for what they felt like was other people's benefit. But also seems to me like a shitty reason to stay alive, unless you're the type of person that gets a lot of fulfillment from helping other people it seems like keeping yourself alive for that reason will never give you a high degree of fulfillment
A lot of us don’t tell anyone we are struggling. We just keep going, until we can’t.
it appears that destiny is missing the point here completely, the human brain is very good at finding happiness in bad situations. however what these guys have isn't a very tough life or a terrible situation its just an absolute lack of anything good in their lives, the brain doesn't handle that very well.
Our brain is not going to adapt to a white room for example. People can lose their legs, wealth, beauty etc. And we can adapt to that. But having no life is terrifying because nobody can get used to that
The greatest hell isn't a dangerous environment or a traumatic experience but the absolute lack of stimuli that leads to atrophy
My human brain does not relate to this at all
Japanese used commit seppuku out of shame. Many cultures have a history of self deleting out of shame, that’s why online bullying became such a big issue. An unfulfilling life will bring feelings of shame and guilt, and that’s not an illness.
I’d love to talk to Destiny about this topic. I was molested, bullied, and both of my parents committed suicide independently and years apart. You just keep going.
Yep, its clear that even after alot of very very very rough expiriences what makes you wanna die is something else. Imo is blaming yourself. If you get molested i think you can recover from it so long as you see it as a shitty thing that happened to you that shouldnt have, if you think you deserved it then thats when it fucks with you.
Its not so much life being tough taht gets you, its thinking you deserve nothing but a tough and sad life, if you think you deserve a good life, then you keep going until you get it.
Destiny doesnt understand that because he has never been such a failure that he thinks hes worhtless, so just like you, hes gone trough whatever dificulties life throws at him, because his self image has always been above ''im worthless'' at the very least.
@@aguspuig6615 indeed. Gotta thank the parents for instilling that within me. “Never quit”. Also, I think many focus in on questions that will never have an answer.
That's why I think it's totally a mental illness or imbalance. My life is decent and there are things I could do to not be lonely, but for some reason when things go wrong or I'm in a funk I think about 988 myself
@@hbsharkmanMost of these people are living a super material life. Hard to find purpose in a material consumerism culture where at every turn you're being bombarded with bad trends of encouragement.
I was molested by my father, both parents are abusive, dysfunctional and unloving and I'm a woman diagnosed with aspergers as a teen. No longer trying to kms. If things get really bad I have sodium nitrat3
My brother used to be the kind of guy to get into street fights all the time, he could fight so he usually won. One of those fights ended in him breaking a minors jaw (he was 19, the kid was 16-17 I think). The kids mom pressed charges and the ensuing legal consequences derailed my brothers life for years. The girl he had a thing for stopped talking to him because her parents thought he was trash (very small rural town so when things like this happened people talked). Destroyed his self worth and left him depressed and frustrated for the better part of his twenties while he tried to figure out how to get by with poor job prospects and massive court fees to pay. He’s pulling it together now but he was at rock bottom for a while.
Yea man, guys in prison never get chicks
It's rough out there. I am short, semi overweight and work 12 hours per day making shit money just to be able to afford to rent a room with a house mate. I struggle to meet woman since personality wise, I am not that charismatic and often I think of suicide but My brother has already taken his life and so I cannot do that to my mum since it will break her.
I just keep grinding on distracting my self with work and My IQ is not good enough to chase a higher paying job. from 18-22 I did not have the brains to become a diesel transmission truck mechanic, Not enough brains to become an electrician which I tried to become up until 25 but I could not understand it.
One thing I have going for me is that I work hard and long hours which I use to distract myself because without it I would spiral into depression and bad thoughts. The only woman I can get are shorter fat woman. (which does not bother me) But the three I have dated all have mental illness and a lot of problems with my last GF cheating on me with her cousin lol. Mind you she blamed me for not being fun enough even though she lived on Doll (welfare in australia) and never worked single job because she has sever anxiety.
I feel you bro. I don't know if it will get better or worse. But I understand where you are coming from. Hang in there though. I think eventually you will be able to get a better paying gig with less hours.
Hope things turn out better for you
You’re doing the right thing mate. Hoping stuff turns for the better 🍻
Dang bro. You gotta listen to figures like Andrew Tate or something.
if you live in Australia why dont you work in the mines
As someone who just graduated college and has failed to make any lasting friends in my whole life, the part where he drew the bell curve of loneliness really makes me want to check out. I mean damn.
