Islamic Modernism vs. Other Islams w/ Dr. Javad Hashmi and Luis Dizon
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- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
- Islamic Modernism vs. Other Islams w/ Dr. Javad Hashmi and Luis Dizon
Dr. Javad Hashmi talks about Islamic Modernism and how it differs from traditional perspectives on Islam.
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Minimum requirements:
Adoption of secular humanism
Respect for free speech
Sharia law in the dustbin
Very enlightening.
Thanks
It is worth noting that while an individual's personal opinions may be subjective and their authority within the Muslim community are wholly uncertain, it is crucial not to dismiss or misrepresent the foundational texts and teachings that form the basis of Islamic law. These texts are studied and taught to imams in seminaries, and their importance should not be understated. Just as there may be Catholic priests and bishops who hold differing views from the Vatican, this does not invalidate the teachings of the Vatican or imply that they are irrelevant. In this case, the exercise appears to have involved a degree of subtle and unsubtle deception by disregarding the established texts and teachings that define Muslim law.
Does Islam have a Magisterium?
@@silverbear5548 Effectively, yes, though not the same structure as the Catholic Magisterium. Sunni Muslims use a consensus, called the ijma, based on the understanding of 4 absolute masters of Islamic knowledge, the mujtahids mutlaq. These are the founders of the 4 schools of fiqh/jurisprudence. The senior scholars are considered their successors, their rulings are authoritative, the senior clerics are the inheritors of the mantle of Mohammed, passing authority down to the lesser clerics. The sharia, as written and practiced within each school is absolute, not to be questioned by Muslims, or anyone else, for that matter. Islamic law permits a range of behaviours, even contradictory ones, that earn reward and still align with doctrine - taysir/darura (ease/necessity) and azima/rukhsa (strictnes/dispensation). The major scholars are of a separate class, masters of the hakika, not just the sharia. It is a Muslims duty to submit, t obey without question what his imam imparts based on his imams' link to higher authority. It's like a military order, with a top down, distributed design. Very much unlike Western concepts, and hard to grasp unless you spend time reading their obscure sharia legal texts.
@@LloydDeJongh
Here we meet again. In the previous video with the same three persons + Bart Ehrman, I had several exchanges with Muslim commenters. I don't know if you have watched it. However, I posted the following and now I'd like to know if you have ever heard of what is mentioned here:
1st comment
*The Islamic-Christian Forum*
Referring to the 'Dicastery for Interreligious Dialogue', and all the writings that are derived from there, in October 2015 it was presented a collection of texts in a book format of 2,100 pages, of annotations and dialogues between Catholic and Muslim scholars from the time of Pope John Paul II through Pope Benedict XVI. The latter proposed a *'dialogue of charity in truth'* .
A year after the Regensburg address, 38 Muslim scholar, who subsequently increased to 138 in number, wrote a letter to the Pope in a document entitled *'A common word between us and you'* , explaining the principles of Islam and expressing hope for mutual comprehension, and a relationship between Islam and Christianity based on love for God and neighbor, in accordance with the teachings of Jesus.
The result of this praiseworthy initiative was the creation of the Islamic-Christian Forum, which continues to exist to this day.
[Source Vatican News. va, 2015]
2nd Comment
Not to mention the 59-year-old Declaration of Pope St. Paul VI *'Nostra Aetate'* of October 28, 1965, and the latest Pope Francis' *'Document on Human Fraternity for World Peace and Living Together'* signed in Abu Dhabi (UAE) as joint statement with the Grand Imam of Al-Azhar, Sheikh Ahmed el-Tayeb on February 4, 2019.
Don't you thinks 2,100 pages would give a different perspective than what you are used to?
@@therealongI hope one day you'll be relevant.
@@LloydDeJongh
You're so negative, man! I told you in the chat yesterday, you're full of prejudices, possibly due to your mentioned 11 years living in the Middle East? And what else did you mention? Having been in the Army or something?
