I really enjoyed this conversation with Stephen. Here's the outline: 0:00 - Introduction 3:10 - Do all human beings crave power? 11:29 - Russian people and authoritarian power 15:06 - Putin and the Russian people 23:23 - Corruption in Russia 31:30 - Russia's future 41:07 - Individuals and institutions 44:42 - Stalin's rise to power 1:05:20 - What is the ideal political system? 1:21:10 - Questions for Putin 1:29:41 - Questions for Stalin 1:33:25 - Will there always be evil in the world?
Спасибо большое тебе Лекс за этот подкаст! Уже посоветовал его друзьям, кто интересуется искусственным интеллектом 😅 Этот эпизод очень символичный - 20 лет назад Путин стал главой России (1 января 2000 года). Сейчас выросло целое поколение молодых людей, кто видел президентом только его. Все больше людей считает, что эпоха Путина - это время упущенных возможностей. Мы всерьез могли стать второй Норвегией и совершить экономическое чудо. Но что-то пошло не так, сейчас мы все больше понимаем, что конкретно. Я надеюсь, что довольно скоро народ России одумается, уберет режим Путина и построит нормальное демократическое общество. С Новым годом! Желаю всего самого хорошего в этом году! Успехов!
I think you missed an opportunity to bring in the political ideas of Chomsky - anarcho-syndicalism is an alternative to capitalism in a modern industrialized democratic society, and not only in theory (he refers to the anarcho-syndicalist society in Spain that was crushed in the late 1930s). There is nothing essential or inherent about capitalism to humanity or human society.
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question. I like the format. Keep it up.
I'm really impressed with the interview. Even though at times you were clearly stuttering, you covered yourself well and asked a food question. The interview improves as it goes on. Very well done.
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question. I like the format. Keep it up.
Truly. It also means hes really paying attention, which can and might be hard to do especially when u might have several questions and points your trying to get across to the audience
"Calm, clear, concise" is 2/3 the definition of the word "Cogent"! Just replace concise for convincing" ****This is something that caught my eye. I am not trying to "teach" at you new vocabulary words.****
As a Russian, it's very insightful to see Stephen speaking. His intuition behind Russian power is even more right than of many Russians I know. And another point I noticed is that unlike many other western media I saw, Stephen does not try to offend Russian's political system, but rather explains what pros and cons it has. Very interesting watch.
Indeed, he is very prominent historian. He has been to late Soviet Union several times, he himself got acquainted with those communist party monsters like Ligachyev and observed the situation from inside. His book about the fall of Soviets is really great and down to facts rather than ideology. And, beside of his realistic vision on today’s Putin Russia, he obviously loves russian culture and people.
I am from Romania and the liberal Westerners are both blind and hypocritical. they do not understand the seduction and attraction Putin has in Russian society especially on educated people that do not agree at all with Putin ideas. they think everything is based on oppression and repression without seeing the fundamentals of Putin regime. the same way they ignored and still ignore the way Trump seduced poor white people to vote for him while ruining their lives
Listening to historians is always mind boggling for me, it reminds me how easy it is for us to ignore the consequential outcomes that we could draw from history as we move forward a a species. Thanks Lex! Great conversation with Stephen Kotkin.
@Mark Smith -- so sorry. I didn't realize you were a Russia scholar. My mistake. It's healthy to treat books like football teams, as you apparently do.
When I listen to Mr. Kotkin and read his books he always challenges me. His clarity of thought is refreshing. I also appreciate this moderator for not interrupting.
I find myself in awe of Steven Kotkin, but Lex Fridman's interview style is so sensitive and intelligent that it shows the interviewee to best advantage. Not every day I spend an hour and a half listening to an interview.
I just love the part where he just lists of these questions he would like to ask Putin and Stalin. I believe we rarely think of them and other leaders as people and how the nature of their occupation impacts them as a human beings. Stephen literally managed to humanise two figures that I otherwise look at as despotic overlords. Also, being from Romania - a former communist country - I really hope people from Western societies realise what a gift they'd been given by not having to deal with the consequences of such a regime. Please protect your democracies and don't fall in the trap of extremism of any kind, be it left or right.
Unfortunately in this generation, they do not know what we have. And even some of the older generation have lost appreciation for it. We are on a horrible path, that history tells us, will not have a good outcome.
Kotkin makes a point of this often, it is important to not dehumanize evil. Because then you lose track of how humans become "evil" and repeat their mistakes
@@Blendletan The first thing I always think of when I see someone like Putin, Trump, or any power hungry leader is think that they once had their nappies changed too! Second thing I always think is you too must sit down on the toilet and go for a poo. It helps to level the playing field! 🤣
I admire how Professor Kotkin structures his explanation of the subject. Absolutely masterful. He captures my curiosity. I listen to him for hours and enjoy every minute.
Thanks Frank. I agree. I could listen to Kotkin for hours and hours. He is very unique - calm, concise, encyclopedic memory, remains as neutral as possible, just says it as it is. He's a huge gift to the world.
