Can You Outshoot an FBI Agent? [Part 3: 2019]
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- Опубліковано 21 лип 2024
- Wrapping up our series on FBI pistol standards, we're looking at the newest qualification test from 2019. We're also digging into the FBI's sidearm choices from the 90s to the present, including the infamous 10mm ordeal.
We skipped the 2013 FBI test, but you can catch that here: • Start Shooting Better ...
The Rangemaster Core Handgun Skills Test (PDF): www.luckygunner.com/lounge/me...
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Yes I wanna hear the whole story.........but I wanna hear Manny Mansfield explain it.
"The FBI's Greatest Mistake: Abandoning 10mm For An Ultra-Light-Duty Cartridge"
Absolutely.
I'd like to see him do a serious video on it with brief, snippets of Manny Mansfield giving his 2 cents throughout the thing. Would be fun.
10mm does nothing more or less than 9mm. Get some education
Yes
10mm Auto full length feature: YES PLEASE!
"Speed and power solves many things." - Jeremy Clarkson
i am here for it too
Long version would be nice.
Chris: Let me know if you want to hear the long vers...
Me: YES!!
If you can get access to an Army range you might want to give the Army Combat Pistol Qualification Course a try. Superficially, it is not particularly challenging but it has one feature that makes it quite difficult. Unlike other qualification courses which use a fixed target, the CPQC uses pop up targets at ranges 5-32 meters. Instead of strings of fire at a fixed range you can go from 5m to 32m to any range in between for each stage.
Do the Air Marshal test.
@@DaveL9170 That is supposed the most demanding.
@@johnshepherd9676 by far
You remain static for the entire qualifying for air marshals. Law enforcement qualifications are not difficult regardless of agency.
This, and the "new" M4 Individual Weapons Qualification (IWQ). In the case of not having access to an IWQ range, I've had the idea of using the M16 ALT-C target at 25m, and still following the engagement order
I've got it. What we NEED, is a "documentary" episode of Manny Mansfield reciting the traditional myths about the 10mm/.40S&W story. But you cut back and forth to regular Chris Baker interjecting the necessary factual corrections between key points in Manny's Mythical Monologue, like a political rebuttal in a news-analysis show. The Surprise Rise and Sudden Fall of the .40-cal. market should be a key theme, along with the generation-long gradual rising tide of popular support for the 10mm. With special mention of the recent proliferation of new chassis chambered for 10mm, even as .40 now fades.
Then there's a feel-good ending to resolve an lingering awkwardness between Manny and Chris: Despite their differences, we all agree that an ascendant trend in 10mm cartridge sales is worth celebrating.
Then for part 2 of the whole 10mm saga, you can cover the really touchy practical controversies:
1) The debatable practice of shooting .40 S&W from a 10mm chamber.
2) The problem of two dramatically distinct power-level categories for 10mm ammo, and the benefits (or necessity!) of changing recoil springs in your semi-auto to accommodate the difference.
I like this a lot.
Has been said, but I want to reinforce this: Yes I want the long version and yes I want to hear it from Manny Mansfield.
+1 for the long version and +1 for getting out and dusting off the Manny Mansfield character!
Oh - My - Gosh. Chris you are brilliant. I can't thank you enough for your clear and concise statements that recoil was NEVER a problem with the 1076 and FBI service loads. I have been refuting this narrative for over a decade in online forums. It is so refreshing to hear an accurate account in your narrative. Kudos!
Yeah, for those who don't know (haven't watched the vid yet myself) the FBI was always going to adopt the 10mm in a down loaded form, it was on the initial requirements. The reality is that the gun guys wanted the .45 ACP, but the military had just dumped it, so that was never going to fly with the budget. And the 1076 was an absolute POS.
I've been so annoyed with the popular gunzine narrative that I wrote up a mini-history of FBI semi-auto pistols for the Scattered Shots blog. The emphasis is on the post-Miami adoptions for general and specialist (HRT and SWAT) issue.
...I can listen to 10mm all day long, so yes please Chris, bring on those future presentations
Yes, the whole 10mm story please.
Long 10mm Story Please
Yes, long story please!
Long version please. If possible, the really very long version with diagrams and interviews.
The internet longs for the mines. Long form miniseries documentaries. Give us 12 hours or your beautiful voice
All the 10mm stuff all the time I thought I had heard the whole story but noticed some difference in just the short you just gave us. Thanks again for another interesting video 😊😊
Part 4: Can you outshoot an FBI agent while wearing autographed J Edgar Hoover lingerie. 😂😂
👗😉
Air Marshal qualification next?
You know darn well we want to hear the long version.
Chris, despite sometimes disagreeing with you on minor points I want to say your content through the years has been incredibly educational for me and is very much appreciated. Keep cranking em out friend.
Long version, please!
you mean the FBI agent in Denver who did a back flip in a bar and shot someone in the leg? that guy ? 😂
Yes, I would very much like to hear the whole story. 😊
+1 for the 10mm saga.
This has been a great series. Would love to see any more content on styles and instruction over the years…
Just did this qualification test at the range monday, and all of us passed. An excellent drill!
Throwing another vote behind the full length long version of the 10mm story.
Would love to see the full length version…..
Great stuff, Chris, thanks!
Very much enjoyed this series!
Would love to hear the long story :D
Long 10mm story, shotgun story, rifle story including whether Morales used an AUG after 1986 or not, and finally the MP5 and AR stories. That brings us up to date on much of the modern FBI firearms history.
Excellent series. Thanks much for the hard work!
Great series. Hope to hear more.
Yes. I absolutely want to hear about the 10mm and the FBI.
Always interested in the long version of the story! Great video series!
This has been an awesome series - Thanks
Hey Chris……you do excellent videos….learn a lot by watching.
