Electronic Thermostatic Shower Valve - This is impressive!
Вставка
- Опубліковано 11 жов 2024
- My Real ReBuild project is almost done with Mechanical Rough-Ins and I think this Kohler System is absolutely the future of the Master Shower! I love that this Digital Thermostatic valve gives me some fantastic control options AND by mounting this in my attic I can easily do an upgrade or service without having to dig into my tile shower. Learn more at Kohler.com or
Check out these digital Kohler Products here - www.us.kohler....
Follow Matt on Instagram! / risingerbuild
or Twitter / mattrisinger
For more great video content check out Matts new site! buildshownetwo...
Sign-Up for the Newsletter buildshownetwo...
Build Show Network on Instagram / thebuildshow
Huge thanks to our Show sponsors Polywall, Huber, Dorken Delta, Prosoco, Rockwool & Viewrail for helping to make these videos possible! These are all trusted companies that Matt has worked with for years and trusts their products in the homes he builds. We would highly encourage you to check out their websites for more info.
www.Poly-Wall.com
www.Dorken.com
www.Huberwood.com
www.Prosoco.com
www.Viewrail.com
www.Rockwool.com
People usually flex their pool or living room. Not Matt, he'll make you go to the attic, squat and look at his plumbing lol
Anytime there is a mechanical room - that’s what gets my attention!!
And that's why we love him!
Deja vu re Matt’s old house tour lamenting his decision to put in top of the line electric switches that ends up being a pain and unnecessarily complicated.
I get that, but you know others are following suit and in the attic like that they're accessible.
@@steven7650 for the 15% of the country that can put utilities in their attic.
@@kraphtymac I'd guess overall between basements and conditioned attics we could get to 50%. There's no reason a lot of places can't build with a basement other than they refuse to out of tradition. Many places claim it's the water table or rocks, but it's not.
I like having my mixing
right in the bathroom-individual knobs for hot and cold!
This is so AWESOME! I actually did almost the exact thing a few years ago in my master. Used 2 of the Kohler DTV valves for a his and hers shower so we can each have our desired temp. Also have the steam unit and am such a fan over the more popular ones. Their service isn't just for their big customers like you either. My steam unit wouldn't run and they had someone out and had it replaced in less than a week. One suggestion on the Ditra Heat - run it up the wall behind the bench to take the chill off your back. I have it throughout the bath, shower and bench but would do that if I had to do it over again. Both Kohler and Schluter are doing wireless integrations now, which I'd recommend so you can tell your 'smart speaker' to "get the sexy shower going" - as my wife likes to call it.
Matt, I rebuilt my bathroom about a year ago. I also installed the Schluter ditra heated floor. I love it. I opted for the WiFi thermostat so I can adjust it from anywhere, but its scheduled for 87 degrees for the most part. One other thing I did, and highly recommend: I mounted a 1st gen Amazon Alexa in the ceiling, ran a 3.5 mm cable-out to a $30 T-class amp in a closet, from the amp I ran 2 sets of speaker wires back to 2 8" steam-proof speakers mounted in the ceiling on either side of the bathroom. Now when I'm in the shower I can listen to my favorite podcast, ask the weather, listen to news, or change song and rock out! Trust me, its ESSENTIAL. :-)
The steam generator is the cherry on top! Need this system for my shower as soon as possible. Great vid, thanks for sharing!
We had a Moen IoDigital put into our new build 8 years ago. Still going strong and we love it, I even got my wife the remote for Christmas that first year.
“All your gonna see are two nipples”
I’ve heard enough.
It's a slow night
The world of carpentry is a cesspool of constant sexual innuendo. That's why I left. Now I just deliver hardwood to the backdoor of whoever pays.
@@ps3shakes123 hahahahahahahaha
Hehe
I was gonna write it, but you beat me to it! 😂
Love the set-up, we have an earlier version we installed about 12 years ago when we built our house. A touch pad on the wall controls 4 wall spray heads, a rain head on the ceiling and a handheld. What I really like is programming the temp and what heads you want. My wife can set her program and I have mine and with a single touch you are ready to go. Wish I had the steam feature though!!
Normally I play these videos while washing the dishes and my wife makes dinner. I’m not letting her overhear this one. 😂
Kohler's history began with manufacturing engines for generators. They used the excess foundry capacity to make plumbing fixtures.
