Tom, that is just beautiful! the black handwheel and bearing mounts, silver steel and the bronze coloured pieces. It is great seeing and hearing it turn over. Somehow it reminds me of the Victorian older machines one sees in restored museums such as pumping stations and the like. Just gorgeous, efficient art work that will do a great job for eons of time in the future. Brilliant and well done.
Thanks Dan, I'll take a bow on that nice compliment. Chris mentioned Victorian machinery as well. I didn't consciously think of that when I worked it up but now that you mention it I agree. I guess I'll be looking for a pinstriper pretty soon. All the best, Tom
Beautiful machine work! I have a small pop up camper that employs something very similar. It’s a two stage wabbler. One set of gears rotates one way the other set rotates the opposite way with the eccentric gear in between the two output gears all contained in one gearbox. It is operated with a hand crank.
That really is a beautiful piece of machinery you've created, Tom. Comes to life when it's running. I keep watching the first minute as there's something fascinating about the way it moves. Perhaps you should make a relaxation video of it just turning for an hour or so :)
I have limited form tool experience but in what I have found it works better for me to do the cut in two directions so the form meets in the middle rather than the end. It seems to reduce cutting forces chatter and make it easier to blend. So I would have cut over then backed out come all the way in and plunged, then backed out and gone over again then repeat the back out and plunge and do that until I had my form cut. It also appeared in your test run that the shaft speed was speeding up and slowing down with each revolution? Looks like maybe the weight of the anti rotation arm was speeding it up when gravity could take over. For the application it probably does not matter but would maybe the addition of a friction brake smooth the rotational motion out?
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that uneven speed is caused by the anti-rotation arm swinging from side to side which causes the centre gear to rotate slightly backwards and forwards. When it's rotating the same way as the ring gear it's rotation is added to the ring gear which speeds it up, and when it's turning the opposite way it's subtracted which slows it down. If the centre gear was constrained by a parallel-motion linkage so that the arm stayed vertical then the speed would be constant ... I think. But I'm guessing that the speed variation doesn't matter anyway for this application
The drive is not a constant velocity drive. In fact the curve is a cycloid. The back and forth you noticed (sharp eyes) is because there is no load on the system so the lash between the gears can fall backward with gravity. All that will go away when the system is loaded in use. On the radius cut I was pretty close to the chuck. I didn't want to Bozo it by moving two axes at once. All the best, Tom
I am loving this project, seems like your planning and detail work have served you well, seems to operate quite smoothly. What is the name of that hole punch machine you have that has all the different punch/dies in it, kind of a rotary shapped?
Hey Tom, Its a Rotex 18A turret punch. Thanks for the comment. They are still in business in San Leandro California. You won't like the new prices for these....... Cheers, Tom
Hi Pest, Well that is a nice comment. Doug's boat is quite the project. That boy has some energy. I think his Junk and the press will weigh about the same amount. Cheers, Tom
Hi Tom, I'm impressed by the quality of a flame cut on those parts. I was blowing as strong as I could on my screen to clear the smoke, but California is really too far from me to do any good... Coming along nicely. Cheers, Pierre
Hey Harold, I didn't have it in the layout. After putting it together it was totally obvious that it needed one. One of the differences between the virtual world and the real world. Cheers, Tom
Tom, was any consideration given to swapping the cuts of the inner and outer gear? I'm assuming the reason it was riding on the outside on the outer gear is due to the flame cut kerf angle. I would think if you flipped the inner gear so the taller portion of the kerf was on the inside it would allow the gears to mesh better.
Hi Bradley, Nothing other than a brain fart. I had the gears oriented with the pierce side up since they arrived. I didn't even think to flip one over. When I tested it on the bench with the eccentric was the first indicator there were some high spots. The interference is not bad at all. A little filing and sanding is taking care of it. All the best, Tom
The number of spokes and diameter of handwheel give the illusion of a much higher gear reduction. Watched the section of you rotating it several times just to see the movement of the pieces. Pretty cool. Colin ;-)
Hey Colin, Thanks for stopping by. Pretty compact for 18:1. Can you imagine the mess of chains and sprockets you would need to get that ratio. All the best, Tom
Hi Matthew, That might work. The contact points are a bit heavy for that right now. Filing them off seems to be the right method for now. I will run it for a while until I'm satisfied its good. Cheers, Tom
Hi Tom Enjoyed, thanks for sharing/showing the progress....as I watched you get close with the radius tool, all I could think was I know Tom won't mar (leave a line) on the face but I know I would...LOL Chuck
Hey Chuck, Thanks for the vote of confidence. Knowing when to stop is half of what you learn in forty years. Just say stop would be a good motto. Thanks for stopping by. --Tom
Thanks for doing these videos on your project. I never get to see the end product of my burning. It is really cool to see this project coming along. Thanks for doing the videos and calling me out in your video. I picked up a few more subs thanks to you. I hope I can live up to their expectation. Lol
Hey Steve, Thank you again for making the gears possible. Its a much better story if a couple of tubers get together and horse trade than me ordering some cut from a steel house right? for me its about the process and my interaction with the people and materials needed to do a project like this. All the best, Tom
May I inquire what would this machine use as a final product? I mean it is an beautiful machine, but that huge torque will be used on what? a grinder? bender? ring roller?
Hi Miguel, Thanks for the comment. The gear reducer is for a large intaglio etching press. Used to imprint paper with an image carved or etched into a zinc or copper plate. Google intaglio or something like Goya etching to see some examples of prints from a machine like this. Hope this helps. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco Yes I know what is intaglio, it was etched in our minds in art class in college, many beautiful examples where shown, including the really old ones. Thanks for your prompt answer.
