One thing that's worth highlighting is that Shimano say that functionally, Ultegra and Dura-Ace are the same. So they'll behave in the same way in use. It's just that Dura-Ace is made from lighter materials - the down side being that Dura-Ace components can wear out faster. Which is why people (including some pro-teams) will sometimes use a mix of Ultegra/Dura-Ace on a build (cassette being a prime example)
105 has always been good. A few generations ago they briefly did Ultegra SL to open up some distance. 105 is named after Levi 501 jeans. Meant to be hardwaring and good value by not having to be fancy. The workhorse groupset.
Got a new bike yesterday, equipped with R7000 105 (Merida Scultura 400), an upgrade from my battered old 2011 Giant Defy 3 (with old sora/tourney group... 3x8, pure shite by now) On my maiden ride, the 105 shifted like I've never felt before! Being on a new bike, new size and all the biggest difference for me was definitely the smooth, faultless shifting of 105. Not a noise off the thing when running, but a confidence inspiring click when shifting. It doesn't really feel like I shifted on 11 speed vs 8 hahaha Brilliant value for money, I'm delighted!!
My friend put a top end of the bike with 6.5kg but his speed average still same as before . I have to recommend to investment on your bike 1.) tire (for practice 1 set , for race 1 set ) *don’t use race tire on practice 2.) saddle (for the best comfort) and your tiny boy
Interesting video. I bought a bike with 105 groupset when I first got into cycling back in the late 80's. It didn't take long to trash the drive-train -- shifting was sketchy and everything seemed to break down within a year. The upgrade to Dura-Ace was like night and day. I rode and raced tons of km's and never had a problem with shifting, braking, etc, etc. Only thing I needed to replace were chains and cables. Dura-Ace is astoundingly good.
When someone ask me about groupsets. I send this video and 1 other to them. I raced 105 for years. I would go on ebay and replace my old groupset every 2 to 3 years and raced my Lemond Beunos Aires from 2004 to 2016. So many people will sell their 105 groupset barely used to upgrade to Ultegra or Dura ace. I was almost always the in the top 5 bike in my age group and quite a few times the fastest. My swim kept me from winning. I bought a new bike in 2017, a Cannondale super six evo that came with SRAM red.
Perfectly satisfied with Ultegra as a "late adopter" of technology (...and frugal). It's basically the latest Dura-Ace with the bugs worked out and slightly heavier.
@Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj Keep saying that but your wrong. There's a GNC video with Shimano reps that verify this. They basically say that 105 gets the trickle down tech year after year. On one level your right 2020 105's compared to 2020 Dura-Ace is a different level but by next year or 2022 Shimano takes that Dura-Ace tech and applies it downward. My 2019 105 groupset is far superior than my bike from 2005 with 105's.
Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj well the video clearly says that the 105 of today is the same as the dura ace of a few years ago. But obviously the 105 of today is not at all the dura ace of today.
If i'm worried about a few grams of weight i will take a dump and maybe go on a diet. Been riding 105 group set for 5 years and has been super dependable as long as you take care of them.
The hydro brake shown is in the process of being replaced. That's the RS505, which is bulbous, to say the least. R7000 has its own hydro STI shifter, BUT it is not widely available yet. I just got a new bike delivered that was speced with R7000; it came with Ultegra shifters and hydo calipers. That being said, for the non-pro rider (guys like me who are getting older and not particularly a bike snob), 105 is beautiful. 200 grams is irrelevant to me. I'm 6'4" and 205 pounds. I will never feel the difference. In the final analysis, everything Shimano makes is good. I have bikes with 20-year-old 105, current Sora, Tiagra, SLX, 105, and a smattering of XT and Ultegra components. They are ALL good.
I used ot ride SRAM Rival and thru laziness messed up the gears with bad maintenance, took it to a LBS for a service, got into a bit of an argument with them because it came back with some things just messed up. Took it back and the mechanic had it in for me - deliberately overtighened the skewers and cranks resulting in stuffed bearings. The bottom bracket made a loud noise like it had sand in it. Decided to rather use the situation as an excuse to replace the groupset since I was having problems with the chain ring shifting anyway. Waited just long enough to get a bargain on the new 105 R7000 (52/36 11/28) and did the fitting myself after getting the right tools. It's sheer magic compared to the old 10-speed rival. Really easy to do the indexing too. Can't afford the more expensive stuff so I am super happy with the new 105. Just in case someone's wondering - my old wheels were Mavic Ksyriums which allowed 11 speed cassettes without having to change the hub. I replaced the wheels later with Hunt Aero 24/31s.
Literally the exact same thing happened to me, but I was getting my Rival properly taken care of. Was having shifting issues over and over...I put Ultegra on mine. Glad I made the change...
105 is also the only groupset that offers a silver version. If I bought 105, I would go for the silver, because it is something special. I am surprised how few people actually choose it.
I have Ultegra Di2 on my fast road bike andvitvis incredibly good, but I have Tiagra on a cyclocross bike I use for training in bad weather. I have to say, even new Tiagra is perfectly functional for training rides. That bike weighs a ton and is like driving a truck compared to driving a BMW but watts are watts and training is training and itvshifts fine. The newest 105 is especially good and more like Dura Ace than ever before.
I had 105 on a new bike 10yrs ago, had it adjusted a couple times. Kept jumping out of gear worst time on climbs, was happy to get rid of it. Went to Ultegra on a bike briefly, then Dura Ace on my road bike, SRAM Red on my TT bike, much happier, never miss a gear, will never go back to 105.
I am now 27 and have been cycling for almost 7 years. Up until now I've only ridden older bikes like my 2001 Trek 5500 OCLV 120 with DA 7700 (7,2 kg) and compared to the Tiagra 4400 from my Stevens (9,3 kg) of the same year, the difference in shifting and braking performance is MASSIVE. So I assumed that it was still the case. I have now bought my first new road bike after this video, light aluminum frame with 105 R7000 (around 8.3 kg) for just 999 €. Was 400 € cheaper than the Ultegra model.
Great video. Thanks. I just purchased a 2019 CAADX Cross bike with the Ultegra 8020 GS. Video was very informative and makes me more excited to receive it later this week. ALL of my other bikes have SRAM Force or Red - so I am stoked to give Ultegra a spin.