Could have listened for another hour and a half. The truth is always more interesting, subtle and human then the narratives we hear in this country about Russia.
Kotkin is a brilliant mind. Take away messages: The inefficiency of our political system is a feature, not a bug. Competition is the foundation of almost all healthy systems, be it political or not. Public discourse and limited government are the only way to sustain a political system on the long term. Lessons that the world needs to hear over and over again...
What makes this episode so great is that there is zero fluff. He doesn't go down any path that isn't important to the topic at hand. Hard to fill an hour and half that way. Props to this guy.
I actually learn and retain information from people like him. His way of talking keeps the mind engaged without overwhelming it with information. That was a fascinating listen. Thanks Lex and Stephen.
Heeeelp 😂. I'm addicted to Stephen Kotkin's narration of history. Been at it for five hours!!!. Feels like litsening to my grandfather talk about political history. First time a soft spoken historian had my complete attention for hours and hours. Rational, captivating and informative. 👏
Stephen Kotkin has presented the most accurate and open interpretation of contemporary life in Russia. I have looked many years for such an analysis. Thank you for this incredible interview.
I’m a huge Kotkin fan. I own all his books and have seen all his videos. I am new to this channel. I consider this interview to be one of Kotkin’s most enlightening and I attribute that to the OUTSTANDING questions put to him by this interviewer. Very well done. So often interviewers come with generic questions and let the interview flow where it will. But the preparation demonstrated by your questions distinguished this interview from the rest. I particularly liked your big picture questions such as, “What would you ask these world leaders?”, and the questions that gave rise to Kotkin’s observation that the contradictions in practice of Leninism are inherent in Marxism itself even if Marx’s ideology calls for all the benefits of eliminating Capitalism and none of the drawbacks. This is the “nuclear bomb without civilian casualties” analogy. Outstanding interview...I’m a subscriber starting today. For those looking to read more about Stalin or Communism in Russia/Soviet Union, you cannot so much better than Kotkin’s two published biographies of Stalin. For your own sake, steer clear of less rigorous biographers like Sebag Montefiore. Kotkin limits his sources only to contemporaneous written texts so it is based on history as it unfolds rather than people’s biased recollections years later which are inevitably colored by subsequent events.
Stephin Kotkin is a national treasure! His translation of history (and power) into our world today is real and based on a very well informed reality. He is in a respected category of contributors to society that is very small indeed. While your dislike for Putin did sneak through your interview was outstanding in allowing Kotkin to answer the questions (which were excellent). It was extremely informative. Thank you.
Thanks 😊 Lex ! That’s so great you extend Your channel for great minds ! Hope you may do russian subtitles , it is so needed today for Russia to hear more about past & future !
Thank you Mr Kotkin for spelling out the obvious: that the USA and the western democracies belong together and should stand together for freedom, tolerance, and true progress. Thanks again.
Many thanks Mr. Fridman, this has come to me like divine grace because although you talk mostly of Russia and America without even a subconscious thought about India, still this conversation is 100% related to the present situation here. We are under a highly authoritarian government and just as the respected guest of your podcast states that unquestioned authoritarianism breeds extremism and results in more mistakes than normal, we are facing some intolerable blunders of our ministers. To name a few, Demonetisation, Goods and Services Tax, Political laws, and the ongoing madness of Citizenship and National Security. Thank you, I found much useful content and context through this. GODSPEED.
@May Day Hi. I most certainly am saying that. India is definitely an autocratic rule for the last 6 years. It is reaching new heights of fascism these days. The ruling party is on a rampage, targetting students and intellectuals, ordering police to shoot openly on protestors, ministers openly provoking their young party workers to shoot and kill the people who oppose the government. It is unbelievable what is happening here. The future has two aspects, a near future and a distant future. The near future is depressive as the ruling party, the BJP, has four more years in power and they are going to continue the ongoing madness progressively. This is their ideology to make India into a religious state, A Hindu Raashtra they say. On the other hand, the distant future is quite extraordinary I imagine. This is because the present disturbance has brought to surface a definitive ideology to counter this disturbance which is the Spirit of our constitution. Also that the educated youth of the country has begun to stand firm against the aggression of the state while abiding by the restrictions of the constitution. Students are chanting the Preamble of the Constitution all over the nation.This as a whole is sure to breed a new wave of torch bearers of democracy that shall lead the country in a few years from now.
@Übermensch My friend you are at the lowest level of argument in the chronology, which, im sure you do not know, is "Name Calling". I would like to discuss with you when you might grow to the higher levels, the chances of which seem poor. God bless you.
Not fair, he's far more intelligent than that. I imagine a New Jersey encyclopedia as one where the cast of "Jersey Shore" wrote the entire thing. Probably more like a pamphlet actually.
