At What Water Level and Temperature I Should Brew My MOKA POT
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- Опубліковано 4 чер 2024
- At What Water Level and Temperature I Should Brew My MOKA POT is a video where I explain the importance of this variable. The water. Depending on how much water we place and also the temperature we will have different outcomes, even with the same coffee, dose and grind size.
Use the guideline to brew the coffee you like and consistently you can enjoy it every single day.
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Moka Bialetti Express 3 Cups
Scale Acaia Pearl
Kettle Fellow Stagg EKG
Dosing funnel 54mm
WDT Tool custom made
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00:00 Intro
00:37 The Test
00:57 Moka 1
01:44 Moka 2
02:30 Moka 3
03:19 Moka 4
04:23 TDS and Extraction Comparison
07:28 The Conclusion
09:22 THE GUIDELINE - Розваги
I just bought a 6-cup Bialetti and have been tearing my hair out. No matter what I did, my coffee was bitter. I changed the grind, put in less water, more water, everything I could think of...except changing the water temp. I bought into the recommendations of many coffeephiles that I had to use almost boiling water. Then I saw your videos and you use room temp H2O, so I decided to give it a shot. The vast majority of the bitterness is gone. Thank the Lord! Now I just need to dial in the grind for the best coffee I know a moka pot can give me.
Happy my video helped to achieve a better coffee. I have tasted this variable for months! Following this will help you a lot to dial in the coffee.
do the grind half way between coarse and medium also just make sure you are not padding it down
Well, I’m at my friends house and she loves Café Bustelo I like a different coffee from Puerto Rico what I have found is when I put the coffee grounds in i add table salt!!! it takes away the bitterness when I am at my own home. I use a coffee call El Coqui. I love that coffee. It’s never bitter.
The water quality is absolutely crucial for a good coffee. In Sweden, we have very clean fresh calcareous spring water without additives, which makes the coffee perfect. In other countries they add chlorine to the water to prevent bacteria and then you get a bitter coffee. In that case, it is better to buy bottled water without gas to make coffee.
Thank you man! Nice trail! It saves me a lot of time and coffee !!!!
Matteo, your knowledge, with clear precise presentation about the Moka machine is very impressive. I’ve watch a few others explain techniques but you are hands down the best. Well done
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I really appreciate your kind words and I'm happy :)
Man, you did really ask the right questions. Thank you for sharing your knowledge on this!
I’ve heard that using room temperature water is the best. Thanks for the video!
Thank you very much for this instructional video.
Thanks for your feedback 🙏
I think it's really dependant on roast level like you told, I also prefer room temperature water for darker roasts but hot water for lighter ones
that is the correct approach. Glad we are aligned.
Great comparison work. Very helpful. Thank you.
Thanks for your feedback 🙏
Thanks, Matteo! Grazie mille, great channel and videos!
Thank you very much for the support! I really appreciate it!
So glad to find this video!! This is the information that I've been looking for. I use stainless steel moka pot on induction stove. I have tried many method but end up with under extracted coffee because I only fill 90 grams of water, thought it will give a full bodied and syrupy extraction, but it turns out to be very light. I have used the paper filter method, but used it in the wrong way that almost made my moka pot explode because of too much pressure. Thank you so much for making this video!!!
Greatest video of Moka Pots I have seen. Subscribed. Thank you and keep it up.
Hi! Thanks so much for the nice words and the support 🙏
Thank you, Matteo! Your videos are really informative and explained so well that even a complete newbie can understand :)
Thank you very much for your comment and feedback. It means a lot for me what you said 🙏🏻
Another excellent video. Definitely the go to man for all things coffee. Thanks for putting in the hard work so that I can get the maximum enjoyment from my coffee!
Thank you very much for your comment and thanks for the nice words. 🙏
I have a one cup Moka and I use 10g fine ground coffee (60 clicks on Kingrinder K4). 50g freshly boiled water, left for 1 min before pouring. When the water is in the lower chamber it's 70c. I've never timed how long it takes for the coffee to come to the top of the funnel, but I guess around 90secs to 2mins. This gives me a short but intense shot that a perfect base for my flat white.
When I tried the same recipe with cold water it took far longer to brew with no noticeable difference in taste. As I'm boiling the kettle anyway to heat my cup and milk jug, I'll keep using the hot water method.
I was literally testing different temperatures yesterday and today, and also checking again and again your older videos to see what you were saying about that subject.
I never talked about this in the previous ones because I was still testing. I hope we can find some correlation between my tests and yours.
THANK YOU! I needed to see this video of comparisons to ease my mind of doubts when brewing my coffee. I have watched your videos for a while and needed to see this comparison between water temp and grind levels. I love dark roast and my next pot will be made with less water for sure. Thank you Matteo for the great work on helping us to understand the moka pot better and how to make even better coffee! 😀
Thanks for the comment. I hope that helped to make better coffee with your moka pot.
