*Timestamps:* 0:00 - Intro 0:15 - Background of Dr. Ehrman 0:50 - Topics to be discussed 1:11 - Reasons for dating the 4 Canonical Gospels to about 70-100 AD 3:37 - Paul's writing predating the Gospels & contradicting John 5:06 - Is Jesus Yahweh ? 8:03 - Did Jesus PBUH predict his death ? 11:00 - Tampering with the story of Jesus's death 12:13 - Did Jesus PBUH think he was God ? 15:07 - Jesus PBUH denying being God in Mark 10: 17-19 18:40 - Using God (Theos) as a title for people in the Bible [Concept of Divinity in ancient times] 23:33 - Death and Resurrection of Jesus PBUH making him divine 24:40 - No concept of Incarnation of Jesus PBUH in the Gospels 26:49 - Disagreements between the Disciples and Paul 31:05 - Observing the Torah by Jewish Christians according to Paul 35:14 - Jesus PBUH not abolishing the law & Matthew's views on the law 37:38 - Textual Criticism of the Bible (Are the original gospels available today ?) 41:35 - Scribes changing the words in the Bible (Copying errors & Deliberate Alterations) 44:02 - Significance of the Dead Sea Scrolls 48:22 - Historicity of a Scripture vs its Accuracy 50:45 - Early Christianity after the New Testament 56:53 - Which of the early Christian movements resembles the faith of Jesus's disciples ? 57:27 - The Faith of Jesus's original disciples being declared as a Heresy 58:15 - Authorship of the Gospels (Did the Disciples write the Gospels ?) 1:00:26 - People writing books/letters on a famous person's behalf in the ancient times 1:07:19 - Reception of Dr. Ehrman's work by the Biblical Scholars 1:10:21 - Views of St. Augustine on lying being always wrong 1:12:17 - Criteria approach to the Historical Jesus Christ PBUH 1:16:47 - Dr. Ehrman's view of the criteria 1:19:26 - Dale Allison's approach and History as a probability Judgement 1:23:52 - Historical vs Biblical Jesus 1:25:43 - Closing Statements by Dr. Ehrman & his upcoming projects 1:28:40 - Wrapping Up & book recommendations SUBHANALLAH ❤️🤍❤️ *Brilliant, chilled & very informative discussion with one of the most anticipated guests.* _May Allah ﷻ bless you and reward you for your efforts._
Muslims should not get offended by what Dr B.Ehrman says about Islam; he is not an expert in islamic sciences and barely understands it. When it comes to biblical sciences, yes, his opinion matters as he is an Expert in that field. Thanks brother Paul for all your effort; we learn a lot. JazzakAllahu Kayran!
@@james9077 It is not a double standard; he has zero knowledge in Islamic fields. “Here you are - those who have argued about that of which you have [some] knowledge, but why do you argue about that of which you have no knowledge? And Allah knows, while you know not.” Noble Quran 3:66
Sir, I am brand new to this channel. I must say, this is the best Bart Ehrman interview I have seen. You respected us and him by being well-prepared, succinct, informed and focussed. You did the work, and the work paid off. Useful, informative, enlightening, relevant -- just wonderful.
Paul, thanks for all your work. I wish you interview professor Wael Halaq. He is an American professor of humanities of Palestinian Christian background. He has multitude of books on Islam and modernity. His latest book is called the impossible state. I imagine this would be an epic interview.
@@noahwamalwa4385 god doesnt go to bathroom, he governs everything and he can erase eveyrthing in a blink of a second, he doesnt get beaten by human beings just to save you from himself, he doesnt change how he does revelation and comes as human when for centuries he sended hundreds of prophets, and he knows what the future upholds so he knows what will happen, he is the most powerful and his figure was not and will not never be touched and harmed by none of his creations.
Great conversation. I'm by no means an experienced reader on Christian scholarship but I really do like Bart Ehrman. He must be fun to take a class with.
All the credits go to Paul to be so knowlegeable to keep up with a world leading scholar in his field on highly academic subjects... and I sensed from Dr Bart's demeanor that he was delighted to be interviewed by an erudit like Paul...THANK YOU to both of you for this great conversation
By Bart's own word, he has never picked up a Qur'an to read for himself. He's 66/67 but seems pretty sharp still Masha'Allah. Insha'Allah he gives it a fair chance without any preconceived notions, emotional bias, or gossip and he will be amazed. Much love and peace brother Paul.
@@Logia1978 he isn’t wrong though.. he “usually” accepts invitations like this for donations. He doesn’t take money himself he always asks people to donate to good foundations. He’s been doing that for a long time.
Salaam Paul. I'm on holiday in Turkey but yet find myself still sneaking in one of your vids 😊 No way of escaping your truly informative and noteworthy channel!
Thank you so much. I have been waiting for the longest time for you Sir, to feature Dr Ehrman on your show. I have been following him for many years now with great interest.
Probably the best interview I've seen with Ehrman. I read The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture back in college, around 1999, and it changed everything for me. I need to get his book about forgeries.
@@merlinx8703 Really Bart Ehrman, Granted very smart. The guy can never make up his mind. I appreciate his opinion, there's too much evidence otherwise.
Thank you brother Paul. I read a lot of books by Bart Ehrman so was familiar with most of the content of the video. However you asked a very significant question that I have never heard him answer in the minute 52. Which group of early Christians most resembled the faith of Jesus early desciples. The answer was even more significant...the Ebionites which was the group who believed in observing the Torah and that Jesus was the Jewish Messiah and that he was not devine.
Superb Q & A session Paul. Thank you Paul for the series of questions, which addressed the most salient points. Great work Paul! A lot of enlightening content. I hadn’t been familiar with some of the books presented here, looks like I’ll have a lot of reading to do over the holidays 😃. Mr. Bart Erhman, wanted to extend my appreciation for your Patience and Time enlightening us with your extensive scholarship/knowledge on the subject matter! BTW; I had written a comment on the previous blogging Theology podcast with Dr. Brown. Hope you can find the time to review. Happy holidays and Happy new year to all.
@@mohameda5947 when it’s Eid and someone wishes you a Happy Eid, will your reply be you are Christian and this isn’t your holiday now? It’s all about building Bridges! Be extreme when you are engaging in prayer 🤲🏻
@@logicalreasoning1088 huh? Well, let me keep this short and sweet. Although i may get where you’re coming from, i should point out that being kind And respectful does not entail or necessitate supporting disbelief. Neither does making your position or stance on a matter clear hinder building bridges. Rather it can be argued that it. allows you to build stronger bridges with stronger integrity. in other words the bridge wouldnt be compromised or built on a shaky foundation also because there is transparency and you can see what position everyone is working from. There wouldn’t be fake smiles over and support for things you don’t believe in or support.
@@mohameda5947 Appreciate your perspective on the matter. Christmas is “supposed” to be a celebration of the Birth of Jesus (PBUH), although the view of who Jesus is/was maybe different, along with the actual date of his Birth. Saying that you respect that date isn’t disbelief. The better argument IMO, is to say we don’t celebrate any other Prophets Birthday, so celebrating the birth of Jesus, wouldn’t be warranted. Nevertheless, this particular celebration (Christmas) can build bridges, in addition to promoting Christians who are not familiar with Islam, to perhaps gain some interest in learning, which in turn can lead to reversion. Taking a hard stance or transparent stance (As you say), isn’t the way to optimize building bridges. That’s my personal perspective and opinion.
Honestly this was a joy. Thank you so much Paul and Dr Ehrman. You've definitely gained a fan in me and looking forward to venturing into Ehrman's literature and scholarship. God bless you all
@@BloggingTheology This was worth the money Paul. In the future you could start a donation campaign to fund an hour of any other worthy speaker. speaking for myself, i would be happy to pay into this. anybody in mind? jzk.
A remarkable discussion and very revealing of Barts character. Very different from the session with Dr Brown. Bart is so at home with the historical Jesus. Paul interviewed him very well.
Hey Paul... I like where Bart Ehrman said ( regarding ancient beliefs about God ): "In all these belief systems, the divine world is more like a pyramid." I don't think I was ever fully aware of this. So when it comes to Jesus' identity regarding His "divinity," I need to better understand the beliefs of the Ancient Near East, the beliefs of the followers of Jesus and the beliefs of Jesus Himself. If it took "a long time to deal with this question" for Bart Ehrman ( a scholar ), It will probably take me the rest of my life !! assalam wa alaekum
I am sure glad you did this session with Dr.Bart...full of academic and intellectual discussion.... After huge frustration and dissatisfaction with the previous unbalanced unacademic non intellectual speakers corners type session between him and Dr Brown.....with no disrespect to Dr. Brown... This session really satisfied my passions for academic and intellectual session
H MY an ardent fan of biased scrutiny of scriptures! I cannot understand this former Christian scholar refuting Christians beliefs n revered by them n building a following who does not want to accept an alternative truth existing in their midst n blatantly ignoring to seek the ultimate truth! I say biased because why if he is sincere is he not dissecting the Quran?