I struggled with that my whole life. I worked really hard at social skills making friends throughout my 20’s. I mastered it at the detriment of my career and success. Now I have lots of friends but no meaning in life. Never felt more empty but I digress. What do you like to do? You have to get involved with groups and activities that you like doing and friends will come. Eventually if you put yourself out there enough you will find long lasting, lifetime friends. It’s a game of probability. Put yourself out there and your odds will get better and better
Destiny is completely wrong about learning soft skills. If you graduate college with shit social skills you aren't screwed, you'll just have to embrace your cringe and accept you are in for a lot of awkward situations while you learn.
Men wanting to quit life because of social isolation feels very true to me. When I became atheist and all of my friends disregarded my feelings towards cults, it did feel a bit depressing.
So it depends how you define "mental illness". What is a "normal" or "healthy" brain? Do all serial killers qualify to be mentally ill? You can really call almost anything that is misbehavior and damaging to yourself and others as mental illness. If you can say that everyone that kills themselves is insane, can't you also say that all criminals can "plead insanity".
Destiny is quite literally defining it as something wrong with your brain that allows you to kill yourself here. So by his definition it is automatically untrue. But is being good at coming up with copes really more healthy than accurately assessing your prospects? I don't think so, and most seem not to either
You gotta realize destiny’s main goal is to dismiss the problems of men
Destiny’s main goal is to just deny no matter what
he's a russian cyberagent
Why don't women have these problems?
@@redaderoua8816because they have social programs for women. Whereas men don't god forbid men try to create a space for men they get ridicule by women and get disbanded.
Plenty of men commit S to avoid consequences of their actions
It must be exhausting pretending to be an expert in so many different fields.
“Having a life that is genuinely not worth living” isn’t the same as “this person wasn’t illogical in killing themselves”. I think it’s a matter of phrasing.
He’s saying, from their perspective, they arrived at “my life is not worth living”. He’s not saying those people have objectively lives not worth living. He’s saying, that is their thought process.
@@ihaveachihuahau which sounds depressive.
Its a matter of clip chimping. DrK starts off by saying ''a life not worth living'' to make those who think that feel heard and validated, then he moves on to say ''even if you feel that way, youre most likely missing something, a way, a strategy to make your life better'' hes just saying they arent mentally ill but that clip makes it sound like hes saying they are corrrect.
But lets be honest DrK doesnt think half his male patients should actually just fucking die, he just deeply understands why they think it
Honestly, to be able to kys, something has to be wrong.
Nobody knows what comes after life, unless you have the answer, doing it is incredibly illogial.
@@j.ceasar What does afterlife have to do with anything? A lot of people who kill themselves are probably atheists who dont believe in an afterlife
I agree with the idea that societal pressures lead to this. Especially when it comes to being told "you need to make more and more money or you're not worth anything." Everyone, not just men, needs to stop attaching so much value and self worth to their "career." Find fulfillment in your every day lives, and start with something that makes you happy when you're alone.
Yes! But i think there has to be something you find fullfillment in. I think we too often try to devalue everything ''money shouldnt be the reason to live'', ''sex shouldnt...'' ''beauty shouldnt..'' we classify every aspect of fullfillment besides being a good friend or a good father as vane and superficial, but people do need Ws to want to live, getting soem bitches is a W, getting money is a W, the issue is realising that happiness doenst come from that, it comes from knowing you can do that, youre capable.
@aguspuig6615 In my opinion there have to be other things you find fulfilling that can give you those Ws, whether it be painting, woodworking, music, nature, fitness, teaching others those things, or whatever. Money and bitches are nice, but you gotta find worth in knowing you're capable of more than that, and you're not a failure if you're lacking in those two specific areas.
@@aguspuig6615 I don't think that's accurate, there are no objective w's other than the very very basic stuff. Getting bitches or money are not part of those basic things although I ofcourse know that money helps if you don't have a roof over your head.
People are wired differently, some people will find meaning from being an entreprenour and making money, for others it literally makes zero difference. The very idea that "money" is even a factor at all here is fundamentally just capitalist conditioning.
There are far too many examples of extremely rich people who did or are doing terrible mental health wise to say that more money is a good thing.
