Hi Dave, Thank you for all the amazing recommendations! I am getting my PhD in Hurwitz and it is delightful. You are a treasure. Please keep up all the excellent work. Warmest Regards, Allen Glass II
Thank you so much for sharing your passion and insights with us, Dave. My music library has benefited greatly from your imparted wisdom. I'm definitely keeping on listening!
Thanks for bringing this to my life. This sound like Beethoven unfiltered. It is magnificent. I will listen to this a lot. The other two symphonies are also beautiful. I will listen to this regularly.
Hadn’t heard this one before. Just listened to the first movement on my phone, and even with the sound limitations, I find it delightful. I love how there’s no quashing of the winds, brass and percussion. Thanks Dave!
You know, I wanted to be really snotty and exalt all things Kleiber and "how dare you not say Kleiber's Beethoven 5 is THE gold standard." However, I just listened to Markevitch's version and, I've got to hand it to you, Dave. It was magic. Thank you for the reccomendation.
I never heard of Markevitch and Orchestre Lamoureux until I watch your introduction to this performance of Beethoven Symphony No. 5. And in my opinion, this is the best, most exciting, and outstanding performance I have heard. I agree with your comments point by point. I thought Kleiber with the Vienna Philharmonic is the best interpretation. Now I believe Markevitch is, as you mentioned, closer to the composer’s mindset. The Philips recording is definitely better than the DG recoding. It presents all the key elements of the instruments at the right moment. Thank you very much for your introduction to such a wonderful performance
This is an absolutely stonking B5, but one that I hadn't heard until your recommendation a few years ago - since then I've got the DG and Philips boxes - thanks for really introducing me to this great musician
I’m looking forward to hearing Markevich’s. The 5th that I’ve heard recently that blew me away was Dorati’s with LSO on Mercury Living Presence. I felt like I was hearing the last movement for the first time - amazing!
Didn't know this one, so cued it up, it was awesome. It was like heavy metal--the rock hard tympani mallets and super-bright brass playing give especially the second and fourth movements a completely unique and brilliant sound to my ears. Also love all of Markevitch's interesting details with color and texture. A rousing and dramatic 5th, thanks for the recommendation.
One of the things I enjoy about this channel is filling the vast lacunae in my knowledge of classical music and recordings. Yes, I admit this is a recording I am completely unfamiliar with, and in fact, this conductor has somehow evaded my radar for over 40 years of listening. As I write this, I am listening to the recording on Presto's streaming service, where it is also available for purchase as a download in case anyone is interested. Incidentally, the Presto recording was released in 2021 on a series called "Markevitch - The Philips Legacy", which includes Symphonies 1, 5, and 8. I'm not sure if this is the same packaging as the CD that Dave is brandishing, but I suspect the recording of the 5th and 8th is the same, perhaps with the addition of Symphony 1, a worthy expansion in my view. By the way, I agree that Kleiber is very good but not the best IMHO.
I luckily found and purchased the Orfeo CD of Szell’s Beethoven concert a few years ago; it is fabulous. The Markevitch Beethoven 5 is on my iPhone and also excellent. So happy to have both of these.
A little side remark about "schlampiges" playing and french symphonic tradition: After Bernstein once had finished a recording of Berlioz Symphonie fantastique the recording engineer told him, that the intonation of the trombones had been bad, Bernstein answered: "Yes you are right! But didn't it sound marvelous?!"
My personal favorite recording of the 5th that I've heard is Szell with the Cleveland Orchestra - so I would LOVE to get my hands on that Szell/Vienna live recording.
Kleiber has that whiplash beginning and incredible drive. So I totally understand why he has the consensus largely on his side. But that being said, there is room enough in this town for multiple best ever recordings :)
I have not heard this one yet, but everything by Markevitch I have heard is superb! Agree that he is a fantastic conductor who should have received more acclaim. Look forward to checking this out...
