It's not a full on drag race of course, just to the speed limit to keep it all legal lol. But it throws up some interesting questions about how much power you need. On the road? The 701 leaps ahead. But on dirt roads? Due to wheelspin the 701 only really starts to fly past the DR650 from about 70kmh on. First time here? Welcome to our dodgy channel! Adventure bike & product reviews bit.ly/3DpEKxk Motorbike safety & protective gear bit.ly/3Dpb438 Motorbike setup bit.ly/3Dpb6rM DR650 project series bit.ly/3XOsPRK
im currently after a adventure bike thats got more beans then my yamaha v star 650 classic its a great bike sounds awesome and goes toe to toe with most harleys i ride with but the roads around wagga wagga NSW are total garbage and it beats me up too much so ive been looking at something upto 15k aud preferebly new and has cruise control and the only thing i have found is the cfmoto 800mt with the all new ktm 790 engine im interested in the upcoming triumph 400cc scrambler but knowing small bikes it probobly wont have cruise control but their is a company that makes cruise controls for alot of bike so i guess we will see what happens with that
Agreed. And for comparison, the dr is very comparable to a ninja 300. So that's good enough for freeway passing, but it's not going to wow you at those speeds. Technically, it might be faster than my ninja 300, but even with less power and torque the ninja is way more fun on the street.
@@travisj2370 If you don't want to go Austrian or Chinese the VStrom is a remarkably capable road bike and more comfortable on crap Aussie roads than you'd believe possible. The newest 1000s have cruise, but they're maybe bigger and more expensive than you want. The older ones are a bargain but no cruise. Also worth noting the 1000s have better suspension than the 650s (stock that is - VStrom owners are mad farklers). Don't know about the 250s, never ridden one.
The 650 has enough power where it counts and is as good in most circumstances than a bike twice the price. It's a better choice despite the price for some people. What a gem
Yep, I reckon it's got more than enough power for most riders. But there'll always be the very skilled riders who can actually use that 70hp offroad and actually want to use it. Others will just try to and probably get hurt lol.
Had a heavily modded DR650 for 5 or so years (Tuned DRZ forks, Wilbers rear shock, TM40, Leovince muffler, 25L tank, etc....) and I'm now on a modded 2019 701 (Tuned suspension, Safari tanks, plus more...). I agree with pretty much all your comments, the 701 is powerful, but revvy motor. The difference between the two bikes I find the biggest is the handling honestly. The underseat fuel on the 701 helps a lot: a full tank of fuel on the 701 feels like the DR did when empty, or even better still. That's not even including my safari tanks. It's not just the low down weight though, the 701's geometry seems to make is so much more predictable and composed at medium/high speed over loose and rough surfaces. I say that from the perspective of having loaded the thing with enough adventure gear to make it top heavy, and even then it's still the case. The high speed twitchiness you mentioned is down to suspension sag setups: I had that problem, went through and revised my sags (more at the rear), and now it's stable at high speed without feeling like a chopper. The way I think about the 690 platform honestly: it's a mini 950/990. The mini version of a big desert racer. You strip all the bodywork off and look at them, and there are so many common aspects about the designs. Similar aspect ratios, component positions, weigh distributions, frame style. All that said, I think I'd sell body parts if I could get one with an engine as solid and reliable as the DR.....
I'll mention your comments to the 701 owner about sag. I was really surprised when he handed my DR650 back and said he loved the stability of the DR's handling.
I assume drz-s fork? Or was it the super moto fork? My dr650 has cogent front and rear but it was set up for someone heavier than me.. wondering how you liked the swap
@@gabrieltiso8537 DRZ-E forks. Definitely tracked better and had better damping (and I guess just how much you can tune the damping before you hit design limitations). I had Plex valves before, and the DRZ-E forks were better. Did have to respring and re-tune them though.
@@SK3DDO much appreciation for the details! The bike will be more capable than me for the foreseeable future but I realize it's important to get the suspension dialed.. now I have yet another option for the front! 🤙
At first I thought I needed a faster bike to go faster, but I'm beginning to realize that the weaknesses in my lower back and my tendency to be out of shape are going to slow me down more than any engine or suspension
Many of us will actually be faster on a slower bike I think. The vast majority of us lack the skills to use 70hp offroad, and if we try we'll probably ride worse lol.
@@crosstrainingadventure It becomes a point for any rider at around 60hp on two wheels is kinda to much power and acceleration for any real off roading unless your in sand drag racing uphill all the time.
I just keep coming back to the old school DR! I have finally just embraced the fact that for whatever reason these bikes just strike a certain chord with me that others don't. I've just recently purchased my 3rd DR650, and even though I always modify mine to suit my taste, I am blown away that I'm enjoying it quite a lot in bone stock configuration. It won't be that way long, but until then I'll enjoy it. Great video, and a treat for an old DR guy like me to watch.
@@crosstrainingadventure I let a riding buddy ride my DR that I recently purchased. He told me I never stressed to him how good the DR is, though I did. I'm not the type of person to oversell something. Anyway he bought a DR650 in less than a week after riding mine! 😀
The 701 is like a dream bike for me but in reality the DR is the perfect bike for me, my DR never revs higher than 5000 rpm because I short shift all the time, more because of mechanical sympathy more than anything, part of the reason I seldom have to adjust the valve clearance. Along with the fact for the price of one 701 I have had 2 DR 650s with a total of 800,000 klms so financially the DR is a clear winner and still own both, one I have owned for 18 years the other for 9 years and they both still run perfectly.
What's better than one DR650? 😂 I love the short shifting. Even in the 'drag race' you can hear I'm just changing gear at about 6000rpm. Any higher and it's just making more noise and actually less hp!
Ive got a DR650 and my riding partner has a 701 and had a 690 before that. The 690/701 is a very good bike, no doubt about it, and very attractive, but I have no plans of getting rid of my DR. It has an FCR pumper carb, GSXR muffler, modified air box, Ricor Intimidators in the front shock and Ricor rear shock, among other upgrades. I can hang with him everywhere but on the highway, and thats only over about 70 miles per hour, and I love how I can "tractor" the DR around at low RPMs. (I should note that I put my DR on a weight reduction program and its a good 45 pounds less than stock). He loves is 701, though, and I certainly respect that, but I love my DR as well.
How hard core did you go with the weight loss? I've heard that some owners managed to drop close to 20kg but it means things like losing your steering lock, ignition, headlight bracket, helmet lock etc.
@@crosstrainingadventure You nailed it. I pulled off everything you noted, except the headlight bracket. Replaced the airbox (which is heavy), with UNI filter, replaced battery with lithium one, Lighter weight aluminum bars, replaced stock speedo and cables with trailtech, got rid of passenger pegs, rear hand holds, stock mirrors, etc. I weighed every piece I took off and kept a spreadsheet, LOL. (I still have everything if I ever want to go back to stock.) The bike still looks pretty stock as well. I also did most of this over many years...it wasn't an overnight transformation. I've had it for 13 years now.
I'd love to see the spreadsheet if you wanted to email it via the website email address. I covered as many weight loss tips as possible in this vid. I could always add your stuff to the pinned first comment. ua-cam.com/video/h6fl-GWdURk/v-deo.html
After watching your videos I purchased my 1998 Dr 650 with 2500 miles in perfect condition for 2300 , I put another 2500 in it and I love this bike, I can go anywhere and it has plenty of power, more than any XR650 for sure ! Love the old tractor! Thanks!
I own a KTM 300,KTM 500 and a fully modded DR650. Although I love them all,if I could only keep one bike it would be the DR. The DR is just a great do it all bike for this stage of my riding.
The dr650 was my first dual sport after years of hard enduro on 2 strokes. I really enjoyed the bike especially for exploring the Nevada desert. As a package, it’s fun enough to forgive the flexy chassis and the softness. That bike always evokes some fond memories.
Ex DR owner - I’m picking up a 690. For me it’s to reduce the weight, and transfer it lower. The idea is to use it as an adventure bike.. maybe I’m a sadist, lol. After prepping, it’s off to the high country! I think it’ll be a good test (and further tweaks) to see how I cope before heading to central Australia. Also, due to the subframe being a tank, it’ll encourage me to pack even less. Go lighter, go further is the plan.
This is such a great comparison video Barry! Just my little opinion but modifying the DR650 is all part of the fun! The 701 is a great bike but for me, I love the tractor like grunt of the DR650 on the places I ride. By the way, "All Hail the Mighty Bush Pig!" Cheers!
@@crosstrainingadventure Same here Barry! The additional advantage is the more you do mods and are taking the DR apart, the more you learn about how it functions and any possible issues you might have on the trail will be easier to fix due to your higher level of knowledge about the bike. Cheers Bud!
my DR for that reason reminds me of when I started driving early 70s, and the thrill of doing mods to my HR Holden and seeing huge gains everywhere (even a good cut and polish gave it several more mph on the Calga expressway LOL)
You can ride the 701 at lower revs on the dirt and it’s great, similar power to DR, as shown on your chart. Then on the tar twisties you can rev it harder and its very sporty, unlike the DR. That’s where you can really enjoy the 70 hp. Ride whatever makes you smile the most. Cheers
I own both a 2022 KTM 690 Enduro and a 2021 Suzuki DR-650. Love them both, and they are both awesome and fun. I agree 100%, the DR is more light adventure duty, the KTM leans more towards enduro. I am building them both towards those directions.
I bough a brand new DR-650 on 2003 and kept it for about 10 years. I'm a big guy and the suspension was very soft for sure! The only problem I ever had with it was the fork seals started leaking right before I sold it. I did replace the battery once - Other than that, I can't remember anything else that went wrong with it. I kind of wish I'd kept it now!! As always, another great video. Thanks!!
DR650SE was my first Bike in 1996, I replaced fork springs with progressive, stronger ones and got a firmer rear shock. I had 70,000km of fun until I finally sold it. 17inch rear wheel reduces choice of tyres. The carb is very smooth due to the type (slide is indirect driven by a membrane). This carb can change slide positition on jumps, especially landing, where it closes. It may contribute to the heavy-flywheel-feel motor characteristics. But do not overestimate the carbs negative side. On the other hand it is easy to control. My DR650SE was good for adventure rides and my first enduro race as well as the Erzberg prologue. I also had supermoto tyres for first supermoto trainings on a SM-race track. Many good memories. Great that you can still buy it.
Despite its flaws the stock carb is very forgiving when it comes to jetting it correctly. I know a lot of guys have trouble dialling in the FCR pumper carb as it needs to be a lot more precise with jetting.
I have a DRZ400E and a KTM 690 Enduro R. I went to purchase a DR650, that had all the top quality options ( pumper carb, suspension, seat etc) and looked brand new. I almost bought it first sight, knowing that i wouldnt find any better. Then i took it for a test ride. Underwhelmed is an understatement. The seller noticed my reaction when i returned , as he commented that i didnt seem impressed with it. The bike felt gutless, i told the owner that my DRZ felt like it out performed it easily. I found it to be a real shame, as i thought a DR650 would suit me perfectly, i guess theyre named "PIG" for a reason. The KTM however is an exceptional road bike and an exceptional dirt bike.
It's why I always suggest test rides if possible to see if you gel with the bike. My case? I bought a 690 years ago and hated it... sold it three months later. But I couldn't get a test ride to realise this would happen. 😢 Interesting you felt the DRZ would be quicker, the DR650 and DRZ have around the same maximum power and are pretty much neck and neck in a drag race. But the DRZ will certainly feel faster as it revs higher.
Rode a DR650 for 4 years. modified the crap out of it. I ended up wanting more power on the road so went '16 690. Rode the 690 for 5 years. Never had any issues with it except the clutch basket needed to be replaced because it grooved out. Likely because I was lugging it around too much. The ergos on the 690 fit me better, and the added freeway speed was worth it. both bikes had to have the suspension done for my fat ass. seat height was lower (and thus better for me) on the DR. Both are great bikes. Both bikes want another gear, but the 5 speed DR wants it more.
I was always puzzled at the gearbox on my old 690. Very close ratio so despite six gears I found first too high and sixth too low. Lots of false neutrals too.
