MR. Pete, I wish I had you as a shop teacher back in the day! I might've actually learned something! Well, I'm learning now, so it's never too late to start, I guess. I enjoyed your teaching style, keep the videos coming! Great stuff!
Thank You Lyle.... So I get up, make coffee, turn on this lap top, and find a new show from "mrpete222" .. I watch and I think back to my early shop days in 1971. My shop teacher talking about knurls. I so much wish I could briefly return and express how much my teachers efforts have influenced my 49 years being a machinist!!! .. LYLE I appreciate ALL YOU DO!!!..... TM
Very true about that nonesense of diameters and pitches on knurls. That "B&S" knurler is great adapted to the lathe. I have several videos of adapting screw machine/ turret lathe tooling to my Logan 10" lathe.
Your the best Lyle. I really enjoy all your instructional videos it takes me back over 50 years to my metals shop classes in High School. I wish you would put a disabled Veteran discount on a complete set of your training videos , I know I want a set. I can’t afford them separately.
I use my mini bolt cutters for all kinds of stuff! But mainly to clip my tig wire. After 10s of thousands of cuts on stainless and harder materials they can still clip a piece of scotch tape cleanly!! May not sound impressive but if u know you know lol. Kleins and other top brands (that aren’t much cheap) could never hold up like the knipex
Mr Pete, I greatly admire your presentation and teaching techniques. This vid could/should be used as a guide for those who want to know how to put together a teaching vid properly. I hope this day finds you well and healthy.
Mr. Pete, you know darn well that the knurl on a micrometer is there so you don't have to squeeze your water pump pliers so hard when making fine adjustments.
I was first exposed to knurling from my shop teacher Mr. Morrison at Kewanee High School by making a ball peen hammer handle. The method I learned was to keep the rollers engaged with the cut and use multiple passes back and forth by reversing the feed and increasing the depth until the desired result was achieved. It would not be a high production method but was very good for learning the process and making a great project for a budding machinist. Thanks Mr. Pete for another interesting video!
Lyle - Good explanation of knurling. I agree completely that there is no rational relationship between work diameter and knurl pitch. At least in this old engineer's mind - does not make sense.
Hobby machinist from Kankakee. Been learning from you for years. Thanks for posting all the information. Definitely going to track down a hand knurler.
As a retired tool, die and gagemaker I've knurled lots of round hand held gages. I only had the bump style knurling tools to work with and it took a long time for me to find a way to knurl that doesn't double skip on one side. I never worried about the pitch either. I liked to start my knurl at the headstock where the part was the most rigid and use a center to keep it from pulling out of the chuck if possible. I purposely tipped my knurler at a slight angle so the edge nearest the headstock was touching and would put the lathe in neutral before I pushed the tool into the part, then I would rotate the chuck by hand so the knurl didn't have an opportunity to skip. Once I made a couple of revolutions and could see everything was tracking right, I would put it in gear and power feed it out to the tailstock. I could use either coolant from the lathe sump or brushed on oil, both worked fine.
I got a chuckle out of that too and also from your comment. I can see an English teacher at the head of her class saying in a very stern voice; “You there Mr. K, just sit right there in your desk and stay silent and don’t you correct me. Do you understand?”
As for pitch / circumference relationship, I believe that you can usually get a good knurl if the "agreement" is anywhere close (meaning that the circumference is nearly an even multiple of the pitch). In fact it is more the reverse: if the "disagreement" is nearly perfect (that is if the circumference is nearly equal to a multiple of the pitch plus exactly 1/2 of the pitch),, then your chances of a bad knurl are much increased. Disagreement *does* mean that the knurls will be formed by pushing and displacing metal more from one side of the ridges than the other. This can result in occasional ridges or points breaking off or being weaker than they would have been with closer agreement. And it doesn't need much adjustment of the work diameter to come into agreement. For a 21 pitch (medium) knurl, the change in diameter to achieve perfect agreement will always be less than about 0.007". [(1/pitch)/π/2]
Indeed. I have found that agreement is more important when knurling on small lathes that inherently lack stiffness. I think being closer to agreement probably reduces the load and hence flex in the machine. So, I always make my knobs diameters close to the pitch diameter for knurling as actual diameter is not important for decorative or gripping surfaces.
Thank you Mr Pete. I have the Armstrong with the three way head and have made good and bad knurls with it. I agree that it puts way too much stress on my old machine but that all that I have to work with and was happy to get it, but I will definitely be looking for better options. So far I have not seen anything in the wild that I could aquire.
Hi Danny, search for "scissor knurling tool", there are some kits too, James from Clough42 and Quinn from Blondihacks both have youtube videos building some.
Mr. Pete I love your shop classes brings me back to my apprentice days learning from the GREATEST GENERATION. Pete what about the ( scissor Knurl ) my favorite top & bottom pressure no stress on machine and can knurl stock as long as your machine. PS. I never figure out any Diameter / Ratio calculations and made beautiful knurls. Keep It Going my friend.