A W is something that feels like a W for you. You cannot let anybody or anything tell you what should be a win for you. That just means you wont chase what actually makes you happy.
Having the right opinion in niche internet circles has never produced good and effective changes to the world. Change my mind..
But the dopamine hit tho.
Haven't you kinda begged the question? Sure in hyper niche or even just niche circles not much change can be made by being correct but that is almost tautological. Being right in a niche community isn't going to change the world because the amount of people exposed to the right opinion is definitionally small.
However what about large internet communities? Wouldn't we say that it's undeniably positive, for example, that the online fittness community encourages sustainable means of weight loss, not to smoke, getting regular blood work, etc? Doesn't arguing for / holding the "right" opinion have some positive effect on the people exposed to that group?
I don't see a world in which having the right opinion is a net negative or a non-positive, even if in small communities it doesn't make as big of difference.
@@nothingnothing3947I understand what you are saying, but you are proving his point lmao.
@@HevEagle How so?
@@nothingnothing3947 I think the issue is that people rarely come onto the internet to "inform" themselves, but rather, to hear information that we already agree with. His use of "never" is inappropriate, but generally speaking, society would be a better place if we focused our time elsewhere instead of the internet. There is a healthy balance to be had, but most people skew too much on the internet (including myself).
If you want to make a positive impact, spending more time in local politics, or going out and talking to people is a much more effective approach than online debate.
I dunno, I can see someone arriving at a logical conclusion that their life is not worth living anymore cos they can predict its trajectory and know that they won't change anything about it or have no strength or will to change it.
It's still strange to think about someone coming to the conclusion to take their life though. Most people just really want to live, even if they're in pain.
Most people don't have the time to sit down and look at their life in retrospect lol That's also why Destiny's example is kind of bad. Wouldn't be strange to me if a lithium slave came to the western world and after 10 years of mundange work felt worse than in a mine where there was no time to think about things as they were in survival mode.@@avivastudios2311
That analysis can be easy to come to. What is not easy is to dissprove every other way that could change how you feel/perceive/live your life.
@@avivastudios2311have you ever been in some loud room with children screaming, banging on tables or stomping their feet wishing for silence? Sometimes nothing is preferable to something.
@@avivastudios2311 I'm not an example of someone who's healthy but feeling this, but many would say I can turn my life around probably, but the odds don't say that. I'm 23 but I'm very chronically ill in a very long list of ways, mental, severe pain, neurological, GI pain, born missing limbs, etc. I've been on sick leave since high school due to the illness. Most people seem to think I'm one of the smarter people they know but I can't do anything with that due to the illness, and I'm honestly just very, very tired. I'm feeling like Arthur Morgon in RDR2 when he says "No, I think that's all I have to give". This is not some woe is me thing, I'm just saying it's very rational. I know the statistics, I know my own lived experience. Odds of improvement to an acceptable degree at a minimum is... low. Very low. I still do really want to live though, I feel like I'm not done yet, but that will is rapidly running out, barely there anymore, just from the pure fatigue, that's all. That's the thing non-chronically ill people don't understand. All you feel is TIRED. Being sick for a week is one thing, a month another, a year another, try a decade, it eats away at you.
Destiny is clueless lol.
Some of people who do it are in a situation where they cannot see a way to any kind of improvement and are making a logical judgement in the moment.
The issue is that most of them would likely be glad they didn't do it if they held out for whatever amount of time they need to come to terms with their situation and/or start seeing some light.
That's not mental illness, it's a snap judgement either because you've had a shitty life that is slowly but surely getting shittier for such a long time that you can't imagine anything else or because you lost everything you valued in a short time (e.g. someone without a support network who loses his job which leads to his wife fucking off with the kids or something similar~).
It's not even a "in the moment" logic. If the reason they're doing it means reducing the level of overall suffering even more, for them and for their loved ones, it's not an incorrect way of seeing things. People will mourn for a bit but they will eventually move on.
There is always a way to make life better, anyone who hasn't figured out a way is either not thinking hard enoguh or is just looking for excuses.
But even when you have found a way, it can be very difficult to do those things, and therefore you might come to the conclusion that you're stuck in life.
I mean lets be real. We all know Destiny for all his pros like his intelligence, memory, debating etc, he has a huge con where he has a really hard time seeing anyone else's perspective.
