Ok, so I am not a calibration tech or engineer and can only go by what the manufacturer of these scales provide me. They said the specific scale I received is an NTEP Certified Scale. This is what that means (for those who are not familiar with scale nomenclature): NTEP approved scales are generally considered those scales which are intended by the manufacturer for use in commercial weighing applications where products are sold by weight. NTEP Approved is also known as Legal for Trade or complies with Handbook 44. NTEP scales are commonly used for applications ranging from delicatessens to weigh coldcuts at the deli counter, to fruits and vegetables at the roadside farm stand, shipping centers for determining shipping cost, scrap metal recycling centers or precious metals buyers for weighing gold and silver and more. www.nist.gov/pml/weights-and-measures/publications/nist-handbooks/handbook-44-current-edition
@i70 _ I see why people would want to know how accurate it is, but 5mins of Google researching the company would provide all their certifications and specs. Read some of the comments.
@@BTBRVReviews I wasn't trying to be a dick with my comment just saying I see flaws. I work very closely with DOT and see lots of trucks placed out of service due to bad weighing practice from where they received the load. Now with regards to how well this would work I don't know as I mentioned in another comment I'm going to test it I just have to fabricate a stand for my fifth wheel pin. Now at the weight you have provided in the test according to handbook 44 table 6 there would be a acceptable range of +/- 40lbs when compared to a DOT certified scale (2 graduations- i can expand on that math more if you would like) if that setup is accurate within that range good to go but it has to be compared to certified weights applelied in the way you have. Again not saying anything is wrong here and the world would end just don't want to see someone taken out of commission after doing this and you may argue non cdl is except. Well not anymore DOT has portable weigh systems they do random checks with. Saw a poor guy get hit a few weeks ago he was obviously over loaded but no where near a state scale they still got him. Again not trying to be a dick if you want more information feel free to reach out to me. This is a good thought and has my wheels turning on a canister cell system that I have seen in aerospace to weigh aircraft that might apply here BUT I have to test the effects of the suspension sag first.
It would be interesting to see the difference in weight as you change the level of the hitch point. Showing the difference between too low, level, and too high. I see many folks running towables not level.
Hey JD: While watching this it occurred to me the for folks that are running close on tongue weight, they can lessen it by changing goose ball hitches. I use an Anderson hitch and I can adjust the height of the gooseneck ball. This of course transfers some weight rearward. So for those on the edge or over weight, there are east solutions to solve or lessen a heavy hitch.
I was really surprised at the hitch weight. I was guessing 2000 pounds. But I think the goose ball hitch that looks a bit more extended than the factory 5th wheel hitch and the lower contact point to the tow vehicle probably does mess with the hitch/axle weight ratio.
Would have been interested in if someone would have walked in the RV to change the weight as they moved forward in it and how much does it change closer to their weight to the pin
Hey JD that was definitely eye opening just goes to show that tongue weight is really important you always preach about people towing with undersized rigs it is dangerous and they should know their pin weight Thank you for the demonstration
Put your vehicle on a truck scale, then come back with your trailer ( I’m guessing it’s at a fifth wheel ) then weigh with just your truck on the scale. Subtract the first weight from the second.
Real life comment I don’t have the room for a large scale, but a 2x2 or 3x3 that I could put a larger cover on would be perfect. This way I can measure compact and spread out weight. Love the good work you’re doing.
I think the point is obvious...this would be very helpful to RVers so they are COLLABORATING...working together for an RV friendly product! Many upgrades to RVs, i think are because or this Channel and the collaboration he encourages. My hat is off 👏
I was off by 16#'s. As I was explaining to a rookie RV-r (i've been add it about 45+ yrs) ; its not the towing capacity that you have to watch as carefully as the load capacity. In 90+ percent of the time with RV's you'll over load the truck before you come that close to the tow cap. Speaking for me; I don't like to exceed 80% of the load or tow capacity. I'd estimate that close to 25-35% of the people towing tt are overloaded...
How about the car scales used to balance out a race car? That gets you 4 loadcells suitable to put each wheel of a car on. Not sure what those are rated to but, something else to consider
I’ve been harvesting pecans for years and the company we sell to have a scale much like this one but is accurate to 1 lb and has a 4x4 ft base for shipping bags And I was off on what your trailer tongue weight was by about 400 lbs
I looked at getting a scale until I saw the price lol. I'm always trying to weigh my bigtex trailer since I have varying loads. More of a curiosity than anything. Thanks JD!
That was interesting. And you could do another video (or 2) with weighing various RVs down at Ron Hoover. But question... do you have plans for accomplishing the same for bumper-pulls?
Nice to see the actual weights. My Megacab dually only has a 2600lb payload. No where enough for a big 5th wheel. Axle, springs, and tires are rate for much more but the truck isn't. I normally need space and not weight capability so I converted over to SRW anyways.
You bring up a good point. I believe when DOT weighs you they only go by axle weight. You may pass that but could still be over payload, which DOT can't measure unless they make you unhook.
That is a really cool product. Looking forward to seeing what’s coming next. Now I am curious how the big version for putting trailers on compares to the CAT scales. As well as looking at the actual weight of vehicles and trailers.