I have spent my entire life calling straight knurling: "reeding" as we find on the edges of dimes and quarters. (and I am older than Mr. Pete) There is no such thing as over explaining details. The details are important to the observant. Ron W4BIN
Thank you Mr. Pete. The more information the better. I read something about turning the part to the right size for the knurl a long time ago. That put me off knurling. I never tried it. We used to increase the size of pistons by lots of dots from a center punch, then file to the right size. No sandpaper. It would leave grit in the metal. It always worked okay.
Ah the ever elusive chase to form the perfect cylinder to be knurled. I remember forming on back in 1975 that came out perfect. It must have been that Southbend Heavy 10 I was running. Thank you Lyle I look forward to the follow up.
A fix for worn valve guides in an engine was to knurl them with a drill driven knurl, as it used to be called where I worked. It looked like a modified tap that had six of eight "flutes" and would spiral in just like a tap but it did not cut metal, just moved it about while making a groove similar to a thread and decreasing the inside diameter. It had to be followed with what we called a broach. That was a shaft with a an enlarged dimension close to one end that would be driven through the guide to flatten the knurls to the proper size for the valve to fit properly. It also allowed oil down the guide and usually that is something you really don't want too much of as it will destroy the valve seat and valve face during combustion causing pitting. Both the knurling tool and the broach were piloted to keep them aligned when starting. Thank you for this video topic being covered. I feel I will kanow everything about kanurling after the next video.
Diameter isn’t important for cut knurling but is, theoretically, for form knurling if you want to form a perfect knurl. In practice, most formed knurls come out absolutely fine unless the diameter is way off and then it’s only only an issue precision work such as instrument making or watchmaking
Depending on which cutting roller you used, would you see that one line of diamonds were a bit shorter than the rest for example? If the circumference of the stock used didn't allow for equal bites of each tooth of the roller. Is that what you mean??
Always enjoy your videos. As an old math teacher I've always used the pitch and diameter method with a bump tool. Have stopped knurling because of the bump tool. Would sure like for you to take the B&S tool apart showing all the details. Thanks for the instruction.
Thanks! Was surprised in 60's HS shop how simple the 'bump' knurl tool is. Also, looking forward to part 2, as having 2 fixed diameters seems obvious for a good pattern that repeats or causes an overlap. Good knurls are in the eye of the beholder.
I always enjoy your vids, I try to watch one every night. I really appreciated this one, I suspect my shop teacher thought the same thing about me and my knurls as you mentioned you had about others. Stay safe!
Over the years working in the aerospace and defense industries, I can't tell you how many times I have come across the same argument of pitch and knurl. The proof is in the pudding and have never had a knurl fail due to diameter. The only issues I had as an engineer, was trying to convince DCAS inspectors otherwise. (Got written up several times for arguing with government "experts".)
Great video mrpete. BUT I must disagree with you about the Aloris 250-110 knurler. I cut the tongues off using a disc cutter on mine. I then put it in the mill and used carbide cutters to clean the end up & cut the tool slot all the way to the end. I even drilled and tapped 2 new set screws into the newly formed end. It makes an excellent extended tool holder and is much more use than a knurler. Most toolholders are only surface hard so not as difficult to cut as you may think. Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to the next in the series. ATB regards from the UK
Looking forward to part 2. I have the smallest Brown & Sharpe knurl tool but haven't mastered the adjustment . I have a very expensive cut knurling tool and that has an adjustment for the diameter of the work. Thanks Lyle nice presentation as always
I've wondered about the relationship between the diameter of the piece and the knurl tool wheels. Thanks for the discussion, looking forward to viewing part 2 tomorrow. I appreciate your teaching style.
We had a family of parts a few years ago that were big on appearance so we tried cut knurling as opposed to pinch... I'm not gonna lie it was a game changer, they look better than any form knurls I've seen. Love your videos, appreciate the knowledge
I believe the bump knurled earned that name because you want to come in hard and fast so the second roller is forced to track the lead roller. If you feed in slow they will possibly not acquire timing and will not make a good knurl.
Hello Mr. Peter. An excellent video and definitive guide on Knurly. I predominately use pinch style knurling tool when knurling. I also find the students struggle with the push in type (bump) knurler. Warm regards from downunder. Aaron.
My experience .. Never heard about the "pitch formula " untill I had made loads of perfect knurls. If it is perfect you have to hit it harder untill it is. That is why bump knurlers are a nonsense. Totally agree with you Lyle.
I own a scissors type knurler it has no manufacturer name but , it produces very nice diamonds. With that type of knurler its all about adjusting the tool to the work piece, the one drawback of said tool is it is awkward to work with ( albeit I don't use it alot) but, once its lined up she produces.
