I remember having a conversation on the official SRB2 server about bosses and on many online servers. Almost everyone said the Metal Sonic fight was the worst one. Even the custom characters with overpowered projectiles (Aether, Flare) struggle since Metal Sonic decides you have to intimidate him again for no reason at all.
Another thing I despise about the Egg Slimer is how incredibly LOUD his second phase attacks are. There's no reason for them to be as deafening as they are
For me I have my volume down as I sorta play it with other videos along with the music playing in the background It's not really that loud for me but once I played the game with the volume all the way and yea it's Definitely defining I don't know why it is and I wish there was a mod to fix like for the meantime until a patch but it's only a minor issue for me (Sorry for the ramble)
The Metal Sonic race does have potential to be more, specially how the original "boss fight" of Metal on Sonic CD it's as much of a race through an obstacle course, as much as a fight as you run against him since he can attack you in 2 different ways, so if the Metal race on SRB2 adds ways for Metal to try to stop you directly, it would be a nice change of pace.
The problem with the race is how it's set up, Jackal's analysis of it being a visual metaphor for your time limit is pretty much spot on, as he's merely a demo recording of someone playing through the level as him, meaning that there is no way for him to interact with the player in any unique way. Metal (the race entity) would have to be pretty much entirely reprogrammed in order for race aspect to have any sort of depth to it.
12:02 WHAT DO U MEAN SRB2 STILL HAS MORE TO BE ADDED?!/11/?!1??! i never knew this until now, i cant believe that there were a whole two zones to be added with one of them being from the Sonic OVA movie, i really hope that they finish up red volcano zone so that they can start working on the other two levels
Its true tho, I think not only does it actually feel like a boss and is challenging but it focuses on both aspects of sonic being speed and platforming plus some strategy as well, but I think it can be better i will say, but I really don't get the hate for it
@@Doxthefox I mostly gave my piece on it in my own comment but it boils down to a really terrible first impression that most people are not willing to reconcile.
@ I mean yeah i hated it first time but it was similar to how a crash bandicoot level feels, which yeah this is sonic but i think its fun when you learn how it works, but i think there can be some things added to make it better. Like I had this idea were there’s slopes that would connect to the wall and to the next platform which would be a harder way to get to each button but it would help not getting hit and it would be a perfect way to show off what sonic is best at and it be a challenge for people who don’t fully know on the physics plus it add more planning on how you would beat the boss
@@Doxthefox the incredibly tight damage windows on such a floaty and imprecise moveset, confusing and unsafe transition to phase 2, excess of downtime where you wait for openings, and bizarre ways it constricts where you can and can't platform all add up to make it unfun for 90% of players. maybe in an adventure-era game the concept would work better, but in SRB2 it feels out of place and tedious at best for most playthroughs
@MegMegal-k1i i don't really think I see those problems, the transition to second phase makes sense for it being a boss and I always mvoe slightly more towards the middle of the map to not get h8t by the spikes until I see the springs appear, and I can tell where I can platform to which is the grass spots, the dirt spots are areas that I can go on but will be destroyed soon and the spikey floor will hurt you. I think the boss can absolutely fit in with srb2 especially if they made the other bosses more complex like it, I don't wanna see it be nerfed in difficultly when the game gets it's next major update and isn53ad jsut improve on what's there
Fun fact: Amy is the only character (who fight up close) that has less risk getting hit by as he bounces, because with other it can happen you touch his tail & take damage instead, while Amy's hammer has no hurtbox (Amy herself still does ofcourse), only a hitbox around Amy, meaning that if you hit with her hammer, it will always be fang who takes damage, even if you hit his tail
Worth noting that you're safe from the egg-robos in the Castle Eggman boss if you walk on the purple line, so it is possible to get more hits in on the boss more quickly, if you can keep from slipping off the path and land the rebounds off Eggman.
For Metal Sonic, you need to get really close to him to trigger a spin-out. The easiest (and safest) way is this: Metal Sonic needs to build up to so much momentum that he cannot safely avoid you when you try to jump into him. This can be done by making him rubberbanding him back and forth with your movements to put him on a collision course.