HeyJD, I wonder what your dump trailer weighs when you have it loaded with sand and then weigh it again as if you had left it loaded overnight and you had a good rain shower come through
Also you need to acclimate the scale to the temperature prior to using it will give an inaccurate reading also depress the rate button to zero out the display prior to placing weight on the scale.
I’ve been wondering… why don’t RV manufacturers move the generator space and other heavy components back over the trailer axels or towards the rear to help alleviate some of the pin weight? Wouldn’t that make it easier for the trucks and open up more SRW trucks to pull their campers?
Thanks for sharing the info. I think all RV dealers should have this scale on hand. This way the can show the buyer what pin weight they are at. Seems the sticker on the rig from the manufacture has a lot of variables. Kind of fudged numbers on the manufactures part.
Great video, the product is really cool. I do have an unrelated question though. The pad you have for the RV how wide is it and what material do you use. I thought about putting mine on a concrete pad, but concrete is not cheap in 2022. Thank you in advance.
FYI that scales accuracy is compared to what? I work in the calibration field and we calibrate these types of scales most scales are generally 1-3% of full scale value IAW a NIST calibration. Second thing is why place the scale in the back of the truck in stead of on the firm ground or concrete slap I doubt the scale is designed to be as accurate in the back of your truck vs on a solid slab of concrete? What’s you idea on this?
I work in calibrations as well. I might test this with 4x4 floor scale on the back of my truck and on solid earth by fabricating a mount for my Anderson hitch. Should be interesting results.
Ok, so I am not a calibration tech or engineer and can only go by what the manufacturer of these scales provide me. They said the specific scale I received is an NTEP Certified Scale. This is what that means (for those who are not familiar with scale nomenclature): NTEP approved scales are generally considered those scales which are intended by the manufacturer for use in commercial weighing applications where products are sold by weight. NTEP Approved is also known as Legal for Trade or complies with Handbook 44. NTEP scales are commonly used for applications ranging from delicatessens to weigh coldcuts at the deli counter, to fruits and vegetables at the roadside farm stand, shipping centers for determining shipping cost, scrap metal recycling centers or precious metals buyers for weighing gold and silver and more.
As a calibration tech, what is the error of putting the scale on a vertically movable surface? The downward force applied from the pin is not shared with the truck’s leaf springs, is it not?
I was thinking this scale was gonna be a lot more expensive, $1,000 isn't terrible I suppose. I mean, that dumb lock box on the trailer is like $300 alone and it's half useless. I guess it might be fun to have for a little bit and then sell it once I was bored lol. I mean, how many times is a normal person gonna weigh something that heavy? Maybe if you were wanting to weigh a hay bail or something in the bed of your truck to know how much to feed your horses or cattle or whatever, or maybe if you had a big water tank in your truck bed you use to get water to an off grid area if you're living in your fifth wheel or a cabin or something that might be helpful to know how much weight you're adding with water to know when to stop. I suppose if you have the money to waste it might be fun to just weigh random stuff. As someone who enjoys doing wood working and building stuff like tables or bed frames or a china hutch or something having a fairly large scale in a shop might be cool so you can tell a customer hey it weighs X amount just as general information. But it wouldn't need to be very high in capability, but a large footprint would be more useful, then again it'd be more wasted space. I have a feeling there's a reason these are 99.9% commercially used, because the average person has no use for one to justify the cost lol. Now, if a dealership of campers bought one to help educate their customers like you're trying to do on videos, that would be priceless. They could weigh a potential camper right there on a customers truck and say hey this is what it weighs facts are facts your truck is either too small or just right or you can go even bigger on a camper if you wanted. But again, that's commercial use.
DOT used to use portable scales that you would drive up on with one axle at a time, one on each side of the truck or trailer etc, it's alot like you have there but split in 2 with a ramp on both sides so you can drive on and off it, I know this because in California I was order to go on one at a rest area 😉
@@BTBRVReviews cool, I think their awesome unless you're truck is over weight that will get a big ticket and parked until adjusting is done, of course I'm taking about a big truck 🚚
It makes me wonder why RV dealers aren't offering or using something like this when serving or selling RV's? I know dealers only want to sell RV's, but they should also care enough about the safety of their customers to at least offer weight measuring and tow vehicle compatibility assessments as a service offering. Dealers could provide the information and if the customer ignores it, they will have it documented and use it for CYA. I really like the idea of a smaller footprint unit that is also affordable for the average RV owner.
There is already a posted sticker that gives you the trailer weight and hitch weight. A good sales person will advise of the tow vehicle needs, although everyone has a subjective opinion mixed in with the OEM stated specs.
@@boson285 I agree, but most owners don' t have clue how much weight they're adding in cargo. As you take your RV/ trailer in for service, it would ideal to have a actual loaded pin weight / axle weight and ratio's. I always wonder what my actual loaded pin weight is, but don't have a scale. RV dealerships (not just truck stops) should ideally offer this service. .
Good point.. the main issues of hitch scales are that they use hydraulic fluid in the scale vs a load sensor. Load sensors are far more precise and last longer.