Well done Sir, one of the best moka pot videos out there! Would be great to see the temperature progression readings under each of the sample groups (i.e. start temp, mid extraction temp, final temp).
Probably also good to see the start and end time for each as well.
Again, great video. I feel I can be strategic with my moka and the roast type.
Thanks so much. putting all the times and temperature in the video was a bit too much. Then the video was too long. I hope you can get good info from it anyway.
Thank you !!!
Bravo!!🎉
I use the small Brikka on a daily basis. I've tried hot water and paper filter. So far the best results have been with 120g room temperature water, no paper filter, no tamping... basically as simple as possible.
I do use a homemade WDT to distribute the grounds in the basket.
That is the best way to brew with brikka! Thanks for sharing
You need more subs I've just got into Costco and you do a great job!
I wish that too. Thanks so much!
Very eye opening! I have been making my morning coffee in a moka pot for the past 10-12 years. I weigh the coffee (24.00g) but add room temperature carbon filtered water up to the bottom of the valve without weighing. It's hit or miss as sometimes the water level is up to the middle of the valve. Usually the coffee tastes good. Sometimes not so good. Today was a not so good cup, and the water level was to the middle of the valve. Thanks to your research and this video, I now know why. I will weigh my water from now on and keep the water level below the valve. Excellent timing for this video Matteo! I'm using an Alessi 9090/6 moka pot so I will need to experiment to find the ideal ml of H2O fo my taste. THANK YOU Matteo!!
Thanks for your comment and I'm happy you could get good info from this video. I'm happy :)
Nice video Matteo! ☕
Thanks :)
Great video! Thanks to this i found out that i have to use almost maximum level of my heater to reach first extraction at ~3,5 minutes. Now it is much better and not burned which sounds weird 😄
Thanks for the comment and for sharing your experience. Also thanks for the support :)
Brilliant ❤
Thanks 🙏
Tack!
🙏 Thank you!
Grazie mille! If I had seen this sooner, maybe I would have been able to save a bag of beans that were too light for my moka technique
Thank you very much for the support 🙏 Hope this tip will make you waste less coffee
I have had very mixed results myself, sometimes, I use hot water and end up with sputtering in the moka, other days I get the best coffee I have ever had. The ONLY instance where I have had consistent results is when brewing dark roasts, the you should always use cold water (probably what Bialetti himself discovered when he invented the moka, as he most likely only had access to dark roasts). Thanks for the insights! Amazing as always :D
are you using pre ground? I think mine is as you said, darker roast need lower temps and lighter roast needs higher temps. I would guess your inconsistencies can be solved if you have capable grinder.
@@antiwoosh4302 I always grind at the moment, granted my grinder isn't the best but I also use a WDT tool and the same clicks on my grinder for consistency, my guess is that preheated water is more prone to overheating and therefore sputtering (makes sense since sputtering is caused by overheated water) so you would have to control everything very precisely.
EDIT: now that I think about it, I almost never weight the water, maybe I should try doing that before jumping to the conclussion that my grinder isn't enough, could save a couple dozens of dollars that way lol
Thx for this very informative video. What do you think about using paper filter in the coffee chamber?
Do you mean paper underneath coffee or above coffee?
Thanks for sharing you method. Yes, if it works for you, stick with it!
Thanks Matteo
:)
Grazie!
Prego!
I made my first cup this morning with boiled water a little over the valve and wondered why it didn't taste very great. I watched this video, went back to the kitchen, went easier on the grind and used room temp water to just below the valve. It came out tasting just as good as the espresso I get from the machine at work! Thanks, Matteo.
Glad my video helped you!
hi matteo, i rarely play with water volume in tbe bottom chamber, but i tweak with the coffee out in the upper chamber, so if i use dark roast i cut it short (not using all the water), which way do you think is better in your experience?
I suggest you placing less water like I explain in the video, you will also have a lower temperature, perfect for a dark roast coffee.
Thank you, Matteo. I wonder, how much water should I put in 2 cup Moka pot
It’s good to have a scale to understand how many gr of water you can put until below the valve and then for dark roast you place the 85% of the total
I bought some coffe from a shop. They told me this coffees roasted like City or full city. What should i do. I use bialetti express 3 cup. Less and room temp water or water until the valve and boiled?
Wow, so 20 ml less water made like a 10 degrees difference, right? That's very interesting ! Thank you
Correct less water will give brewing water earlier
Did you used an aeropress paper filter in these exemples? I am just curious
No I didn't use it. With the filter all the numbers would definitely go up because the higher resistance the paper creates.