Yes, 10mm story, please
Great video. Very informative.
Great show.
You and your team put out great content. Keep it up
Yes, please tell the WHOLE 10mm story!!
Definitely would like to hear the 10mm story. Great stuff!
Great video series. Please do the full 10 MM video in the future.
Fun series. Never thought about it until this popped up.
I’m also asking for the full length version of the 10mm saga.
Definitely would like the whole story!!
Votes for the long version
Gen X kid who cannot WAIT to hear the Full Long Version of Chris Baker's 10mm FBI History.
Please.
Bring it.
Of course we want the "10mm Fiasco" video!
Very interesting to see the evolution of shooting fashion in this serie, great job.
Thank you Mr Backer for excellent story.
It would be nice to hear LONG STORY with more details.
Nice work
Chris thanks for this excellent series. I found your recommendation of Bill Vanderpool's "Guns of the F.B.I. : A History of the Bureau's Firearms and Training" to be an excellent resource.
Do the long version of 10mm
Yes! More 1076, 10mm, etc. Great channel!
+1 for long 10mm episode
Thank you for the interesting series. I learned a lot of information and look forward to more in the future. A question one ammunition selection. Did you use the FBI issue ammo, which I read was a 135 grain 9mm critical duty plus p. This may not be accurate, however your series provided knowledge and insight.
Would love to hear the "long version"! ❤
We want to hear about the long story!
Give us the 10mm looooong story, with sprinkles of Manny Mansfield wisdom too 👍
10mm Story Time Please
long version, please!
Finally, an FBI course of fire with which I am familiar. Thanks for covering that, and for the entire series.
Long version requested. Please and thank you.
I wouldn't mind a 2 hour long story
I want the long version so I can send people to a concise video about 10mm and the FBI.
Try diet and exercise
@@HWG-wm8ld I am and it's working. Thank you for your concern.
Yes please!!! 10mm Long version
Yes, give us the long version!
I want to hear the long version!
"Can You Outshoot an FBI Agent?"
Sometimes it feels like these social media challenges become crazier every time, I'm still in it.
Thanks Again ‼️
"Stereotypes come from somewhere."
- My dad
I have enjoyed the FBI videos. I would like to see more about the 10mm. Perhaps, you could do similar videos about the firearms and qualifications of different agencies.
Can‘t wait for the full version of the 10mm story haha
I love a good 10mm rant lol
Here here! So glad more of the public can see how law enforcement agencies sometimes significantly lower standards. It's sad actually. Considering his "accountant" statement: the FBI always had a bunch of accountants and lawyers. They were able to pass the old test. This is just lowering standards.
What is the FBI HRT pistol qualification test? That would be a very interesting expert standard to assess against
Yes
Interested in the long version
Long version please
🙋♂️ I’d like to see the long version of the FBI & the pistol caliber saga
What about the Air Marshals? Are they still required to be expert shooters, or have they lowered their standards? I'd welcome a video on that topic.
Lowered across the board. Armed security guards pass unless they hit someone on the line.
Bring on the 10mm story. I'm all ears
I know someone who signed up to be a forensic accountant at the FBI and now he’s kicking down doors so you never know where you’ll end up after Quantico!
That’s what they say they do. Watching too much sacario
Miami Day, ammo selection or bringing a handgun to fight with someone with a rifle? :(
They really should have a more strict test for field agents imo.
I got high score on Asteroids, once. That's got to count for something.
I want to hear the long story too
2:15 How can a company release a product with defects and prone to malfunction? This was a multi-million dollar contract with a world-famous agency. Wouldn't they want a "perfect" product?
Being paid in advance with a contract lacking the right language for accountibility will easily do it. love my third gen SW semiautos but there is a lot that can go wrong when you look at the design. Gaston's design is a clear winner for cost and reliability
I think it was the trigger return spring. A retired agent said the heat treatment of the double forked spring was a problem. One fork could break and the owner wouldn't know it. Both break and then there is a problem let alone the broken pieces in the frame.
Depends? Am I doin'a handstand? 😂
FYI the FBI used the TRC (tactical revolver course) 50 yards and in during the 70s and 80s.
Have you, or will you do the Rangemaster test for us?
🇺🇸
I would also enjoy seeing Manny explain the 10mm history vis-a-vis the FBI....but only after the actual story as told by Chris.
E.g. Chris tells the whole story, then there's an 80s video splice cut and Manny takes over with a "that's what they want you to believe, but REAL shooters know..." style telling of his Fuddlore version.
Let's hear the long one
Of course I want to hear Manny Mansfield tell me about the history of the 10mm!!
Yeah, gonna need to full 10mm story because I feel like if they issued reduced power 10mm, they implied that it was too powerful
Full power 10mm is overpowered for 2 legged threats and the fbi isn't getting into shoot outs with Grizzlies regularly
What people think of as "full power" 10mm is the basically p+ load that Norma insisted on that's way overkill for human targets and that even the Bren Ten couldn't handle.
But the BS story goes that the S&W 1076 wasn't durable enough nor controllable with Norma-spec loads. However, the FBI selected the Mid-Velocity specification before they ever solicited a 10mm issue pistol, much less awarded the contract for the 1076. The 170gr Norma was only tested in a Colt Delta Elite, personally supplied by the FTU's chief John Hall.
Long form 10mil👍
I did the 2019 and scored 50/50 about 1 year ago. Not hard at all which i thought was strange. Thought the standards would be tougher.
Most police qualification courses of fire are quite easy.
And getting easier. Look at a graduation for the nypd.
Seems to be an okay test to ensure they are at least competent.
I definitely think Manny should give us the rest of the story...
Yep, guaranteed
TBh the training is done by the person not the organization. Anyone working for an employer that has to carry it up to them to practice on their own time and become proficient
long version for sure