However, you didn't even bother with digesting what was written here, and see the positive side of it. Do you really think it is utopian? What's the point of exchanging "God bless"'es" then? 🤔
PAX CHRISTI 😇
I really appreciated this!
Thanks!
The Quran wasn’t preserved through writing it was preserved orally and considering people have different levels of memorisation why’s it a surprise that you have differences because of that?
Notice @25:00 he says “they wrote from a “defective script” assuming these writings are because of an original script.
The Quran wasn’t preserved through writing it was preserved orally and considering people have different levels of memorisation why’s it a surprise that you have differences because of that?
I appreciate David Wood's content and his approach to Islam, but I think it's also good to have more listening focused content where we just hear out the other side.
Other side?? Wow
What you want to know the other side of why the 53 year old mohamagoat did a nine year old little girl who was still playing with dolls.
And you have to say still playing with dolls because moo zlimes will say the nine year old Aisha was mature for her age.
Do we need to hear the other side of the Nazis??
And mohamagoat is still the example all moo zlimes are commanded to follow today.
And the other side is commanded to lie and deceive non-moo zlimes. And you think you get the truth. The stupidity is astounding.
43:05 emm well, no, you can, after invastigation, come to the conclusion that some miracle claims are more rational to believe in than others or that there is no good reason to believe in some miracle claims as opposed to others etc. It would be only special pleading if one were not to invastigate the claims in question and arbitrary believe in only those that are compatible with ones prefered religious tradition
Pakistan was socialist in the 60s , it was more liberal than India at the time.
Many Muslims countries had social experience.
In fact Obama grew up the socialist indonisia thinking that was Islam
🙏
Pre-pubescent marriage and intercourse in Islamic law:
M3.9: The Bride's Right to Marry a Suitable Match of Her Choice Whenever a free woman asks to marry a suitor who is a suitable match (def m4) (O: by telling her guardian, “Marry me to him''), the guardian must marry her to him (O: whether she is a virgin or nonvirgin, and whether prepubescent or not).
M3.13: Guardians Who May Marry a Virgin to a Man Without Her Consent Guardians are of two types, those who may compel their female charges to marry someone, and those who may not.
-1- The only guardians who may compel their charge to marry are a virgin bride's father or father's father, compel meaning to marry her to a suitable match (def: m4) without her consent.
-2- Those who may not compel her are not entitled to marry her to someone unless she accepts and gives her permission. Whenever the bride is a virgin, the father or father's father may marry her to someone without her permission, though it is recommended to ask her permission if she has reached puberty. A virgin's silence is considered as permission.
As for the nonvirgin of sound mind, no one may marry her to another after she has reached puberty without her express permission, no matter whether the guardian is the father, father's father, or someone else.
Book N: Divorce
N9.1 There is no waiting period for a woman divorced before having had sexual intercourse with her husband.
N9.2 A waiting period is obligatory for a woman divorced after intercourse, whether the husband and wife are prepubescent, have reached puberty, or one has and the other has not.
Intercourse means copulation (def: n7.7). If the husband was alone with her but did not copulate with her, and then divorced her, there is no waiting period.
N9.6 If a woman is not pregnant and has menstrual periods, her waiting period ends when three intervals between menstruations have finished. A part of an interval between menstruations is considered the same as a whole interval. Thus, if the woman's husband divorced her and her menses began an instant later, her waiting period would end after two more intervals between menstruations had finished and a third menstruation begun.
N9.9 The waiting period for a woman who does not menstruate, whether prepubescent or postmenopausal, is three months.
Book E: Purification
E10.3
When a woman who has been made love to performs the purificatory bath, and the male's sperm afterwards leaves her vagina, then she must repeat the ghusl if two conditions exist: (a) that she is not a child but rather old enough to have sexual gratification (A: as it might otherwise be solely her husband‟s sperm);
(b) and that she was fulfilling her sexual urge with the lovemaking, not sleeping or forced.
Umdat as-Salik
Infants may be contracted by their guardians.