1:26:06 this is the best explanation I’ve ever heard of control-freaks, power seekers, etc.. People ignore the rush/drug/addiction side of controlling people. Most of us have no control over our environment and habits, so we have a hard time imagining that control can be a negative narcotic-style problem. This helps us understand the rare freaks who have so much power that they actually can control almost everything around them indefinitely
just look at how much emotional abuse is in a marriage. you marry a person to be happy and end up in a constant fight without leaving or making it better. tyranny starts at home
In addition to the addiction due to the rush of exercising power there is unfortunately for some a compulsive narcissistic psychological illness that can drive some to exercise power in truly abusive way while feeling deeply guilt and self-loathing inside, only to project all on the subjects of that abuse. Lastly but not least there is fear and paranoia factor to holding authoritarian power where one becomes further and further isolated, self-absorbed, and with no ability to trust in anyone for fear they wish to usurp your power or avenge any of your actions taken through your powers. That becomes a power psychology arms race in the internal person of the authoritarian and the external interpersonal relationships with all those around the authoritarian.
This is possibly the first and only episode I've heard that hasn't delved into technology or AI, and I really appreciated it. Kotkin spoke with such clarity and eloquence, you've gotta get him back on the show to discuss another topic. This episode is in my top three all time for sure.
A fascinating account made by the keen eye of an experimented historian. Definitively a first class interview, informative and well achieved. Thanks again
Please have this man on again. To be honest, I watch your podcast mainly for the more "STEM-like" folks but nevertheless, his exposition and expertise on the subject engaged me thoroughly. Thank you again for just having these conversations in general. Now I'm going to smash that subscribe button and be on my merry little way.
What wonderful insight. An outstanding episode in a long list of heavywieghts. You allow your guests to speak and let them take the lead. I'm surprised you don't have more subscribers.
This guy GETS it, and his advice for Russians (to build institutions with effective checks and balances for the long haul) is just as applicable for Americans. We're lucky to have the few remaining checks and balances we do, and we're in deep trouble if we continue to elect candidates who undermine these restrictions.
Wow! That was such an interesting conversation. I've recently read The Gulag Archipelago and that story burnt a hole in my heart learning about what happened to all those people. Thanks for posting :)
Would you consider this fact: the writer of the Gulag Archipelago and his wife claimed the book was not a historical telling but an experiment in story telling. Or would you claim I was lying/biased just because it disagrees with the accepted narrative of the USSR?
J N I would say you are historically ignorant because independent of the GA, there is overwhelming evidence the USSR was a horrible regime. Not to mention we know the author actually suffered under the USSR, why would he lie? You are probably mis interpreting a quote or not understanding what he meant by “experiment”
@@quinntolchin3080 A reason he would lie is because western states would AND DID fund his literature on account of it serving as anti Russian propaganda. Not to say it was all lies, I'm sure there are truths in it. But you would also be incentivized to appeal to your western backers by painting the most grim images. Exactly how North Korean defectors tell horror stories about NK and get payed for it, even if it cant be verified, and is sometimes even contradictory. And occasionally when the stories are disproved nobody in the media mentions it. Its funny because i probably research the USSR more than the average person and a lot of what is said is straight up false or twisted. Not everything, because the USSR did do things wrong but most people have no sensibility as to what that really was. They are all on the anti soviet band wagon, choo choo!! To have an unbiased view on such a controversial topic is hard. Especially when that topic, The USSR, is used extensively in ALL forms of media to contrast and exalt "western supremacy". This is especially toxic when our country, the USA, has been and actively is possibly the worst human rights violators on the planet. Really makes you think as to why we have to hate this boogeyman called the USSR. Maybe it's so we don't look at ourselves. The points is not to be pro this and anti that. It's to be unbiased and truthful.
@@jnr2349 I agree that western media definitely is not completely truthful when it comes to journalism and it did probably serve their agenda to promote the GA, but on the other hand the soviets did not even have freedom of journalism and actively suppressed any ideas contrary to their narrative which is the issue. You could say that the gulags were grossly exaggerated but thats doing a disservice to the thousands that were robbed of their voice. The issue of power in a capitalistic society is very real and leads to inequality but its a much more approachable than the alternative of never having the possibility of recognizing tyranny. Maybe if you would have read The Gulag Archipelago you would understand that the author purposely undermines the perceivable immorality of the camps to instead question the method of subjugation.
@@altvibr I wish the USSR would have done media and culture differently. But, they did no different than the US did and still does. Do you really think there has been free journalism in US? They claim there is. It's obvious that's not true from all the people who get stomped on for telling the truth. Even kids movies in the US are just thinly veiled pro military forces propaganda (looking at you comic book films). And I did read some of GA a while ago, but it was so blatantly propagandistic and dramatic that it was annoying me and I stopped.
That was a great podcast. Really insightful. I really like how you allowed you the speaker to talk so much. Many times I wish more podcasters would do this. Thanks again :)
that closing quote was powerful. Thank you for the people you have on the podcast! they are great interviews, and as am not a voracious reader, i am a voracious listener. I do enjoy the content you have shared so far. stay awesome!
really enjoyed this discussion. I've been viewing this channel to glom AI, physics, robotics, maths, so I thought I'd be doing some skip and fast fwrd, but this has been one of my fave episodes: bravo & thank you, Lex & Stephen!