Robert first of all you need either your gooseneck or your fifth wheel in there because you’ve tipped your fifth wheel itself down farther so more weight is actually going onto the bed than actually would be carried in other words the trailer isn’t level
Since the RV was maybe 2" lower vs being hitched (well within the normal connection margin) it's unlikely the weight would have decreased by much. Mainly because the majority of the weight is over and forward of the axles and not behind them on the RV. Also, who is Robert?
The numbers the manufacturer claim are almost always based on dry weight. This number is usually around 21%. My numbers are slightly higher because of the Generator
I understand maybe you are being a little dramatic to get the point across, which is important but I don’t really think you are surprised. You have always said pin weight is 20% to 25% of the 5th wheel’s GVWR. And this just proves it. This is why we are moving up to a DRW. Thank you.
No. The weight on the scale is static. Compression below the scale doesn't impact the weight being applied to it. It's kind of like asking if your truck have suspension impacts the weight of whatever is pushing down on it.
@@BTBRVReviews I was going to ask the same thing. I think it's slightly more nuanced than that, though I'm no physicist. If you stand on a scale in an elevator, your weight will decrease as the elevator accelerates downwards. But once the speed becomes constant your weight levels out. The same would be true for your truck. Probably not so obvious in your F-450, but may be noticeable in a small truck that squats a lot. The scale will be inaccurate only for the second or two that the suspension of the truck is "accelerating downwards", or starting to squat. However you are correct - once the suspension settles and is no longer moving at all, the scale will be completely accurate. This is because scales measure weight, or the force of gravity, and not mass. Thanks for letting me think this one out loud lol
1st if you want a true calibrated weight you should have weighed the truck all four corners all loaded up tool box tools fuel and people and anything else that would be the true gross weight of the truck then get axle weights front and rear then hook rv trailer or whatever your hooking to then get a true gross combination weight then all the axle weights that is front axle rear axle of truck and the axle weights of trailer be it a single axle duel axle or triple axle as long as you are not over front axle gross weight rating rear axle gross weight rating and trailer axle or axles gross weight rating or over gross combination weight rating you are good to go legally (notice I didn't say anything about gross vehicle weight rating that's because as far as the law is concerned when you hook up to that trailer you are considered a combination vehicle) that's when gcvwr comes into effect that is the commercial law on legal weights plus it is a federal law not city county or state but federal. Almost forgot you need to make sure your tires are weight rated to the weight you are putting on that axle on the sidewall of tire it will tell you the weight rating in single tire or run as duels and at what psi you need to be for that weight rating. No where does the law speaking commercial say anything about cargo or payload capacity so if it's not enforced in the commercial world are you really going to argue about personal use? By the way you said your 5th wheel weighed in the neighborhood of 16000lb your truck I'm guessing weighes in the neighborhood of 8500 to 9000lbs so when hooked up to your truck your probably weighing in the neighborhood of 24000 to 26000lbs total gross weight what weight is your truck tagged and registered for does your license plate and registration have enough weight capacity to cover your total gross weight? If it does congratulation but in most states that extra weight capacity license plate and registration can cost the owner several hundreds of dollars more per year its all according to the state that's why most 3/4 ton trucks are capped at 9000 to 10000lb and 1 ton dually is at 14000lbs and I'm betting that your f450 is at the same 14000lbs why is that I'll tell you why to stay in the weight classification that the federal DOT classes trucks so the manufacturers cheat somewhat on the weights to save people in certain states on registration fees some states over 10000lb gvwr is automatically a commercial vehicle period. I see rvers all the time running regular license plates which is only good to 8500lbs gross weight on 3/4 ton and 1 ton dually pulling I know for a fact empty weight of 15000 to 16000lb rvs because I've or one of my 3/4 ton trucks has transported the same exact rv never ever seen them pulled over or checked at a weigh station so you expect me to believe that these people really care about or even understand weights and what their truck can legally do or tow. Like I said I understand why you are so conservative on your numbers because some people just don't understand but at your pin weight which I don't believe is a true accurate weight because of the suspension on the truck but besides that if it is correct at basically 3500lbs I can legally haul that trailer with anyone of my 3/4 ton transport trucks and not be over on any of my axles or my gross combination weight and cross the weigh stations legally and safely that would basically put me around 6000lbs on rear axle that's rated to 6900lbs roughly transfers 500lbs to front axle making it around 4750lbs with a rating of 6000lbs with a gross combination weight of roughly 24500 to 25000lbs with a rating of 27500lbs gross combination rating so I'm under on all and legal on all no legal binding on payload or cargo
Brother, honestly I combed through your post but didn't read it carefully. That said, I have a video that went viral talking about weight and registration and licensing requirements. I'm legal with a Class A license. Also, the pin weight is accurate base on how I took the measurement. As far as total truck weight, well according to the CAT scale my truck is a 10,380lbs loaded with my family and supplies. The fifth wheel is 3480lbs. The reality of an F450 pickup is that it's significantly derated due to Ford's demand to keep it a class 3 truck (14k GVWR and below). The payload capacity is actually higher than a similarly equipped F350 dually since all the components that make it an F450 technically increase it's ability to handle weight and tow more (large axle half shafts, commercial wheels/tires, larger brakes, larger differential, larger front frame section.) The components that add to the curb weight are largely unsprung components. Many of them are used on the chassis cab F450 with a 16k GCWR.
