I raced on my full suss for two seasons but then switched back to a hardtail and my season results were much better over very similar terrain. Same brand of bike and both XC bikes.
Could you do a test whats quicker....a xc bike with enduro wheels+tyres or an enduro bike with xc wheels+tyres? Might make a good video and intrested to find out!
Both are right, it all comes down to how the carbon is weaved and constructed. Generally for MTB carbon is stiffer and for road bikes are more flexible.
@@wrthndr69 1 kilo lighter doesn't make or break it, the frame is arguably less rigid, and the climbing is arguably almost identical when you lockout rear suspension
Just bought myself a hardtail Cube Elite C:62, 9,8kg without pedals and is a game changer versus previous bike Trek x-caliber 8 which has 14kg. Hope that one day I'll treat myself with a fully carbon🤘🏻
Hi, I would like to ask, I also had an x caliber 8 and I changed it to a carbon bike (bh ultimate) did you feel a change in comfort on the carbon bike? When I went on the trek I felt great... when on carbon I feel my back a lot after the ride days off..
Many wealthy men in my area are buying full suspensions. The only problem is that the terrain in general cannot justify the full sus, especially if they have trail full sus. and not a dedicated XC racing full sus. with short suspension. That means that they have to modify the trails and build a lot of artificial obstacles on them to justify their investment. The weather in Denmark is often wet and muddy, which lends itself to a hardtail. The season on a full sus. is thus shorter than a hardtail that works all year round without worrying about the pivot joints. I've tried riding a fully for some seasons only to realize that the descends become almost too easy and not as engaging. The climbs almost always suffer, unless you have the raciest fully. So my suggestion to upcoming buyers would be to buy a bike that suits your local terrain.
on the right course, absolutely love my hardtail. I also learned on the hardtail, finally got a full sus this year and was slower at first on several trails. finally pushing it to where I'm faster on the full sus on the rougher trails but I wouldn't take for granted what I learned (and continue to learn) on the hardtail.
For me the way to go is Hardtail Bike. Mine is the Canyon Exceed CF5. Already driven full suspension but now for me i think the full suspensiom bikes feels a litte bit loose due to the amount of movement that the bike do. I prefer Hardtail🙌
I have a Santa Cruz Highball , put a dropper on her , 180 front rotor and she’s in beast mode ! I also have a Hightower.. that gets ridden when I wanna get rowdy . But if I had to sell one , it would be the full suspension. I ride my XC bike 80% ..
I changed from an alu ht to a carbon ht and the difference is huge, especially on longer rides. Not wanting to invest in a full sus I went tubeless which takes off the hardness of the ride. But the best investment was the dropper. HT's are getting a more and more aggressive seating position it becomes scary for amateurs in downhill sections, that dropper is a life saver. So I ended up with an almost as soft ride as a full sus but without the weight of it. Love it.
the best advice I ever had on Full vs Hardtail was this - quote: " just get a bike that suits your local terrain. if it's mostly flat you'll regret buing a full sus. when you got some hills and i mean HILLS than get full. you'll not regret.
I can answer this question even before watching this, neither..... because it depends on the trails, situation, personal choice, and most of all What you enjoy.
At the moment, my only MTB is Giant Talon 2 (2017). It's my workhorse, so to speak. Very utilitarian MTB, indeed! With its existing 2x9 drivetrain, I intend to upgrade it to a 2x10 system with a rear derailleur that has a clutch. I also intend to replace the coil-spring fork with an air fork. Plus, I want to edit the seat post with a dropper one. Lots'a love, cheers, & Mabuhay, from tropical Philippines! #KeepBiking
That's exactly what I did with my Talon minus the dropper. I went with Deore 2x10 with a clutch and a Raidon fork among many other mods. The fork completely changed the bike! The only thing I didn't change was the seat lol
I used to ride XC hardtails since I began with cycling, which I consider to be 9 years ago when I was 11 (I learnt how to ride a bike when I was a little kid, this was about the time I started to ride more regularly and race). I wanted to switch to a fully already for the 2020 season, but the pandemic's start meant I couldn't get it for a price I could afford and therefore stayed with hardtails for another two years. I already have a good skillset as I can ride with exception for big jumps and drops (mostly because of worries about the bike) pretty much any enduro trail nearby with 100 mm of front travel and high seat. However, this year I'm convinced to finally get myself a full sus and if I don't find one for a good price, I'd stick with just road, gravel and cyclocross for a year. Hardtails are fun, but after nearly on decades only on them they start to get a bit boring. And as I found, in most XC races at least here in the Czech Republic full suspension bikes are just quicker and at the races where hardtails are quicker, they are quicker just by a tiny bit.
