British 1958 Pattern vs DDR UTV Part II - Kit Comparison
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- Опубліковано 26 лис 2019
- The second part of a comparison between British 1958 Pattern and the UTV (Universelle Tragevorrichtung), the DDR's last design of web equipment which was undoubtedly influenced by the British equipment.
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Call me an old nerd( 'your an old nerd') but this content i find extremely interesting, used to have both 58 patt and the East German uniform and Webbing, but only have 58 pattern left now.
I'm glad you enjoyed, I'm glad of nerds (and being one) else there would be little point in making these videos!
East German AK copies served with the National People's Army throughout its existence. The MPi-K and MPi-KS were derived from the original AK-47 and AKS, the MPi-KM, MPi-KMS-72 and MPi-KMS-K were derived from the AKM and AKMS, and the MPi-AK-74N, MPi-AKS-74N, and MPi-AKS-74NK, were derived from the AK-74 and AKS-74.
I have an East german grenade pouch and a waterbottle, bought them for next to nothing (DM3,roughly £1 each) got them in the early 90s at a flea market in Germany. Wish I bought as much as possible cos there were boxes of various bits of kit on sale
It was a good time to be collecting this kit, for sure!
Interesting to note the UTV magazine pouch conforms to the format of the final (straight sided) MPiKM magazine pouch that you can see sometimes used to carry flares by the Grenztruppen, rather than the MPiKM-74 pouch with stripper clip pocket and oil bottle pocket.
I forget when UTV was developed but as I understand it, were under production from 1984.
There is also an example with an oil bottle pocket which I'd like to pick up. I believe the uniform was in production in '86 as you say, not sure on the equipment itself.
I believe that the grey nylon-strapped camo cover for the shovel was mainly issued to paratroopers and other specialized units while the base components of the NVA had a faux leather frame for a carrier.
I've seen suggestions that the entrenching tool could be worn inverted, unlike previous NVA equipment and that's what the laces on the yoke are for - to support the handle.
Consensus so far seems to be the strichtarn carrier with grey derderon straps was used with the Fallschirmjäger vest and I think there are photos out there showing this. That as best I know predates UTV and can be considered seperate
The paratroopers had the Fallschirmjäger-Tornister.
I've seen the suggestion regarding the entrenching tool being carried handle up before but I've yet to see actual period documentation supporting that so I've not gone with that assertion. That said I do discuss the supposition in Part I as it's an interesting theory.
Nice man, very interesting period. Are you going to be able to do West German stuff?
I have looked at some West German stuff with a friend, Dean, it's in one of the Hack Green videos from 2018. Not something I'm likely to cover myself as it's not something I collect I'm afraid.
@@RiflemanMoore Yeah I saw that, although I don't think Dean mentions what the actual model of equipment is. I can't find any references for it.
Very cool video I have a easy German impression with the later issue equipment and I prefer the gear they actually used.
Indeed, it's cheap and easy to get as you say.
I have a UTV set I bought in the late 90's. It's great gear TBH.
Не знал что немцы в 80 - х годах копировали элементы английского снаряжения...Лайк.
The NVA three cell Grenade pouch followed the Soviet three cell pouch, which was designed originally to be how Grenades were stored in vehicles going back to the Great Patriotic War era.( That is why there are so many mint condition ones about both Soviet and DDR manufactured ones. The post war DDR grenade pouches were also used in this manner,they may have even originally been a Reparation item .)
The Red Army Rifleman in the thirties issued a two cell pouch first for the RDG 33 Grenade Complex.... and “brother it was a Complex”, this same pouch was used with F1 and RG 42 Grenades.
You try finding photos of the three cell pouch being used by Red Army Riflemen...... if you do please share.
Later the two cell pouch commonly seen postwar was developed, which is part of as the Russian collectors call it, Model 59 equipment I believe.
The NVA seemed to have normally carried Grenades in a pocket and the fuses in another until the order “Prepare Grenades “ was given.
The Manuals indicate A/T Grenades were carried in special strengthened containers, which is interesting
The UTV equipment seemed to be a “ I hope you like our new direction” moment in the defence of world peace.
Of course, the UTV pouch is made of the Ein/Nein tarn pattern plastic cloth like the Assault Pack, the earlier Grenade Pouch was made of a light cloth canvas in grey/ blue to brown colour.
Thanks for all the info David, it's appreciated! As you say the earlier pouch was made in canvas, with buttons and loops to close it, quite an archaic design and not really up to field use I would say though fine for carrying in vehicles I suppose.
The previous NVA grenade pouch was apparently attached to the interior of the transports, and grenades would be carried in the uniform pockets by soldiers when needed. I don't know why they differed from the Soviets in this way or why they changed that for the UTV equipment. Certainly this explains why the original pouches are in flat colours, not strichtarn or blumentarn pattern
Crazy Theorie
@@kulikov9215 I will check with my sources but we know from both the NVA uniform regulations, the Militarische Grundwissen and period photos that no grenade pouches were worn by NVA soldiers, including Fallschirmjäger or Fernaufklarer, and that the UTV is the first instance of it being included in the webbing system. That the vehicles have the mounts for them is what I've been told, but I will check and confirm where this information originally came from, if you like.
@@deancosens5710 your partly right, the Kampfgruppen and early nva had granade pouches. But stuffin uniform pockets was a tabu or kind of an unspoken rule.
@@kulikov9215 so far the only grenade pouches I've seen for wearing on the belt are for tear gas grenades. You're right that these were used earlier, the example I've seen were from the sixties, and MdI stamped (so yes, used by the KdA, not the NVA) but then the KdA used different equipment to the NVA, like the 7.62 drum magazines and their pouches for the RPK for example. I hadn't seen any grenade pouches in use by the NVA at all, so I'd definitely be keen to see what the were using! Are you are it wasn't the KVP or DGP?
@@kulikov9215 there are photos of those pouches in use by KdA units at the closure of the Berlin border in 1961, is that the ones you're thinking of? If so those are indeed smoke or CS gas grenade pouches
The water bottle cup is very disappointing for anyone from the UK......very disappointing size for a brew.
Very true, you'd need to be a fan of espresso to make good use of it.