Don't know Ford trucks that well was just taking a guess at the weight glad to hear that you have a class a cdl I've had my class a cdl when got grandfathered in from special chauffeur license but any I own and operate 5 3/4 ton trucks that are running rv transport leased to a company then I own and operate 9 class 8 tractor trailers running on dedicated lanes under my operating authority so I do believe I have enough experience with legal weights that when I say you and others are so worried about cargo capacity or payload that you are misinformed there are no legal binding or mention of cargo or payload capacity and when you hook up to a trailer that in legal commercial use the gvw of the truck is superseded by gcw. For example a class 8 truck has gvwr of 38000lbs but hook to a trailer that becomes a combination with a gvwr of 80000lbs now most newer 3/4 ton trucks have somewhere in the neighborhood of 6200 to 7000lbs rgawr so anybody should be able to do math if rear axle on truck load but without trailer has 3000lbs and its rated at 7000lbs then legally you c a n put 4000lbs on th a t axle and be legal that's all I'm trying to explain that I understand why you are conservative on your numbers but legally you can tow a good sized 5th wheel rv with a 3/4 ton truck and be legal that's where we disagree is you believe in cargo payload capacity which has no none zip legal binding only fagw ragw gvw or gcvw when hooked to a trailer the gvwr of truck goes out the door because it's considered a combination vehicle when hooked to trailer fagw ragw tagw (trailer axle gross weight) and the gross weight of the entire rig truck and trailer now that is how the federal DOT and the fmcsa(federal motor carrier safety administration) looks at it so if a 3/4 ton truck that is not over on fagw ragw tagw and gross weight of entire rig or the tire weight rating is legal and safe in their eyes but you and several others will say that truck is overloaded because it probably is over compared to the yellow and white sticker that has no legal binding whatsoever plus the gvw of the truck which has no legal binding because the truck is hooked to a trailer now which makes it a combination vehicle now so now you go by the gvw of entire rig. Now that was the way it was explained to me by the federal DOT and fmcsa when you get operating authority you go through a 90 day audit everybody has to and that is the way it was explained to me during that audit so if that works for commercial to figure out the weights then it should be alright to be used for personal rving. Don't you think so?
I work in metrology there are much better scales and indicators out there. Also scale needs to be mounted solid to get a accurate reading. I am familiar with this brand and I would say they are far from industrial just real world facts. For a base contact Rice Lake they will make you a rough deck in any size you want by far the best built I have worked with. Mettler Toledo would be another good brand. If someone wants to weigh fifth wheel pin weights I recommend place the scale on solid earth, concrete, ext. And mounting a solid mount on the scale even then everything needs to be on the same flat level plane as the trailer. Look at a truck scale the next time you are by one they are 3 scales all level and on the same plane. Trying this on a incline or decline will change readings. I get this isn't meant to be super accurate but just giving advice to get the best reading.
Why do you believe it needs to be mounted on a different surface? The truck was not running and the RV had settled, so the weight is static. The reading would be completely accurate. Also, SellEton scales have MUCH better reviews than both brands you mentioned. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just pointing out information after doing the research you mentioned.
The goal would be a much smaller and highly portable unit that weighs significantly less. Probably a max capacity closer to 5k, since very very few RVs would exceed that in terms of pin weight or hitch weight. It would also give you enough capacity to weight corners individually on most large RVs.
Ok, so I am not a calibration tech or engineer and can only go by what the manufacturer of these scales provide me. They said the specific scale I received is an NTEP Certified Scale. This is what that means (for those who are not familiar with scale nomenclature): NTEP approved scales are generally considered those scales which are intended by the manufacturer for use in commercial weighing applications where products are sold by weight. NTEP Approved is also known as Legal for Trade or complies with Handbook 44. NTEP scales are commonly used for applications ranging from delicatessens to weigh coldcuts at the deli counter, to fruits and vegetables at the roadside farm stand, shipping centers for determining shipping cost, scrap metal recycling centers or precious metals buyers for weighing gold and silver and more. www.nist.gov/pml/weights-and-measures/publications/nist-handbooks/handbook-44-current-edition
Who would care that much ? Dang internet surfers ! lol
@i70 _ I see why people would want to know how accurate it is, but 5mins of Google researching the company would provide all their certifications and specs. Read some of the comments.
@@BTBRVReviews I wasn't trying to be a dick with my comment just saying I see flaws. I work very closely with DOT and see lots of trucks placed out of service due to bad weighing practice from where they received the load. Now with regards to how well this would work I don't know as I mentioned in another comment I'm going to test it I just have to fabricate a stand for my fifth wheel pin. Now at the weight you have provided in the test according to handbook 44 table 6 there would be a acceptable range of +/- 40lbs when compared to a DOT certified scale (2 graduations- i can expand on that math more if you would like) if that setup is accurate within that range good to go but it has to be compared to certified weights applelied in the way you have. Again not saying anything is wrong here and the world would end just don't want to see someone taken out of commission after doing this and you may argue non cdl is except. Well not anymore DOT has portable weigh systems they do random checks with. Saw a poor guy get hit a few weeks ago he was obviously over loaded but no where near a state scale they still got him. Again not trying to be a dick if you want more information feel free to reach out to me. This is a good thought and has my wheels turning on a canister cell system that I have seen in aerospace to weigh aircraft that might apply here BUT I have to test the effects of the suspension sag first.