@@abdulazizmanaf2015 truths and sincerity is not an academic or intellectual objectives.... Theirs objective is to seek facts... Through logical methodology... If you seek truths and sincerity... You need to ask religious teachers.... They can give you whatever version of truth you want
@@WORLDNEWREALITY The whole presentation was equally interesting covering three main topics: how the gospels depict Jesus upon him be peace, textual criticism methodology and a brief history of Christianity. They are presented in that order if you are interested.
Great conversation gentlemen. Thank you. Impressive what Bart is doing for the homeless & hungry with his blog. Interesting how he rationalises & critiques the reliability of previous Christian history, tradition & accounts etc - this contrasts with the consistency of the Quran & Hadith chains and their classifications that at least attempts to add some certainty and nuance to historic Islamic claims. One wonders if Bart has ever read the Quran & explored the hadiths?
EXACTLY..MOST PROBLEMS were caused by atheists secular govts and Christianity majority counties!! He looks less intellectual nowadays and more of an emotional teenager!
i think he could not follow christianity anymore after he discovered all the false hood , But he has some sort of pride that is preventing him from looking at islam ,therefore he is finding a cause to reject God altogether . He thinks hiding in this little corner , in a false comfort Zone is good enough for him.
@@truthmatter9972 exactly what I have felt .. I wonder the question he has about Christianity, have been answered in Islam … but pride is preventing him from looking
Half way through it and so thankful to both of you. Islam ☪️ asks believers to look into these books and seek knowledge as it was Devine revelations but got corrupted! Thank u so much for ur expert opinion on bible. One of best and simple explanation.
I used to be scared of listening to Bart Ehrman or reading his books. But after this discussion, I feel more comfortable listening to him. That does not mean I agree with everything he says, but I respect his scholarly research.
@@Ace0555 What "forgeries" are you referring to and what do you mean by the word "forgeries." If a book seemingly is fake or not historically accurate, then of course I should disregard what the book says.
@@johnbrzykcy3076 obvious forgeries that were included. Did you not watch the interview. There are obvious forgeries from unknown authors. That can’t be the word of God
@@johnbrzykcy3076 if u are a Christian then please don't be afraid to read scholarly critics of Christianity. Yes, u might be scared of losing your faith but think about this: You have only one life and if u are scared of researching different ideas and theologies then you might die while following a wrong religion. I am a Muslim and I try to read scholarly works of all religions. You shouldn't be hiding in a corner. Come out and explore proffesional works/readings with an open mind and In Sha Allah you will become a Muslim. May Allah guide you.
some people complaining about the last episode. just want to share my thoughts as a regular consumer of the content from this channel. first of all, it was a completely new idea from Paul to bring to guests of opposing views to discuss their ideas on the platform. while i think the discussion was very interesting, i would prefer less of such content on the channel on the future as imo debates have less valuable knowledge for lay people and it feels like battle of emotions and who can do better argumentation rather than we gain some knowledge. secondly on surface the performance from dr bart was not what we are generally used to from intellectuals and academics. same maybe said for dr Brown as well. the simple reason is dr bart didn't have deep enough knowledge of basic Islamic Creed to intellectually engauge with dr Brown. also these people are academic intellectuals not trained debaters. so i would stress that unless we have a very structured debate format, these types of episodes may not necessarily be very useful of the average audience. last but not least i think what Paul is trying to do by bringing the intellectuals of opposing ideas together is very praiseworthy. but i think the episodes of Paul having conversations with each individual separately are extremely valuable for many people especially Muslims like myself as i get to understand the perspective of other religions in a very objective way and how academics think about various aspects of Islamic Creed. jazakAllah for the good work though. love you Paul for the sake of Allah SWT.
I agree. I'd rather see the different/opposing views in their own separate videos rather than being debated. It's much more engaging and informative when it's one-on-one with Mr Williams.
I agree, but you're also ignoring the fact that Paul brought Dr Brown and Dr Ehrman for an open dialogue and not to debate at all! For whatever reason Dr Ehrman went off script and started pressing Dr Brown on his beliefs, perhaps he had misunderstood the aim of the discourse. There's actually no reason why they cannot both share a platform again providing they both understand and agree to the aims of having free, open dialogue with the aims of increasing understanding and sharing thoughts and ideas.
He is already a muslim but refraining from making a declaration to expose the traditionalist Muslims. He is on to making a new renaissance in Islamic society.
As muslims we need to understand that Islam is the religion chosen by God to be the last guidance for the human race. God will protect it. Islam and daawa do not need people no matter how knowledgeble they seem. Knowledge without humility and mercy means nothing. Look at how God describes al Khidr in Quran:"So they found one of Our servants, on whom We had bestowed Mercy from Ourselves and whom We had taught knowledge from Our own Presence." Mercy before knowledge. It is we , humans who need islam to save ourselve in this life and after death. It's dr.Bart who needs to get the message before it's too late. " O men! It is you, who stand in need of God, whereas He alone is self-sufficient, the One to whom all praise is due."
Hey Paul... I never read any of Bart Ehrman's books because I had preconceived notions about his beliefs that scared me. But this interview made me feel less reluctant to listen to Ehrman and I have more respect for his scholarly views. As a Christian, my core beliefs have not changed. I really like when Bart said regarding the existence of an original manuscript: "that would have no bearing on the question of whether it's accurate or not." Excellent point ! I also liked Bart's honesty when he said "it's a very complicated issue."
@John, I have to disagree with the fact that an original manuscript would have NO bearing on the question of whether it's accurate or not. It's a DIVINE manuscript, it absolutely has bearing. The day will come when the original Bible will be found, and I hope it's in my time when I'm alive God willing.
@@ajzab Well... I think it depends on what we mean by "accurate." If we mean that the original manuscript not only contains the words written by the author, but those words are an accurate representation of reality, in particular the reality of God ( it's a "divine manuscript" as you said ), then of course I would accept such a manuscript as being "accurate" both historically and theologically. I doubt we will ever find any "original" manuscripts of the New Testament because they were written on papyrus which usually decays after a few decades. Personally, I believe the New Testament manuscripts that have been discovered are accurate in the sense that the words are the "ipsissima vox" ( the concepts of what Jesus said ) although not necessarily the exact words of Jesus. Regarding the Quran, I am learning slowly. Is the Quran "divine"? For me personally, I'm not convinced it is. I hope God guides my path because my reasoning has often been "derailed." assalam wa alaekum from Florida
Great discussion. I guess I feel like there is a missing piece in the puzzle that dr. Brown didn't get the chance to complete. The missing 3rd prophet mentioned in the Bible started his journey to research Islam but then as he dug deeper it was apparent to him that this is the truth because of the miracle of the Qur'an and the ways this book is so amazing that it's impossible that it was written by a man and that this religion totally makes sense and matches our innate nature. That's what for me turns faith into knowledge, pure probability calculation. What are the chances that a random guy that couldn't read or write in a desert around year 610 could come up with a book that is so amazing in its language and content without contradictions, so different from every writing before and after and turned one very primal nation of various tribes into the biggest civilization in the history in just a few decades? It's really that saying that I read somewhere, "You can deny God but how do you deny Mohammed". Mohammed is a historical person and by most western scholars the most influential person in HUMAN history. That to me is the missing piece of the puzzle that wasn't noted in this discussion that makes Islam go from faith to knowledge and makes it so easy to accept.
one more thing to add. This kinda got dismissed or missed during the discussion but Bart mentioned that one of the unanswered questions that scientists have today is that how did something come from nothing and he believes that science will come to answer this question. I would argue that science will never be able to answer this as based on all our evidence and science today this will go against everything we know.
Another great video. The more muslims know about christianity and its origins the better, so they can preach and defend their faith more effectively. Can someone add timestamps to the video though?
@@thefenerbahcesk4156 I'm a Christian and I also want to know more about Christianity and it's origins. I know very little about Islam but I still try to respect Muslims.