Hi Mr. Pete....NO HURT FEELINGS HERE! I hate those DANG Armstrong bump knurling tools too! Just about gave up on them too....put them all away in a drawer....then one day I took one out and grabbed a piece of leaded steel 1 1/4 in. dia. I had the tool on center and square to the axis of rotation. Then I rotated the knurling tool about 10-15 degrees CCW and locked it down. slowest speed in direct drive on a South Bend 10 lathe both tumblers set mid way, position C on left tumbler. With the corner of the knurling tool digging in and doing all of the work, I GOT A NEAR PERFECT KNURL EVERY TIME !...I'LL BE DANGED...AFTER ALL MY YEARS OF TEACHING MACHINE TOOL TECHNOLOY, I STUMBLED ONTO A METHOD THAT SEEMS TO WORK CONSISTENTLY....GO FIGURE !!!
As for sizing, the same principle of upsetting material in order to increase diameter can, in some cases, be done with something as simple as a tubing/pipe cutter. I've used that method to improve the fit of a new wheel bearing on a spindle, where the previous bearing had seized and spun the inner race on the spindle. It was a desperation move that worked way better than I expected. At the time all I was after was a fix that would get a bearing to last for more than 10 miles, allowing me to get the car home for further repairs. It ended up lasting for the remaining life of that car, about 7 years. A few of those years involved several trips to either coast (dragged or driven) while moving trucks. One can experiment with a bit of scrap mild steel and an old, dulled, pipe or tube cutter, and look at the profile it makes under magnification, to see what happens.
I have a die set for broaching straight knurls onto shafts. it was designed for instrument grade parts. I believe the clock/watch industry uses knurling broaches for small shafts as well.
You can also shrink a bore with knurling. Worn valve guides are often knurled then reamed to bring them back into spec. It's done with a single wheel knurler that makes a spiral knurl.
True! I have some of those. Use them for engines that are not used frequently because the guides wear faster. I used mine for quick renovation of worn stone holders that are used for grinding the valve seats. Knurl and ream, next time I will use the K line inserts…
@ 2:09 Kinder-garden Grammar... Or this side of the Pond;... Infant School... ... It is spelt with a "K" but the K is silent as in... Knife;... & many more;.. Knack. Knave. Knead. Knee. Kneel. Knell. Knickers.
I hope in your next video you'll show us the scissor type &/or the parallel arm type of pinch knurler, since they are by far the most popular type in use today. Over the last year or so all the cool kids on YT have made the parallel Hemmingway Kits knurler. (I think it's an elegant piece, but needlessly complicated.) As for your bad knurls, I had a lot of trouble with one wheel double tracking, making asymmetric knurls like you showed. I was about to give up and order a new pair of wheels when I read the knurling advice in MSC's Big Book. It said to be sure the wheels are matched in diameter. I miked mine and, sure enough, they were a few thou different. So I stoned the larger one down to match its mate and got much better performance out of them. That said, I knurled two parts yesterday. One wheel double tracked on one part, and both wheels double tracked on the other. The knurling gods are mercurial. 🤥
You can see the knurling pattern ( called checkering when done on wood) on the handles of medieval swords in museums. There is a tactile advantage that is hard to duplicate using other methods and the practice persists on firearms.
The bell has rung. Class is in session. With respect to the knurl pitch vs diameter discussion, as always, there’s a big difference between theoretical approach and practical application.
My cheap Chinese tool holder/knurler was not hardened as I was able to cut it off with a band saw. I use the holder with a chamfering tool to chamfer the ID of a bore.
@@TheUncleRuckus I pronounce the M in knife (Messer)! 🤦 I assure you as a native German speaker: the K in Knipex is actually pronounced quite clearly. If you say Nipex in Germany or Austria you will not be understood or looked at strangely.
@@TheUncleRuckus Look up any video on the Knipex company YT channel. They definitely pronounce the K. Also, they pronounce the i with a long e sound, so it's kuh-nee-pex. Here's an example: ua-cam.com/video/p6QkcDRTtCc/v-deo.html
As usual I enjoyed your video. I've made good knurls and bad knurls. Some with the bump tool before I ever heard of the pinch type. i never worried about the diameter of what I was knurling. I can't for the life of me see how it would matter.
Aloha, the theory is the same as gear cutting the pitch diameter, blank diameter, and number of teeth matter, so thinking of making teeth that is why the diameter matters. BUT we are cutting material away with gear cutting so it is important there. In knurling we are upsetting (Swaging) by rolling the material into shape so the PD of the knurls are changing the diameter of the material to fit the PD of the knurling wheel. You can see this by making a very light cut by hand on your lathe if the diameter is not correct you will see overlap or underlap at the 360 degree point, but as we increase the depth of engagement we are squeezing the metal into the diameter needed for the PD of the knurls. That is a simple explanation.... it does matter but doesn't make any difference to knurls commonly used. I hope I didn't confuse you
AS to your observation about proper diameter of the part... I've done it both ways. I've not had any issues either way. So, I quit worrying about it. Time waits for no man....
