Captain's Commentaries - Evolution of Magazines
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
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As someone who just got into the half dart ecosystem, you have no idea how helpful this is.
Hey Captain, here are some details you accidentally missed at beginning. The Singapore company Xplorer really pioneered half dart mags, though they had a different and slightly bulkier and proprietary geometry. And the company Artifact (based out of china, perhaps they Became worker IDK) made one of the first n-strike mag compatible half-dart only mags. The Artifact mags looked like a really short n-strike mag at the top with a katana like body coming out of it. The Singaporean nerfer Psyke put out a video on the Artifact mags several years back. I'm 90% confident this all happened before worker put out the n-strike half dart mags. Or at least before they got popular.
Some of that I knew but chose to omit because they failed to become the industry standard. Other bits of that I simply did not know. So thank you for the info. :)
Something i wish had been leaned into more is the durability of all the mag options. The Koda mag being so insanely durable is the whole reason why Im slowly switching to them over Talons. That, and the capacity increase. I play at indoor arenas on friday nights, and having 8 more darts on hand, whether it's for a springer or flywheeler, makes a massive difference. Yes, Koda's are expensive, but I think we'll slowly see more and more people using them in the future. I already have a butt-ton of talons, but im wanting Koda's.
I reviewed the Koda mags in their own video, didn't I? Super durable, very nice.
@@CaptainXavier yup, I saw you had, I was moreso saying comparing the durability of all the mags could have been a good talking point within the video. Good look back through the hobby tho!
Right, like nearly every Nightingale mag you will see in the wild has the bottom taped because the end cap is only friction fit in and will often pop right off if you drop the magazine.
@@jackganger-spivak5160 yup. I went with mag extenders and/or screws. A bit less jank.
Solid, educational video! A side note about slim-angled talon or "Nightingale" mags: Like Dart Zone and X-Shot's hybrid magwells, they have been pseudo-adopted as the mag-in-grip standard as far as profile; the ZWQ S200 Fire Rat, the S200s Viper, and the HC Diana all take Nightingale mags as long as you carve out a new mag release catch in the appropriate spot.
Interesting!
Very interesting, thanks for the explanation of the evolution of the dart magazine.
Excellent video! You sir have an impressive array of magazines and an equally impressive knowledge of them. Bangarang!
The diffarences between the magazines isn't copyright, but patent law, which expires after 20 years.
This is why we can copy the old Nerf magazine design freely, but not the newer designs, which will change after the patents expire.
That dartzone mag is from the mk3 not 4 the 4 is translucent smoke black and very much a talon mag
No that grey one is the 1.2. The mk3 and 1.2 mags are pretty much the same but the 1.2 mags are much smoother to insert and release from the blaster. The Mk4 and 1.2 mags are almost the same except for the lip design on the mk4 mags. As for being a talon mag, the mk4 mag is still a katana mag at heart with its catch location
Yeah, stop spreading misinformation. I did that already. I literally just went and pulled the mag out of my MK4 box, and while it is translucent, it is NOT a Talon mag. The geometry, while close, is still off and the catch is in the Katana location.
@@CaptainXavier well hell, I didn't look as closely to them besides holding the mk4 mag next to a talon....I stand corrected. But it still wasn't an mk4 mag 😁
No worries, I did the exact same thing. That was why I made this video, to correct that error.
The buzzbee tornado comes with a clear full length 14 rd banana mag. It's basically a smaller worker mag. The blaster is terrtlible, but the mag is cool.
Loving these commentaries
I NEED MORE!!!
the jurassic pro had a different spin on the AF mags too. and the conquest mag is slightly different from the nexus/aeon mags as well. once you have an adapter from EZE it really stops mattering though. his are better form fit to the blaster than stock ones, and are katana/ talon/ and AF compatible. it's become the first mod i get for any new blaster as soon as he releases it. can't wait until he gets his hands on the XSLS.
This is a great video and a super helpful resource! There were two details I think would’ve been good to have included, one being something I’m familiar with but some might not be, and the other being something I’d like an answer to personally. The first detail is regarding the magazines from the DZP mk1 and mk1.1. This may seem irrelevant to many, but there are a fair number of those magazines on the market and it is important to note that they’re adapters are not universal like we saw first with the nexus pro. While they look very similar, dzp mk1/1.1 mags will not fit into the adapters or mag wells found on the nexus, aeon, mk3, or mk4 blasters from the same brand. They redesigned the magwell and magazine for the adventure force series and kept that geometry going forward. Because of this, when the mk3 was released, they clearances off all the mk1 and mk1.1 magazines and adapters because they knew they would not be compatible going forward. They are still great mags but they have to be used in their own adapters and if you want to put the adapters into blasters they weren’t made for, there are some bars on the sides of the adapter you have to shave off and some trimming you must do inside the main blaster’s magwell. What I’ve done for my games is I’ll give someone a modified aeon pro with a dzp mk1 adapters and mk1 mags, and tell them to only use their mags to avoid confusion.
Another detail I’d have liked to have seen is whether the latest dzp mags fit into the x shot adapter. I’ve heard they’re Omni compatible, but I don’t know if that includes dart zone.