I just read that Hindus believe in a concept called ‘ghar wapsi’ (that all people of India are ancestrally Hindu and, hence, conversion to Hinduism is one of "coming home" to their ancestral roots). We Muslims say every baby is born in fitrah, as Muslims. Do we see the difference? They see religion and worship as an ethnic thing as if there is a separate religion for each ethnicity. We Muslims say all humans are descendants of Adam, and we are all Created by One and Only God.
Assalamu'alalkum. My sincere wish is to listen to a debate between Dr Zakir Naik, Dr Bart Ehrman and Rabbi Tovia Singer. Appreciate if you could arrange for this debate online. All should benefit from this discourse... Muslims, Christians and Jews Thank you very much, sir
Hey Paul, for the problem of Matthew I'd refer you to a lecture done by Nehemia Gordon titled the hebrew Yeshua vs the greek Jesus. Apparently there is a translation error from hebrew or aramaic to greek and Jesus was warning his disciples not to follow the man made laws that the rabbis have created.
That’s was useful , I can see why he have a very distorted view of GOD due to his biblical deep understanding and presentation of GOD as an angry aggressive being.
😱 How did I missed to like this video the last two times I watched it!!? Shame on me 😭Had to watch this again after Dr. Ehrman posted it his in his blog 😁
Glad to see Dr. Ehrman speaking within his expertise. Alhamdul-lah in Islam we have the chain of narrations both for the Qur'an and the hadith. Especially for the hadiths, which the scholars classified them in sahih, Hasan, daif, maudu. So Muslims who want to learn would know the forgeries from the truth in their religious scriptures.
@@srnp0007 because he was the messenger of Allah, never lied before or after prophecy, was known in Makkah as Al Ameen the trustworthy, that's why his enemies from the pagans never called him a liar, called him a poet, a soothsayer, not a liar. If you study the science of hadith you would see that Muslim took great care of their traditions.
@@srnp0007 Because there are dozen of hadiths narrating the same thing from different people. The logical question would also arise as to why people would die for their invented stories, which is largely what happened.
@@europg81 Why dont you do your own own homework? Start searching ‘sahih hadiths that contradict the quran’ and you will find hundreds. Because you askes for one, here you go: Quran says the knowledge of the Hour and the Unseen is ONLY with Allah. Yet there are hundreds of hadith of the last prophet predicting and prophecising the day of judgment/ future
Thanks a lot br Paul. Just wish you invite Dr abdulhakiim quick to discuss these holidays & there pagan origins, Halloween, Christmas, Easter, valentine.
Say (O Muhammad SAW): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allah, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allah. Then, if they turn away, say: "Bear witness that we are Muslims." Quran 3:64
Assalamu alaikum my dearest brother in Islam I'm requesting if you could kindly do audio quran with your awesome voice which Almighty Allah has blessed you with masha Allah
In lost Christianities bart mentioned that we don't have anything from Jewish Christianity (Ebionites and Nazarenes ) if we got from them the situation will be totally different Christianity
I wanted to have a bilateral meeting with the presence of personalities such as: Ustaadh Muhammad Tim Humble ,Nicholas Pelletier, Yusuf Estes,، Samuel Sharcher, Sheikh Bilal Philips ، Khalid Green ، Sheikh Shamsi ، Sheikh Mufti Menk ، Sheikh Othman bin Al-Farouq.
Paul your videos are unmatched I am genuinely thankful for your insightful content Alhamdulillah. May Allah(SWT) bless you with a long life full of health and reward you for all the quality knowledge you share. You should drop a reading list I have gotten a few books that you recommend on my list but there is so many. Do you have a "top 10" that you would recommend on biblical scholarship and early Christian theology ?
A nice summary of the growth of Christianity in the early years. And it can be interesting to discuss the origins of the gospels. But the gospels contain various teachings from Jesus. Jesus referred to these teachings as the "Bread of Life" as they contain messages that feed our souls. One can argue over the phraseology of them, but in the end, we do have various teachings from Jesus, that one either takes to heart, or not. Getting people to take them to heart is the hard part. Talking about how they got here is the easy part.
Can't wait. Having said that, Prof Ehrman has been disingenuous in various talks with Muslims imo....for instance he says things like Qur'anic preservation is not an evidence of divinity, yet he has said about the bible 'if God sent revelation, why didn't he preserve it'?
@@The_Angry_BeEconomist He doesn’t agree with the second statement though. He says that the statement: “if something is divine, it must be preserved” is just people trying to impose their own standards onto God.
@@IbnMurrah I don't see whats controversial about that statement. The reason most muslims give for not accepting the modern day torah is because its not preserved.
@@The_Angry_BeEconomist Agreed - that's why he should simply have acknowledged that fact when it was presented to him by Muhammad Hijab, instead ehrman says just because Qur'an is preserved doesn't point to a divine nature , even using a phonebook example to make his point! Glad you clarified.
Re Paul's Q at 12:30, on the historical evidence substantiating divinity of Jesus (ie whether HE said it or not), is there extra-scriptural historical source material that substantiates this (contemporary historical accounts, etc)?
Wow I’m so surprised how many contradictions in Christianity. So many ideas don’t make sense and even their scholars can’t understand so many things in it. Thank God for sending prophet Mouhamed PBAH as last prophet to clarify everything and about all the prophets before him. May God guide us to Islam religion and keep us following it until we pass away.
@@srnp0007 whats up with you dude, why you keep making contradictory sarcastic posts, may things are not clarified to you .. maybe you haven't read it and maybe you are just a troll
But my problem is I don't see the "last prophet" as clarifying everything. I admit I'm still learning about Islam. I personally believe that Jesus' love for mankind makes a lot of sense. Only God can guide us to truth. He understands our hearts and our reasoning.
@Paul, if I may suggest a piece I would be interested in a discussion... In what ways do the stories of Jesus, written largely after the destruction of Israel by Roman legions, create an identity for Jewish presence now dispersed and roundly entered into a gentile society as slaves or refugees? I could understand a displaced people telling anyone who would listen things like Pontious Pilate crucified their messiah because they thought he was the unappointed King of the Jews, adding narratives appealing to the poor, etc. I can't help but feeling there is no temple now, there is no country, there is barely a religion left, but this story might bring forth a new Israel, a new world and a new place of power for those utterly without.
Apart from the er.emm.eh eh hmm.er. but.but.but emm er's. Really informative & enjoyable conversation between 2 people with a real understanding of the topic discussed leaving us with many Q's answered & with explanations throughout for their individual stance. Many thanks for the upload, learning can never be underestimated
Salaam paul thank you for a very educational interesting interview both muslims & Christians should learn from each other when engaged with others in discussions we could explained in more humane ways instead of ignorance!
It's funny how more people don't find it mighty suspicious that the god/religion their parents happened to teach them, as their parent's parents did etc just happens to be the right one, and also how people rarely have a better reason for believing in whatever religion other than their parents taught it to them. Born in India, you're a Hindu, born in Afghanistan, you're a Muslim, North America, you're a Christian... Nobody ever seems to think about that.
P.S. many of the sahaba (may Allah be pleased with them) didn't follow what their parents followed. Actually the Quran address this issue well. You should read it .
Quran 5:104 When it is said to them, “Come to Allah’s revelations and to the Messenger,” they reply, “What we found our forefathers practicing is good enough for us.” ˹Would they still do so,˺ even if their forefathers had absolutely no knowledge or guidance?
Fitnah can also means kufr (disbelief) , shirk (idolatry) Al-Anfal 8:39 وَقَٰتِلُوهُمْ حَتَّىٰ لَا تَكُونَ *فِتْنَةٌ* وَيَكُونَ ٱلدِّينُ كُلُّهُۥ لِلَّهِۚ فَإِنِ ٱنتَهَوْا۟ فَإِنَّ ٱللَّهَ بِمَا يَعْمَلُونَ بَصِيرٌ And fight them until there is no more *Fitnah* (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allah) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allah), then certainly, Allah is All-Seer of what they do.
@@علي-ش7ث8ب Firstly, as Arabic spelling is concerned the end is Taa' marbuuta (-ta, this t is t with a dot underneath for the letter ط مَرْبُوطَةٌ) which represents the singular feminine word and its plural is "-aat". Arabic in its original you write it down as you pronounce it, -at would've been pronounced just that, but since it became normal not pronounce syntactic ends then people pronounce it as -a without the T, but I think its wrong to replace the T with H, H doesn't represent femininity, in the Afroasiatic languages the T is what represents the feminine! It's all distortion!