Having owned and sold a CRF250L, KLR 650, 1250 GS, and 690 enduro r with ownership ranging from one year to 8 years I have settled on and love my modded DR650 and I just splurged for a '23 890 R. It's a 2 bike stable for me, always. I feel these two bikes take me through the wide dual sporting-ADV-supermotoesq range in the best fashion for my taste. Of the previous bikes I by far put the most miles on the CRF and KLR. I got rid of the 690 the fastest. I was enamored with the miraculous ridability of the GS but it was little overbearing offroad for my 140 pounds and my wallet. If I was truly rubbing nickels together I would just own a DR650.
@@crosstrainingadventure Again at 140 lbs I felt it was too powerful to keep planted without constant finesse of throttle and clutch... I was also learning to improve those skills as I subsequently still had to with the DR. This was a 2018 model without TC. The gear box felt like shit. It was too much animal for me at the time. The DR is more mellow but it's no slouch. I've totally corrected the ergos and controls and put an Adventure Spec mini fairing and IMS tank on her. Last will be suspension but it's been ok for me.
701 guy here. I use mine as an adventure bike mostly now and do big miles on the highway but I’m still good on trails. Reliability has been exceptional, I have 25,000 miles on it now.
I'd be really curious to see how the 690/701 stacks up to the old XR650R. That bike does have the power of the austrian but also has low down grunt and reliability on par with the DR
That would be a great comparison for sure, Jacob. I've seen dyno charts that show the XR650R doesn't quite have the top end power of the 690, but those bikes were soooo rock solid. I'd buy one in a flash if Honda brought them back with a few mods.
I was the drongo on the 701 and had a ball playing around with Barry on the day. I got to break my DR virginity and rode Barry's DR, I'm not going to lie I quite liked it.......... would I own a DR? I don't know but I'm definitely a sucker for the tyre shredding power of the 701.
I did this, 701 v 500 EXC on tarmac. 701 did it, but we needed to get to about 100kph before the 701 started opening the gap, both bikes were hooking power wheelies with about 20kg of kit on the back. Hitting the rev limiter on the 701 slows her right down. Childish fun. BTW, my 701 has been from the Arctic to the Sahara. Apart from fecked clutches, she's been grand.
@@crosstrainingadventure the 701 does alright on single track. I'm a rider of distinctly average talent and I can get the 701 through most things. But it is a lump. My adventurised FE350 is a true go anywhere bike, even in my clumsy hands.
I rode very little on DR about 30 years ago so I can't really compare but I can say few things about 701 with mods : 1- ride on highways (and twisties) at a 130 kph whiteout a problem 2- the throttle response is very linear so there is no problem controlling the power 3- the factory suspension tuned is for fast off road trail. it's not so good at slow technical section. 4- brakes are precise and very strong. it's actually the best I've ridden ever. One should be remembered that in addition to purchase cost of 701, the rider will invest between $1,000 and $2,000 on additions and improvements such as hand guards, pegs, mirrors and more... The reason I sold mine was a throttle fault that the local dealer couldn't fix for 3 months. For me the 701 and its capabilities are overkill.
As an adventure bike I’ve found the 701 to be Amazing. Added 1.5 gallon tank under the seat and a couple other adventure mods. Nothing Ive tried has a better balance of aggressive offroad capability and can still pull 85 mph highway comfortably. The 701 is the Backcountry Discovery Route unicorn.
The PR7 seems to check almost all the boxes. Light, powerful enough, good suspension, simple, limited electronic crap, field reparable, fewer proprietary parts. Why aren’t we all buying it? I feel like if any of the big brands made it, it would be immensely popular.
It's strange and I've mentioned it in a few vids. Are those of us wanting that sort of bike only a tiny part of the market? Do we think everyone wants that sort of bike, but in reality the majority don't? It would explain why bikes like the CCM450, Husqvarna TE610, TE630 and TR650 never really took off.
Don't know too much about the 701 - there aren't that many in NZ - The 690 however... well as the anecdote has it - it's great on Prom night but you can expect a messy divorce 18 months in...high maintenance (costs) and can fail in ways that you'd go to the moon and pay in fingers to avoid. The initial price difference is just one factor, it's fairly common knowledge that dealers make most their profit on service and spares - in NZ these costs are jacked up further by the scarcity / prestige marketing BS. Anyone with a limited budget would be far better off spending some of that difference on off road training or just riding instead of doing the overtime to pay for it. The DR has been around for donkeys years, there's a large 2nd hand and aftermarket spares available - possibly the largest of any bike out there. Last but not least the simplicity of the DR - a competent home mechanic or anyone with an engineering background can do a major service in an hour or so. The bike encourages tweaking, fiddling and modification. Might not seem like a big deal, but out in the middle of a 200km trail simple reliability and familiarity with how the thing works is a big deal IMHO.
You have to love simplicity. Occasionally we get into some really remote areas and that's when I especially love the DR. Hardly anything ever goes wrong. And it's usually a really simple fix if it does.
Great video Barry! For budget minded individuals like ourselves you just can't beat the DR. Price tag on newer machines make us want to puke 🤮 Hope you're doing good and have a great weekend! *T4S*
Yo, Barry. It's been several years! I have 30,000 trouble free miles on my 2021 KTM 890ADV R. Never got heavy into very challenging dirt riding here in Baja, just lots of easy enough dirt roads. As I aim for my 76th birthday next month, I'm just too cautious to be dangerous anymore. Even a small, slow fall just takes a hell of a long time for the effects to go away. I really like the bike. Love all the modern electronics, but i find that I've settled into pretty much the same 2 modes - one for dirt and one for road. I love the power at speed on the highway, being able to pass any slow traffic at will, yet it has plenty of fork travel, and agility for the dirt and potholes that abound. But, I'm headed to the Holy Land in May and don't want to take this bike, due to its electrical and mechanical complexities, as well as its weight. So, coincidently with your video here, I've been looking into taking either a basically modded DR 650, pretty much as you've done, or the 701 Enduro. It seems that the 701 can be as reliable as DR, and I sure like the 6th gear, horsepower and slightly lighter weight of the 701, but I'm not totally at ease with the somewhat extra maintainance and possibility of reliability issues. So, seeing this video made me more aware of the nature of each bike. Thanks. It will be more difficult, I think, getting service. My mind says that I should get the DR, but my heart says the 701. I'll be trying to Ride them both while still in the States, but I think, for one of the few times in my life, i will listen to my more sensible side, and aim for the DR. Glad to see that your back is pretty much healed up. Ride 'til ya Rot! Gabriel
Shalom Gabriel, good to hear you are still riding! A friend just bought an 890 so I got my first ride on one last weekend. I can see what you mean about the weight... but so relaxed on the road. So many pros and cons with the DR650 and 701. I suspect in the end only a decent test ride on each can really resolve it for some riders. As mentioned, when my 701 buddy swaps bikes he is always impressed with my DR650 and is half tempted to get one. But then other 701 owners have ridden it and hated it lol!
I have ridden a 690 KTM and found it light and agile, but I am still thoroughly enjoying the strong torque and comfort of your old FFRC DR that you developed in earlier videos. As with you, it suits me down to the ground. I have sold my 2013 BMW GS after buying this machine. Didn't need it after all.
my long distance (mainly) sealed road adventurer is a KTM 790 Adventure S. My rougher, gnarlier adventure bike with more diversions into all sorts of terrain is my highly modded DR650 which is now 15 years old. The beauty of the DR is in doing the mods to it as you become aware you need to - it's a work in process, not just a case of signing a cheque or plonking down the card. I'll not part with mine. Suspension - done, bigger exhaust and carb - done, any known possible weak links - again, done. The other benefit is in seeing the bike as a reliable old friend rather than just a purchase. And interestingly, with my set of 17" wheels and tyres on it I can flat foot it and it makes an incredibly great commuter bike in the city and suburbs. Braided front line and road rubber bring it up to very decent stopping ability.
I was so close to buy a newer 701 then I came to my senses and got a used modified DR650. Glad I did. I got a bike that I can fix myself, mod myself and don't need a computer to decipher fault codes.
If you really want more than 60hp in a big single a 690/701 is the only option really. But if you are happy with similar midrange but only 40hp max then the DR650 is a lot cheaper, simpler and way less things to go wrong.
Mate, new subscriber. This channel is brilliant. Im 60 and just bought my 1st bike, Honda 300L, (dont hate me too much!) Gearing up for an across Asia, and hopefully around the world trip if the funds hold out!
I still haven't ridden one but keen to, Phil. Great bikes from what I hear! Guys in the USA are riding them across the country in all sorts of terrain... the usual Honda reliability. 😎
I added a DRZ400 SM USD front end, w/ triple clamps that bolted right on my DR650, and by using a standard DRZ400 21" front wheel with the big supermoto rotor the bikes suspension and brakes are fantastic. Even the DRZ400 digital dash was easily be added, the headlights and housings are the same. Makes you wonder why Suzuki cannot do this if an old timer like me can/
Sweet! Did you lose the steering lock in the process? Any changes to the suspension? I've heard the DRZ400SM suspension can be a bit harsh for offroad use but the extra weight of the DR650 would probably make it work well?
@@crosstrainingadventure Yes I did loose the steering lock, the extra tonnage of the DR and the ability to change the clicker’s balances out the front, a heavier rear spring and oil in the rear for now. Thank you.
@@crosstrainingadventure I believe it’s worth it, I was lucky to find a DRZ400sm blown up for $500 USD, I took the front end sold the wheels for $550. Best deal ever.
Thanks for a great video! 1 other factor is availability; new DR650 & KLR650 are not available in EU because of euro norm 😞 I would like to use a XR/KLR/DR850 but had to settle for the 701. What I don't like about the 701 is the gearing; there's a reason there is a special aftermarket kit for sale... _____ PS did you read my 2nd response about the tablet in a previous video ??
Bummer, I didn't see your comment about the tablet. I read every comment usually, but after a few days UA-cam stops sending notifications about new comments on a video. 😢 I'm still puzzled that so many have complained the 690/701 gear ratios but they are still the same. I hope they got rid of the multiple false neutrals....
I have experience with both bikes, as my riding buddies have DRs and 690s The DRs Suspension in stock form and lightly tweaked is a horrible pogo stick. It quickly becomes uncontrolled, not only when riding quick but also when the terrain becomes more challenging. No feedback, harsh on hard hits and wallowy everywhere else. You never know whats going on and you end up constantly managing the suspension, trying to anticipate what it's going to do next. In my opinion the biggest downside of the bike. Reason enough for me to not own one. Besides that its a fun, proper dual sport, that handles everything from commuting, twisties, traveling and off-roading. The engine is thermally stable and does what you want it to do, unless you jump and the carb slide flies shut. Its just an easy, un-neurotic bike. The 690 is very different in its character. The suspension can be harsh if not well serviced, but gives loads of feedback. You can push it and lean on the suspension and it works for you, you don't think about it. Its firm, but its your friend. The engine is mighty powerful and extremly direct. You quickly find yourself blipping a single gob of 70hp-powerstroke in what sounds like a gunshot. With the snorkle removed it has a very nice, linear power delivery. You wheelie, you stoppie and become a rightout hooligan. Until the rocker arm breaks, the engine oil needs topping up again and the suspension needs servicing. But as long as the engine rattles like it has three bent valves you know, everything is as it should be. If you know what to look out for, and accept that its a bit of a diva, you have the most capable dual-sport bike on the market today. That beeing said, I myself ride a 93' XR 600R More lightweight than both, better suspension than both, and tons of racing pedigree. Commuting is its nemesis. And stalling on a hillclimb.
Good summary! Yeah the stock DR650 is simply atrocious. But just throwing in Plex valves transforms the front. I find the rear is okay if I jack up the damping and preload to the max. I only feel its limitations when I start to push the bike hard in snotty terrain, which isn't that often nowadays. I might get the shock revalved at some point though when it needs servicing. But the XR600 rules over all of course!
