£70 an hour is so fair, obviously Barum is more about honest engineering without the fancy upkeep and profiteering, old school English engineering isn’t dead, not yet at least anyway.
Great update. I was well surprised that your total cost was so reasonable. I had an engine rebuilt about 15 years ago and that was about 4k, and not a Cosworth!
So, question for you Lee: why do you use oil for assembly rather than assembly paste? Assembly paste is usually used because it provides better protection at start-up but also is less prone to creeping under shell bearings etc. Generally it is better at staying where it is put unlike oil. I just wondered if there was a specific reason you prefer oil to assembly paste? Have to say, I was expecting the cost of the cosy to be more than that all in, thats actually very reasonable.
Always like to see how you build a race engine as I used to build them. My only caveat is your use of motor oil to prelube the bearings. While you would think that procedure makes sense, there is a problem of oil being pressed out when you tightened the rods and mains. With the first start the oil may spin out because the sump has not fully loaded the oil paths. That applies even if you prime the sump. I prefer Permatex Ultra Slick Engine Assembly Lube - 81950. Guarantee you will never have a dry start and the engine will thank you.
Thanks for this video . I wanted to know the cost of this for some time . Thanks for being so transparent with your figures. Very honest company. I know we're to come when I buy a cosworth. Keep up the great videos please 👍
I built a Mini race engine in 1990 for £600. How prices have risen. I have never seen you Crack Test a crankshaft. The journals burn in the radii if the grinder does not use coolant properly. I was trained in Metallurgy at Westland Helicopter's Yeovil technical college. You learnt a lot about how to build reliable engineered parts. My local Landrover specialist charges £10,000 to rebuild and fit a Land Rover Discovery 4 TDV83.0 engine. Charge for forty hours, you are missing out the workshop charges. We charged for a machine shop £130 an hour twenty years ago.
Great video, Lee. Thank you once again. How about line boring? When is it necessary? How is that state detected? And how much do you charge for that service? BTW, the kudos go for both channels!
I have notices that you do not remove the sharp edge of the cylinder bottom edge as most race engines that I have seen have this removed to allow oil to flow clear on the piston. Removing any sharp edges helps to reduce any chance for cracks to start.
Thanks for showing this. I am surprised the number of hours is actually so low. Having been a machinist (a bad one at that) there is no way I could even dream of doing an engine in 30 to 35 hours. I guess that shows your experience!!
Depends how much experience you've had. Back in the day (around 1980) when I was a lot younger and fitter I was probably 300% faster than I am now. Even in my 50's things hadn't slowed down too much
End float on cranks, get them right too, right sized thrust bearings. Was a hefty clutch on A-series MG Metro Turbos, standard. Wears the thrusts fairly quickly, if it hasn't exploded the gearbox first.
Hi Lee. Great content. I watch as much as i can on both channels now. You say "obviously" a lot. I think you could simply leave that word out and improve your presentation a lot. Love the E30 btw. I don't live in the UK anymore but if i did. I'd send you my OM606 long block to machine up.
Hi from south africa, Awsome channel you have going. Im really quissy about why the rods have a camel back in the first place. im off to watch another of your episodes. bye
Love the video Lee. I’ll be rewatching this when I rebuild my bottom end. You mentioned the oil pumps. Do you always replace with a new pump or do you ever pull one apart and measure them to see if they can be reused?
Thanks Adam We do strip the pumps, measure and check but very rarely are the Cosworth pumps good to use again. Don’t be tempted with a pinto rebuild kit or fitting pinto pump internals to a Cosworth pump, they are made smaller although identical to look at, many will say they are the same but they’re not 👍
Cheers Lee. Try and use the proper terminology when describing parts of the re-build, ie, thrust face, journal, slip, interference fit, ovality, etc. I would check the Tolerance of the little end with a new one just to see if the Conrod is scrap. Do you use a face gauge for Conrods?, when I was doing it a lot of them were out. See you on the next one 😊
I'd have no idea where to start doing your job with so many different engine manufacturers and engines within it ! . As you know up front and honest is the best way .
That swizz cheese clutch cover got me, you have some balls to put that out on vid. Add weight with a welder, teach the youngster fgs. That cover is scrap.
Love your channel and builds Don’t understand why you have not got metal faced benches Laying parts on a old wooden bench (regardless how clean you think it is ) can’t be as clean as metal faced benches I know your builds are mega clean but I would have different bench surfaces Pls don’t think Iam knocking your build quality cuz Iam not Keep up good work
Great video as always, learned a lot without feeling overwhelmed 👍😁. Just one question, is grinding that much off the small end going to compromise the strength and integrity of that con rod?
Do you ever bob weight a flat plain crank when balancing in order to try and reduce the rocking couple effect? If so, What % factor would you use of reciprocating mass to rotating mass? I know its unorthodox but it is something to think about.