Definetly no longer looking at ultegra. 105 is going to be my next upgrade or next bike! Thanks Cam, your Chanel is supremely helpful and honest! Cheers
I tend to disagree about the comments on durability. In my experience, the better finishes of the higher end groupsets tend to resist UK winter conditions a little better. Bearings and pivot points are usually better sealed too.
I'd disagree with that. I thrashed the hell out of ultegra here in Scotland and it was done in a lot quicker than the 105 I ended up replacing it with. I've not stuck with 105 on my bike as it's cheaper to replace and doesn't need replaced as often as ultegra did. I've not noticed a huge amount of difference between ultegra and 105 either. Ultegra shifted gear a bit smoother, but not much else was noticeable, nothing to justify the price hike. Everyone has their opinion on it though, but I'd say ultegra is obsolete at the moment. Either go with 105 or jump to Dura Ace
It's like the difference between wedding bands, Do you want the 18k gold or the 22k gold ring? 105 is all I'd ever need but I want that ultegra set because I have to look at it every time I ride and I want to be proud of it..I can justify it to myself because it's way less in price than the 24k dura ace ring.
Baffled how you managed to have bikes with ultegra and dura ace before 105. I have upgraded to a 105 bike recently from a claris one and love it. Nice rundown mate.
I'll probably always have ultegra. Middle ground seems to be the way to go for me. I can't justify the expense of dura ace but I never like the cheapest stuff. Plus I'm obsessed with hill climbs.
Online 105 is $400-500 Ultegra $700-800. About $2 per gram price difference. Why would anyone not professional racer run D-A especially D-A for everyday regular rides is beyond me. I wash my bike twice a year, some odd years 3 times and lubricate my chain maybe twice a month, sometimes once a month. I don't think D-A will survive long on my bike.
Hello,my name is dancun a student from kenya I love cycling am looking for someone who can sponsor me with a bike .I did 480km with my alluminium mtb to raise some money to buy a new one but failed.maybe if you might be in a position to help I will be thankful. Thank you.my e-mail is gontinificent@gmail.com
duncan kuria you're on you tube= why not make a video for us to see your epic fundraising trip. You can link to your fundraising platform from the video. But I think you need to build a case for why we should contribute to your bike (and what group you intend to put on it).
@4:35 - The information is wrong - Dura ace and Ultergra are *identical* other than the materials used - there is no "tickle down" between the two. The trickle down is to 105 which is usually a couple of series behind the others. From the horses mouth - Tim Gerrits - ua-cam.com/video/HbDROaZ2_Wo/v-deo.html
Babbel talk... I’ve owned all three categories of Shimano. There’s no discernible difference, especially for the weekend cyclists. The performance is flawless for each level of the group sets. This is also true for the Di2 version of the Ultegra and Dura Ace group sets. If you have the budget go for the “BLING”, but know that the 105, and Ultegra level group sets are to not disappoint.
I just bought the bike at 4:12 Roubaix elite for 2060 pounds. I cannot belive how good it is, apart from getting flat tyre within a week.. :( Was a little heavier than I thought it would be with shimano pedals I added at 9.3kg with no other addons.
I love that bike! I rode the 'Expert' the entire length of New Zealand last year. See here:ua-cam.com/video/Bxn4XQZnmKQ/v-deo.html . Such a good machine and incredabily comfortable. Cam
I also have had several 105 gruppos on bikes. Great durability, shifting, and braking for the price. I would recommend the group to anyone who can't, or doesn't want, to afford more. My daughter has a Ruby (woman's Roubaix model) that has 105 and it's a fantastic bike for her. I had a Roubaix Expert with Ultegra and now have a SWorks Roubaix with DA 9100. So I have abundant experience with all 3 groupsets. All 3 series are great depending on your finances and needs. I have a suggestion for Winstan to try here in regard to flat tires (tyres, heh, heh.). I live in the east side of Washingon State, USA. We have a thorn that is notorious for causing flats and is very commonplace. We call it the "goat head" or another name for it is "tackweed". It has 3 sharp spikes that can be anywhere from 1mm to 4 or 5 mm long. It sticks to all sorts of things and then falls off in new areas (or on the road and path to be quickly picked up by bikes) and propagates very quickly. The spikes will penetrate a tire and tube very quickly and often you end up with 2 or 3, and sometimes even more, puncturing a tire at the same time. I have averaged two or 3 flats a week for years. Unfortunatley my road wheelsets aren't tubeless compatible. But this year I found a simple solution. I will only buy tubes with removable valves now. I simply remove the valve, put about 25-30 grams of Stan's latex into the tube and run them normally after that. I haven't had a flat in over a thousand miles now. Yes, I've picked up numerous thorns but haven't changed or patched a tube since March. 2 of my riding partners have followed suit with the same results. I am no longer considering reinvesting in new wheelsets to run tubeless, although there would be other benefits as well. But I'm retired and on a fixed income so I don't have the float money to do that. This works absolutely great! If it can survive a goat head patch and keep going, without a significant loss of pressure, I think it can survive anything and I recommend it. Adding 30 grams to my 1400 gram wheelset is a negligible weight addition.
i would say that if you stay in mechanical group sets then there is little need for more then 105 for most riders that are not racing. i would put the difference in cost into a slightly better frame then group set. When you go to hydraulic braking i think there is a massive difference between the 105 and the Ultegra. but the thing most missing in the 105 group set is the electronic shifting and that is what made me chose Ultega
Thanks for the feedback/comment. Always looking to improve the audio. Was it the shotgun mic you thought lowered the audio quality? I.e. should have I worn a lapel mic also? The audio from Darcy was a lapel and put through an audio editing tool. My audio was from the shotgun, and I thought that would have been OK, but perhaps not! Cam
I'm.The same.got dura ace on my.best bike latest disc version.mechanical. It's quiet, smooth and a little bit lighter weight than the ultegra version. I've ridden.both and can't tell difference. The parts will last longer but not.much.. I've heard of returns on.dura ace for silly things just like ultegra and 105. I've heard the latest 105 is very good even Shimano are pricing it closer to ultegra now. If di2 is not wanted I'd just buy 195. We've got a guy blitzing the group on a generic carbon bike, base level.Shimano wheels and tiagra 10spd.
Good content as usual! Like your style as its very “free”. Speaking of groupsets, im on mechanical sram red now and i low key miss my old 105 groupset. You get so much performance for what you pay for
Thanks Richard, much appreciated. I have ridden SRAM Red mechanical myself and I do like the snappy performance, but you're right, the 105 is bloody unreal when you consider it's price point versus the rest.
