Thank you again for taking the time to make these videos. ( you're getting better and better with the editing☺️) The Just Fly podcast is a always a great listen. Was just listening to an interesting one regarding foot strength and it had some really solid info. PS. IMO Paul always seems to be a very loose and flexible athlete and seems to lack the stiffness and springiness of the other athletes. Is that really so and why? PPS. Have you read any Tony Holler articles?
Many thanks for the comments... Paul is a different type of jumper, he is loose limbed and also has an arm span longer than his legs (note to coaches check this!). This creates rotation around his hips and also (probably) contributes to a slightly forward running action and torso. Funny you mention that as just today we were working on his running using wickets. Your comment is a good one! I also listen to HMMR podcasts and also sportscoach radio. Quite a lot of choice. Nope, not read Tony Holler, I will go in search...
the interesting thing about weight lifting is that it tends to be a reflection of one's bodytype. Cal Dietz looks like a football player or powerlifter and his body is made for lifting heavy. So it makes sense that he's going to be a weight room guy. At the recreational or high school level, it's also true. When you see a coach like Tony "Feed the Cats" Holler, he does not emphasize weights. Look at his body type. Ryan Banta is built like a powerlifter and promotes weight lifting and he clearly eats a lot of carbohydrates and looks like weight room guy. I can see a lot of guys getting a disc bulge or ACL tear from some of the weight room antics. It's usually just a matter of when. That's the reality of lifting heavy things.
I also think that, as Cal works I believe as a S&C coach with so many varied athletes that weights (and the triphasic method) is somewhat central to his working... as a long jump coach for example, I have to account for technique and speed and want to incorporate the conditioning into the daily workload of my athletes. I do have trouble with separated S&C regimes as they can impact on the work done at other times. To me the S&C coach should support the main sport's coach and not work in isolation (also we coaches need to be receptive to their expertise). I have had a number of the athletes in my training group go the US and, in some cases, they are provided with a S&C programme that seems far removed from what they are required to do on the run way, for example. If you give an athlete lots of weight lifting exercises, then guess what, they'll become weight lifters! I like what the triphasic method 'stands for' and have done some research to answer some of my own queries. Cal' book is itself very detailed and sets up the rationale for triphasic really well... however, as in most cases in life, it pays to find out a little yourself and not just copy. All the best,
Jason, There's not really a definitive text as there are varying ideas ... in the past older Soviet and Eastern European texts could be useful .. they can give a good grounding still. Work by Tudor Bompa Periodisation of Strength is a useful reference. A good starting point for contemporary track conditioning and understanding of coach philosophies is Training Talk Conversations with a Dozen Master Coaches by G Martin Bingisser of HMMR media. He produces numerous podcasts with track and other coaches ... I often listen to these to get ideas .. the book however is a great way to get an initial understanding of various ideas. I've developed my own ideas over time and have picked up some new ideas to add to the older ones. All the best.
Hi John These are very very useful clips. As an ex high jumper the methods you explain would seem to apply for high jumpers but do you think the crossover from your triple/long training would apply to high jumpers ? Many thanks again for all the postings.
I think there would be quite a bit of cross-over although there would also need to be some specific changes. I'd guess most obviously that jumps with more vertical displacement would be needed - for example, HJ take-off, with one step and three steps between. I've also been party to the belief that there's perhaps more of a need to add loaded plyos into the mix for high jumpers. The take-off is the little bit longer than the LJ and TJ, so that would make sense. I do coach a couple of young high jumpers, but as it's not my specialism I don't post on the subject. However, a bit like with my LJ & TJ at the beginning I'm trying to figure out what's needed! Consequentially I'm thinking that iso/eccentric drop and block jumps could be important due to the more dramatic switch of angles in the HJ. Thanks for the comments on the videos!
