About those hyper-expensive loudspeakers: maybe an impression video about one of these speakers roughly once a year just to provide some perspective as to how much better/not that much better it really gets. Then again, it might be eating into time for more "realistic" videos. That is for John to decide, really.
Great episode! I didn't know about the noise issues at the Munich show! Thanks for pointing that out, one more reason for me not to go. And thanks for the shout out.
I like how this video is 50% excellent information on the inner workings of the hi-fi world, and 50% the "old man yells at cloud" meme from the simpsons
John, you ARE the Future of Fi. Typical hifi reviewers from mainstream audio mags are bald men in their 60s or beyond. I'd rather have you tells us of innovative products coming from smart designers rather than uber-expensive 2 channel stuff chasing the ultra-riche niche...mere refinements of old-tech, e.g. cone speakers, turntables. This video was worth 40 min of my time. 👍👍
Your focus on entry level and dare I say it "affordable" equipment is one reason I followed your channel. I know affordable is different for everyone,but you do well covering a range of products across various price points. Keep up the good work but I don't think we would be too upset with an occasional review of the Lamborghini priced items.
Hey John, people that can afford $80,000 speakers and 200,000 turntables are very fortunate, but I don’t think they are sitting around watching youtube, it’s not your target audience.
Hi John - this is one of the *best* videos you've made since I started watching/followingsubscribing to your UA-cam Channel over 3 years ago. So informative, objective, honest, balanced & fair... Tremendous effort!! [P.S. A big *no* to you wasting your valuable time re; 80,000 Euro spkr. reviews, please.....just my tuppence-worth]. Cheers from Japan! G. (ex-Scotland).
Hey John I have been trying to work out why it's so easy for me to watch your videos right to the end regardless of the subject..... Today I realised why, it's because you make your channel's experience so human..... Something rarely seen.....
Loved that phrase "Stay happy with what I have!". That's so true. Listening to stuff outside your price bracket can only lead to heartbreak and regret. Being happy with what you have and focusing on the music has to be the No.1 focus. I love your thinking.
I enjoyed your thoughts on this show. For me, it's really no different to an art exhibition: lots of very expensive and interesting looking objects that serve absolutely no practical purpose.
Hello John. You mentioned the hifi rose. I would like you, to review the new Eversolo dmp A6 ! A streaming killer….,keep up the good work . Groet André
John, your title reminds me of the old story about two Quaker elders who were walking one day, discussing the state of the world. One stopped, turned, to his friend, and said, “Brother, all the world is insane but me and thee, and sometimes I have my doubts about thee.” P.S. Thanks for your videos, podcasts, Instagram, and your website. I enjoy them all! 🎉❤
As a visitor and blogger I must say, this is one of the best coverages of a Munich show I ever watched. Fantastic holistic view of this monster and the advantages of conversations on the show. Thx a lot for this and also the insides of your production reality.
I Think it's important to keep your focus on "affordable" hifi. Quite often I have noticed price creep occur with youtube reviewers and in some cases they have become irrelevant to me. I'm not saying that there can't be exceptions, but I do believe it serves the average subsciber better to maintain some sort of constant affordability level.
Understanding the pinnacle of performance, gives you and upper bound. Then you can get a good idea where you get good value on the cost vs performance curve
Really happy that you have found your goosebump setup! As I have loved and enjoyed the wonders of playing instruments and listening to artists (live and recorded music) all my life... and got into hifi with friends in my mid teens ...and by trying out, demoing and trial and error found the personal sound setup and presentation I like....and it still amazes how music, artists and good recordings can connect on another level ...and give goosebumps, awe, wonder, laughter and tears .... as they stir memories that flicker and dance, come and go! ....or the adventure of finding abd discovering new music and musicians that then make their mark and start new chapters and memories too!
Interesting to hear your thought on the High End 😊 I went there as well. Totally agree with you about the noise. Checking out headphones was totally impossible. The upper floor show rooms worked better for me due to their room treatments - at least in some places. I actually liked the opportunity to listen to hyper expensive loudspeaker. Just to see what’s possible. My biggest issue was the music selection. In my opinion they should change genres more often just to show more factettes of their speaker. I would also appreciate a comparison once in a while between 50k + speaker and what you have at home - again, just to get a feeling how close we could come with less budget. Keep up the good work and greetings from Munich!