I am writing this comment as I watch the video: I hate metal sonic, but for slightly different reasons (although actually hitting him is another huge factor). The pinch mode is extremely boring, easy to avoid, and takes way too long. I do not enjoy "wait for me to expose my weakpoint" bosses unless there's some twist to it. I like Brak's take on it because you have to manually remove his invulnerability, exposing the weak point is a part of the boss design. Metal Sonic is "watch him bounce around a couple times and THEN you are allowed to hit him" the boss would be so good without that second phase. As a whole, I think all of the bosses up to and including Deep Sea's boss are fairly well designed (I know you knocked the Techno Hill boss but as the second boss in the game I think it's fair to be a little bit easy) but then once you hit Castle Eggman the bosses become extremely tedious and, I'd argue, mostly unfun. I think Brak is most definitely going to be reworked in some fashion if/when he gets moved to Dark City. I have to imagine he was tweaked slightly to serve as a "Good enough" final boss by being given more hit points and a challenging arena. Honestly aside from his missiles being able to stunlock you and knock you into the instant death pit once he hits pinch mode (which is honestly pretty cheap) I can respect him being this high) Egg Colosseum at number 1 is... certainly a choice, haha. He's certainly "unique" but that's the nicest thing I can say about it. It (Like Castle Eggman) is far too much of a difficulty spike compared to what comes before (and arguably what comes after, Fang is far easier) and is an absolute nightmare for any new players. - constantly corralled inside the two rows of maces, meaning constant fear of damage - very precise hitbox when he opens up that risks you taking even more damage if you don't do it right - footing that is constantly destroyed as the fight progresses which makes the fight even harder if you are still struggling with SRB2's control scheme - confusing pinch mode transition which isn't immediately clear what you're supposed to do, and can also punish you in multiple ways for not immediately doing it right (there's no way for the player to know the Eggrobos will stun you back into the pit of thorns, and also there's a chance you might just get hit by the swinging maces when trying to use the spring anyway) - while this arguably shouldn't count, it is also one of the worst bosses to fight in multiplayer, as multiple players trying to hit him while vulnerable means several of them are going to take pretty much unavoidable damage when he lowers his lid back down, which is a scenario that I can't really say for any of the other bosses in the game (except maybe Brak if you get a really bad position but this is extremely infrequent) It's far too punishing if you don't immediately know what to do, and still is even if you do. Sure, you can "get good" at it, but that does not make it a better or fun boss to me. A good boss in my opinion should be fun to fight on your first go around and become even better on subsequent attempts, and Egg Colosseum fails to accomplish this in my book, unfortunately. I think the devs are somewhat inclined to agree with this, because after Oneyplays played SRB2 and then got stuck on the boss and essentially gave up the entire Let's Play, they made an entire issue on their Gitlab that amounted to "This boss is too hard, we need to tweak it" so who knows how they'll go about adjusting it in the future. Anyways, aside from putting the Egg Colosseum just above Metal Sonic and Bumping Eggmobile up to either number 2 or perhaps even number 1, my list would pretty much be identical to yours. Even though I don't agree with all of your placements, it's interesting to hear your reasoning behind them.
Not even surprised about your opinions on the bosses tbh. Tbf, Sonic games aren't know for their spectacular and replayable boss fights. They feel more like afterthoughts imo. Also not surprised that you think Metal Sonic and Fang are the worst bosses in the game, and I agree.
You have no idea how vindicated i feel seeing you place Metal Sonic as the worst. Went through the whole game as Sonic for the first time a while ago and it kind of sucks, especially in those last few Acts where the level design gets super cruel against him. Still love the game (especially with mods) but it's worse moments are really bad.
Can you cover a rather unique aonic mod, its called ability sonic,it gives him a plethra of moves that can be used for both horizontal and vertical movement. In my opinion, i would give him a 7/10 on the moveset scale. But thats for you to find out
I remember having a conversation on the official SRB2 server about bosses and on many online servers.
Almost everyone said the Metal Sonic fight was the worst one. Even the custom characters with overpowered projectiles (Aether, Flare) struggle since Metal Sonic decides you have to intimidate him again for no reason at all.
I was struggling trying to beat Metal Sonic as Mario and Luigi.