I'll be wanting to search for this. Just a few weeks ago I had one of those "as if hearing it for the first time" experiences when I put on Barenboim's, whose complete set I had bought on your recommendation. It was immediately arresting, and the Statskapelle Berlin sounded especially colorful. A revelation for me.
This one is a smoker! You know, the funny thing is one could've listened the 5th a bizillion times, know it by heart, and listening to this recordings is like listening to the 5th for the first time... and that is a great feeling.
Ordered the Markevitch/Beethoven box because of your discussion and this 5th is indeed my new favorite. I find it thrilling. There is something he does with crescendos that I don't know how to describe that creates a tension and release effect different from anyone else I've heard. Likewise agree about the Kleiber which is fine but also doesn't actually move me. (Heard him do it with CSO in Chicago way back and it was very fast and exciting, but also a bit ragged somehow.) Sadly, the sound on some of the other Markevitch box recordings is startlingly poor, even for the period. But the 5th and 9th are stunners.
Just listened to Keilberth's Beethoven 5 from the Warner Icon box - focused, controlled but passionate as well. The whole box is a revelation, by the way- worth reviewing?
Read this and went and listened. Totally agree! What a great performance. I've always enjoyed Keilberth's Wagner, but I'm off to enjoy the rest of the Warner box. Would be great if Dave reviewed it....and it's still available!
A short confession about Carlos Kleiber (and his Beethovens - esp 3rd & 5th): I prefer Carlos' father, for the latter's more expressive performance. This was before I caught on to the hype, no doubt justified, about Carlos. I happened to hear that there is a good fifth by a Kleiber. So I went out and purchased it -- Erich's with the Concertgebouw. Then, I discovered that there is another Kleiber . Of coourse I like Markevitch a lot, but then I am alswyas partial to dynamics, good road-holding, and dynamics!
You know Dave, you're right. Markevitch's Beethoven Five is a belter. I hadn't played it in years and it came out of the box sounding powerful, incisive and as fresh as a daisy. And yes, Markevitch made some excellent recordings with the Lamoureux, not least a Symphonie Fantastique which in my view beats all others. I'm also with you on Carlos Kleiber's VPO Beethoven 5, which to my ears is a very good - but not great - interpretation and recording. His dad did it much better, as did Eugene Jochum (the LSO one in particular, Carlo Maria Giulini (LAPO), Otto Klemperer (his 1955 mono version) and the young Seiji Ozawa in Chicago, to list just a few of the personal favourites from the 200+ recordings of Beethoven 5 that I own. Couldn't go past Furtwaengler (1943) or Toscanini (1939) either. Impossible to pick which of these is the best. Schnabel hit the nail on the head when he talked about Beethoven's music being "better than it could ever be played".
Hello: I was going to mention that Szell version with the Vienna Philharmonic, 1969 (ORFEO), but you already said so. I like it better than the Concertgebouw (Philips), and, of course, also better than the one in his Cleveland integral. But I would like to observe something, I don't know what you think. And that is that the 5th of John Elliot Gardiner's integral (the first integral, from the eighties, nineties), seems to me to be Carlos Kleiber's version within the historicist line. I have known your videos recently and I enjoy listening to you. Could you post the details of the recording of the 5th by Markevich, so that I can request it from someone? Yours sincerely.
When you talk about Beethoven recordings, I always miss the mention of René Leibowitz. Coudn't one understand his performances as the bridge between tradition and "original performance practice", especially concerning the tempi?
Hi Dave, Thank you for all the amazing recommendations! I am getting my PhD in Hurwitz and it is delightful. You are a treasure. Please keep up all the excellent work. Warmest Regards, Allen Glass II
Thank you very much! You are so welcome!
Thank you so much for sharing your passion and insights with us, Dave. My music library has benefited greatly from your imparted wisdom. I'm definitely keeping on listening!
My library has benefited greatly as well - and has expanded GREATLY! 😊
Thanks for bringing this to my life. This sound like Beethoven unfiltered. It is magnificent. I will listen to this a lot. The other two symphonies are also beautiful. I will listen to this regularly.