I think it could be interesting to take something Uber expensive and compare it to something much lower in the price spectrum, to see just how close it comes. You’d probably only be able to do it once though 😂
Thanks For the video John , Always a pleasure to drop in , Its tuff working all the time and not being able to go to Audio shows myself , But after your video I'm good 😊
Whilst at university in London I went to every hi-fi and photographic show in London. Earl's Court, Olympia and the hotels near Heathrow were the main venues. The hotel rooms were emptied and set up for listening with a limited number of seats. Whilst the walls gave some sound separation the rooms are like some people would have a home office and not even the size of a lounge. Some of the large demo rooms were well set up. By the end of day, as they were packing away and it was less noisy you could listen to them at least as well as in most hi-fi shop showrooms. In 1980 there were few speakers over £1000. A full system of turntable amp and speakers under £3000 {teacher salary, junior programmer at £5000}. There are more speakers at over £50k now (teacher salary at £30k}. The three grand system, when new or now refurbished would compared to a £15k system. The people who might afford them have risen to higher income levels whilst their hearing range is reduced (many 55-70+ don't have much hearing above 12khz and few of us ever had much hearing above 16kHz). Far more choice today, at every price level, fewer shops to see any equipment and even fewer to compare anything on a short list. Perhaps Buchardt's direct to customers is the way others should go with a home trial and only cost the shipment back to base. The Future-Fi is worrying as many of the features are new technologies. Anything needing an app on a mobile phone when the operating systems of those phones changes every year, steaming features once built in are handed to a third party app and the whole family has to be equally set up just to turn the system on if that even works
I wish there were hi-fi “hotels” that people could rent out by the hour or day where you could just listen to extremely expensive gear in a finely tuned and treated room without any pressure to buy it. I’m tired of pressing my nose against the rich man’s window and fantasizing. Just take my money and let me experience it myself for a little while without a dealer over my shoulder or whining neighbors.
Fantastic business idea! I think it would be more reasonable to have an event you’d sell tickets to as hi-fi isn’t quite mainstream enough to carry the cost of a hotel. Hence the Hi-Fi event here. I think it would be better to have hi-fi headphones listening rooms
I thought I’d offer one theory on why shows like these play classical, opera, and female vocal tracks instead of more contemporary or popular styles of music. In fact, I think you already alluded to it when you commented that you’d prefer to hear tracks you’re familiar with, so you could compare what you hear against something you know. If you don’t know a pop, hip-hop, or electronica track, you’re at a “double” disadvantage. Not only do you not know the piece; but because these styles of music often rely on synthesizers or manipulated samples of familiar sounds, the uninitiated may not even know what they’re listening for. Now take classical music. Even if you don’t know the piece, you know what a violin, piano, or trumpet should sound like. You can still listen for the familiar tone and timbre of a given instrument. Same with classical female vocals. Of course, this is just a theory. The next time you or one of you loyal viewers (me included) are at a show, we should ask the exhibitor why they choice the piece and what we should be listening for. Then we should share with this community. It would make for an interesting article/podcast/episode.
Really kind of you to do this, John. It is a good reality check for a lot of people who are inexperienced with events like this. Noise is actually a big factor. Cheers man. Thank you.
I have a tall friend that is a chef. He's around 6'7 I think and people are always asking him if he plays basketball. He responds with, "No, do you play mini-putt?" 😂
I'd love to hear what you, usually listening to expensive but somewhat achievable priced gear, might think about super high-end. Can you even evaluate/max it out given a "normal" apartment? Can you tell a difference? What does it take to tell a difference? Does it make you (a somewhat normie) actually enjoy music more? What factions of a percent improvements are we talking about here when going from $10k to $100k.
Agree with you John; covering hifi within your- and many people's financial reach makes it all the more fun to watch your videos. I see your great Schiiit preamp review, think hmm very interesting... and it is feasible. Same goes for the Mission speakers and although they do cost more serious money, it's all good news for most of us. I read TAS as well but there, I often end up feeling a pauper when reading about ultra high-end with ultra price tags.
Your focus on gear that regular people can afford (ahem, somewhat) is perfect. I know exactly what you're talking about when you say you will get spoiled by listening to high-end gear and then not wanting to listen to anything else. The first time I heard a pair of MartinLogan electrostatic speakers was in the early 1990s/late 1980s. The audio source was a LaserDisc of Sting (or The Police?) live, if I remember correctly. The sound was just unbelievable. While I still remember that, it did not spoil me -- much. However, if I listened to that all the time, I would become an audiophile snob and it would take all my money.
At Australian HiFi shows, most exhibitors will let you request music of your choice. Those who don't, generally have empty rooms. The listening rooms are generally off carpeted passage ways and we therefore have virtually no ambient noise.
tbf one in a while it would be intresting to compare best of 100k speakers as reference to what is possible and what they can get you and how close to them 10% of thier price will get you
John, what an amazing video! I could hear you for hours! I loved what you said about trying things not trying the Sennheisers lol I'm kind of like that lol
I got to drive a Porsche GT3RS on a track for my bachelor party. That “broke me” in just the same way the über high end headphones would snap my perception of what is possible.
A long one, but super-funny too John! You covered so much in detail the MHES that have nothing to complain. You focused on noise, slamming doors, uber-hiend, demonstration music, high volumes (both SPL and speaker sizes) - all that caught also my attention even in humble shows here in Athens! Personally, don't have an objection for you to review uber-high end, because I am sure that the result won't be full of b/s or snob. We will be able to know some useful info from some appliances we dream but believe in the near future will reach us through more affordable incarnations. In the end, even LP-video, it wasn't fatiguing at all, a pure joy. Now, some products I wanna see here (maybe already on your list): Musical Fidelity A1, the new Naim 50 'shoebox, Hifi ROSE stuff, Elac Debut ConneX DCB41. P.S.: I see you found this little magic box of yours at Audiophonics. I love these guys! I 've just bought HPA-S400ET, a Purifi-Power amp (2x400W@4 Ohm, ~1500 euros!!!) and it is stunning! Really good stuff!