It would be interesting to see the difference in weight as you change the level of the hitch point. Showing the difference between too low, level, and too high. I see many folks running towables not level.
Wow! Never expected that hitch weight. Thank you Selleton Scales for this collaboration and the great info that will come from JD!
Hey JD: While watching this it occurred to me the for folks that are running close on tongue weight, they can lessen it by changing goose ball hitches. I use an Anderson hitch and I can adjust the height of the gooseneck ball. This of course transfers some weight rearward. So for those on the edge or over weight, there are east solutions to solve or lessen a heavy hitch.
I was really surprised at the hitch weight. I was guessing 2000 pounds. But I think the goose ball hitch that looks a bit more extended than the factory 5th wheel hitch and the lower contact point to the tow vehicle probably does mess with the hitch/axle weight ratio.
Would have been interested in if someone would have walked in the RV to change the weight as they moved forward in it and how much does it change closer to their weight to the pin
Always enjoy watching your videos on trailer weights - thanks for charing JD.
Access to the feet from the top is probably to level the scale.
What an awesome tool! So many things you can weigh with this. The quality looks amazing.
Thanks! It's so cool for a nerd like me
Hey JD that was definitely eye opening just goes to show that tongue weight is really important you always preach about people towing with undersized rigs it is dangerous and they should know their pin weight Thank you for the demonstration
I wish I could rent one of those just to see the actual pin weight on my trailer. Pretty cool product thank you for sharing.
Put your vehicle on a truck scale, then come back with your trailer ( I’m guessing it’s at a fifth wheel ) then weigh with just your truck on the scale. Subtract the first weight from the second.
Could also call a local scale company. We rent them at ours.
Real life comment I don’t have the room for a large scale, but a 2x2 or 3x3 that I could put a larger cover on would be perfect. This way I can measure compact and spread out weight. Love the good work you’re doing.
Wow someone just became chief commissioner of the weight police! Ha ha.
I think the point is obvious...this would be very helpful to RVers so they are COLLABORATING...working together for an RV friendly product! Many upgrades to RVs, i think are because or this Channel and the collaboration he encourages. My hat is off 👏
very useful information regarding not over loading your tow vehicle.....
I was off by 16#'s. As I was explaining to a rookie RV-r (i've been add it about 45+ yrs) ; its not the towing capacity that you have to watch as carefully as the load capacity. In 90+ percent of the time with RV's you'll over load the truck before you come that close to the tow cap. Speaking for me; I don't like to exceed 80% of the load or tow capacity. I'd estimate that close to 25-35% of the people towing tt are overloaded...
Wow! Thats eye opening.
Wow awesome. So many models I’d like weighed now lol. Hopefully you start weighing them all
Love to see that used on some supposedly half ton towables. I'm sure you'll do that.
How about the car scales used to balance out a race car? That gets you 4 loadcells suitable to put each wheel of a car on. Not sure what those are rated to but, something else to consider
I’ve been harvesting pecans for years and the company we sell to have a scale much like this one but is accurate to 1 lb and has a 4x4 ft base for shipping bags And I was off on what your trailer tongue weight was by about 400 lbs
I looked at getting a scale until I saw the price lol. I'm always trying to weigh my bigtex trailer since I have varying loads. More of a curiosity than anything. Thanks JD!
That was interesting. And you could do another video (or 2) with weighing various RVs down at Ron Hoover. But question... do you have plans for accomplishing the same for bumper-pulls?
Nice to see the actual weights. My Megacab dually only has a 2600lb payload. No where enough for a big 5th wheel. Axle, springs, and tires are rate for much more but the truck isn't. I normally need space and not weight capability so I converted over to SRW anyways.
You bring up a good point. I believe when DOT weighs you they only go by axle weight. You may pass that but could still be over payload, which DOT can't measure unless they make you unhook.
That is a really cool product. Looking forward to seeing what’s coming next. Now I am curious how the big version for putting trailers on compares to the CAT scales. As well as looking at the actual weight of vehicles and trailers.
You were right. It's R L Carriers. That's a cross between the letters.
HeyJD, I wonder what your dump trailer weighs when you have it loaded with sand and then weigh it again as if you had left it loaded overnight and you had a good rain shower come through
Can you do a review of Bluetooth trailer tire pressure systems?
I'll do a followup in the LCI Tirelinc, which I use.
Also you need to acclimate the scale to the temperature prior to using it will give an inaccurate reading also depress the rate button to zero out the display prior to placing weight on the scale.
It acclimated for over a day. Power of editing
I’ve been wondering… why don’t RV manufacturers move the generator space and other heavy components back over the trailer axels or towards the rear to help alleviate some of the pin weight? Wouldn’t that make it easier for the trucks and open up more SRW trucks to pull their campers?
Goes by percentage for safe towing and axle positions or number of axles under the unit. Could be 15 to 25% pin weight depending on model.