I’d start with being able to handle body weight first. We do single leg squats, glute bridges abs … and lots of basic drills which strengthen muscles specific to sprinting and jumping. These include marches and lunges for example. When completed over 20m 2-3 times each they will have a significant strengthening effect. Also realise that plyometrics are strength (power) exercises and that these are in my opinion more beneficial than weights at an early age - as is the learning of optimum technique. I introduce more loaded weights exercises circa the age of 15/16 with the jumpers but these are more for and injury avoiding benefit than an improvement enhancing one. At age 20/21 then there can be a move to more performance enhancing weights. Hope this overview helps
That's a good question and I do try to vary the workouts between different types of jumpers. In an ideal world I'd split the athletes and provide slightly more distinct workouts than I am able to at present. We tend to all train at the same time - after school/college or work, so being really specific in a fully targeted way is difficult. However, some of the long jumpers don't bound nor do they do as much training as others. Another triple jumper bounds but can get "away" with only 3 or so workouts a week (similar to the long jumper mentioned). And these two guys are potentially the quickest and most powerful (they've jumped 7.86m & 16 plus...). Different types of jumpers do need different training - that's an idea for another video. Thanks for your question.
Thank you coach. Hi my new internship and my evening classes give me only two days for bodybuilding . Saturday and Sunday. how can I put these days to profit? I make the jump in length, and I gained 1,24m in 4 months of training. I measure 1,82m for 70 kilograms
It’s not so much my area of expertise being a Jumps coach... however, I’d recommend that you do your running (especially your fast and higher anaerobic running) first. You can then do weights in the latter part of the day. Don’t forget that you should also do plyometric exercises too and that you can do these as part of your running warm-ups. Also you should look lift predominately heavy - not strength endurance type training. The more force you can generate whatever your distance - everything else being equal - the quicker you will be.
at 4:49, is that single leg squat (3-5 sec?) supposed stress more of the concentric contraction on the hamstrings? Does a slow concentric load potentially help an eccentric movement?
Hi, really concentric force needs to be rapid for max transferability into speed and power events in general. It will target fast twitch type 2x fibres and the largest of muscle motor units. A single leg squat can place more emphasis on the hamstrings but that's most likely to be during the lowering phase when the hamstrings are under tension and working concentrically (shorten) as the quads, for example work eccentrically (lengthen). In terms of the other part of your query, really the answer to me, is no with a weights exercise. Muscles will have more time under tension but this is not what they will be subject to in competition for instance. Now, eccentrically this may be the opposite... eccentric lowering for example can target more fast twitch fibre and rebalance some of the natural and trained emphasis on concentric actions. If you just let the lower half of a squat just happen, for example, there would be little eccentric activity. I see eccentric training at the foundation to improved concentric ones. Bit complex and in part my thoughts but hope this helps
My approach is very similar to yours from what I have seen of your athletes. We tend to work on 3 week cycles when everyone is in good shape. Medium/ heavy /light volume wise with the intensity wave out of phase by a week ie high intensity when low volume. On a separate note even though we do the eccentric/iso landing drills too but I am not convinced that there is a lot of added benefit. I think a lot of those qualities are actually developed in the weight room doing stuff like power clean catches, heavy partials and explosive pistol squats. I will make a final decision at the end of this season but since the triple is so rythemic I think that the real progress comes from conditioning by doing stuff like repeat bounds for distance with a decent run in. My daughter goes 33m for 10 bounds of 12strides and my son 39m. As these have improved so have their triples
Always a tricky one to know which conditioning means really improves performance... I have found similar with the run on bounds and using a low platform (to propel out to two bounds/hops and a jump from 6-10 steps). Those scores for your son and daughter are good! With the 16m triple jumper in my group we are also working on his hop range and this was literally holding him back up until a year ago, when guess what we started to do more run-on hops... I think that each athlete is different too and that you can see where specific event leg stiffness is missing and which athletes are better eccentrically compared to plyometrically and so forth. Cheers.