I'd like to see, as an experiment, one throw of a crank cut off and Bob weighted and put on the machine to see what sort of designed in factor a manufacturer is using.
Bob weighting is taking 100% of the rotating mass, big end , and a % of reciprocating mass, piston and little end, and adding that mass to the crank pin in the form of a Bob weight before spinning on the balancing machine. Essential on a cross plane crank like a typical V8 but less so on a flat plane crank as one going up counter acts one comming down. But the counter weights on the crank assist the dynamics. But to ensure the counter weights are as correct as possible you must decide on a balance factor. You can only really asses a crank if you cut one up to get a single cylinder throw, calculate the Bob weight and decide on the factor, then spin it up and see what it's like. If you end up with a good crank design you can apply that to a whole 4 cylinder crank, or 6. Bob weight the whole lot and then balance it. Just spinning up a flat plane crank and expecting no 1 and 2 to cancel each other out is a poor compromise
Take pictures of your engine builds on an iPhone as you build each engine, then email them into a build email address , with that job and engine number reference , You ever have a query where that engine build was done or as you go along you know exactly when it was done and you’ll also have a backup in the iPhone which if is backed up with Apple you have multiple ways to retrieve that same photo later if needed No more engine build query’s then
Really surprised at Cosworth engine rebuild cost, thought it would have cost at least twice that, when i think back at the cost of 2.0 Diesel range rover engines that would need turbos injectors etc and total cost about £15k , then Cosworth engine again only my view but seems very very cheap.
I don't know if it's possible, I mean, you're CRAZY busy, but it would be cool to do a once a month "NEWBIE" video. Obviously, there are lot of people with massive knowledge here, but there are also a lot of people who are new to this whole thing.
I wouldn't think it's possible to buy a new lump from Ford. What i do know is these engines (like all RS bits) are mega expensive used. I know a guy thats just bought and a knackered old cossie lump for 6k
There a saying Lee u pay peanuts u get monkeys .in your case thay paying for quality workmanship not some backstreet engine rebuild .the attention to detail u guys put in to building those engines is second to none ...
I would imagine the conrods have been moded, and weighed by a home builder, and done so, exactly as ive always done as a whole unit, maybe wrong, but always worked for me, as home builders do not have the equipment you have, ive also done my own balancing on crankshafts with V blocks, and never had a problem (All on Crossflows)
Your labour rate at £75 is cheap. Where I live here in the States they want $110.00 an hour. Cheaper for me to ship to you guys than have it done here. What ever happened to the Ford 289?
I was very surprised how cheap it is - I think you are not charging enough mate. It is a professional, hand built, service by experienced engineers. Way too cheap.
£70 an hour is so fair, obviously Barum is more about honest engineering without the fancy upkeep and profiteering, old school English engineering isn’t dead, not yet at least anyway.
@@alanrichardson1672 Would you not recommend Barum and do you think you could get a better standard of engine work for the same price somewhere else?
@@jaysimpson6857He only comes on here to moan, obviously has a very sad life.
@@paulpaintshop103 I’d imagine he’s a competitor to Barum who isn’t doing as well in business or he’s just a 🔔end.
Labour is. £70 per/HR
If you watch. £105 per/HR
if you help £140 per/HR
Great update. I was well surprised that your total cost was so reasonable. I had an engine rebuilt about 15 years ago and that was about 4k, and not a Cosworth!
Try keep the overheads down, like office staff, buildings.
So, question for you Lee: why do you use oil for assembly rather than assembly paste? Assembly paste is usually used because it provides better protection at start-up but also is less prone to creeping under shell bearings etc. Generally it is better at staying where it is put unlike oil. I just wondered if there was a specific reason you prefer oil to assembly paste?
Have to say, I was expecting the cost of the cosy to be more than that all in, thats actually very reasonable.
Always like to see how you build a race engine as I used to build them.
My only caveat is your use of motor oil to prelube the bearings. While you would think that procedure makes sense, there is a problem of oil being pressed out when you tightened the rods and mains. With the first start the oil may spin out because the sump has not fully loaded the oil paths. That applies even if you prime the sump. I prefer Permatex Ultra Slick Engine Assembly Lube - 81950. Guarantee you will never have a dry start and the engine will thank you.
I use the Permatex one as well, can't go wrong...
All adds up. But. When you explain it, it sounds very reasonable. A lot of work.
A very important video.Well done and very interesting.