"Ooh my eyes are watering, it was emotional that!" Yes it was Rich, yes it was. I have my 2013 Giant Anthem X29er dual suspension and my Trek Marlin 7 Hard tail (5 weeks old and loving it. ) Both are extremely good bikes but as I have been riding much harder, I have actually found the limits of the Anthem and its older technology. It's still very capable but as there's no clutch on the 3 by 10 gears, I have had the chain come off and go in under the rear pivot between the crank housing a few times when the full suspension has bottomed out. The more modern clutch system on the Marlin and the fact it's a hard tail, I haven't got the same problem. But my experience with hard tails vs dual suspension is if you want a plush cushy ride then you will never beat dual suspension but if you want to power up steep smooth hills, you will definitely get the power down with the hard tail.
I went from a 19 Marlin 7 (3X9) to a leftover 19 (bought in 20) Canyon Neuron AL 7.0 SL. Even though it’s apples to oranges or cross country to trail, I love them both. The Marlin climbs much easier, but I can bomb the down hills on the Canyon. I need to go to one of my trails, and time a lap on each bike.
Great video. I'm a roadie and I've just bought my first hard tail (Kona Honzo) this winter and I'm both excited and slightly terrified about learning new skills but I have to admit, XC riding is SO much fun. Huge difference going from a road bike that weighs 7.4kg all in (minus bidons) to, uh, don't even know what this beast weights but it rolls like a tank over everything! Interesting your comment on a dropper post. I've never had one before but I'm loving the ability to change riding position dynamically through a ride. I've ridden my gravel bike on single track before and nearly been bucked off. Drop that saddle and I feel centered. Again, i'm just a total noob though.
Honzo is a great bike. Just rode one the other day. Riding road, you may fancy light carbon xc. Accelerates like road and can handle most single tracks and fun trail. Personally I feel people get really caught up in these super slacked out monster truck bikes. Don't get me wrong, there is a place for 140/150mm travel and 64° head tube angles but it's overkill and extra work for the majority of trails. I moved to a fairly flat area and people are riding f.s. enduro and even seen a few downhill bikes. 😆 They will be for sale in a couple weeks.
My Type of Riding is Light Trail and Long Rides. Type of bike i need 1) Light and Simple, with Less Maintenance 2) Cheaper so Hardtail XC Suites me Better.
Thanks for the vid Rich. It will be full sus for me for the marathon races I plan to do. Over a 6hr race the comfort will even be quicker. The track looked nice. I wonder how much the difference on the roots would be between a 29er hardtail and a 26 inch
I think it all comes down to the kind of riding you do, so the terrain picks the type of bike for you really. I've ridden hard tails since the 90's, and only got my first full suss bike just over a year ago. The full suss is an incredibly capable bike, especially heading downhill, but for me and the type of riding I do then a hard tail wins still. Having both though allows me to cover all bases 🙂🙂 My hard tail is a 2019 Whyte 905, and it is a very capable and fun bike, even when charging downhill at Flyup 417!!
I have an old HT and did a 100 mile race last week on a fairly technical course. It beat me up pretty badly, honestly. But, I still love the efficiency and am thinking of replacing it with another HT, maybe just a slacker head tube angle. Maybe I'm crazy, but the weight and moving parts/complexity of an fs don't get me excited!
I went for a hardtail only because I couldn't afford the FS, I don't see why would anyone choose the hardtail over the FS other than financial reasons.
XC hardtail with a Redshift suspension post works great so I can pedal over more of the rough and save energy like a full sus, but it's cheaper, lighter and no extra maintenance.
@@TheeJohnWayne I'm not convinced they're needed for XC. I've always ridden XC bikes and a modern 29er feels good going downhill on typical red runs at trail centres, and certainly not needed for the countryside where I do the majority of my riding. I've been on a few demo days and tried trail bikes with droppers but prefer the forward position an XC bike puts you in - easier to keep the front weighted for grip and much sharper handling. Agree this has it's limitations though, and there's a point when a trail bike and dropper becomes the better setup.
@@steveco1800 Sorry, I forgot to state that I have a entry level hardtail trail bike that already has a dropperpost. I do love the Redshift products. I have the stempost and seatpost suspension installed on my casual e-roadbike, which is amazing btw :) I rly hoped to be able to attach the Redshift to my dropperpost on MTB so I don't always have to stand slightly for those small bumps lol
There are lockouts on XC FS bikes for a reason lol. Locked for climbing and open for going down best of both worlds lol. I laugh at people that say hardtail is faster when descending.
Used to live in a place where a FS was a must. Most of the xc races required fs. Then I moved to a place where all the tracks are quickest ridden with a HT. I’ve since switched to a HT. That said my next mtb will be a FS again, due to the forgiveness, comfort, and versatility.