The marriage of a boy or girl underage, by the authority of their paternal kindred, is lawful, whether the girl be a virgin or not, the Prophet having declared, "Marriage is committed to the paternal kindred." Malik alleges that this is a power the excercise of which does not appertain to any of the kindred except the father. Shafei maintains that it belongs only to her father or grandfather: and he adds that this privilege does not appertain to any guardian whatever with respect to an infant Siyeeba, although he be her father or her grandfather. Malik argues that power over freemen is established from necessity; but in the present instance no such necessity exists, as infants are not subject to any canal appetite : yet it is vested in a father, on the authority of sacred writings contrary to what analogy would suggest : but he also says that a grandfather, not being the same as a father, is not to be included with him.
The Hedaya
And of one not subject to courses, three months : and of one who is pregnant, the term of her travail. THE Edit of a woman who, on account of extreme youth or age, is not subject to the menstrual discharge, is three months, because GOD has so ordained in the sacred writing, The Edit of a pregnant woman is accomplished by her delivery, whether she be a slave or free, because GOD, in the sacred writings, has so ordained respecting woman in that situation.
The Hedaya
And so likewise of a child born of a wife under age within nine months after either irreversible or reversible divorce. If a man repudiate, by an irreversible divorce, a wife who is under the age of puberty, but yet such an one as may admit of carnal connexion, and she bring forth a child after the expiration of nine months from the time of divorce, the parentage of the child is not established in him ; but if the delivery be within less than nine months, it is established. This is according to Haneefa and Mohammed, Aboo Yoosaf says that the Parentage is established in the man, although the child, should not be born within less than two years from the period of divorce, because she was under Edit, and it is possible that the pregnancy may have existed at the time of the divorce, and she not have declared the accomplishment of her Edit, wherefore this infant wife is the same as a full-grown woman.
The Hedaya
"Problem # 12. Intercourse with a woman is not allowed unless she attains the age of nine years, regardless whether the marriage is permanent or temporary. There is, however, no objection in other enjoyments like touching lasciviously, hugging and rubbing the thighs, even with a suckling infant. If a person has had intercourse with a girl before she has attained the age of nine years, but it has not resulted in ifda' he shall not be subjected to any punishment, except that he shall be considered to have committed a sin. If his intercourse has resulted in Ida'. so that the urinal and menstrual or the menstrual and fecal passages have become one she shall be rendered perpetually prohibited to him though, according to the more cautious opinion, it shall be so in the latter case. In any case, according to the stronger opinion, she shall not cease to be his wife. So all the laws relating to her wifehood shall apply to her like mutual inheritance, prohibition on having a fifth wife, and the prohibition for the husband to marry her sister, etc. He shall be bound to maintain her as long as she is alive, even if he divorces her, rather, according to the more cautious opinion, even if she marries another husband after the divorce by the first husband, rather it is not devoid of force, and he shall also be bound to pay the Diyat for Ilda' to her, and that is equal to the Diyat of a human being. If the wife is a free woman, she shall receive half the Diyat of a man in addition to the dower to which she is entitled by virtue of the contract and consummation of marriage. If the husband performs intercourse with his wife after she has completed nine years of age, and it results in Ilda' , she shall neither be rendered unlawful to him, nor shall he be required to pay her Diyat, but, according to the more cautious opinion, he shall be bound to maintain her as long as she is alive, though, according to the stronger opinion, he is not bound to do so."
Tahrir al Wasilah
2:05:00 taqiyyah is real.... painting it like it was akin to the N word is intellectually and morally disrespectful.
It is old hat for Hashmi. He spent years under the pseudonym 'Danios' writing for a smear site called 'loon watch'.
@@Tar-Elenion Well I checked this out and yes :D He even scammed on this loonwatch site. He did an Indiegogo fundraising and disappeared with 8000 USD. Obviously a trustworthy fellow... Surely he would not lie again...
I’ve read that taqqiyyah is real, but only a thing for Shia Muslims, who are 20% of Muslims and the ones in Iran. Sunni Muslims, who are 80% of Muslims, don’t believe in it