Thanks for this video . I wanted to know the cost of this for some time . Thanks for being so transparent with your figures. Very honest company. I know we're to come when I buy a cosworth. Keep up the great videos please 👍
I built a Mini race engine in 1990 for £600. How prices have risen. I have never seen you Crack Test a crankshaft. The journals burn in the radii if the grinder does not use coolant properly. I was trained in Metallurgy at Westland Helicopter's Yeovil technical college. You learnt a lot about how to build reliable engineered parts. My local Landrover specialist charges £10,000 to rebuild and fit a Land Rover Discovery 4 TDV83.0 engine. Charge for forty hours, you are missing out the workshop charges. We charged for a machine shop £130 an hour twenty years ago.
Your bench leaves a lot to be desired. I would prefer to have a clean sheet of ply or other protective coating for my bench?
Great video, Lee. Thank you once again. How about line boring? When is it necessary? How is that state detected? And how much do you charge for that service?
BTW, the kudos go for both channels!
I think your prices are very reasonable & as soon as I can find a single cylinder cossie, I will send it to you.
I have notices that you do not remove the sharp edge of the cylinder bottom edge as most race engines that I have seen have this removed to allow oil to flow clear on the piston. Removing any sharp edges helps to reduce any chance for cracks to start.
5k for a Cossie rebuild is a great price.
Thanks for showing this. I am surprised the number of hours is actually so low. Having been a machinist (a bad one at that) there is no way I could even dream of doing an engine in 30 to 35 hours. I guess that shows your experience!!
Depends how much experience you've had. Back in the day (around 1980) when I was a lot younger and fitter I was probably 300% faster than I am now. Even in my 50's things hadn't slowed down too much
So interesting and informative! Bet there are a few engine builders learning too from what you find!!
Does taking the meat off the little ends of the rods make them weak ????
Yet another brilliant and informative video, great work Lee 👏
Another fantastic video! I Learn so much. keep doing what you are doing.
Great video. That’s a reasonable amount for a balanced and blueprinted 16 valve performance engine.
End float on cranks, get them right too, right sized thrust bearings. Was a hefty clutch on A-series MG Metro Turbos, standard. Wears the thrusts fairly quickly, if it hasn't exploded the gearbox first.
Hi Lee. Great content. I watch as much as i can on both channels now.
You say "obviously" a lot. I think you could simply leave that word out and improve your presentation a lot.
Love the E30 btw. I don't live in the UK anymore but if i did. I'd send you my OM606 long block to machine up.
"Obviously"
Love this channel! What's the score with that clutch pressure plate, or what's left of it?
Hi from south africa, Awsome channel you have going. Im really quissy about why the rods have a camel back in the first place. im off to watch another of your episodes. bye
Thanks Lee wow didn't realise it was that sort of money but I can see why.
Great video Lee. Did you take any footage of doing Adam smiths block? Be interested in seeing that if you did.
Love the videos also the new channel 👍
Love the video Lee. I’ll be rewatching this when I rebuild my bottom end.
You mentioned the oil pumps. Do you always replace with a new pump or do you ever pull one apart and measure them to see if they can be reused?
Thanks Adam
We do strip the pumps, measure and check but very rarely are the Cosworth pumps good to use again. Don’t be tempted with a pinto rebuild kit or fitting pinto pump internals to a Cosworth pump, they are made smaller although identical to look at, many will say they are the same but they’re not 👍
Good info buddy
Cheers Lee. Try and use the proper terminology when describing parts of the re-build, ie, thrust face, journal, slip, interference fit, ovality, etc. I would check the Tolerance of the little end with a new one just to see if the Conrod is scrap. Do you use a face gauge for Conrods?, when I was doing it a lot of them were out. See you on the next one 😊
I'd have no idea where to start doing your job with so many different engine manufacturers and engines within it ! . As you know up front and honest is the best way .
Very informative mate, the last time I had one of these rebuilt it was £1200 😳😂... That was about 30 years ago though lol
Great video. Very professional. ☘️
That swizz cheese clutch cover got me, you have some balls to put that out on vid. Add weight with a welder, teach the youngster fgs. That cover is scrap.
when your weighing the small ends why do you need the jig on the scale would it not weigh the same if it just layed on the scale?
it's just money. only thing we take with us when we pass, is our memories, so get out and make them memories.
Great video!
That’s a great price for a engine build would have thought it would be a lot more
I guessed £5.300 + vat at the start, so not bad considering I have not owned 1 for 10 years, not a lot of change price wise
i was wondering if you were going to add: ''doctored report for the wife...20 quid....''
Loadsa Money.
Twist those spannas.
Love your channel and builds
Don’t understand why you have not got metal faced benches
Laying parts on a old wooden bench (regardless how clean you think it is ) can’t be as clean as metal faced benches
I know your builds are mega clean but I would have different bench surfaces
Pls don’t think Iam knocking your build quality cuz Iam not
Keep up good work
Any thoughts on using a speedi sleeve if the cranks grooved ?