I’m not sure heart rate is an indication of consistent effort. Maybe next time use watts? 🤔 If both efforts are the same average watts over the same course and one bike is quicker in time, that would be the more efficient bike (for that course)…. Maybe? I’m not sure 🤔 But I think average watts would be better than heart rate 🤷♂️
I know that full squish is more capable going downhill. However, any full squish i've ever ridden (around town as well as up the hill...) has paled when compared to the brutal FORWARDS you get from a hardtail with a stiff frame and click pedals... Yeez i need my drag racing pulls, that direct response. Any full squish i tried that with just went "you wanted to change speed, really? I don't think so." Dear lord do i love the brutal feeling when going full send on the checkered pig.
Sorry for the potentially dumb question, but I'm new to mtb. Could you just lock the rear shock and effectively convert it into a hardtail when desired?
I hate when you only compare just a single time between the two. This needs to be done on multiple times on different days to be a bit more conclusive. But, honestly it all just depends on the rider.
Seriously, Hardtails are NOT just about these crazy XC race bikes. Who actually even races XC these days?? Modern geo Hardtails are mentally good and all about the fun !!! Give Blake a modern geo 29” Trail HT. He’ll rip it !!! That would be a genuine test on an all round test.
It depends on what purpose we are using for If you are more on the road or clean offroad Hardtail is the best But if you are more on the offroad full with bump Full suspension is the best Not going to argue that hardtail is lighter than full suspension Not going to argue also that full suspension is higher in maintenance than hardtail Last but not least I need an answer Which one is more stable when taking a corner?
I’ve had hard tail bikes and now I ride an old 2016 trance 2 but maybe I could up grade the dual front cogs to a single and the rear rim and maybe change the front fork but I may have to sell it now that I have problems breathing having had the virus 🦠 so that’s that . Speed depending on how hard you ride and how steep the hill is now no longer a thing for me but full suspension is more comfortable and maybe an e bike before the wheel chair? Copd is no joke. Covid is no joke three months on oxygen and watching these videos is a memory of what was able to do ! Be careful with your lungs .
I have a question. What sort of MTB bike should I get. I'm in new Zealand and I'm wanting to do some of the trails that take 3 days. Around 30 km a day rides on gravel/off road. Nothing to Intense terian wise...
Hey! We would still recommend a hardtail for beginner XC riders. It helps develop better control and body position. However, the differences aren't as noticeable, for example, a hardtail to an enduro or downhill bike. 👍
What bike should I buy if I want the best alloy hardtail trail bike? I'm thinking I want the best alloy bike instead of one the cheapest carbon bikes. Maybe Trek Roscoe 9, Merida big trail 600, or Canyon stoic 4? Nukeproof scout 290 pro also looks really incredible but is expensive. I have also been thinking about Orbea. Any inputs? 😊
How do I enable an aggressive lower xc position on a mid range hardtail? Go down a bit in framesize and raise the saddle? Or invest in steeper negative and longer stem? I wanna be able to keep up with my gravel friends and won't ride much gnarly rough trails but rather fast and long..
Hi I will go to Jersey for two weeks in july and would have loved to see the "An Epic Ride Around Jersey In One Day" video once more. But I can not find it anymore. Where can I find it?
Thank you for an awesome channel! I have a request for you! Could you please review a few bikes for flatter terrain? I am not thinking of xc since I am looking for something that is more lively and fun than xc, but not as heavy or inefficient as some trail bikes. Many reviews if trail bikes mostly cover cool descends, but where i live the terrain is mostly flat with short ascends and descends. It is also a lot of roots, stones and gnarly terrain so the bike must be somewhat capable, but still efficient to build up speed. My own analysis would be that a lighter down country bike would suit quite well but I would go for a little bit longer travel e.g. 130 in front and 120 in the back. Couldn’t you please do a video that covers bikes for this purpose? Thank you 🙏🏻
An XC HT like a Spot Rocker would have been a nice 3rd bike for this comparison. As it has even more modern geon than the Canyon HT and it can take a 120mm of travel too. Plus, it's light enough with even 27.5x3.0 tires.
I’m trying to decide between V Spot Rocker vs Orbea OIZ M30 100mm front & rear for XC racing in central Mexico. Mostly gravel but after a long ride, even on a FS bike, my butt is sore
@@mellissanash7517 Trust me, I’ve watched them all. lol. I’m not a huge fan of matte paint but in terms of build it checks off all the boxes. I’m comparing it to the more expensive Trek Procaliber 9.7.
@@mellissanash7517 My concern are my knees though. Your legs are your suspension on a hard tail. Where I currently live, I can’t just go that ride new bikes. I have to wait until I get back to the states.