The only time I knurled anything was about 1981 in HS shop. It was with the bump style and it was difficult to get a good knurl but after about 3 tries I got it.
For what ever it’s worth, the machineries handbook does have a formula for knurling. The Germans pronounce the K in Knipex pliers because they manufacture them. English words that begins with K are mostly silent, but there are exceptions like kink. Knurling is a great process to learn to do correctly.
How about knurling with a pipe wrench? Keith Fenner runs into that once in a while, and naturally we are all guilty. I prefer a very shallow knurl on a punch, so as to not lose to much skin when it slips through my fingers. Please keep cranking out your stimulating videos
You can take the knurls out of the Aloris holder and put a bearing in the top hole (or even just a solid piece of round) and you have an automatic "centering" gizmo for off axis parts.
I just did a project in hot rolled steel that was difficult. I am spoiled by aluminum. I wonder if you could cover different steels and their ease of working?
Hi Mr Pete! Wondering if you can use the Brown&Sharpe knurling tools positioned 90 degrees? Hold it in a side holder for internal boring bars in the radial direction of the work piece. Then it should be possible to knurl longer parts. It should at least work at the 45 degree position of the B&S tool..
The bump knurlers require a heavy, rigid machine. My 13x40 can handle one in aluminum, but it weighs 5 or 6 times as much as the Atlas/Craftsman 12" that it replaced. Those cut-type knurlers like your B&S are available, but very, very expensive, even by Aloris #19 standards. IIRC they start around $2k.
I have often looked a driveshaft slip-type U-joint yokes from smaller cars (I have owned many British MGBs over the years and have tons of parts for them) and wondered if I could convert it into a pinch-type knurling tool. I have one in the "future projects drawer" I keep in my shop ... with a lot of other stuff I'll probably never get to.
MR. Pete, I wish I had you as a shop teacher back in the day! I might've actually learned something! Well, I'm learning now, so it's never too late to start, I guess. I enjoyed your teaching style, keep the videos coming! Great stuff!
Wow, thanks!
Thank You Lyle.... So I get up, make coffee, turn on this lap top, and find a new show from "mrpete222" .. I watch and I think back to my early shop days in 1971. My shop teacher talking about knurls. I so much wish I could briefly return and express how much my teachers efforts have influenced my 49 years being a machinist!!! .. LYLE I appreciate ALL YOU DO!!!..... TM
👍👍👍
Very true about that nonesense of diameters and pitches on knurls. That "B&S" knurler is great adapted to the lathe. I have several videos of adapting screw machine/ turret lathe tooling to my Logan 10" lathe.
👍👍
Your the best Lyle. I really enjoy all your instructional videos it takes me back over 50 years to my metals shop classes in High School. I wish you would put a disabled Veteran discount on a complete set of your training videos , I know I want a set. I can’t afford them separately.
Yes, I can give you a disabled discount. Let me know which ones you want and I will quote But do it through an email
The correct pronunciation of knipex is “darn-that’s-expensive”.
You got that right?
True but my cobras are hands down my go to multi-tool.
I use my mini bolt cutters for all kinds of stuff! But mainly to clip my tig wire. After 10s of thousands of cuts on stainless and harder materials they can still clip a piece of scotch tape cleanly!! May not sound impressive but if u know you know lol. Kleins and other top brands (that aren’t much cheap) could never hold up like the knipex
thank you Mr Pete
Good Morning Mr Pete!!!
The Tennessee Mole Man 👍🇺🇸🍊🍊🍊
I am CRUSHED! You knurled me!
Good Morning Mr, Pete, thanks for another share of your knowledge.
Mr Pete, I greatly admire your presentation and teaching techniques. This vid could/should be used as a guide for those who want to know how to put together a teaching vid properly. I hope this day finds you well and healthy.
Thank you very very much for that kindly evaluation. It really encourages me.
Perfect timing...just poured my first cup of coffee!! Thanks for all your hard work Mr.Pete! Take care.
Mr. Pete, you know darn well that the knurl on a micrometer is there so you don't have to squeeze your water pump pliers so hard when making fine adjustments.
Mr. Pete: Never offended by your criticism of tools or techniques. Now that I have my own lathe I try to avoid unnecessary stress on working parts.
Very interesting and informative video well done Mrpete 👍👍
Thanks Mr. Pete , I learned on bump type , didn't have pinch type in school , learned what I was missing later .😎👍
Can't wait for part 2, I could never get a good knurled. Thank you
I was first exposed to knurling from my shop teacher Mr. Morrison at Kewanee High School by making a ball peen hammer handle. The method I learned was to keep the rollers engaged with the cut and use multiple passes back and forth by reversing the feed and increasing the depth until the desired result was achieved. It would not be a high production method but was very good for learning the process and making a great project for a budding machinist. Thanks Mr. Pete for another interesting video!