Lex, could you try to interview Grigori Perelman - the man who refused one million dollar prize for proving Poincaré conjecture? His mindset is a big misery to many people myself included.
Love the diversity of the guests, thanks Lex for doing this! Not sure if you take recommendations for guests, but I'd love to see Hinton (guessing you've already asked him), or people like Tibshirani/Hastie about statistical learning, Michael I. Jordan, Tamara Munzner on Data Visualization. Keep up the good work!
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question. I like the format. Keep it up.
I really enjoy hearing him speak. Actually watched some of his lectures and various college campuses. His tone and flow of the use of words is easy to listen to. Knows how to hold an audience.
Absolutely fantastic podcast. Lex, you are perfect for this. Your curiosity about what it means to be human will drive this podcast to truly awesome places. Thank you!
I really enjoyed this conversation with Stephen. Here's the outline:
0:00 - Introduction
3:10 - Do all human beings crave power?
11:29 - Russian people and authoritarian power
15:06 - Putin and the Russian people
23:23 - Corruption in Russia
31:30 - Russia's future
41:07 - Individuals and institutions
44:42 - Stalin's rise to power
1:05:20 - What is the ideal political system?
1:21:10 - Questions for Putin
1:29:41 - Questions for Stalin
1:33:25 - Will there always be evil in the world?
Спасибо большое тебе Лекс за этот подкаст! Уже посоветовал его друзьям, кто интересуется искусственным интеллектом 😅
Этот эпизод очень символичный - 20 лет назад Путин стал главой России (1 января 2000 года). Сейчас выросло целое поколение молодых людей, кто видел президентом только его. Все больше людей считает, что эпоха Путина - это время упущенных возможностей. Мы всерьез могли стать второй Норвегией и совершить экономическое чудо. Но что-то пошло не так, сейчас мы все больше понимаем, что конкретно. Я надеюсь, что довольно скоро народ России одумается, уберет режим Путина и построит нормальное демократическое общество.
С Новым годом! Желаю всего самого хорошего в этом году! Успехов!
I think you missed an opportunity to bring in the political ideas of Chomsky - anarcho-syndicalism is an alternative to capitalism in a modern industrialized democratic society, and not only in theory (he refers to the anarcho-syndicalist society in Spain that was crushed in the late 1930s). There is nothing essential or inherent about capitalism to humanity or human society.
LOVE THIS ❤😍❤ LOVE FROM SWEDEN
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question.
I like the format. Keep it up.
I'm really impressed with the interview.
Even though at times you were clearly stuttering, you covered yourself well and asked a food question.
The interview improves as it goes on. Very well done.
I appreciate how you let your guests roll with their thoughts without interruption. Beautiful style.
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question.
I like the format. Keep it up.
We speaking on joe rogan?
i also like when he interupts to have the guest explain a term into layman terms, then resume the train of thoughts.
Truly. It also means hes really paying attention, which can and might be hard to do especially when u might have several questions and points your trying to get across to the audience
Great comment on an excellent episode of an amazing show!
Lex: Ask question
Kotkin: Give answer
Perfect interview
also Lex: listening to the whole sentence before asking a new question
So rare these days.
He should ask his guest have they ever tried DMT? Maybe he'll get tens of millions of dollars
Calm, clear, concise.
Mastery of one's subject
"Calm, clear, concise" is 2/3 the definition of the word "Cogent"! Just replace concise for convincing" ****This is something that caught my eye. I am not trying to "teach" at you new vocabulary words.****
@@SpoonfulOfMenticide thank you.
Kotkin has a manner of speaking that energizes the listener.
I had for some reason really hard time listening to him speak, not sure what it was about the way he spoke.
Anton Cromas I take it that you’re not a fan of Joe Pesci.
I'm not sure whether this is facetious or not, lol.
I love listening to Kotkin at 1.5x he’s definitely energising at those speeds. He’s got a unique style that’s for sure.
As a Russian, it's very insightful to see Stephen speaking. His intuition behind Russian power is even more right than of many Russians I know. And another point I noticed is that unlike many other western media I saw, Stephen does not try to offend Russian's political system, but rather explains what pros and cons it has. Very interesting watch.
Me too! I was soo amazed how this guy've been able to understand current political situation in Russia even though he is not russian
Indeed, he is very prominent historian. He has been to late Soviet Union several times, he himself got acquainted with those communist party monsters like Ligachyev and observed the situation from inside. His book about the fall of Soviets is really great and down to facts rather than ideology. And, beside of his realistic vision on today’s Putin Russia, he obviously loves russian culture and people.
totally agree this was so well put and in a nice way for a change clearly explained that makes total sence.
I am from Romania and the liberal Westerners are both blind and hypocritical. they do not understand the seduction and attraction Putin has in Russian society especially on educated people that do not agree at all with Putin ideas. they think everything is based on oppression and repression without seeing the fundamentals of Putin regime. the same way they ignored and still ignore the way Trump seduced poor white people to vote for him while ruining their lives
That’s what was really good about this interview no criticism just observations.