For most of us, and as a general all-round, year-round bike, I do think the FS is the way to go. I've just bought myself a Vitus FS Rapide (unbelieveable value for a full carbon FS - I wish someone would review it!) and it's fantastic. It's so fast compared to my 5 year old Commencal Meta Trail and has enough travel for 99% of what I need it to cover. I did toy with a hardtail for the weight saving but it just wouldn't have the range of ability.
Everything functions properly ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L Nothing was damaged in the box aside from a decal on the fork. The decal was missing a piece of a corner but I ended up peeling them off anyways. Assembly is easy BUT make sure you tune up the derailleurs. Both the front and rear need adjusting. I'd advise going to a bike shop but I opted out and put in 10+ hours with the help of UA-cam. Ended up fraying a shifter cable but all in all I learned from the experience. The Brakes work well but the front caliper needs adjusting or at least mine did because the rotor was rubbing against the pads. Make sure you swap out the seat, grips, and pedals. For the short run you'll be fine though. I've read that this bike isn't built yet for hard trails but I just need it for the city. PA has some of the worst roads and being in a mountain this was a great choice. Worth the investment!
What style of XC bike do you prefer? Let us know down below!👇
Fully ridged please.
I raced on my full suss for two seasons but then switched back to a hardtail and my season results were much better over very similar terrain. Same brand of bike and both XC bikes.
i have ridden be the owner of xc hardtails so far
Could you do a test whats quicker....a xc bike with enduro wheels+tyres or an enduro bike with xc wheels+tyres? Might make a good video and intrested to find out!
I have a hardtail
GMBN: Carbon=less forgiving, more vibrations, GCN=more forgiving, less vibrations. You should do a joint episode on the topic.
Yeah, does someone know who is right?
Both are right, it all comes down to how the carbon is weaved and constructed. Generally for MTB carbon is stiffer and for road bikes are more flexible.
Different types of vibrations
i also got confused on this one! ;D sheeeed
I’ve had full suspension bikes and hard tail. Personally I love hard tail less things to go wrong less to service and far more fun
Yes but after trying full suspension, your butt and your back say thank you
How are they far more fun?
@@TheUrbanEpicure lighter, more nimble, more rigid frame, easier climbing
@@wrthndr69 1 kilo lighter doesn't make or break it, the frame is arguably less rigid, and the climbing is arguably almost identical when you lockout rear suspension
Just bought myself a hardtail Cube Elite C:62, 9,8kg without pedals and is a game changer versus previous bike Trek x-caliber 8 which has 14kg. Hope that one day I'll treat myself with a fully carbon🤘🏻
U shoukd try adding pedals I hear it helps
@@gieco9583 pedals weigh a lot.
@@gieco9583 it is lighter without ;)
Hi, I would like to ask, I also had an x caliber 8 and I changed it to a carbon bike (bh ultimate) did you feel a change in comfort on the carbon bike? When I went on the trek I felt great... when on carbon I feel my back a lot after the ride days off..
I switched from a full suspension bike to a fully rigid.
It's faster, but less comfortable. My next bike will be a hard tail.
Many wealthy men in my area are buying full suspensions. The only problem is that the terrain in general cannot justify the full sus, especially if they have trail full sus. and not a dedicated XC racing full sus. with short suspension. That means that they have to modify the trails and build a lot of artificial obstacles on them to justify their investment. The weather in Denmark is often wet and muddy, which lends itself to a hardtail. The season on a full sus. is thus shorter than a hardtail that works all year round without worrying about the pivot joints. I've tried riding a fully for some seasons only to realize that the descends become almost too easy and not as engaging. The climbs almost always suffer, unless you have the raciest fully. So my suggestion to upcoming buyers would be to buy a bike that suits your local terrain.
same here! in middle poland. Where Are the hills I ask! all of my friend ok.. some are going full. I don't know where the watt economy is going..
on the right course, absolutely love my hardtail. I also learned on the hardtail, finally got a full sus this year and was slower at first on several trails. finally pushing it to where I'm faster on the full sus on the rougher trails but I wouldn't take for granted what I learned (and continue to learn) on the hardtail.
For me the way to go is Hardtail Bike. Mine is the Canyon Exceed CF5. Already driven full suspension but now for me i think the full suspensiom bikes feels a litte bit loose due to the amount of movement that the bike do. I prefer Hardtail🙌
I have a Santa Cruz Highball , put a dropper on her , 180 front rotor and she’s in beast mode ! I also have a Hightower.. that gets ridden when I wanna get rowdy . But if I had to sell one , it would be the full suspension. I ride my XC bike 80% ..