👍👍
Knurled for your pleasure, The French Knurler. If it was in a vending machine in a gas station bathroom or the public bathroom at a fishing pier.
I think I saw that in an old Texaco gas station
Lyle - Good explanation of knurling. I agree completely that there is no rational relationship between work diameter and knurl pitch. At least in this old engineer's mind - does not make sense.
Yes
Hobby machinist from Kankakee. Been learning from you for years. Thanks for posting all the information. Definitely going to track down a hand knurler.
👍
I have clamping knerler works great .great video Mr pete
Cool, thanks
Another excellent lesson! Thanks, Mr.Pete
As a retired tool, die and gagemaker I've knurled lots of round hand held gages. I only had the bump style knurling tools to work with and it took a long time for me to find a way to knurl that doesn't double skip on one side. I never worried about the pitch either. I liked to start my knurl at the headstock where the part was the most rigid and use a center to keep it from pulling out of the chuck if possible. I purposely tipped my knurler at a slight angle so the edge nearest the headstock was touching and would put the lathe in neutral before I pushed the tool into the part, then I would rotate the chuck by hand so the knurl didn't have an opportunity to skip. Once I made a couple of revolutions and could see everything was tracking right, I would put it in gear and power feed it out to the tailstock. I could use either coolant from the lathe sump or brushed on oil, both worked fine.
Thank you for that short tutorial. Very helpful.
Mr. Pete, that's one knarly Knurling video!
Mr Pete I laughed when you enunciated the k in knurle my English teacher said it would be silent 😂😂😂
lol
I got a chuckle out of that too and also from your comment. I can see an English teacher at the head of her class saying in a very stern voice; “You there Mr. K, just sit right there in your desk and stay silent and don’t you correct me. Do you understand?”
I'm always amazed at how much stuff you ... K'now 😁
Not as much as you might think, lol
Thanks Mr. Pete for the video, Very informative!
As for pitch / circumference relationship, I believe that you can usually get a good knurl if the "agreement" is anywhere close (meaning that the circumference is nearly an even multiple of the pitch). In fact it is more the reverse: if the "disagreement" is nearly perfect (that is if the circumference is nearly equal to a multiple of the pitch plus exactly 1/2 of the pitch),, then your chances of a bad knurl are much increased. Disagreement *does* mean that the knurls will be formed by pushing and displacing metal more from one side of the ridges than the other. This can result in occasional ridges or points breaking off or being weaker than they would have been with closer agreement. And it doesn't need much adjustment of the work diameter to come into agreement. For a 21 pitch (medium) knurl, the change in diameter to achieve perfect agreement will always be less than about 0.007". [(1/pitch)/π/2]
Excellent explanation, cheers!
Indeed. I have found that agreement is more important when knurling on small lathes that inherently lack stiffness. I think being closer to agreement probably reduces the load and hence flex in the machine. So, I always make my knobs diameters close to the pitch diameter for knurling as actual diameter is not important for decorative or gripping surfaces.
I love knurling, it looks great when executed properly and has a tremendous feeling when gripped. Nice video Tubalcain
👍👍
Thank you Mr Pete. I have the Armstrong with the three way head and have made good and bad knurls with it. I agree that it puts way too much stress on my old machine but that all that I have to work with and was happy to get it, but I will definitely be looking for better options. So far I have not seen anything in the wild that I could aquire.
😀
Hi Danny, search for "scissor knurling tool", there are some kits too, James from Clough42 and Quinn from Blondihacks both have youtube videos building some.
Great video Mr Pete
Mr. Pete I love your shop classes brings me back to my apprentice days learning from the GREATEST GENERATION. Pete what about the ( scissor Knurl ) my favorite top & bottom pressure no stress on machine and can knurl stock as long as your machine. PS. I never figure out any Diameter / Ratio calculations and made beautiful knurls. Keep It Going my friend.
I need to buy one of those
Once again I learned something I knever knew.
I have spent my entire life calling straight knurling: "reeding" as we find on the edges of dimes and quarters. (and I am older than Mr. Pete) There is no such thing as over explaining details. The details are important to the observant. Ron W4BIN
👍👍👍
Fascinating talk on this. Anxious to see the process in action. I don't have the equipment but would love to be able to make my own knurled knobs.
Lots of great information. I enjoyed this video.
Very good video Mr Pete.See you in part 2.Thank you.
Very informative as always, thank you teacher
Thanks Mr. Pete, I was unaware of hand knurlers. In retrospect it’s an obvious implementation, like a pipe cutter. 👍
Thank you Mr. Pete. The more information the better. I read something about turning the part to the right size for the knurl a long time ago. That put me off knurling. I never tried it. We used to increase the size of pistons by lots of dots from a center punch, then file to the right size. No sandpaper. It would leave grit in the metal. It always worked okay.
