Richard Hartley was a Kiwi. He would be well pleased to hear that you called it an Australian boat. I still have a set of plans for an H16 and enjoyed those I owned and raced. You need to keep them indoors in NZ, otherwise the ply rots.
you have to be careful about over-sheeting, including jibs. If you make a sail too flat it will start to lose its airfoil shape and stall. Instead of accelerating the air over the leeward edge, a quasi dead zone of turbulence will form and you lose quite a bit of speed.
eh, yes, but it's bit of a simplification/generalization. I saw some clips where the TS16 looked underpowered and also a lot where it looked overpowered, so pointing out a few places where you feel the jib was "oversheeted" is kinda easy. Meaning in one design classes, you sometimes end up with a compromise in trim due to strict rules or an emphasis on keeping the boat simpler. I don't know the class rules of this boat or how easy it is to get to the halyard and what the purchase is on it. But maybe you end up flattening the bottom of the jib more than looks ideal as a way of trying to depower it a bit higher up. As for stalling, that really depends on AoA and wind speed. You can trim your job extremely flat and not stall it. It just wont have much power. Often, powering up the jib and flattening the main is faster but I am not gonna armchair trim a class of boat I have never seen in real life and which has raced for 50-60 years;)
for someone who does not know how to sail, you are have very strong opinions about sail trim. If you make a genoa flat as a board, and/or horse it too far inboard, it does not function properly as an airfoil - not on its forward edge nor in the slot between the genoa and the main. In other words, it stalls. The boat will slow down and make excessive leeway. Resolving that has nothing to do with the jib halyard, not sure where you got that. There may be people reading these columns to try to learn to sail better, so if you're some kind of troll, find a greener pasture.
@@mattlechner8442either there’s a typo I can’t find or you misread something… I don’t blabber on about stuff I don’t know. So, yes, I know how to sail. What I said is one class designs sometimes for better or worse can’t be trimmed “ideally”. Well, ideally to the class but not to perfection as a whole. So, unless there’s a typo it seems to me you got offended that I, personally, won’t really pass judgment on a class of boat I haven’t sailed. T
@@mattlechner8442 this is a jib. Not a Genoa but you aren’t wrong on the basics. What I said that you didn’t catch is that the bottom of the jib looks too flat which is a way of depowering a sail. It doesn’t have much effect in the higher up panels which are flattened by the halyard. That’s the type of stuff racing teaches you. But whether you can depower that jib on that particular boat in more ideal ways I don’t know as I don’t know what’s allowed and where you can move your control to. Also, you can close the slot without flattening the jib but since you used oversheeting and flat more or less interchangeably I got thrown off a bit. Anyways, I guess you’re more offended now. Merry Xmas.
@@mattlechner8442 back to basics. This started cuz you talk about over flattening a sail. Your points are basically not wrong. But there are a lot more points to consider. Stalling and closing the slot is correctly risks, too. But you can flatten a jib without doing that and it’s common to do. Maybe you saw them stalling the jib in the videos? I didn’t. I saw it depowered. But it’s very hard to tell without sitting in the boat looking at telltales. And everything is a compromise. Sometimes you have to live with the main being backwinded a bit so you have more sailarea downwind on a racing course. Also, reefing isn’t a choice on many one design classes. Again leading to less than perfect setups - but they may still be the fastest in that class.
Nice to watch the Hartley tearing along. Thanks
Another great Aussie boat i never knew existed.
Richard Hartley was a Kiwi. He would be well pleased to hear that you called it an Australian boat. I still have a set of plans for an H16 and enjoyed those I owned and raced. You need to keep them indoors in NZ, otherwise the ply rots.
Nice video and well sailed, no comments
Graet little boats
Supergroovy
Want one
you have to be careful about over-sheeting, including jibs. If you make a sail too flat it will start to lose its airfoil shape and stall. Instead of accelerating the air over the leeward edge, a quasi dead zone of turbulence will form and you lose quite a bit of speed.
eh, yes, but it's bit of a simplification/generalization. I saw some clips where the TS16 looked underpowered and also a lot where it looked overpowered, so pointing out a few places where you feel the jib was "oversheeted" is kinda easy. Meaning in one design classes, you sometimes end up with a compromise in trim due to strict rules or an emphasis on keeping the boat simpler. I don't know the class rules of this boat or how easy it is to get to the halyard and what the purchase is on it. But maybe you end up flattening the bottom of the jib more than looks ideal as a way of trying to depower it a bit higher up.
As for stalling, that really depends on AoA and wind speed. You can trim your job extremely flat and not stall it. It just wont have much power. Often, powering up the jib and flattening the main is faster but I am not gonna armchair trim a class of boat I have never seen in real life and which has raced for 50-60 years;)
for someone who does not know how to sail, you are have very strong opinions about sail trim. If you make a genoa flat as a board, and/or horse it too far inboard, it does not function properly as an airfoil - not on its forward edge nor in the slot between the genoa and the main. In other words, it stalls. The boat will slow down and make excessive leeway. Resolving that has nothing to do with the jib halyard, not sure where you got that. There may be people reading these columns to try to learn to sail better, so if you're some kind of troll, find a greener pasture.
@@mattlechner8442either there’s a typo I can’t find or you misread something… I don’t blabber on about stuff I don’t know. So, yes, I know how to sail. What I said is one class designs sometimes for better or worse can’t be trimmed “ideally”. Well, ideally to the class but not to perfection as a whole. So, unless there’s a typo it seems to me you got offended that I, personally, won’t really pass judgment on a class of boat I haven’t sailed. T
@@mattlechner8442 this is a jib. Not a Genoa but you aren’t wrong on the basics. What I said that you didn’t catch is that the bottom of the jib looks too flat which is a way of depowering a sail. It doesn’t have much effect in the higher up panels which are flattened by the halyard. That’s the type of stuff racing teaches you. But whether you can depower that jib on that particular boat in more ideal ways I don’t know as I don’t know what’s allowed and where you can move your control to.
Also, you can close the slot without flattening the jib but since you used oversheeting and flat more or less interchangeably I got thrown off a bit. Anyways, I guess you’re more offended now. Merry Xmas.
@@mattlechner8442 back to basics. This started cuz you talk about over flattening a sail. Your points are basically not wrong. But there are a lot more points to consider. Stalling and closing the slot is correctly risks, too. But you can flatten a jib without doing that and it’s common to do. Maybe you saw them stalling the jib in the videos? I didn’t. I saw it depowered. But it’s very hard to tell without sitting in the boat looking at telltales. And everything is a compromise. Sometimes you have to live with the main being backwinded a bit so you have more sailarea downwind on a racing course. Also, reefing isn’t a choice on many one design classes. Again leading to less than perfect setups - but they may still be the fastest in that class.