Hi there, it's better to have a flatter back than an overly rounded one, as this will enable you to create a better exit angle i.e block clearance. You can "push/drive" through your back as you accelerate away. If the shoulders are rounded then you may not achieve the best angles for the drive phase... many sprinters keep their head down, which - if the back is not correctly positioned - will result in an ineffective drive (basically they run near upright but think they are driving correctly because they are looking at the track). The first steps away need to get that full extension through the body without a hing at the hips and the flat back will help enable this. Good luck!
John Shepherd track & field coach - author & editor could I send you some clips of my acceleration via mail so maybe you could evaluate and make changes ?
If an athlete has the same fibre makeup as the cheater your analogy is good. But if an athlete has less 11b's then you need to incorporate modalities to address 11a's as well. And then there is work capacity. I know that you know this, it's just that some people will use the analogy to avoid working hard and although we know that sprinting should be infrequent with good recovery training the human athlete is more complex than catching your food/surviving/catching your food etc :)
Many thanks for your comment and good observation. Yes, training a human is a complex consideration. The comment about the cheetah was made more in terms of not overtraining in general and the need to do focussed work that will target IIbs (and create overshoot). It's an interesting point re the IIa's and work capacity. I know coaches who up training intensity and volume to work these fibres in a way that will produce greater power output (aimed at this "type" of athlete). I have a multi-event athlete who probably falls into this category... they have quickness, they can jump and hurdle very well and also run a great 800m (a telling point)... it's going to be of interest to see whether we can generate more power and speed from this athlete overtime. We need to work to the athlete's strength (in general but specifically) and also try to make some subtle changes (to RFD vis-a-vis fibre type, CNS etc) in order to attempt to get closer to what will optimise performance. Many thanks for the comment and perhaps I'll try to say more on this in another video.
I use the overshoot process with my athletes with pretty good results usually. It seems to be explained with the idea of fibre suppression through loading and the subsequent rebound and replenishment in the taper period. This seems to be they latest way to explain the phenomenon. I remember my coach describing the effect with the analogy of loading a spring in a heavy block then releasing the load to allow it to spring back. This was the idea 30 years ago. I think there could be CNS recovery happening in addition to the shift in fibre proportions but regardless of the science we all know that It works. We are moving into the competitive phase here in NZ. My son and daughter both had their first comp on Saturday and both are clearly more powerful this season. They struggled a bit technically due to this but the signs are good. My daughter managed 12.77 in relatively still conditions 17cm shy of her PB.
Richard, that 's a good analogy. My coach of 20 years back tended to use a very classical periodisation model and although it seemed to work, I think that I'd have produced better performance with a block periodisation model... we used to run repeat 300s (and similar) for long-ish periods. This no doubt effected fibre composition... it would take a while to feel really fast subsequently... might explain why I was faster over 200/400 as a long jumper. So, with my athletes now I try to maximise the long and triple jump's physiological requirements. We all respond differently too which makes for the "art" of coaching. So, a good start to the season for your athletes (and children!) and all the best for the rest of the season.
Great stuff John. So glad that I stumbled across your channel. Been very helpful as a reference for my training. Keep at it 👍
Many thanks and good luck with the training 👍🏼
Thank you for the weight training videos, long winter season to train ahead.
Thank you!
How to choose the distance between the start and take off ?(long jump)
What a great, informative video. Thanks a lot, I appreciate your channel
Many thanks and do spread the word! 👍🏽🙏🏽
Thank you again for taking the time to make these videos. ( you're getting better and better with the editing☺️)
The Just Fly podcast is a always a great listen. Was just listening to an interesting one regarding foot strength and it had some really solid info.
PS. IMO Paul always seems to be a very loose and flexible athlete and seems to lack the stiffness and springiness of the other athletes. Is that really so and why?
PPS. Have you read any Tony Holler articles?
Many thanks for the comments... Paul is a different type of jumper, he is loose limbed and also has an arm span longer than his legs (note to coaches check this!). This creates rotation around his hips and also (probably) contributes to a slightly forward running action and torso. Funny you mention that as just today we were working on his running using wickets. Your comment is a good one!