@@علي-ش7ث8ب Noun cases are: Fitnatun فِتْنَةٌ Fitnatan فِتْنَةً Fitnatin فِتْنَةٍ Dual: Fitnataani فِتْنَتَانِ Fitnatayni فِتْنَتَيْنِ When the word on its own is either Fitnatun or Fitna without pronouncing the t, but Fitna or Fitná but there's no need to stretch the sound to -ah only -á otherwise you're making -ah part and parcel of the word structure distorting the feminine -t into fantasy and delusion instead as if -h were the natural sound and physical structure of the word! When the word is part of إِضَافَةٌ or construct state noun + noun in a genitive relationship then you pronounce -t, Fitnatu-Ssadri (s with a dot underneath = letter ص) or Fitnat-Ssadr فِتْنَةُ الصَّدْرِ = trial / distress of the heart /soul, in other words Fitna describes situation you find that tries you into (in this particular phrase) uneasiness, anxiety, concern, worry, affliction; but in another phrase opposite. Fitna is about trials in life positives or negatives; so, Fitna in these Aayaat, each has its speech context meaning. 5:41 Fitna = trial (self-delusion) 6:23 Fitna = yearning (what their hearts were yearning for no longer is there) 7:155 Fitna = trial (guide/misguide) 8:39 Fitna = errant situation (8:36-37)
@@علي-ش7ث8ب Whether it's Unfortunate or fortunate, in this lower life humanity always without exception is in Fitnat, in fact it's our identity! If Allaah makes anyone see the Fitnat he / she is in, then that person can navigate himself / herself to Allaah and that is fortunate, if not unfortunate, and certainly whether anyone finds whether he / she is fortunate or unfortunate is in the judgement day!
In this wonderful conversation between Paul Williams and Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman, I noted, I think, some important points; [13:50/1:29:33] "Jesus never called himself God in Matthew, Mark, and Luke."(Prof.Dr. Bart Ehrman) [14:17/1:29:33] "He[Jesus] describes himself as a Divine being only in Gospel John, the last Gospel...If it is true that Jesus is going around saying that he was God..., if that were the case, how is it that three of the Gospels don't mention it?...that is why most critical scholars suspect that it was developed later..."(Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman) [19:46/1:29:33] " I don't think any early Christians [calling?] that Jesus is Yahweh."(Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman) [1:10:21/1:29:33] "we have the idea that lying is always wrong...there are some Christians who are lying sometimes." (Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman) [1:10:35/1:29:33] "you can't lie under any circumstances, you can't lie!" (Paul Williams) [1:11:40/1:29:33]"The end justifies the mean!" (Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman) [1:17:02/1:29:33] most probably Prof.Dr. Bart Ehrman is quoted as saying, "If you're going to do history, there is no objective method...you shouldn't take this as subjective, as there is some sort of alternative...there is no alternative because history is subjective, all of the humanities are subjective compassion...My view of these criteria is.., these criteria are how everybody figures out what happens in the past...I think doing history involved a probability judgment. Always involved in the probability judgment... You can't prove it because history is not like chemistry. In chemistry, you can repeat the same experiment over and over again and you'll get the same result of a variable [you control of a variable?]. You get the same result! What happens in chemistry, it allows you then to predict what will happen next. In history, we are not predicting what is going to happen next, we are trying to figure out what happened before, you can't repeat this experiment...so, we have other kinds of the evaluation... you can't do it statistically, but probability[probability judgment?]." Note: sorry if I noted some points wrongly[or I missed out on some points]. Please refer to the full conversation between the two gentlemen!
*Timestamps:*
0:00 - Intro
0:15 - Background of Dr. Ehrman
0:50 - Topics to be discussed
1:11 - Reasons for dating the 4 Canonical Gospels to about 70-100 AD
3:37 - Paul's writing predating the Gospels & contradicting John
5:06 - Is Jesus Yahweh ?
8:03 - Did Jesus PBUH predict his death ?
11:00 - Tampering with the story of Jesus's death
12:13 - Did Jesus PBUH think he was God ?
15:07 - Jesus PBUH denying being God in Mark 10: 17-19
18:40 - Using God (Theos) as a title for people in the Bible
[Concept of Divinity in ancient times]
23:33 - Death and Resurrection of Jesus PBUH making him divine
24:40 - No concept of Incarnation of Jesus PBUH in the Gospels
26:49 - Disagreements between the Disciples and Paul
31:05 - Observing the Torah by Jewish Christians according to Paul
35:14 - Jesus PBUH not abolishing the law & Matthew's views on the law
37:38 - Textual Criticism of the Bible
(Are the original gospels available today ?)
41:35 - Scribes changing the words in the Bible
(Copying errors & Deliberate Alterations)
44:02 - Significance of the Dead Sea Scrolls
48:22 - Historicity of a Scripture vs its Accuracy
50:45 - Early Christianity after the New Testament
56:53 - Which of the early Christian movements resembles the faith of Jesus's disciples ?
57:27 - The Faith of Jesus's original disciples being declared as a Heresy
58:15 - Authorship of the Gospels
(Did the Disciples write the Gospels ?)
1:00:26 - People writing books/letters on a famous person's behalf in the ancient times
1:07:19 - Reception of Dr. Ehrman's work by the Biblical Scholars
1:10:21 - Views of St. Augustine on lying being always wrong
1:12:17 - Criteria approach to the Historical Jesus Christ PBUH
1:16:47 - Dr. Ehrman's view of the criteria
1:19:26 - Dale Allison's approach
and History as a probability Judgement
1:23:52 - Historical vs Biblical Jesus
1:25:43 - Closing Statements by Dr. Ehrman & his upcoming projects
1:28:40 - Wrapping Up & book recommendations
SUBHANALLAH ❤️🤍❤️
*Brilliant, chilled & very informative discussion with one of the most anticipated guests.*
_May Allah ﷻ bless you and reward you for your efforts._
Thank you brother
@@thefenerbahcesk4156 جَزاكَ اللهُ خَـيْراً ☺️😊
You are the man bro
@@merlinx8703 ❤️
@@asadullahsaaid3794 💚
Muslims should not get offended by what Dr B.Ehrman says about Islam; he is not an expert in islamic sciences and barely understands it. When it comes to biblical sciences, yes, his opinion matters as he is an Expert in that field. Thanks brother Paul for all your effort; we learn a lot. JazzakAllahu Kayran!
Agreed
100% Agree. I second that. 👍🏼
Double standard, the way of a typical Islamist.
@@james9077 KKK Christmas
@@james9077 It is not a double standard; he has zero knowledge in Islamic fields. “Here you are - those who have argued about that of which you have [some] knowledge, but why do you argue about that of which you have no knowledge? And Allah knows, while you know not.” Noble Quran 3:66
Sir, I am brand new to this channel. I must say, this is the best Bart Ehrman interview I have seen. You respected us and him by being well-prepared, succinct, informed and focussed. You did the work, and the work paid off. Useful, informative, enlightening, relevant -- just wonderful.
Wow, thank you
You’re also a respected atheist
Erereettetete re Re the w we ereere
@@stevecampbell1368 seems u don't know how to type
Paul, thanks for all your work. I wish you interview professor Wael Halaq. He is an American professor of humanities of Palestinian Christian background. He has multitude of books on Islam and modernity. His latest book is called the impossible state. I imagine this would be an epic interview.
Wael Halaq is another type of Orientalist. He has some ideas which we could agree with as an academic.
@@noahwamalwa4385 god doesnt go to bathroom, he governs everything and he can erase eveyrthing in a blink of a second, he doesnt get beaten by human beings just to save you from himself, he doesnt change how he does revelation and comes as human when for centuries he sended hundreds of prophets, and he knows what the future upholds so he knows what will happen, he is the most powerful and his figure was not and will not never be touched and harmed by none of his creations.
Great conversation. I'm by no means an experienced reader on Christian scholarship but I really do like Bart Ehrman. He must be fun to take a class with.
All the credits go to Paul to be so knowlegeable to keep up with a world leading scholar in his field on highly academic subjects... and I sensed from Dr Bart's demeanor that he was delighted to be interviewed by an erudit like Paul...THANK YOU to both of you for this great conversation
ua-cam.com/video/CznzKf_Tqdw/v-deo.html
Bart ehrman delivered, excellent guest on blogging theology. Thank you so much Paul.
My pleasure!
This was absolutely incredible! Great questions and a wonderful and civil discussion.
Excellent clarifying questions poked by Brother Paul. And really appreciate Dr Ehrman's frank discourse. Big thank you to both of you.
