Just some thoughts I've had regarding the magic system in WoF (from a writing standpoint). Although, don't get me wrong -- I love it in the series, regardless of its flaws. It allows for some AWESOME moments, plots, and characters. Question of the day: What other languages do you know? My answer: Right now I know English and Latin, although I just started learning the fictional language of Na'vi (from the Avatar films). Really soon I'm going to be learning Spanish as well! And I actually am currently developing my own fictional language: Ura'bi. Here's one of my favorite words in the language XD: N'eve! (neh-vay) Now you can call people an idiot in a language they don't understand ;) If you guys are ever curious about Ura'bi, I can talk about it sometime! It's still in the early stages of development, but things are going well. I've been working on basic vocabulary and the grammatical structure/rules for the past few months now. If you're wondering what this is for, it's going to be part of a fantasy series I hope to write. I want to make it a functional language, just like Na'vi is!
Tui should really take notes from the Inheritance Cycle books. They have the most balanced heavy magic system I’ve ever seen, and they are strongly about dragons too!
@therandomguyhi I like it. It’s great world building and shows limits with good reasons why a character can’t do something that otherwise seems like a solid choice.
Agree with this 100%. Honestly, if we want a 'fair' consequence to how powerful animus magic can be, I think Jerboa III is a good example. Obviously the way it happened to her was horrible, and in context I don't think it's fair to her at all. But what if that was how it went with animus magic from the start? What if 'losing a bit of yourself' with each spell was literal? Or at the very least it required some kind of physical or personal sacrifice? From bits of oneself like Jerboa to having to sacrifice another's life--someone close to you--for the more powerful spells. The magic could still basically be anything the character can imagine, but the question would then be if the caster thought it was worth the cost.
Yeah, good thought! Imagine having to choose to physically or mentally lose part of yourself or someone close to you... even the best of dragons could go crazy from that after choosing to inflict it on themselves, eventually doing it on others.
I feel like the cursed put on jerboa really showed a lot about her, she’s always been way too hard on herself and I’m pretty sure she could’ve gotten rid of the curse on her self, but she didn’t want to. She felt like she deserved it.
I LOVE animus magic but no doubt it is WAY too overpowered. In the first arc animus magic was way more mysterious and we only got hints that animus magic would control dragons in book 5 with Stonemover and Sunny. But with arc 2 and Darkstalker legends we learn it is practically limitless. I think it would be much better if there was more of a criteria for casting spellings.
Animus magic really is a pain to write around, especially when it can just give an easy solution. I’m working on an retelling AU and it has been a pain to work with, ended up making a rework to animus magic that would help keep most of the canon enchantments even if they aren’t exactly the same. Though, there are a few things about the reworked animus magic that are its own thing, such as enchantments manifesting a bit of a personality with enchantments such as Orca’s Statue and Pyrite having their own sentience due to how the rework works.
I like the freedom of Animus magic, the possibilities are endless and it can really test how good a dragon is since most Animus we have seen become evil a lot of the time, it's so interesting to see how they use it but also how they figure out ways to get things done without relying on it
You put into words what I was thinking, experimenting with the freedom and limitlessness of that magic is exactly what makes it so interesting for me. The fact that you CAN’T reach very many limits and the dragons needing to figure out how to MAKE those limits
Still creates tons of plot holes. If you have ANY villain with animus magic, they could do anything and no one could stop them. There’s no limits; it’s just breaks the plot. Why didn’t darkstalker immediately slaughter all the ice wings as soon as he got released? It’s a plot hole. Because there’s no limits, the villain logically can’t be stopped. The only reason he was was plot armor, that being the fact that darkstalker didn’t immediately accomplish his goals. If it was because of a character flaw, we need to know that in the story.
@@minecraft6829 well they usually don't think that big or have a certain plan in mind, for darkstalker he wanted to become king, he needed the Nightwings to listen to him and hate the icewings. He did try wiping them all out a bit but in a more less direct way with the plague if I remember correctly. Also imagine giving a human that kind of power, not everyone would immediately think they can do anything, they'd be limited by their imagination basically. Dragons with Animus magic haven't done very big things, definitely not as bad as it could be
One thing I noticed is that animus magic can’t permanently erase personality traits. Remember Jerboa 3? Her need to be free and to defy her abusive mother would keep coming back no matter how many times her personality was altered.
I actually skipped ”talons of power” on my third re read of the series because i was so mad at turtle for being so stupid sometimes just for the sake of the plot
Yeah, I'd agree, Animus magic is a huge flaw. Though it can definitely be interesting, it is very op, and kinda awesome. But, it isn't that rare, and ARE literally gods if they have Animus magic. It definitely seems WAY to op
ngl when i first read the lost heir and they started talking about how animus magic worked i thought they couldn't be serious about them being able to do literally anything but i was wrong and it kinda made me wanna stop reading it a little but i eventually was able to ignore it glaring at me and I love the series to bits now but i am glad to see this getting talked about
This was such an amazing video, and it really got me thinking. It would be awesome if Tui Sutherland made a legends book about the first animus dragon explaining what animus magic is and where it came from. Could you imagine a book about the first animus dragon, especially if it was told through he or hers point of view and how it affects them. I can't wait to see where the future of animus magic goes.
I feel like any animus dragon could travel back in time and just make whoever you want to revive immortal and travel back into the future and BOOM!!! Just like that you revived them!!