I changed from an alu ht to a carbon ht and the difference is huge, especially on longer rides. Not wanting to invest in a full sus I went tubeless which takes off the hardness of the ride. But the best investment was the dropper. HT's are getting a more and more aggressive seating position it becomes scary for amateurs in downhill sections, that dropper is a life saver. So I ended up with an almost as soft ride as a full sus but without the weight of it. Love it.
the best advice I ever had on Full vs Hardtail was this - quote: " just get a bike that suits your local terrain. if it's mostly flat you'll regret buing a full sus. when you got some hills and i mean HILLS than get full. you'll not regret.
Wish i heard that before bying a hardtail, Rocks and roots everywhere where i live and my ass hurt 😝
I just bought a specialized epic hardtail comp, couldnt be happier, such a quick bike
I can answer this question even before watching this, neither..... because it depends on the trails, situation, personal choice, and most of all What you enjoy.
At the moment, my only MTB is Giant Talon 2 (2017). It's my workhorse, so to speak. Very utilitarian MTB, indeed!
With its existing 2x9 drivetrain, I intend to upgrade it to a 2x10 system with a rear derailleur that has a clutch. I also intend to replace the coil-spring fork with an air fork. Plus, I want to edit the seat post with a dropper one.
Lots'a love, cheers, & Mabuhay, from tropical Philippines! #KeepBiking
That's exactly what I did with my Talon minus the dropper. I went with Deore 2x10 with a clutch and a Raidon fork among many other mods. The fork completely changed the bike! The only thing I didn't change was the seat lol
I used to ride XC hardtails since I began with cycling, which I consider to be 9 years ago when I was 11 (I learnt how to ride a bike when I was a little kid, this was about the time I started to ride more regularly and race). I wanted to switch to a fully already for the 2020 season, but the pandemic's start meant I couldn't get it for a price I could afford and therefore stayed with hardtails for another two years. I already have a good skillset as I can ride with exception for big jumps and drops (mostly because of worries about the bike) pretty much any enduro trail nearby with 100 mm of front travel and high seat. However, this year I'm convinced to finally get myself a full sus and if I don't find one for a good price, I'd stick with just road, gravel and cyclocross for a year. Hardtails are fun, but after nearly on decades only on them they start to get a bit boring. And as I found, in most XC races at least here in the Czech Republic full suspension bikes are just quicker and at the races where hardtails are quicker, they are quicker just by a tiny bit.
Depends depends depends. :-) I use my XC bike where most would want an AM/Enduro - couldn't imagine doing that on a hard tail XC bike. :-)
"Ooh my eyes are watering, it was emotional that!" Yes it was Rich, yes it was. I have my 2013 Giant Anthem X29er dual suspension and my Trek Marlin 7 Hard tail (5 weeks old and loving it. ) Both are extremely good bikes but as I have been riding much harder, I have actually found the limits of the Anthem and its older technology. It's still very capable but as there's no clutch on the 3 by 10 gears, I have had the chain come off and go in under the rear pivot between the crank housing a few times when the full suspension has bottomed out. The more modern clutch system on the Marlin and the fact it's a hard tail, I haven't got the same problem. But my experience with hard tails vs dual suspension is if you want a plush cushy ride then you will never beat dual suspension but if you want to power up steep smooth hills, you will definitely get the power down with the hard tail.
I went from a 19 Marlin 7 (3X9) to a leftover 19 (bought in 20) Canyon Neuron AL 7.0 SL. Even though it’s apples to oranges or cross country to trail, I love them both. The Marlin climbs much easier, but I can bomb the down hills on the Canyon. I need to go to one of my trails, and time a lap on each bike.
The Anthem X29er is a wonderful bike !
What kind of cluch do you miss ? I dont understand what is this part
I really love Rich’s approach to educational videos!!! Very relatable!!! Thanks for the knowledge!!!
Cheers dude 👊
@@richardpayne5176 👊
Great video. I'm a roadie and I've just bought my first hard tail (Kona Honzo) this winter and I'm both excited and slightly terrified about learning new skills but I have to admit, XC riding is SO much fun. Huge difference going from a road bike that weighs 7.4kg all in (minus bidons) to, uh, don't even know what this beast weights but it rolls like a tank over everything! Interesting your comment on a dropper post. I've never had one before but I'm loving the ability to change riding position dynamically through a ride. I've ridden my gravel bike on single track before and nearly been bucked off. Drop that saddle and I feel centered. Again, i'm just a total noob though.
wow! that Honzo,gotta love it
Honzo is a great bike. Just rode one the other day. Riding road, you may fancy light carbon xc. Accelerates like road and can handle most single tracks and fun trail. Personally I feel people get really caught up in these super slacked out monster truck bikes. Don't get me wrong, there is a place for 140/150mm travel and 64° head tube angles but it's overkill and extra work for the majority of trails. I moved to a fairly flat area and people are riding f.s. enduro and even seen a few downhill bikes. 😆 They will be for sale in a couple weeks.