YES!!! Just ordered DTV Mode for a little bath remodel at home... happy to see great minds think alike.
Love that the water stays the same temp when the laundry, sink, dishwasher, or toilet are used, no more hot or cold water spikes. I put the Moen U in our shower last year & It's been Awesome.
Did you by any chance talk Matt Carricker into a similar setup in his renovation? Sounds like this would be right up his alley!
I have had the Aqualisa digital shower unit for around 10 years, fantastic shower with a remote on/off button and probably half the price.
Being from Wisconsin we're all definetly very proud of Kohler. Good motors and generators too 🤙
Alot of products made in china
so many points of failure. I do like the idea of having it accessible in the attic.
Seriously. Give me a valve that works and I'm good. Every additional bit of tech is one more thing that'll bust over the next few years.
But the system is built to fail. So they make it easy to replace the parts....
Web connected valving for showers? You didn't vote the "right" way, your shower's been cancelled. Nah.
As a software engineer, this networked valve control system makes me cringe. Who wants to reboot or install software patches on their shower controls? This falls squarely in the “just because you can doesn’t mean you should” category for me. What’s wrong with sticking a hand in to turn on the shower and gauge the temp before stepping in? If accessibility to the valves is important, provide an access panel in a closet on the wall behind the shower.
@@readyplayer2 My thoughts exactly. It's an attempt to create something to make money but it seems like it will create more problems than solves.
I’m a very tech savvy guy, but this is an over engineered “solution” that is brings a lot of moving and electronic components that can fail. Standard valves aren’t fancy but they just work and rarely fail.
I’ve had mine for 4 years and no problems whatsoever
@@Ampacityelectric that’s exactly what it costs lol
Being able to control the shower temp from outside is just asking for trouble
@@Ampacityelectric yup. 10k, but yo also have to remember that his concealed toilet carriers are around 1200$ per and the wall toilets he is installing are an additional 1200-1900 each. Plus, his plumbers destroyed a structural beam on the rough, last I checked it hadn’t been addressed, and the way they ran waterline and did some of the plumbing in that house like in Matt’s en-suite lavs, I’m not sure they were 100% sure on what they were doing. Should be fun to see how they plum the steam machine that’s meant to be installed at the same level or beliw the outlet 9 feet above it.
@@ny2la2day yeah, get back to me when it’s been 40 years.
Matt’s wife: Honey, I can’t get any hot water.
Matt: oh that’s simple. It’s either the keypad malfunctioned, or the electronic thermostat jammed, or we have to reset the controller or the Cat5 cable is shot.
Matt’s wife: Did you fix it?
Matt: no, The kid next door hacked my system again.
Or is the internet service provider isn't working mean this type of faucet doesn't work without an internet connection, which means not internet not shower 🥵🥵🥵
I have had my Kohler DTV system for 3 years now. I LOVE IT. I would do it again.
Third world problem : We need clean water to drink.
First world problem : We want endless hot water to shower.
Matt’s problems : I want to program my shower before I get wet.
Matt should build himself a ultra basic cabin in the woods to detox himself from all his frivolous Luxuries. The dude probably can't function without a HEPA filter attached to his face.
Haha
Seriously, just yesterday was on TV how EU immigration camps have no heat, no water, no hot water, and obviously no showers during cold WINTER temps. Guys go outside naked in snow and shower with ice cold rain water.
@@IYG-x7c Ask yourself a different question, why does Europe have to take care of something that isn't meant for them to pay for to begin with? Why didn't they just build those camps in Turkey where the muslims could assimilate properly? How are the Syrian camps even europes problem to begin with? Its a good way for ISIS to secretly come in, the perfect trojan horse. It makes no sense how those camps are even in europe. They didn't even vet who came in.
@@JOSEPH-vs2gc thats a different question. I don't agree with illegal immigration either, and I don't think those camps should even exist.
Turning on the shower remotely... like a technology in Japanese showers since the 90’s
Not new in the states either, just becoming more common. Lexus did do the self parking cars 15 years ago and everyone else is now catching up!
Good to know that when I remodeled my bathroom in the UK, 3 years ago, with the Mira equivalent thermostatic valve, I was using the future.