I also listen to HMMR podcasts and also sportscoach radio. Quite a lot of choice. Nope, not read Tony Holler, I will go in search...
Holler's articles are pretty basic, but his ideas are pretty radical for all the volume/Wight lifting coaches. Always a fun read though.
the interesting thing about weight lifting is that it tends to be a reflection of one's bodytype.
Cal Dietz looks like a football player or powerlifter and his body is made for lifting heavy. So it makes sense that he's going to be a weight room guy.
At the recreational or high school level, it's also true. When you see a coach like Tony "Feed the Cats" Holler, he does not emphasize weights. Look at his body type.
Ryan Banta is built like a powerlifter and promotes weight lifting and he clearly eats a lot of carbohydrates and looks like weight room guy.
I can see a lot of guys getting a disc bulge or ACL tear from some of the weight room antics. It's usually just a matter of when. That's the reality of lifting heavy things.
I also think that, as Cal works I believe as a S&C coach with so many varied athletes that weights (and the triphasic method) is somewhat central to his working... as a long jump coach for example, I have to account for technique and speed and want to incorporate the conditioning into the daily workload of my athletes. I do have trouble with separated S&C regimes as they can impact on the work done at other times. To me the S&C coach should support the main sport's coach and not work in isolation (also we coaches need to be receptive to their expertise). I have had a number of the athletes in my training group go the US and, in some cases, they are provided with a S&C programme that seems far removed from what they are required to do on the run way, for example. If you give an athlete lots of weight lifting exercises, then guess what, they'll become weight lifters! I like what the triphasic method 'stands for' and have done some research to answer some of my own queries. Cal' book is itself very detailed and sets up the rationale for triphasic really well... however, as in most cases in life, it pays to find out a little yourself and not just copy. All the best,
John Shepherd track & field coach - author & editor Hii sir I wanna practice with you please tell how's it's possible
Great content coach. Much appreciated
Hi John, your video was quiet insightful what reference material would you recommend for further insight into weight training a sprinting.
Jason,
There's not really a definitive text as there are varying ideas ... in the past older Soviet and Eastern European texts could be useful .. they can give a good grounding still. Work by Tudor Bompa Periodisation of Strength is a useful reference. A good starting point for contemporary track conditioning and understanding of coach philosophies is Training Talk Conversations with a Dozen Master Coaches by G Martin Bingisser of HMMR media. He produces numerous podcasts with track and other coaches ... I often listen to these to get ideas .. the book however is a great way to get an initial understanding of various ideas. I've developed my own ideas over time and have picked up some new ideas to add to the older ones. All the best.
Hi John
These are very very useful clips. As an ex high jumper the methods you explain would seem to apply for high jumpers but do you think the crossover from your triple/long training would apply to high jumpers ?
Many thanks again for all the postings.
I think there would be quite a bit of cross-over although there would also need to be some specific changes. I'd guess most obviously that jumps with more vertical displacement would be needed - for example, HJ take-off, with one step and three steps between. I've also been party to the belief that there's perhaps more of a need to add loaded plyos into the mix for high jumpers. The take-off is the little bit longer than the LJ and TJ, so that would make sense. I do coach a couple of young high jumpers, but as it's not my specialism I don't post on the subject. However, a bit like with my LJ & TJ at the beginning I'm trying to figure out what's needed! Consequentially I'm thinking that iso/eccentric drop and block jumps could be important due to the more dramatic switch of angles in the HJ. Thanks for the comments on the videos!
@@Johnshepherdtrackcoach Thank you John.
Hi John, at what age would you recommend weight training at?, is 13 too young.
I’d start with being able to handle body weight first. We do single leg squats, glute bridges abs … and lots of basic drills which strengthen muscles specific to sprinting and jumping. These include marches and lunges for example. When completed over 20m 2-3 times each they will have a significant strengthening effect. Also realise that plyometrics are strength (power) exercises and that these are in my opinion more beneficial than weights at an early age - as is the learning of optimum technique.