A long waited interview with Bart Ehrman is finally here. Thank you Paul
By Bart's own word, he has never picked up a Qur'an to read for himself. He's 66/67 but seems pretty sharp still Masha'Allah. Insha'Allah he gives it a fair chance without any preconceived notions, emotional bias, or gossip and he will be amazed. Much love and peace brother Paul.
Thank you Dr Ehrman for accepting to come to this channel.
And thank you Paul to make it happen.
He charged a good fees for that!
@@henriquesombiga4338
Hater talking..
@@Logia1978 he isn’t wrong though.. he “usually” accepts invitations like this for donations. He doesn’t take money himself he always asks people to donate to good foundations. He’s been doing that for a long time.
Awesome Podcast with Dr. Ehrman, Nice to hear and to see him happy all along the conversation. Cheers
Glad you enjoyed it!
Salaam Paul. I'm on holiday in Turkey but yet find myself still sneaking in one of your vids 😊 No way of escaping your truly informative and noteworthy channel!
Wa alaykumu s-salam and happy holidays!
I'll get extra popcorn this time. I've still to comment on the last dialogue with Dr. Brown. It was epic. 👍🏽😘
InshaAllah send me popcorn, mine finished!
@@allykhan8594 😅😂
Excellent podcast Paul. Superb interviewing. This is probably the best interview that I have seen of Dr Ehrman. Bravo!!
Paul thanks for addressing my all questions. I'd be always grateful for it. 😊👋🙂
Thank you so much. I have been waiting for the longest time for you Sir, to feature Dr Ehrman on your show. I have been following him for many years now with great interest.
So you like Bart Erhman ?
I think it id the limitation of human language in describing zzgod
Probably the best interview I've seen with Ehrman. I read The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture back in college, around 1999, and it changed everything for me. I need to get his book about forgeries.
Yes there are errors in the Bible, of course. Even Bart Ehrman says it doesn't change the death and Resurrection of Jesus Christ or salvation.
@@Faith-Ministries Bart does not consider the resurrection to have happened ...... he is even debating Mike Licona on this
@@merlinx8703 Really Bart Ehrman, Granted very smart. The guy can never make up his mind. I appreciate his opinion, there's too much evidence otherwise.
@@merlinx8703 By the way he has debated Mike Licona on this before..A cpl of times....and lost, probably why he wants to debate him again.
@@Faith-Ministries i dont think he lost
Prof. Ehrman; my favourite biblical scholar. Thank you very much for inviting him for this dicussion Sidi Paul.
So you like Bart Erhman?
Thank you brother Paul. I read a lot of books by Bart Ehrman so was familiar with most of the content of the video. However you asked a very significant question that I have never heard him answer in the minute 52. Which group of early Christians most resembled the faith of Jesus early desciples. The answer was even more significant...the Ebionites which was the group who believed in observing the Torah and that Jesus was the Jewish Messiah and that he was not devine.
Thank you so much for this interview brother. May the most high bless you greatly
Superb Q & A session Paul. Thank you Paul for the series of questions, which addressed the most salient points. Great work Paul! A lot of enlightening content.
I hadn’t been familiar with some of the books presented here, looks like I’ll have a lot of reading to do over the holidays 😃.
Mr. Bart Erhman, wanted to extend my appreciation for your Patience and Time enlightening us with your extensive scholarship/knowledge on the subject matter!
BTW; I had written a comment on the previous blogging Theology podcast with Dr. Brown. Hope you can find the time to review. Happy holidays and Happy new year to all.
Happy New Year to you too ( from Florida )
We follow jesus and these are not our holidays are they now? 😁
@@mohameda5947 when it’s Eid and someone wishes you a Happy Eid, will your reply be you are Christian and this isn’t your holiday now?
It’s all about building Bridges! Be extreme when you are engaging in prayer 🤲🏻
@@logicalreasoning1088 huh? Well, let me keep this short and sweet. Although i may get where you’re coming from, i should point out that being kind And respectful does not entail or necessitate supporting disbelief. Neither does making your position or stance on a matter clear hinder building bridges. Rather it can be argued that it. allows you to build stronger bridges with stronger integrity. in other words the bridge wouldnt be compromised or built on a shaky foundation also because there is transparency and you can see what position everyone is working from.
There wouldn’t be fake smiles over and support for things you don’t believe in or support.
@@mohameda5947 Appreciate your perspective on the matter. Christmas is “supposed” to be a celebration of the Birth of Jesus (PBUH), although the view of who Jesus is/was maybe different, along with the actual date of his Birth. Saying that you respect that date isn’t disbelief.
The better argument IMO, is to say we don’t celebrate any other Prophets Birthday, so celebrating the birth of Jesus, wouldn’t be warranted.
Nevertheless, this particular celebration (Christmas) can build bridges, in addition to promoting Christians who are not familiar with Islam, to perhaps gain some interest in learning, which in turn can lead to reversion. Taking a hard stance or transparent stance (As you say), isn’t the way to optimize building bridges.
That’s my personal perspective and opinion.
Honestly this was a joy. Thank you so much Paul and Dr Ehrman. You've definitely gained a fan in me and looking forward to venturing into Ehrman's literature and scholarship. God bless you all
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@BloggingTheology Did you have to pay the USD 5k for him to appear? just curious since you mentioned earlier in some video
@@aaza638 yes he required a fee. $1000 an hour.
@@BloggingTheology This was worth the money Paul. In the future you could start a donation campaign to fund an hour of any other worthy speaker. speaking for myself, i would be happy to pay into this. anybody in mind? jzk.
@@aaza638 Thanks!
A remarkable discussion and very revealing of Barts character. Very different from the session with Dr Brown. Bart is so at home with the historical Jesus. Paul interviewed him very well.
I was glad to see Paul was laughing at times. I did not watch the session with Dr. Brown.
There is no historical record of Jesus from that era outside New Tesrament. None...
Dear Shaikh Paul, beautiful !!! Thank you Professor Bart Ehrman, for your scholarly information in your usual smile n style.
Hey Paul... I like where Bart Ehrman said ( regarding ancient beliefs about God ): "In all these belief systems, the divine world is more like a pyramid." I don't think I was ever fully aware of this. So when it comes to Jesus' identity regarding His "divinity," I need to better understand the beliefs of the Ancient Near East, the beliefs of the followers of Jesus and the beliefs of Jesus Himself. If it took "a long time to deal with this question" for Bart Ehrman ( a scholar ), It will probably take me the rest of my life !!
assalam wa alaekum
I just love how well prepared the interviewer (Br. Paul) is. I wish I get this much command in my profession. Ameen!
I am sure glad you did this session with Dr.Bart...full of academic and intellectual discussion.... After huge frustration and dissatisfaction with the previous unbalanced unacademic non intellectual speakers corners type session between him and Dr Brown.....with no disrespect to Dr. Brown... This session really satisfied my passions for academic and intellectual session
👍
H MY an ardent fan of biased scrutiny of scriptures! I cannot understand this former Christian scholar refuting Christians beliefs n revered by them n building a following who does not want to accept an alternative truth existing in their midst n blatantly ignoring to seek the ultimate truth! I say biased because why if he is sincere is he not dissecting the Quran?
@@abdulazizmanaf2015 truths and sincerity is not an academic or intellectual objectives.... Theirs objective is to seek facts... Through logical methodology... If you seek truths and sincerity... You need to ask religious teachers.... They can give you whatever version of truth you want
I love your work and how prepared and educated the interviews you run in this channel !
Amazing truly ...
In my experience and opinion I think Bart Ehrman is all-rounder, he is perfect in discussions, debates & lectures.
Wow. MashAllaah the channel is growing br Paul and the most recent accomplishment of your channel Is having Bart join you!!! Allaah hummah baarik
Excellent interview, I learned quite a lot. Thanks!
Thank you professor Paul williams. and Dr bart ehrman.
Please professor Paul. Keep invite more people like dr bart and many more
I really like Dr.Ehrman, happy to see his continued collaboration with this channel. I'd love to see him revise the methods of hadith.
Revise the method of hadith? What are you on about? Muslim scholars aren’t sufficient enough?
@@Mhh90 he’s not a Muslim !
This was quite informative and useful 👍
Well done Paul.
Glad it was helpful!
What part did you find was most useful, it would. E interesting to find out.
@@BloggingTheology I'm a Christian and I also found this discussion helpful.