I agree wholeheartedly with your comments on HiFi show music choice. Apart from in the 1980s, where every HiFi dealer seemed to play Dire Straits and not much else, I have never entered a demo room and recognised the music or the artist. Nearly always a female jazz singer or something that just shows off the dynamic of the system - stuff that would never be a choice form me to play at home! I even wonder whether the more expensive the system, the more it 'pushes' you towards a certain kind of (well-recorded) music!
They play music from small groups so you don't know if the speaker is any good unless you bring your own music. They like small woofers and no midrange, so they're not selling high fideity - in my opinion unless you get into the big bucks.
What a great video- I’ve always felt one of John’s greatest strengths is being able to talk at length about any topic in a way that’s engaging but also *approachable*. I wouldn’t have interest in attending one of these shows myself (would just feel overwhelmed), but I found this to be a very enjoyable 40 mins. Thanks!
Indeed, it is true that the exhibition venue can be quite noisy. However, this is a common occurrence at almost all audio exhibitions around the world, unless the event is poorly attended. So, it is something that one must get accustomed to.🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Hi John, you should of visited the Montreal or even the Toronto hifi shows, there a lot smaller and more intimate. All the big players are there plus a few niche companies like Angela-Gilbert (formally Blue Circle). They even have a basement where they sell used vinyl. A lot more laid back. Montreal is very much a European city in North America with many great audio companies like Totem, Verity, PSB and lately the Billy Amp. You should come and relax. All the best
It is such a pleasure to listen to your reasoning, you did talk a lot but... i watched till the end. And your attitude toward unaffordable opulence is perfect. Good luck with the noice...
I also suggest that the HiFI industry is a harbinger of the global market: manufacturers are chasing the 0.1-1.0% of earners at the expense of everyone else. Btw those large speakers need large rooms and no $1M house in US cities like DC, Boston, NYC, Seattle, San Francisco, etc. is large enough to accommodate such speakers. More like $2M or more required.
Great summary of Munich. I went with a mate this year after quite a few years of the Bristol show. Was quite amazing - vast and somewhat overwhelming. We arrived at about 10:30am on the Saturday and so many dream systems to listen to, but as you say the music being played was definitely not my taste either. My mate and I call it ‘yuppie jazz’. Lasted till 4pm but with very many rooms left unvisited we just couldn’t take any more of that music I’m afraid. Have always found Harbeth particularly bad for their show tunes. Would love to hear a pair playing some recognisable music but instead have been driven from their rooms (Bristol and Munich) within a few minutes with burning earache! Oh well, maybe one day. Really enjoyed the Lyngdorf room and the little JBL 4305p were quite amazing at the affordable end of the spectrum!
Late to the party because my bank holiday treat was John Fogerty celebrating getting the tights to hos songs back. Wall to wall bangers. Short scale guitars: I'm loving my Sterling Cutlass SSSH. Great little guitar and so comfortable
The Roon GPT thing is interesting. Please cover Sonic Sage within Plexamp too. Very similar functionality (from the short video) and equally groundbreaking. It was initially tied to Tidal, but the last release opened it to local libraries. I've been using it, and showing it off to people.
Plexamp has a "sonic sage" in its settings that allows you to use chat gpt4 for your music along with tidal. I haven't tried it but it looks like something you would like and could probably make a video about.
Great video. Totally agree with you John. There is no point to review 50k speakers and gear. Of course Coltrane by Martens are so great but 1 to 10k people could buy it. Love your work 📻!
I think there are two music listening use cases- active listening in a fixed set up and the other is one where you want DJ mixing in a dynamic way in many locations.
You have allways had ok videos and good reviews but after this video my respect for you channel rise up by a factor of 10 👌 Great that you have the princips on what you do !
I have to say this isn't just a Munich High-End....I went to a local show (Southwest Audio Fest), and it felt so out of time with what they were selling, what music played to audition the speakers...and there were so many high end rooms that were just boomy as hell because of the rooms.
My Future-Fi highlight of the show were the Cabasse Rialto. Interesting alternative to the KEF LS50 Wireless II. Currently in the process of getting a pair for my desk setup.
Those audio convention "sound rooms" you referenced ... I first encountered those at CEDIA in 2000. The physics/acoustic attributes are outstanding as a baseline. They're essentially a low pass filter ... which is very much needed in any room. Even high performance residential listening room don't possess the ability to lower the LF decay times like those pre-fab sound rooms. However pulling the LF energy out of the room, introduces it to the adjacent public spaces, ... oftentimes into the next sound room over. Some simple scattering/diffusion on the sidewalls, retains some liveliness to the experience. For an exhibitor, they're quite expensive, plus HVAC, power, lighting, etc.