Hi Tom Wav, it looks really, really nice - great job ! The big wheel is very nice too - that shiny black paint - looks really nice and prof ! I noticed though in the begining of the video where the big wheel is turning, then the small wheel (the slow side of the gear) is NOT turning in a constant speed - sometimes it slows down - why ? Maybe it's because you don't have this anti-rotation-part mounted yet or at least I think you don't - I can't see it. I don't think there could be so much mis-mesh in the teeth - right ? In fact you should only sand down the high spots to get them to mesh exactly - right ? When finished should the gear run in any kind of lube ? Long to see more of this fantastic project !
Hi Keld, You are correct that this is not a constant velocity drive. In fact the curve is a cycloid. There is a lot of clearance in the gear teeth but this is not a problem. The system gets loaded in one direction at a time. If it was constantly reversing it would need to be fitted much closer. The gears will be nickel plated and lubricated with light grease once in a while. Thanks for the comment and great questions. Cheers, Tom
Hi Diy, The output is actually cylcloidal. So you are correct that its not constant velocity. There is some back and forth now because their is no load on the drive. Its just idling in bearings. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
In the video it looks like the rotational speed of the output varies while I'm sure the hand wheel must be turning at a constant rate. Is that an optical illusion?
Hi Clock, Thanks for the comment. These gears are also used for hoists for spare tires on GM trucks. Somebody showed me the guts of one recently. Cheers, Tom
I notice that the output doesn't turn smoothly, it accelerates and decelerates in comparison to the input. Will the move-pause-move action have an effect on the print?
Once its loaded up in one direction it should be less herky jerky. The output is not constant velocity but that does not effect the printing process. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Tom, three questions. First, what type of steel are the wobble gears made of? Why did you choose that steel? Would a waterjet have resulted in a more accurate profile than flame/plasma?
Hi Thomas, The steel is A-36. The profile is not supposed to need great accuracy which is one of its advantages. These were produced by forging and casting and used net shape. I'm just a little fussier than normal for the fit. Yes WJ would probably have given be a little better accuracy. However I was also horse trading with another tuber that cuts steel for a living. Cheers, Tom
Hi Tom Overall this press is going to run pretty smooth - congratulations on a great desing. No matter how smooth it runs it will not compete with how smoothly you erased the 'Railway Thermite' video to do off your whiteboard..... LOL and thanks Rod
Hey Rod, Man I thought I made it. You noticed apparently. I should have changed one letter at a time until it said something else. Totally busted. Cheers, Tom
So it looks like that gear reduction runs at an inconsistent speed. Kinda reminds me of a shaper and how the drive unit in it gets the faster return stroke. Did you expect that change in speeds?
Hi Jeff, You are right it is not constant velocity. In fact it describes a Cycloid as it turns. For this application its not important. Also the output has no load on it and can flop around a little. Once the drive is loaded in one direction or the other is shouldn't flop back and forth but will still have the cycloidal motion. Good eye. All the best, Tom
Hey Perry, The mesh is not that accurate. I have filed most of the spots and will run it some more to get a better fitup. I don't think lapping compound is aggressive enough right now. Cheers, Tom
Very Cool demo of the gears, I love learning new things and had a difficult time picturing in my head how the gears were going to work together. Thank you for clearing that mess up. It's another wonderful effect that UA-cam and great videos like this have on my visual based learning center, different that learning from a book, which I can do, but having it shown to you while it's described by Professor Ox Wizard makes things as clear as crystal...or casting resin ;) Be on the lookout for something coming for you to put your hands on, just a prototype but something tactile. Aloha...Chuck
oxtoolco Well then, since I forgot to bring you guys fresh melons when I came for a visit, I will just have to add a pack of some dried goodies to the package I'm sending you on Monday. The neighbor down the road still has melons and he's offered me some and I'll just have to make some more! Stan can't be the only one who gets melons, even though it was for Mrs. Zinkowsky per request. I will spread the wealth as he said they were pretty good :) Aloha...Chuck
Hi Gorilla, I don't think I will do any special treatment to the teeth. The teeth are large and have a large contact area. This is my story at least. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
That might work. The problem with valve grinding compound is it will embed in the steel and stay. Filing seems to be working well right now. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hi Darren, Its a special height gage so I can calibrate the center height. Hardinge makes one that I adapted for my larger lathe. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Isn't this sort of drive not a real gear reduction, in that you get more torque out of a normal gear reduction in exchange for speed, and you're doing nothing but slowing down the big wheel without getting any increase in power? Wouldn't you want the torque to aid in forcing things through the press?
+phookadude Hi Phook, It is a true gear reduction. Take a look at harmonic gear reducers. The principle is similar. There is a mechanical advantage here that is 18:1 ratio. Thanks for the comment. Cheers, Tom
Hey Tom, You're a regular "wabble rouser"! You may be on vacation, but you are still back to the old "grind"! I think 2 disgusting puns per comment is about it. Any more and you will block me from commenting on your channel! Anyway . . . nice work on the drive guts to the etching press. Does the drive operate a platen or a cylinder to hold the sheet of paper? Does the paper holding device move or does the printing plate move on a carriage (like the Hilderberg cylinder press)? Thanks for another interesting video! It will be great to see the machine in action! Have a good one! Dave
Hey Dave, The drive rotates a large cylinder. The paper and plate are on a platen that is pulled between the two main rolls. Kind of like a laundry wringer but on a bigger scale. The pressure at the nip point squeezes the plate into the paper and transfers the ink. cheers, Tom
That handwheel looks great powder coated! The drive really does have a high reduction ratio, how long does it take to pass a plate through the rollers? Speaking of rollers, do you have the material for them yet? Andre
Hi Andre, That will depend on how big the plate is. The roll diameter is 8 inches so the linear speed will be fairly good with a 25 inch circumference. It takes eighteen turns to move 25 inches which takes maybe a minute just spinning the wheel. In actual use the pressing will probably be much slower. Have to wait and see. Cheers, Tom
But that sounded great when you span it, the rattle clank of true Victorian machinery, one of the world's best sounds. Now you are going to risk spoiling it, oh the youth of today! :>) ATB c
Hey Chris, High praise indeed. Thank you sir! It does have that quiet clickity clack that you see in some mechanical equipment. I'm quite pleased so far. Cheers, Tom
oxtoolco That roller would be like the old wringer style washing machines where the lady doing the laundry had to watch and not bend over the wringer rollers too far. I believe those were the forerunners of the Mammogram without the x-rays.