@@WORLDNEWREALITY The whole presentation was equally interesting covering three main topics: how the gospels depict Jesus upon him be peace, textual criticism methodology and a brief history of Christianity. They are presented in that order if you are interested.
Great conversation gentlemen. Thank you. Impressive what Bart is doing for the homeless & hungry with his blog. Interesting how he rationalises & critiques the reliability of previous Christian history, tradition & accounts etc - this contrasts with the consistency of
the Quran & Hadith chains and their classifications that at least attempts to add some certainty and nuance to historic Islamic claims. One wonders if Bart has ever read the Quran & explored the hadiths?
He's on record that he's not interested in joining Islam
I watched this 3 times learnt a lot thank you so much Paul
Glad it was helpful!
I agree, this was a thorough, but humorous and enlightening talk and I learned a more from your questioning.
Awesome conversation. Thank you brother Paul. JazakAllahu Khairan
Glad you enjoyed it
My Questions :🤔🤔🤔
Why does B.Ehrman Blamed God for man made Sufferings in his Discussion with Dr.L.Brown ?
EXACTLY..MOST PROBLEMS were caused by atheists secular govts and Christianity majority counties!! He looks less intellectual nowadays and more of an emotional teenager!
Without evil there's no importance of good... without dark we can't understand light
i think he could not follow christianity anymore after he discovered all the false hood , But he has some sort of pride that is preventing him from looking at islam ,therefore he is finding a cause to reject God altogether . He thinks hiding in this little corner , in a false comfort Zone is good enough for him.
@@truthmatter9972 exactly what I have felt .. I wonder the question he has about Christianity, have been answered in Islam … but pride is preventing him from looking
@@stadiamak692 that won’t change the reality of suffering if you believe or not believe in god .. suffering will be there, death will be there too
Best interview with Dr. Ehrman on UA-cam. Thanks!
Now this is topic of discussion we need
Half way through it and so thankful to both of you. Islam ☪️ asks believers to look into these books and seek knowledge as it was Devine revelations but got corrupted! Thank u so much for ur expert opinion on bible. One of best and simple explanation.
A very informative discussion this is the difference when academics discuss to evangelical polemics.
That is the best Bart Ehrman interview I have seen for a long time.
I used to be scared of listening to Bart Ehrman or reading his books. But after this discussion, I feel more comfortable listening to him. That does not mean I agree with everything he says, but I respect his scholarly research.
@@johnbrzykcy3076 so do you agree with forgeries? Cuz that would bother me a lot for any book
@@Ace0555 What "forgeries" are you referring to and what do you mean by the word "forgeries." If a book seemingly is fake or not historically accurate, then of course I should disregard what the book says.
@@johnbrzykcy3076 obvious forgeries that were included. Did you not watch the interview. There are obvious forgeries from unknown authors. That can’t be the word of God
@@johnbrzykcy3076 if u are a Christian then please don't be afraid to read scholarly critics of Christianity. Yes, u might be scared of losing your faith but think about this:
You have only one life and if u are scared of researching different ideas and theologies then you might die while following a wrong religion.
I am a Muslim and I try to read scholarly works of all religions. You shouldn't be hiding in a corner. Come out and explore proffesional works/readings with an open mind and In Sha Allah you will become a Muslim.
May Allah guide you.
some people complaining about the last episode. just want to share my thoughts as a regular consumer of the content from this channel.
first of all, it was a completely new idea from Paul to bring to guests of opposing views to discuss their ideas on the platform. while i think the discussion was very interesting, i would prefer less of such content on the channel on the future as imo debates have less valuable knowledge for lay people and it feels like battle of emotions and who can do better argumentation rather than we gain some knowledge.
secondly on surface the performance from dr bart was not what we are generally used to from intellectuals and academics. same maybe said for dr Brown as well. the simple reason is dr bart didn't have deep enough knowledge of basic Islamic Creed to intellectually engauge with dr Brown. also these people are academic intellectuals not trained debaters. so i would stress that unless we have a very structured debate format, these types of episodes may not necessarily be very useful of the average audience.
last but not least i think what Paul is trying to do by bringing the intellectuals of opposing ideas together is very praiseworthy. but i think the episodes of Paul having conversations with each individual separately are extremely valuable for many people especially Muslims like myself as i get to understand the perspective of other religions in a very objective way and how academics think about various aspects of Islamic Creed.
jazakAllah for the good work though. love you Paul for the sake of Allah SWT.
I agree. I'd rather see the different/opposing views in their own separate videos rather than being debated. It's much more engaging and informative when it's one-on-one with Mr Williams.
I agree, but you're also ignoring the fact that Paul brought Dr Brown and Dr Ehrman for an open dialogue and not to debate at all! For whatever reason Dr Ehrman went off script and started pressing Dr Brown on his beliefs, perhaps he had misunderstood the aim of the discourse. There's actually no reason why they cannot both share a platform again providing they both understand and agree to the aims of having free, open dialogue with the aims of increasing understanding and sharing thoughts and ideas.
@@ZedElite I agree with you. I can follow the information much better when it's "one-on-one."
Hoping to see Professor Jonathan Brown on the blogging theology soon!
Me too!
If Dr Bart Ehrman was to become Muslim, then his dawah to Christians would be amazing.
May Allah guide him.
He is already a muslim but refraining from making a declaration to expose the traditionalist Muslims. He is on to making a new renaissance in Islamic society.
@@WORLDNEWREALITY You’re funny.
In shaa'Allah.
@@WORLDNEWREALITY are you talking about Paul or Dr Ehrman?
As muslims we need to understand that Islam is the religion chosen by God to be the last guidance for the human race. God will protect it. Islam and daawa do not need people no matter how knowledgeble they seem. Knowledge without humility and mercy means nothing.
Look at how God describes al Khidr in Quran:"So they found one of Our servants, on whom We had bestowed Mercy from Ourselves and whom We had taught knowledge from Our own Presence."
Mercy before knowledge.
It is we , humans who need islam to save ourselve in this life and after death.
It's dr.Bart who needs to get the message before it's too late.
" O men! It is you, who stand in need of God, whereas He alone is self-sufficient, the One to whom all praise is due."
Apuss is going mad now that Paul and Mohammed hijab have both talked to Ehrman and Dr Peterson, 2021 is a good year for online dawah
N Jordan Peterson looks like he got touched by the quran...bad day for atheist Christians
@@kingofdetroit358 he had the real experience😄
@@nahumhabte6210 yup he teared up a little n basically asked y did it affect him even tho he don't know Arabic
@@kingofdetroit358Who did?
another great video Paul. But I would suggest Doctor Brown individually as well!
good idea!
Hey Paul... I never read any of Bart Ehrman's books because I had preconceived notions about his beliefs that scared me. But this interview made me feel less reluctant to listen to Ehrman and I have more respect for his scholarly views. As a Christian, my core beliefs have not changed. I really like when Bart said regarding the existence of an original manuscript: "that would have no bearing on the question of whether it's accurate or not." Excellent point !
I also liked Bart's honesty when he said "it's a very complicated issue."
Read the Quran and you will be clarified
@John, I have to disagree with the fact that an original manuscript would have NO bearing on the question of whether it's accurate or not.
It's a DIVINE manuscript, it absolutely has bearing. The day will come when the original Bible will be found, and I hope it's in my time when I'm alive God willing.
@@rathernot6660 Agree, he is seeing this as a history book, not a book of salvation.
@@ajzab Well... I think it depends on what we mean by "accurate." If we mean that the original manuscript not only contains the words written by the author, but those words are an accurate representation of reality, in particular the reality of God ( it's a "divine manuscript" as you said ), then of course I would accept such a manuscript as being "accurate" both historically and theologically.
I doubt we will ever find any "original" manuscripts of the New Testament because they were written on papyrus which usually decays after a few decades. Personally, I believe the New Testament manuscripts that have been discovered are accurate in the sense that the words are the "ipsissima vox" ( the concepts of what Jesus said ) although not necessarily the exact words of Jesus.
Regarding the Quran, I am learning slowly. Is the Quran "divine"? For me personally, I'm not convinced it is. I hope God guides my path because my reasoning has often been "derailed." assalam wa alaekum from Florida
@@johnbrzykcy3076 God will guide you, keep praying keep asking he will hear you call. God willing. I will pray for you too.