Oh yea I’ll go right out and get me one ☝️
Thanks for sharing the info.
I think all RV dealers should have this scale on hand. This way the can show the buyer what pin weight they are at.
Seems the sticker on the rig from the manufacture has a lot of variables. Kind of fudged numbers on the manufactures part.
Every RV dealer should have scales on site. When are going to get a set of axle scales?
Wow!!! I was guessing around 2700-2900lbs!!!! That’s crazy!!!!
Great video, the product is really cool. I do have an unrelated question though. The pad you have for the RV how wide is it and what material do you use. I thought about putting mine on a concrete pad, but concrete is not cheap in 2022. Thank you in advance.
FYI that scales accuracy is compared to what? I work in the calibration field and we calibrate these types of scales most scales are generally 1-3% of full scale value IAW a NIST calibration. Second thing is why place the scale in the back of the truck in stead of on the firm ground or concrete slap I doubt the scale is designed to be as accurate in the back of your truck vs on a solid slab of concrete? What’s you idea on this?
I work in calibrations as well. I might test this with 4x4 floor scale on the back of my truck and on solid earth by fabricating a mount for my Anderson hitch. Should be interesting results.
Ok, so I am not a calibration tech or engineer and can only go by what the manufacturer of these scales provide me. They said the specific scale I received is an NTEP Certified Scale. This is what that means (for those who are not familiar with scale nomenclature): NTEP approved scales are generally considered those scales which are intended by the manufacturer for use in commercial weighing applications where products are sold by weight. NTEP Approved is also known as Legal for Trade or complies with Handbook 44. NTEP scales are commonly used for applications ranging from delicatessens to weigh coldcuts at the deli counter, to fruits and vegetables at the roadside farm stand, shipping centers for determining shipping cost, scrap metal recycling centers or precious metals buyers for weighing gold and silver and more.
As a calibration tech, what is the error of putting the scale on a vertically movable surface? The downward force applied from the pin is not shared with the truck’s leaf springs, is it not?
25 seconds in and I'm glad that wasn't a Swift driver when he just missed the tree🤣🤣
3/4 ton truck guys will still act like air bags will let them haul this.
As a aircraft Meck, you need a scale under each point, for my RV I would need 3 of them.
Yeah, I heard that. SellEton sells aircraft scales as well
I wonder it the increased down angle of the pin (at a lower than usual connected position) increased the load
The angle, if calculated, would be truly, a single digit percentage of the pin weight. Even if you said 9%, that would be the weight of a large man.
Not bad. Maybe they can incorporate to a hitch.
I was thinking this scale was gonna be a lot more expensive, $1,000 isn't terrible I suppose. I mean, that dumb lock box on the trailer is like $300 alone and it's half useless. I guess it might be fun to have for a little bit and then sell it once I was bored lol. I mean, how many times is a normal person gonna weigh something that heavy? Maybe if you were wanting to weigh a hay bail or something in the bed of your truck to know how much to feed your horses or cattle or whatever, or maybe if you had a big water tank in your truck bed you use to get water to an off grid area if you're living in your fifth wheel or a cabin or something that might be helpful to know how much weight you're adding with water to know when to stop. I suppose if you have the money to waste it might be fun to just weigh random stuff. As someone who enjoys doing wood working and building stuff like tables or bed frames or a china hutch or something having a fairly large scale in a shop might be cool so you can tell a customer hey it weighs X amount just as general information. But it wouldn't need to be very high in capability, but a large footprint would be more useful, then again it'd be more wasted space. I have a feeling there's a reason these are 99.9% commercially used, because the average person has no use for one to justify the cost lol. Now, if a dealership of campers bought one to help educate their customers like you're trying to do on videos, that would be priceless. They could weigh a potential camper right there on a customers truck and say hey this is what it weighs facts are facts your truck is either too small or just right or you can go even bigger on a camper if you wanted. But again, that's commercial use.
DOT used to use portable scales that you would drive up on with one axle at a time, one on each side of the truck or trailer etc, it's alot like you have there but split in 2 with a ramp on both sides so you can drive on and off it, I know this because in California I was order to go on one at a rest area 😉
I'm going to be showcasing those as well soon.
@@BTBRVReviews cool, I think their awesome unless you're truck is over weight that will get a big ticket and parked until adjusting is done, of course I'm taking about a big truck 🚚
It makes me wonder why RV dealers aren't offering or using something like this when serving or selling RV's? I know dealers only want to sell RV's, but they should also care enough about the safety of their customers to at least offer weight measuring and tow vehicle compatibility assessments as a service offering. Dealers could provide the information and if the customer ignores it, they will have it documented and use it for CYA. I really like the idea of a smaller footprint unit that is also affordable for the average RV owner.
There is already a posted sticker that gives you the trailer weight and hitch weight. A good sales person will advise of the tow vehicle needs, although everyone has a subjective opinion mixed in with the OEM stated specs.
@@boson285 I agree, but most owners don' t have clue how much weight they're adding in cargo. As you take your RV/ trailer in for service, it would ideal to have a actual loaded pin weight / axle weight and ratio's. I always wonder what my actual loaded pin weight is, but don't have a scale. RV dealerships (not just truck stops) should ideally offer this service. .