I also like snappy change, one reason why I don’t pick shimano. I run campy and if you tighten up the “b” screw, it changes like a shot gun, sounds great through tunnels as you change up. But absolutely right. For the price, 105 is unbeatable!
Ultegra mech, plus Duraace crank and rear deraileur if you want it lighter, quite close to full D ace, but much cheaper. I did it on my bike, look from the right side, it looks like the bike got full D Ace groupset.
@Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj you dont get longevity by getting a more expensive groupset, for my experience i can tell that, basically is just weight savings
I have owned bikes with Dura Ace and Ultegra, have ridden bikes with 105. especially now . I have stated to friends etc that I would use Ultegra groupset. Rather than spend the big dollars for Dura Ace , for the performance, when for my point of view the Ultegra performance is just as good.
But the cranset that is shown at about 3min30 is not a 105, it's the cheap and heavy RS510. The 105 has the "105" written on it, this,one has "Shimano", it's about 200g heavier than the 105. Here in Canada, you can get it for 150$C, while the 105 is over 300$C.
I have the 105 R7000 groupset, it wasn't as good as many has praised. I tried very hard to do a proper indexing on my RD and the indexing always conflicts with 3rd vs 9th gear. Meaning that if you get 3rd gear index right, 9th gear will be out from indexing and vice versa. Many owners have experienced this flaw and we have to live with this flaw by compensating the indexing between these two gears. The front derailleur also has design flaw on the H limiter screw where it will get twisted and jammed if you turn in too hard. Overall I will only give 105 R7000 a 6/10 score since I suspect Shimano purposely induce these flaws as to push consumers to invest on their more expensive groupsets, a very good marketing strategy. Even for Ultegra, some of my friends did broke the alloy crank after pushing it at over 1000watt. It's very fragile and brittle. Come on Shimano, can't you just use carbon crank just like what SRAM did instead of sticking to such obsolete, heavy and weak alloy material? Some how I think Shimano won't do so since their products are way too popular and already gain majority profit from the market. I call this a shame for Shimano for able to do better but they refused to do so.
l d say save your money and get 105 basic with no cranks and buy some carbon cranks light weight cranks and even save money !! LOTS OF OPTIONS THERE . ALSO other options for groupsets from other makes that are lighter and less $$$.
A pro riding 105 would have ZERO difference in his performance or placement in a race lol, froome could win the tour on sora if he had proper gearing for gods sakes
Is there much -if any- difference in performance between the Tektro Axis caliper that comes factory on a Specialized Allez Sprint vs the Shimano 105 r7000?
@@ayowser01 I upgraded my brakes on an older Allez from Axis to 105 and definitely noticed the difference. Between that and new wheels are the two best upgrades I did to that bike
@@IdolOracle good to know my money is well spent. I found it odd that the component set is all 105, except for the calipers. I ordered a set of 105 brakes and a set of carbon UST wheels. Hopefully they arrive soon. I can't wait to test them out.
I love to pass the $5000 Dura Ace superbike poseurs on my $75 Raleigh Gran sport (1973) on the way up Torrey Pines grade in San Diego. Actually it's got Ultegra/600/Titlist (the lattermost) = generation negative one.
Great vid mate, made me subscribe 👍. I've just started looking for my first road bike after riding my retired MTB with skinnies for the last year and this has been super helpful. Seems like the only reason to go for Ultegra or Dura-ace (for amatures like me) would be DI2. Without DI2 most bikes seem to be around 3k (105), with DI2 they seem closer to 5k (Ultegra). Seems to be a pretty big jump and pretty difficult to justify, what's your thoughts? Also what is that wrap/sticker you have on your forks and logos? It looks freakin awesome. Cheers
Thanks for supporting the channel mate. The Specialized Allez, is a special edition and it comes with that 'Graffiti" colour scheme on the folks! 105 and above you can't go wrong. Depends on your budget. If you can go up to Ultegra mechanical, that would probably be my preference. If you've got lots of cash then electronic is worthwhile but not worth it if it's squeezing your budget. You're better off investing money in a good set of wheels, in my opinion! Cam
Thanks for the great comparison. I do 50% roads and 50% rough path..would you go for canyon grail with 105 r7000 for 2200 Euro or Ultegra "Rx" for 2600? is this clutch rear derailleur worth the investment? Gravel bikes without it seem to be doing just as fine..
Thanks for the comment and question Changsu. Unfortainteky I can't answer that one as I don't have the hands-on experiences. The only thing I will say with a Gravel bike is that if you're doing a lot of Gravel riding the clutch rear derailleur might be worthwhile. If Gravel is just part of your overall riding experiences then perhaps it's not overly relevant. Cam
Que ganas de que Aparezca una marca al acceso del bolsillo de la gente que Ama este deporte con productos de calidad duraderos ya que Las grandes marcas hacen pedazos los bolsillos de todos los que aman este deporte
I rode 105 for years with no issues. Now I can afford DA I bought it! Think its totally a waste of money but it does seem to have a much better resale value
Summary: 105: entry level, precision bearings, tolerances, 20Y durability. No attention to finish. Simple to manufacture, shifts only 1 gear at a time (vs 3). Ultegra: All of 105's features, nicely finished, and lightened to give people incentives to upgrade, 20Y durability. Used by TDF domestiques and people racing on their own $. Dura Ace: Stupid light, think Octalink UN-9100 alloy bottom brackets that lasted 12mo, best case. 2Y durability. Brilliant in the way Trump is, ie in name only.
Good info mate. Definitely noticed the clunkier shifts coming from DA to 105. Thoughts on running tubulars everyday? I'm sure you would know someone who does...idea for a vid maybe
What do you think of Ribble's Sportive Racing Ultegra bike that cost about $1000? I've being doing some research and I have a good idea on the price points for each bike that comes with the entire groupset. At $1000 is the frame, fork, handlebar and stem worth it? Because I don't want to buy "only" the Shimano Ultegra with the rest being garbage. Buying my first bike and I want it to last at least 10 years. (It's currently on sale, but it's too good to be true.)