Most of the examples for ways Animus magic could have fixed everything are valid but I think either the characters or maybe even tui herself didn't think about stuff like that or thought it was unethical. like the part of changing every evil hivewings mind, forcing them to think and feel something that they don't really would completely ruin the point of Luna's story. even she thought the same about Animus magic about how it would make things so much more easier but then she realized how that wouldn't solve the issue, they'd just be suppressing the hivewings and basically be as bad as wasp was for controlling everyone. Also the whole your soul will get corrupted or whatever thing may also act as a deterrent, make the Animus dragons afraid to use their powers to much, big world changing spells could probably affect them much differently than a small spell to help out with small things, or maybe Animus are only dangerous because of the way they're used and treated. Albatross for example was probably a normal dragon until the queen started using his Animus magic all willy nilly and showing him off like an object instead of a person, we know that when prince artic fled with foeslayer he did attack and I believe kill their pursuers and forever crippled snowflake, he just wanted to be with the one he loved though and not be forced to conform to the icewing way, we all know how overbearing his mother. even darkstalker yeah he was probably evil despite the Animus magic, it just helped him a lot, he was an ambitious dragon and got betrayed by the one he loved the most, if I woke up and that was my part memory I'd be rather mad and sad to. Qibli was given the chance to have the powers of an Animus yet he turned it down, he knew he could have been so powerful and stopped darkstalker but he refused, if Animus magic wasn't as strong as it was this scene wouldn't have been as impactful probably. I don't think Animus magic is a flaw in wings of fire, could it have been written a bit better sure probably but it's still an interesting part of this world tui has created, maybe it'll make an appearance again who knows.
Here are some rules I’ve thought of that might make animus magic more grounded (Please suggest more if you feel the need to, for I do not have a lot of experience on this subject!) 1. Animi cannot resurrect dead dragons. 2. Animi cannot give/remove another dragon’s animus powers. 3. Enchantments only work on objects. You cannot enchant a living being. 4. Animus magic cannot directly kill a dragon (ex. You could make a dragon wear an object that makes their lifespan shorter or gradually gives them a serious disease, but you can’t kill or make a dragon kill themself directly). 5. Animi cannot change a dragon’s personality. They can make them more prone to trusting the magic user and other similar acts, but you can’t make a dragon into another dragon (ex. Darkstalker trying to make Fatespeaker into Clearsight). 6. The more powerful the spell, the higher toll it takes on the magic user (I’d think the toll would be physical and/or mental well-being. For example, an animus that gave another dragon a fatal disease would get severely ill, and perhaps die as well). 7. Animi cannot make themselves immortal. They could increase their lifespan drastically (like Jerboa), but cannot live forever. 8. Animi cannot make themselves entirely immune to attacks. They can make their scales stronger or heal faster (with an object, of course), but cannot dodge the injury entirely. In my AU that takes place after the canonical 2nd arc, I made an animus dragon put all these rules in place.
I feel like the reason why she didn’t really put a lot of limitation on It is because animus magic is very rare. Every time you wanted turtle to just fix some thing, it didn’t go with his character, it wasn’t something that turtle would actually do.
Magic only works if there’s some kind of limitation; in the first arch there was limitations in the form of fear mongering. But darkstalker didn’t have that and thus the reasoning behind why he didn’t just take over the world with one spell is one big plot hole.
Im sorry but there's way better magic systems then Harry Potter's, this ones has a death spell that can make you win any fight like that's extremely bad, you should compare it more to magic like in: - MLP (which can do a lot of things but magic, unicorn magic to be exact is both a muscle that you have to use often and a science that you have to study, it's also implied that unicorn who's special talent isn't magic have a harder time doing complicated spells) - Avatar the last Airbender / Korra, there's a ton of videos that will explain it better then I ever will - The Owl House (Basically the same as MLP but add the fact that there's ways for non-magical creatures such as humans to do magic and the fact that you can actually lock people into using only one type of magic (along with the fact that the only insta death spell that seem to exist is stationary so it's less OP and doesn't ruin battle scenes) - Magic as shown in the Elder Scrolls Games, not perfect, but pretty nice and structured, with risks to casting spells (even though, at least in skyrim, the player never bears the consequences)
I have a thing I want to point out We don't actually know if animus magic can't bring back the dead, we do see Darkstalker trying to "bring back" Clearsight from death using Fierceteeth but keep in mind that the spell wasn't "Bring back Clearsight to life" but "Change that dragon into Clearsight" and that Darkstalker wasn't just trying to bring back Clearsight but bring back a version of her that would love him unconditionally, trust him and blablabla (she probably didn't had any power anymore too or would only see good futures of him) So yeah what is happening is no normal case of Necromancy, and maybe, if he just tried to *actually* bring her back it would have worked
I actuallydid make a mistake in this video -- the time we did see this mentioned was by Albatross directly. "The first lesson about being an animus is that you must always be careful. Remember this is powerful, powerful magic. It can go wrong very easily. It's so powerful that you can do almost anything, except bring a dragon back from the dead." -Darkstalker Legends, p. 28 So either Darkstalker tried to revive Clearsight off-page and was unsuccessful, or this was common knowledge so he didn't even bother trying.
Most fantasy writers: "I better make sure my magical system has some checks and balances so I don't write myself into a corner." Tui T Sutherland: "Screw consequences, we ballin'!"
In an au I’m working on, animus dragons start out being very weak and are only able to enchant small objects. Over time they’re able to do more, but for the most part if they want to do stronger enchantments (like, for example, enchanting a dragon to be invincible) they’d have to train with other animi or have many animi combine their powers to do the spell. They’d have to train for years to even get close to the power the dragons in the canon books do. This keeps the same story potential as the og animus magic but without having them all be super overpowered(only a few of them are lol)
Ooh! The strength of magic increasing with age is a really cool concept. I hope that exists in WoF with the next generation of animi! Maybe dragonets can only do small things, but old dragons can do nearly anything if they have the strength for it.
Yes! Exactly! The Inheritance cycle: magic is the exactly same as actually using your mind or body to do a task, you have to memorize a complex language and can easily kill yourself. Ninjago: you literally get one element to control and there are like three rock types that can dampen and/or stop you from using it Warrior cats: you get one power, you must keep it secret and your dead grandma yells at you if you use it wrong I think animus magic had potential, but it’s just too op, these are just a few examples of great magic systems you didn’t mention that I wanted to add
@@Dogloverlikesdoge it’s actually a pretty popular series. I’m sure it’s at the library. I got my copies from Books a Million. It’s four books in the series btw. Eragon, Eldest, Brisingr and Inheritance. In that order. I definitely would bet it’s a book series you’d like.
jerboa actually mentions that it is only gone for as long as she lives. she also mentions that she will grow old and die like any other dragon. meaning that animus magic will return. but i hope it returns with these boundaries. but, then again, tui might not right another arc. i really hope that she does, but she might not. and if she doesnt, then animus magic will never return in the books. we can only imagine what would happen next in our own wings of fire stories.