I'll bet you weren't happy once you put a real load on that "output shaft", were you? That "drive" is an engineering "joke" that apparently lots of "professional engineers" simply don't "get" until its way too late to be even slightly "funny". What works for "NASA" on a LUNAR ROVER in a far different "application" where that "output shaft" would be the INPUT SHAFT and the "handwheel" the wheel assembly of the LUNAR ROVER isn't worth a SHIT when "repurposed" in a "similar" but "backward" application and one where the "cardinal rule" of "planetary gearsets" is "violated" which is the case with your setup. The "cardinal rule"? ONE "ELEMENT" OF A "PLANETARY" GEARSET HAS TO BE "HELD STATIONARY" OR THE RESULT IS "NEUTRAL". And if that "element" is the "driven gear" in a "Wabble Drive" and "anti-rotation links" have to be used to allow the "drive gear" to "raise" and "advance" and "lower" and "advance" to drive the driven gear "one tooth at a time", then you have TWO "held stationary" elements once the entire unit is assembled and THAT is the SECOND CARDINAL RULE VIOLATION. What is the SECOND CARDINAL RULE OF PLANETARIES? IF YOU HAVE TWO "HELD STATIONARY" ELEMENTS YOU HAVE "PARK". But without those links and with the output shaft only "held stationary" once you get enough load "on" the drum cranking a "plate" through and the other two elements "free" you STILL get "neutral", don't you? And you can't use those "anti-rotation links" in the "final design" either because obviously whatever "shaft" the drive gear they're cycling up and down and the "shaft" that's driving it ALL HAVE TO "FLOAT" UP AND DOWN TAKING THE GEARS OUT OF MESH AND INTO "NEUTRAL" EVERY TIME THEY RAISE AND PUTTING IT IN "PARK" EVERY TIME THEY LOWER ONCE YOU HAVE A REAL LOAD "ON" THE DRUM. Seriously, if you want to know how to "design" and "engineer" EFFICIENTLY and PRACTICALLY and produce something that WORKS GOOD WHICH MAKES YOU LOOK A HELL OF A LOT SMARTER THAN SOMETHING THAT "LOOKS COOL" AND DOESN'T WORK AT ALL, TRY TALKING TO OR LISTENING TO OR GETTING THE SAME "EDUCATION" AS OR USE THE SAME "RESOURCES" FOR LEARNING ABOUT/FIXING/DESIGNING/IMPROVING MECHANICAL SYSTEMS AS.....PLAIN OLD "MECHANICS". "MECHANICAL ENGINEERS" DIDN'T EVEN "EXIST" UNTIL ALL THE "HARD" AND "CHALLENGING" AND "THEORETICAL" AND "PRACTICAL" AND "SCIENTIFIC" WORK OF "ENGINEERING" PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING WE HAVE TODAY HAD ALREADY BEEN DONE BY "MECHANICS". AND NOT TO BE "SMART" OR "COOL" OR "GET RICH" OR "GET FAMOUS" BUT SIMPLY TO DO WHAT TRUE "ENGINEERING" HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT AND WILL ALWAYS BE ABOUT. WHICH IS "SOLVING PROBLEMS" THAT EXISTING "SOLUTIONS" TO OTHER POSSIBLY "SIMILAR" PROBLEMS DO NOT "SOLVE". YOU DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM UNSOLVABLE BY SEVERAL EXISTING SOLUTIONS BESIDES WANTING TO LOOK LIKE A MASTER-MACHINIST AND EXPERT-ENGINEER. BOTH A SIMPLE "SPUR GEAR" DESIGN OR A "COMPLEX" TRUE PLANETARY DESIGN WOULD HAVE WORKED "PERFECTLY" WHILE THAT CUSTERFUCK NON-SOLUTION TO THE ACTUAL "PROBLEM" OF HOW TO TURN THAT GIANT HANDWHEEL "FAST" AND THE DRUM "SLOW" OBVIOUSLY IS NOT ONLY NOT A SOLUTION BUT NO DOUBT GAVE YOU A WHOLE PILE OF OTHER PROBLEMS. OR AT LEAST ONE BIG ONE WHICH WAS LEARNING/DECIDING TO SAY "OOPS" AND "I FUCKED UP" AND "THIS WILL/WOULD NEVER WORK" AND JUST WALKING AWAY. OF COURSE AS AN "EDUCATOR" IN THESE VIDEOS YOU "SHOULD" ALSO "FESS UP" TO YOUR "FOLLOWERS" AND "FANS" AND "STUDENTS" AND LET THEM ALL BENEFIT FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE AND NEW-FOUND WISDOM AND "PROFESSIONALISM" SINCE TEACHING PEOPLE ITS "OK" TO MAKE MISTAKES AND IF YOU'RE NOT MAKING MISTAKES YOU'RE NOT DOING/LEARNING ANYTHING WORTHWHILE ANYWAY. BUT I'VE SEEN REPEATED COMMENTS ON MANY VIDEOS ABOUT THE "DISAPPEARING" ETCHING PRESS PROJECT AND I'M CERTAIN YOU DIDN'T JUST "FORGET" ABOUT IT AND YOU RESPOND TO COMMENTS YOU LIKE AND THAT MAKE YOU FEEL GOOD/SMART SO I ASSUME YOU'VE "MOVED ON" AND AREN'T WILLING TO REALLY "HELP" PEOPLE BY "FESSING UP" AND EVEN BETTER "FIXING" THE "MISTAKE" BY "REDESIGNING" THE PRESS WITH WHAT WOULD/WILL OBVIOUSLY BE MAYBE A LESS "EXOTIC" GEAR SET BUT AN INFINITELY MORE "ELEGANT" ONE GIVEN IT WOULD ACTUALLY WORK. Of course there are lots of etching presses out there factory-made across a wide range of sizes, shapes, designs, costs and "ages" both new and used and "similar" presses to your design probably new or used aren't much if any more expensive than what you've got in the parts you "outsourced' or WOULD HAVE if just a regular machinist working on paying OR personal project and paying "retail" for that stuff and not being able to "trade" mentions of the "suppliers" in a UA-cam video for "discounted" or "free" parts. And as a "honey-do" project I imagine your "better half" had a "sooner" rather than "later" timeframe in mind for her new "venture" and probably either got tired of waiting and bought a "commercial" press or got bored of the whole idea in the meantime and moved on OR you actually did "start over" and redesign and "cranked out" the "new and improved" press ASAP long ago and just didn't have time to "document" that process or didn't make time for various reasons. It doesn't matter to me what actually happened and its your deal and whether or not you "fess up" or not or anything else about the "missing press" is really