Is it really a surprise that with an issue like this he has zero empathy and ability to see why someone might have that experience and outlook on life?
If someone has a different perspective then to him its ''oh they are irrational, crazy, or just wrong!''. That's the problem with havinng a lot of intelligence but low empathy. There's only so far you can go with logic and reason if you only have your own perspective to extrapolate, especially if your experiences in life aren't that varied. You need empathy so you can add pieces of other people's perspectives to your own, and be able to relate to other perspectives.
@@j.ceasar and you think the ones who actually did it were *actively choosing* to _"look for excuses"_ or _"not think hard enough"?_ Lol.
Even if that's the case _(sans the active choice)_ for some of them, you think there might be a reason behind why they're doing that? Some reason that is making it impossible to notice that that's what they're doing? Or very hard/impossible to overcome it? Perhaps?
Or are you just one of those _"fuck 'em, evolution weeds out the weak"_ types who doesn't want to seem callous but cba "thinking hard enough"- and/or who "makes up excuses"- to avoid the mental and emotional work related to empathising with people you don't immediately understand? ^^
5:47 is such a shit cop out take @destiny I expect more from you g
you're right that people in other countries have worse way of living. but it's still bad that even in america you're bound to have a shit way of living. EVEN when you make it to "the best country in the world" it will end up being despair. that's the point
@@shanttt In Europe during their latest famine, they boiled leather shoe soles to get protein. And they got through it... except the ones who didn't ofc.
NOBODY in America or Europe has it THAT bad today. It's obvious that it's as much of a people problem as it is a society problem.
This goat beard its not working for him.
It's not controversial. It's just true.
They are not mutually exclusive. Many true things are controversial
Yeah like alex said some truth are bothering to some ppl, and just look at how some ppl got mad at him even tho there are some research to back it up
It’s controversial because, if true, that means that society needs to change. Controversial and true are distinct dimensions.
But the question is, why suicide is more common in developed countries? If it's truth that some people truly think they have nothing else to live for wouldn't it be more common in places where life sucks more?
@@SteponlyoneWhy is it controversial to say that society needs to change? I genuinely don’t get it.
This is a semantic debate about how we define "health" in psychological terms. If we are saying that "health" is defined my the will to carry on living rather than the ability to reason clearly, then he is wrong.
That’s literally what I’ve noticed too. Self help gurus do this SO much where they will change the definitions of things to make it seem like they cracked the code.
Saying someone who wants to kill themselves is not mentally ill or has no history of mental illness is straight up ridiculous
This is touching on a very important and ignored point: listen to todays music. It’s not “emo”. It IS straight “ready to do it” music with much darker vibes and people can get sucked into this type of thinking so easily. “Oh, other people feel the same, it’s okay”
The twitter post is quite telling. "One had a daughter and one had a high paying job". That's what people think makes men happy? It's like men are being treated as a completely different species. What makes any human happy, is emotional security and fulfilling relationships.
Its wild how often I run into people just casually dehumanizing men, I don't know what its going to take for people to stop hating on men. We need some type of Martin Luther King figure but I do not think thats going to happen any time soon.
There's plenty of men that have that one thing that drives them over the edge happen to them. Often it's a succession of events that lead to a feeling of worthlessness with no escape. This, I think, is what Dr K is talking about. I don't think you'd diagnose someone with depression that is just going through some grief or whatever else. You just hope we only take it out on ourselves.
I believe EVERY man is capable of the absolute destruction and evil, internal or external. We just differ on what it takes for us to get there.
I think what a lot of people forget about is that suicide being bad is very western idea. It’s a Judah-Christian concept that suicide is always bad. Many cultures suicide wasn’t just rational it was honorable. Even In Greco-Roman society if you were seen as failure in some major way then suicide was the honorable way out. Christianity is what changed for western civilization. Even in WW 2 for Asian cultures the honorable choices after failure was suicide. In the Soviet Union after religion was quashed out huge numbers of people killed themselves. The reason people born in western countries even think suicide is always wrong is because of Christianity.
Steve Bonelli is a 35 year old name
Steven borelli
it must be older than that if he's the second one
Actual children commenting on fighting. Thinking fist fights are a normal occurrence. Lmaoooo.