An animus dragon could literally say “make the planet explode this instant” and then end the world with no one able to stop them. A magic system where that can happen is probably not great
Great job on highlighting and discussing this issue! From what I see, animus wielders are almost like authors within the story itself, being able to write the story however they want, which is not ideal to say the least According to your suggestions on fixing the concept of animus magic, I think such rules can be taken from the Mystics Arts, the movie Everything, Everywhere, All at Once and the magic from Mushoku Tensei (a light novel series with manga and anime adaptations, it's a truly great story I highly recommend). First of all, limits of magic usage. In the Mushoku Tensei, everyone has the ability to use magic. However, they must practice to develop the affinity for magic. The more they practice, the easier it become to perform spells and more of them, with more power. In a way, a person must develop their "magic battery" to be able to use magic. Overuse can cause tiredness and may cause the user to pass out. The same can be applied to animus magic here. Second, limitations to the alteration of reality. In Everything, Everywhere, All at Once, there is the ability to "verse-jump", which is essentially "downloading" the thoughts and abilities of your variant from another universe, into yourself. If done improperly or too much, you can risk fracturing your own mind, and your universe. It's the same with the Mystics Arts in Spiderman: No Way Home. Rewriting timelines will cause realities to collide. Finally, rules for manipulation of objects. This is my own idea that could be implemented: You cannot enchant living beings. This comes from the understanding that and animus dragon can "give life" to inanimate objects, like scrolls or statues. So you can't enchant things that are already alive, like animals and other dragons. You could at most enchant plants or insects, but that would require a certain degree of mastery of magic.
I feel like the fact that dark stalker could’ve controlled every dragon with the flick of a claw in less than a two seconds, and he didn’t shows the readers that he does deserve a second chance.
I think that he didn’t control everyone just because of plot convenience. He fully intended to take over pyrrhia and he could’ve done it with the flick of a claw, and we were given no reason as to why he didn’t.
Honestly, I think Animus dragons should die if they cast more than their limit, ANNNDDDD they cannot say something like "MAKE THE RULES DISSAPEAR ". (OR they go to some void and have to reflect their actions truly to come back)
I think a nice way of fixing animus magic is actually explaing HOW it works and going from there. My version is that animus magic is just the natural energy of the planet and animus Dragons are able to absorb it and channel that magic/energy through their body. When an animus Dragon casts a spell, they just draw in magic from their enviorment and release their will upon their world. Now here is how that fixes animus magic: number one: it gives normal dragons the ability to ALSO tap into that magic. A normal Dragon could also draw magic into themselves its just harder and requires hard training. Animus Dragons draw in magic subconciously all the time, for them its just like breathing, another dragon would have to Train to draw in magic and push it around in their body Number 2. it gives an actual mecanic on how a spell is formed/released, therefore you can COUNTER a spell by just desturbing the magic around that other dragon, making the spell not come into effect. It gives the ability to DETECT when magic is beeing used. Because energy is being drawn in from around the dragon, the amount of energy, at least shortly after a spell is cast is lower in that specific Area. ALSO remember when Turtles Animusmagic was taken away? He said it felt like something inside of him was missing. With my Magic system we can explain that line, because the easiest way to stop an animus dragon to stop casting magic is simply to make them stop drawing in magic and push it through their body. It doesnt mean they dont have the inherent ability anymore, just that they are blocked from using it. Yes this still leaves animus magic ITSELF broken but thats the entire point of animus magic.. this just gives ways of detecting and stopping animus magic, and also just giving more dragons access TO magic. Animus Dragons still would be way more powerful than Normal Dragons but thats the entire point. Animus magic was ALWAYS a tool to talk about ethical questions , that started in book 2 and ramped up in arc 2 and Darkstalker. The Way this works is that because dragons would Understand animus magic, they could create RULES and Systems and Organisations around it. Knowledge truly is the greatest weapon !
Ooh!! Animus magic taking energy from the environment is really really interesting. I love that! I think animus magic needs some kind of thing it's drawn from, whether that be their DNA (possibly even damaging them slowly), energy from the environment, a part of themself or others, etc.
@@Dogloverlikesdoge but I always LOVED that the thing about Animus magic was that It DIDNT corrupt your soul , your own choices are what lead you down the path to madness. As I said in my comment ( I edited it , added some stuff) the Idea is giving dragons UNDERSTANDING and the ability to control magic, not nerf it into the ground so that almost nobody would use it.
@@lolfreakwaca4328 Yeah! That fact just proves that you can't blame the magic. Just like in real life, you can't ultimately blame someone's position of power for the choices they make. While it does influence them, those choices are still theirs.
One way I'd fix is to bring in a tribe that needs animus magic. The tribe would be asian inspired, so they need animus magic to fly. Like Icewings, only royalty has it. Have the tribe reveal that animus magic DOES affect a dragon's soul, and there is NOTHING that can prevent it. This new tribe got around it by casting only small spells that benefits the tribe. Have them lurk on the small corner of Pantala we never saw.