Mateo, have you experimented freezing the coffee beans? Any thoughts on that?
I have a freezer full of coffee 😅
I usually freeze rare coffee, unique competition coffee, already portioned and ready to use.
The positive thing of freezing is the longer shelf-life of the coffee.
The negative is that home freezer, slow freeze the coffee as well as the food. slow freezing brings to the breakage of the cells because the water inside expand (expansion is given by slow freezing). that means that after you defrost the item because the cells are broken aromatic parts and nutrients are going away. Now water in coffee roasted is very low, but it's there. So if you freeze the coffee and then you defrost it and you refreeze it is not good. You lose the quality, also the broken cells release the fats of the coffee, so you will see the beans shining. this fats in contact with oxygen left in the package start to oxidate, because oxidation of the fats happens in freezing temperature. So after a while your coffee will taste rancid. The best way to freeze the coffee is with a commercial blast chiller because you avoid the breakage of the cells.
The best freezing practice for home is: portion the coffee in doses, vacuum seal them, place in the freezer and take out only the coffee you need.
After that you can, grind the coffee straight from the package (than you need to consider a changing in grinding though), or keep the coffee to naturally defrost in the vacuum sealed package before opening it and brewing it. Never defrost coffee at open air, otherwise the coffee will absorb humidity from the air and it will be difficult to grind.
Sorry for the long comment :)
@@matteofromtheswamps on the contrary, thank you for that detailed answer. I had no idea about the importance of fast freezing.
I actually froze some beans in my normal freezer (so slow freezing). I noticed that it is a bit more difficult to grind the beans. Also, I need a little bit more coffee by weight to fill the basket of my Brikka. The end result is not better, I get no crema and less output. Taste-wise I don't see any improvement either.
@@rfdc yeah freezing change the dynamic of grinding. I don’t suggest freezing if the coffee is the one you use everyday
Hello Matteo, thank you for the helpful video. I am using a 2 cup induction Bialetti mocha pot and illy Classico pre-ground coffee in the moka preparation. I think this is medium roast coffee. At first I used 14 grams of coffee and 116 grams of water at room temperature and got around 22% extraction (I am using a scale to measure the weight of the coffee before brewing and after brewing and drying it in the oven, then taking the reduction in weight and dividing by the original weight).It seems 14 grams might be too much for the basket because I have to pack the coffee a little to get it all to fit. So I tried with 13 grams of coffee and still 116 grams of water at room temperature. With this the coffee tasted sour and sure enough I was getting about 17.5% extraction. Why did lowering the coffee weight lower the extraction? How can I get this back up while still using 13 grams of coffee? Should I increase the water as much as I can and also increase the starting water temperature? When you say fill to the valve level do you mean to the bottom of the ring that holds the moving part of the valve or just below the moving part of the valve? Thank you for your tips. Tom
Hello Tom, thanks for the comment. I think you were getting less extraction with less coffee because when you put 14 you pack well the coffee and this will make resistance increasing a bit the pressure and the contact time. Because you using pre ground I cannot tell you to grind finer. What you can do to increase the extraction with less coffee: 1 place a paper filter on the metal filter. This will increase the pressure and you will extract more. 2 you can use the method I use for the 6 cups moka to increase the contact surface. 3 use hot water (not boiling) to increase the extraction as I show in this video.
When I say to the valve I mean below bottom of the ring, because as the water gets warm, it will expand a bit and we need to avoid it goes on the moving part. I hope my tips can be useful to you.
Hello Matteo. thank you for the advice. today I used 120 grams of water at 50 deg C and got around 20.7% extraction. I could already tell from tasting the coffee that it was less sour and slightly more balanced. Next time I will up the water temp to 80 deg C.
Hi Matteo! Can you please make a video or just explain to me how and when to use the reducer? I have a 2 cups GB Kitty Oro Moka Pot and it came with a reducer and I have no idea how to use it correctly.
I believe it would really help me since I would only really use the Moka Pot for 1 cup instead of 2 and I believe that's where the reducer comes into play but I don't know how to use it!
Thanks!
Hi, thanks is a good idea. Thanks.
Yes, that is a screen to place inside the basket, But you need the basket that has an internal bump half way the board of the basket. that bump should hold the screen. Then you fill the basket with coffee until the top. It's used to brew less coffee in the moka as you said.
@@matteofromtheswamps Thank you for replying, Matteo! Yes, the basket has that internal bump. Thanks a lot for explaining!
@@realSkepSys perfect!
Also, I there is some comments about the fact that if you fill the moka with a lot a water, there is less air, and according to some physics rules, if there is a few air left, this few air that can expend and less water can go out. More water in = less air = less water out. That sound logical in theory but I don't know about the moka pot application. There is a paper about that "Physics of a stove-top espresso machine", but I have to search more to remember
That is a nice comment.