I had a 2019 model 690 and before that I had a 2016 dr650, both very good bikes on their on way ,both were very reliable, the 690 truly felt more like a modern dual sport, the traction control was very helpful once you develop a relationship with it, Also the sitting position and ergonomics was much better on the 690,
We had always had traction control it's called smooth throttle control, braking and shifting. If you need electronic nanny's engaged then the machine is far to powerful for you.
@@gabrieltiso8537 ABS and traction control are for posers and not for dirt bikes. ABS is bloody dangerous off road on a dirt bike. The 690 is a big fat pig that really can't do any real offroading. It's for people that have more money than skill and knowledge just like ABS and traction control on a dirt bike lol. 350lb is a terribly big and fat dirt bike just like a Big red pig fast in a straight line but not really a good dirt bike that can do it all like a light weight 450 that has even better power to weight ratio. The 690 is to much bike for anyone to handle when the going gets tough and fly by wire throttle, ABS and traction control do not belong on any real dirt bike. Electronic nannies are for minivans not hard core dirt bikes in the the dirt. The right hand is all the traction control you need and if you need help with that then you are not safe enough to enjoy the ride and the bike is just to much to Handel for the skill level.
All the big singles aren't much chop for true dirt riding. Probably the last 650 that was actually good was the Husaberg 650? I completely agree that ABS does not suit dirt bikes and it's much better to focus on proper riding skills. And in the past it was downright dangerous. Having said that, I'm okay with its use on adventure bikes for two reasons (but I still wouldn't want it on my bike lol). Accident stats are showing a lot of middle aged riders hurting themselves. They get back into riding after a few decades off, often buying bikes that are too big for their rusty skills. ABS will probably add a bit of safety on road and easy dirt roads. Two? ABS is way more refined now. My brother hates ABS too but he admits that all the multiple settings on his GS1200 work really well and he's actually started using it on dirt roads. Me? I prefer to keep my bikes really simple with minimal electronics.
I've spent plenty of time on all the bikes in this category. IMO, the Suzuki 400 Supermoto is the best all-arounder for most people. Obviously needs different tires for off-roading. The downside is it's very expensive to hop up if you want serious power. For aggressive rides who aren't afraid of a little maintenance, the big Husky/KTM is the clear choice. No matter how much money you dump into one of the Japanese machines, it will never come close to a 701 with a few intelligent mods.
I did buy a DRZ400 where the owner had done quite a few mods... big bore kit, pumper carb, exhaust, hot cams etc. The funny thing is it didn't feel that much faster than a stock model. I'd be guessing a 10 to 15% increase for all that money?
Bought a low miles 17 dr650 on the cheap. Gold emulators installed with stiffer springs...had the seat widened. Have a Pro Cycle carb jet kit on the way and a 5.3 tank. I'm an old and slow Harley rider... suits me just fine lol...oh and a Rallz is going on the back next week.
Interesting... was that a custom seat job, Sheldon? I went to an upholsterer to get the same thing done but it mainly made it higher and barely any wider lol. Still a big improvement and only $100 so I didn't complain.
@@crosstrainingadventure yes the custom car upholstery guy glued up "wings" to make it a saddle. Google maps. Rainbow Auto Glass here in Bancroft Ontario for a pic and review. Any good guy can do one. This one was 175.00.
Just got a 701 loaded with all the extras for not much more than the price being asked for a DR400/650s here in NZ. I know I only need CRF250/300 DR400 power but then would have to spend money on suspension and the other stuff.
I have a 2008 DR and the only mod I have done is put a Dominator muffler on it and this improved acceleration response quite a bit. It’s a great bike for a rally around the bush tracks, but a bit heavy when it gets tight.
Did you rejet to suit the exhaust too, Scott? Makes quite a difference as otherwise it runs too lean. Apart from the free mods, I reckon the next bang-for-buck mod is a set of Plex Valves dropped into the forks.
Honda has price, parts availability and reliability, the 701 has everything else... Plus the 701 is a super capable road bike as well. I bought the SM for daily commute and track riding and after 18 months I have no complaints (so far, lol).
As I get a little older and wiser I'm learning that it's all about logistics with these bikes. Any KTM or Husky runs on the hopes and dreams that it won't have a problem, because it'll clear out your wallet if you do. Thing is ... they always have problems, it's what separates them from the Japanese bikes. Of course the Japanese bikes can have problems too, but so much less frequently and they'll be fixed so much faster and cheaper too. I've seen many a Honda keep plodding along while it's KTM owner went to the shop for the 3rd time that year. That kind of reliability is invaluable.
It's a good point. Another viewer pointed out they'll have the occasional hiccup with a DR but it's easily fixable. But the KTM? Usually your arranging transport back home.
You can go everywhere a 690 and 701 will on a DR650, that’s a fact. You could actually get away with just suspension, a seat and a front braided brake line with a DR and still have a ball touring or on tight trails.
Staying under 80kmh on dirt roads with equal riders? Probably! All that extra hp just goes into wheelspin of course. But faster than that the 701 will pull away fast lol.
Excellent bush pig overview vs. 701 with great clickbait title. Still riding my mini Suzuki bush pig (350) but eventually one day will probably switch over to the 650.
I knew someone would comment on the title as clickbait. 😁 I normally avoid that but I did actually think it was a great way to show the different nature of these beasts... Great to hear your DR350 is still going strong!
This is the video we’ve all been waiting for! I understand that the 690/701 has undergone a significant update since you owned one. Did you find it better than before, even if it’s still not to your liking?
Still didn't like it, Christiaan. They do run smoother at low revs than the early 690s though. But I still didn't like the harsh suspension, weird ergos, snappy throttle response and lack of stability at speed.
Currently own a 2018 690 and its...just okay. Started with dr650, then f800gs, then drz400. Now I miss my DR. Doubt I'll drop the ktm but I do miss the ergonomics of the 650.
Surely there's a fuelling dongle or ECU controller with MAP selection for the 690/701, whereby you can tone-down throttle response in the loose stuff??
There is some adjustment but there's also the fact it's fuel injected. Some guys fit a G2 throttle tamer to get rid of that snappiness and have a more carb-like throttle. Each to their own of course.
Using nannies to make a bike run better for you is not really doing much but hiding the fact that there is just to much power on tap for you to effectively use. Driving a slower machine faster is better fun than using nannies on a to powerful of a machine for the riding you are doing to limit what you will never be able to use anyways lol. These new 100HP extremely top and bottom heavy tanks with fuel injected, ABS equipped machines are not even made for the off road. Lol.
Totally with you on that one. I must admit that everyone I've met who bought a 690 or 701 have nowhere near the skill to properly use the power. And they'll admit it, but they just love spinning that wheel and spraying gravel on straight flat dirt roads lol. There was one exception though. A very talented guy who had the bike sideways or up on the rear wheel most of the time. He had a ball with all that horsepower.
@@crosstrainingadventure I would just get a CR500AF for a crazy and real dirt bike. 70hp and 60Ft/lbs of TQ in a cr 250 frame 220lb bike cannot be dominated and it's very old and better "Teck" than today. You know how to ride and endure the fall but I will not recommend just anyone to try and ride these over powered machines they accelerate so hard that it would put a new perspective on life for many people and push most people body's way past their limits and g forces. Even for allot of highly talented and crazy riders the CR500AF is plenty of bike for them and no need for gimmicks like ABS or "wireless throttle" lol.
Great to still have these choices in some countries, David! It's getting very restricted in Australia now due to emission laws etc. The big singles now are just the 690/701, the rare AJP PR7 and the increasingly heavy KLR650.
As a long-term DR owner, I’ve continued to tweak things along the way and still love the old girl. But I’ve never even touched the suspension. Interesting in your comments that you’ve just changed to have Plex valves? Can you tell me a bit more about what you did and where you got them? Thanks Chris.
Hi mate, I’m a DR rider not a tech Guru. So when you start talking about things being pinned into previous videos, I have no idea how to find that. Hopefully you can help.
I'M always amazed at everyone getting these expensive bikes,huskys,t7's,bmw's etc that have large amounts of power,but really you dont need it.I bought a klr650 changed a few things its all need for touring,touring is about seeing our vast country and not doing 190km's hr to get there.
I'm with you, Andrew. Lately I've been riding with a guy on a KLR650 and whenever he hits the throttle I can't keep up with him... hanging out the rear on corners, jumps, wheelies. A good rider can do amazing things with less than 40hp.
@@crosstrainingadventure As long as that 40hp has the down low and mid range Tourqe then it will be very very effective at moving across rough terrain ya. 40hp at 10,000rpm with no TQ down low is a nightmare unless you are 14 years old and still like to ride like a bat outta hell idiot everywhere all the time lol. HP means nothing without the TQ to back it up and smooth out the hit.
I prefer the more reliable bike and the one with shorter seat height. My riding style is conservative, so not into racing. Much prefer a bike akin to the proverbial tortoise 🐢 rather than the hare 🐰, so hope to one day get a dr650
Such a shame hey Simon? All they had to do was fit ABS.... we could always bin it to reduce the weight. Kawasaki managed to add ABS and keep the KLR650 alive here. But it now weighs as much as a T7 lol.
@@crosstrainingadventureyes ABS can be life saving technology. They could have also switched to EFI but clearly some boring crunched the numbers and decided on a hard No. RIP DR big-bore. You will be missed by the faithful.
Honda's CEO admitted that the company had lost its mojo and promised to get it back. It's a shame this hasn't occurred in the adventure and enduro motorbike section. Suzuki is probably worse. 😒
The real downside of the 701 is the lack of a real WR gearbox. A note on the weight comparison: Some judicious choices allow you to cut nearly 20 pounds. Ditching the lead-acid battery, fender extension, OEM mirrors, passenger pegs, grab handles, stock airbox, and [the big win] the catalyst/muffler cuts a lot of bulk. If you can resist adding a bunch of shit back, you get a much lighter bike and a bit more HP.
Have ridden a 690 and am the owner of a DR. The KTM is lightyears ahead of the DR with regard to performance but at the cost of long term reliability. The thing about the DR is that there is huge potential for increasing power and torque where the 690 is fairly maxed out, out-of-the-box. My DR has a 790 kit, big valves, 42mm pumper carb and large exhaust. I think you would be hard pressed squeezing more power out of it but the 690 is still faster on the pavement. But the low-end of the big bore DR is lustful and more useable and a hell of a lot easier to work on.
100% agree. The 701 rider in the vid still enjoys swapping bikes when we ride. He said the 650 just feels more stable, predictable and takes less energy to ride.
Do you find any reliability or over-heating issues with the 790 kit?[ Still good for lugging around in 1st and or vibration at 80mph on open highway? I'm very interested in that series of engine modifications for the DR. Thanks.
@@bikerabbi It was not at all what I expected, all the needles were pointing in the opposite direction after all those mods. No increase in heat which actually is lower then I like with the DR in Supermoto trim. With the tire hugging fenders it runs around 150F oil temp on the output side of the cooler but runs about 30 degrees hotter with the off-road fender. Before I switched to reserve at around 175 miles with a 5.3 gallon Acerbis tank. Now I switch to reserve at 190 miles go figure? That's with 16/40 gearing which the 790 easily pulls and cruises at 90 mph. No increase in vibes as the CP 790 piston is only 1 gram heavier than the stock slug. Makes the DR a hoot to ride! 😃 No downsides from what I've experienced other than the drain to your bank account 😕
I have a 2020 KTM690 Enduro R and have had two XR650R’s, the low end is similar but the KTM quickly out performs the XR’s. But, in my opinion the XR’s are bulletproof, no computers, no map settings, and depending on state..no smog stuff. There’s also the price factor, 13,500 for the KTM or 3500.00 (used) for the XR?? I ride with four guys, one has a XR650R, three of us have 690’s and one KTM890, we have a neighbor who has a 2013 DR650 who comes along on some of the rides. Through canyons or long grades the DR falls back but not much, it’s capable and far less expensive to work on, all the bikes in the group are solid and really the only noticeable differences are off-road capability, the XR is every bit as fast as the KTMs there, the long grades though definitely separate the bikes quickly. I have no problem with any of them and am glad to be able to ride.
It's a real shame Honda doesn't bring back the XR650R and upgrade it, Rakkasan. With fuel injection and a few tweaks it would match the 690 for top end as well.