Just a comment on Hifi Rose, and especially the RS150B. I was sceptic until I listened to one and touched one. It sounds really good, that was enough to buy one, and with the touchscreen and the user friendly app I fell in love with it. And the digital VU-meters 😍. I have had tons of hifi but never been ”in love” like this.
I watched and continue to watch your channel because I relate. I listen on a system that is worth around $15K and will play in this space maybe nudging up to 20k total and I get great joy listening to songs like I did the other night like Band of Horses, ‘Is there a ghost’ and Sufjan Stevens ‘Chicago’ and songs wide and varied in that niche. So thanks for continuing to play in this space both musically and with hi fi
I also went to this years High End. So many brands were missing this year, I was very disappointed. I was trying to show my mum more Kef Speakers, but GP Acustics was missing, D&M I also could not find. As John is talking about all the expansive setups that were shown this year, most affordable brands simply did not come. Also most demos are simply too loud. On the topic of overexpensive gear, yes please review, but make it a condition that you also get a product from their line which is downscaled to your prefered price range!
E1DA is chinese company but its run by and engineered a Russian engineer living in shenzehn by the name of Ivan Khlyupin, E1 is a play on his name Ivan when you sound it out phonetically in english. Da is just dah in russian which is just "yes". Hes been making incredible DACs for years now looking forward to seeing his new amp and complete ADC set. The software side of things needs some help but he's a wizard in hardware!
I went for public opening, what stood out in live listening (with in reach) was the tannoy vintage, focal and the lyndorf 3400 with cue100 speakers, they had the most emotional presentation, honestly live they were fantastic, biggest surprise. Even saw Peter lyndorf in person in the demo room.,
That app sounds cool for those who are playlist people. I am not one of those. I am an album person. What I would use it for is reminding me of songs I had forgotten about from past years. Thanks again.
The reason most high end stereo shows and high end stores play things like jazz, classical and opera is because it is simple. It is uncomplicated music that allows the driver to play the notes as perfectly controlled as the driver can. You seldom hear them playing things like Gotye - Somebody That I Used To Know, because it is a complex piece of music that will highlight any flaws like smearing in the speakers. You have two different competing voice played over the top of each other, this is a nightmare for driver cone control. That is why when I audition equipment I take an assortment of music that I am well familiar with.
I just subscribed to Plex(Amp) today for the lifetime subscription and at first it was a bit fiddly trying to figure out what to download and where to download it to. Then my PC went bonkers (not related to Plex) and I had to do a system restore which wiped my core connection with Plex. I was finally able to get it all sorted, and I am loving it very much! I actually prefer using Plexamp over Roon Arc because for me, it's interface seems to be more logical to use for me at least and I have had a blast setting it up with my system. So I wanted to thank you for introducing me to this service and I am very happy with it. Great video as always and I look forward to seeing your next one very soon. Cheers!
I would like to see you do a video that explores the Wilson audio version of a proper speaker setup with the correct time alignment. I heard this first hand once and was a real treat
About those hyper-expensive loudspeakers: maybe an impression video about one of these speakers roughly once a year just to provide some perspective as to how much better/not that much better it really gets. Then again, it might be eating into time for more "realistic" videos. That is for John to decide, really.
Agree! Be great to understand from a real person what the difference really is .. maybe get some 2M tall 😂
Great episode! I didn't know about the noise issues at the Munich show! Thanks for pointing that out, one more reason for me not to go. And thanks for the shout out.
I enjoy your channel Steve
Must be the REAL SteveG:
He's not offering a prize plus $100 shipping....
🎶😉🎶
I like how this video is 50% excellent information on the inner workings of the hi-fi world, and 50% the "old man yells at cloud" meme from the simpsons
I am interested to know your thoughts on how much better a €85k speaker sounds compared to more affordable speakers costing ~US$2 - 10k
John, you ARE the Future of Fi. Typical hifi reviewers from mainstream audio mags are bald men in their 60s or beyond. I'd rather have you tells us of innovative products coming from smart designers rather than uber-expensive 2 channel stuff chasing the ultra-riche niche...mere refinements of old-tech, e.g. cone speakers, turntables. This video was worth 40 min of my time. 👍👍
Your focus on entry level and dare I say it "affordable" equipment is one reason I followed your channel. I know affordable is different for everyone,but you do well covering a range of products across various price points.
Keep up the good work but I don't think we would be too upset with an occasional review of the Lamborghini priced items.
Hey John, people that can afford $80,000 speakers and 200,000 turntables are very fortunate, but I don’t think they are sitting around watching youtube, it’s not your target audience.
Hi John - this is one of the *best* videos you've made since I started watching/followingsubscribing to your UA-cam Channel over 3 years ago. So informative, objective, honest, balanced & fair... Tremendous effort!! [P.S. A big *no* to you wasting your valuable time re; 80,000 Euro spkr. reviews, please.....just my tuppence-worth]. Cheers from Japan! G. (ex-Scotland).
Just do 1 pair of 80k speakers. Just for shits and giggles..
Genelec 8381 would fit that budget... And stomp basically anything up to a billion dollars from any other company.
And then try to make comparisons to one or two well known affordable speakers like the ls50 or so.