Me, I do, I have just bought clincher wheels for touring after 6 years of running tubulars on all my bikes, as very hard to get ally tubulars now. They to me are the best system to run. WHY?? The rim tyre combination is considerable lighter, the ride is nicer, feels like the tyres are slightly flat, but they are not. Easier to change if flat. And if you run 30mls of stans in them, incredibly reliable against punctures. PROs you can ride on flat tyres is desperate to get home (although slowly), if you get a flat, no loosing the tyre of the rim, you can run higher pressures and lower pressures than clinchers (I have run them at 40 psi for 23mm no probs) no pinch flats and no messy sealant with tubeless if you run sealant. CONs only available in top end rims, and more expensive to run. Maybe I am old school, but I have very little trouble with them and use tape which is so easy.
Just upgraded from ultegra to Dura ace. Didn't pay for it tho. If I was gonna pay for a new groupset id stick with ultegra. 105 can do it ultegra feels a bit more premium and is all you need and dira ace is just for sponsored riders imo. If you have the money, go for ultegra but never Dura ace unless you're a dentist
Thanks, Howard. It's an interesting question, and probably worth a video! I have gone back to mechanical and enjoyed not having to worry about the charge, to be honest. The differences in shifting are really marginal in my opinion and the weight gains with electronic are something to consider. I know some detailed humans will disagree with that. I'd rather invest in a good set of rims. That could be the difference between winning and losing a race. Not mechanical VS electronic. Although, if your electronic groupset runs out of batteries mid-race it could! LOL. Cam
would love to see that video. How about if there are 2 exact same bikes, except one running mechanical ultegra, the other running electronic ultegra, base on your experience, which one will you choose for training, racing and even commute?
I think electronic is a nice to have..... it is heavier and actually changes slower. For some that have a disability or problem with strength in their hands, electric is great. Some systems can be programmed to do everything in one STI. I do think for the masses thou, the price difference in the top groupsets is a bit too much.
8 yr old Ultegra = Sora today. Relax all my Shimano bikes are Ultegra. They do cheapen the finishes, tolerances, and bearings as groups get demoted in rank. Plastic brifter parts, yuck!
One thing that's worth highlighting is that Shimano say that functionally, Ultegra and Dura-Ace are the same. So they'll behave in the same way in use. It's just that Dura-Ace is made from lighter materials - the down side being that Dura-Ace components can wear out faster. Which is why people (including some pro-teams) will sometimes use a mix of Ultegra/Dura-Ace on a build (cassette being a prime example)
I have often heard it said that Ultegra is the thinking rider's groupset.
105 has always been good. A few generations ago they briefly did Ultegra SL to open up some distance. 105 is named after Levi 501 jeans. Meant to be hardwaring and good value by not having to be fancy. The workhorse groupset.
105 is named after 10 S (speed). When dura ace and ultegra was the only 11 speed.
@@user-vn9js9yn1j There was 105 when dura ace was 10 speed.
105 is the Swiss army knife of group sets.
It’s the Toyota Camry of group sets 😁
So my Deore XT groupset Is like a Corolla then 😂
It's the Telecaster of group sets 😁
Got a new bike yesterday, equipped with R7000 105 (Merida Scultura 400), an upgrade from my battered old 2011 Giant Defy 3 (with old sora/tourney group... 3x8, pure shite by now)
On my maiden ride, the 105 shifted like I've never felt before! Being on a new bike, new size and all the biggest difference for me was definitely the smooth, faultless shifting of 105. Not a noise off the thing when running, but a confidence inspiring click when shifting. It doesn't really feel like I shifted on 11 speed vs 8 hahaha
Brilliant value for money, I'm delighted!!
My friend put a top end of the bike with 6.5kg but his speed average still same as before .
I have to recommend to investment on your bike
1.) tire (for practice 1 set , for race 1 set ) *don’t use race tire on practice
2.) saddle (for the best comfort) and your tiny boy
The only reason I can think of that I'd go above 105 is if I decided I *needed* DI2
105 is the best value groupset for cost/performance bar none!
I agree with you Wayne! Cam
But check out last year's Ultegra it might be better finished and selling below 105 MSRP!
Interesting video. I bought a bike with 105 groupset when I first got into cycling back in the late 80's. It didn't take long to trash the drive-train -- shifting was sketchy and everything seemed to break down within a year. The upgrade to Dura-Ace was like night and day. I rode and raced tons of km's and never had a problem with shifting, braking, etc, etc. Only thing I needed to replace were chains and cables. Dura-Ace is astoundingly good.
Stumbled across this video. I'm a newbie and it answered all my questions about groupsets. Subscribed.
Glad to hear and thanks for the comment Martyn. Also, appreciate you subbing/supporting the channel! Cam
When someone ask me about groupsets. I send this video and 1 other to them. I raced 105 for years. I would go on ebay and replace my old groupset every 2 to 3 years and raced my Lemond Beunos Aires from 2004 to 2016. So many people will sell their 105 groupset barely used to upgrade to Ultegra or Dura ace. I was almost always the in the top 5 bike in my age group and quite a few times the fastest. My swim kept me from winning. I bought a new bike in 2017, a Cannondale super six evo that came with SRAM red.
Very interesting insights Wayne. Thank you for sharing and also sharing this video! Cam
Perfectly satisfied with Ultegra as a "late adopter" of technology (...and frugal).
It's basically the latest Dura-Ace with the bugs worked out and slightly heavier.
@Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj Keep saying that but your wrong. There's a GNC video with Shimano reps that verify this. They basically say that 105 gets the trickle down tech year after year. On one level your right 2020 105's compared to 2020 Dura-Ace is a different level but by next year or 2022 Shimano takes that Dura-Ace tech and applies it downward.
My 2019 105 groupset is far superior than my bike from 2005 with 105's.
Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj well the video clearly says that the 105 of today is the same as the dura ace of a few years ago. But obviously the 105 of today is not at all the dura ace of today.
If i'm worried about a few grams of weight i will take a dump and maybe go on a diet. Been riding 105 group set for 5 years and has been super dependable as long as you take care of them.
haha, well said Gage. Cam
Haha, brilliant.
What about if I’ve done the diet and had a dump and still want to loose some weight off the bike? Ok to buy it then? 🤣🤣
Cam great content, I had 105 6 speed on a 531c steel race frame in 1990 I still use 105 today!