Darkstalker was my very first Wings of Fire book, and I think there is one very good point in it about the limits of animus magic placed by society: "you cannot use animus magic in war, because then the other side will do the same, and then things get really bad" (paraphrased). That's balance of terror. It compares animus magic directly to nuclear weapons. And for its use in war, it works as a limit for me. (However, it doesn't work for any other use. Now what does that actually make animus magic within the books, aside from a magic system? Is there any real-life technology it compares to? My best, but still pretty bad guess, would be AI. But if that was intentional, Tui must have futuresight.) There's a children's book series I read about a decade ago called Children of the Lamp. I don't remember much of the details anymore, but I will always remember that its magic system gave it the coolest self-sacrifice story a children's book could have: the main characters 'burning out' all their magic in the end. Essentially, in that magic system using magic required a fire-like sorts of energy, and you could be low on energy if you had used too much magic, if you were cold or unwell, etc. Quite simple in that regard (there were certainly more details, I just don't remember much except needing to be very precise with your spells to avoid unwanted consequences, which could be similar to animus magic), but it made for a limited magic system that worked well in the story.
To be honest, animus magic DOES have limitations in a way. I think it depends on the mental state of the animus, though. When Anemone cast a spell on herself to protect her soul, it was to relieve to superiority and selfishness that came with casting each spell. Every time Jerboa enchanted her daughter, she had instincts asking her if her decision to cast each spell was costing her evil. Darkstalker had turned evil because he had cast every spell for personal gain (and the harm of others).
Animus magic is kinda crazy but not as crazy as the fan origen I made for it with it involving demons and Animus magic being the nerfed version of a dragon thinking magic makes other lives worst and wanted others to feal his pain
I think the reason there are no rules is because each queen makes the rules in each kingdom. The ice wings did have a rule. 1 spell per life time. The only way to have a set of rules across the whole continent is if all the queens agreed and say Coral for example probably wouldn't agree because she likes to use Anemone and her magic to make he life easier. The only way tui could have made it like that is if she wrote Coral as a very different character
Animus could just disagree with those rules. If their magic is limitless they can just use it to grant themselves permission and keep doing whatever they want to... Even if they don't do that nobody can really stop them
I have the impression that the problems you point to are minor, especially the black holes. There have always been limits to this magic: the judgment of other dragons, the spells of other animus, the fear of making a mistake in the formulation, the fear of going mad (fathom or turtle), the fear of losing scales. Precaution with animus magic has been an important theme of the series. I don't think there should be more rules from the author because all animus spells in the series seemed logical and believable at least for me. Maybe I just liked wof too much and therefore I'm not critical enough..
It worked in the first arch because of what you said. But the fact is, you can’t have a villain like dark stalker, who wants to commit genocide and isn’t afraid to use his magic to do it when your system of magic has no other rules. Darkstalkers abilities and why he didn’t immediately achieve his goals is one big plot hole that’s never explained. We’re not even given a reason why he didn’t kill all the icewings with one spell. He just didn’t for plot convention.
The rules of Animus magic are so loose, an Animus could enchant a tree so that every chipmunk alive will explode when it falls... Granted I can't think of a reason why they would want to do that, BUT THEY COULD!!
Sorry,@Dogloverlikesdodge,but I’m going to have to strongly disagree on this discussion of animus magic having “flaws” and the other criticisms of animus magic in the Wings Of Fire series. First of all,animus magic is one of the best things about the Wings Of Fire series. It’s easy to jump to the conclusion that any dragon with animus magic abilities can believe they can do whatever they want with it and use it however they want. But do the dragons that are able to use animus magic just aware they know how it works,how to use it,that they are no consequences with how animus magic is used,and/or that animus magic has no limits? Dragons that possess animus magic aren’t exactly dragons that can know EVERYTHING about its possibilities and consequences. Animus magic shouldn’t have any limits,rules,and/or anything else that would make it seem weaker just to appease those who claim it’s “overpowered”. When it comes to the magic system in the Wings Of Fire series,it shouldn’t try to make it like the magic system in Harry Potter. The Wings Of Fire series has its own identity,and animus magic is part of that identity. So animus magic shouldn’t change despite those who think it should. I also disagree that it was “lazy” to remove animus magic for the rest of the third arc. Hopefully,animus magic makes some kind of return in the Wings Of Fire series. And if/when it does,I expect anyone within the Wings Of Fire community can just agree to disagree on the lack of limitations and consequences of animus magic. As well as agree to disagree on its so-called “flaws”.
@@paulj_ actually, he terraformed a dragon to try to be exactly like clearsight, but it failed. he never brought anyone back, no animus recorded in wof hasent yet
Is it me or I am the only one who has s pic of capybara of my yt I beg no one has a pic of a capybara in your channel I am the only one lol I wonder why typing all of this took a while while
Just some thoughts I've had regarding the magic system in WoF (from a writing standpoint). Although, don't get me wrong -- I love it in the series, regardless of its flaws. It allows for some AWESOME moments, plots, and characters.
Question of the day: What other languages do you know?
My answer: Right now I know English and Latin, although I just started learning the fictional language of Na'vi (from the Avatar films). Really soon I'm going to be learning Spanish as well! And I actually am currently developing my own fictional language: Ura'bi.
Here's one of my favorite words in the language XD:
N'eve! (neh-vay) Now you can call people an idiot in a language they don't understand ;)
If you guys are ever curious about Ura'bi, I can talk about it sometime! It's still in the early stages of development, but things are going well. I've been working on basic vocabulary and the grammatical structure/rules for the past few months now. If you're wondering what this is for, it's going to be part of a fantasy series I hope to write. I want to make it a functional language, just like Na'vi is!
Tell. Us. All that you can about the language! As someone who loves things like that I'd love to hear it. Also, I'm bilingual!
I know English and little Spanish + 2 German curses
This doesn't count as another language, but I know a British vulgar slang
Hint: it starts with a q
I know Spanish, English, and I did know Latin but I forgot it
I know Spanish, and a little bit of German. Mein got! Ich bin nitch güt! Ich bin lerne! Auf Wiedersehen
@@SpAc3B3e Oh, that could be MANY things, in terms of the 'q' word...
Tui should really take notes from the Inheritance Cycle books. They have the most balanced heavy magic system I’ve ever seen, and they are strongly about dragons too!