Thank’s Rich, that was a great video :)
Thanks for the support, Adam! Safe Riding! 🙌
My Type of Riding is
Light Trail and Long Rides.
Type of bike i need
1) Light and Simple, with Less Maintenance
2) Cheaper
so Hardtail XC Suites me Better.
I just went with a hard tail due to the price but now that I know just a little more about Mtb I’m currently saving up for a full sus
Love my HT
When I raced 25yrs ago you would not see full suspension bikes in xc races. Even thought I raced one and loved it.
If I had to choose between a full sus with a rigid post and a hardtail with a dropper. I’d pick the hardtail every time
Thanks for the vid Rich. It will be full sus for me for the marathon races I plan to do. Over a 6hr race the comfort will even be quicker. The track looked nice. I wonder how much the difference on the roots would be between a 29er hardtail and a 26 inch
I think it all comes down to the kind of riding you do, so the terrain picks the type of bike for you really. I've ridden hard tails since the 90's, and only got my first full suss bike just over a year ago. The full suss is an incredibly capable bike, especially heading downhill, but for me and the type of riding I do then a hard tail wins still. Having both though allows me to cover all bases 🙂🙂 My hard tail is a 2019 Whyte 905, and it is a very capable and fun bike, even when charging downhill at Flyup 417!!
I have an old HT and did a 100 mile race last week on a fairly technical course. It beat me up pretty badly, honestly. But, I still love the efficiency and am thinking of replacing it with another HT, maybe just a slacker head tube angle. Maybe I'm crazy, but the weight and moving parts/complexity of an fs don't get me excited!
I'm on a whyte 901 and it's a solid hardtail. Peddles like an xc bike. Plays like a trail bike. Drop the seat a it's now a dj bike.
My Ibis Ripley AF is my XC bike. I have a hard time with hardtails because my ankle take a beating nowadays
I went for a hardtail only because I couldn't afford the FS, I don't see why would anyone choose the hardtail over the FS other than financial reasons.
XC hardtail with a Redshift suspension post works great so I can pedal over more of the rough and save energy like a full sus, but it's cheaper, lighter and no extra maintenance.
how to fit with dropperpost though?
@@TheeJohnWayne I'm not convinced they're needed for XC. I've always ridden XC bikes and a modern 29er feels good going downhill on typical red runs at trail centres, and certainly not needed for the countryside where I do the majority of my riding. I've been on a few demo days and tried trail bikes with droppers but prefer the forward position an XC bike puts you in - easier to keep the front weighted for grip and much sharper handling. Agree this has it's limitations though, and there's a point when a trail bike and dropper becomes the better setup.
@@steveco1800 Sorry, I forgot to state that I have a entry level hardtail trail bike that already has a dropperpost. I do love the Redshift products. I have the stempost and seatpost suspension installed on my casual e-roadbike, which is amazing btw :) I rly hoped to be able to attach the Redshift to my dropperpost on MTB so I don't always have to stand slightly for those small bumps lol
Currently buying a new bike and a friend of mine wants to push me to full suspension but all I want is a Nukeproof Scout :D
And those of us that have one of each, we will pick the proper bike based on the course we have to ride.
Thank you for this video this will help me to think about bikes and progress my mountain bike skills!
Great to hear that Shin! Be sure to keep having lots of fun on the way 👍
@@gmbn oh I will! “I hope”
I raced bmx and because of that the full sus did not click with me for xc riding i just switched to a hard tail and i love it
I would choose a dropper post w/HT than a FS w/ rigid post.
Love my hardtail. In the process of finding the perfect full sus frame. Unsure what to go for.
Halfords indi range. Or apollo.
@@morganwilliams2863 hahaaaaaaaaaa. Sounds fab. Do they still do apollos.
Throw better bikes out to scrap guy
Get the Trek Supercaliber. Game changer for me. Full suspension that actually handles like hardtail!!!
@@RFGrinch tbh I think I did see one in there the other day. Don’t guarantee it though.
There are lockouts on XC FS bikes for a reason lol. Locked for climbing and open for going down best of both worlds lol. I laugh at people that say hardtail is faster when descending.
Used to live in a place where a FS was a must. Most of the xc races required fs. Then I moved to a place where all the tracks are quickest ridden with a HT. I’ve since switched to a HT. That said my next mtb will be a FS again, due to the forgiveness, comfort, and versatility.
Oooh very nice video, thanks!
I’m a sucker for some hard tail action!
Living the single bike, low maintenance life - hardtail for me all the way. Saves a tonne of money too.