Nice one Flash. Thanks for sharing. Cam
The hydro brake shown is in the process of being replaced. That's the RS505, which is bulbous, to say the least. R7000 has its own hydro STI shifter, BUT it is not widely available yet. I just got a new bike delivered that was speced with R7000; it came with Ultegra shifters and hydo calipers.
That being said, for the non-pro rider (guys like me who are getting older and not particularly a bike snob), 105 is beautiful. 200 grams is irrelevant to me. I'm 6'4" and 205 pounds. I will never feel the difference.
In the final analysis, everything Shimano makes is good. I have bikes with 20-year-old 105, current Sora, Tiagra, SLX, 105, and a smattering of XT and Ultegra components. They are ALL good.
Thanks for sharing Peter. Interesting insights and feedback. Cam
Lucky you! Similar thing happened to me. I warrantied 8020 shifters, Shimano had none in stock so they sent me 9120 instead.
I used ot ride SRAM Rival and thru laziness messed up the gears with bad maintenance, took it to a LBS for a service, got into a bit of an argument with them because it came back with some things just messed up. Took it back and the mechanic had it in for me - deliberately overtighened the skewers and cranks resulting in stuffed bearings. The bottom bracket made a loud noise like it had sand in it. Decided to rather use the situation as an excuse to replace the groupset since I was having problems with the chain ring shifting anyway. Waited just long enough to get a bargain on the new 105 R7000 (52/36 11/28) and did the fitting myself after getting the right tools. It's sheer magic compared to the old 10-speed rival. Really easy to do the indexing too. Can't afford the more expensive stuff so I am super happy with the new 105.
Just in case someone's wondering - my old wheels were Mavic Ksyriums which allowed 11 speed cassettes without having to change the hub. I replaced the wheels later with Hunt Aero 24/31s.
Great insights. Thanks for sharing Kevin. Cam
Literally the exact same thing happened to me, but I was getting my Rival properly taken care of. Was having shifting issues over and over...I put Ultegra on mine. Glad I made the change...
105 is also the only groupset that offers a silver version. If I bought 105, I would go for the silver, because it is something special. I am surprised how few people actually choose it.
Great video, but why do Australians make every sentence sound like a question?
James Wilson haha, it’s the mystery of accents James! We’ll never know?
Indeed, keep up the good work.
Hehe. Good question!. ...
What’s your favourite colour Blue?
Do we? Geddit?
I have Ultegra Di2 on my fast road bike andvitvis incredibly good, but I have Tiagra on a cyclocross bike I use for training in bad weather. I have to say, even new Tiagra is perfectly functional for training rides. That bike weighs a ton and is like driving a truck compared to driving a BMW but watts are watts and training is training and itvshifts fine. The newest 105 is especially good and more like Dura Ace than ever before.
Interesting to hear re Tiagra. Agree with your sentiment on training. Thanks for the comment. Cam
Just bought a Colnago C40 with Dura Ace group set, can't complain I've got it at a reallly good price!
I had 105 on a new bike 10yrs ago, had it adjusted a couple times. Kept jumping out of gear worst time on climbs, was happy to get rid of it. Went to Ultegra on a bike briefly, then Dura Ace on my road bike, SRAM Red on my TT bike, much happier, never miss a gear, will never go back to 105.
I am now 27 and have been cycling for almost 7 years. Up until now I've only ridden older bikes like my 2001 Trek 5500 OCLV 120 with DA 7700 (7,2 kg) and compared to the Tiagra 4400 from my Stevens (9,3 kg) of the same year, the difference in shifting and braking performance is MASSIVE. So I assumed that it was still the case.
I have now bought my first new road bike after this video, light aluminum frame with 105 R7000 (around 8.3 kg) for just 999 €. Was 400 € cheaper than the Ultegra model.
Thanks for sharing on the thread. Cam
Just ordered 105 R7000 after watching this video .. Thanks mate !
Nice one, thanks for letting me know Dinesh. Enjoy the 105 Groupset! Cam
Every single sentence ends with a higher note. Still great content.
105 has its justice for its price and performance. I can'r Argue with that, I've been using Ultegra but 105 is the best
I opted 105 on ultegra on my bianchi impulso.
Great video. Thanks. I just purchased a 2019 CAADX Cross bike with the Ultegra 8020 GS. Video was very informative and makes me more excited to receive it later this week. ALL of my other bikes have SRAM Force or Red - so I am stoked to give Ultegra a spin.
Nice one Kevin, enjoy. Cam
Definetly no longer looking at ultegra. 105 is going to be my next upgrade or next bike! Thanks Cam, your Chanel is supremely helpful and honest! Cheers
Nice one, can't go wrong with 105. I love it. Many thanks, Cam
Check out 1-2yr old Ultegra on clearance!
I tend to disagree about the comments on durability. In my experience, the better finishes of the higher end groupsets tend to resist UK winter conditions a little better. Bearings and pivot points are usually better sealed too.
Fair call and great to have your perspective. Thanks Simon! Cam
I'd disagree with that.
I thrashed the hell out of ultegra here in Scotland and it was done in a lot quicker than the 105 I ended up replacing it with. I've not stuck with 105 on my bike as it's cheaper to replace and doesn't need replaced as often as ultegra did.
I've not noticed a huge amount of difference between ultegra and 105 either. Ultegra shifted gear a bit smoother, but not much else was noticeable, nothing to justify the price hike.
Everyone has their opinion on it though, but I'd say ultegra is obsolete at the moment. Either go with 105 or jump to Dura Ace
It's like the difference between wedding bands, Do you want the 18k gold or the 22k gold ring? 105 is all I'd ever need but I want that ultegra set because I have to look at it every time I ride and I want to be proud of it..I can justify it to myself because it's way less in price than the 24k dura ace ring.
Baffled how you managed to have bikes with ultegra and dura ace before 105. I have upgraded to a 105 bike recently from a claris one and love it. Nice rundown mate.
haha, I did have "Sora" on my original road bike. But that only lasted a few months before I upgraded straight to Ulegra! Thanks for the comment! Cam
haha nice Sora was a suitably crap place to start, not so jealous now :)
105 has the most quality performance ever
The biggest weight gain in the groupsets is the crankset. The next weight gain is the bolts. Dura Ace uses titanium and ultegra uses stainless steel.
Thanks for all the info. Subscribed !!
Thanks for supporting the channel mate
I'll probably always have ultegra. Middle ground seems to be the way to go for me. I can't justify the expense of dura ace but I never like the cheapest stuff. Plus I'm obsessed with hill climbs.