Ah the ever elusive chase to form the perfect cylinder to be knurled. I remember forming on back in 1975 that came out perfect. It must have been that Southbend Heavy 10 I was running. Thank you Lyle I look forward to the follow up.
Knice knowledge on knurling. Keep it komming
lol
I like my scissors knurler the best, fast and no pressure exerted on the lathe.
A fix for worn valve guides in an engine was to knurl them with a drill driven knurl, as it used to be called where I worked. It looked like a modified tap that had six of eight "flutes" and would spiral in just like a tap but it did not cut metal, just moved it about while making a groove similar to a thread and decreasing the inside diameter. It had to be followed with what we called a broach. That was a shaft with a an enlarged dimension close to one end that would be driven through the guide to flatten the knurls to the proper size for the valve to fit properly. It also allowed oil down the guide and usually that is something you really don't want too much of as it will destroy the valve seat and valve face during combustion causing pitting. Both the knurling tool and the broach were piloted to keep them aligned when starting. Thank you for this video topic being covered. I feel I will kanow everything about kanurling after the next video.
Thanks for that information
Diameter isn’t important for cut knurling but is, theoretically, for form knurling if you want to form a perfect knurl. In practice, most formed knurls come out absolutely fine unless the diameter is way off and then it’s only only an issue precision work such as instrument making or watchmaking
Thanks
Depending on which cutting roller you used, would you see that one line of diamonds were a bit shorter than the rest for example? If the circumference of the stock used didn't allow for equal bites of each tooth of the roller. Is that what you mean??
Interesting.
Always enjoy your videos. As an old math teacher I've always used the pitch and diameter method with a bump tool. Have stopped knurling because of the bump tool. Would sure like for you to take the B&S tool apart showing all the details. Thanks for the instruction.
Thanks! Was surprised in 60's HS shop how simple the 'bump' knurl tool is. Also, looking forward to part 2, as having 2 fixed diameters seems obvious for a good pattern that repeats or causes an overlap. Good knurls are in the eye of the beholder.
“Now I’m gonna talk a little, actually a lot…” 😂 -Mr Pete “the GOAT”
I used to turn the diameter slightly undersize to get the final size .knurling makes the diameter grow and the pitch is controlled by the rollers
I always enjoy your vids, I try to watch one every night. I really appreciated this one, I suspect my shop teacher thought the same thing about me and my knurls as you mentioned you had about others. Stay safe!
👍👍
Brilliant presentation, thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
Over the years working in the aerospace and defense industries, I can't tell you how many times I have come across the same argument of pitch and knurl. The proof is in the pudding and have never had a knurl fail due to diameter. The only issues I had as an engineer, was trying to convince DCAS inspectors otherwise. (Got written up several times for arguing with government "experts".)
Great video mrpete. BUT I must disagree with you about the Aloris 250-110 knurler. I cut the tongues off using a disc cutter on mine. I then put it in the mill and used carbide cutters to clean the end up & cut the tool slot all the way to the end. I even drilled and tapped 2 new set screws into the newly formed end. It makes an excellent extended tool holder and is much more use than a knurler. Most toolholders are only surface hard so not as difficult to cut as you may think. Thanks for sharing. Looking forward to the next in the series. ATB regards from the UK
Looking forward to part 2. I have the smallest Brown & Sharpe knurl tool but haven't mastered the adjustment . I have a very expensive cut knurling tool and that has an adjustment for the diameter of the work. Thanks Lyle nice presentation as always
👍👍
Your videos have inspired me to take some college courses. I’m currently taking CAMM 111
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍😀
Knice video , looking forward to part 2
lol
I've wondered about the relationship between the diameter of the piece and the knurl tool wheels. Thanks for the discussion, looking forward to viewing part 2 tomorrow. I appreciate your teaching style.
Thanks
Lots of good information. I make perfect knurls. Thanks for the video keep on keeping on.
Thank you, I enjoyed your foundry video
We had a family of parts a few years ago that were big on appearance so we tried cut knurling as opposed to pinch... I'm not gonna lie it was a game changer, they look better than any form knurls I've seen. Love your videos, appreciate the knowledge
👍😄😄
I believe the bump knurled earned that name because you want to come in hard and fast so the second roller is forced to track the lead roller. If you feed in slow they will possibly not acquire timing and will not make a good knurl.
Always hated knurling until I used the B&S type on a ward 2a capstan lathe - back in 1989
Thanks for another entertaining video 👍
👍👍
Thanks for sharing.
Used to knurl valve guides in cylinder heads. Piston skirts were knurled to reduce friction in the bore. Especially on race engines.