It drove me nuts how many people were talking in The rooms at axpona.
Hey John I have been trying to work out why it's so easy for me to watch your videos right to the end regardless of the subject..... Today I realised why, it's because you make your channel's experience so human..... Something rarely seen.....
Loved that phrase "Stay happy with what I have!". That's so true. Listening to stuff outside your price bracket can only lead to heartbreak and regret. Being happy with what you have and focusing on the music has to be the No.1 focus. I love your thinking.
I enjoyed your thoughts on this show. For me, it's really no different to an art exhibition: lots of very expensive and interesting looking objects that serve absolutely no practical purpose.
*John, please don't change. Your style of presentation is excellent* Also, please remain within 10k gear as always on this channel.
A review of more expensive speaker(s) could shed some light on what the consumer is is paying for. Other reviewers do it whether it's cars or watches.
You must not have kids. If you did you wouldn’t notice the bad music, interruptions and noise. I’m not joking.
Unfortunately… This is the way….
Truth
Amen to that bro
💯
It’s why audio post children is a solitary room or headphone based affair
Having kids is very over rated. Having massive disposable income by not having kids allows us to buy stuff we like..
Hello John. You mentioned the hifi rose. I would like you, to review the new Eversolo dmp A6 ! A streaming killer….,keep up the good work . Groet André
John, your title reminds me of the old story about two Quaker elders who were walking one day, discussing the state of the world. One stopped, turned, to his friend, and said, “Brother, all the world is insane but me and thee, and sometimes I have my doubts about thee.” P.S. Thanks for your videos, podcasts, Instagram, and your website. I enjoy them all! 🎉❤
As a visitor and blogger I must say, this is one of the best coverages of a Munich show I ever watched. Fantastic holistic view of this monster and the advantages of conversations on the show. Thx a lot for this and also the insides of your production reality.
I Think it's important to keep your focus on "affordable" hifi. Quite often I have noticed price creep occur with youtube reviewers and in some cases they have become irrelevant to me. I'm not saying that there can't be exceptions, but I do believe it serves the average subsciber better to maintain some sort of constant affordability level.
i loved the doors closing John 🤣.. love your sense of humor. Excellent video too.
Hello Darko. Review the Lintons! I seem them just hanging out looking beautiful behind you.
Understanding the pinnacle of performance, gives you and upper bound. Then you can get a good idea where you get good value on the cost vs performance curve
Always interesting to see what the brands have to offer! Great show coverage Darko!
Fantastic video John. Great insight as always. I could listen to you blather on about Roon and speakers all day long. 😊
Really happy that you have found your goosebump setup!
As I have loved and enjoyed the wonders of playing instruments and listening to artists (live and recorded music) all my life... and got into hifi with friends in my mid teens ...and by trying out, demoing and trial and error found the personal sound setup and presentation I like....and it still amazes how music, artists and good recordings can connect on another level ...and give goosebumps, awe, wonder, laughter and tears .... as they stir memories that flicker and dance, come and go!
....or the adventure of finding abd discovering new music and musicians that then make their mark and start new chapters and memories too!
Holy crap! 2 meters, Darko is an absolute unit.
Good one :)))
Interesting to hear your thought on the High End 😊 I went there as well. Totally agree with you about the noise. Checking out headphones was totally impossible. The upper floor show rooms worked better for me due to their room treatments - at least in some places. I actually liked the opportunity to listen to hyper expensive loudspeaker. Just to see what’s possible. My biggest issue was the music selection. In my opinion they should change genres more often just to show more factettes of their speaker. I would also appreciate a comparison once in a while between 50k + speaker and what you have at home - again, just to get a feeling how close we could come with less budget. Keep up the good work and greetings from Munich!
I enjoyed the line from "Panic" by The Smiths, it's a great lyric, and very relevant in the context you used it.
Great video as always.
I think it could be interesting to take something Uber expensive and compare it to something much lower in the price spectrum, to see just how close it comes. You’d probably only be able to do it once though 😂
LOL😂
Thanks For the video John , Always a pleasure to drop in , Its tuff working all the time and not being able to go to Audio shows myself ,
But after your video I'm good 😊
Whilst at university in London I went to every hi-fi and photographic show in London. Earl's Court, Olympia and the hotels near Heathrow were the main venues. The hotel rooms were emptied and set up for listening with a limited number of seats. Whilst the walls gave some sound separation the rooms are like some people would have a home office and not even the size of a lounge. Some of the large demo rooms were well set up. By the end of day, as they were packing away and it was less noisy you could listen to them at least as well as in most hi-fi shop showrooms.
In 1980 there were few speakers over £1000. A full system of turntable amp and speakers under £3000 {teacher salary, junior programmer at £5000}. There are more speakers at over £50k now (teacher salary at £30k}. The three grand system, when new or now refurbished would compared to a £15k system. The people who might afford them have risen to higher income levels whilst their hearing range is reduced (many 55-70+ don't have much hearing above 12khz and few of us ever had much hearing above 16kHz). Far more choice today, at every price level, fewer shops to see any equipment and even fewer to compare anything on a short list. Perhaps Buchardt's direct to customers is the way others should go with a home trial and only cost the shipment back to base.