Hardtail for the simplicity and cost. I'm broke so hardtail is it for me. Lol. Still, that Canyon is looking absolutely sexy
I’m not sure heart rate is an indication of consistent effort.
Maybe next time use watts? 🤔
If both efforts are the same average watts over the same course and one bike is quicker in time, that would be the more efficient bike (for that course)…. Maybe? I’m not sure 🤔 But I think average watts would be better than heart rate 🤷♂️
I know that full squish is more capable going downhill. However, any full squish i've ever ridden (around town as well as up the hill...) has paled when compared to the brutal FORWARDS you get from a hardtail with a stiff frame and click pedals... Yeez i need my drag racing pulls, that direct response. Any full squish i tried that with just went "you wanted to change speed, really? I don't think so."
Dear lord do i love the brutal feeling when going full send on the checkered pig.
Thats why xc rear shocks have lockouts lol...
Why did he climb with both the fork and shock fully open? Yes maybe it helped on bumps but the efficiency suffers more open than locked, correct?
My trek EX8 is amazing but the Ragley is just something else 👍
Sorry for the potentially dumb question, but I'm new to mtb. Could you just lock the rear shock and effectively convert it into a hardtail when desired?
Yup. You can also lock both front and back suspension at a same time too.
Yeah, but the extra weight won't disappear.
I hate when you only compare just a single time between the two. This needs to be done on multiple times on different days to be a bit more conclusive. But, honestly it all just depends on the rider.
The bike with skinwalls of course 😎
XC Hardtail - cheap, light, easy to militance!
1. 13 seconds is a huge difference imho 2. the bikes are on different tires, tires could make more difference than full sus or not,
Seriously, Hardtails are NOT just about these crazy XC race bikes.
Who actually even races XC these days??
Modern geo Hardtails are mentally good and all about the fun !!!
Give Blake a modern geo 29” Trail HT. He’ll rip it !!! That would be a genuine test on an all round test.
Hardtail, Cannondale F29. ❤
Using a Specialized Chisel for racing xc. Sick bike and it’s very light (alloy 27 lbs)
Faster on every trail around my house which are very XC only on a full squish that’s 4pounds heavier than my Hardtail.
It depends on what purpose we are using for
If you are more on the road or clean offroad
Hardtail is the best
But if you are more on the offroad full with bump
Full suspension is the best
Not going to argue that hardtail is lighter than full suspension
Not going to argue also that full suspension is higher in maintenance than hardtail
Last but not least
I need an answer
Which one is more stable when taking a corner?
First! Interesting video guys!
🏆🏁
I love full sus but they're too expensive for me :(
One day... I'll buy it with my own earned money 🙂
I hope your dreams come true and yes same I looks full sus but like you said SO MUCH ####### money!
My first proper bike was 300e full sus(used of course) which I upgraded over time just because I didn't like the ide of a ht...
it was the tan wall tyres that made the difference
💯% 😂
I've yet to find a bike that compares to my 2013 specialized epic fsr that I bought in 2016. It rides like a hardtail, but sucks up roots and rocks
I started on hardtail and I loved it 💯👌 But not long ago I got into full sus gang 💥🤘
Thanks for the video! Which ride did you enjoy the most?
I’ve had hard tail bikes and now I ride an old 2016 trance 2 but maybe I could up grade the dual front cogs to a single and the rear rim and maybe change the front fork but I may have to sell it now that I have problems breathing having had the virus 🦠 so that’s that . Speed depending on how hard you ride and how steep the hill is now no longer a thing for me but full suspension is more comfortable and maybe an e bike before the wheel chair? Copd is no joke. Covid is no joke three months on oxygen and watching these videos is a memory of what was able to do ! Be careful with your lungs .
I love theses videos
Wonder how much difference the tires made in this comparison. with Barzo on the FS and Mezcal/Peyote on the HT.
The bad thing about carbon is their will never be an antique. It will deteriorate and fall apart
Since i don't have much money then I'll go for hardtail bikes.
If hardtails are less forgiving, maybe people should learn on a FS and then 'upgrade' to a hardtail? Seems nuts I know.
I'm 54 and I've been riding a full suspension for nearly 10 years now and I want to go back to a hardtail. Faster and less maintenance
I have a question. What sort of MTB bike should I get. I'm in new Zealand and I'm wanting to do some of the trails that take 3 days. Around 30 km a day rides on gravel/off road. Nothing to Intense terian wise...
These bikes have more carbon in them than my fireplace!
Video idea. Turn that full sus to a gravel bike and see how it rides.
Get a Trek procaliber 👌🏻
Hi, what's the price and weight difference between the two bikes?