Great video as always, learned a lot without feeling overwhelmed 👍😁. Just one question, is grinding that much off the small end going to compromise the strength and integrity of that con rod?
Do you ever bob weight a flat plain crank when balancing in order to try and reduce the rocking couple effect? If so, What % factor would you use of reciprocating mass to rotating mass? I know its unorthodox but it is something to think about.
I'd like to see, as an experiment, one throw of a crank cut off and Bob weighted and put on the machine to see what sort of designed in factor a manufacturer is using.
Does Bob weight mean having 2 sets of scales one each end ?
Bob weighting is taking 100% of the rotating mass, big end , and a % of reciprocating mass, piston and little end, and adding that mass to the crank pin in the form of a Bob weight before spinning on the balancing machine. Essential on a cross plane crank like a typical V8 but less so on a flat plane crank as one going up counter acts one comming down. But the counter weights on the crank assist the dynamics. But to ensure the counter weights are as correct as possible you must decide on a balance factor. You can only really asses a crank if you cut one up to get a single cylinder throw, calculate the Bob weight and decide on the factor, then spin it up and see what it's like. If you end up with a good crank design you can apply that to a whole 4 cylinder crank, or 6. Bob weight the whole lot and then balance it. Just spinning up a flat plane crank and expecting no 1 and 2 to cancel each other out is a poor compromise
@@rushymoto thanks rushy
Anything old and Ford is expensive nowadays and should be expected!!
Liners haven't gone up much, Iwas paying over $80.00 in 2002 for 87mm flsnged liners.
70 £ an hour? Cheaper than where I'm at in the USA here the rate is around 116 £ an hour.
Take pictures of your engine builds on an iPhone as you build each engine, then email them into a build email address , with that job and engine number reference ,
You ever have a query where that engine build was done or as you go along you know exactly when it was done and you’ll also have a backup in the iPhone which if is backed up with Apple you have multiple ways to retrieve that same photo later if needed
No more engine build query’s then
You need a stainless steel bench top.
The brain memory muscle, comes with experience. Hence need for experts, easy to get something wrong with DIY.
Well, we weren't assuming it was cheap!!
Really surprised at Cosworth engine rebuild cost, thought it would have cost at least twice that, when i think back at the cost of 2.0 Diesel range rover engines that would need turbos injectors etc and total cost about £15k , then Cosworth engine again only my view but seems very very cheap.
When paying £6.5K + for a blue printed motor, what warranty would I get with that?
Race engines F all
I don't know if it's possible, I mean, you're CRAZY busy, but it would be cool to do a once a month "NEWBIE" video. Obviously, there are lot of people with massive knowledge here, but there are also a lot of people who are new to this whole thing.
£70 an hr would be ok with me. Main dealers changing pollen filters are £120 an hr . . . ha ha ha ha ha
How much to buy a new engine?be interesting to see the difference in price,I know there classic engines and there not built anymore
I wouldn't think it's possible to buy a new lump from Ford. What i do know is these engines (like all RS bits) are mega expensive used. I know a guy thats just bought and a knackered old cossie lump for 6k
@jimmyjt16 🫣 oh dear ,thank you for your reply👍
Need to raise your rates
Did a quick guesstimate at £4500 +vat for a basic 😎
These are all very reasonable cost on labour.
Honest days work mate.
I'd also like to say that being meticulous and thorough is what separates the proper shops.
Well done
There a saying Lee u pay peanuts u get monkeys .in your case thay paying for quality workmanship not some backstreet engine rebuild .the attention to detail u guys put in to building those engines is second to none ...
I would imagine the conrods have been moded, and weighed by a home builder, and done so, exactly as ive always done as a whole unit, maybe wrong, but always worked for me, as home builders do not have the equipment you have, ive also done my own balancing on crankshafts with V blocks, and never had a problem (All on Crossflows)
Your labour rate at £75 is cheap. Where I live here in the States they want $110.00 an hour. Cheaper for me to ship to you guys than have it done here. What ever happened to the Ford 289?
It's £70 + vat (20%) so $108
Great!
People get crazy when they here the word cosworth ! Too many 40 /50 somethings with too much disposable income , must take them back to the mid 90’s
I was very surprised how cheap it is - I think you are not charging enough mate. It is a professional, hand built, service by experienced engineers. Way too cheap.
No need to watch , the thumbnail gives it away.
How much for cash🤣…. No seriously that’s is very reasonably 👍
One for The Who fans 15:18
Well
You are not charging enough! Quite simple
In relation to the cost of doing a Cosworth engine I just have one question for you.... Discount for cash??? Ha LOL!!
Hi since we voted out of Europe and vat is European tax shouldn't we refuse to pay it?
Obviously
Obviously….
How much for cash 😂😂
Quality work costs the is no substitute for good work