none of my business and all of yours. I've fucked up and didn't fess up, too. But I still think that as an "educator" with a lot of viewers who are more or less your "students" and with plenty of them being less "experienced" and "wise" in the realities of even "experts" making "stupid mistakes" than I know I am and I assume you are, it would be the best lesson possible to "finish" the etching press project in a "wrap-up" video regardless of what the actual "story" is. And I'm NOT "trashing" you or your ability and skill as a machinist, engineer or mechanic at all. That's some pretty kick-ass machining AND "engineering" AND "mechanicking" and I had to "study" those "drives" for a little while before I "got" the "joke" and did some online research and saw the lunar rover reference and did some recollecting about my personal experience with a "replica" lunar rover and real-deal astronaut damned near 30 years ago as a result. Details are fuzzy and I'm probably making up what I don't remember but it does seem like he talked about and got into the nuts and bolts of the "drivetrain" and the lack of "u-joints" because "engineers" were unwilling to risk running them "dry" and no grease available is still "grease" rather than "ice" on the surface of the moon "in the shade" so that contraption was selected. But on the rovers all the "suspension" is in the piano-wire "tires" which are kind of like the "steel-belted" part of a "steel-belted radial" minus the rubber. Because rubber is also "ice" on the moon in the shade. But because the suspension was the "tire" and the "ring gear" was attached to the "wheel" and the "drive" also served as the "spindle" and "bearing" with the "sun gear" being driven by an electric motor at each corner and the "carrier" was attached to the "chassis", the end result was that the gears ended up being more of an "internal spur gear" setup rather than an obviously unnecessary and "impossible" ratcheting-type set-up with "anti-rotation links" raising and lowering the sun gear in and out of mess with the ring gear. Maybe the sun gear was on the bottom of the ring gear or maybe it was on top. I can't remember and it doesn't matter. What matters is that is a clusterfuck of a "drive" that literally was and is good only for a single, special and highly "exotic" application and its more or less "worthless" for everything else.
I was looking for the grounded/stationary element too. It must be a shaft that goes through the center of the roller and fixed in place off screen. I looked through some of his other videos searching for evidence of this -- without luck.
Tom, that is just beautiful! the black handwheel and bearing mounts, silver steel and the bronze coloured pieces. It is great seeing and hearing it turn over. Somehow it reminds me of the Victorian older machines one sees in restored museums such as pumping stations and the like. Just gorgeous, efficient art work that will do a great job for eons of time in the future. Brilliant and well done.
Thanks Dan,
I'll take a bow on that nice compliment. Chris mentioned Victorian machinery as well. I didn't consciously think of that when I worked it up but now that you mention it I agree. I guess I'll be looking for a pinstriper pretty soon.
All the best,
Tom
Beautiful machine work! I have a small pop up camper that employs something very similar. It’s a two stage wabbler. One set of gears rotates one way the other set rotates the opposite way with the eccentric gear in between the two output gears all contained in one gearbox. It is operated with a hand crank.
"Cycl-Ox-Drive"!!! Wow, the hand wheel looks so nice..... in motion! The accuracy of the flame cut is unreal!
Hey Joe,
I think I hypnotized myself watching the wheel spin around. Its like a really expensive relaxation mobile.
Cheers,
Tom
Great video Tom......form meets function. I really like the thought you have put into the aesthetics on this. Thanks, Sean.
Hi Sean,
Thanks for the nice comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Wow that is one cool looking gear drive, awesome design. That is definitely work to be proud of of.
Thanks, Ian Little
Hi Ian,
Thanks for the comment and compliment.
Cheers,
Tom
That really is a beautiful piece of machinery you've created, Tom. Comes to life when it's running.
I keep watching the first minute as there's something fascinating about the way it moves. Perhaps you should make a relaxation video of it just turning for an hour or so :)
Hey El,
Thanks for the nice comment. It is kind of a soothing sound. Might have to package it and make a meditation tape for gearheads.
Cheers,
Tom
I have limited form tool experience but in what I have found it works better for me to do the cut in two directions so the form meets in the middle rather than the end. It seems to reduce cutting forces chatter and make it easier to blend. So I would have cut over then backed out come all the way in and plunged, then backed out and gone over again then repeat the back out and plunge and do that until I had my form cut.
It also appeared in your test run that the shaft speed was speeding up and slowing down with each revolution? Looks like maybe the weight of the anti rotation arm was speeding it up when gravity could take over. For the application it probably does not matter but would maybe the addition of a friction brake smooth the rotational motion out?