Hadn’t heard this one before. Just listened to the first movement on my phone, and even with the sound limitations, I find it delightful. I love how there’s no quashing of the winds, brass and percussion. Thanks Dave!
Best Fifth I’ve ever heard! Thanks, Dave, and shanah tovah.
You know, I wanted to be really snotty and exalt all things Kleiber and "how dare you not say Kleiber's Beethoven 5 is THE gold standard." However, I just listened to Markevitch's version and, I've got to hand it to you, Dave. It was magic. Thank you for the reccomendation.
Thanks for listening with an open mind!
I never heard of Markevitch and Orchestre Lamoureux until I watch your introduction to this performance of Beethoven Symphony No. 5. And in my opinion, this is the best, most exciting, and outstanding performance I have heard. I agree with your comments point by point.
I thought Kleiber with the Vienna Philharmonic is the best interpretation. Now I believe Markevitch is, as you mentioned, closer to the composer’s mindset.
The Philips recording is definitely better than the DG recoding. It presents all the key elements of the instruments at the right moment.
Thank you very much for your introduction to such a wonderful performance
This is an absolutely stonking B5, but one that I hadn't heard until your recommendation a few years ago - since then I've got the DG and Philips boxes - thanks for really introducing me to this great musician
Great video Dave
Thank you so much
Haven’t heard this but now I will; Szell is my fav but if this is even better I am all for it.
I’m looking forward to hearing Markevich’s. The 5th that I’ve heard recently that blew me away was Dorati’s with LSO on Mercury Living Presence. I felt like I was hearing the last movement for the first time - amazing!
Hear hear! This is my favourite also - the precision, the basslines, the sneakiness, the triumph!! (If only it was available for download!)
Always a breath of fresh air. Merci beaucoup.
Didn't know this one, so cued it up, it was awesome. It was like heavy metal--the rock hard tympani mallets and super-bright brass playing give especially the second and fourth movements a completely unique and brilliant sound to my ears. Also love all of Markevitch's interesting details with color and texture. A rousing and dramatic 5th, thanks for the recommendation.
One of the things I enjoy about this channel is filling the vast lacunae in my knowledge of classical music and recordings. Yes, I admit this is a recording I am completely unfamiliar with, and in fact, this conductor has somehow evaded my radar for over 40 years of listening. As I write this, I am listening to the recording on Presto's streaming service, where it is also available for purchase as a download in case anyone is interested. Incidentally, the Presto recording was released in 2021 on a series called "Markevitch - The Philips Legacy", which includes Symphonies 1, 5, and 8. I'm not sure if this is the same packaging as the CD that Dave is brandishing, but I suspect the recording of the 5th and 8th is the same, perhaps with the addition of Symphony 1, a worthy expansion in my view. By the way, I agree that Kleiber is very good but not the best IMHO.
I luckily found and purchased the Orfeo CD of Szell’s Beethoven concert a few years ago; it is fabulous. The Markevitch Beethoven 5 is on my iPhone and also excellent. So happy to have both of these.
Yes I have the Szell.
There are so many recordings of the 5th, and so many good ones, that the bad ones are easy to spot. Not so easy to spot the best. Good video.
A little side remark about "schlampiges" playing and french symphonic tradition: After Bernstein once had finished a recording of Berlioz Symphonie fantastique the recording engineer told him, that the intonation of the trombones had been bad, Bernstein answered: "Yes you are right! But didn't it sound marvelous?!"
My personal favorite recording of the 5th that I've heard is Szell with the Cleveland Orchestra - so I would LOVE to get my hands on that Szell/Vienna live recording.
I would have never believed this choice until I heard it several months ago, but I agree with you 100%!
Kleiber has that whiplash beginning and incredible drive. So I totally understand why he has the consensus largely on his side. But that being said, there is room enough in this town for multiple best ever recordings :)
the first two or three minutes of the Markevitch final movement absolutely cranks
100 percent agree. That transition from the 3rd to 4th movements is one of my favorite sections of any disc I own.