Dp you know any cheap hardtails around £147 to £184
Trek callibur is best one in my op
Wtf ...just bought a BMC two-stroke for my first XC race on Sunday. Team hardtail all day!!!!!!!
As this is probably aimed at people newer to mountain biking which bike would teach people more about this skills needed to do XC and in general?
Hey! We would still recommend a hardtail for beginner XC riders. It helps develop better control and body position. However, the differences aren't as noticeable, for example, a hardtail to an enduro or downhill bike. 👍
What bike should I buy if I want the best alloy hardtail trail bike? I'm thinking I want the best alloy bike instead of one the cheapest carbon bikes. Maybe Trek Roscoe 9, Merida big trail 600, or Canyon stoic 4? Nukeproof scout 290 pro also looks really incredible but is expensive. I have also been thinking about Orbea. Any inputs? 😊
How do I enable an aggressive lower xc position on a mid range hardtail? Go down a bit in framesize and raise the saddle? Or invest in steeper negative and longer stem? I wanna be able to keep up with my gravel friends and won't ride much gnarly rough trails but rather fast and long..
@Globabl Mountain Bike Network... Talks cheap! Time to bring in the Garmin Rally XC Power Meter pedals and prove it with power data!
Hi
I will go to Jersey for two weeks in july and would have loved to see the "An Epic Ride Around Jersey In One Day" video once more. But I can not find it anymore. Where can I find it?
Thank you for an awesome channel! I have a request for you! Could you please review a few bikes for flatter terrain? I am not thinking of xc since I am looking for something that is more lively and fun than xc, but not as heavy or inefficient as some trail bikes. Many reviews if trail bikes mostly cover cool descends, but where i live the terrain is mostly flat with short ascends and descends. It is also a lot of roots, stones and gnarly terrain so the bike must be somewhat capable, but still efficient to build up speed. My own analysis would be that a lighter down country bike would suit quite well but I would go for a little bit longer travel e.g. 130 in front and 120 in the back. Couldn’t you please do a video that covers bikes for this purpose? Thank you 🙏🏻
There’s only one answer, and it’s RIGID😎🔥
An XC HT like a Spot Rocker would have been a nice 3rd bike for this comparison. As it has even more modern geon than the Canyon HT and it can take a 120mm of travel too. Plus, it's light enough with even 27.5x3.0 tires.
I’m trying to decide between V Spot Rocker vs Orbea OIZ M30 100mm front & rear for XC racing in central Mexico. Mostly gravel but after a long ride, even on a FS bike, my butt is sore
@@paulv8453 Spot Rocker(carbon or even the older steel) would be the way to go. Just watch some of the review videos of the bike. It looks so cool
@@mellissanash7517 Trust me, I’ve watched them all. lol. I’m not a huge fan of matte paint but in terms of build it checks off all the boxes. I’m comparing it to the more expensive Trek Procaliber 9.7.
@@paulv8453 paint isn't hard to change or just add a coat of gloss.
@@mellissanash7517 My concern are my knees though. Your legs are your suspension on a hard tail. Where I currently live, I can’t just go that ride new bikes. I have to wait until I get back to the states.
I am fairly new to MTB but am great on a bike what should I get
13 seconds is not close.
What’s the name of the odometer you have on the hard tail in the middle of the handlebar
For most of us, and as a general all-round, year-round bike, I do think the FS is the way to go. I've just bought myself a Vitus FS Rapide (unbelieveable value for a full carbon FS - I wish someone would review it!) and it's fantastic. It's so fast compared to my 5 year old Commencal Meta Trail and has enough travel for 99% of what I need it to cover. I did toy with a hardtail for the weight saving but it just wouldn't have the range of ability.
Nice
Great video but the thumbnail has the word "sus" in it so i'll laugh uncontrollably now
Is it me or do they keep doing the same videos?
Stay safe fellow mtb’er
Any geometry differences between the 2 bikes?
Almost all the XC Pro racers are running FS. Courses are too tough for a HT.
Everything functions properly ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L Nothing was damaged in the box aside from a decal on the fork. The decal was missing a piece of a corner but I ended up peeling them off anyways. Assembly is easy BUT make sure you tune up the derailleurs. Both the front and rear need adjusting. I'd advise going to a bike shop but I opted out and put in 10+ hours with the help of UA-cam. Ended up fraying a shifter cable but all in all I learned from the experience. The Brakes work well but the front caliper needs adjusting or at least mine did because the rotor was rubbing against the pads. Make sure you swap out the seat, grips, and pedals. For the short run you'll be fine though. I've read that this bike isn't built yet for hard trails but I just need it for the city. PA has some of the worst roads and being in a mountain this was a great choice. Worth the investment!
TLDR it depends
Aggressive trail hardtail for me
What do you think of the Spot Rocker geared with 29’s?