Great discussion. I guess I feel like there is a missing piece in the puzzle that dr. Brown didn't get the chance to complete. The missing 3rd prophet mentioned in the Bible started his journey to research Islam but then as he dug deeper it was apparent to him that this is the truth because of the miracle of the Qur'an and the ways this book is so amazing that it's impossible that it was written by a man and that this religion totally makes sense and matches our innate nature. That's what for me turns faith into knowledge, pure probability calculation. What are the chances that a random guy that couldn't read or write in a desert around year 610 could come up with a book that is so amazing in its language and content without contradictions, so different from every writing before and after and turned one very primal nation of various tribes into the biggest civilization in the history in just a few decades? It's really that saying that I read somewhere, "You can deny God but how do you deny Mohammed". Mohammed is a historical person and by most western scholars the most influential person in HUMAN history. That to me is the missing piece of the puzzle that wasn't noted in this discussion that makes Islam go from faith to knowledge and makes it so easy to accept.
one more thing to add. This kinda got dismissed or missed during the discussion but Bart mentioned that one of the unanswered questions that scientists have today is that how did something come from nothing and he believes that science will come to answer this question. I would argue that science will never be able to answer this as based on all our evidence and science today this will go against everything we know.
Another great video. The more muslims know about christianity and its origins the better, so they can preach and defend their faith more effectively. Can someone add timestamps to the video though?
@@srnp0007 OK....thank you for that insightful comment sir
@@srnp0007 you are a troll, you are just pasting negative stupid comments....
@@thefenerbahcesk4156 you trolled the troll :D
@@srnp0007 You literally subscribed to every Muslim channel dude thanks for your support 👍😁
@@thefenerbahcesk4156 I'm a Christian and I also want to know more about Christianity and it's origins. I know very little about Islam but I still try to respect Muslims.
I just read that Hindus believe in a concept called ‘ghar wapsi’ (that all people of India are ancestrally Hindu and, hence, conversion to Hinduism is one of "coming home" to their ancestral roots). We Muslims say every baby is born in fitrah, as Muslims. Do we see the difference? They see religion and worship as an ethnic thing as if there is a separate religion for each ethnicity. We Muslims say all humans are descendants of Adam, and we are all Created by One and Only God.
Hindooism is much a tribal religion than universal, period.
But where was Adam created ?
Not Hindus, but fascists Sanghis believe in ghar wapsi
Astonishingly informative discussion even for a regular Bart Ehrman follower. Paul's BT is getting better by each new guest.
ua-cam.com/video/CznzKf_Tqdw/v-deo.html
Great podcast. Bart is definitely an interesting character.
Assalamu'alalkum. My sincere wish is to listen to a debate between Dr Zakir Naik, Dr Bart Ehrman and Rabbi Tovia Singer.
Appreciate if you could arrange for this debate online. All should benefit from this discourse... Muslims, Christians and Jews
Thank you very much, sir
Bart destroyed David wood 😂😂
🤣🤣
coming soon : david debunked Bart 😂🤣
One of the truly great interviews of all that I've seen
Holy moly! It’s Bart Ehrman with our own Paul!
Fascinating conversation
Looking Forward to it
Hey Paul, for the problem of Matthew I'd refer you to a lecture done by Nehemia Gordon titled the hebrew Yeshua vs the greek Jesus. Apparently there is a translation error from hebrew or aramaic to greek and Jesus was warning his disciples not to follow the man made laws that the rabbis have created.
I hope Hatun , Asif. Bob and others from DCCI are watching this ....or may be what Bart is discussing is too heavy for them to follow through...
😂 coming soon @ZZ DCCI Team Debunk Bart 😂🤣
I loled at Asif.
May Allah swt grant them Hidayah.
This is by far Barts best interview... Wow!
That’s was useful , I can see why he have a very distorted view of GOD due to his biblical deep understanding and presentation of GOD as an angry aggressive being.
😱 How did I missed to like this video the last two times I watched it!!? Shame on me 😭Had to watch this again after Dr. Ehrman posted it his in his blog 😁
Watched the whole video...important stuff
Great discussion. Thanks.
Glad to see Dr. Ehrman speaking within his expertise.
Alhamdul-lah in Islam we have the chain of narrations both for the Qur'an and the hadith.
Especially for the hadiths, which the scholars classified them in sahih, Hasan, daif, maudu.
So Muslims who want to learn would know the forgeries from the truth in their religious scriptures.
So many sahih hadiths contradict our holy book quran, so I guess their classifications of authentic or unauthentic are absolutely garbage
@@kokos4947 example?
@@srnp0007 because he was the messenger of Allah, never lied before or after prophecy, was known in Makkah as Al Ameen the trustworthy, that's why his enemies from the pagans never called him a liar, called him a poet, a soothsayer, not a liar.
If you study the science of hadith you would see that Muslim took great care of their traditions.
@@srnp0007
Because there are dozen of hadiths narrating the same thing from different people.
The logical question would also arise as to why people would die for their invented stories, which is largely what happened.
@@europg81 Why dont you do your own own homework? Start searching ‘sahih hadiths that contradict the quran’ and you will find hundreds.
Because you askes for one, here you go: Quran says the knowledge of the Hour and the Unseen is ONLY with Allah. Yet there are hundreds of hadith of the last prophet predicting and prophecising the day of judgment/ future
Thanks a lot br Paul. Just wish you invite Dr abdulhakiim quick to discuss these holidays & there pagan origins, Halloween, Christmas, Easter, valentine.
Great suggestion!
Awesome podcast again 😁
Dr. Ehrman and the late Bishop Shelby Spong are my favorite biblical historians.
Say (O Muhammad SAW): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allah, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allah. Then, if they turn away, say: "Bear witness that we are Muslims."
Quran 3:64
Thank you Dr Ehrman
U are the real paul😂❤
My humble request to brother Paul please facilitate a discussion including Rabbi Tovia Singer and Bart Ehrman.
Mashallah that was very good hope you invite Jordan Peterson one day In shah Allah
Thank you Paul. Thank you doctor Erhman.
Assalamu alaikum my dearest brother in Islam I'm requesting if you could kindly do audio quran with your awesome voice which Almighty Allah has blessed you with masha Allah
Wa alaykumu s-salam
In lost Christianities bart mentioned that we don't have anything from Jewish Christianity (Ebionites and Nazarenes ) if we got from them the situation will be totally different Christianity
I wanted to have a bilateral meeting with the presence of personalities such as: Ustaadh Muhammad Tim Humble ,Nicholas Pelletier, Yusuf Estes,، Samuel Sharcher, Sheikh Bilal Philips ، Khalid Green ، Sheikh Shamsi ، Sheikh Mufti Menk ، Sheikh Othman bin Al-Farouq.
Paul your videos are unmatched I am genuinely thankful for your insightful content Alhamdulillah. May Allah(SWT) bless you with a long life full of health and reward you for all the quality knowledge you share. You should drop a reading list I have gotten a few books that you recommend on my list but there is so many. Do you have a "top 10" that you would recommend on biblical scholarship and early Christian theology ?
Salam Paul. Dr Ehrman has never read Quran, maybe you can try motivating to read Oxford Quran translation by Prof. Haleem.
A nice summary of the growth of Christianity in the early years. And it can be interesting to discuss the origins of the gospels. But the gospels contain various teachings from Jesus. Jesus referred to these teachings as the "Bread of Life" as they contain messages that feed our souls.
One can argue over the phraseology of them, but in the end, we do have various teachings from Jesus, that one either takes to heart, or not. Getting people to take them to heart is the hard part. Talking about how they got here is the easy part.
Can't wait. Having said that, Prof Ehrman has been disingenuous in various talks with Muslims imo....for instance he says things like Qur'anic preservation is not an evidence of divinity, yet he has said about the bible 'if God sent revelation, why didn't he preserve it'?
he is right, just because something is preserved, doesn't mean its divine, but if something is divine, it must be preserved
@@The_Angry_BeEconomist He doesn’t agree with the second statement though.
He says that the statement: “if something is divine, it must be preserved” is just people trying to impose their own standards onto God.
@@IbnMurrah I don't see whats controversial about that statement. The reason most muslims give for not accepting the modern day torah is because its not preserved.
@@The_Angry_BeEconomist
Agreed - that's why he should simply have acknowledged that fact when it was presented to him by Muhammad Hijab, instead ehrman says just because Qur'an is preserved doesn't point to a divine nature , even using a phonebook example to make his point!
Glad you clarified.
@@IbnMurrah
Exactly, that what I don't like ....he's been disingenuous. One has to wonder why??
Paul Williams know what he talking about, and well read that's why it's so interesting interview. Thank you
Not him again,,after his teenage emotional rant with Dr.Brown his credibility has hit rock bottom.
Sorry, are you ok?
