Every time I hear George RR Martin respond to something, I realize how much he and I have in common. I swear, I feel like I agree with every opinion that he has.
I sort of understand his Fanfic option, too much I see writer just follow the same storyline with no change and don't bother to explain anything because they expect the reader to already know. But I also see writer that willing to go beyond the establish storyline and flesh out the world beyond what there. The later if they decided to write their own stuff they can become great writer.
I get where he's coming from too in that people who want to explore and make their own stuff should expand their own world building. I don't agree with him in it being harmful to the source material, or how it being copywritten makes it so it shouldn't be touched by anyone other than the copy write holder. It honestly seems kinda selfish to try and prevent people from exploring and having fun in your world as long as they don't profit it off of it without your authorization. And of course there are plenty of authors who explore the worlds of others' universes and not their own in published novels and expand the lore and depth in their respective settings.
I mentioned on this on the subreddit fan fiction and got banned lol. It takes talent and effort to establish an entire world yet they would just start the story with "Luke needed to use the Force" and they never explain what the Force is, where it comes from, how it works, because we are all familiar with it. Ok, but what happens when you need to write something new and original? You haven't been practicing
I come up with a lot of fan fiction ideas in my head, but I usually don’t write it down. Regardless I think it can be good practice for writers still learning the craft.
@Angry Troll Bot I again disagree, arguably everything which isn't made by the original author is fanfic. Does that make the metro books set in Poland, Ukraine and elsewhere are not creative? Is what CD projekt did with the Witcher not engaging or good story telling? What about all the various Star Wars novels which are so detached from George's own creation that it kinda doesn't feel like star wars, such as what Timothy Zahn does with thrawn? All of these examples enrich the universes they exist for the better, the only difference between "fanfic" are person writes in their spare time and these works is that these are published or have gotten a license. It's dismissive to say that exploring existing universes is lazy when it only makes them more engaging and deeper, if it all had to be unique you'd end up with shallow deep and deeply derivative works much more than what you find, hell George is deeply derivative in many aspects, and a fuck ton of the shit in the world of ice and fire is just H P Lovecraft shit he is fitting to his universe
The idea that setting your works in someone elses world or using those characters is a dead end is ridiculous. Is all literature set in the real world a dead end? All historical fiction? If using the force because everyone understands is derivative, is asoiaf derivative because it uses concepts we are all familiar with, like trees, noble houses, humans, swords, war, etc? The greatest works of fiction were done by generations that improved on the work of their elders, bad changes get discarded, improvements get popular and built upon.
I think GRRM forgets that fanfic using other people's charactets predates everything he was talking about. Most famously with sherlock holmes, and Christain fanfics like paradise lost and the divine comedy.
I don’t personally feel that writing fanfiction dooms people to be hacks. I’ve found it really useful in being able to adopt multiple writing styles/voices. That said, I definitely get more satisfaction out of doing my own thing, even if that doesn’t always garner as much attention on the internet as glomming onto a pre-existing fandom ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Copyright violation is a fair point, but I think fan fiction is a good way to get people both interested and experienced in writing. It's not the best way to learn but it's a start.
Now this is my opinion, but I think he is seeing fanfiction like a gateway to bad writing. Fanfiction can lead to a new writer not creating something solely original, as he says, preventing them from leaving their comfort zone and trying out new genres to see what they settle into, but there are some positives to fanfiction. It can lead writers to discover what they like to write about the most, like if a Potterhead wants to create a new fantasy series, or a Treky makes their own intergalactic magnum opus.
Amazing totally complete. Genius, George R Martin created something that is on such a magnificent level that people couldn't properly understand it even if they wanted to.
I respect but don't agree with his opinion about fanfiction - though it could just be a generational difference. It usually is never a copywright violation, as its usually written for fun and consumed for free. I also think that it could be a great way for writers to grow and expand their own craft. Oftentimes writing fanfiction can create original plots and scenarios that can eventually evolve into original works of art. I've written plenty of original stories that were inspired by fanfiction I once wrote. I think people who write fanfiction _are_ learning how to world and character build. Its just done and evolving in a different sort of way.
Where were video games mentioned? And hes not wrong, fanfiction is derivative and stunting for developing writers. You lock yourself into set characters, worlds, and either follow along the original, stunting your creative development, or you change it into your own thing. The last one is not only copyright, but also ends up being kinda shitty because youre taking an already established character thats been developed and warping it to your own fantasy. At that point just make a different character and let it evolve.