Need those hybrid adapters then can use whatever. I use the Axel Customs, now Zaurko Blaster, KT adapters. They are solid grate design and work amazing 😉
speaking of xshot, they had their own full size mag previously as well, that was not n strike compatible. busbee mags for both full size and mega size darts seem to have been always cross compatible, with small exceptions here and there of course.
Yeah, I thought I mentioned the older x-shot mags. It might not have made the final cut. I said early on in the video that I was not going to go onto every possible one off or proprietary mag. There are just too many.
Thank you for the highly informative video sir! I was really hoping the new X-Shot short dart mags would become a new talon alternative as if they were to sell them in shops here in the UK it would be like easily accessible talon mags, but the proportions worry me
Hm notably another factor to the magwell standards is that as far as i know of all drum magazines ever produced have fit either an n-strike or talon magwell
So another reason to buy the x shot pro longshot.
you get the short magazine adapter which will take all magazines, right?!
Its kinda weird looking back on this. As a kid Nerf was just gimmicky weird crap IE the Razorfin or before that the blasters that you had to squeeze the squishy hollow grip to fire the dart. Get back into it as an adult after finding a stryfe in value village and it was a whole new ball game. That was also when Worker debuted and kicked off the foam arms race between companies. Needless to say its been a hell of a ride and an odd feeling seeing half darts go from homemade and expensive hobby stuff off Ebay to in stores like Wal Mart and Target.
Informative. Thank you.
Thanks for this! Also if you do a fly wheel series it would be great to have one of these minis on batteries. For example, allot of blasters recommend battery X, but that lipo is sold out or disc. What can I do to find a 2nd battery, replacement etc. when the suggested battery is no longer avail?
HobbyKing, OutofDarts, Amazon. One of them will have a battery that will work. You just need to know the dimensions and specs.
@@CaptainXavier Thanks woot woot, I found 2 at Out of Darts!
Longshot to longshot, dust to dust
Just throwing it out there, for the sake of accuracy and clarity...
Copyright wouldn't be involved with the mechanical aspects of mags; things that are purely an expression of function, rather than an ARTISTIC expression of something, generally can't be coprighted. That would instead be a trademark issue- at least in the vast majority of USA legal instances.
Just sayin'.
I always wondered what the difference was.
Hey captain, where did you get those bumpers on your talon mags? I've seen some on Etsy but none for the curved mags, which is what I use.
Thingiverse. Well...kinda. The base files are available on Thingiverse. Mine are custom and have my logo on them.
Any bumper that works on straight Talons should also work on the curved one. I use the same bumpers on all my Talons. Straight, curved, angled. Works on all of them.
Do Kodas fit in dzp adapters?
Yes
@CaptainXavier hey, im in the middle of trying to make a model for magasin for halfdart and was looking at my Talon mag. I was just wondering, do you know if theres a special reason, to why the length in the mag is like 5 mm longer than a normal half dart? for me it just seems like a waste of space, but maybe theres a funktional reason?
Probably because not all half-darts are tue same length or to give plenty of margin for error. Smaller mags, like the Nighingale mag, are much picky about darts and prone to more jams as a result.
Dear Captain, I have a question which I think might make an interesting video like this.
I'm from the UK, and we are only just discovering the magic of half length darts, and something I am wondering is WHY half length darts don't work in full length systems. I know there must be a reason, but I just can't get my head around it. I suppose my main examples would be muzzle loaded blasters (and hence revolvers like the Villainator) and magazines.
It's something I was always curious about but never understood, and think it would make an interesting video to break down the reasons why.
I know a number of people in the UK who would strongerly disagree with your claim that they are "only just discovering half darts" but we can leave that for now.
The main reason half darts don't work in full length blasters is because those blasters were designed to use full length darts. Similar to why you cannot put a pistol round in a gun designed for rifle rounds.
However, half darts will work in most blasters with only minor modifications to the blaster. For muzzle loaded blasters you have to remove the dart post so the half dart can be loaded all the way into the barrel (this will require a ramrod). Alternatively, on many revolvers you can dril out the back of the cylinder so you can rear load half darts. For mag fed blasters you have to add a sealed breach for much the same reason.
In regards to half/full dart comparability, while i think the system on the nexus pro is interesting, anybidea why they didn't just engineer a longer prime to allow for a bit if extra clearance?
Not a clue.
I don't think it's vital info, but I happen to really like the one mag ya skipped over; curved Talon's...
I didn't skip it. There is one in the video.
Oh. Ok. Missed that. Old eyes. Excellent video. 👍
Yeah, I don't specifically mention it. But it is there. It is my primary go to mag too.
Rewatched the video. Now I see it. Oh and I've always enjoyed all your videos. The DMR series has been great👍
Oh geez, Short darts... They (keeping the tip constant) are not necessarily more accurate, and don't necessarily get better range at constant velocity or even energy than the full length (12.7x72mm). In fact tip for tip, since they lose some mass (as much as 0.25g) and thus sectional density due to the mass of the omitted foam, they are more likely to be LESS reachy/more droppy.