So how it works is that in the space left in the boiler we allow the steam created by heating the water to create pressure and this pressure will push the water up and then we know what happens.
water stars to evaporate even from 60 degrees celcius, doesn't have boil.
Now, all the water that can go out will go out, no matter the level of water you put in the boiler (of course some water will remain there at the end, I made a video explaining that).
What you need to consider now is that different levels of water have also difference weight.
If we put less water it will weight less. In fact I use the scale in the video.
Now less quantity of water will get hot faster so it will create steam earlier than if you have full boiler. Also you will need less steam pressure to push up 120 g rather than 140 g because it weight less, so it's easier. That why it comes up earlier and at lower temperature.
That was in a 3 cups moka. In a 6 cups moka you have even more water inside, that's why with 6 cups you have higher risk of sputtering. You need more pressure, that means more steam, that means more time on the stove, that means higher water temperature, that means boiling water and that means sputtering.
Sorry for the long reply
@@matteofromtheswamps Thank you for everything. That is very interesting. Moka pot is very interesting.
I'm now going to weigh my coffee & water, trying a few variations: just to taste the difference.
I note that, as I have discovered, minimising the heat permits a gentle stream of coffee; rather than an angry sputtering.
Let me know how that go. Yes lower heat less sputtering and better taste
Going to try using 120ml of room temperature filtered water in my Brikka tomorrow morning instead of filling to the valve with boiled filtered water using my home roasted dark coffee (was supposed to be medium but I got distracted and it went a wee bit runaway exothermic on me 🤦). Thanks for reporting on this experiment!
Since Brikka increases pressure to create more crema, I don't think I need a paper filter although I'll try that on my older Zanzibar Moka Pot.
Let us know how it goes!
I also use the Brikka everyday. 120g water in at room temp. Approx 19g coffee grounds (depending on the coffee it can be more or less) and 60g liquid out. No paper filter.
@@rfdc Thanks for the reply! Do you get ~60ml liquid out naturally or do you control the output in some way?
@@nmatheis I have a pot filled with water nearby. When I hear/see that the moka is starting to sputter I immediately lift it up from the heat and put it in the water to stop the brewing process.
More often than not I get 60 ml of brewed coffee. It can vary sometimes between 59 and 62 ml.
@@rfdc Thanks for the additional detail!
Yes that is a good move. Also yes, NO paper filter, that will increase even more the resistance that you don't need. Thanks for the comment
I have a "6 cup" Moka pot, yours appears to be 3 cup. How would your recipe differ for the 6 cup? Just double the amounts? How many grams of coffee did you use in this test? Is it possible to get the same or similar results using half the qty of grounds and water (brew for 1 person instead of 2)? I've heard from others less water and grounds gives lower yield. I just don't want to always have to make coffee for 2 people when I'm alone.
Yes mine is a 3 cups. I use different approach with a 6 cups. Check this video if you didn't yet ua-cam.com/video/9TwyYWFZoK8/v-deo.htmlsi=DWw9yrFMOAdrKCNq
ratios are different in between 3 and 6. But if you place less water you can get a similar result. Now the problem of brewing coffee for one person with a big moka it's tricky because you don't get the good result as when you fill the basket with coffee until the top
Wich manual grinder do you recomend for the mokapot?
There are plenty of grinder in the market. I think you don't need a super expensive grinder. Depend also if you brew the coffee in other different ways. What's your budget?
I read that the 1zpresso q2 heptagonal is similar to comandante (the grinder that you use very often)
150 dollars will be my budget for the grinder
@@FernandoReyes-vt1il exactly 1zpresso produce good handgrinders, also there is Timemore chestnut c3 pro.
Hm. In earlier videos you recommended starting with hot water and a reference of 150 grams of water. I understand the variables you describe at the end but I’m a bit confused
Hi, so in that video I'm showing how I was doing my coffee with Moka in that period, like around 2 years ago. I still use hot water but only when I brew light roast coffee. In this video I wanted to give a generic guideline depending on the coffee you use. Soon light roast vs dark roast will come. Sorry if I made you confused.
And if I have an medium level of roasting. Which is better to pour water, room temperature or hot?
I would start with room temperature always. Then depending on the coffee, if I need more energy to balance the coffee, I'll place warm water.
@@matteofromtheswamps Here's what I noticed.
When I poured hot water, the coffee constantly came out sour, but when I tried to pour room temperature water, surprisingly, the acidity disappeared. Coffee is the same, and that's what the difference is when you change the water temperature.
@@matteofromtheswamps So it can be concluded that medium roast coffee was not brewed well, that's why it turned out sour.
professor matteo, M.MP (magister of moka pot) hahaha
ahahah thanks :)