@therandomguyhi I like it. It’s great world building and shows limits with good reasons why a character can’t do something that otherwise seems like a solid choice.
Agree with this 100%. Honestly, if we want a 'fair' consequence to how powerful animus magic can be, I think Jerboa III is a good example. Obviously the way it happened to her was horrible, and in context I don't think it's fair to her at all. But what if that was how it went with animus magic from the start? What if 'losing a bit of yourself' with each spell was literal? Or at the very least it required some kind of physical or personal sacrifice? From bits of oneself like Jerboa to having to sacrifice another's life--someone close to you--for the more powerful spells. The magic could still basically be anything the character can imagine, but the question would then be if the caster thought it was worth the cost.
Yeah, good thought! Imagine having to choose to physically or mentally lose part of yourself or someone close to you... even the best of dragons could go crazy from that after choosing to inflict it on themselves, eventually doing it on others.
So basically full metal alchemist
I feel like the cursed put on jerboa really showed a lot about her, she’s always been way too hard on herself and I’m pretty sure she could’ve gotten rid of the curse on her self, but she didn’t want to. She felt like she deserved it.
I LOVE animus magic but no doubt it is WAY too overpowered. In the first arc animus magic was way more mysterious and we only got hints that animus magic would control dragons in book 5 with Stonemover and Sunny. But with arc 2 and Darkstalker legends we learn it is practically limitless. I think it would be much better if there was more of a criteria for casting spellings.
Agreed completely
sorry, i'm alergic to animus magic.
Same lol
@@artsywitch I love your pfp!!
My allergic reaction is VERY serious.
Animus magic really is a pain to write around, especially when it can just give an easy solution. I’m working on an retelling AU and it has been a pain to work with, ended up making a rework to animus magic that would help keep most of the canon enchantments even if they aren’t exactly the same. Though, there are a few things about the reworked animus magic that are its own thing, such as enchantments manifesting a bit of a personality with enchantments such as Orca’s Statue and Pyrite having their own sentience due to how the rework works.
I like the freedom of Animus magic, the possibilities are endless and it can really test how good a dragon is since most Animus we have seen become evil a lot of the time, it's so interesting to see how they use it but also how they figure out ways to get things done without relying on it
You put into words what I was thinking, experimenting with the freedom and limitlessness of that magic is exactly what makes it so interesting for me. The fact that you CAN’T reach very many limits and the dragons needing to figure out how to MAKE those limits
Still creates tons of plot holes. If you have ANY villain with animus magic, they could do anything and no one could stop them. There’s no limits; it’s just breaks the plot. Why didn’t darkstalker immediately slaughter all the ice wings as soon as he got released? It’s a plot hole. Because there’s no limits, the villain logically can’t be stopped. The only reason he was was plot armor, that being the fact that darkstalker didn’t immediately accomplish his goals. If it was because of a character flaw, we need to know that in the story.
@@minecraft6829 well they usually don't think that big or have a certain plan in mind, for darkstalker he wanted to become king, he needed the Nightwings to listen to him and hate the icewings. He did try wiping them all out a bit but in a more less direct way with the plague if I remember correctly. Also imagine giving a human that kind of power, not everyone would immediately think they can do anything, they'd be limited by their imagination basically. Dragons with Animus magic haven't done very big things, definitely not as bad as it could be
My way of fixing animus magic is this: For every spell they cast,they lose a piece of themselves,literally, or they lose their memories.
One thing I noticed is that animus magic can’t permanently erase personality traits. Remember Jerboa 3? Her need to be free and to defy her abusive mother would keep coming back no matter how many times her personality was altered.
I actually skipped ”talons of power” on my third re read of the series because i was so mad at turtle for being so stupid sometimes just for the sake of the plot
Yeah, I'd agree, Animus magic is a huge flaw. Though it can definitely be interesting, it is very op, and kinda awesome. But, it isn't that rare, and ARE literally gods if they have Animus magic. It definitely seems WAY to op
ngl when i first read the lost heir and they started talking about how animus magic worked i thought they couldn't be serious about them being able to do literally anything but i was wrong and it kinda made me wanna stop reading it a little but i eventually was able to ignore it glaring at me and I love the series to bits now but i am glad to see this getting talked about
This was such an amazing video, and it really got me thinking. It would be awesome if Tui Sutherland made a legends book about the first animus dragon explaining what animus magic is and where it came from. Could you imagine a book about the first animus dragon, especially if it was told through he or hers point of view and how it affects them. I can't wait to see where the future of animus magic goes.
That would be awesome!
I feel like any animus dragon could travel back in time and just make whoever you want to revive immortal and travel back into the future and BOOM!!! Just like that you revived them!!
Most of the examples for ways Animus magic could have fixed everything are valid but I think either the characters or maybe even tui herself didn't think about stuff like that or thought it was unethical. like the part of changing every evil hivewings mind, forcing them to think and feel something that they don't really would completely ruin the point of Luna's story. even she thought the same about Animus magic about how it would make things so much more easier but then she realized how that wouldn't solve the issue, they'd just be suppressing the hivewings and basically be as bad as wasp was for controlling everyone. Also the whole your soul will get corrupted or whatever thing may also act as a deterrent, make the Animus dragons afraid to use their powers to much, big world changing spells could probably affect them much differently than a small spell to help out with small things, or maybe Animus are only dangerous because of the way they're used and treated. Albatross for example was probably a normal dragon until the queen started using his Animus magic all willy nilly and showing him off like an object instead of a person, we know that when prince artic fled with foeslayer he did attack and I believe kill their pursuers and forever crippled snowflake, he just wanted to be with the one he loved though and not be forced to conform to the icewing way, we all know how overbearing his mother. even darkstalker yeah he was probably evil despite the Animus magic, it just helped him a lot, he was an ambitious dragon and got betrayed by the one he loved the most, if I woke up and that was my part memory I'd be rather mad and sad to. Qibli was given the chance to have the powers of an Animus yet he turned it down, he knew he could have been so powerful and stopped darkstalker but he refused, if Animus magic wasn't as strong as it was this scene wouldn't have been as impactful probably. I don't think Animus magic is a flaw in wings of fire, could it have been written a bit better sure probably but it's still an interesting part of this world tui has created, maybe it'll make an appearance again who knows.