Another thing I despise about the Egg Slimer is how incredibly LOUD his second phase attacks are. There's no reason for them to be as deafening as they are
For me I have my volume down as I sorta play it with other videos along with the music playing in the background
It's not really that loud for me but once I played the game with the volume all the way and yea it's Definitely defining I don't know why it is and I wish there was a mod to fix like for the meantime until a patch but it's only a minor issue for me
(Sorry for the ramble)
The Metal Sonic race does have potential to be more, specially how the original "boss fight" of Metal on Sonic CD it's as much of a race through an obstacle course, as much as a fight as you run against him since he can attack you in 2 different ways, so if the Metal race on SRB2 adds ways for Metal to try to stop you directly, it would be a nice change of pace.
That's a great idea, but the race probably has to be longer.
The problem with the race is how it's set up, Jackal's analysis of it being a visual metaphor for your time limit is pretty much spot on, as he's merely a demo recording of someone playing through the level as him, meaning that there is no way for him to interact with the player in any unique way. Metal (the race entity) would have to be pretty much entirely reprogrammed in order for race aspect to have any sort of depth to it.
12:02 WHAT DO U MEAN SRB2 STILL HAS MORE TO BE ADDED?!/11/?!1??! i never knew this until now, i cant believe that there were a whole two zones to be added with one of them being from the Sonic OVA movie, i really hope that they finish up red volcano zone so that they can start working on the other two levels
seeing number 1 feels like an april fools joke
Its true tho, I think not only does it actually feel like a boss and is challenging but it focuses on both aspects of sonic being speed and platforming plus some strategy as well, but I think it can be better i will say, but I really don't get the hate for it
@@Doxthefox I mostly gave my piece on it in my own comment but it boils down to a really terrible first impression that most people are not willing to reconcile.
@ I mean yeah i hated it first time but it was similar to how a crash bandicoot level feels, which yeah this is sonic but i think its fun when you learn how it works, but i think there can be some things added to make it better. Like I had this idea were there’s slopes that would connect to the wall and to the next platform which would be a harder way to get to each button but it would help not getting hit and it would be a perfect way to show off what sonic is best at and it be a challenge for people who don’t fully know on the physics plus it add more planning on how you would beat the boss
@@Doxthefox the incredibly tight damage windows on such a floaty and imprecise moveset, confusing and unsafe transition to phase 2, excess of downtime where you wait for openings, and bizarre ways it constricts where you can and can't platform all add up to make it unfun for 90% of players.
maybe in an adventure-era game the concept would work better, but in SRB2 it feels out of place and tedious at best for most playthroughs
@MegMegal-k1i i don't really think I see those problems, the transition to second phase makes sense for it being a boss and I always mvoe slightly more towards the middle of the map to not get h8t by the spikes until I see the springs appear, and I can tell where I can platform to which is the grass spots, the dirt spots are areas that I can go on but will be destroyed soon and the spikey floor will hurt you. I think the boss can absolutely fit in with srb2 especially if they made the other bosses more complex like it, I don't wanna see it be nerfed in difficultly when the game gets it's next major update and isn53ad jsut improve on what's there
OH SHIT, THERE'S ME! AT 0:58! THERE I AM! HI
Fun fact: Amy is the only character (who fight up close) that has less risk getting hit by as he bounces, because with other it can happen you touch his tail & take damage instead, while Amy's hammer has no hurtbox (Amy herself still does ofcourse), only a hitbox around Amy, meaning that if you hit with her hammer, it will always be fang who takes damage, even if you hit his tail
Worth noting that you're safe from the egg-robos in the Castle Eggman boss if you walk on the purple line, so it is possible to get more hits in on the boss more quickly, if you can keep from slipping off the path and land the rebounds off Eggman.
For Metal Sonic, you need to get really close to him to trigger a spin-out. The easiest (and safest) way is this: Metal Sonic needs to build up to so much momentum that he cannot safely avoid you when you try to jump into him. This can be done by making him rubberbanding him back and forth with your movements to put him on a collision course.