@@terrencehawk8201 Not in this video obviously. But George has said they aren't art or storytelling but could be in the future. ua-cam.com/video/IO1l7nOiG7E/v-deo.html and before you defend him again watch this video: ua-cam.com/video/Xs6qBDuY1ww/v-deo.html Now back to topic. Most fanfiction is indeed pretty trashy, fanfiction is filled to the brim with self-insert characters, author wish fulfillment and improbable plot points. However that is most fanfiction, during high days of Harry Potter fanfiction a very significant split happened in the fanfiction that was being written. Some just wrote smut of for instance about Hermione and Draco somehow inexplicably developing a relationship, but eventually fanfiction site emerged that only allowed stories on them that made sense, that where in line with the books and the characters as they were established there. With these constraints laid upon you as a fanfiction writer you are forced to really examine the world your stepping into, you are forced in short to understand how what you like is written, before you can write something yourself. Doing this is infinitively beneficial to an aspiring writer. Writing fanfiction is perfect training for when you are going to do the real thing. Especially if you post it somewhere, where the standards are high and the criticisms are harsh. Copyright, smopywright. Nothing is infringed upon when people just want to play sandbox somebody else created, many new authors find it thrilling to know there is fanfiction about their work, it is something that shows you, you kinda made it, you made people care enough to spend time of their days writing a story set in your sandbox. Feels good man. As long as someone isn't deriving an entire incomes from writing stories solely set in your sandbox or creating artwork just about your sandbox, I feel it is all fine. Life and let life you know. Furhtermore fanfictions, artwork and indeed fanfilms have actually contributed in many cases to the success and the interest rate in a work. People have seen Star Trek and Star Wars fan films and then gotten interested in the real deal. My opinion is that fanfiction is both beneficial to a property as well as somewhat detrimental, but more beneficial in the long run. Finally there are some people who have taken their fanfiction and reworked it into an original story and made a boatload of money. Though indeed some of them are bottom of the barrel garbage writers *cough* E.L. James *cough*.
He's a genius at pissig on expectations. And a pro at procrastination. Master of evasion. Takes money for a 5 year deal before finishing what he promised to deliver YEARS ago.. All round piece of shit.
Every time I hear George RR Martin respond to something, I realize how much he and I have in common. I swear, I feel like I agree with every opinion that he has.
I sort of understand his Fanfic option, too much I see writer just follow the same storyline with no change and don't bother to explain anything because they expect the reader to already know.
But I also see writer that willing to go beyond the establish storyline and flesh out the world beyond what there.
The later if they decided to write their own stuff they can become great writer.
I get where he's coming from too in that people who want to explore and make their own stuff should expand their own world building. I don't agree with him in it being harmful to the source material, or how it being copywritten makes it so it shouldn't be touched by anyone other than the copy write holder. It honestly seems kinda selfish to try and prevent people from exploring and having fun in your world as long as they don't profit it off of it without your authorization. And of course there are plenty of authors who explore the worlds of others' universes and not their own in published novels and expand the lore and depth in their respective settings.
I mentioned on this on the subreddit fan fiction and got banned lol.
It takes talent and effort to establish an entire world yet they would just start the story with "Luke needed to use the Force" and they never explain what the Force is, where it comes from, how it works, because we are all familiar with it. Ok, but what happens when you need to write something new and original? You haven't been practicing
I come up with a lot of fan fiction ideas in my head, but I usually don’t write it down. Regardless I think it can be good practice for writers still learning the craft.
@Angry Troll Bot I again disagree, arguably everything which isn't made by the original author is fanfic. Does that make the metro books set in Poland, Ukraine and elsewhere are not creative? Is what CD projekt did with the Witcher not engaging or good story telling? What about all the various Star Wars novels which are so detached from George's own creation that it kinda doesn't feel like star wars, such as what Timothy Zahn does with thrawn? All of these examples enrich the universes they exist for the better, the only difference between "fanfic" are person writes in their spare time and these works is that these are published or have gotten a license. It's dismissive to say that exploring existing universes is lazy when it only makes them more engaging and deeper, if it all had to be unique you'd end up with shallow deep and deeply derivative works much more than what you find, hell George is deeply derivative in many aspects, and a fuck ton of the shit in the world of ice and fire is just H P Lovecraft shit he is fitting to his universe
The idea that setting your works in someone elses world or using those characters is a dead end is ridiculous. Is all literature set in the real world a dead end? All historical fiction? If using the force because everyone understands is derivative, is asoiaf derivative because it uses concepts we are all familiar with, like trees, noble houses, humans, swords, war, etc? The greatest works of fiction were done by generations that improved on the work of their elders, bad changes get discarded, improvements get popular and built upon.
I think GRRM forgets that fanfic using other people's charactets predates everything he was talking about. Most famously with sherlock holmes, and Christain fanfics like paradise lost and the divine comedy.
D&D should pay attention
Yes
Beautiful interview location📍 💥👍
I really like this interviewer
Love the respect that he holds the mic.