I have a DR, 701, 350exc and 500exc. The DR and 701 are going to be sold. Keeping the 500 for ADV and DS riding. I have loved all the bikes and put many miles on each but the weight of the 701 and DR have made me realize I prefer light weight bikes. I have a hard time recovering the DR / 701 from a tip over situations. Most the time I have to let them down as gently as possible and then pick up with whole body. The 500 I can usually just hold it up and get back to the balance point. They all have their good and bad points.
Both bikes are quite capable offroad but 690/701 adds more smiles per mile :) Both are not really suitable for all-day-long highway riding because of a thumper buzz so riding to and from offroad sections could be exhausting. Now I own a DR with modded suspension and a big tank but dreaming about 2-cyl machine every time I hit a pavement. Unfortunately there is no dual sport 2-cyl ~600cc bike within 165 kg on the market.
I went the middle ground and grabbed a SWM650 RSR. Lighter than both, cheaper than both, nice usable power, lots of after market accessories (same as a Husky TE630). Haters may try the 'Chinese made' route but most of the big four now make all there cheaper bikes in China or Taiwan and KTM are firmly embedded with Chinese manufacturing (CF Moto).
A real shame these were discontinued. I loved my old TE610 which was even lighter. The Superdual was next and started to get very obese and then they discontinued that. 😢
For day rides on popular routes I figure it's not quite as important, Brent. E.g. you haven't gone far from base so transport for a busted bike isn't so hard. But riding in remote areas and/or multi day rides? The DR gets more tempting for the less mechanically inclined!
I ride a ktm 690smcr. If I was going to start off road I think the husky would be my choice, but I am not sure I would go for such a big engine. My SMCR has crazy amounts of power and will wheelie easy in 3rd on the road, I can’t imagine wanting that much power on dirt
I'm sure a really skilled rider could use all the power on faster tracks. But for us average muppets? Way too much lol. It's what I like about the DR650, the 40hp is generally all you need on dirt roads.
Interesting! On a dirt road the much lighter 570 would shoot ahead initially I reckon. The 701 probably has an extra 10hp so would eventually overtake on dirt or sealed road?
I ended up with the klr. I almost bought the dr. My buddy bought the ktm1200 and had so many problems with his it was gone before the end of the first summer. All the break downs were super expensive to repair.. The cost of the parts was sickening. He bought a honda, then traded it for the dr. That was almost 20 years ago, we both have these big slow boring reliable bicks still.
I have a Duke 690R my brother has a DR650, (I use to own a RD650 too with the plex valves, jetted tuned and exhaust) we've done a few drag races pretty much the same different in speed. Almost the same power delivery until around 5k where the Duke 690R just leaves it behind. Similar size engine, similar torque, similar weight although the DR650 will drop off torque as the revs increase making a modest 40-45hp but the KTM will keep pulling up to the rev limiter making 73hp and a Manic One thing the DR650 does better is low rpm pulls and will just tractor up anything between 2-3,000rpm The KTM hates being under 3,000rpm even when cruising
Definitely completely different styles of engine, Andrew. Many of us would love to see Honda bring back a revised XR650R. I reckon it would be the perfect compromise. The same grunt of the DR but close to the Kato in terms of outright power. And reliable as a brick.
@@crosstrainingadventure a suspension service helped a lot on a friends 690 brought it from harsh to firm felt direct and gave a lot of feedback without beeing crashy
If the DR 650had 6 gears I'd still own one ,the suspension can be sorted and seat replaced with something kinder to the huskier riders butt (100kg+)gearing it down for an off-road 1st gear means losing too much top end speed for the highway.
@@crosstrainingadventure yes,they just banned non ABS equipped bikes here in NZ just a thoughtless bureaucratic decision not based on any reasonable accident data DR 650 riders are mainly mature riders who know the bikes limits and ride accordingly (DRZ400 riders not so much) the rock solid reliability can't be beat for peace of mind.
@@pauldavidson6321 I think reliability, toughness (“little to break when dropped), and ease of maintenance/repair ability more than even it out in the long run. That first radiator replacement after a long walk home….at least when you wreck a lot like me.
Something u didn't mention was road ability, commuting etc. here the 650 takes the prize with comfort, reliability, carrying ability and ease of maintenance, not to mention parts availability. I think I would prefer the 650 for loaded up touring. U can drop another 3kg from the 650 with exhaust replacement and end up with a bike barely heavier than a CRF300L with twice the torque.
I had a 690 for a year. While i enjoyed the top end power, the engine was so unhappy below 4500rpm it felt like it wanted to kill itself. You had to stay a gear lower and/or slip the clutch in the slow stuff. Plus the horrible steering radius. Much happier on my drz400!
One of the things I hated about mine and sold it within three months.The cure back then was spending a few thousand on a remapped ECU and an Akro exhaust. And I'd already spent so much on the bike. Apparently they did fix this eventually. the 701 in this vid ran fine at low revs completely stock.
Its unfortunate to be forced to spend an extra couple thousands just to have a bike that runs like it should. Even more insulting when the bike is "premium". Oh well. Good to hear the newer ones run better at least, also no more rocker arms as maintenance items.
Just went max on the preload and damping. I don't ride that aggressively nowadays and it works fine most of the time. I must admit though if I start to push it hard in rough terrain you hit its limitations fast lol. I will get it revalved (and probably a stiffer spring) when I get the shock serviced soon.
I'm like you when it comes to riding style Barry I mostly like to plug along and watch the scenery Flow by on the DR650 too much on the line these days to get all busted up dependant over the thrill rides although that's what I've spent the last half a century doing usually twisting WOT on an XR 650 r ..see how fast she goes before she blows that kind of riding 😁😎 I better slow er down while I'm ahead though
You are so lucky that you could still buy the DR650. It's not available in Europe for 15 years or so. I would defo get one for that price if available. I love big thumpers
hello , well i have spent time on the bush pig and i found soft suspension, heavy , and lack of power , 17" rear wheel ,as stock bike , but still a good bike ,well over due for a upgrade as i now own a 2022 ktm690enduro r , its light , power full , good suspension , good balanced bike , and with the added safety of traction control and ABS . 6 speed ,quickshifter ,and 4 x ride modes so you can dial it in to suit you and your riding , but in the end get out the a ride !! enjoy . Steve/Geraldton
It's great we've got these options in terms of price, reliability and performance! And we all look for different things. I'm always surprised when the 701 owner is actually keen to ride my DR650 and talks about all the things he likes about it lol. I'm always expecting him to hate it! Mind you, he probably WOULD hate a stock one.
Where in Oz this? I’m from the NE US and would love to do do a dual sport vacation in Australia. At least part of the time, I’m actually more interested in riding a bicycle around your awesome country? Adelaide?
Our footage is from all over the eastern coast. The most varied riding is probably south down in Victoria. Cycling? I'd definitely focus on doing it in our winter, especially as you head further north! Dual sport riding? Heaps of good GPS files on Trans Australia Trails for all over the country.
And so you should be. 😊 There's no real comparison between a dual sport bike and proper enduro bikes. A bit like a sports car owner not liking a family car.
Sometimes I feel like I want a bit more power out of my DR but then I think about it logically and realize I can lose my license on every single road in Canada with it , so I dont really need to go any faster than that . And on the gravel roads I dont think I'd want to do more than 100mph anyways.
@Cross Training Adventure Yes sir , I started with that, then my buddy did the same with his Pig. So naturally I had to one up him and put a TM40 pumper carb on it. He's jealous of my 3rd gear wheelies now lol
Brilliant comparison 🙌! Bush Pig squeal of approval 🐷. The Cost difference is the biggest factor #1,, I'm older and would likely hurt my quicker on the Husky #2. Although the DR still has the carby,, I'd have to lean (no pun intended) for the Bush 🐷. Cheers 🍻, G. In beautiful Boulder City Nv. USA 🇺🇲
It's not a full on drag race of course, just to the speed limit to keep it all legal lol. But it throws up some interesting questions about how much power you need. On the road? The 701 leaps ahead. But on dirt roads? Due to wheelspin the 701 only really starts to fly past the DR650 from about 70kmh on.
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im currently after a adventure bike thats got more beans then my yamaha v star 650 classic its a great bike sounds awesome and goes toe to toe with most harleys i ride with but the roads around wagga wagga NSW are total garbage and it beats me up too much so ive been looking at something upto 15k aud preferebly new and has cruise control and the only thing i have found is the cfmoto 800mt with the all new ktm 790 engine
im interested in the upcoming triumph 400cc scrambler but knowing small bikes it probobly wont have cruise control but their is a company that makes cruise controls for alot of bike so i guess we will see what happens with that
Agreed. And for comparison, the dr is very comparable to a ninja 300. So that's good enough for freeway passing, but it's not going to wow you at those speeds.
Technically, it might be faster than my ninja 300, but even with less power and torque the ninja is way more fun on the street.
@@travisj2370 If you don't want to go Austrian or Chinese the VStrom is a remarkably capable road bike and more comfortable on crap Aussie roads than you'd believe possible. The newest 1000s have cruise, but they're maybe bigger and more expensive than you want. The older ones are a bargain but no cruise. Also worth noting the 1000s have better suspension than the 650s (stock that is - VStrom owners are mad farklers). Don't know about the 250s, never ridden one.
Theres a big bore 790 kit for the DR Id like to see that comparison even though the 701 would still win.
The 701 is double the cost and double the maintenance that's the difference
The 650 has enough power where it counts and is as good in most circumstances than a bike twice the price. It's a better choice despite the price for some people. What a gem
Yep, I reckon it's got more than enough power for most riders. But there'll always be the very skilled riders who can actually use that 70hp offroad and actually want to use it. Others will just try to and probably get hurt lol.
Hear hear!
@@crosstrainingadventure The DR also has enough to lose ur license or hurt yourself, if that's your bag.
Had a heavily modded DR650 for 5 or so years (Tuned DRZ forks, Wilbers rear shock, TM40, Leovince muffler, 25L tank, etc....) and I'm now on a modded 2019 701 (Tuned suspension, Safari tanks, plus more...). I agree with pretty much all your comments, the 701 is powerful, but revvy motor. The difference between the two bikes I find the biggest is the handling honestly.
The underseat fuel on the 701 helps a lot: a full tank of fuel on the 701 feels like the DR did when empty, or even better still. That's not even including my safari tanks. It's not just the low down weight though, the 701's geometry seems to make is so much more predictable and composed at medium/high speed over loose and rough surfaces. I say that from the perspective of having loaded the thing with enough adventure gear to make it top heavy, and even then it's still the case.
The high speed twitchiness you mentioned is down to suspension sag setups: I had that problem, went through and revised my sags (more at the rear), and now it's stable at high speed without feeling like a chopper.
The way I think about the 690 platform honestly: it's a mini 950/990. The mini version of a big desert racer. You strip all the bodywork off and look at them, and there are so many common aspects about the designs. Similar aspect ratios, component positions, weigh distributions, frame style.
All that said, I think I'd sell body parts if I could get one with an engine as solid and reliable as the DR.....
I'll mention your comments to the 701 owner about sag. I was really surprised when he handed my DR650 back and said he loved the stability of the DR's handling.
I assume drz-s fork? Or was it the super moto fork? My dr650 has cogent front and rear but it was set up for someone heavier than me.. wondering how you liked the swap
@@gabrieltiso8537 DRZ-E forks. Definitely tracked better and had better damping (and I guess just how much you can tune the damping before you hit design limitations). I had Plex valves before, and the DRZ-E forks were better. Did have to respring and re-tune them though.
@@SK3DDO much appreciation for the details! The bike will be more capable than me for the foreseeable future but I realize it's important to get the suspension dialed.. now I have yet another option for the front! 🤙
At first I thought I needed a faster bike to go faster, but I'm beginning to realize that the weaknesses in my lower back and my tendency to be out of shape are going to slow me down more than any engine or suspension
Many of us will actually be faster on a slower bike I think. The vast majority of us lack the skills to use 70hp offroad, and if we try we'll probably ride worse lol.