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that uneven speed is caused by the anti-rotation arm swinging from side to side which causes the centre gear to rotate slightly backwards and forwards. When it's rotating the same way as the ring gear it's rotation is added to the ring gear which speeds it up, and when it's turning the opposite way it's subtracted which slows it down. If the centre gear was constrained by a parallel-motion linkage so that the arm stayed vertical then the speed would be constant ... I think. But I'm guessing that the speed variation doesn't matter anyway for this application
The drive is not a constant velocity drive. In fact the curve is a cycloid. The back and forth you noticed (sharp eyes) is because there is no load on the system so the lash between the gears can fall backward with gravity. All that will go away when the system is loaded in use.
On the radius cut I was pretty close to the chuck. I didn't want to Bozo it by moving two axes at once.
All the best,
Tom
It will wear in nicely. What do you plan on using for lubrication?
Hi James,
Whale oil. Need to find me a whale to flense to extract the oil.
Cheers,
Tom
So you are moving to Iceland? Finland? Do you speak Japanese?
oxtoolco Well when you go for your whale oil, don't forget to get your beef hooked as well....
James Kilroy Elska að borða hvali
oxtoolco Ég heyri að það er mjög gott!
I am loving this project, seems like your planning and detail work have served you well, seems to operate quite smoothly. What is the name of that hole punch machine you have that has all the different punch/dies in it, kind of a rotary shapped?
Hey Tom,
Its a Rotex 18A turret punch. Thanks for the comment. They are still in business in San Leandro California. You won't like the new prices for these.......
Cheers,
Tom
That press is going to be such a beautiful machine, Tom. This is my favorite ongoing project on UA-cam. SV Seeker's boat is a close second.
Hi Pest,
Well that is a nice comment. Doug's boat is quite the project. That boy has some energy. I think his Junk and the press will weigh about the same amount.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom,
I'm impressed by the quality of a flame cut on those parts.
I was blowing as strong as I could on my screen to clear the smoke, but California is really too far from me to do any good...
Coming along nicely.
Cheers,
Pierre
Hey Pierre,
I felt some wind on my neck. Thanks!
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom,
Great job man, the big wheel reminds me of my uncle's vintage printing press!
Thanks,
Ray
Hey Ray,
Thanks for stopping by. You have any pictures of your uncles press?
Cheers,
Tom
very nice... This kind of gear with very soft, can be used in the buffer device.
Great video. Nice job of cutting the radius. Did you just forget to do that in the first place or discover it later? Thanks for sharing.
Hey Harold,
I didn't have it in the layout. After putting it together it was totally obvious that it needed one. One of the differences between the virtual world and the real world.
Cheers,
Tom
Tom, was any consideration given to swapping the cuts of the inner and outer gear? I'm assuming the reason it was riding on the outside on the outer gear is due to the flame cut kerf angle. I would think if you flipped the inner gear so the taller portion of the kerf was on the inside it would allow the gears to mesh better.
Hi Bradley,
Nothing other than a brain fart. I had the gears oriented with the pierce side up since they arrived. I didn't even think to flip one over. When I tested it on the bench with the eccentric was the first indicator there were some high spots. The interference is not bad at all. A little filing and sanding is taking care of it.
All the best,
Tom
Where is that rewind button anyway! Nice work regardless!
The number of spokes and diameter of handwheel give the illusion of a much higher gear reduction. Watched the section of you rotating it several times just to see the movement of the pieces. Pretty cool.
Colin ;-)
Hey Colin,
Thanks for stopping by. Pretty compact for 18:1. Can you imagine the mess of chains and sprockets you would need to get that ratio.
All the best,
Tom
I imagine best would be a planetary set but aesthetically the wabble is better looking.
Why not use some fine grinding paste? I'm really pleased to see the mechanism in operation, such an elegant solution! Regards, Matthew
Hi Matthew,
That might work. The contact points are a bit heavy for that right now. Filing them off seems to be the right method for now. I will run it for a while until I'm satisfied its good.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom
Enjoyed, thanks for sharing/showing the progress....as I watched you get close with the radius tool, all I could think was I know Tom won't mar (leave a line) on the face but I know I would...LOL
Chuck
Hey Chuck,
Thanks for the vote of confidence. Knowing when to stop is half of what you learn in forty years. Just say stop would be a good motto. Thanks for stopping by.
--Tom
Thanks for doing these videos on your project. I never get to see the end product of my burning. It is really cool to see this project coming along. Thanks for doing the videos and calling me out in your video. I picked up a few more subs thanks to you. I hope I can live up to their expectation. Lol
Hey Steve,
Thank you again for making the gears possible. Its a much better story if a couple of tubers get together and horse trade than me ordering some cut from a steel house right? for me its about the process and my interaction with the people and materials needed to do a project like this.
All the best,
Tom
May I inquire what would this machine use as a final product? I mean it is an beautiful machine, but that huge torque will be used on what? a grinder? bender? ring roller?
Hi Miguel,
Thanks for the comment. The gear reducer is for a large intaglio etching press. Used to imprint paper with an image carved or etched into a zinc or copper plate. Google intaglio or something like Goya etching to see some examples of prints from a machine like this. Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Yes I know what is intaglio, it was etched in our minds in art class in college, many beautiful examples where shown, including the really old ones. Thanks for your prompt answer.
Hi Tom
Wav, it looks really, really nice - great job !
The big wheel is very nice too - that shiny black paint - looks really nice and prof !
I noticed though in the begining of the video where the big wheel is turning, then the small wheel (the slow side of the gear) is NOT turning in a constant speed - sometimes it slows down - why ? Maybe it's because you don't have this anti-rotation-part mounted yet or at least I think you don't - I can't see it.
I don't think there could be so much mis-mesh in the teeth - right ?
In fact you should only sand down the high spots to get them to mesh exactly - right ?
When finished should the gear run in any kind of lube ?
Long to see more of this fantastic project !