Yeah, at any boxing gym worth it's salt, the first thing they teach you is don't get in a street fight. You can just die from a sucker punch for no reason. Real fights are ugly and short.
Why is distiny talking about some thing he literally knows 0 shit about lmao
And reacting to a real doctor talking about his real world experience with it lmao
Yeah like wtf 10 seconds in he is debating Dr.K about his statement. This is like the "erm.. source" meme.
Because he's projecting.
Have you noticed how irrationally angry he gets about "virgins" talking about sex? Because Destiny has supposedly had a ton of sex, so he wants to gatekeep being an expert about it. However, that's his entire personality where he wants to gatekeep being smart (and right) about everything because he lacks the humility and self-awareness and accountability to be able to say he's wrong.
That’s basically his entire career…
If it somehow weren’t clear already, Destiny has an INSANE ego. It’s also what made him wildly successful
3:53 destiny knows better than an actual PhD in psychology.
(With clinical practice)
5:45 that's such a horrible point. Has the average person in America been in that position to contrast? Or is this our normal making it not look that amazing?
Non-binary person here, upper middle class. I was suicidal in my teenage years, because of the emotional abuse at home and the constant studying I had to do, combined with little to no social life. I couldn't share and wasn't listened to when I felt any negative emotions.
Strangely enough, in my late teens and early twenties the ideation went away, even though I experienced so much more shit, I truly lived a lifetime these past 8 years.
I think that, due to the friendship connections I found and me leaving my parents house, it made me never feel suicidal again. Finding my "chosen family", people who love me unconditionally, that listen to me and take my pain seriously, that is what ultimately saved me.
What kept me going during the darker times, even if I had those thoughts, was a glimmer of hope. I knew that if I worked hard enough, I could leave my old miserable life behind. I'm still working on cutting loose of my past, I'm planning to move countries eventually. In my mid twenties now.
In my thirties I will start my peaceful life. I can't wait for things to be mundane ❤
So chronic pain can justify suicidality, but not chronic emotional pain?
To me its so so obvious what hes saying. Everyone on Twitter seems to be conpletely oblivious and CLEARLY havnt struggled from this. I had this EXACACT depression my entire life. Found something to live for at the age of fucking 30.
Leave to Destiny, with zero clinical experience or expertise, to think he knows better than a Harvard psychiatrist, lol.
Destiny Cornelli is a great R&B female artist from New York, mixing hip hop and traditional Sicilian hymns.
Omg how many factors he’s disregarding always. Ok why upper class kids could be more suicidal than McDonald’s workers ? Ok let’s see , their parent are pressuring them tight af to be successful. When ur poor nobody gives a shit if you go to college or not and if you do go everybody congratulates you soooo hard. When your upper mid - you go to university , it’s like heck of course, what else could
You possibly do. So just going is not enough nothing really is ever enough. Once again, not much pressure at the bottom bcuz clearly you can survive or fall on social security at any point. When you r at the top you could work your games get your way on pretty much anything. And when you in the mid - that’s the hardest pressing point usually from your closest people , which feels like a betrayal, Iike don’t they want you to just be happy ? Nah they want you to keep pushing like there’s no tomorrow way more than any poor person or any rich person. And also for no reason at all. Bcuz there’s plenty of money in a family, y’all are not starving . Anyways , just so that you understand what it’s like in the middle for real.
my dad's reaction when I chose a "wrong" degree which I eventually switched for something more "adequate" and then of course quit after a year and a half. all the time acting like a killed somebody or some sh*t
I think Destiny is just projecting. He's not self-aware enough to be taken seriously.
Lets not forget that lower class women have more sex and accept more lower class men because they help with the bills. Middle class women on the other hand are the ones with the dreams of finding a 6 figure man and never settle for less, so all the women that are around you don't want anything to do with you.
You don't need to be mentally ill to come to a conclusion that you don't want to be here anymore.
On the whole "people in the third world or in the past would kill to be in a position that people are in today that kill themselves" i think the difference is that those people have meaning and purpose in life. It is simple, but it is something like "i will provide for my family" or maybe something religious. Today, people are purposeless beings wandering through life. No amount of material wealth will change that.
Problem with this entire line of argument from Destiny is that people in the third world *do* commit suicide a lot too, it's not just a 1st world problem.