@@crosstrainingadventure It becomes a point for any rider at around 60hp on two wheels is kinda to much power and acceleration for any real off roading unless your in sand drag racing uphill all the time.
@@crosstrainingadventure I should be great, since my bike has about half the HP of a stock DR.😅
@@jpmiller7922 I was never faster offroad than on my ttr250 !
When I wuz young, speed wuz fun. But now I'm looking for an old DR350. It'll cruise at 65mph all day and that works fine for me.
I just keep coming back to the old school DR! I have finally just embraced the fact that for whatever reason these bikes just strike a certain chord with me that others don't. I've just recently purchased my 3rd DR650, and even though I always modify mine to suit my taste, I am blown away that I'm enjoying it quite a lot in bone stock configuration. It won't be that way long, but until then I'll enjoy it. Great video, and a treat for an old DR guy like me to watch.
I keep coming back too. After two years I sell my DR and try something else but always come back eventually. The current one is my fourth of fifth...
@@crosstrainingadventure I let a riding buddy ride my DR that I recently purchased. He told me I never stressed to him how good the DR is, though I did. I'm not the type of person to oversell something. Anyway he bought a DR650 in less than a week after riding mine! 😀
The 701 is like a dream bike for me but in reality the DR is the perfect bike for me, my DR never revs higher than 5000 rpm because I short shift all the time, more because of mechanical sympathy more than anything, part of the reason I seldom have to adjust the valve clearance.
Along with the fact for the price of one 701 I have had 2 DR 650s with a total of 800,000 klms so financially the DR is a clear winner and still own both, one I have owned for 18 years the other for 9 years and they both still run perfectly.
What's better than one DR650? 😂 I love the short shifting. Even in the 'drag race' you can hear I'm just changing gear at about 6000rpm. Any higher and it's just making more noise and actually less hp!
800,000kms?! How many rebuilds is that??
Ive got a DR650 and my riding partner has a 701 and had a 690 before that. The 690/701 is a very good bike, no doubt about it, and very attractive, but I have no plans of getting rid of my DR. It has an FCR pumper carb, GSXR muffler, modified air box, Ricor Intimidators in the front shock and Ricor rear shock, among other upgrades. I can hang with him everywhere but on the highway, and thats only over about 70 miles per hour, and I love how I can "tractor" the DR around at low RPMs. (I should note that I put my DR on a weight reduction program and its a good 45 pounds less than stock). He loves is 701, though, and I certainly respect that, but I love my DR as well.
How hard core did you go with the weight loss? I've heard that some owners managed to drop close to 20kg but it means things like losing your steering lock, ignition, headlight bracket, helmet lock etc.
@@crosstrainingadventure You nailed it. I pulled off everything you noted, except the headlight bracket. Replaced the airbox (which is heavy), with UNI filter, replaced battery with lithium one, Lighter weight aluminum bars, replaced stock speedo and cables with trailtech, got rid of passenger pegs, rear hand holds, stock mirrors, etc. I weighed every piece I took off and kept a spreadsheet, LOL. (I still have everything if I ever want to go back to stock.) The bike still looks pretty stock as well. I also did most of this over many years...it wasn't an overnight transformation. I've had it for 13 years now.
I'd love to see the spreadsheet if you wanted to email it via the website email address. I covered as many weight loss tips as possible in this vid. I could always add your stuff to the pinned first comment. ua-cam.com/video/h6fl-GWdURk/v-deo.html
@@crosstrainingadventure I will see if I can find it! Its been a few years now.
Cheers!
Barry your exceptionally dodgy videos are a large part of why I chose the DR650. The lower seat height was important to me too.
These vids are guaranteed to supply 284% of your daily dodginess requirements 😎
After watching your videos I purchased my 1998 Dr 650 with 2500 miles in perfect condition for 2300 , I put another 2500 in it and I love this bike, I can go anywhere and it has plenty of power, more than any XR650 for sure !
Love the old tractor!
Thanks!
Great to hear!
I own a KTM 300,KTM 500 and a fully modded DR650. Although I love them all,if I could only keep one bike it would be the DR. The DR is just a great do it all bike for this stage of my riding.
I couldn't agree more. I love Husky and want a norden 901, but no way will I ever give up my DR. It's my apocalypse bike.
The dr650 was my first dual sport after years of hard enduro on 2 strokes. I really enjoyed the bike especially for exploring the Nevada desert. As a package, it’s fun enough to forgive the flexy chassis and the softness. That bike always evokes some fond memories.
Ex DR owner - I’m picking up a 690. For me it’s to reduce the weight, and transfer it lower. The idea is to use it as an adventure bike.. maybe I’m a sadist, lol. After prepping, it’s off to the high country! I think it’ll be a good test (and further tweaks) to see how I cope before heading to central Australia. Also, due to the subframe being a tank, it’ll encourage me to pack even less. Go lighter, go further is the plan.
Isn't it absolutely fabulous that we are afforded these amazing options? It's a great time to be alive! (and also to be a moto enthusiast).
Great time for sure, Terry!
This is such a great comparison video Barry! Just my little opinion but modifying the DR650 is all part of the fun! The 701 is a great bike but for me, I love the tractor like grunt of the DR650 on the places I ride. By the way, "All Hail the Mighty Bush Pig!"
Cheers!
It's the perfect bike if you actually enjoy doing the mods... I do!
@@crosstrainingadventure Same here Barry! The additional advantage is the more you do mods and are taking the DR apart, the more you learn about how it functions and any possible issues you might have on the trail will be easier to fix due to your higher level of knowledge about the bike. Cheers Bud!
my DR for that reason reminds me of when I started driving early 70s, and the thrill of doing mods to my HR Holden and seeing huge gains everywhere (even a good cut and polish gave it several more mph on the Calga expressway LOL)
You can ride the 701 at lower revs on the dirt and it’s great, similar power to DR, as shown on your chart. Then on the tar twisties you can rev it harder and its very sporty, unlike the DR. That’s where you can really enjoy the 70 hp. Ride whatever makes you smile the most. Cheers
Whatever puts a smil on your dial! And doesn't hurt the wallet too much. 😎
Yees !!
I own both a 2022 KTM 690 Enduro and a 2021 Suzuki DR-650. Love them both, and they are both awesome and fun. I agree 100%, the DR is more light adventure duty, the KTM leans more towards enduro. I am building them both towards those directions.
How did you get the money for those? 😅
Both fantastic bikes, had a tuned DR it was great. I have a 701 LR now and it’s incredible fully fuelled and loaded it feels very balanced and safe.
I bough a brand new DR-650 on 2003 and kept it for about 10 years. I'm a big guy and the suspension was very soft for sure! The only problem I ever had with it was the fork seals started leaking right before I sold it. I did replace the battery once - Other than that, I can't remember anything else that went wrong with it. I kind of wish I'd kept it now!! As always, another great video. Thanks!!
For most of us the only 'maintenance' is putting fuel in, Jason lol
DR650SE was my first Bike in 1996, I replaced fork springs with progressive, stronger ones and got a firmer rear shock. I had 70,000km of fun until I finally sold it. 17inch rear wheel reduces choice of tyres. The carb is very smooth due to the type (slide is indirect driven by a membrane). This carb can change slide positition on jumps, especially landing, where it closes. It may contribute to the heavy-flywheel-feel motor characteristics. But do not overestimate the carbs negative side. On the other hand it is easy to control. My DR650SE was good for adventure rides and my first enduro race as well as the Erzberg prologue. I also had supermoto tyres for first supermoto trainings on a SM-race track. Many good memories. Great that you can still buy it.
Despite its flaws the stock carb is very forgiving when it comes to jetting it correctly. I know a lot of guys have trouble dialling in the FCR pumper carb as it needs to be a lot more precise with jetting.
I had DR650se with a lot of mods it was a great bike would like another one
I have a DRZ400E and a KTM 690 Enduro R.
I went to purchase a DR650, that had all the top quality options ( pumper carb, suspension, seat etc) and looked brand new.
I almost bought it first sight, knowing that i wouldnt find any better.
Then i took it for a test ride. Underwhelmed is an understatement. The seller noticed my reaction when i returned , as he commented that i didnt seem impressed with it.
The bike felt gutless, i told the owner that my DRZ felt like it out performed it easily.
I found it to be a real shame, as i thought a DR650 would suit me perfectly, i guess theyre named "PIG" for a reason.
The KTM however is an exceptional road bike and an exceptional dirt bike.
It's why I always suggest test rides if possible to see if you gel with the bike. My case? I bought a 690 years ago and hated it... sold it three months later. But I couldn't get a test ride to realise this would happen. 😢 Interesting you felt the DRZ would be quicker, the DR650 and DRZ have around the same maximum power and are pretty much neck and neck in a drag race. But the DRZ will certainly feel faster as it revs higher.
Love your no nonsense style. Shame there weren't more clips of the DR though.
Cheers Simon. The old bushpig features non-stop in pretty much all over our other vids.
Rode a DR650 for 4 years. modified the crap out of it. I ended up wanting more power on the road so went '16 690. Rode the 690 for 5 years. Never had any issues with it except the clutch basket needed to be replaced because it grooved out. Likely because I was lugging it around too much. The ergos on the 690 fit me better, and the added freeway speed was worth it. both bikes had to have the suspension done for my fat ass. seat height was lower (and thus better for me) on the DR. Both are great bikes. Both bikes want another gear, but the 5 speed DR wants it more.
I was always puzzled at the gearbox on my old 690. Very close ratio so despite six gears I found first too high and sixth too low. Lots of false neutrals too.
Having owned and sold a CRF250L, KLR 650, 1250 GS, and 690 enduro r with ownership ranging from one year to 8 years I have settled on and love my modded DR650 and I just splurged for a '23 890 R. It's a 2 bike stable for me, always. I feel these two bikes take me through the wide dual sporting-ADV-supermotoesq range in the best fashion for my taste. Of the previous bikes I by far put the most miles on the CRF and KLR. I got rid of the 690 the fastest. I was enamored with the miraculous ridability of the GS but it was little overbearing offroad for my 140 pounds and my wallet. If I was truly rubbing nickels together I would just own a DR650.
Good range of bikes there, AJ. So the 690 didn't really suit you?
@@crosstrainingadventure Again at 140 lbs I felt it was too powerful to keep planted without constant finesse of throttle and clutch... I was also learning to improve those skills as I subsequently still had to with the DR. This was a 2018 model without TC. The gear box felt like shit. It was too much animal for me at the time. The DR is more mellow but it's no slouch. I've totally corrected the ergos and controls and put an Adventure Spec mini fairing and IMS tank on her. Last will be suspension but it's been ok for me.
701 guy here. I use mine as an adventure bike mostly now and do big miles on the highway but I’m still good on trails. Reliability has been exceptional, I have 25,000 miles on it now.
Good to hear!
so 50 oil changes so far?
I'd be really curious to see how the 690/701 stacks up to the old XR650R. That bike does have the power of the austrian but also has low down grunt and reliability on par with the DR
That would be a great comparison for sure, Jacob. I've seen dyno charts that show the XR650R doesn't quite have the top end power of the 690, but those bikes were soooo rock solid. I'd buy one in a flash if Honda brought them back with a few mods.
I was the drongo on the 701 and had a ball playing around with Barry on the day.
I got to break my DR virginity and rode Barry's DR, I'm not going to lie I quite liked it.......... would I own a DR? I don't know but I'm definitely a sucker for the tyre shredding power of the 701.
Tyre shredding power of a 701? Or go next level with the swingarm bending power of the DR, Brenno? 😂 Great day out mate, can't wait for the next one.
I did this, 701 v 500 EXC on tarmac. 701 did it, but we needed to get to about 100kph before the 701 started opening the gap, both bikes were hooking power wheelies with about 20kg of kit on the back. Hitting the rev limiter on the 701 slows her right down. Childish fun. BTW, my 701 has been from the Arctic to the Sahara. Apart from fecked clutches, she's been grand.
Great to hear! I've often been tempted to adventurise a 500EXCF....
@@crosstrainingadventure the 701 does alright on single track. I'm a rider of distinctly average talent and I can get the 701 through most things. But it is a lump. My adventurised FE350 is a true go anywhere bike, even in my clumsy hands.