Hi Keld,
You are correct that this is not a constant velocity drive. In fact the curve is a cycloid. There is a lot of clearance in the gear teeth but this is not a problem. The system gets loaded in one direction at a time. If it was constantly reversing it would need to be fitted much closer. The gears will be nickel plated and lubricated with light grease once in a while. Thanks for the comment and great questions.
Cheers,
Tom
Very artistic A+. Does the wabble drive output move in a surging motion or does it just appear that way in the video? Thank you for sharing.
Hi Diy,
The output is actually cylcloidal. So you are correct that its not constant velocity. There is some back and forth now because their is no load on the drive. Its just idling in bearings. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hey Tom, the press is taking shape and looking awesome. When OSHA gets done you'll Be covered in perforated screen.
Hey Dennis,
I'm calling it my holiday nutcracker. The safety nazis would have a field day with this one.
cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco SHhhhh! They're snooping! lol Next thing will be a warning label stating "WARNING: Turning this hand wheel will cause rotation." lmao
That thing is not a machine, it's art!
Hi Johan,
Thanks for the nice compliment.
All the best,
Tom
In the video it looks like the rotational speed of the output varies while I'm sure the hand wheel must be turning at a constant rate. Is that an optical illusion?
Those gears remind me of the oil pump gears from a Detroit Diesel engine my brother brought home from his job once.
Hi Clock,
Thanks for the comment. These gears are also used for hoists for spare tires on GM trucks. Somebody showed me the guts of one recently.
Cheers,
Tom
looking really cool tom
Hi Andy,
Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I notice that the output doesn't turn smoothly, it accelerates and decelerates in comparison to the input. Will the move-pause-move action have an effect on the print?
Once its loaded up in one direction it should be less herky jerky. The output is not constant velocity but that does not effect the printing process. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Greetings from Slovenia.
Nice to see you using tool made in Slovenija :)
Anyway, great video as always !
Hi George,
And a fine tool it is. The padded handles are excellent. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Tom, three questions. First, what type of steel are the wobble gears made of? Why did you choose that steel? Would a waterjet have resulted in a more accurate profile than flame/plasma?
Hi Thomas,
The steel is A-36. The profile is not supposed to need great accuracy which is one of its advantages. These were produced by forging and casting and used net shape. I'm just a little fussier than normal for the fit. Yes WJ would probably have given be a little better accuracy. However I was also horse trading with another tuber that cuts steel for a living.
Cheers,
Tom
Hi Tom
Overall this press is going to run pretty smooth - congratulations on a great desing.
No matter how smooth it runs it will not compete with how smoothly you erased
the 'Railway Thermite' video to do off your whiteboard.....
LOL and thanks Rod
Hey Rod,
Man I thought I made it. You noticed apparently. I should have changed one letter at a time until it said something else. Totally busted.
Cheers,
Tom
So it looks like that gear reduction runs at an inconsistent speed. Kinda reminds me of a shaper and how the drive unit in it gets the faster return stroke. Did you expect that change in speeds?
Hi Jeff,
You are right it is not constant velocity. In fact it describes a Cycloid as it turns. For this application its not important. Also the output has no load on it and can flop around a little. Once the drive is loaded in one direction or the other is shouldn't flop back and forth but will still have the cycloidal motion. Good eye.
All the best,
Tom
Why not put some lapping compound in there and run it with an electric motor to bed the gearset?
Hey Perry,
The mesh is not that accurate. I have filed most of the spots and will run it some more to get a better fitup. I don't think lapping compound is aggressive enough right now.
Cheers,
Tom
Nice video as always! i really like watching your video's, people can learn a lot from you.
Hi Peter,
Thanks for the nice comment.
All the best,
Tom
should have called this one smoke gets in your eyes grins great video
Hey Bleu,
Thanks for stopping by and leaving a comment.
All the best,
Tom
Very Cool demo of the gears, I love learning new things and had a difficult time picturing in my head how the gears were going to work together. Thank you for clearing that mess up.
It's another wonderful effect that UA-cam and great videos like this have on my visual based learning center, different that learning from a book, which I can do, but having it shown to you while it's described by Professor Ox Wizard makes things as clear as crystal...or casting resin ;)
Be on the lookout for something coming for you to put your hands on, just a prototype but something tactile.
Aloha...Chuck
Hey Chuck,
Just doing my part to help melon eaters all over. Man those looked good.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco
Well then, since I forgot to bring you guys fresh melons when I came for a visit, I will just have to add a pack of some dried goodies to the package I'm sending you on Monday. The neighbor down the road still has melons and he's offered me some and I'll just have to make some more!
Stan can't be the only one who gets melons, even though it was for Mrs. Zinkowsky per request. I will spread the wealth as he said they were pretty good :)
Aloha...Chuck
Once well mated, will you harden the gear teeth to reduce long-term wear?
Hi Gorilla,
I don't think I will do any special treatment to the teeth. The teeth are large and have a large contact area. This is my story at least. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Can you jus use valve grinding compound to "lap" it in?
That might work. The problem with valve grinding compound is it will embed in the steel and stay. Filing seems to be working well right now. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
What is that device you use to center tools on the lathe?
Hi Darren,
Its a special height gage so I can calibrate the center height. Hardinge makes one that I adapted for my larger lathe. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
that thing is a work of art.
Hey Jim,
Thanks for the comment and compliment.
All the best,
Tom
figure when that is done it will be art in and of it itself.....be one heck of a paperweight Really impressive! too:-0)
You look like Darth Vadar with your multi-colored pens. Similar to his multi-colored lights/buttons on his respirator vest. :)
Blaine Bugaski Hey Blain,
Do not underestimate the power of the dark side. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Thanks for your enjoyable videos as well.
Isn't this sort of drive not a real gear reduction, in that you get more torque out of a normal gear reduction in exchange for speed, and you're doing nothing but slowing down the big wheel without getting any increase in power? Wouldn't you want the torque to aid in forcing things through the press?