They also disadvantage the internal ballistics of any given flywheel blaster, and often, its mechanical accuracy. I pointedly dislike the trend of putting them in full size flywheel primaries, which generally makes a given blaster shoot worse drop, velocity and energy figures, and - worse groups, even if it LOOKS like the darts are flying more accurately (because they are smaller). The mags also are prone by basic design to feed issues, and this is difficult to overcome without changing the material properties of dart foam. I have to deal with tropical climate, but a lot of nerf events are located in humid places so this is a consideration.
By contrast, shorter foam performs better in barrels, and usually barreled blasters don't cycle at more than 10rps, so short is an obvious choice. And of course - ammo density, pistols, SMGs, mag-in-grip, That kinda thing. Short darts are cool for that.
I only use flywheel blasters, and I only use full length in a primary (excepting my belt-fed which is short dart for maximally compact ammo and a specific feeding reason). The full length give significantly better ballistics, and better mag reliability. Also, I dislike the skinny little shorty mags. I seriously experimented with short darts in the magfed rifle app due to all the short dart flywheeler hype, but never found flywheeling short darts to be much good, in general. The fact that a number of users on the internet have reacted in a weirdly hostile/toxic manner to me reporting findings, data, etc. on this subject has ended up drawing my increasing attention onto testing, and that further testing ended up ...showing that even I was making some assumptions and full length was doing even better than I thought. Data on torukmakto4.blogspot.com ...at this point I'm just annoyed by the hype and all the assumptiony crap and borderline misinformation out there about flywheel and short darts.
Hasbro: please call them clips.
21 nerf gun salute for coop: person #2
Umm... the second catch notches on the front of Nightingale magazines ARE already in use... in the Nightingale. 😄
Yes...the side notch on the front is used in the Nightingale. The one on the back is not.
@@CaptainXavier Yes, sorry... rewatching I noticed you did say that's what the Nightingale uses. But it was a bit confusing when you then said "they don't have a blaster that uses it".
@@CaptainXavier The Quik actually uses the one in the back to achieve Nightingale and angled talon compatibility.
@@jackganger-spivak5160 hey yeah? Neat!
What would you say the best 3d printed flywheel blasters are that would fit a 22x22x35 build plate?
Define "best."
@@CaptainXavier Compact and fully automatic preferably :)
Probably something like the Lepus, Quick, or Meowzer. If you know how to program brushless you could try a Gnk-200.
And my dumbass bought 10 Dictator Magazines thinking i saved some money.... so i had to modify the mags to fit in my Colonel wasp 76
Instructions unclear, i put a buzzbee shell in a Jupiter
What? The power clip and mag strike mean nothing to you? Or what about the electric eel or the sawtooth? Could have also included homemade hopper/rscb systems and in line magazines. Or went with the full evolution of multi shot blasters from turrets and chains and clips and homemades to magazines.
...what are you talking about? None of those are "box magazines." I specifically say this video is about box magazines. And more specifically the ones that became and/or influenced the hobby standards. I could do several videos covering every other random/proprietary loading mechanism ever used, but that was not the topic of this video.
Well actually you did not specify “box” magazines but my bad. I get your point. I just thought this was an evolution of magazines/ clips in general. Perhaps this evolution and the homemade designs that used to be the standard could be for another video then. Probably a lot of folks who have only gotten into the hobby in recent years never even saw the way it used to be done with pvc and things of that nature. When things like the crossbow, the doomsayer and air tech 4000 were the Kings of the battle field. Before everyone could just 3D print whatever special part they wanted.
I actually anticipated this exact bit of pedantry and filmed a segment addressing it but I chose to cut it because I felt it was unneeded and a bit harsh...clearly I was wrong. So here it is, just for you. ;P ua-cam.com/video/I83FhW_-wcE/v-deo.html
That would not be a single video (unless it was 10 hours long) because what your are describing is the entire history of the old NIC. That could be a whole series of videos. But you are not wrong, that would be a fascinating series. Sadly, I am not really qualified and much of that was actually before my time in the hobby. I came in just at the tail end of that era.
@@CaptainXavier ok. Is youtube deleting my comments? I’ve replied to this twice now and neither showed up...
Feeding the algorithm
Just me or has it been a while since the captain posted. Still happy he posted tho
My dude, I uploaded 5 days ago...
@@CaptainXavier I know I have just been doing a lot of stuff so time felt stretched. Any who thanks for the reply.
Also I didn't mean to come off as inpatient (if I did) I just reallyenjoy your content and am always anticipating your uploads.
do you have a discord? or plan on making one? i cant find anywhere to go for help with modding-
I do not, no. I would recommend the various Nerf modding Facebook groups. There are lots of them.
@@CaptainXavier ah, ill try to get facebook...
@@CaptainXavier if i may ask, what facebook groups do you reccomend?
@@floofer6699 Nerf Modders Welcome, Nerf Buy/Trade/Sell/Mod, The Federation of United Nerfers, Printed Blaster Support and Rehab Group.
Very informative, but gives me a headache...