I rode very little on DR about 30 years ago so I can't really compare but I can say few things about 701 with mods :
1- ride on highways (and twisties) at a 130 kph whiteout a problem
2- the throttle response is very linear so there is no problem controlling the power
3- the factory suspension tuned is for fast off road trail. it's not so good at slow technical section.
4- brakes are precise and very strong. it's actually the best I've ridden ever.
One should be remembered that in addition to purchase cost of 701, the rider will invest between $1,000 and $2,000 on additions and improvements such as hand guards, pegs, mirrors and more...
The reason I sold mine was a throttle fault that the local dealer couldn't fix for 3 months.
For me the 701 and its capabilities are overkill.
As an adventure bike I’ve found the 701 to be Amazing. Added 1.5 gallon tank under the seat and a couple other adventure mods. Nothing Ive tried has a better balance of aggressive offroad capability and can still pull 85 mph highway comfortably. The 701 is the Backcountry Discovery Route unicorn.
The AJP PR7 is quite similar and has all the rally gear too but it just hasn't been as popular as expected.
The PR7 seems to check almost all the boxes. Light, powerful enough, good suspension, simple, limited electronic crap, field reparable, fewer proprietary parts. Why aren’t we all buying it? I feel like if any of the big brands made it, it would be immensely popular.
It's strange and I've mentioned it in a few vids. Are those of us wanting that sort of bike only a tiny part of the market? Do we think everyone wants that sort of bike, but in reality the majority don't? It would explain why bikes like the CCM450, Husqvarna TE610, TE630 and TR650 never really took off.
Don't know too much about the 701 - there aren't that many in NZ - The 690 however... well as the anecdote has it - it's great on Prom night but you can expect a messy divorce 18 months in...high maintenance (costs) and can fail in ways that you'd go to the moon and pay in fingers to avoid.
The initial price difference is just one factor, it's fairly common knowledge that dealers make most their profit on service and spares - in NZ these costs are jacked up further by the scarcity / prestige marketing BS. Anyone with a limited budget would be far better off spending some of that difference on off road training or just riding instead of doing the overtime to pay for it.
The DR has been around for donkeys years, there's a large 2nd hand and aftermarket spares available - possibly the largest of any bike out there.
Last but not least the simplicity of the DR - a competent home mechanic or anyone with an engineering background can do a major service in an hour or so. The bike encourages tweaking, fiddling and modification. Might not seem like a big deal, but out in the middle of a 200km trail simple reliability and familiarity with how the thing works is a big deal IMHO.
You have to love simplicity. Occasionally we get into some really remote areas and that's when I especially love the DR. Hardly anything ever goes wrong. And it's usually a really simple fix if it does.
Great video Barry! For budget minded individuals like ourselves you just can't beat the DR. Price tag on newer machines make us want to puke 🤮 Hope you're doing good and have a great weekend! *T4S*
The vs I was waiting for! I'll watch it carefully! Thanks dude!
Cheers Cristian!
Yo, Barry. It's been several years! I have 30,000 trouble free miles on my 2021 KTM 890ADV R. Never got heavy into very challenging dirt riding here in Baja, just lots of easy enough dirt roads. As I aim for my 76th birthday next month, I'm just too cautious to be dangerous anymore. Even a small, slow fall just takes a hell of a long time for the effects to go away. I really like the bike. Love all the modern electronics, but i find that I've settled into pretty much the same 2 modes - one for dirt and one for road. I love the power at speed on the highway, being able to pass any slow traffic at will, yet it has plenty of fork travel, and agility for the dirt and potholes that abound. But, I'm headed to the Holy Land in May and don't want to take this bike, due to its electrical and mechanical complexities, as well as its weight. So, coincidently with your video here, I've been looking into taking either a basically modded DR 650, pretty much as you've done, or the 701 Enduro. It seems that the 701 can be as reliable as DR, and I sure like the 6th gear, horsepower and slightly lighter weight of the 701, but I'm not totally at ease with the somewhat extra maintainance and possibility of reliability issues. So, seeing this video made me more aware of the nature of each bike. Thanks. It will be more difficult, I think, getting service. My mind says that I should get the DR, but my heart says the 701. I'll be trying to Ride them both while still in the States, but I think, for one of the few times in my life, i will listen to my more sensible side, and aim for the DR.
Glad to see that your back is pretty much healed up.
Ride 'til ya Rot!
Gabriel
Shalom Gabriel, good to hear you are still riding! A friend just bought an 890 so I got my first ride on one last weekend. I can see what you mean about the weight... but so relaxed on the road. So many pros and cons with the DR650 and 701. I suspect in the end only a decent test ride on each can really resolve it for some riders. As mentioned, when my 701 buddy swaps bikes he is always impressed with my DR650 and is half tempted to get one. But then other 701 owners have ridden it and hated it lol!
@@crosstrainingadventure Howzbout a DR with the 750 kit? Would reliability suffer?
Apparently not. The DR can very occasionally have a third gear failure and I guess the extra power would increase the chances slightly...
I have ridden a 690 KTM and found it light and agile, but I am still thoroughly enjoying the strong torque and comfort of your old FFRC DR that you developed in earlier videos. As with you, it suits me down to the ground. I have sold my 2013 BMW GS after buying this machine. Didn't need it after all.
Great to hear it's still plugging away. They did brilliant work on that suspension setup.
my long distance (mainly) sealed road adventurer is a KTM 790 Adventure S. My rougher, gnarlier adventure bike with more diversions into all sorts of terrain is my highly modded DR650 which is now 15 years old. The beauty of the DR is in doing the mods to it as you become aware you need to - it's a work in process, not just a case of signing a cheque or plonking down the card. I'll not part with mine.
Suspension - done, bigger exhaust and carb - done, any known possible weak links - again, done. The other benefit is in seeing the bike as a reliable old friend rather than just a purchase.
And interestingly, with my set of 17" wheels and tyres on it I can flat foot it and it makes an incredibly great commuter bike in the city and suburbs. Braided front line and road rubber bring it up to very decent stopping ability.
A reliable old friend definitely, Steve. I've been tempted to buy some motard wheels for the old bushpig too...
I was so close to buy a newer 701 then I came to my senses and got a used modified DR650. Glad I did. I got a bike that I can fix myself, mod myself and don't need a computer to decipher fault codes.
If you really want more than 60hp in a big single a 690/701 is the only option really. But if you are happy with similar midrange but only 40hp max then the DR650 is a lot cheaper, simpler and way less things to go wrong.
Mate, new subscriber. This channel is brilliant. Im 60 and just bought my 1st bike, Honda 300L, (dont hate me too much!) Gearing up for an across Asia, and hopefully around the world trip if the funds hold out!
I still haven't ridden one but keen to, Phil. Great bikes from what I hear! Guys in the USA are riding them across the country in all sorts of terrain... the usual Honda reliability. 😎
I added a DRZ400 SM USD front end, w/ triple clamps that bolted right on my DR650, and by using a standard DRZ400 21" front wheel with the big supermoto rotor the bikes suspension and brakes are fantastic. Even the DRZ400 digital dash was easily be added, the headlights and housings are the same. Makes you wonder why Suzuki cannot do this if an old timer like me can/
Sweet! Did you lose the steering lock in the process? Any changes to the suspension? I've heard the DRZ400SM suspension can be a bit harsh for offroad use but the extra weight of the DR650 would probably make it work well?
@@crosstrainingadventure Yes I did loose the steering lock, the extra tonnage of the DR and the ability to change the clicker’s balances out the front, a heavier rear spring and oil in the rear for now. Thank you.
I might keep an eye out for a DRZ front end in that case. I wouldn't mind losing the steering lock and losing a bit more weight.
@@crosstrainingadventure I believe it’s worth it, I was lucky to find a DRZ400sm blown up for $500 USD, I took the front end sold the wheels for $550. Best deal ever.
Sweet!
The big bore KTMs put an almost constant smile on my face. You have to test ride one even if they're not for you. They're a hoot.
Travelled Europe on the DR750 DRBig, five thousand miles, never skipped a beat.
Came home and beat dirt bikes in my local quarry on it.
Oh Man, the Legendary DR750 DR Big! It is a shame it was never imported to the US. That's a bike to have for sure!
I'd love to try the DR750 or DR800 one day. I often get tempted to fit the big bore kit...
my fav pic was parking it next to the exact copy 50cc version in Spain, same colour as well.
@@crosstrainingadventure Very tempting for sure!
@@chargeriderepeat7024 That would be awesome to see!
Subscribed man. I have a 2021 DR650 here in the states. It's been a learning adventure with this bike and your videos help alot.
Great to hear, Bill. The big plus with Suzuki barely changing anything on the DR is that all the info has been relevant from 1996 to today.
Aussie Aussie Aussie Oy Oy Oy! Congratulations HUNTER! Love your videos mate! Congratulations on life and show you have followed your passion.
Thanks for a great video! 1 other factor is availability; new DR650 & KLR650 are not available in EU because of euro norm 😞 I would like to use a XR/KLR/DR850 but had to settle for the 701. What I don't like about the 701 is the gearing; there's a reason there is a special aftermarket kit for sale... _____ PS did you read my 2nd response about the tablet in a previous video ??
Bummer, I didn't see your comment about the tablet. I read every comment usually, but after a few days UA-cam stops sending notifications about new comments on a video. 😢
I'm still puzzled that so many have complained the 690/701 gear ratios but they are still the same. I hope they got rid of the multiple false neutrals....
Love my XR for all the reasons you embrace the DR! Plus, I need to know I can wrench on my rides, no matter what the issue. Great vid!
I have experience with both bikes, as my riding buddies have DRs and 690s
The DRs Suspension in stock form and lightly tweaked is a horrible pogo stick. It quickly becomes uncontrolled, not only when riding quick but also when the terrain becomes more challenging. No feedback, harsh on hard hits and wallowy everywhere else. You never know whats going on and you end up constantly managing the suspension, trying to anticipate what it's going to do next. In my opinion the biggest downside of the bike. Reason enough for me to not own one.
Besides that its a fun, proper dual sport, that handles everything from commuting, twisties, traveling and off-roading.
The engine is thermally stable and does what you want it to do, unless you jump and the carb slide flies shut.
Its just an easy, un-neurotic bike.
The 690 is very different in its character.
The suspension can be harsh if not well serviced, but gives loads of feedback. You can push it and lean on the suspension and it works for you, you don't think about it. Its firm, but its your friend.
The engine is mighty powerful and extremly direct. You quickly find yourself blipping a single gob of 70hp-powerstroke in what sounds like a gunshot.
With the snorkle removed it has a very nice, linear power delivery.
You wheelie, you stoppie and become a rightout hooligan.
Until the rocker arm breaks, the engine oil needs topping up again and the suspension needs servicing.
But as long as the engine rattles like it has three bent valves you know, everything is as it should be.
If you know what to look out for, and accept that its a bit of a diva, you have the most capable dual-sport bike on the market today.
That beeing said, I myself ride a 93' XR 600R
More lightweight than both, better suspension than both, and tons of racing pedigree.
Commuting is its nemesis.
And stalling on a hillclimb.
Good summary! Yeah the stock DR650 is simply atrocious. But just throwing in Plex valves transforms the front. I find the rear is okay if I jack up the damping and preload to the max. I only feel its limitations when I start to push the bike hard in snotty terrain, which isn't that often nowadays. I might get the shock revalved at some point though when it needs servicing.
But the XR600 rules over all of course!
I owned a Doctor it's unforgettable. Try 690. Gravity center very low, I can compare with my drz e.
Thank you for great video!
I had a 2019 model 690 and before that I had a 2016 dr650, both very good bikes on their on way ,both were very reliable, the 690 truly felt more like a modern dual sport, the traction control was very helpful once you develop a relationship with it, Also the sitting position and ergonomics was much better on the 690,
We had always had traction control it's called smooth throttle control, braking and shifting. If you need electronic nanny's engaged then the machine is far to powerful for you.