+phookadude Hi Phook,
It is a true gear reduction. Take a look at harmonic gear reducers. The principle is similar. There is a mechanical advantage here that is 18:1 ratio. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Hey Tom,
You're a regular "wabble rouser"! You may be on vacation, but you are still back to the old "grind"! I think 2 disgusting puns per comment is about it. Any more and you will block me from commenting on your channel! Anyway . . . nice work on the drive guts to the etching press. Does the drive operate a platen or a cylinder to hold the sheet of paper? Does the paper holding device move or does the printing plate move on a carriage (like the Hilderberg cylinder press)? Thanks for another interesting video! It will be great to see the machine in action!
Have a good one!
Dave
Hey Dave,
The drive rotates a large cylinder. The paper and plate are on a platen that is pulled between the two main rolls. Kind of like a laundry wringer but on a bigger scale. The pressure at the nip point squeezes the plate into the paper and transfers the ink.
cheers,
Tom
Nice close up.
Hi Tridac,
Yeah you can see the less than perfect finish of the radius tool. But thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
Great vid , Thanks !!
That handwheel looks great powder coated!
The drive really does have a high reduction ratio, how long does it take to pass a plate through the rollers?
Speaking of rollers, do you have the material for them yet?
Andre
Hi Andre,
That will depend on how big the plate is. The roll diameter is 8 inches so the linear speed will be fairly good with a 25 inch circumference. It takes eighteen turns to move 25 inches which takes maybe a minute just spinning the wheel. In actual use the pressing will probably be much slower. Have to wait and see.
Cheers,
Tom
But that sounded great when you span it, the rattle clank of true Victorian machinery, one of the world's best sounds. Now you are going to risk spoiling it, oh the youth of today! :>)
ATB
c
Hey Chris,
High praise indeed. Thank you sir! It does have that quiet clickity clack that you see in some mechanical equipment. I'm quite pleased so far.
Cheers,
Tom
And so you should be, it is looking, and sounding, like something special.
dang, that's like 4000 ft/lbs of torque at the main roll!!! (with 100 lbs of input force)
Hey Perry,
That will leave a blood blister if you're not careful. Should put the squash on the etching plates. Thanks for stopping by.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco That roller would be like the old wringer style washing machines where the lady doing the laundry had to watch and not bend over the wringer rollers too far. I believe those were the forerunners of the Mammogram without the x-rays.
Tom: Very Nice!
made in Slovenia? interesting indeed
Now that's a dremel!
Foredom tools are awesome, and surprisingly affordable.
+OuijaSTi are you saying I can a"foredem"?? lol
woooowwww!!! Great Job!!!!
I love my impact driver it is the greatest since slice bread!!!
Russel Jacobson Hey Russel,
I'm with you. I really like this Makita impact. Thanks for the comment.
Cheers,
Tom
I'd love to be able to waste time like this.
Made in Slovenia no less!
I prefer skinny chicks.
I'll bet you weren't happy once you put a real load on that "output shaft", were you? That "drive" is an engineering "joke" that apparently lots of "professional engineers" simply don't "get" until its way too late to be even slightly "funny". What works for "NASA" on a LUNAR ROVER in a far different "application" where that "output shaft" would be the INPUT SHAFT and the "handwheel" the wheel assembly of the LUNAR ROVER isn't worth a SHIT when "repurposed" in a "similar" but "backward" application and one where the "cardinal rule" of "planetary gearsets" is "violated" which is the case with your setup.
The "cardinal rule"? ONE "ELEMENT" OF A "PLANETARY" GEARSET HAS TO BE "HELD STATIONARY" OR THE RESULT IS "NEUTRAL". And if that "element" is the "driven gear" in a "Wabble Drive" and "anti-rotation links" have to be used to allow the "drive gear" to "raise" and "advance" and "lower" and "advance" to drive the driven gear "one tooth at a time", then you have TWO "held stationary" elements once the entire unit is assembled and THAT is the SECOND CARDINAL RULE VIOLATION. What is the SECOND CARDINAL RULE OF PLANETARIES? IF YOU HAVE TWO "HELD STATIONARY" ELEMENTS YOU HAVE "PARK".
But without those links and with the output shaft only "held stationary" once you get enough load "on" the drum cranking a "plate" through and the other two elements "free" you STILL get "neutral", don't you? And you can't use those "anti-rotation links" in the "final design" either because obviously whatever "shaft" the drive gear they're cycling up and down and the "shaft" that's driving it ALL HAVE TO "FLOAT" UP AND DOWN TAKING THE GEARS OUT OF MESH AND INTO "NEUTRAL" EVERY TIME THEY RAISE AND PUTTING IT IN "PARK" EVERY TIME THEY LOWER ONCE YOU HAVE A REAL LOAD "ON" THE DRUM.
Seriously, if you want to know how to "design" and "engineer" EFFICIENTLY and PRACTICALLY and produce something that WORKS GOOD WHICH MAKES YOU LOOK A HELL OF A LOT SMARTER THAN SOMETHING THAT "LOOKS COOL" AND DOESN'T WORK AT ALL, TRY TALKING TO OR LISTENING TO OR GETTING THE SAME "EDUCATION" AS OR USE THE SAME "RESOURCES" FOR LEARNING ABOUT/FIXING/DESIGNING/IMPROVING MECHANICAL SYSTEMS AS.....PLAIN OLD "MECHANICS". "MECHANICAL ENGINEERS" DIDN'T EVEN "EXIST" UNTIL ALL THE "HARD" AND "CHALLENGING" AND "THEORETICAL" AND "PRACTICAL" AND "SCIENTIFIC" WORK OF "ENGINEERING" PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING WE HAVE TODAY HAD ALREADY BEEN DONE BY "MECHANICS". AND NOT TO BE "SMART" OR "COOL" OR "GET RICH" OR "GET FAMOUS" BUT SIMPLY TO DO WHAT TRUE "ENGINEERING" HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT AND WILL ALWAYS BE ABOUT. WHICH IS "SOLVING PROBLEMS" THAT EXISTING "SOLUTIONS" TO OTHER POSSIBLY "SIMILAR" PROBLEMS DO NOT "SOLVE".