+1
Here are some rules I’ve thought of that might make animus magic more grounded (Please suggest more if you feel the need to, for I do not have a lot of experience on this subject!)
1. Animi cannot resurrect dead dragons.
2. Animi cannot give/remove another dragon’s animus powers.
3. Enchantments only work on objects. You cannot enchant a living being.
4. Animus magic cannot directly kill a dragon (ex. You could make a dragon wear an object that makes their lifespan shorter or gradually gives them a serious disease, but you can’t kill or make a dragon kill themself directly).
5. Animi cannot change a dragon’s personality. They can make them more prone to trusting the magic user and other similar acts, but you can’t make a dragon into another dragon (ex. Darkstalker trying to make Fatespeaker into Clearsight).
6. The more powerful the spell, the higher toll it takes on the magic user (I’d think the toll would be physical and/or mental well-being. For example, an animus that gave another dragon a fatal disease would get severely ill, and perhaps die as well).
7. Animi cannot make themselves immortal. They could increase their lifespan drastically (like Jerboa), but cannot live forever.
8. Animi cannot make themselves entirely immune to attacks. They can make their scales stronger or heal faster (with an object, of course), but cannot dodge the injury entirely.
In my AU that takes place after the canonical 2nd arc, I made an animus dragon put all these rules in place.
Those are perfect!
I feel like the reason why she didn’t really put a lot of limitation on It is because animus magic is very rare. Every time you wanted turtle to just fix some thing, it didn’t go with his character, it wasn’t something that turtle would actually do.
Magic only works if there’s some kind of limitation; in the first arch there was limitations in the form of fear mongering. But darkstalker didn’t have that and thus the reasoning behind why he didn’t just take over the world with one spell is one big plot hole.
Im sorry but there's way better magic systems then Harry Potter's, this ones has a death spell that can make you win any fight like that's extremely bad, you should compare it more to magic like in:
- MLP (which can do a lot of things but magic, unicorn magic to be exact is both a muscle that you have to use often and a science that you have to study, it's also implied that unicorn who's special talent isn't magic have a harder time doing complicated spells)
- Avatar the last Airbender / Korra, there's a ton of videos that will explain it better then I ever will
- The Owl House (Basically the same as MLP but add the fact that there's ways for non-magical creatures such as humans to do magic and the fact that you can actually lock people into using only one type of magic (along with the fact that the only insta death spell that seem to exist is stationary so it's less OP and doesn't ruin battle scenes)
- Magic as shown in the Elder Scrolls Games, not perfect, but pretty nice and structured, with risks to casting spells (even though, at least in skyrim, the player never bears the consequences)
In my fanfic Animus spells cause sickness or old injuries (cuts,broken bones) to reappear
I have a thing I want to point out
We don't actually know if animus magic can't bring back the dead, we do see Darkstalker trying to "bring back" Clearsight from death using Fierceteeth but keep in mind that the spell wasn't "Bring back Clearsight to life" but "Change that dragon into Clearsight" and that Darkstalker wasn't just trying to bring back Clearsight but bring back a version of her that would love him unconditionally, trust him and blablabla (she probably didn't had any power anymore too or would only see good futures of him)
So yeah what is happening is no normal case of Necromancy, and maybe, if he just tried to *actually* bring her back it would have worked
I actuallydid make a mistake in this video -- the time we did see this mentioned was by Albatross directly.
"The first lesson about being an animus is that you must always be careful. Remember this is powerful, powerful magic. It can go wrong very easily. It's so powerful that you can do almost anything, except bring a dragon back from the dead."
-Darkstalker Legends, p. 28
So either Darkstalker tried to revive Clearsight off-page and was unsuccessful, or this was common knowledge so he didn't even bother trying.
@@Dogloverlikesdoge Yeah, it would have been nice to know how this became a thing widely known tho, it would have been interesting
Most fantasy writers: "I better make sure my magical system has some checks and balances so I don't write myself into a corner."
Tui T Sutherland: "Screw consequences, we ballin'!"
In an au I’m working on, animus dragons start out being very weak and are only able to enchant small objects. Over time they’re able to do more, but for the most part if they want to do stronger enchantments (like, for example, enchanting a dragon to be invincible) they’d have to train with other animi or have many animi combine their powers to do the spell. They’d have to train for years to even get close to the power the dragons in the canon books do. This keeps the same story potential as the og animus magic but without having them all be super overpowered(only a few of them are lol)
In addition pretty much every tribe has animus dragons, so there’s not an unfair advantage to the ones who do
Ooh! The strength of magic increasing with age is a really cool concept. I hope that exists in WoF with the next generation of animi! Maybe dragonets can only do small things, but old dragons can do nearly anything if they have the strength for it.
Yes! Exactly!
The Inheritance cycle: magic is the exactly same as actually using your mind or body to do a task, you have to memorize a complex language and can easily kill yourself.
Ninjago: you literally get one element to control and there are like three rock types that can dampen and/or stop you from using it
Warrior cats: you get one power, you must keep it secret and your dead grandma yells at you if you use it wrong
I think animus magic had potential, but it’s just too op, these are just a few examples of great magic systems you didn’t mention that I wanted to add
Magic with stakes! I love it. I've never heard of the Inheritance Cycle before 👀But I love that magic system already
@@Dogloverlikesdoge have you heard of Eragon? That’s the first book in the series. It’s got dragons and stuff you’d like it
@@lilybethwalters4433 I haven't, no!