@@Hooga89 still suicide rates tend to increase with hdi
well it's not like you are born with a purpose, you gotta find a purpose if you don't have one whether it be being a family man or being a successful artist uplifting people or being a pioneer in your field pushing humanity forward or something to that effect you know
the only purpose in life is to have fun...
Also, whether you are born in 1st or 3rd world, you acclimate (Destiny mentions acclimation a lot, so weird that he didn't think about it in this case).
17:23 7 years later Sargon won this debate
I think of unaliving myself daily. I have no purpose.
I didn't do it yesterday so I'm not gonna do it today, I hated myself yesterday but maybe tomorrow I wont
I feel you. I feel worthless.
I put a bullet in my mouth to remind me the taste is bad. Stay strong brother. We only get one ride and maybe an after credits scene. Gotta wait till the end to see tho!
@@FuhrerHeisen Isn't that a reason not to end it? We're already gonna die, rushing the process is retarded
What comes after life might be worse than what you have now.
Besides, don't you wanna finish on top? Finishing at the bottom is just sad.
I deleted all my social media and my mental health has never been better.
I think suicide is a complex situation that could be categorized as its own illness. I’ve attempted it once and I can say that your mindset going in isn’t scared, afraid or even angry. It’s this deep loathing of life. I blame the internet with all the gore, sex and drugs being displayed and pushed. In life there is no easy road in it. It’s like life always had this mechanism that balances out the good and the bad in your life. Even in our “utopia” we are facing a travesty that no other nation has ever seen before. It’s like yeah you don’t have environmental dangers but your mind will kill you, but in Africa it’s like I don’t have time to even be sad gotta run from this lion. We just can’t win in life.
On destiny's point about high suicide rates in middle/upper class children at 13:20: Palo Alto High School is directly across the street from Stanford University and high school kids were robloxing themselves on the nearby train tracks so frequently that they had to put barriers and guard posts up.
I mean couldn’t it just be an irrational analysis of their life that leads them there? Mental illness isn’t necessary to be irrational.
Does it have to be irrational though? I'd say it's pretty easy to imagine situations where one's life is strictly rationally viewed as not worth the struggle. If anything, I think oftentimes peoples' will to live is more irrationally driven than rational (not to say that's a bad thing, but merely that there is some degree of delusion that can actually end up being adaptive in these circumstances.)
What makes such rational or irrational? That it conforms to preconceived standards or not? Some do not see what they look to find if anything at all, without contentment. How do you convince someone they should want something else, be happy with something else, that they do not?
@@ark-L Pretext: I believe anyone can choose that route if they wanted to since there is no consent to being born. The only thing effecting this would be if they consent to another person becoming dependent on them. At that point you are consenting to obligatory living.
Whether or not it is rational is probably a matter of perspective. If you take a look at the timeframe of a life, imo it is the rational decision to just wait it out. You’re going to die soon regardless.
The only exception would probably be if daily life was actual physical torture.
But if someone has an extremely shortsighted perspective on life it could probably become rational in their view for them to no longer endure.
The main point of my comment was just to disconnect rationality from mental illness though lol.
For example if they were gay but there were no other partners, can you convince them to be happy with a straight relationship? If they wanted a free life but they could never achieve one, can you convince them to be happy of one without? If one hated their organic form and wanted an artificial body, can you convince them to be happy with their current form? Somethings are beyond rationale.
@@V01DIORE I don’t think we have a responsibility to determine what is rational or irrational for others. It is largely an introspective journey.
The most you can do is provide influence for others to build their own internal narratives off of.
I'm a girl but often have a masculine way of communicating and i cant agree enough with the unfairness of when i'm in an argument with a girl who is showing sad emotion and im showing anger emotion that im expected to take care of the sad one and im seen as the "bad guy." Its extremely frustrating because sometimes that sad person just spit snake venom at me 2 minutes ago which caused my anger and i dont really want to take care of the crying snake, caz they honestly don't even deserve it in that moment!
One of the few times ive disagreed with Destiny. There are lots of people who simply have awful lives. I think the point Dr K is making is that trying to convince these people not to commit suicide should not be through strict logic because for these people their lives are objectively bad. We should instead focus on arguments like "things can be improved" or "there are things to value about life that are not logical"
Edit: I'll add that i was one of these people. I attempted suicide, and the thing that turned my life around was not a logical analysis of how my life was actually good, but through the belief that i could improve my situation to a point where things werent bad anymore.