@@leanlifter1 if I had a bike as light and powerful as a 690 I'd be happy to have traction control. Though I appreciate the simplicity of my dr
@@gabrieltiso8537 ABS and traction control are for posers and not for dirt bikes. ABS is bloody dangerous off road on a dirt bike. The 690 is a big fat pig that really can't do any real offroading. It's for people that have more money than skill and knowledge just like ABS and traction control on a dirt bike lol. 350lb is a terribly big and fat dirt bike just like a Big red pig fast in a straight line but not really a good dirt bike that can do it all like a light weight 450 that has even better power to weight ratio. The 690 is to much bike for anyone to handle when the going gets tough and fly by wire throttle, ABS and traction control do not belong on any real dirt bike. Electronic nannies are for minivans not hard core dirt bikes in the the dirt. The right hand is all the traction control you need and if you need help with that then you are not safe enough to enjoy the ride and the bike is just to much to Handel for the skill level.
All the big singles aren't much chop for true dirt riding. Probably the last 650 that was actually good was the Husaberg 650? I completely agree that ABS does not suit dirt bikes and it's much better to focus on proper riding skills. And in the past it was downright dangerous. Having said that, I'm okay with its use on adventure bikes for two reasons (but I still wouldn't want it on my bike lol). Accident stats are showing a lot of middle aged riders hurting themselves. They get back into riding after a few decades off, often buying bikes that are too big for their rusty skills. ABS will probably add a bit of safety on road and easy dirt roads. Two? ABS is way more refined now. My brother hates ABS too but he admits that all the multiple settings on his GS1200 work really well and he's actually started using it on dirt roads. Me? I prefer to keep my bikes really simple with minimal electronics.
@@crosstrainingadventure it's incredible the level of thought and detail you provide your audience. Can't thank channels like your's enough!
I've spent plenty of time on all the bikes in this category. IMO, the Suzuki 400 Supermoto is the best all-arounder for most people. Obviously needs different tires for off-roading. The downside is it's very expensive to hop up if you want serious power. For aggressive rides who aren't afraid of a little maintenance, the big Husky/KTM is the clear choice. No matter how much money you dump into one of the Japanese machines, it will never come close to a 701 with a few intelligent mods.
I did buy a DRZ400 where the owner had done quite a few mods... big bore kit, pumper carb, exhaust, hot cams etc. The funny thing is it didn't feel that much faster than a stock model. I'd be guessing a 10 to 15% increase for all that money?
Bought a low miles 17 dr650 on the cheap. Gold emulators installed with stiffer springs...had the seat widened. Have a Pro Cycle carb jet kit on the way and a 5.3 tank. I'm an old and slow Harley rider... suits me just fine lol...oh and a Rallz is going on the back next week.
Interesting... was that a custom seat job, Sheldon? I went to an upholsterer to get the same thing done but it mainly made it higher and barely any wider lol. Still a big improvement and only $100 so I didn't complain.
@@crosstrainingadventure yes the custom car upholstery guy glued up "wings" to make it a saddle. Google maps. Rainbow Auto Glass here in Bancroft Ontario for a pic and review. Any good guy can do one. This one was 175.00.
He used the original seat pan and foam. No extra hight. I found the extra width is the key to a better seat.
Nice build! You are going to love the RallZ on the back! They really hook up well!
Sweet! The Rallz just arrived yesterday... can't wait.
Just got a 701 loaded with all the extras for not much more than the price being asked for a DR400/650s here in NZ. I know I only need CRF250/300 DR400 power but then would have to spend money on suspension and the other stuff.
Damn, sounds like good value
I have a 2008 DR and the only mod I have done is put a Dominator muffler on it and this improved acceleration response quite a bit. It’s a great bike for a rally around the bush tracks, but a bit heavy when it gets tight.
Did you rejet to suit the exhaust too, Scott? Makes quite a difference as otherwise it runs too lean. Apart from the free mods, I reckon the next bang-for-buck mod is a set of Plex Valves dropped into the forks.
@@crosstrainingadventure no I haven’t yet. That’s the next project.
I'd like to see an XR 600 or 650R thrown into the mix too. I always wonder if I should jump at the chance to buy one, should it pop up.
Thats the older 701. 2020+ with stock quick shifter really moves out. And the dual map, for street and off road, TC works great!
Honda has price, parts availability and reliability, the 701 has everything else... Plus the 701 is a super capable road bike as well. I bought the SM for daily commute and track riding and after 18 months I have no complaints (so far, lol).
Honda? Are you thinking of the XR650L? I wish we could still get those in Australia.
Apologies for the of topic question, have you had any experience with the BMW F650gs Dakar ?
Never ridden one.
As I get a little older and wiser I'm learning that it's all about logistics with these bikes. Any KTM or Husky runs on the hopes and dreams that it won't have a problem, because it'll clear out your wallet if you do. Thing is ... they always have problems, it's what separates them from the Japanese bikes. Of course the Japanese bikes can have problems too, but so much less frequently and they'll be fixed so much faster and cheaper too. I've seen many a Honda keep plodding along while it's KTM owner went to the shop for the 3rd time that year. That kind of reliability is invaluable.
It's a good point. Another viewer pointed out they'll have the occasional hiccup with a DR but it's easily fixable. But the KTM? Usually your arranging transport back home.
dr not available in EU and 690/701 not suited for beginner, have t700, but would really like something with dr weight and some 50hp
I have, Suzuki Freewind XF 650 -2001/Husqvarna 701-2022
Good motorcycles !!
You can go everywhere a 690 and 701 will on a DR650, that’s a fact. You could actually get away with just suspension, a seat and a front braided brake line with a DR and still have a ball touring or on tight trails.
Great to see the mighty DR can still hang with the 701!
Staying under 80kmh on dirt roads with equal riders? Probably! All that extra hp just goes into wheelspin of course. But faster than that the 701 will pull away fast lol.
Excellent bush pig overview vs. 701 with great clickbait title. Still riding my mini Suzuki bush pig (350) but eventually one day will probably switch over to the 650.
I knew someone would comment on the title as clickbait. 😁 I normally avoid that but I did actually think it was a great way to show the different nature of these beasts... Great to hear your DR350 is still going strong!
This is the video we’ve all been waiting for! I understand that the 690/701 has undergone a significant update since you owned one. Did you find it better than before, even if it’s still not to your liking?
Still didn't like it, Christiaan. They do run smoother at low revs than the early 690s though. But I still didn't like the harsh suspension, weird ergos, snappy throttle response and lack of stability at speed.
Suzuki 🥳 Husqvarna 🧐
Husqvarna 701-2022 !! Superior !! ⚙️🕹️🎚️🚀
Suzuki Freewind 😁2001 !! 🇯🇵🦬🚜🏕️🛖🗾
@@crosstrainingadventure did you try all 3 modes on the 701?
Currently own a 2018 690 and its...just okay. Started with dr650, then f800gs, then drz400. Now I miss my DR. Doubt I'll drop the ktm but I do miss the ergonomics of the 650.
Surely there's a fuelling dongle or ECU controller with MAP selection for the 690/701, whereby you can tone-down throttle response in the loose stuff??
There is some adjustment but there's also the fact it's fuel injected. Some guys fit a G2 throttle tamer to get rid of that snappiness and have a more carb-like throttle. Each to their own of course.
Using nannies to make a bike run better for you is not really doing much but hiding the fact that there is just to much power on tap for you to effectively use. Driving a slower machine faster is better fun than using nannies on a to powerful of a machine for the riding you are doing to limit what you will never be able to use anyways lol. These new 100HP extremely top and bottom heavy tanks with fuel injected, ABS equipped machines are not even made for the off road. Lol.
Totally with you on that one. I must admit that everyone I've met who bought a 690 or 701 have nowhere near the skill to properly use the power. And they'll admit it, but they just love spinning that wheel and spraying gravel on straight flat dirt roads lol. There was one exception though. A very talented guy who had the bike sideways or up on the rear wheel most of the time. He had a ball with all that horsepower.
@@crosstrainingadventure I would just get a CR500AF for a crazy and real dirt bike. 70hp and 60Ft/lbs of TQ in a cr 250 frame 220lb bike cannot be dominated and it's very old and better "Teck" than today. You know how to ride and endure the fall but I will not recommend just anyone to try and ride these over powered machines they accelerate so hard that it would put a new perspective on life for many people and push most people body's way past their limits and g forces. Even for allot of highly talented and crazy riders the CR500AF is plenty of bike for them and no need for gimmicks like ABS or "wireless throttle" lol.
DR is a beautiful classic that for me will always be a motorcycle that meets my expectations 😮
I love my 701 but definitely see a Dr as a great option!
Great to still have these choices in some countries, David! It's getting very restricted in Australia now due to emission laws etc. The big singles now are just the 690/701, the rare AJP PR7 and the increasingly heavy KLR650.
As a long-term DR owner, I’ve continued to tweak things along the way and still love the old girl. But I’ve never even touched the suspension. Interesting in your comments that you’ve just changed to have Plex valves? Can you tell me a bit more about what you did and where you got them? Thanks Chris.
See our pinned first comment in our DR650 best suspension upgrade ever vid, Chris.
Hi mate, I’m a DR rider not a tech Guru. So when you start talking about things being pinned into previous videos, I have no idea how to find that. Hopefully you can help.
You look up the video. The look at the very first viewer comment. 'Pinned' just means it stays at the top so it's a good place to put further notes.
The Dr is my first bike. It's fantastic. Will last forever. Is half the price. More power would be nice but, I could also use alot more skill!
I'M always amazed at everyone getting these expensive bikes,huskys,t7's,bmw's etc that have large amounts of power,but really you dont need it.I bought a klr650 changed a few things its all need for touring,touring is about seeing our vast country and not doing 190km's hr to get there.
I'm with you, Andrew. Lately I've been riding with a guy on a KLR650 and whenever he hits the throttle I can't keep up with him... hanging out the rear on corners, jumps, wheelies. A good rider can do amazing things with less than 40hp.
@@crosstrainingadventure As long as that 40hp has the down low and mid range Tourqe then it will be very very effective at moving across rough terrain ya. 40hp at 10,000rpm with no TQ down low is a nightmare unless you are 14 years old and still like to ride like a bat outta hell idiot everywhere all the time lol. HP means nothing without the TQ to back it up and smooth out the hit.
I prefer the more reliable bike and the one with shorter seat height. My riding style is conservative, so not into racing. Much prefer a bike akin to the proverbial tortoise 🐢 rather than the hare 🐰, so hope to one day get a dr650
Except we can’t buy the DR650 new anymore. The other consideration is reliability. Suzuki has a better reputation.
Such a shame hey Simon? All they had to do was fit ABS.... we could always bin it to reduce the weight. Kawasaki managed to add ABS and keep the KLR650 alive here. But it now weighs as much as a T7 lol.
@@crosstrainingadventureyes ABS can be life saving technology. They could have also switched to EFI but clearly some boring crunched the numbers and decided on a hard No. RIP DR big-bore. You will be missed by the faithful.
Honda's CEO admitted that the company had lost its mojo and promised to get it back. It's a shame this hasn't occurred in the adventure and enduro motorbike section. Suzuki is probably worse. 😒
The real downside of the 701 is the lack of a real WR gearbox. A note on the weight comparison: Some judicious choices allow you to cut nearly 20 pounds. Ditching the lead-acid battery, fender extension, OEM mirrors, passenger pegs, grab handles, stock airbox, and [the big win] the catalyst/muffler cuts a lot of bulk. If you can resist adding a bunch of shit back, you get a much lighter bike and a bit more HP.
So many complaints about those gear ratios over the years and it's still the same, sigh. Good tips on the weight reduction!
Have ridden a 690 and am the owner of a DR. The KTM is lightyears ahead of the DR with regard to performance but at the cost of long term reliability. The thing about the DR is that there is huge potential for increasing power and torque where the 690 is fairly maxed out, out-of-the-box. My DR has a 790 kit, big valves, 42mm pumper carb and large exhaust. I think you would be hard pressed squeezing more power out of it but the 690 is still faster on the pavement. But the low-end of the big bore DR is lustful and more useable and a hell of a lot easier to work on.
100% agree. The 701 rider in the vid still enjoys swapping bikes when we ride. He said the 650 just feels more stable, predictable and takes less energy to ride.