The Future-Fi is worrying as many of the features are new technologies. Anything needing an app on a mobile phone when the operating systems of those phones changes every year, steaming features once built in are handed to a third party app and the whole family has to be equally set up just to turn the system on if that even works
I wish there were hi-fi “hotels” that people could rent out by the hour or day where you could just listen to extremely expensive gear in a finely tuned and treated room without any pressure to buy it. I’m tired of pressing my nose against the rich man’s window and fantasizing. Just take my money and let me experience it myself for a little while without a dealer over my shoulder or whining neighbors.
Fantastic business idea! I think it would be more reasonable to have an event you’d sell tickets to as hi-fi isn’t quite mainstream enough to carry the cost of a hotel. Hence the Hi-Fi event here. I think it would be better to have hi-fi headphones listening rooms
Nice idea but I think it would be too expensive.
How much would you pay to listen to your favorite album once?
Thank you John for your always different approach to audio shows, love it
I thought I’d offer one theory on why shows like these play classical, opera, and female vocal tracks instead of more contemporary or popular styles of music. In fact, I think you already alluded to it when you commented that you’d prefer to hear tracks you’re familiar with, so you could compare what you hear against something you know. If you don’t know a pop, hip-hop, or electronica track, you’re at a “double” disadvantage. Not only do you not know the piece; but because these styles of music often rely on synthesizers or manipulated samples of familiar sounds, the uninitiated may not even know what they’re listening for. Now take classical music. Even if you don’t know the piece, you know what a violin, piano, or trumpet should sound like. You can still listen for the familiar tone and timbre of a given instrument. Same with classical female vocals.
Of course, this is just a theory. The next time you or one of you loyal viewers (me included) are at a show, we should ask the exhibitor why they choice the piece and what we should be listening for. Then we should share with this community. It would make for an interesting article/podcast/episode.
Really kind of you to do this, John. It is a good reality check for a lot of people who are inexperienced with events like this. Noise is actually a big factor. Cheers man. Thank you.
...while sitting there with a T-shirt that says "audiophile"...
"Yeah we know John, that's why we're watching"
I have a tall friend that is a chef. He's around 6'7 I think and people are always asking him if he plays basketball. He responds with, "No, do you play mini-putt?" 😂
I'd love to hear what you, usually listening to expensive but somewhat achievable priced gear, might think about super high-end. Can you even evaluate/max it out given a "normal" apartment? Can you tell a difference? What does it take to tell a difference? Does it make you (a somewhat normie) actually enjoy music more? What factions of a percent improvements are we talking about here when going from $10k to $100k.
Agree with you John; covering hifi within your- and many people's financial reach makes it all the more fun to watch your videos. I see your great Schiiit preamp review, think hmm very interesting... and it is feasible. Same goes for the Mission speakers and although they do cost more serious money, it's all good news for most of us. I read TAS as well but there, I often end up feeling a pauper when reading about ultra high-end with ultra price tags.
Your focus on gear that regular people can afford (ahem, somewhat) is perfect. I know exactly what you're talking about when you say you will get spoiled by listening to high-end gear and then not wanting to listen to anything else. The first time I heard a pair of MartinLogan electrostatic speakers was in the early 1990s/late 1980s. The audio source was a LaserDisc of Sting (or The Police?) live, if I remember correctly. The sound was just unbelievable. While I still remember that, it did not spoil me -- much. However, if I listened to that all the time, I would become an audiophile snob and it would take all my money.
At Australian HiFi shows, most exhibitors will let you request music of your choice. Those who don't, generally have empty rooms. The listening rooms are generally off carpeted passage ways and we therefore have virtually no ambient noise.
tbf one in a while it would be intresting to compare best of 100k speakers as reference to what is possible and what they can get you and how close to them 10% of thier price will get you
Thank you so much for this video. I always enjoy your reviews and candid emotions on how hardware or software makes you feel. Always a fan.
Looks very much like a old and grey dude Rally. Which means it's probably dying...
Great Video blog. I really enjoyed listening to this. I agree with you on all fronts. Thank you.
ooh, that RooAIDJ looks super useful, very very much looking forward to finding out more, thanks
great reflections and amble John! thanks for the overview on Munich as I hope to go sometime!
John, what an amazing video! I could hear you for hours! I loved what you said about trying things not trying the Sennheisers lol I'm kind of like that lol
An 80000 Euro loudspeaker every once in a while would be fun, but your current focus is spot-on.
Chapters would be nice in such a long video with lots of topics. Nice work
I got to drive a Porsche GT3RS on a track for my bachelor party. That “broke me” in just the same way the über high end headphones would snap my perception of what is possible.
I remember the era when demos were mostly a recording of a garage door slamming.
A long one, but super-funny too John! You covered so much in detail the MHES that have nothing to complain.
You focused on noise, slamming doors, uber-hiend, demonstration music, high volumes (both SPL and speaker sizes) - all that caught also my attention even in humble shows here in Athens!