Lol! I love this dude-bro interviewing George 😅
Thank you for this knowledge and great video Aegon!!!!
so touching for an excellent video
I don’t personally feel that writing fanfiction dooms people to be hacks. I’ve found it really useful in being able to adopt multiple writing styles/voices. That said, I definitely get more satisfaction out of doing my own thing, even if that doesn’t always garner as much attention on the internet as glomming onto a pre-existing fandom ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Wow I haven’t heard copied called dittoed in a long time. I definitely remember that term being more common.
Interesting
It’s not a copyright violation
It is. If you set your story in hogwarts you're stealing intellectual propriety
I mean he's mostly right about it limiting your creative freedom but copyright violation? What? Who's selling their fanfics?
Upload daily...,
Copyright violation is a fair point, but I think fan fiction is a good way to get people both interested and experienced in writing. It's not the best way to learn but it's a start.
Now this is my opinion, but I think he is seeing fanfiction like a gateway to bad writing.
Fanfiction can lead to a new writer not creating something solely original, as he says, preventing them from leaving their comfort zone and trying out new genres to see what they settle into, but there are some positives to fanfiction.
It can lead writers to discover what they like to write about the most, like if a Potterhead wants to create a new fantasy series, or a Treky makes their own intergalactic magnum opus.
@@Impractical0 Agreed. I think Fanfiction is good practice, personally.
Amazing totally complete. Genius, George R Martin created something that is on such a magnificent level that people couldn't properly understand it even if they wanted to.
I mean he used a map of England for his world and then based almost all of his characters off of historical figures lol
Yes
I respect but don't agree with his opinion about fanfiction - though it could just be a generational difference. It usually is never a copywright violation, as its usually written for fun and consumed for free. I also think that it could be a great way for writers to grow and expand their own craft. Oftentimes writing fanfiction can create original plots and scenarios that can eventually evolve into original works of art. I've written plenty of original stories that were inspired by fanfiction I once wrote. I think people who write fanfiction _are_ learning how to world and character build. Its just done and evolving in a different sort of way.
Not the twiddling of the beard, grunt, then saying, "well, it depends on how you define fanfiction." Bros literally built like the nerd emoji.
Sorry but this is Martin just showing himself to be an old man who doesn't get things like video games and fan fiction.
Nah.
Where were video games mentioned? And hes not wrong, fanfiction is derivative and stunting for developing writers. You lock yourself into set characters, worlds, and either follow along the original, stunting your creative development, or you change it into your own thing. The last one is not only copyright, but also ends up being kinda shitty because youre taking an already established character thats been developed and warping it to your own fantasy. At that point just make a different character and let it evolve.
@@terrencehawk8201 Not in this video obviously. But George has said they aren't art or storytelling but could be in the future.
ua-cam.com/video/IO1l7nOiG7E/v-deo.html
and before you defend him again watch this video:
ua-cam.com/video/Xs6qBDuY1ww/v-deo.html
Now back to topic. Most fanfiction is indeed pretty trashy, fanfiction is filled to the brim with self-insert characters, author wish fulfillment and improbable plot points. However that is most fanfiction, during high days of Harry Potter fanfiction a very significant split happened in the fanfiction that was being written. Some just wrote smut of for instance about Hermione and Draco somehow inexplicably developing a relationship, but eventually fanfiction site emerged that only allowed stories on them that made sense, that where in line with the books and the characters as they were established there. With these constraints laid upon you as a fanfiction writer you are forced to really examine the world your stepping into, you are forced in short to understand how what you like is written, before you can write something yourself. Doing this is infinitively beneficial to an aspiring writer. Writing fanfiction is perfect training for when you are going to do the real thing. Especially if you post it somewhere, where the standards are high and the criticisms are harsh.
Copyright, smopywright. Nothing is infringed upon when people just want to play sandbox somebody else created, many new authors find it thrilling to know there is fanfiction about their work, it is something that shows you, you kinda made it, you made people care enough to spend time of their days writing a story set in your sandbox. Feels good man. As long as someone isn't deriving an entire incomes from writing stories solely set in your sandbox or creating artwork just about your sandbox, I feel it is all fine. Life and let life you know. Furhtermore fanfictions, artwork and indeed fanfilms have actually contributed in many cases to the success and the interest rate in a work. People have seen Star Trek and Star Wars fan films and then gotten interested in the real deal. My opinion is that fanfiction is both beneficial to a property as well as somewhat detrimental, but more beneficial in the long run.
Finally there are some people who have taken their fanfiction and reworked it into an original story and made a boatload of money. Though indeed some of them are bottom of the barrel garbage writers *cough* E.L. James *cough*.
He's a genius at pissig on expectations. And a pro at procrastination. Master of evasion. Takes money for a 5 year deal before finishing what he promised to deliver YEARS ago.. All round piece of shit.
The only thing he should be giving advice on, is how to disappoint millions, while making millions.
Why? Whats the reason?
I just wanna know
i mean ive never been disappointed in his writing, just the lack of it