I introduce more loaded weights exercises circa the age of 15/16 with the jumpers but these are more for and injury avoiding benefit than an improvement enhancing one. At age 20/21 then there can be a move to more performance enhancing weights.
Hope this overview helps
@@Johnshepherdtrackcoach thank you very much, your advice is appreciated, I really do like all you videos as well
Do you use different workouts for your speed vs power jumpers, or is it more of a technique difference between the two and one general workout ?
That's a good question and I do try to vary the workouts between different types of jumpers. In an ideal world I'd split the athletes and provide slightly more distinct workouts than I am able to at present. We tend to all train at the same time - after school/college or work, so being really specific in a fully targeted way is difficult. However, some of the long jumpers don't bound nor do they do as much training as others. Another triple jumper bounds but can get "away" with only 3 or so workouts a week (similar to the long jumper mentioned). And these two guys are potentially the quickest and most powerful (they've jumped 7.86m & 16 plus...). Different types of jumpers do need different training - that's an idea for another video. Thanks for your question.
Thank you coach. Hi my new internship and my evening classes give me only two days for bodybuilding . Saturday and Sunday. how can I put these days to profit? I make the jump in length, and I gained 1,24m in 4 months of training. I measure 1,82m for 70 kilograms
How long does it take for that overshoot to occurr?
What diet should maintain for runners
Sir i need 100m workout time table
What is the better way of practicing 800 meters.
Should I go to morning ground
And evening to the gym for strenth...?
It’s not so much my area of expertise being a Jumps coach... however, I’d recommend that you do your running (especially your fast and higher anaerobic running) first. You can then do weights in the latter part of the day. Don’t forget that you should also do plyometric exercises too and that you can do these as part of your running warm-ups. Also you should look lift predominately heavy - not strength endurance type training. The more force you can generate whatever your distance - everything else being equal - the quicker you will be.
Where r u from...
@@Johnshepherdtrackcoach what is plyometric exercises sir
London!
I from India hii sir .please one video making for me with long jump waight practice . please sir my interview before 31 October
at 4:49, is that single leg squat (3-5 sec?) supposed stress more of the concentric contraction on the hamstrings? Does a slow concentric load potentially help an eccentric movement?
Hi, really concentric force needs to be rapid for max transferability into speed and power events in general. It will target fast twitch type 2x fibres and the largest of muscle motor units. A single leg squat can place more emphasis on the hamstrings but that's most likely to be during the lowering phase when the hamstrings are under tension and working concentrically (shorten) as the quads, for example work eccentrically (lengthen). In terms of the other part of your query, really the answer to me, is no with a weights exercise. Muscles will have more time under tension but this is not what they will be subject to in competition for instance. Now, eccentrically this may be the opposite... eccentric lowering for example can target more fast twitch fibre and rebalance some of the natural and trained emphasis on concentric actions. If you just let the lower half of a squat just happen, for example, there would be little eccentric activity. I see eccentric training at the foundation to improved concentric ones. Bit complex and in part my thoughts but hope this helps
You helf me new word record in 2020 YES I WILL MADE NEW RECORD IN LONG JUMP IN2020 YOU ARE READY TO COACH YOUER WORK IS BEST MORE THANKS
My approach is very similar to yours from what I have seen of your athletes. We tend to work on 3 week cycles when everyone is in good shape. Medium/ heavy /light volume wise with the intensity wave out of phase by a week ie high intensity when low volume.
On a separate note even though we do the eccentric/iso landing drills too but I am not convinced that there is a lot of added benefit.