@@Dogloverlikesdoge it’s actually a pretty popular series. I’m sure it’s at the library. I got my copies from Books a Million. It’s four books in the series btw. Eragon, Eldest, Brisingr and Inheritance. In that order. I definitely would bet it’s a book series you’d like.
jerboa actually mentions that it is only gone for as long as she lives. she also mentions that she will grow old and die like any other dragon. meaning that animus magic will return. but i hope it returns with these boundaries. but, then again, tui might not right another arc. i really hope that she does, but she might not. and if she doesnt, then animus magic will never return in the books. we can only imagine what would happen next in our own wings of fire stories.
An animus dragon could literally say “make the planet explode this instant” and then end the world with no one able to stop them. A magic system where that can happen is probably not great
Yeah 😭
XD just the thought of that happening lol, kinda glad we aint got animus magic in real life,
Well as far as we know I guess kinda spog
My way with making Animus powered villains work is to give them a sense of houner and wouldent use it unless his opponents had magic
Great job on highlighting and discussing this issue! From what I see, animus wielders are almost like authors within the story itself, being able to write the story however they want, which is not ideal to say the least
According to your suggestions on fixing the concept of animus magic, I think such rules can be taken from the Mystics Arts, the movie Everything, Everywhere, All at Once and the magic from Mushoku Tensei (a light novel series with manga and anime adaptations, it's a truly great story I highly recommend).
First of all, limits of magic usage. In the Mushoku Tensei, everyone has the ability to use magic. However, they must practice to develop the affinity for magic. The more they practice, the easier it become to perform spells and more of them, with more power. In a way, a person must develop their "magic battery" to be able to use magic. Overuse can cause tiredness and may cause the user to pass out. The same can be applied to animus magic here.
Second, limitations to the alteration of reality. In Everything, Everywhere, All at Once, there is the ability to "verse-jump", which is essentially "downloading" the thoughts and abilities of your variant from another universe, into yourself. If done improperly or too much, you can risk fracturing your own mind, and your universe. It's the same with the Mystics Arts in Spiderman: No Way Home. Rewriting timelines will cause realities to collide.
Finally, rules for manipulation of objects. This is my own idea that could be implemented: You cannot enchant living beings. This comes from the understanding that and animus dragon can "give life" to inanimate objects, like scrolls or statues. So you can't enchant things that are already alive, like animals and other dragons. You could at most enchant plants or insects, but that would require a certain degree of mastery of magic.
Those are some great ideas!
Literally most of ToP and DoD are just the Jade Winglet and Darkstalker overriding eachothers spells
I feel like the fact that dark stalker could’ve controlled every dragon with the flick of a claw in less than a two seconds, and he didn’t shows the readers that he does deserve a second chance.
I think that he didn’t control everyone just because of plot convenience. He fully intended to take over pyrrhia and he could’ve done it with the flick of a claw, and we were given no reason as to why he didn’t.
Honestly, I think Animus dragons should die if they cast more than their limit, ANNNDDDD they cannot say something like "MAKE THE RULES DISSAPEAR ". (OR they go to some void and have to reflect their actions truly to come back)
I think a nice way of fixing animus magic is actually explaing HOW it works and going from there.
My version is that animus magic is just the natural energy of the planet and animus Dragons are able to absorb it and channel that magic/energy through their body.
When an animus Dragon casts a spell, they just draw in magic from their enviorment and release their will upon their world.
Now here is how that fixes animus magic:
number one: it gives normal dragons the ability to ALSO tap into that magic. A normal Dragon could also draw magic into themselves its just harder and requires hard training. Animus Dragons draw in magic subconciously all the time, for them its just like breathing, another dragon would have to Train to draw in magic and push it around in their body
Number 2. it gives an actual mecanic on how a spell is formed/released, therefore you can COUNTER a spell by just desturbing the magic around that other dragon, making the spell not come into effect.
It gives the ability to DETECT when magic is beeing used. Because energy is being drawn in from around the dragon, the amount of energy, at least shortly after a spell is cast is lower in that specific Area.
ALSO remember when Turtles Animusmagic was taken away? He said it felt like something inside of him was missing. With my Magic system we can explain that line, because the easiest way to stop an animus dragon to stop casting magic is simply to make them stop drawing in magic and push it through their body. It doesnt mean they dont have the inherent ability anymore, just that they are blocked from using it.
Yes this still leaves animus magic ITSELF broken but thats the entire point of animus magic.. this just gives ways of detecting and stopping animus magic, and also just giving more dragons access TO magic. Animus Dragons still would be way more powerful than Normal Dragons but thats the entire point.
Animus magic was ALWAYS a tool to talk about ethical questions , that started in book 2 and ramped up in arc 2 and Darkstalker.
The Way this works is that because dragons would Understand animus magic, they could create RULES and Systems and Organisations around it.
Knowledge truly is the greatest weapon !
Ooh!! Animus magic taking energy from the environment is really really interesting. I love that!
I think animus magic needs some kind of thing it's drawn from, whether that be their DNA (possibly even damaging them slowly), energy from the environment, a part of themself or others, etc.
@@Dogloverlikesdoge but I always LOVED that the thing about Animus magic was that It DIDNT corrupt your soul , your own choices are what lead you down the path to madness.
As I said in my comment ( I edited it , added some stuff) the Idea is giving dragons UNDERSTANDING and the ability to control magic, not nerf it into the ground so that almost nobody would use it.
@@lolfreakwaca4328 Yeah! That fact just proves that you can't blame the magic. Just like in real life, you can't ultimately blame someone's position of power for the choices they make. While it does influence them, those choices are still theirs.
One way I'd fix is to bring in a tribe that needs animus magic. The tribe would be asian inspired, so they need animus magic to fly. Like Icewings, only royalty has it. Have the tribe reveal that animus magic DOES affect a dragon's soul, and there is NOTHING that can prevent it. This new tribe got around it by casting only small spells that benefits the tribe. Have them lurk on the small corner of Pantala we never saw.