Matt great story I am so suprised about Tankless water heaters, I lived in Australia and we had one put in back in 1987 when I first built my house there. They have them all out side as well. After these last couple of days, where Texas has had to experience no Elec and everything freezing a lot of folks will be thinking about generators for sure. As with all the tech you are putting in your house the one thing folks need to know if you lose power you are out of luck. I have been in IT for going on 40 years now, while I love it, I till worry about depending on everything needing Elec. This the weakest point in this entire country if hackers took out the power grid for the country we would really be hurting.. Great stuff Matt I enjoy your channel very much.
Can't wait to see the finished shower. Definitely do a video when everything is tiled and functioning.
Kohler, Moen, American Standard.
Respect all 3 for their quality and service. Kohler...have to give them a slight edge. Ever since I first worked with their stuff in the 90's, I've appreciated the extra little bits, like the overflow pan you just showed. Nice shower.
I'd like to see what Matt has done for information cabling. His plumbing is exceptional, his electrical is excellent.
Most people simply settle for wi-fi, and don't bother with hard wired IT delivery... which is better. I believe a high-end project like Matt's deserves IT wiring... in conduit... with home runs to that lovely, spacious attic.
Matt,
I am really excited to see this system in action and during installation. I have been looking at this digital system for my future home, along with multiple other construction details that you have shown. Looking forward to future videos about it.
Put in body sprayers! I've had a bigger version in my house for five years, and it's amazing! The valve did break just before five years, but it's still awesome! Kohler was great to work with and it was replaced for free!
I heated my shower bench with the ditra heat too and my wife loves it.
Kohler has never let me down. Great products.
Installed a mira digital shower a year ago. Love it, better pressure. Just watch out, if you turn on hand unit after you are in the shower you get the cold leg in the face first!!
Be careful with those networked elements, they’re the primary targets of cyberattacks. Make sure you’re careful with your firewall settings. On another note, I love how all the parts replacement is done away from the tile. Replacing individual parts is going to be really easy.
Good call putting the electronic valve where you can replace it; my research suggested you’ll need to in just a few years, that’s why I went with conventional valves.
$3k instead of turning a nozzle is pretty tough. I waste money with the best of them but damn.
I like the remote idea but I would still like to see hand controls as backup like when the power goes out.
@@mslinstrot4643 Well in his case, he has a backup generator when the power goes out.
paying extra for the privilege of having your shower being able to be hacked to scald you alive while getting rickrolled
It’s actually not *that* bad. I just did a shower with three water options, and three valves with diverter etc was around $2,300 for all the valves. With the electronic you just plug it all in and have a controller and no valves needed.
Obviously, a bucket with water work better end the day
Very cool attic setup. I have a 10x9 wet room in my house being built and I just couldn't find a place to install this without being difficult to get to without hiding behind a wall or something. So, I decided to bail on the steam idea, plus all the mechanical stuff that will eventually go wrong. My house is high-tech enough, just give me a valve and a shower head. Thanks for sharing though, pretty cool.
I have wanted a DTV for years now. It looks amazing.
Remember this one started out as a $50,000 Reno. Without all the freebies from sponsors this one would easily be over $1,000,000 to replicate in the real world.
Sooo a real life renovation creep..... yeah this real life for sure.
@@zlmdragon. I enjoy looking at the all the new gadgets and advanced building techniques, but it absolutely changes original intent of the series of renovation on a budget. I hope Matt eventually tries again to do a reno on a budget series. It'll be interesting to see what kind of trade-offs and cost benefit analysis he does on a more budget build.
Ok I busted your chops on type a or b water line, I’m a just retired contractor building my own house n used type A by the way . Now I’m just in the framing stage and I’m glad I saw this now n not later . I’ve been accused of liking gadgets, and these r gadgets. I see a steam filled shower with gadgets in my Mechanical room . And it’s conveniently on the other side of my shower . Thanks .
Should’ve installed some lights in that attic area for service and showing friends! Hahaha. That’s going to be a nice shower!
I've been a fan of Kohler for a while. Our house has a Kohler cast iron tub, Kohler faucets and toilets.
Back in the 90’s, there was a show called Beyond 2000. I vividly remember them showcasing something like this. Albeit I don’t recall the name brand.
I loved that show, have never heard anyone mention it before.
By vividly you mean vaguely.
It was moen.
@@danbedard290 Do you happen to know the season and episode?