It would be nice to see a comparison to a hitch scale.
Good point.. the main issues of hitch scales are that they use hydraulic fluid in the scale vs a load sensor. Load sensors are far more precise and last longer.
Robert first of all you need either your gooseneck or your fifth wheel in there because you’ve tipped your fifth wheel itself down farther so more weight is actually going onto the bed than actually would be carried in other words the trailer isn’t level
Since the RV was maybe 2" lower vs being hitched (well within the normal connection margin) it's unlikely the weight would have decreased by much. Mainly because the majority of the weight is over and forward of the axles and not behind them on the RV. Also, who is Robert?
You're between 20 and 25% pin weight according to the math, do those numbers match up to the manufacturers numbers provided?
The numbers the manufacturer claim are almost always based on dry weight. This number is usually around 21%. My numbers are slightly higher because of the Generator
Great Vid
This serves as a bathroom scale in much of the American south
Haha
Pretty sure I’ll never have one, we had one at work for barreled products.
I understand maybe you are being a little dramatic to get the point across, which is important but I don’t really think you are surprised. You have always said pin weight is 20% to 25% of the 5th wheel’s GVWR. And this just proves it. This is why we are moving up to a DRW. Thank you.
Haha. The surprise was because the plastic disks didn't fail.
I’m guessing 2140 pin weight Wow 3482 is a lot!
Wouldn't the fact that your truck suspension flexes, wouldn't that throw off the reading?
No. The weight on the scale is static. Compression below the scale doesn't impact the weight being applied to it. It's kind of like asking if your truck have suspension impacts the weight of whatever is pushing down on it.
@@BTBRVReviews I was going to ask the same thing. I think it's slightly more nuanced than that, though I'm no physicist. If you stand on a scale in an elevator, your weight will decrease as the elevator accelerates downwards. But once the speed becomes constant your weight levels out. The same would be true for your truck. Probably not so obvious in your F-450, but may be noticeable in a small truck that squats a lot. The scale will be inaccurate only for the second or two that the suspension of the truck is "accelerating downwards", or starting to squat. However you are correct - once the suspension settles and is no longer moving at all, the scale will be completely accurate. This is because scales measure weight, or the force of gravity, and not mass.
Thanks for letting me think this one out loud lol
Red would have been nice 🤷♂️
Wow! You need a bigger truck!
Lol
1st if you want a true calibrated weight you should have weighed the truck all four corners all loaded up tool box tools fuel and people and anything else that would be the true gross weight of the truck then get axle weights front and rear then hook rv trailer or whatever your hooking to then get a true gross combination weight then all the axle weights that is front axle rear axle of truck and the axle weights of trailer be it a single axle duel axle or triple axle as long as you are not over front axle gross weight rating rear axle gross weight rating and trailer axle or axles gross weight rating or over gross combination weight rating you are good to go legally (notice I didn't say anything about gross vehicle weight rating that's because as far as the law is concerned when you hook up to that trailer you are considered a combination vehicle) that's when gcvwr comes into effect that is the commercial law on legal weights plus it is a federal law not city county or state but federal. Almost forgot you need to make sure your tires are weight rated to the weight you are putting on that axle on the sidewall of tire it will tell you the weight rating in single tire or run as duels and at what psi you need to be for that weight rating. No where does the law speaking commercial say anything about cargo or payload capacity so if it's not enforced in the commercial world are you really going to argue about personal use? By the way you said your 5th wheel weighed in the neighborhood of 16000lb your truck I'm guessing weighes in the neighborhood of 8500 to 9000lbs so when hooked up to your truck your probably weighing in the neighborhood of 24000 to 26000lbs total gross weight what weight is your truck tagged and registered for does your license plate and registration have enough weight capacity to cover your total gross weight? If it does congratulation but in most states that extra weight capacity license plate and registration can cost the owner several hundreds of dollars more per year its all according to the state that's why most 3/4 ton trucks are capped at 9000 to 10000lb and 1 ton dually is at 14000lbs and I'm betting that your f450 is at the same 14000lbs why is that I'll tell you why to stay in the weight classification that the federal DOT classes trucks so the manufacturers cheat somewhat on the weights to save people in certain states on registration fees some states over 10000lb gvwr is automatically a commercial vehicle period. I see rvers all the time running regular license plates which is only good to 8500lbs gross weight on 3/4 ton and 1 ton dually pulling I know for a fact empty weight of 15000 to 16000lb rvs because I've or one of my 3/4 ton trucks has transported the same exact rv never ever seen them pulled over or checked at a weigh station so you expect me to believe that these people really care about or even understand weights and what their truck can legally do or tow. Like I said I understand why you are so conservative on your numbers because some people just don't understand but at your pin weight which I don't believe is a true accurate weight because of the suspension on the truck but besides that if it is correct at basically 3500lbs I can legally haul that trailer with anyone of my 3/4 ton transport trucks and not be over on any of my axles or my gross combination weight and cross the weigh stations legally and safely that would basically put me around 6000lbs on rear axle that's rated to 6900lbs roughly transfers 500lbs to front axle making it around 4750lbs with a rating of 6000lbs with a gross combination weight of roughly 24500 to 25000lbs with a rating of 27500lbs gross combination rating so I'm under on all and legal on all no legal binding on payload or cargo
Brother, honestly I combed through your post but didn't read it carefully. That said, I have a video that went viral talking about weight and registration and licensing requirements. I'm legal with a Class A license. Also, the pin weight is accurate base on how I took the measurement. As far as total truck weight, well according to the CAT scale my truck is a 10,380lbs loaded with my family and supplies. The fifth wheel is 3480lbs. The reality of an F450 pickup is that it's significantly derated due to Ford's demand to keep it a class 3 truck (14k GVWR and below). The payload capacity is actually higher than a similarly equipped F350 dually since all the components that make it an F450 technically increase it's ability to handle weight and tow more (large axle half shafts, commercial wheels/tires, larger brakes, larger differential, larger front frame section.) The components that add to the curb weight are largely unsprung components. Many of them are used on the chassis cab F450 with a 16k GCWR.