I have not heard this one yet, but everything by Markevitch I have heard is superb! Agree that he is a fantastic conductor who should have received more acclaim. Look forward to checking this out...
I'll be wanting to search for this. Just a few weeks ago I had one of those "as if hearing it for the first time" experiences when I put on Barenboim's, whose complete set I had bought on your recommendation. It was immediately arresting, and the Statskapelle Berlin sounded especially colorful. A revelation for me.
For many of us, it is the first recording we heard.
This one is a smoker! You know, the funny thing is one could've listened the 5th a bizillion times, know it by heart, and listening to this recordings is like listening to the 5th for the first time... and that is a great feeling.
Ordered the Markevitch/Beethoven box because of your discussion and this 5th is indeed my new favorite. I find it thrilling. There is something he does with crescendos that I don't know how to describe that creates a tension and release effect different from anyone else I've heard.
Likewise agree about the Kleiber which is fine but also doesn't actually move me. (Heard him do it with CSO in Chicago way back and it was very fast and exciting, but also a bit ragged somehow.)
Sadly, the sound on some of the other Markevitch box recordings is startlingly poor, even for the period. But the 5th and 9th are stunners.
Just listened to Keilberth's Beethoven 5 from the Warner Icon box - focused, controlled but passionate as well. The whole box is a revelation, by the way- worth reviewing?
Read this and went and listened. Totally agree! What a great performance. I've always enjoyed Keilberth's Wagner, but I'm off to enjoy the rest of the Warner box. Would be great if Dave reviewed it....and it's still available!
I learn so much from Hurwitz. He's fun, too.
A short confession about Carlos Kleiber (and his Beethovens - esp 3rd & 5th): I prefer Carlos' father, for the latter's more expressive performance. This was before I caught on to the hype, no doubt justified, about Carlos. I happened to hear that there is a good fifth by a Kleiber. So I went out and purchased it -- Erich's with the Concertgebouw.
Then, I discovered that there is another Kleiber .
Of coourse I like Markevitch a lot, but then I am alswyas partial to dynamics, good road-holding, and dynamics!
You know Dave, you're right. Markevitch's Beethoven Five is a belter. I hadn't played it in years and it came out of the box sounding powerful, incisive and as fresh as a daisy. And yes, Markevitch made some excellent recordings with the Lamoureux, not least a Symphonie Fantastique which in my view beats all others.
I'm also with you on Carlos Kleiber's VPO Beethoven 5, which to my ears is a very good - but not great - interpretation and recording. His dad did it much better, as did Eugene Jochum (the LSO one in particular, Carlo Maria Giulini (LAPO), Otto Klemperer (his 1955 mono version) and the young Seiji Ozawa in Chicago, to list just a few of the personal favourites from the 200+ recordings of Beethoven 5 that I own. Couldn't go past Furtwaengler (1943) or Toscanini (1939) either. Impossible to pick which of these is the best. Schnabel hit the nail on the head when he talked about Beethoven's music being "better than it could ever be played".
Hello: I was going to mention that Szell version with the Vienna Philharmonic, 1969 (ORFEO), but you already said so. I like it better than the Concertgebouw (Philips), and, of course, also better than the one in his Cleveland integral. But I would like to observe something, I don't know what you think. And that is that the 5th of John Elliot Gardiner's integral (the first integral, from the eighties, nineties), seems to me to be Carlos Kleiber's version within the historicist line.
I have known your videos recently and I enjoy listening to you.
Could you post the details of the recording of the 5th by Markevich, so that I can request it from someone?
Yours sincerely.
I thought it will be Szell 1965 live
When you talk about Beethoven recordings, I always miss the mention of René Leibowitz. Coudn't one understand his performances as the bridge between tradition and "original performance practice", especially concerning the tempi?
I don’t think so.
A truly sensational performance… way better than Kleiber VPO, as you correctly said…
Hourra pour les vraies traditions
To me the only contenders of this performance are: Solti/VPO and Wand/NDR