More specifically he was saying that medication is not the solution. Mental illness treatments often involve medication, but if its your life circumstance that is causing the problems then no medication is going to do anything for you other then give you negative side effects. I understand why no nothings on twitter misinterpret this clip but its kinda shocking that destiny is totally not getting this.
"breaking isolation is pretty easy"
Not if you've been isolated for years. Having a conversation with someone after becomes so stressful because you need social skills, which you can't develop during isolation.
Try and find people who are as socially inept as you. Online gaming is perfect for that. Plenty of people in the same situation as you but it works because you have a common goal/interest and get where the other person is coming from. Double benefit is that you do get in contact with socially apt people as well, so you get the best (and worst) of both worlds. There's probably other nerdy hobbies this applies to but gaming is likely the biggest and most diverse.
Probably Existential Distress, hence the need for existential psychology.
A theory I have about the middle class kids with depression is that they’re usually the ones that tend to experience a drastic change in lifestyle. Unless some unfortunate thing happens to a very rich family, they most likely will be Rich. The poorer people will already be born into their situation and learn to cope with their reality early on in life. The middle class however start life on a softer scale then they’re hit with reality that they can easily become lower than their financial class without doing the necessary work. Parents of those middle class kids can also experience sudden shifts in their careers for better or worse and it will have significant impact.
it's just logical.
like playing a game... a very long grinding game... but you no longer level up but even slowly level down.
Acclimating to uncontrollable circumstances is completely different to dealing with mental chaos. Absolutely suicidal people make rational analyses about whether they expect life to get any better. They are not necessarily less rational than other people, and I think that is part of Dr K's point. It doesn't mean suicide is objectively rational. It also does not mean suicidal people don't have unwell brains -- I think they necessarily do in that they are probably sad. But I get from Dr K's point that suicide isn't just explained by having an unwell brain.
Crazy how Destiny asserts with absolute conviction "No you have to have something wrong with your brain to commit suicide" 😆
I do believe it is possible to become suicidal without showing signs. Especially for men who hide their feelings, which is most men.
I don't see what's irrational about it. If something isn't fun anymore, and the juice isn't worth the squeeze, then why wouldn't you quit?
I know what the “American dream” used to mean and part of it was the assumption that hard work will help you achieve it. Nowadays, I think expectations of realizing your dream are as sky high of ever but minus the hard work part. Unfulfilled unreasonable expectations can’t be helping the mental health situation.
Define hard work in this instance? Is 40-50 hours of labour a week hard work?
@@milomoran582goal setting, determination, hustle, idk, but 50 hours of masturbation doesn’t qualify.
L take destiny
I was a meth addict for 18yrs. Thought of suicide several times. Surrendering my life to Jesus Christ has given my life purpose. I am now 391 days sober and helping others going through what I felt
If you have everything going for you in life and you still feel miserable you will start to believe that the problem is you and if you do not figure out how to change yourself so that you can be happier you feel doomed in life.
I imagine that lower class people or people in poorer countries can ascribe blame to their external circumstances and they get focused on fixing those (and to be fair externalities are pretty straight forward to solve such as getting work experience and a higher paying job or something like that) but people have a hard time to fix internal things, especially in this time of digital distraction.
spoken like someone who has never faced such problems hence has no idea.
Not sure which situation you refer to. I relate more to the middle class situation than the lower class situation, so you're right I can only speak to one of those experiences with more certainty. I have experienced suffering while having a "successful life" and I can speak to that experience.
Maybe I should edit it to say "I imagine ..." for the lower class situation.
@@xecor4450 also the whole "you have no idea what it's like to suffer" rhetoric is exactly what dr.k is speaking of and is toxic and damaging to society
that Noah smith tweet does not in any way shape or form refute what dr. K. said, regardless of whether you think what dr. k. said is true or hyperbole. What is he talking about "walking out on people you could be helping". The type of people he is talking about don't have people in their lives in the first place.
I don’t get it destiny. If I have nothing to live for, “it could be worse” isn’t gonna become one.
Welp I’ll never make a livable wage, I’ll never have a place to live on my own, I’ll never see an environment or set of systems worth living in, I’ve squandered every opportunity in my life to change those things, BUT AT LEAST I HAVE BOTH LEGS. AT LEAST IM NOT IN A SLUM IN INDIA. like bro, that’s not how fulfillment works.