YOU DIDN'T HAVE A PROBLEM UNSOLVABLE BY SEVERAL EXISTING SOLUTIONS BESIDES WANTING TO LOOK LIKE A MASTER-MACHINIST AND EXPERT-ENGINEER. BOTH A SIMPLE "SPUR GEAR" DESIGN OR A "COMPLEX" TRUE PLANETARY DESIGN WOULD HAVE WORKED "PERFECTLY" WHILE THAT CUSTERFUCK NON-SOLUTION TO THE ACTUAL "PROBLEM" OF HOW TO TURN THAT GIANT HANDWHEEL "FAST" AND THE DRUM "SLOW" OBVIOUSLY IS NOT ONLY NOT A SOLUTION BUT NO DOUBT GAVE YOU A WHOLE PILE OF OTHER PROBLEMS. OR AT LEAST ONE BIG ONE WHICH WAS LEARNING/DECIDING TO SAY "OOPS" AND "I FUCKED UP" AND "THIS WILL/WOULD NEVER WORK" AND JUST WALKING AWAY. OF COURSE AS AN "EDUCATOR" IN THESE VIDEOS YOU "SHOULD" ALSO "FESS UP" TO YOUR "FOLLOWERS" AND "FANS" AND "STUDENTS" AND LET THEM ALL BENEFIT FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE AND NEW-FOUND WISDOM AND "PROFESSIONALISM" SINCE TEACHING PEOPLE ITS "OK" TO MAKE MISTAKES AND IF YOU'RE NOT MAKING MISTAKES YOU'RE NOT DOING/LEARNING ANYTHING WORTHWHILE ANYWAY.
BUT I'VE SEEN REPEATED COMMENTS ON MANY VIDEOS ABOUT THE "DISAPPEARING" ETCHING PRESS PROJECT AND I'M CERTAIN YOU DIDN'T JUST "FORGET" ABOUT IT AND YOU RESPOND TO COMMENTS YOU LIKE AND THAT MAKE YOU FEEL GOOD/SMART SO I ASSUME YOU'VE "MOVED ON" AND AREN'T WILLING TO REALLY "HELP" PEOPLE BY "FESSING UP" AND EVEN BETTER "FIXING" THE "MISTAKE" BY "REDESIGNING" THE PRESS WITH WHAT WOULD/WILL OBVIOUSLY BE MAYBE A LESS "EXOTIC" GEAR SET BUT AN INFINITELY MORE "ELEGANT" ONE GIVEN IT WOULD ACTUALLY WORK.
Of course there are lots of etching presses out there factory-made across a wide range of sizes, shapes, designs, costs and "ages" both new and used and "similar" presses to your design probably new or used aren't much if any more expensive than what you've got in the parts you "outsourced' or WOULD HAVE if just a regular machinist working on paying OR personal project and paying "retail" for that stuff and not being able to "trade" mentions of the "suppliers" in a UA-cam video for "discounted" or "free" parts. And as a "honey-do" project I imagine your "better half" had a "sooner" rather than "later" timeframe in mind for her new "venture" and probably either got tired of waiting and bought a "commercial" press or got bored of the whole idea in the meantime and moved on OR you actually did "start over" and redesign and "cranked out" the "new and improved" press ASAP long ago and just didn't have time to "document" that process or didn't make time for various reasons.
It doesn't matter to me what actually happened and its your deal and whether or not you "fess up" or not or anything else about the "missing press" is really none of my business and all of yours. I've fucked up and didn't fess up, too. But I still think that as an "educator" with a lot of viewers who are more or less your "students" and with plenty of them being less "experienced" and "wise" in the realities of even "experts" making "stupid mistakes" than I know I am and I assume you are, it would be the best lesson possible to "finish" the etching press project in a "wrap-up" video regardless of what the actual "story" is.
And I'm NOT "trashing" you or your ability and skill as a machinist, engineer or mechanic at all. That's some pretty kick-ass machining AND "engineering" AND "mechanicking" and I had to "study" those "drives" for a little while before I "got" the "joke" and did some online research and saw the lunar rover reference and did some recollecting about my personal experience with a "replica" lunar rover and real-deal astronaut damned near 30 years ago as a result. Details are fuzzy and I'm probably making up what I don't remember but it does seem like he talked about and got into the nuts and bolts of the "drivetrain" and the lack of "u-joints" because "engineers" were unwilling to risk running them "dry" and no grease available is still "grease" rather than "ice" on the surface of the moon "in the shade" so that contraption was selected. But on the rovers all the "suspension" is in the piano-wire "tires" which are kind of like the "steel-belted" part of a "steel-belted radial" minus the rubber. Because rubber is also "ice" on the moon in the shade.
But because the suspension was the "tire" and the "ring gear" was attached to the "wheel" and the "drive" also served as the "spindle" and "bearing" with the "sun gear" being driven by an electric motor at each corner and the "carrier" was attached to the "chassis", the end result was that the gears ended up being more of an "internal spur gear" setup rather than an obviously unnecessary and "impossible" ratcheting-type set-up with "anti-rotation links" raising and lowering the sun gear in and out of mess with the ring gear. Maybe the sun gear was on the bottom of the ring gear or maybe it was on top. I can't remember and it doesn't matter. What matters is that is a clusterfuck of a "drive" that literally was and is good only for a single, special and highly "exotic" application and its more or less "worthless" for everything else.
I was looking for the grounded/stationary element too. It must be a shaft that goes through the center of the roller and fixed in place off screen. I looked through some of his other videos searching for evidence of this -- without luck.