✌️👍🏼🌅
Listening to historians is always mind boggling for me, it reminds me how easy it is for us to ignore the consequential outcomes that we could draw from history as we move forward a a species. Thanks Lex! Great conversation with Stephen Kotkin.
@@dsm5d723 Very far off my friend.
The far left and the far right ought to stfu and pick up a few history books before they drag us into the same bullshit all over again
“Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it“ Edmund Burke
This was perhaps the most interesting podcast i've ever listened to. So deep and insightful at the end it gave me chills.
exactly the end had me too
Check out this one too. Stephen Kotkin - Why Does Jospeh Stalin Matter ua-cam.com/video/jhi2icRXbHo/v-deo.html
I agree. I’ve never cared about Russian history but this discussion had the prefect mixture of pacing and expertise
He need to mention more of DMT
Stephen Kotkin is an incredible Historian. I can't recommend Stalin Volume 1 and 2 enough. They're the absolute best biographies of Stalin ever made
Yup. FInished vol 1 a few months ago and about to get started on Vol 2. Staggering piece of work.
Wrong. Robert C. Tucker's "Stalin in Power" goes deeper
How does it compare to Robert Service's biography on Stalin?
@Mark Smith -- so sorry. I didn't realize you were a Russia scholar. My mistake. It's healthy to treat books like football teams, as you apparently do.
Better than "Stalin: In The Court of the Red Tsar"?
When I listen to Mr. Kotkin and read his books he always challenges me. His clarity of thought is refreshing. I also appreciate this moderator for not interrupting.
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Kotkin is hard hitting and on point. This is like a 2 yr AP college history course condensed into a podcast
I find myself in awe of Steven Kotkin, but Lex Fridman's interview style is so sensitive and intelligent that it shows the interviewee to best advantage. Not every day I spend an hour and a half listening to an interview.
Lex is the nicest podcaster, he even gave us a respectful segway into his ad
Best way to give an ad. Because of that, I watched the whole ad.
Another hour of this would have hit the spot even better.
Studio Productions That’s what she said
Check part two out this week!!
@@GaminHasard i did. i'd take more still : )
I just love the part where he just lists of these questions he would like to ask Putin and Stalin. I believe we rarely think of them and other leaders as people and how the nature of their occupation impacts them as a human beings. Stephen literally managed to humanise two figures that I otherwise look at as despotic overlords. Also, being from Romania - a former communist country - I really hope people from Western societies realise what a gift they'd been given by not having to deal with the consequences of such a regime. Please protect your democracies and don't fall in the trap of extremism of any kind, be it left or right.
Unfortunately in this generation, they do not know what we have. And even some of the older generation have lost appreciation for it.
We are on a horrible path, that history tells us, will not have a good outcome.
It's so hard to imagine Stalin as somebody's little baby all grown up. But he was.
Kotkin makes a point of this often, it is important to not dehumanize evil. Because then you lose track of how humans become "evil" and repeat their mistakes
@@Blendletan The first thing I always think of when I see someone like Putin, Trump, or any power hungry leader is think that they once had their nappies changed too! Second thing I always think is you too must sit down on the toilet and go for a poo. It helps to level the playing field! 🤣
@@IosafBennis Funny thing is, the current US president gets his nappies changed still.
i am a simple man - i see a Stephen Kotkin interview - i listen to it.
I'm an addict - can't get enough of prof. Kotkin. Eagerly awaiting his third book on Stalin...
same here.
Avner Senderowicz, no, you are a humble but wise person.
Love it, its like one of the Goodfellas giving a history lesson!
Sober Analysis-rare commodity.
He does sound like Joe Pesci!
He could order a hit midway through the talk and it wouldn't feel out of place
he talks about Bad Fellas
roc - 😂 ✌️Bad fellas according to who?
Always two or more side to a story.
I admire how Professor Kotkin structures his explanation of the subject. Absolutely masterful. He captures my curiosity. I listen to him for hours and enjoy every minute.
Thanks Frank. I agree. I could listen to Kotkin for hours and hours. He is very unique - calm, concise, encyclopedic memory, remains as neutral as possible, just says it as it is. He's a huge gift to the world.
Time to bring Kotkin back!
Stephen Kotkin is a national treasure.
Could have listened for another hour and a half. The truth is always more interesting, subtle and human then the narratives we hear in this country about Russia.
Facinating place, facinating history, facinating people.
Endlessly fascinating!! Agree totally.
Part two out this week go check it!!
Kotkin's Sphere of Influence series on UA-cam is excellent. Very informative, insightful and laced with humor.
Kotkin is a brilliant mind.
Take away messages: The inefficiency of our political system is a feature, not a bug. Competition is the foundation of almost all healthy systems, be it political or not. Public discourse and limited government are the only way to sustain a political system on the long term. Lessons that the world needs to hear over and over again...
Your observation on competition indicates to me that you maybe a eugenicist...Are you?