I think a lot of those qualities are actually developed in the weight room doing stuff like power clean catches, heavy partials and explosive pistol squats. I will make a final decision at the end of this season but since the triple is so rythemic I think that the real progress comes from conditioning by doing stuff like repeat bounds for distance with a decent run in. My daughter goes 33m for 10 bounds of 12strides and my son 39m. As these have improved so have their triples
Always a tricky one to know which conditioning means really improves performance... I have found similar with the run on bounds and using a low platform (to propel out to two bounds/hops and a jump from 6-10 steps). Those scores for your son and daughter are good! With the 16m triple jumper in my group we are also working on his hop range and this was literally holding him back up until a year ago, when guess what we started to do more run-on hops... I think that each athlete is different too and that you can see where specific event leg stiffness is missing and which athletes are better eccentrically compared to plyometrically and so forth. Cheers.
Hey coach my back seems to be slightly rounded at the set position of a block start. Is this normal ?
Hi there, it's better to have a flatter back than an overly rounded one, as this will enable you to create a better exit angle i.e block clearance. You can "push/drive" through your back as you accelerate away. If the shoulders are rounded then you may not achieve the best angles for the drive phase... many sprinters keep their head down, which - if the back is not correctly positioned - will result in an ineffective drive (basically they run near upright but think they are driving correctly because they are looking at the track). The first steps away need to get that full extension through the body without a hing at the hips and the flat back will help enable this. Good luck!
John Shepherd track & field coach - author & editor could I send you some clips of my acceleration via mail so maybe you could evaluate and make changes ?
Sure, send them over to Johnshepherdfitness@gmail.com I'll do what I can time-permitting.
If an athlete has the same fibre makeup as the cheater your analogy is good.
But if an athlete has less 11b's then you need to incorporate modalities to address 11a's as well. And then there is work capacity.
I know that you know this, it's just that some people will use the analogy to avoid working hard and although we know that sprinting should be infrequent with good recovery training the human athlete is more complex than catching your food/surviving/catching your food etc :)
Many thanks for your comment and good observation. Yes, training a human is a complex consideration. The comment about the cheetah was made more in terms of not overtraining in general and the need to do focussed work that will target IIbs (and create overshoot). It's an interesting point re the IIa's and work capacity. I know coaches who up training intensity and volume to work these fibres in a way that will produce greater power output (aimed at this "type" of athlete). I have a multi-event athlete who probably falls into this category... they have quickness, they can jump and hurdle very well and also run a great 800m (a telling point)... it's going to be of interest to see whether we can generate more power and speed from this athlete overtime.
We need to work to the athlete's strength (in general but specifically) and also try to make some subtle changes (to RFD vis-a-vis fibre type, CNS etc) in order to attempt to get closer to what will optimise performance.
Many thanks for the comment and perhaps I'll try to say more on this in another video.
I use the overshoot process with my athletes with pretty good results usually. It seems to be explained with the idea of fibre suppression through loading and the subsequent rebound and replenishment in the taper period. This seems to be they latest way to explain the phenomenon.
I remember my coach describing the effect with the analogy of loading a spring in a heavy block then releasing the load to allow it to spring back. This was the idea 30 years ago.
I think there could be CNS recovery happening in addition to the shift in fibre proportions but regardless of the science we all know that It works.
We are moving into the competitive phase here in NZ. My son and daughter both had their first comp on Saturday and both are clearly more powerful this season. They struggled a bit technically due to this but the signs are good. My daughter managed 12.77 in relatively still conditions 17cm shy of her PB.
Richard, that 's a good analogy. My coach of 20 years back tended to use a very classical periodisation model and although it seemed to work, I think that I'd have produced better performance with a block periodisation model... we used to run repeat 300s (and similar) for long-ish periods. This no doubt effected fibre composition... it would take a while to feel really fast subsequently... might explain why I was faster over 200/400 as a long jumper. So, with my athletes now I try to maximise the long and triple jump's physiological requirements. We all respond differently too which makes for the "art" of coaching. So, a good start to the season for your athletes (and children!) and all the best for the rest of the season.
You should get a mic, you're very hard to hear
Too bad we are not cheetahs.