Personally, don't have an objection for you to review uber-high end, because I am sure that the result won't be full of b/s or snob. We will be able to know some useful info from some appliances we dream but believe in the near future will reach us through more affordable incarnations.
In the end, even LP-video, it wasn't fatiguing at all, a pure joy.
Now, some products I wanna see here (maybe already on your list): Musical Fidelity A1, the new Naim 50 'shoebox, Hifi ROSE stuff, Elac Debut ConneX DCB41.
P.S.: I see you found this little magic box of yours at Audiophonics. I love these guys! I 've just bought HPA-S400ET, a Purifi-Power amp (2x400W@4 Ohm, ~1500 euros!!!) and it is stunning! Really good stuff!
I agree wholeheartedly with your comments on HiFi show music choice. Apart from in the 1980s, where every HiFi dealer seemed to play Dire Straits and not much else, I have never entered a demo room and recognised the music or the artist. Nearly always a female jazz singer or something that just shows off the dynamic of the system - stuff that would never be a choice form me to play at home! I even wonder whether the more expensive the system, the more it 'pushes' you towards a certain kind of (well-recorded) music!
Audiophiles are not interested in music. Only the equipment. 😅
They play music from small groups so you don't know if the speaker is any good unless you bring your own music. They like small woofers and no midrange, so they're not selling high fideity - in my opinion unless you get into the big bucks.
What a great video- I’ve always felt one of John’s greatest strengths is being able to talk at length about any topic in a way that’s engaging but also *approachable*.
I wouldn’t have interest in attending one of these shows myself (would just feel overwhelmed), but I found this to be a very enjoyable 40 mins. Thanks!
You do realize a million dollar house is not much these days. Have you checked the MEDIAN house price in Melbourne or Sydney recently.
Indeed, it is true that the exhibition venue can be quite noisy. However, this is a common occurrence at almost all audio exhibitions around the world, unless the event is poorly attended. So, it is something that one must get accustomed to.🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Hi John, you should of visited the Montreal or even the Toronto hifi shows, there a lot smaller and more intimate. All the big players are there plus a few niche companies like Angela-Gilbert (formally Blue Circle). They even have a basement where they sell used vinyl. A lot more laid back. Montreal is very much a European city in North America with many great audio companies like Totem, Verity, PSB and lately the Billy Amp. You should come and relax. All the best
It is such a pleasure to listen to your reasoning, you did talk a lot but... i watched till the end. And your attitude toward unaffordable opulence is perfect. Good luck with the noice...
I also suggest that the HiFI industry is a harbinger of the global market: manufacturers are chasing the 0.1-1.0% of earners at the expense of everyone else. Btw those large speakers need large rooms and no $1M house in US cities like DC, Boston, NYC, Seattle, San Francisco, etc. is large enough to accommodate such speakers. More like $2M or more required.
Great summary of Munich. I went with a mate this year after quite a few years of the Bristol show. Was quite amazing - vast and somewhat overwhelming. We arrived at about 10:30am on the Saturday and so many dream systems to listen to, but as you say the music being played was definitely not my taste either. My mate and I call it ‘yuppie jazz’. Lasted till 4pm but with very many rooms left unvisited we just couldn’t take any more of that music I’m afraid. Have always found Harbeth particularly bad for their show tunes. Would love to hear a pair playing some recognisable music but instead have been driven from their rooms (Bristol and Munich) within a few minutes with burning earache! Oh well, maybe one day. Really enjoyed the Lyngdorf room and the little JBL 4305p were quite amazing at the affordable end of the spectrum!
Late to the party because my bank holiday treat was John Fogerty celebrating getting the tights to hos songs back. Wall to wall bangers.
Short scale guitars: I'm loving my Sterling Cutlass SSSH. Great little guitar and so comfortable
The Roon GPT thing is interesting. Please cover Sonic Sage within Plexamp too. Very similar functionality (from the short video) and equally groundbreaking. It was initially tied to Tidal, but the last release opened it to local libraries. I've been using it, and showing it off to people.
Agreed!
Wow, interesting analysis !! Waiting for your take on the Lintons!! Bill from Northeastern France !!
John I am envious for your conversation with this legend of an inventor and pioneer. When he says this ADC is good, it is good ❤
Plexamp has a "sonic sage" in its settings that allows you to use chat gpt4 for your music along with tidal. I haven't tried it but it looks like something you would like and could probably make a video about.
I'd love to see the expensive, high-end speakers just for the fun of watching! Go for it.
Great video. Totally agree with you John. There is no point to review 50k speakers and gear. Of course Coltrane by Martens are so great but 1 to 10k people could buy it. Love your work 📻!
I think there are two music listening use cases- active listening in a fixed set up and the other is one where you want DJ mixing in a dynamic way in many locations.
You have allways had ok videos and good reviews but after this video my respect for you channel rise up by a factor of 10 👌 Great that you have the princips on what you do !