True
This guy is a legend and really great interview
Who else is circling back to this interview?
Historians are always the best story tellers!
What makes this episode so great is that there is zero fluff. He doesn't go down any path that isn't important to the topic at hand. Hard to fill an hour and half that way. Props to this guy.
Lex, you continue to produce exemplary work.
I actually learn and retain information from people like him. His way of talking keeps the mind engaged without overwhelming it with information. That was a fascinating listen. Thanks Lex and Stephen.
Heeeelp 😂. I'm addicted to Stephen Kotkin's narration of history. Been at it for five hours!!!. Feels like litsening to my grandfather talk about political history. First time a soft spoken historian had my complete attention for hours and hours. Rational, captivating and informative. 👏
Dude sat there and got a hour and half personal lecture from one of the greatest historians of our time..... Lucky man
Great interview, felt like this could've gone on longer. Hope you have him back sooner rather than later.
This is insightful on whole another level. Thanks for bringing Kotkin to the conversation!
Stephen Kotkin has presented the most accurate and open interpretation of contemporary life in Russia.
I have looked many years for such an analysis. Thank you for this incredible interview.
I’m a huge Kotkin fan. I own all his books and have seen all his videos. I am new to this channel. I consider this interview to be one of Kotkin’s most enlightening and I attribute that to the OUTSTANDING questions put to him by this interviewer. Very well done. So often interviewers come with generic questions and let the interview flow where it will. But the preparation demonstrated by your questions distinguished this interview from the rest.
I particularly liked your big picture questions such as, “What would you ask these world leaders?”, and the questions that gave rise to Kotkin’s observation that the contradictions in practice of Leninism are inherent in Marxism itself even if Marx’s ideology calls for all the benefits of eliminating Capitalism and none of the drawbacks. This is the “nuclear bomb without civilian casualties” analogy.
Outstanding interview...I’m a subscriber starting today.
For those looking to read more about Stalin or Communism in Russia/Soviet Union, you cannot so much better than Kotkin’s two published biographies of Stalin. For your own sake, steer clear of less rigorous biographers like Sebag Montefiore. Kotkin limits his sources only to contemporaneous written texts so it is based on history as it unfolds rather than people’s biased recollections years later which are inevitably colored by subsequent events.
I am still blown away by how educated this man is, how good he can pass down his knowledge, and at last, but not at least the sense of humor he has :)
I appreciate you making the insights of Kotkin more widely available.
Stephin Kotkin is a national treasure! His translation of history (and power) into our world today is real and based on a very well informed reality. He is in a respected category of contributors to society that is very small indeed. While your dislike for Putin did sneak through your interview was outstanding in allowing Kotkin to answer the questions (which were excellent). It was extremely informative. Thank you.
What dislike? Lex was and still is fawning over this genocidal dictator just to get an interview with him.
One of your best podcast. Please invite this man once again onto the show in the near future.
Really enjoy listening to Stephen. His logical flow of speaking makes me feel less dumb.
Thanks 😊 Lex ! That’s so great you extend Your channel for great minds ! Hope you may do russian subtitles , it is so needed today for Russia to hear more about past & future !
Lex, this is one of your best interviews ever and your closing remark quoting STALIN gave me goose bumps ...
Thank you Mr Kotkin for spelling out the obvious: that the USA and the western democracies belong together and should stand together for freedom, tolerance, and true progress. Thanks again.
I’m binge listening Kotking for days now because of this podcast. Amazing knowledge!
This was a totally brilliant interview on multiple levels. Thanks to you both.
Many thanks Mr. Fridman, this has come to me like divine grace because although you talk mostly of Russia and America without even a subconscious thought about India, still this conversation is 100% related to the present situation here. We are under a highly authoritarian government and just as the respected guest of your podcast states that unquestioned authoritarianism breeds extremism and results in more mistakes than normal, we are facing some intolerable blunders of our ministers. To name a few, Demonetisation, Goods and Services Tax, Political laws, and the ongoing madness of Citizenship and National Security.
Thank you, I found much useful content and context through this. GODSPEED.
I guess it's relatable, not 100% but relatable.
@May Day Hi. I most certainly am saying that. India is definitely an autocratic rule for the last 6 years. It is reaching new heights of fascism these days. The ruling party is on a rampage, targetting students and intellectuals, ordering police to shoot openly on protestors, ministers openly provoking their young party workers to shoot and kill the people who oppose the government. It is unbelievable what is happening here.
The future has two aspects, a near future and a distant future. The near future is depressive as the ruling party, the BJP, has four more years in power and they are going to continue the ongoing madness progressively. This is their ideology to make India into a religious state, A Hindu Raashtra they say.
On the other hand, the distant future is quite extraordinary I imagine. This is because the present disturbance has brought to surface a definitive ideology to counter this disturbance which is the Spirit of our constitution. Also that the educated youth of the country has begun to stand firm against the aggression of the state while abiding by the restrictions of the constitution. Students are chanting the Preamble of the Constitution all over the nation.This as a whole is sure to breed a new wave of torch bearers of democracy that shall lead the country in a few years from now.