Online 105 is $400-500 Ultegra $700-800. About $2 per gram price difference. Why would anyone not professional racer run D-A especially D-A for everyday regular rides is beyond me. I wash my bike twice a year, some odd years 3 times and lubricate my chain maybe twice a month, sometimes once a month. I don't think D-A will survive long on my bike.
You make a good point on D-A. Ultegra is so good. It really ticks so many boxes. Thanks for the comment. Cam
Hello,my name is dancun a student from kenya I love cycling am looking for someone who can sponsor me with a bike .I did 480km with my alluminium mtb to raise some money to buy a new one but failed.maybe if you might be in a position to help I will be thankful. Thank you.my e-mail is gontinificent@gmail.com
duncan kuria you're on you tube= why not make a video for us to see your epic fundraising trip. You can link to your fundraising platform from the video. But I think you need to build a case for why we should contribute to your bike (and what group you intend to put on it).
@@jimmit77 thank you for the advice, I will try as much to make this video
Great video again Cam...very informative. Love my Cervelo r2 105
Thank you sir, much appreciated. Cam
Best comparison video on the net, just subbed
Thank Paul much appreciated. Looks like you're Kiwi too. I'm 1/2 thanks to mum. She would love your profile image! All Blacks all the way. Cam
I'm more than happy with the Tiagra groupset on my gravel bike it's very durable.
Tiagra is very good I have 105 and Sora and they are both superb
@@abu1950 my sora set was a epic. Time to see what ultegra has to offer!
@@Antivirus2390 I upgraded my other bike to ultegra r8000 and I love it. If someone can not afford it the r7000 is a superb alternative.
@4:35 - The information is wrong - Dura ace and Ultergra are *identical* other than the materials used - there is no "tickle down" between the two. The trickle down is to 105 which is usually a couple of series behind the others. From the horses mouth - Tim Gerrits - ua-cam.com/video/HbDROaZ2_Wo/v-deo.html
105 5800 already outdated. 105 R7000 are the current updated version.
Thanks for letting us know Dennis. Cam
Yes and they are raving about the new 105 as it has the shadow tech. It can also fit bigger cassettes.
Babbel talk... I’ve owned all three categories of Shimano. There’s no discernible difference, especially for the weekend cyclists.
The performance is flawless for each level of the group sets. This is also true for the Di2 version of the Ultegra and Dura Ace group sets.
If you have the budget go for the “BLING”, but know that the 105, and Ultegra level group sets are to not disappoint.
Will not disappoint...
I'm not quite sure what Babbel talk is, but you appear to be agreeing with what is being said, so I assume its a good thing! Cam
Cam...
I was referring to some of the things your mechanic said. Much of his comment made no sense.
Appreciate your contribution, Good Stuff!
I just bought the bike at 4:12 Roubaix elite for 2060 pounds. I cannot belive how good it is, apart from getting flat tyre within a week.. :( Was a little heavier than I thought it would be with shimano pedals I added at 9.3kg with no other addons.
I love that bike! I rode the 'Expert' the entire length of New Zealand last year. See here:ua-cam.com/video/Bxn4XQZnmKQ/v-deo.html . Such a good machine and incredabily comfortable. Cam
I also have had several 105 gruppos on bikes. Great durability, shifting, and braking for the price. I would recommend the group to anyone who can't, or doesn't want, to afford more. My daughter has a Ruby (woman's Roubaix model) that has 105 and it's a fantastic bike for her. I had a Roubaix Expert with Ultegra and now have a SWorks Roubaix with DA 9100. So I have abundant experience with all 3 groupsets. All 3 series are great depending on your finances and needs.
I have a suggestion for Winstan to try here in regard to flat tires (tyres, heh, heh.). I live in the east side of Washingon State, USA. We have a thorn that is notorious for causing flats and is very commonplace. We call it the "goat head" or another name for it is "tackweed". It has 3 sharp spikes that can be anywhere from 1mm to 4 or 5 mm long. It sticks to all sorts of things and then falls off in new areas (or on the road and path to be quickly picked up by bikes) and propagates very quickly. The spikes will penetrate a tire and tube very quickly and often you end up with 2 or 3, and sometimes even more, puncturing a tire at the same time. I have averaged two or 3 flats a week for years. Unfortunatley my road wheelsets aren't tubeless compatible.
But this year I found a simple solution. I will only buy tubes with removable valves now. I simply remove the valve, put about 25-30 grams of Stan's latex into the tube and run them normally after that. I haven't had a flat in over a thousand miles now. Yes, I've picked up numerous thorns but haven't changed or patched a tube since March. 2 of my riding partners have followed suit with the same results. I am no longer considering reinvesting in new wheelsets to run tubeless, although there would be other benefits as well. But I'm retired and on a fixed income so I don't have the float money to do that. This works absolutely great! If it can survive a goat head patch and keep going, without a significant loss of pressure, I think it can survive anything and I recommend it. Adding 30 grams to my 1400 gram wheelset is a negligible weight addition.
Jay Crume Thats great advice ! Yeah is my spelling a bit weird of tyre? Must be a British thing!
105 is still top quality. Heavier than Ultegra yes but really good for what you pay..
i would say that if you stay in mechanical group sets then there is little need for more then 105 for most riders that are not racing. i would put the difference in cost into a slightly better frame then group set. When you go to hydraulic braking i think there is a massive difference between the 105 and the Ultegra. but the thing most missing in the 105 group set is the electronic shifting and that is what made me chose Ultega
Great video. Clean, simple comparisons. I wish you used more than one microphone.
Thanks for the feedback/comment. Always looking to improve the audio. Was it the shotgun mic you thought lowered the audio quality? I.e. should have I worn a lapel mic also? The audio from Darcy was a lapel and put through an audio editing tool. My audio was from the shotgun, and I thought that would have been OK, but perhaps not! Cam
@@CamNicholls Audio good for poor acoustics room, just some background noise.
I'm.The same.got dura ace on my.best bike latest disc version.mechanical. It's quiet, smooth and a little bit lighter weight than the ultegra version. I've ridden.both and can't tell difference. The parts will last longer but not.much.. I've heard of returns on.dura ace for silly things just like ultegra and 105. I've heard the latest 105 is very good even Shimano are pricing it closer to ultegra now. If di2 is not wanted I'd just buy 195. We've got a guy blitzing the group on a generic carbon bike, base level.Shimano wheels and tiagra 10spd.