Now I understand why you need this backup generator, to have a glass of cold water when grid is down ,lol. I agree it removes some future enhancements, would be great to have similar with some kind of tap in case you need that water.
Pretty cool setup, really like how you've set it up so it's accessible in case there are issues with it! Seems like there was a lot of thought that went into designing the whole thing.
Just needs lighting to highlight the different units so you don't have to use a flashlight to inspect or repair.
At 1200$ just for the controller, I see that Matt and I don’t have the same budget when it comes to my master shower
His shower valve cost more than my entire bathroom remodel lol
Yep, he's basically dropping 10k for a high-tech shower valve. I could do my entire bathroom for that.
@Greg Erthal Hah, good one.
Matt I think you are like one week ahead of me in construction. Next week's project involves planning systems that go in the attic space above my master bath. I had not thought considered this Kohler doodad because I worried about having too much tech behind a tile wall, but you make a great case for putting it in the attic above. Also, I've been considering a steam shower. It's nice that it's all part of one system. So, chances are the Kohler people will get at least one quick sale from this video.
1st class Everything. Everywhere. Awesome build
I like this. I love the idea of not having the valves in the wall! I see they also have a more simplified control for this, which I like
Steam generator - awesome, I have one myself; valves not inside the wall, behind the tile - really good, I like Hans Grohe line with valves in front of the tile, easier maintenance; touch screen in shower - bad idea! Yet to see one registering your interaction with it reliably enough to not be super annoying!; Electronically controlled valves - ha ha ha... we, as an engineering species, really didn’t evolve enough to make this robust, reliable, and secure.
That's huge that the steam is integrated into that same control. In the past we've covered that copper line to the steam outlet with high heat insulation from the plumbing supply.
I installed one of those in Kempner, TX for my buddy, who has ALS. A bit more work, but MAN it is awesome! BTW, I saw one of your trucks on MoPac earlier today... wanted to speed up to give a quick thumbs up, but the roads were too dicey... so, I played it safe... love the channel, btw.
Have to say BRAVO! Personally I wouldn't put those hi-tech in my bathroom, but everyone has right to do what they want in their own homes. Watching your's and Steve Baczek videos I learned so much about home building and specially passive house building. You two explain things in such a way I started making model of my future home in SketchUp (arhitect still needs to do his/her job). You guys go in such a details and explaining why things are done in certain way blows my mind. Explaining all new technologies in building industries... wow! Because of that I have million questions about building wood home (in Europe we build in a different way). One thing I've noticed, in your own future home, walls are 24'' OC and about 10' high (if I'm not mistaken) but without blocking. If it's possible can you tell me is it necessary to do blocking since walls are 24'' OC and 2x6 stud walls have a lot of weight to carry? Thanks!
Dude, that's a legit shower setup!
Kohler is what I’m planning on using in our build. Best shower I’ve ever been in at Old Course Hotel st Andrews by Kohler
Check where it's made alot of their products are made in China.
That Kohler system was released back in like 2011 (?). I remember seeing it at KBIS with a former employer, so it was before 2012. Hard to call something "the future of XYZ" a decade after it's introduction.
I like the idea of keeping valves separate from the wall, but the electronics are a bit much for me. And I run a small tech firm doing design/build of supercomputer systems. I have three software patents to my name. Sometimes I like simple. But awesome if anyone else loves it. Not knocking it. Thanks for the product intro. I saw the final result in another video of yours, and admit it is impressive.
Kohler is a legit company. I was part of the crew that wired the Honda Data Center in Ohio. Kohler built the massive A/B power substation and the 3 semi trailer sized back up generators.
You had me at steam. That's what I want so bad.
Thank you. Perfect timing. I'm in a middle of doing my shower. .....
wow it's been a while since I've seen such good combination of "unnecessary & expensive".
Anyway I like most of your videos Matt, thanks for the content!
I love how clean it looks
Love watching you on The UA-cam im always learning something w/ you. Thanks Big Guy
I love your videos! I am hoping to build a new home in a few years and I'm wondering if you have ever put together a resource to link all the top notch products you have shown. I know they are all there in your videos, but they are so varied, from hinges and hardware, from pocket doors and exterior windows/doors, to hose bibs to master shower plumbing, I would love to see an accessible resource to all those products linked together.
Cool, another way for companies to collect information on you.
That is nice Matt. I would have suggested adding a rain system showerhead.