👍
Hello Mr. Peter. An excellent video and definitive guide on Knurly. I predominately use pinch style knurling tool when knurling. I also find the students struggle with the push in type (bump) knurler. Warm regards from downunder. Aaron.
😀😀
Rất yêu mến bác,tuy bác cao tuổi nhưng vẫn còn rất minh mẫn và khỏe mạnh 💪💪
My experience ..
Never heard about the "pitch formula " untill I had made loads of perfect knurls.
If it is perfect you have to hit it harder untill it is.
That is why bump knurlers are a nonsense.
Totally agree with you Lyle.
👍👍
I own a scissors type knurler it has no manufacturer name but , it produces very nice diamonds. With that type of knurler its all about adjusting the tool to the work piece, the one drawback of said tool is it is awkward to work with ( albeit I don't use it alot) but, once its lined up she produces.
Thank you, I would like to buy one of those
Hi Mr. Pete....NO HURT FEELINGS HERE! I hate those DANG Armstrong bump knurling tools too! Just about gave up on them too....put them all away in a drawer....then one day I took one out and grabbed a piece of leaded steel 1 1/4 in. dia. I had the tool on center and square to the axis of rotation. Then I rotated the knurling tool about 10-15 degrees CCW and locked it down. slowest speed in direct drive on a South Bend 10 lathe both tumblers set mid way, position C on left tumbler. With the corner of the knurling tool digging in and doing all of the work, I GOT A NEAR PERFECT KNURL EVERY TIME !...I'LL BE DANGED...AFTER ALL MY YEARS OF TEACHING MACHINE TOOL TECHNOLOY, I STUMBLED ONTO A METHOD THAT SEEMS TO WORK CONSISTENTLY....GO FIGURE !!!
👍👍👍👍
Great topic to cover!
BTW, everyone of your videos ends with me heading to Ebay for another purchase of something it seems😉
lol
Thanks for the video
The Williams revolver here makes perfect knurls everytime! KIDDING.
No it doesn't. More spiral than Knurl.
Looking forward to part 2!
As for sizing, the same principle of upsetting material in order to increase diameter can, in some cases, be done with something as simple as a tubing/pipe cutter. I've used that method to improve the fit of a new wheel bearing on a spindle, where the previous bearing had seized and spun the inner race on the spindle.
It was a desperation move that worked way better than I expected. At the time all I was after was a fix that would get a bearing to last for more than 10 miles, allowing me to get the car home for further repairs. It ended up lasting for the remaining life of that car, about 7 years. A few of those years involved several trips to either coast (dragged or driven) while moving trucks.
One can experiment with a bit of scrap mild steel and an old, dulled, pipe or tube cutter, and look at the profile it makes under magnification, to see what happens.
Thank you, that was very interesting
I have a die set for broaching straight knurls onto shafts. it was designed for instrument grade parts. I believe the clock/watch industry uses knurling broaches for small shafts as well.
😀
You can also shrink a bore with knurling. Worn valve guides are often knurled then reamed to bring them back into spec. It's done with a single wheel knurler that makes a spiral knurl.
Thanks
True! I have some of those. Use them for engines that are not used frequently because the guides wear faster. I used mine for quick renovation of worn stone holders that are used for grinding the valve seats. Knurl and ream, next time I will use the K line inserts…
I like the bump type because they can do large diameter stock.
@ 2:09 Kinder-garden Grammar...
Or this side of the Pond;... Infant School...
...
It is spelt with a "K" but the K is silent as in...
Knife;... & many more;..
Knack.
Knave.
Knead.
Knee.
Kneel.
Knell.
Knickers.
I would be interested in buying your Knurlmaster hand knurler. Since you haven't used it in at least a decade, you probably wouldn't miss it.
I hope in your next video you'll show us the scissor type &/or the parallel arm type of pinch knurler, since they are by far the most popular type in use today. Over the last year or so all the cool kids on YT have made the parallel Hemmingway Kits knurler. (I think it's an elegant piece, but needlessly complicated.)
As for your bad knurls, I had a lot of trouble with one wheel double tracking, making asymmetric knurls like you showed. I was about to give up and order a new pair of wheels when I read the knurling advice in MSC's Big Book. It said to be sure the wheels are matched in diameter. I miked mine and, sure enough, they were a few thou different. So I stoned the larger one down to match its mate and got much better performance out of them. That said, I knurled two parts yesterday. One wheel double tracked on one part, and both wheels double tracked on the other. The knurling gods are mercurial. 🤥
You can see the knurling pattern ( called checkering when done on wood) on the handles of medieval swords in museums. There is a tactile advantage that is hard to duplicate using other methods and the practice persists on firearms.
👍👍
The bell has rung. Class is in session. With respect to the knurl pitch vs diameter discussion, as always, there’s a big difference between theoretical approach and practical application.