Thanks for sharing your experiences. Appreciate the comment. Cam
I was looking for exactly this!! Thx for Upload! ♥
Awesome, thanks for sharing
Hydro? That means water, not hydraulic. Plus, most people say disc vs rim brake.
Dura ace is hella reliable, been running dura ace 7900 since 2010, still going strong ✔️✔️
Good content as usual! Like your style as its very “free”. Speaking of groupsets, im on mechanical sram red now and i low key miss my old 105 groupset. You get so much performance for what you pay for
Thanks Richard, much appreciated. I have ridden SRAM Red mechanical myself and I do like the snappy performance, but you're right, the 105 is bloody unreal when you consider it's price point versus the rest.
I also like snappy change, one reason why I don’t pick shimano. I run campy and if you tighten up the “b” screw, it changes like a shot gun, sounds great through tunnels as you change up. But absolutely right. For the price, 105 is unbeatable!
Ultegra mech, plus Duraace crank and rear deraileur if you want it lighter, quite close to full D ace, but much cheaper. I did it on my bike, look from the right side, it looks like the bike got full D Ace groupset.
When you're getting up in the higher-end groupsets you're paying for weight. You're paying for small differences...
Thanks for the comment Darin. I would also add shifting into the conversation, but it's margibal unless you're a hardcore racer. Cam
@Firsthgyhgyhuy Lastujhujhuj you dont get longevity by getting a more expensive groupset, for my experience i can tell that, basically is just weight savings
@@moliyo are Sora and claris reliable as 105 group set ? Thank you!
I have owned bikes with Dura Ace and Ultegra, have ridden bikes with 105. especially now . I have stated to friends etc that I would use Ultegra groupset. Rather than spend the big dollars for Dura Ace , for the performance, when for my point of view the Ultegra performance is just as good.
Thanks for sharing Andrew. Cam
But the cranset that is shown at about 3min30 is not a 105, it's the cheap and heavy RS510. The 105 has the "105" written on it, this,one has "Shimano", it's about 200g heavier than the 105. Here in Canada, you can get it for 150$C, while the 105 is over 300$C.
Loved the content Quality information :)
Thanks John. Cam
I think the best upgrade is a good wheelset.
how do you know whether your saddle is to far forward or to far back ?
regards Peter
this was good explanation .. very good!
Cheers Andrey, Cam
I have the 105 R7000 groupset, it wasn't as good as many has praised. I tried very hard to do a proper indexing on my RD and the indexing always conflicts with 3rd vs 9th gear. Meaning that if you get 3rd gear index right, 9th gear will be out from indexing and vice versa. Many owners have experienced this flaw and we have to live with this flaw by compensating the indexing between these two gears. The front derailleur also has design flaw on the H limiter screw where it will get twisted and jammed if you turn in too hard. Overall I will only give 105 R7000 a 6/10 score since I suspect Shimano purposely induce these flaws as to push consumers to invest on their more expensive groupsets, a very good marketing strategy. Even for Ultegra, some of my friends did broke the alloy crank after pushing it at over 1000watt. It's very fragile and brittle. Come on Shimano, can't you just use carbon crank just like what SRAM did instead of sticking to such obsolete, heavy and weak alloy material? Some how I think Shimano won't do so since their products are way too popular and already gain majority profit from the market. I call this a shame for Shimano for able to do better but they refused to do so.
Enjoying the content👍🇦🇺
Thanks mate, appreciate it. Cam
Awesome vid and great information!!! Thx for sharing!!!
Thank you so much for this really informative video!
Why is that Specialized painted in Celeste green? Does it wish it was a Bianchi?
I’ve bought the 105 hydraulic shifters with Ultegra derailleurs and calipers.
Nice one! Enjoy
Cam Nicholls thanks!
Shimano have said that Ultegra and Dura ace is the same. The molds just use different materials (Thus weight), but the precision is the same.
Interesting... Thanks for sharing John. Cam
l d say save your money and get 105 basic with no cranks and buy some carbon cranks light weight cranks and even save money !! LOTS OF OPTIONS THERE . ALSO other options for groupsets from other makes that are lighter and less $$$.
A pro riding 105 would have ZERO difference in his performance or placement in a race lol, froome could win the tour on sora if he had proper gearing for gods sakes
Is there much -if any- difference in performance between the Tektro Axis caliper that comes factory on a Specialized Allez Sprint vs the Shimano 105 r7000?
A technical query that I don't have the experience with, sorry about that! Cam
@@CamNicholls no worries. I figured it out. Looks like Shimano 105 and up have the same characteristics, which are all better than the Tektro.
@@ayowser01 I upgraded my brakes on an older Allez from Axis to 105 and definitely noticed the difference. Between that and new wheels are the two best upgrades I did to that bike
@@IdolOracle good to know my money is well spent. I found it odd that the component set is all 105, except for the calipers. I ordered a set of 105 brakes and a set of carbon UST wheels. Hopefully they arrive soon. I can't wait to test them out.
I love to pass the $5000 Dura Ace superbike poseurs on my $75 Raleigh Gran sport (1973) on the way up Torrey Pines grade in San Diego. Actually it's got Ultegra/600/Titlist (the lattermost) = generation negative one.
Great vid mate, made me subscribe 👍. I've just started looking for my first road bike after riding my retired MTB with skinnies for the last year and this has been super helpful. Seems like the only reason to go for Ultegra or Dura-ace (for amatures like me) would be DI2. Without DI2 most bikes seem to be around 3k (105), with DI2 they seem closer to 5k (Ultegra). Seems to be a pretty big jump and pretty difficult to justify, what's your thoughts? Also what is that wrap/sticker you have on your forks and logos? It looks freakin awesome. Cheers
Thanks for supporting the channel mate. The Specialized Allez, is a special edition and it comes with that 'Graffiti" colour scheme on the folks! 105 and above you can't go wrong. Depends on your budget. If you can go up to Ultegra mechanical, that would probably be my preference. If you've got lots of cash then electronic is worthwhile but not worth it if it's squeezing your budget. You're better off investing money in a good set of wheels, in my opinion! Cam
In the end it all comes down to the rider.
Yes, fair call Jorge
Great bikeshop, great video!