I’m watching this with Lintons, and you’re on the screen with Lintons. 😂
I have to say this isn't just a Munich High-End....I went to a local show (Southwest Audio Fest), and it felt so out of time with what they were selling, what music played to audition the speakers...and there were so many high end rooms that were just boomy as hell because of the rooms.
My Future-Fi highlight of the show were the Cabasse Rialto. Interesting alternative to the KEF LS50 Wireless II. Currently in the process of getting a pair for my desk setup.
Those audio convention "sound rooms" you referenced ... I first encountered those at CEDIA in 2000.
The physics/acoustic attributes are outstanding as a baseline.
They're essentially a low pass filter ... which is very much needed in any room. Even high performance residential listening room don't possess the ability to lower the LF decay times like those pre-fab sound rooms.
However pulling the LF energy out of the room, introduces it to the adjacent public spaces, ... oftentimes into the next sound room over.
Some simple scattering/diffusion on the sidewalls, retains some liveliness to the experience.
For an exhibitor, they're quite expensive, plus HVAC, power, lighting, etc.
I would like for you to occasionally cover ultra-high end; it’s fun to get a peek at what we’re missing and explore diminishing returns. Thanks.
Excellent video. Thanks for sharing. 🎶😎
Just a comment on Hifi Rose, and especially the RS150B. I was sceptic until I listened to one and touched one. It sounds really good, that was enough to buy one, and with the touchscreen and the user friendly app I fell in love with it. And the digital VU-meters 😍. I have had tons of hifi but never been ”in love” like this.
It might be fun to see really high end speakers but I just bought a pair of B&W 702’s and I can’t see any reason to spend more than that
I watched and continue to watch your channel because I relate. I listen on a system that is worth around $15K and will play in this space maybe nudging up to 20k total and I get great joy listening to songs like I did the other night like Band of Horses, ‘Is there a ghost’ and Sufjan Stevens ‘Chicago’ and songs wide and varied in that niche. So thanks for continuing to play in this space both musically and with hi fi
I also went to this years High End.
So many brands were missing this year, I was very disappointed. I was trying to show my mum more Kef Speakers, but GP Acustics was missing, D&M I also could not find.
As John is talking about all the expansive setups that were shown this year, most affordable brands simply did not come.
Also most demos are simply too loud.
On the topic of overexpensive gear, yes please review, but make it a condition that you also get a product from their line which is downscaled to your prefered price range!
I enjoy your JOY. You are passionate about your experience there in Germany.
Well done John, how right you are. One of your very best videos to date.
E1DA is chinese company but its run by and engineered a Russian engineer living in shenzehn by the name of Ivan Khlyupin, E1 is a play on his name Ivan when you sound it out phonetically in english. Da is just dah in russian which is just "yes". Hes been making incredible DACs for years now looking forward to seeing his new amp and complete ADC set. The software side of things needs some help but he's a wizard in hardware!
I went for public opening, what stood out in live listening (with in reach) was the tannoy vintage, focal and the lyndorf 3400 with cue100 speakers, they had the most emotional presentation, honestly live they were fantastic, biggest surprise. Even saw Peter lyndorf in person in the demo room.,
Been waiting for this awesome video for the longest of time
great video, keep on doing that format!🥰🥰
That app sounds cool for those who are playlist people. I am not one of those. I am an album person. What I would use it for is reminding me of songs I had forgotten about from past years. Thanks again.
The reason most high end stereo shows and high end stores play things like jazz, classical and opera is because it is simple. It is uncomplicated music that allows the driver to play the notes as perfectly controlled as the driver can. You seldom hear them playing things like Gotye - Somebody That I Used To Know, because it is a complex piece of music that will highlight any flaws like smearing in the speakers. You have two different competing voice played over the top of each other, this is a nightmare for driver cone control. That is why when I audition equipment I take an assortment of music that I am well familiar with.
Please cover opulent equipment but do comparisons with much more affordable equipment so we can see whether or not the expensive is obvious.
In another way a great and true review about the HighEnd last week! 😁Thank you!
I would also appreciate higher end reviews not necessarily super expensive but certainly going up the level
Fantastic John !
I just subscribed to Plex(Amp) today for the lifetime subscription and at first it was a bit fiddly trying to figure out what to download and where to download it to. Then my PC went bonkers (not related to Plex) and I had to do a system restore which wiped my core connection with Plex. I was finally able to get it all sorted, and I am loving it very much! I actually prefer using Plexamp over Roon Arc because for me, it's interface seems to be more logical to use for me at least and I have had a blast setting it up with my system. So I wanted to thank you for introducing me to this service and I am very happy with it. Great video as always and I look forward to seeing your next one very soon. Cheers!
Please evaluate the Linton’s with the grills on, thank you.
Roon/Extension/ChatGPT/Amazing… thank you for sharing your experience, spot on!
Excellent reportage !
I would like to see you do a video that explores the Wilson audio version of a proper speaker setup with the correct time alignment. I heard this first hand once and was a real treat
Would love to see you review super expensive speakers and equipment, even just for fun or for comparisons alone
Hi John, Please cover more expensive equipment that is either future-fi or relevant to your channel. Thanks!