These Kohler DTVs are awesome! Enjoy it!
Commenters sure can be judgmental and dumping all over what you do, but I personally love seeing neat things like this (that I'll never have lol), it's just fun and I love your enthusiasm. Thank you for sharing your experience, don't let people stop you! Just because other people wouldn't do the same thing doesn't mean you can't do what you want. Diversity and creativity is great. I certainly don't want to build a cookie cutter home if I ever get there. Keep up the great work!
Solutions to problems that never before existed. This is the Moneypit2020...
You truly could be the next Bob Vila, only with more enthusiasm!
Similar system was made by HansGrohe, but no steam option, that I was aware of. Fantastic system, until it goes wrong, only 2 engineers in the country (UK) can work on them, have had 2 problems in the 5 years that I have had this system, one of the head valves failed, was replaced foc. The second was a lot more complex to find, but a very simple cause. The temperature sensor failed, it was replaced, then the system would shut down after a few seconds, they changed the entire system, the control unit, the cables, everything, with no joy. We went through the entire plumbing system, this shower requires a very different layout to the standard in the UK, large pipes, 22mm, instead of the standard 15mm, full bore valves, and a pressurised hot water tank, instead of the dreadful combi boiler that is so popular. The engineer had the same problem at another installation, at a very rich Russian’s house in London, who was making a huge fuss about his shower not working. He had originally had problems with his plumbing, 15mm pipes had been used, so he had to have it all replaced, after the house had been finished, which he was not happy about, I had read the instructions first so all was good for me. System is German, the OEM got involved, they took one of my old units, by now replaced twice, plumbed it in at their factory, all working, sent it back, same problem. Finally we worked it out, the temperature sensor, they had some reliability problems with the original design, and replaced it, the new one worked fine in Germany, but one big difference, in Germany they had circulating hot water, so the shower was hot as soon as turned on, this is very uncommon in the UK, so the hot water is cold until the hot tank water reaches the shower, in my case about 10 seconds, the new sensor was saying ‘fault’ and shutting down the control unit, this was not mentioned in the instructions. All good now, but a very expensive system. I don’t have the music option, the cost of the speakers was just too much, special water proof speakers, I do have the lighting control option.
I ❤ that you took my suggestion on the outlet in recessed medicine cabinet for the electric toothbrush! 🦷 You will not be disappointed.
I'll be sure to check out Robern for our upcoming build.
Definitely looks like the da 💣 of a setup!
That is the shower i've been looking at putting in! Trying to justify the price to the wife, lol.
There's no justification. The underlying hardware is ridiculously overpriced for what is little more than rebadged common networking gear.
Just go "Yeah. It's a splurge. It'll make me happy." and do what you want.
You should talk about cost. I know that maybe not everyone may be able to afford but I think price points can be included as a reference and idea...thank you for the content
Everything is sponsor so cost is irrelevant tbh.
I’ve repaired a few of theses, $300 part from Kohler. $300 labor for the two trips......
$600 to stop a drip that costs $125 for a typical faucet.
Kohler sucks. 36 yr pro plumber here.
Even if they managed to make to make the touchscreen work reliably in variably-wet conditions (which I'm not convinced they have), there is a huge amount to be said in support of tactile physical controls. I can easily adjust my shower temperature or sprayer valve knobs literally with my eyes closed, when covered in shampoo or soap suds - and I often do.
A touchscreen control, or even multiple touchscreen controls several feet(!) apart, is not unequivocally "better".
excellent video, very interesting Kohler products. Looking forward to the final walk through
The reason you want to be able to turn on your shower remotely is because the water takes time to get to your perfect temp. A problem easily (and very cheaply) solved with a feedback loop that allows a trickle of water to be pumped from the hot water pipe at your shower head back into the the hot water tank. The is keeps the HW supply always at the tank temp.
Another stellar + motivational video Matt! Say don’t wait until AFTER the tile is in to do another video in the master bathroom. I’d enjoy seeing a video of how the tile guy lays out the heating elements and wiring for the heated tile floors and shower seat. Will you be able to turn the floor on with your phone too?