17th :D btw I love ur videos !!! 😊 even though I haven’t finished the dangerous gift I am GONNA WTACH THIS HEHEHE
Darkstalker was my very first Wings of Fire book, and I think there is one very good point in it about the limits of animus magic placed by society: "you cannot use animus magic in war, because then the other side will do the same, and then things get really bad" (paraphrased). That's balance of terror. It compares animus magic directly to nuclear weapons. And for its use in war, it works as a limit for me. (However, it doesn't work for any other use. Now what does that actually make animus magic within the books, aside from a magic system? Is there any real-life technology it compares to? My best, but still pretty bad guess, would be AI. But if that was intentional, Tui must have futuresight.)
There's a children's book series I read about a decade ago called Children of the Lamp. I don't remember much of the details anymore, but I will always remember that its magic system gave it the coolest self-sacrifice story a children's book could have: the main characters 'burning out' all their magic in the end. Essentially, in that magic system using magic required a fire-like sorts of energy, and you could be low on energy if you had used too much magic, if you were cold or unwell, etc. Quite simple in that regard (there were certainly more details, I just don't remember much except needing to be very precise with your spells to avoid unwanted consequences, which could be similar to animus magic), but it made for a limited magic system that worked well in the story.
To be honest, animus magic DOES have limitations in a way. I think it depends on the mental state of the animus, though.
When Anemone cast a spell on herself to protect her soul, it was to relieve to superiority and selfishness that came with casting each spell.
Every time Jerboa enchanted her daughter, she had instincts asking her if her decision to cast each spell was costing her evil.
Darkstalker had turned evil because he had cast every spell for personal gain (and the harm of others).
Animus magic is kinda crazy but not as crazy as the fan origen I made for it with it involving demons and Animus magic being the nerfed version of a dragon thinking magic makes other lives worst and wanted others to feal his pain
I think the reason there are no rules is because each queen makes the rules in each kingdom. The ice wings did have a rule. 1 spell per life time. The only way to have a set of rules across the whole continent is if all the queens agreed and say Coral for example probably wouldn't agree because she likes to use Anemone and her magic to make he life easier. The only way tui could have made it like that is if she wrote Coral as a very different character
Animus could just disagree with those rules. If their magic is limitless they can just use it to grant themselves permission and keep doing whatever they want to... Even if they don't do that nobody can really stop them
I have the impression that the problems you point to are minor, especially the black holes.
There have always been limits to this magic: the judgment of other dragons, the spells of other animus, the fear of making a mistake in the formulation, the fear of going mad (fathom or turtle), the fear of losing scales.
Precaution with animus magic has been an important theme of the series.
I don't think there should be more rules from the author because all animus spells in the series seemed logical and believable at least for me. Maybe I just liked wof too much and therefore I'm not critical enough..
It worked in the first arch because of what you said. But the fact is, you can’t have a villain like dark stalker, who wants to commit genocide and isn’t afraid to use his magic to do it when your system of magic has no other rules. Darkstalkers abilities and why he didn’t immediately achieve his goals is one big plot hole that’s never explained. We’re not even given a reason why he didn’t kill all the icewings with one spell. He just didn’t for plot convention.
The rules of Animus magic are so loose, an Animus could enchant a tree so that every chipmunk alive will explode when it falls...
Granted I can't think of a reason why they would want to do that, BUT THEY COULD!!
Animus magic includes time travel?
It has not been confirmed or denied
Where is part two of what if kestrel kept sky?
It's coming! I'm sorry for the long wait, I had to take a major hiatus to work on other stuff
Animus magic is me in my dreams basically
Omg I'm so excited to watch this!!
If I had Animus magic, I would make it so I could use animus magic
Imagine Queen Wasp was an animus
First? (I legit commented within 14 seconds of release)
I believe so!
Yup :)
you are by 2 seconds :o
Sorry,@Dogloverlikesdodge,but I’m going to have to strongly disagree on this discussion of animus magic having “flaws” and the other criticisms of animus magic in the Wings Of Fire series. First of all,animus magic is one of the best things about the Wings Of Fire series. It’s easy to jump to the conclusion that any dragon with animus magic abilities can believe they can do whatever they want with it and use it however they want. But do the dragons that are able to use animus magic just aware they know how it works,how to use it,that they are no consequences with how animus magic is used,and/or that animus magic has no limits? Dragons that possess animus magic aren’t exactly dragons that can know EVERYTHING about its possibilities and consequences. Animus magic shouldn’t have any limits,rules,and/or anything else that would make it seem weaker just to appease those who claim it’s “overpowered”. When it comes to the magic system in the Wings Of Fire series,it shouldn’t try to make it like the magic system in Harry Potter. The Wings Of Fire series has its own identity,and animus magic is part of that identity. So animus magic shouldn’t change despite those who think it should. I also disagree that it was “lazy” to remove animus magic for the rest of the third arc. Hopefully,animus magic makes some kind of return in the Wings Of Fire series. And if/when it does,I expect anyone within the Wings Of Fire community can just agree to disagree on the lack of limitations and consequences of animus magic. As well as agree to disagree on its so-called “flaws”.
I have good news for you! When I decided to make wof content like you I got a lot more popular and I just hit 200 subs!
I actually dont think any animus has tried to bring yhe dead back, so even that might be possible.(although i could be remembering wrong)
darkstalker did (in book 10 i believe)
@@paulj_ actually, he terraformed a dragon to try to be exactly like clearsight, but it failed. he never brought anyone back, no animus recorded in wof hasent yet
Fathom did , right? Thats how we know its not possible
@@lolfreakwaca4328 Indigo was alive though, just very injured, and fathom never did.
@@titanusspino865 yeah he turned another dragon into clearsight(or at least tried)
Oof. I've always wanted animus magic for SOOO long! But, now I don't. Hehehe😈😈
I speak English and a bit of French and Spanish
Clearsight would agree.
Animus magic is just poweplay if used wrong
Is it me or I am the only one who has s pic of capybara of my yt I beg no one has a pic of a capybara in your channel I am the only one lol I wonder why typing all of this took a while while
:D