@Übermensch My friend you are at the lowest level of argument in the chronology, which, im sure you do not know, is "Name Calling". I would like to discuss with you when you might grow to the higher levels, the chances of which seem poor. God bless you.
@Übermensch You are funny, I call it that because that is what it is.
Thank you for conducting and uploading this interview.
Kotkin is such a great clear and logical communicator. His students are truly blessed.
Super interesting and this guy sounds like a talking encyclopedia from Jersey lol
Name Last he is
Not fair, he's far more intelligent than that. I imagine a New Jersey encyclopedia as one where the cast of "Jersey Shore" wrote the entire thing. Probably more like a pamphlet actually.
Jay Wolf most of the cast members were not from NJ except sammi. Most jersey folk do not sound like that. That's more of a NY accent
Sounds like and looks like that home alone guy
1:26:06 this is the best explanation I’ve ever heard of control-freaks, power seekers, etc.. People ignore the rush/drug/addiction side of controlling people. Most of us have no control over our environment and habits, so we have a hard time imagining that control can be a negative narcotic-style problem. This helps us understand the rare freaks who have so much power that they actually can control almost everything around them indefinitely
just look at how much emotional abuse is in a marriage. you marry a person to be happy and end up in a constant fight without leaving or making it better. tyranny starts at home
In addition to the addiction due to the rush of exercising power there is unfortunately for some a compulsive narcissistic psychological illness that can drive some to exercise power in truly abusive way while feeling deeply guilt and self-loathing inside, only to project all on the subjects of that abuse.
Lastly but not least there is fear and paranoia factor to holding authoritarian power where one becomes further and further isolated, self-absorbed, and with no ability to trust in anyone for fear they wish to usurp your power or avenge any of your actions taken through your powers. That becomes a power psychology arms race in the internal person of the authoritarian and the external interpersonal relationships with all those around the authoritarian.
This is possibly the first and only episode I've heard that hasn't delved into technology or AI, and I really appreciated it. Kotkin spoke with such clarity and eloquence, you've gotta get him back on the show to discuss another topic. This episode is in my top three all time for sure.
Brilliant, I always get excited when I see a new podcast pop up
I love this direction you are taking, Lex. I've learned tons listening to your guests. Keep up the excellent work!
Fascinating. I could listen to him for hours.
Thank you for this episode! Love Kotkin and his fantastic books!
A fascinating account made by the keen eye of an experimented historian. Definitively a first class interview, informative and well achieved. Thanks again
Lex, thank you and thanks to Stephen Kotkin.
I'm staying subscribed for this channel forever.
absolutely loved this episode, thank you for the amazing content Lex!!
Please have this man on again. To be honest, I watch your podcast mainly for the more "STEM-like" folks but nevertheless, his exposition and expertise on the subject engaged me thoroughly. Thank you again for just having these conversations in general. Now I'm going to smash that subscribe button and be on my merry little way.
Every episode is better and better. Just love watching you have these interactions. Thank you for asking what I didn't know I wanted to know.
What wonderful insight. An outstanding episode in a long list of heavywieghts. You allow your guests to speak and let them take the lead. I'm surprised you don't have more subscribers.
What a treasure, thank you for posting this.
Great job Lex as interviewer, perfect questions. I am a fan of Steven for a while but now I am a fan of yours too.
Yesss two of my favourite speakers together. Thank you for inviting Stephen Kotkin.
I was almost going to sleep! and then I opened UA-cam! and now I'm talking!
Thank you for this outstanding interview. I learned a lot.
The thing I find most impressive with Kotkin is how much he knows and easily the words flow out of his mouth
Well, that was perhaps the greatest interview I've seen so far this year!
What a great interview! One hour was not enough.
This guy GETS it, and his advice for Russians (to build institutions with effective checks and balances for the long haul) is just as applicable for Americans. We're lucky to have the few remaining checks and balances we do, and we're in deep trouble if we continue to elect candidates who undermine these restrictions.
That was one of my favourite podcasts of recent time. Thank you
This is one amazing podcast! Thanks Lex for doing this!
Wow! That was such an interesting conversation. I've recently read The Gulag Archipelago and that story burnt a hole in my heart learning about what happened to all those people. Thanks for posting :)
Would you consider this fact: the writer of the Gulag Archipelago and his wife claimed the book was not a historical telling but an experiment in story telling.
Or would you claim I was lying/biased just because it disagrees with the accepted narrative of the USSR?
J N I would say you are historically ignorant because independent of the GA, there is overwhelming evidence the USSR was a horrible regime. Not to mention we know the author actually suffered under the USSR, why would he lie? You are probably mis interpreting a quote or not understanding what he meant by “experiment”
@@quinntolchin3080
A reason he would lie is because western states would AND DID fund his literature on account of it serving as anti Russian propaganda. Not to say it was all lies, I'm sure there are truths in it. But you would also be incentivized to appeal to your western backers by painting the most grim images. Exactly how North Korean defectors tell horror stories about NK and get payed for it, even if it cant be verified, and is sometimes even contradictory. And occasionally when the stories are disproved nobody in the media mentions it.