The case of Jeffery Epstein really proves how we don’t take men’s mental health seriously
Damn i never looked at it like this but it explains a lot about my mental state
What Destiny calls the "Ghetto Mentality", which is basically Honor Culture, is not linked to being a low status person. In fact, it's the opposite. The person who needs to protect their honor, the honor of their family, gang or tribe is primarily whoever is at or near the top.
This is the only way to prevent bullies from completly taking over. In game theory, it's called tit-for-tat. If you have no authority above you to appeal to, you HAVE to earn respect by ensuring that potential bullies understand that attacking you is not worth it, or you'll end up as a slave.
In civilized, well functioning societies, we've simply outsourced this function to the government. If there is no government to protect us (because we live outside the law or in areas where no government is actively enforcing a set of laws), women and children rely on men in their gang/clan/tribe to protect them.
For whoever is on top of such a hierarchi, whether it's deep (like in a well organized state) or shallow (like gangs of children living alone on the street), honor cultures will always appear.
A kid that fights the bully in the school yard follows exactly the same principle as the US did after 9/11, Israel October 7, or Ukraine after the Russian invasion.
Countries, tribes, gangs or individuals with nobody above to protect them MUST present an appearance of strength and willingness to use it when attacked, or they will lose their position and eventually their very existence.
Those who HAVE protectors don't need to worry so much about this, though, whether it's your bigger friend/brother that protects you in the schoolyard or Germany being protected from Russia by the USA. Or the feminists screaming at NRA members, knowing the police will protect them.
Sometimes groups of people who enjoy such protection over multiple generations will no longer comprehend how life would be without these protectors. They may start calling for abolishing the police or dismantling the military. Usually this comes from the left, but it can also come from right wingers such as Anarcho-Capitalists.
Whenever such people actually get what they ask for, societies and somtimes entire civilizations collapse, where those who cannot protect themselves are wiped out.
And with Honor Culture societes similar to Afghanistan or Somila growing out of the rubble.
The probability of failed suicide attempt is probably the number one thing people with depression are afraid cause they probably have researched a lot of stuff about it plus naturally overthinking everything thus not doing it, on the other hand people with no mental illness are more prone to decide it impulsively because of something bad that happened in their lives in some temporate period.
"why do you think suicide rates dipped during covid". I think watching the movie "melancholia" is good insight to why even though it has nothing to do with a virus. When the outer world becomes a reflection of the way you feel inside, it's like society finally gets on your level and you no longer feel like a freak or alone. Seeing society struggle for once, was a breath of fresh air. Society also made life easier for those with mental health conditions... because they accommodated to peoples wellbeing for once. The government paid people on social security, enough to pull them out of poverty for a short while. The government SOLVED homelessness. Workplaces let employees work from home, which saved them a lot more time during the week so they could do things they actually want to do and made for healthier sleep patterns. Students mental health were accomodated more, giving students more flexibility with assignments, also paving waves to study from home. The neurodiverse and those with mental health conditions LOVED this because it can be hard enough to get out of the bed in the morning for these populations let alone get dressed/ready hours before you have to be somewhere just so you get there on time etc. The roads and shops were mostly empty making navigating spaces that are usually totally stressful, calm. People were making art/music and content that we could all relate to as we were having a shared collective experience of being in lockdown and feeling more lonely than usual. Thus, making the world more connected than ever. The last time people would have felt that connected would have been after WW2 ended and the Beatles revolutionised music.
The government didn't solve homelessness, they had a temporary bandaid on it for a year or two and it hurt our economy heavily. The rest of what you said is pretty spot on I think. It was a forced experiment for companies to allow working from home and hopefully enough of them found the productivity wasn't impacted heavily, and will continue.
@@mrhino the temporary bandaid for homelessness still proved they could house the homeless and get them off the streets. Seeing them litter the streets of our cities is what hurts the economy, and the cities spirit. If homeless rates keep rising, nobody will want to go near the city anymore. It's too depressing and gets more dangerous the more desperate people get.
Work in mental health. We sometimes say patients have "shit life syndrome". Usually reserved for people with no family, no friends, low paid/unemployed with no education to help them find a better job, and living in shitty housing