Paul Knecht thanks Paul 👍 Cam
Thanks for the great comparison.
I do 50% roads and 50% rough path..would you go for canyon grail with 105 r7000 for 2200 Euro or Ultegra "Rx" for 2600?
is this clutch rear derailleur worth the investment? Gravel bikes without it seem to be doing just as fine..
Thanks for the comment and question Changsu. Unfortainteky I can't answer that one as I don't have the hands-on experiences. The only thing I will say with a Gravel bike is that if you're doing a lot of Gravel riding the clutch rear derailleur might be worthwhile. If Gravel is just part of your overall riding experiences then perhaps it's not overly relevant. Cam
I get to the 105 I never owned a road bike.I'm looking ahead for 105!
Can't see any difference but the weight 🇧🇷🇧🇷
The gears are slightly snappier at a higher level, but overall 105 is AWESOME!
Que ganas de que Aparezca una marca al acceso del bolsillo de la gente que Ama este deporte con productos de calidad duraderos ya que Las grandes marcas hacen pedazos los bolsillos de todos los que aman este deporte
thank you
I'd love to get a 105 group set but it's for a gravel bike and I'm looking at grx set as it's more off road oriented
Thanks for sharing on the thread. Cam
GREAT reviews......keep up the good work.....
I rode 105 for years with no issues. Now I can afford DA I bought it! Think its totally a waste of money but it does seem to have a much better resale value
Thanks for sharing your experiences Martin. Good insight. Cam
Honestly, 105 5800> SRAM AXS I speak from experience.
What about Tiagra or something more affordable for the casual cyclist
Haven’t ridden it for a while but works well for the casual cyclist for sure
My only 10-speed is 105. My other two bikes are 9-speed Ultegra. If I buy a new bike in a year or two, it'll be 105.
Summary:
105: entry level, precision bearings, tolerances, 20Y durability. No attention to finish. Simple to manufacture, shifts only 1 gear at a time (vs 3).
Ultegra: All of 105's features, nicely finished, and lightened to give people incentives to upgrade, 20Y durability. Used by TDF domestiques and people racing on their own $.
Dura Ace: Stupid light, think Octalink UN-9100 alloy bottom brackets that lasted 12mo, best case. 2Y durability. Brilliant in the way Trump is, ie in name only.
@3:48 ish the chain is on backwards
105 is totally good but maybe spend little extra for duraace brakes
Ultrgra sounds cooler tho, lol
me puhsunally i prefer jura ace groupset for my boikes
What do you think about Team Inform’s new Tarmac disc for this year?
Awesome choice. I will discuss that in my next review actually. Cam
SRAM Red all the way.
I thought you were Bradley wiggins for a few seconds when this video started.
haha, I get that one bit! Cam
900 to $1,000 retail? I paid $725 for Ultegra. Now I'm wondering if I bought re-badged Chinese.
Good info mate. Definitely noticed the clunkier shifts coming from DA to 105.
Thoughts on running tubulars everyday? I'm sure you would know someone who does...idea for a vid maybe
What do you think of Ribble's Sportive Racing Ultegra bike that cost about $1000? I've being doing some research and I have a good idea on the price points for each bike that comes with the entire groupset. At $1000 is the frame, fork, handlebar and stem worth it? Because I don't want to buy "only" the Shimano Ultegra with the rest being garbage. Buying my first bike and I want it to last at least 10 years.
(It's currently on sale, but it's too good to be true.)
Me, I do, I have just bought clincher wheels for touring after 6 years of running tubulars on all my bikes, as very hard to get ally tubulars now. They to me are the best system to run. WHY?? The rim tyre combination is considerable lighter, the ride is nicer, feels like the tyres are slightly flat, but they are not. Easier to change if flat. And if you run 30mls of stans in them, incredibly reliable against punctures.
PROs you can ride on flat tyres is desperate to get home (although slowly), if you get a flat, no loosing the tyre of the rim, you can run higher pressures and lower pressures than clinchers (I have run them at 40 psi for 23mm no probs) no pinch flats and no messy sealant with tubeless if you run sealant.
CONs only available in top end rims, and more expensive to run.
Maybe I am old school, but I have very little trouble with them and use tape which is so easy.
GRX another good option now
Cannondale SystemSix Ultegra Di2 or DuraAce?
Di2
Cam Nicholls Thanks!
Just upgraded from ultegra to Dura ace. Didn't pay for it tho. If I was gonna pay for a new groupset id stick with ultegra. 105 can do it ultegra feels a bit more premium and is all you need and dira ace is just for sponsored riders imo. If you have the money, go for ultegra but never Dura ace unless you're a dentist
So you didn’t feel any difference in shifting between ultegra and da ?
Depending on power meter choice Ultegra may be the way to go.
Ultegra is always a great choice 👌
what specialized frame is that? is it allez E5 red hook edition?
Allez Sprint 2018 Limited Edition.
105 good for the average Joe !
I am a 56 year old who doesn't race. Don't ask me why but I only ride Ultegra. Pride or keeping up with the Jones's. Naw, just vanity.
What's your thought on mechanical vs electronic groupset? great video btw
Thanks, Howard. It's an interesting question, and probably worth a video! I have gone back to mechanical and enjoyed not having to worry about the charge, to be honest. The differences in shifting are really marginal in my opinion and the weight gains with electronic are something to consider. I know some detailed humans will disagree with that. I'd rather invest in a good set of rims. That could be the difference between winning and losing a race. Not mechanical VS electronic. Although, if your electronic groupset runs out of batteries mid-race it could! LOL. Cam
would love to see that video. How about if there are 2 exact same bikes, except one running mechanical ultegra, the other running electronic ultegra, base on your experience, which one will you choose for training, racing and even commute?
I think electronic is a nice to have..... it is heavier and actually changes slower. For some that have a disability or problem with strength in their hands, electric is great. Some systems can be programmed to do everything in one STI. I do think for the masses thou, the price difference in the top groupsets is a bit too much.
Just went from 8 year old 105 to Ultegra. I realize there is no way to fairly compare the 2. My friend just got the new 105 and swears by it.
Thanks for sharing. Cheers, Cam
8 yr old Ultegra = Sora today. Relax all my Shimano bikes are Ultegra. They do cheapen the finishes, tolerances, and bearings as groups get demoted in rank. Plastic brifter parts, yuck!
Ultegra for me