I think the DTV seems cool, feels somewhat like a novelty, I'd prefer a drawn bath with a DTV setup. Love the steam shower detail. You'll have to do a follow up on what changes you needed to make to the shower enclosure to accommodate the steam function.
wish that I could like this a hundred times. Too many times more thought is put into the shower than the bathtub. I rented a house that the master bath had a tub so large that I could sit with my legs criss crossed and my knees didn't touch the sides. It had a sloping back that was enough that you didn't get a crick in your neck and was long enough that you had to be over 6' to have to bend your knees even a little bit. To top it off it was deep enough to submerge the entire body. The tub was also insulated in a way that kept the water warm for several hours.
THAT is my dream bathtub. Unfortunately, being a renter, I couldn't access anything to find the manufacturer and the landlords didn't know. 🧐. So I have been hunting for a while to find that tub.
Wait till you get hacked and the hacker messes with you by controlling the temperature while you are trying to rinse the soap 😂
my overflow is gold
I really like the change from placing something in a different location than the bathroom, so you can change it as your needs or wants change. I do wonder what kind of price tag is on such shower equipment. It's pretty cool to follow how you are doing this rebuild.
I thought steam just happened naturally in Texas. Thought it was called humidity 🤣. Lol jk
Florida - or actually everywhere in SE
So do I even want to know the cost of this house? It will be beautiful I'm sure. I really like all the detailed work in the framing like the 2*6 or 2*8 beam above each door. Well built, not just rushed.
“Hal, shower temperature to 105 degrees, please” “Yes, Matt, 105 degrees Kelvin.”
Seems like they were aiming for 105 degrees Kelvin 4 weeks ago.
This is awesome. So clever and accessible.
This is way too nice and I'm very jealous 😤
I know your attention to detail is incredible so I’m sure you have a reason not to, but I would think running a hot line to the steam generator would be more efficient energy wise.
I would think for the same reason you don't run a hot water line to an instant hot water heater, the efficiency in the steam unit negates the need to have hot water sitting in a pipe waiting on demand. The water would cool in the line when sitting possibly 12 hours between uses.
2 separate opposing shower heads are the way to go.
Hope you can do a show about how insulation helps with the cold weather.
You need to look at getting all those sweet items hooked up to some home automation. Home assistant is great for diy.
"...run the steam because I'm feeling clogged." I love how he even thinks of himself as a plumbing system.
With all of the work on air sealing and the new and innovative products I would like to see a video on how you will be venting the dryer. Most of the material is just crap out there.
I have almost the same setup - but more jets. And I use the Steamist brand computer and controller, which has a nice basic UI. It also allows for much longer steam runs that the Kohler. Out master is in a large home on the second floor so this was necessary.
Yikes that is a lot of stuff to go wrong! Still Extremely cool!
Really like the idea of it. Honestly do a follow up in 2 years please. Too many boxes and screens for a simple function. Looks great. Oh that outlet the valve is plugged into isn't GFI?
5:30 “not the other day, like 6 months ago” hahaha
Good to know family owned and us company
Alot made in china. Do your homework
Do a video on pumping or bringing up oxygen levels in a house. The dangers, the advantages, etc.
moen also makes smart shower. less expensive than kohler but equally as amazing! I used one in a spec home of mine last yr here in wisconsin
Matt, since you are going high tech, why don't you install a camera or two in the attic pointing at the equipment then you can show it off without actually having to go into the attic.
Nice idea that way he see right away if there's a leak or a problem thumbs up 👍
Great idea. But the cameras could fail, so we need another system to monitor the cameras, at least a new set of cameras looking at the first cameras. Never too safe.
@@guillaumelafleche9477 great idea now we talking problems solved 👍
my only problem with any electronics is the lifespan of said parts they do tend to have a short lifespan as an example i know this may be a little like apples to oranges but am gonna say it anyway about 10 years ago a bought a small window air conditioner i had a couple of older ones already they had old style dials and knobs your turn to control temp and fan well long story short the new one with its electronic control board and no knobs or dials is in the scrap heap the old ones are in the garage and still work both are 20 years old and still work great they new one after 6 years stopped allowing me to set the temp it would change the temp on its own and became unusable it still cooled the air but could not set the temp just a thought great video as usual Matt
I have a $100 Moan shower valve with a separate control for Hot and Cold balance. Turn it on and it’s always the same temperature. I can even change that balance while I’m showering!
I don’t think this product will go anywhere. It’s just an unnecessary opportunity to spend money for much greater risk of failure...
Just my opinion.