My cheap Chinese tool holder/knurler was not hardened as I was able to cut it off with a band saw. I use the holder with a chamfering tool to chamfer the ID of a bore.
Thank you sir.
Knipex is Knipex and not nipex because its a german brand, (k)nurl is nurl becaus its english, in german knurling is rändeln
I second that.
I suppose you pronounce the K in knife? 🤦
I've never once heard a German speaker pronounce the K in Knipex and I watch a lot of them on youtube.
TPAI does, and I would trust the german commenters on here as well. I know of no german words with silent K:s
@@TheUncleRuckus I pronounce the M in knife (Messer)! 🤦
I assure you as a native German speaker: the K in Knipex is actually pronounced quite clearly. If you say Nipex in Germany or Austria you will not be understood or looked at strangely.
@@TheUncleRuckus Look up any video on the Knipex company YT channel. They definitely pronounce the K. Also, they pronounce the i with a long e sound, so it's kuh-nee-pex. Here's an example:
ua-cam.com/video/p6QkcDRTtCc/v-deo.html
As usual I enjoyed your video. I've made good knurls and bad knurls. Some with the bump tool before I ever heard of the pinch type. i never worried about the diameter of what I was knurling. I can't for the life of me see how it would matter.
Aloha, the theory is the same as gear cutting the pitch diameter, blank diameter, and number of teeth matter, so thinking of making teeth that is why the diameter matters. BUT we are cutting material away with gear cutting so it is important there. In knurling we are upsetting (Swaging) by rolling the material into shape so the PD of the knurls are changing the diameter of the material to fit the PD of the knurling wheel. You can see this by making a very light cut by hand on your lathe if the diameter is not correct you will see overlap or underlap at the 360 degree point, but as we increase the depth of engagement we are squeezing the metal into the diameter needed for the PD of the knurls. That is a simple explanation.... it does matter but doesn't make any difference to knurls commonly used. I hope I didn't confuse you
At 4:51. Lyle missed the most obvious use of a knurl. It provides an excellent topic for an internet shop teacher's multi-part class.
AS to your observation about proper diameter of the part... I've done it both ways. I've not had any issues either way. So, I quit worrying about it. Time waits for no man....
The only time I knurled anything was about 1981 in HS shop. It was with the bump style and it was difficult to get a good knurl but after about 3 tries I got it.
👍
For what ever it’s worth, the machineries handbook does have a formula for knurling. The Germans pronounce the K in Knipex pliers because they manufacture them. English words that begins with K are mostly silent, but there are exceptions like kink. Knurling is a great process to learn to do correctly.
👍👍👍
How about knurling with a pipe wrench? Keith Fenner runs into that once in a while, and naturally we are all guilty. I prefer a very shallow knurl on a punch, so as to not lose to much skin when it slips through my fingers. Please keep cranking out your stimulating videos
I hope you could disassemble one of your pinch-type knurling tools so we can see how it works. How about a vid series on building one?
I say not (Knot). But I do pronounce it Ka-Nip-ecks for my Knipex as I asked a German engineer from Wuppertal.
I’m glad you got it from the horses mouth. I will pronounce it with the K
You can take the knurls out of the Aloris holder and put a bearing in the top hole (or even just a solid piece of round) and you have an automatic "centering" gizmo for off axis parts.
👍
I think an often overlooked knurl is the ridges on the sides of coins. Why our slippery cell phones don't have knurling is confusing.
Screen replacement business?
I just did a project in hot rolled steel that was difficult. I am spoiled by aluminum. I wonder if you could cover different steels and their ease of working?
Like that " k - nursing "
Hi Mr Pete! Wondering if you can use the Brown&Sharpe knurling tools positioned 90 degrees? Hold it in a side holder for internal boring bars in the radial direction of the work piece. Then it should be possible to knurl longer parts. It should at least work at the 45 degree position of the B&S tool..
Never thought of it, that might be a possibility
The bump knurlers require a heavy, rigid machine. My 13x40 can handle one in aluminum, but it weighs 5 or 6 times as much as the Atlas/Craftsman 12" that it replaced.
Those cut-type knurlers like your B&S are available, but very, very expensive, even by Aloris #19 standards. IIRC they start around $2k.
Thanks for the info!
Do I have two kuhnees or two nees. Me thinks I have two knees. 👊🤜🤛👍👍👌
I have often looked a driveshaft slip-type U-joint yokes from smaller cars (I have owned many British MGBs over the years and have tons of parts for them) and wondered if I could convert it into a pinch-type knurling tool. I have one in the "future projects drawer" I keep in my shop ... with a lot of other stuff I'll probably never get to.
That is a good idea, I bet it could be done. I will take that under advisement, might do it myself. But it would probably be fairly difficult.
Sounds like a good plan. Some steering shafts and farm equipment also have small U-joints that might be a good starting point.