Its funny because i probably research the USSR more than the average person and a lot of what is said is straight up false or twisted. Not everything, because the USSR did do things wrong but most people have no sensibility as to what that really was. They are all on the anti soviet band wagon, choo choo!!
To have an unbiased view on such a controversial topic is hard. Especially when that topic, The USSR, is used extensively in ALL forms of media to contrast and exalt "western supremacy".
This is especially toxic when our country, the USA, has been and actively is possibly the worst human rights violators on the planet. Really makes you think as to why we have to hate this boogeyman called the USSR. Maybe it's so we don't look at ourselves. The points is not to be pro this and anti that. It's to be unbiased and truthful.
@@jnr2349 I agree that western media definitely is not completely truthful when it comes to journalism and it did probably serve their agenda to promote the GA, but on the other hand the soviets did not even have freedom of journalism and actively suppressed any ideas contrary to their narrative which is the issue. You could say that the gulags were grossly exaggerated but thats doing a disservice to the thousands that were robbed of their voice. The issue of power in a capitalistic society is very real and leads to inequality but its a much more approachable than the alternative of never having the possibility of recognizing tyranny. Maybe if you would have read The Gulag Archipelago you would understand that the author purposely undermines the perceivable immorality of the camps to instead question the method of subjugation.
@@altvibr
I wish the USSR would have done media and culture differently. But, they did no different than the US did and still does. Do you really think there has been free journalism in US? They claim there is. It's obvious that's not true from all the people who get stomped on for telling the truth. Even kids movies in the US are just thinly veiled pro military forces propaganda (looking at you comic book films).
And I did read some of GA a while ago, but it was so blatantly propagandistic and dramatic that it was annoying me and I stopped.
Impressive knowledge of the topic. Nuanced, fair and useful picture of the current Russian political landscape! Thank you.
One of the most important interviews I have ever watched. The subjects timeless. The subtlies sublime.
I discovered this channel only a week or so ago... And it's one of my favourites already.
Great interview style and great guests.
That was a great podcast. Really insightful. I really like how you allowed you the speaker to talk so much. Many times I wish more podcasters would do this. Thanks again :)
What an amazing communicator of history. Amazing.
that closing quote was powerful. Thank you for the people you have on the podcast! they are great interviews, and as am not a voracious reader, i am a voracious listener. I do enjoy the content you have shared so far. stay awesome!
really enjoyed this discussion. I've been viewing this channel to glom AI, physics, robotics, maths, so I thought I'd be doing some skip and fast fwrd, but this has been one of my fave episodes: bravo & thank you, Lex & Stephen!
Lex, could you try to interview Grigori Perelman - the man who refused one million dollar prize for proving Poincaré conjecture? His mindset is a big misery to many people myself included.
support!
doubt Mr Perelman would be available
That'd be awesome, but I doubt he'd even respond to an invitation.
@@roc7880 If he did, I doubt he wouldn´t throw with cats.
He is busy picking mushrooms
Love the diversity of the guests, thanks Lex for doing this! Not sure if you take recommendations for guests, but I'd love to see Hinton (guessing you've already asked him), or people like Tibshirani/Hastie about statistical learning, Michael I. Jordan, Tamara Munzner on Data Visualization. Keep up the good work!
This was great, thanks! Kotkin moves to the top of my reading queue.
Thanks, Lex, for keeping this important interview ad-free. We really appreciate this.
You're exactly what I've been looking for Lex. Keep fighting the good fight, I'm sure I speak for many when I say most of us want to be more like you.
Magnetic Mountain by Kotkin is an absolute masterpiece. Most of my final college thesis was centered around that book.
I would say, keep it up with the lack of interruption, I like this rolling of ideas. I find it refreshing to hear the punch line of the thought process when not interrupted with another question.
I like the format. Keep it up.
I really enjoy hearing him speak. Actually watched some of his lectures and various college campuses. His tone and flow of the use of words is easy to listen to. Knows how to hold an audience.
Absolutely fantastic podcast. Lex, you are perfect for this. Your curiosity about what it means to be human will drive this podcast to truly awesome places. Thank you!
Thank you Lex for sharing knowledge with us all.
It’s always a refresh to listen to a great mind like Stephen Kotkin, each and every time.
Excellent taste in choosing your guests. Stephen Kotkin is one of my favorite historians.
thank you lex, for this amazing and insightful podcast.
Thank you Lex and Stephen for making this happen - fascinating discussion.
I've now watched this twice. Made me interested in something I never thought I'd be interested in. Thank you!
Lex, your isolated clip cut led me to the full interview. Keep those up.
Recommend his books!
Lex, thanks for your podcast. It's one of the best i know. Great guests, great host. Keep it up!
Great guest. Great interview. Thank you.
I like how honest he was on replying to your last question. It was a pleasure this whole interview.