Don't know Ford trucks that well was just taking a guess at the weight glad to hear that you have a class a cdl I've had my class a cdl when got grandfathered in from special chauffeur license but any I own and operate 5 3/4 ton trucks that are running rv transport leased to a company then I own and operate 9 class 8 tractor trailers running on dedicated lanes under my operating authority so I do believe I have enough experience with legal weights that when I say you and others are so worried about cargo capacity or payload that you are misinformed there are no legal binding or mention of cargo or payload capacity and when you hook up to a trailer that in legal commercial use the gvw of the truck is superseded by gcw. For example a class 8 truck has gvwr of 38000lbs but hook to a trailer that becomes a combination with a gvwr of 80000lbs now most newer 3/4 ton trucks have somewhere in the neighborhood of 6200 to 7000lbs rgawr so anybody should be able to do math if rear axle on truck load but without trailer has 3000lbs and its rated at 7000lbs then legally you c a n put 4000lbs on th a t axle and be legal that's all I'm trying to explain that I understand why you are conservative on your numbers but legally you can tow a good sized 5th wheel rv with a 3/4 ton truck and be legal that's where we disagree is you believe in cargo payload capacity which has no none zip legal binding only fagw ragw gvw or gcvw when hooked to a trailer the gvwr of truck goes out the door because it's considered a combination vehicle when hooked to trailer fagw ragw tagw (trailer axle gross weight) and the gross weight of the entire rig truck and trailer now that is how the federal DOT and the fmcsa(federal motor carrier safety administration) looks at it so if a 3/4 ton truck that is not over on fagw ragw tagw and gross weight of entire rig or the tire weight rating is legal and safe in their eyes but you and several others will say that truck is overloaded because it probably is over compared to the yellow and white sticker that has no legal binding whatsoever plus the gvw of the truck which has no legal binding because the truck is hooked to a trailer now which makes it a combination vehicle now so now you go by the gvw of entire rig. Now that was the way it was explained to me by the federal DOT and fmcsa when you get operating authority you go through a 90 day audit everybody has to and that is the way it was explained to me during that audit so if that works for commercial to figure out the weights then it should be alright to be used for personal rving. Don't you think so?
I work in metrology there are much better scales and indicators out there. Also scale needs to be mounted solid to get a accurate reading. I am familiar with this brand and I would say they are far from industrial just real world facts. For a base contact Rice Lake they will make you a rough deck in any size you want by far the best built I have worked with. Mettler Toledo would be another good brand. If someone wants to weigh fifth wheel pin weights I recommend place the scale on solid earth, concrete, ext. And mounting a solid mount on the scale even then everything needs to be on the same flat level plane as the trailer. Look at a truck scale the next time you are by one they are 3 scales all level and on the same plane. Trying this on a incline or decline will change readings. I get this isn't meant to be super accurate but just giving advice to get the best reading.
Why do you believe it needs to be mounted on a different surface? The truck was not running and the RV had settled, so the weight is static. The reading would be completely accurate. Also, SellEton scales have MUCH better reviews than both brands you mentioned. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just pointing out information after doing the research you mentioned.
R&l IS GOOD BUT ITS ODFL for the win lol
Maybe so, but the driver was nice and the product was undamaged and delivered on time.
That’s a cool product, but impractical for the common truck/rv owner. If they had one that was a 1/4 the size it would be more practical.
The goal would be a much smaller and highly portable unit that weighs significantly less. Probably a max capacity closer to 5k, since very very few RVs would exceed that in terms of pin weight or hitch weight. It would also give you enough capacity to weight corners individually on most large RVs.
Hearing you say you want something to match the red of your truck….KIND OF TELLS US you are NOT selling the F450.
Oh, and my guess is 2635lbs
3650 lbs.
Why would a regular joe like me need a 6k dollar commerical scale system
6k? More like under $1k if youre ok with a corded display that's not washdown rated.
Have absolutely no use for these thank you.
2700
After watching this video, my wife wants to talk to your wife. I think it’s a conspiracy.
sweet and..... now put it away forever....lol
My friend, I already used it 5 times since this was filmed.
@@BTBRVReviews as you should…. Only so much you can weight tho.. we will see where this ends up in a month….lol
2900