@@monachusexcogitatoris3848 couldn't be better!
@@kaz007 Really? You seemed to have an emotional reaction against Bart Ehrman. Your comment have hit rock bottom and lost all credibility.
@@monachusexcogitatoris3848 obviously english aint your first language!!
@@kaz007 You’re obviously pointing out english is not my first language.
Re Paul's Q at 12:30, on the historical evidence substantiating divinity of Jesus (ie whether HE said it or not), is there extra-scriptural historical source material that substantiates this (contemporary historical accounts, etc)?
Wow I’m so surprised how many contradictions in Christianity. So many ideas don’t make sense and even their scholars can’t understand so many things in it. Thank God for sending prophet Mouhamed PBAH as last prophet to clarify everything and about all the prophets before him. May God guide us to Islam religion and keep us following it until we pass away.
@@srnp0007 whats up with you dude, why you keep making contradictory sarcastic posts, may things are not clarified to you .. maybe you haven't read it and maybe you are just a troll
But my problem is I don't see the "last prophet" as clarifying everything. I admit I'm still learning about Islam. I personally believe that Jesus' love for mankind makes a lot of sense. Only God can guide us to truth. He understands our hearts and our reasoning.
@@srnp0007 Okay... I respect how you feel although we differ in our views. Peace
@@srnp0007 you are a troll ! I have read your responses you do ad hominem and straw an attacks ..
@Paul, if I may suggest a piece I would be interested in a discussion...
In what ways do the stories of Jesus, written largely after the destruction of Israel by Roman legions, create an identity for Jewish presence now dispersed and roundly entered into a gentile society as slaves or refugees?
I could understand a displaced people telling anyone who would listen things like Pontious Pilate crucified their messiah because they thought he was the unappointed King of the Jews, adding narratives appealing to the poor, etc.
I can't help but feeling there is no temple now, there is no country, there is barely a religion left, but this story might bring forth a new Israel, a new world and a new place of power for those utterly without.
لااله الاالله محمد رسول الله
Apart from the er.emm.eh eh hmm.er. but.but.but emm er's. Really informative & enjoyable conversation between 2 people with a real understanding of the topic discussed leaving us with many Q's answered & with explanations throughout for their individual stance. Many thanks for the upload, learning can never be underestimated
Mashallah blessings
Salaam paul thank you for a very educational interesting interview both muslims & Christians should learn from each other when engaged with others in discussions we could explained in more humane ways instead of ignorance!
It's funny how more people don't find it mighty suspicious that the god/religion their parents happened to teach them, as their parent's parents did etc just happens to be the right one, and also how people rarely have a better reason for believing in whatever religion other than their parents taught it to them. Born in India, you're a Hindu, born in Afghanistan, you're a Muslim, North America, you're a Christian... Nobody ever seems to think about that.
Tell that to paul, hamza darren, jordan, yusef estes and many other converts from athiest and christian backgrounds.
Many do. I don't follow what my parents followed.
*No one thinks about it because the place you’re born in does not determine your religion.*
P.S. many of the sahaba (may Allah be pleased with them) didn't follow what their parents followed. Actually the Quran address this issue well. You should read it .
Quran 5:104
When it is said to them, “Come to Allah’s revelations and to the Messenger,” they reply, “What we found our forefathers practicing is good enough for us.” ˹Would they still do so,˺ even if their forefathers had absolutely no knowledge or guidance?
Much obliged.
Fitnah can also means kufr (disbelief) , shirk (idolatry)
Al-Anfal 8:39
وَقَٰتِلُوهُمْ حَتَّىٰ لَا تَكُونَ *فِتْنَةٌ* وَيَكُونَ ٱلدِّينُ كُلُّهُۥ لِلَّهِۚ فَإِنِ ٱنتَهَوْا۟ فَإِنَّ ٱللَّهَ بِمَا يَعْمَلُونَ بَصِيرٌ
And fight them until there is no more *Fitnah* (disbelief and polytheism: i.e. worshipping others besides Allah) and the religion (worship) will all be for Allah Alone [in the whole of the world]. But if they cease (worshipping others besides Allah), then certainly, Allah is All-Seer of what they do.
Fitnat or fitna فِتْنَةٌ (not fitnah) in this aayat means ضَلَالٌ / إِضْلَالٌ errant situation that misleads, misguides, deceives, deludes!
@@علي-ش7ث8ب
Firstly, as Arabic spelling is concerned the end is Taa' marbuuta (-ta, this t is t with a dot underneath for the letter ط مَرْبُوطَةٌ) which represents the singular feminine word and its plural is "-aat". Arabic in its original you write it down as you pronounce it, -at would've been pronounced just that, but since it became normal not pronounce syntactic ends then people pronounce it as -a without the T, but I think its wrong to replace the T with H, H doesn't represent femininity, in the Afroasiatic languages the T is what represents the feminine! It's all distortion!
@@علي-ش7ث8ب
Noun cases are:
Fitnatun فِتْنَةٌ
Fitnatan فِتْنَةً
Fitnatin فِتْنَةٍ
Dual:
Fitnataani فِتْنَتَانِ
Fitnatayni فِتْنَتَيْنِ
When the word on its own is either Fitnatun or Fitna without pronouncing the t, but Fitna or Fitná but there's no need to stretch the sound to -ah only -á otherwise you're making -ah part and parcel of the word structure distorting the feminine -t into fantasy and delusion instead as if -h were the natural sound and physical structure of the word!
When the word is part of إِضَافَةٌ or construct state noun + noun in a genitive relationship then you pronounce -t, Fitnatu-Ssadri (s with a dot underneath = letter ص) or Fitnat-Ssadr فِتْنَةُ الصَّدْرِ = trial / distress of the heart /soul, in other words Fitna describes situation you find that tries you into (in this particular phrase) uneasiness, anxiety, concern, worry, affliction; but in another phrase opposite.
Fitna is about trials in life positives or negatives; so, Fitna in these Aayaat, each has its speech context meaning.
5:41 Fitna = trial (self-delusion)
6:23 Fitna = yearning (what their hearts were yearning for no longer is there)
7:155 Fitna = trial (guide/misguide)
8:39 Fitna = errant situation (8:36-37)
@@علي-ش7ث8ب
I've corrected my mistakes, now it should answer your question!
@@علي-ش7ث8ب
Whether it's Unfortunate or fortunate, in this lower life humanity always without exception is in Fitnat, in fact it's our identity! If Allaah makes anyone see the Fitnat he / she is in, then that person can navigate himself / herself to Allaah and that is fortunate, if not unfortunate, and certainly whether anyone finds whether he / she is fortunate or unfortunate is in the judgement day!
In this wonderful conversation between Paul Williams and Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman, I noted, I think, some important points;
[13:50/1:29:33] "Jesus never called himself God in Matthew, Mark, and Luke."(Prof.Dr. Bart Ehrman)
[14:17/1:29:33] "He[Jesus] describes himself as a Divine being only in Gospel John, the last Gospel...If it is true that Jesus is going around saying that he was God..., if that were the case, how is it that three of the Gospels don't mention it?...that is why most critical scholars suspect that it was developed later..."(Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman)
[19:46/1:29:33] " I don't think any early Christians [calling?] that Jesus is Yahweh."(Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman)
[1:10:21/1:29:33] "we have the idea that lying is always wrong...there are some Christians who are lying sometimes."
(Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman)
[1:10:35/1:29:33] "you can't lie under any circumstances, you can't lie!" (Paul Williams)
[1:11:40/1:29:33]"The end justifies the mean!" (Prof.Dr.Bart Ehrman)
[1:17:02/1:29:33] most probably Prof.Dr. Bart Ehrman is quoted as saying, "If you're going to do history, there is no objective method...you shouldn't take this as subjective, as there is some sort of alternative...there is no alternative because history is subjective, all of the humanities are subjective compassion...My view of these criteria is.., these criteria are how everybody figures out what happens in the past...I think doing history involved a probability judgment. Always involved in the probability judgment... You can't prove it because history is not like chemistry. In chemistry, you can repeat the same experiment over and over again and you'll get the same result of a variable [you control of a variable?]. You get the same result! What happens in chemistry, it allows you then to predict what will happen next. In history, we are not predicting what is going to happen next, we are trying to figure out what happened before, you can't repeat this experiment...so, we have other kinds of the evaluation... you can't do it statistically, but probability[probability judgment?]."
Note: sorry if I noted some points wrongly[or I missed out on some points]. Please refer to the full conversation between the two gentlemen!