There is also that if you attack him right away, you will always make him spin out on the first attack
I am writing this comment as I watch the video:
I hate metal sonic, but for slightly different reasons (although actually hitting him is another huge factor). The pinch mode is extremely boring, easy to avoid, and takes way too long. I do not enjoy "wait for me to expose my weakpoint" bosses unless there's some twist to it. I like Brak's take on it because you have to manually remove his invulnerability, exposing the weak point is a part of the boss design. Metal Sonic is "watch him bounce around a couple times and THEN you are allowed to hit him" the boss would be so good without that second phase.
As a whole, I think all of the bosses up to and including Deep Sea's boss are fairly well designed (I know you knocked the Techno Hill boss but as the second boss in the game I think it's fair to be a little bit easy) but then once you hit Castle Eggman the bosses become extremely tedious and, I'd argue, mostly unfun.
I think Brak is most definitely going to be reworked in some fashion if/when he gets moved to Dark City. I have to imagine he was tweaked slightly to serve as a "Good enough" final boss by being given more hit points and a challenging arena. Honestly aside from his missiles being able to stunlock you and knock you into the instant death pit once he hits pinch mode (which is honestly pretty cheap) I can respect him being this high)
Egg Colosseum at number 1 is... certainly a choice, haha. He's certainly "unique" but that's the nicest thing I can say about it. It (Like Castle Eggman) is far too much of a difficulty spike compared to what comes before (and arguably what comes after, Fang is far easier) and is an absolute nightmare for any new players.
- constantly corralled inside the two rows of maces, meaning constant fear of damage
- very precise hitbox when he opens up that risks you taking even more damage if you don't do it right
- footing that is constantly destroyed as the fight progresses which makes the fight even harder if you are still struggling with SRB2's control scheme
- confusing pinch mode transition which isn't immediately clear what you're supposed to do, and can also punish you in multiple ways for not immediately doing it right (there's no way for the player to know the Eggrobos will stun you back into the pit of thorns, and also there's a chance you might just get hit by the swinging maces when trying to use the spring anyway)
- while this arguably shouldn't count, it is also one of the worst bosses to fight in multiplayer, as multiple players trying to hit him while vulnerable means several of them are going to take pretty much unavoidable damage when he lowers his lid back down, which is a scenario that I can't really say for any of the other bosses in the game (except maybe Brak if you get a really bad position but this is extremely infrequent)
It's far too punishing if you don't immediately know what to do, and still is even if you do. Sure, you can "get good" at it, but that does not make it a better or fun boss to me. A good boss in my opinion should be fun to fight on your first go around and become even better on subsequent attempts, and Egg Colosseum fails to accomplish this in my book, unfortunately. I think the devs are somewhat inclined to agree with this, because after Oneyplays played SRB2 and then got stuck on the boss and essentially gave up the entire Let's Play, they made an entire issue on their Gitlab that amounted to "This boss is too hard, we need to tweak it" so who knows how they'll go about adjusting it in the future.
Anyways, aside from putting the Egg Colosseum just above Metal Sonic and Bumping Eggmobile up to either number 2 or perhaps even number 1, my list would pretty much be identical to yours. Even though I don't agree with all of your placements, it's interesting to hear your reasoning behind them.
Not even surprised about your opinions on the bosses tbh. Tbf, Sonic games aren't know for their spectacular and replayable boss fights. They feel more like afterthoughts imo. Also not surprised that you think Metal Sonic and Fang are the worst bosses in the game, and I agree.
You have no idea how vindicated i feel seeing you place Metal Sonic as the worst. Went through the whole game as Sonic for the first time a while ago and it kind of sucks, especially in those last few Acts where the level design gets super cruel against him. Still love the game (especially with mods) but it's worse moments are really bad.
I got confused thinking that the video was released earlier like a year ago and I was looking through your videos
I'd like to see another speedrun series, but with characters you're more comfortable using.
For a video, I want to see your opinion on Reveries physics mod.
If you're looking for an addon to review, you should check out Trip the Sun Gazer
can you do a trip review?
Can you cover a rather unique aonic mod, its called ability sonic,it gives him a plethra of moves that can be used for both horizontal and vertical movement. In my opinion, i would give him a 7/10 on the moveset scale. But thats for you to find out
Extra points to egg colosseum for the egg robos b*tch slapping you if you get too close
Wrong. Castle eggman boss can go to hell.