Do you find any reliability or over-heating issues with the 790 kit?[ Still good for lugging around in 1st and or vibration at 80mph on open highway? I'm very interested in that series of engine modifications for the DR. Thanks.
@@bikerabbi It was not at all what I expected, all the needles were pointing in the opposite direction after all those mods. No increase in heat which actually is lower then I like with the DR in Supermoto trim. With the tire hugging fenders it runs around 150F oil temp on the output side of the cooler but runs about 30 degrees hotter with the off-road fender. Before I switched to reserve at around 175 miles with a 5.3 gallon Acerbis tank. Now I switch to reserve at 190 miles go figure? That's with 16/40 gearing which the 790 easily pulls and cruises at 90 mph. No increase in vibes as the CP 790 piston is only 1 gram heavier than the stock slug. Makes the DR a hoot to ride! 😃 No downsides from what I've experienced other than the drain to your bank account 😕
I have a 2020 KTM690 Enduro R and have had two XR650R’s, the low end is similar but the KTM quickly out performs the XR’s. But, in my opinion the XR’s are bulletproof, no computers, no map settings, and depending on state..no smog stuff. There’s also the price factor, 13,500 for the KTM or 3500.00 (used) for the XR?? I ride with four guys, one has a XR650R, three of us have 690’s and one KTM890, we have a neighbor who has a 2013 DR650 who comes along on some of the rides. Through canyons or long grades the DR falls back but not much, it’s capable and far less expensive to work on, all the bikes in the group are solid and really the only noticeable differences are off-road capability, the XR is every bit as fast as the KTMs there, the long grades though definitely separate the bikes quickly. I have no problem with any of them and am glad to be able to ride.
It's a real shame Honda doesn't bring back the XR650R and upgrade it, Rakkasan. With fuel injection and a few tweaks it would match the 690 for top end as well.
I have a DR, 701, 350exc and 500exc. The DR and 701 are going to be sold. Keeping the 500 for ADV and DS riding. I have loved all the bikes and put many miles on each but the weight of the 701 and DR have made me realize I prefer light weight bikes. I have a hard time recovering the DR / 701 from a tip over situations. Most the time I have to let them down as gently as possible and then pick up with whole body. The 500 I can usually just hold it up and get back to the balance point. They all have their good and bad points.
I know what you mean. Our adventure ride got pretty gnarly today and I found myself wishing I was on an adventurized big bore dirt bike lol.
Both bikes are quite capable offroad but 690/701 adds more smiles per mile :) Both are not really suitable for all-day-long highway riding because of a thumper buzz so riding to and from offroad sections could be exhausting. Now I own a DR with modded suspension and a big tank but dreaming about 2-cyl machine every time I hit a pavement. Unfortunately there is no dual sport 2-cyl ~600cc bike within 165 kg on the market.
It's a real shame nobody wants to make a light twin adv bike, Alex.
I went the middle ground and grabbed a SWM650 RSR. Lighter than both, cheaper than both, nice usable power, lots of after market accessories (same as a Husky TE630). Haters may try the 'Chinese made' route but most of the big four now make all there cheaper bikes in China or Taiwan and KTM are firmly embedded with Chinese manufacturing (CF Moto).
A real shame these were discontinued. I loved my old TE610 which was even lighter. The Superdual was next and started to get very obese and then they discontinued that. 😢
The 701 scares me with reliability - clutch slaves randomly blowing up on trails etc. I love my DR but the 701 lightness and cool looks are tempting
For day rides on popular routes I figure it's not quite as important, Brent. E.g. you haven't gone far from base so transport for a busted bike isn't so hard. But riding in remote areas and/or multi day rides? The DR gets more tempting for the less mechanically inclined!
I ride a ktm 690smcr. If I was going to start off road I think the husky would be my choice, but I am not sure I would go for such a big engine. My SMCR has crazy amounts of power and will wheelie easy in 3rd on the road, I can’t imagine wanting that much power on dirt
I'm sure a really skilled rider could use all the power on faster tracks. But for us average muppets? Way too much lol. It's what I like about the DR650, the 40hp is generally all you need on dirt roads.
Man, It'd be cool to see the 701 vs a Hasaberg 570...please...
Interesting! On a dirt road the much lighter 570 would shoot ahead initially I reckon. The 701 probably has an extra 10hp so would eventually overtake on dirt or sealed road?
I ended up with the klr. I almost bought the dr. My buddy bought the ktm1200 and had so many problems with his it was gone before the end of the first summer. All the break downs were super expensive to repair.. The cost of the parts was sickening. He bought a honda, then traded it for the dr. That was almost 20 years ago, we both have these big slow boring reliable bicks still.
You can have a lot of fun with slow reliable bricks, that's for sure. 😎
I have a Duke 690R my brother has a DR650, (I use to own a RD650 too with the plex valves, jetted tuned and exhaust) we've done a few drag races pretty much the same different in speed.
Almost the same power delivery until around 5k where the Duke 690R just leaves it behind. Similar size engine, similar torque, similar weight although the DR650 will drop off torque as the revs increase making a modest 40-45hp but the KTM will keep pulling up to the rev limiter making 73hp and a Manic
One thing the DR650 does better is low rpm pulls and will just tractor up anything between 2-3,000rpm The KTM hates being under 3,000rpm even when cruising
Definitely completely different styles of engine, Andrew. Many of us would love to see Honda bring back a revised XR650R. I reckon it would be the perfect compromise. The same grunt of the DR but close to the Kato in terms of outright power. And reliable as a brick.
Do you have a video with what you have done to your DR?
Most of it detailed in the 10 part series.
have 690 and suspension on comfort settings is still beating me up, even on small bumps
Strange, I figured they would have softened it up a little by now. I had one of the early models and it was brutal!
@@crosstrainingadventure a suspension service helped a lot on a friends 690
brought it from harsh to firm
felt direct and gave a lot of feedback without beeing crashy
@@crosstrainingadventure I guess I should have mentioned it is 2011 model :)
Drz 400 for me I had a 690 sold it same as you
Interesting, Eric! What didn't you like about your 690? I had a pretty long list in my case. ua-cam.com/video/z_MdmqNQslw/v-deo.html
If the DR 650had 6 gears I'd still own one ,the suspension can be sorted and seat replaced with something kinder to the huskier riders butt (100kg+)gearing it down for an off-road 1st gear means losing too much top end speed for the highway.
A sixth gear would be great, Paul! But I suspect it would also mean they couldn't sell it in countries where it's under a 'grandfather clause'. 😢
@@crosstrainingadventure yes,they just banned non ABS equipped bikes here in NZ just a thoughtless bureaucratic decision not based on any reasonable accident data DR 650 riders are mainly mature riders who know the bikes limits and ride accordingly (DRZ400 riders not so much) the rock solid reliability can't be beat for peace of mind.
The Nova transmission gear replacement sounds like what you would be after.
@@tarjas it would be , but once you start adding up the price of all the improvements you may as well buy a KTM 690 then everything is done
@@pauldavidson6321 I think reliability, toughness (“little to break when dropped), and ease of maintenance/repair ability more than even it out in the long run. That first radiator replacement after a long walk home….at least when you wreck a lot like me.
Something u didn't mention was road ability, commuting etc. here the 650 takes the prize with comfort, reliability, carrying ability and ease of maintenance, not to mention parts availability. I think I would prefer the 650 for loaded up touring.
U can drop another 3kg from the 650 with exhaust replacement and end up with a bike barely heavier than a CRF300L with twice the torque.
Yes we did a video about weight reduction in our DR650 project series. Lots of free or cheap ways to put the bush pig on a diet!
I had a 690 for a year. While i enjoyed the top end power, the engine was so unhappy below 4500rpm it felt like it wanted to kill itself. You had to stay a gear lower and/or slip the clutch in the slow stuff. Plus the horrible steering radius. Much happier on my drz400!
One of the things I hated about mine and sold it within three months.The cure back then was spending a few thousand on a remapped ECU and an Akro exhaust. And I'd already spent so much on the bike. Apparently they did fix this eventually. the 701 in this vid ran fine at low revs completely stock.
Its unfortunate to be forced to spend an extra couple thousands just to have a bike that runs like it should. Even more insulting when the bike is "premium". Oh well. Good to hear the newer ones run better at least, also no more rocker arms as maintenance items.
So all that you have done is plex valves in the forks ?? Now about the shock ?
Just went max on the preload and damping. I don't ride that aggressively nowadays and it works fine most of the time. I must admit though if I start to push it hard in rough terrain you hit its limitations fast lol. I will get it revalved (and probably a stiffer spring) when I get the shock serviced soon.
I'm like you when it comes to riding style Barry I mostly like to plug along and watch the scenery Flow by on the DR650 too much on the line these days to get all busted up dependant over the thrill rides although that's what I've spent the last half a century doing usually twisting WOT on an XR 650 r ..see how fast she goes before she blows that kind of riding 😁😎 I better slow er down while I'm ahead though
Bet you loved the XR650R. Never had the chance to ride one...
@@crosstrainingadventure you bet Barry 😎👍
You are so lucky that you could still buy the DR650. It's not available in Europe for 15 years or so. I would defo get one for that price if available. I love big thumpers
A real shame. The USA is quite lucky they still have all three Japanese thumpers available at the moment... the XR650L, DR650 and KLR650.
hello , well i have spent time on the bush pig and i found soft suspension, heavy , and lack of power , 17" rear wheel ,as stock bike , but still a good bike ,well over due for a upgrade as i now own a 2022 ktm690enduro r , its light , power full , good suspension , good balanced bike , and with the added safety of traction control and ABS . 6 speed ,quickshifter ,and 4 x ride modes so you can dial it in to suit you and your riding , but in the end get out the a ride !! enjoy . Steve/Geraldton
It's great we've got these options in terms of price, reliability and performance! And we all look for different things. I'm always surprised when the 701 owner is actually keen to ride my DR650 and talks about all the things he likes about it lol. I'm always expecting him to hate it! Mind you, he probably WOULD hate a stock one.
Where in Oz this? I’m from the NE US and would love to do do a dual sport vacation in Australia. At least part of the time, I’m actually more interested in riding a bicycle around your awesome country? Adelaide?
Our footage is from all over the eastern coast. The most varied riding is probably south down in Victoria. Cycling? I'd definitely focus on doing it in our winter, especially as you head further north! Dual sport riding? Heaps of good GPS files on Trans Australia Trails for all over the country.
Can you do a review of the husaberg fe650?
If someone buys me one or at least lends me one for the day, Andre.... sure! 😎
I have ridden the DRZ 400 and was very unimpressed with the power and weight compared to my FE250 or my KTM 450exc.
And so you should be. 😊 There's no real comparison between a dual sport bike and proper enduro bikes. A bit like a sports car owner not liking a family car.
Sometimes I feel like I want a bit more power out of my DR but then I think about it logically and realize I can lose my license on every single road in Canada with it , so I dont really need to go any faster than that . And on the gravel roads I dont think I'd want to do more than 100mph anyways.
Have you done the derestriction mods, Chex? If find that's more than enough to give the DR a solid meaty midrange.
@Cross Training Adventure Yes sir , I started with that, then my buddy did the same with his Pig. So naturally I had to one up him and put a TM40 pumper carb on it. He's jealous of my 3rd gear wheelies now lol
Having ridden a 690 and it will beat my big valve DR-790 in a heartbeat. Would I trade? NO WAY!
Yep. Horses for courses.
Brilliant comparison 🙌! Bush Pig squeal of approval 🐷.
The Cost difference is the biggest factor #1,, I'm older and would likely hurt my quicker on the Husky #2.
Although the DR still has the carby,, I'd have to lean (no pun intended) for the Bush 🐷.
Cheers 🍻, G.
In beautiful Boulder City Nv. USA 🇺🇲
Nevada! Amazing scenery, Gabriel. Riding there one day is on the bucket list...
@@crosstrainingadventure The Nevada BDR (BackroadDiscoveryRoute) would be perfect. It traverses the State North to South. Mostly offroad 2 tracks. ✌️🍻