Can I get This Broken Bolt Out Of This Bushing?
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- Опубліковано 10 лют 2024
- Can I get This Broken Bolt Out Of This Bushing?
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Please comment, was it a waste of time trying to remove this broken bolt?
What's a new part cost?
Yes! Why waste time and money on a new part if you can reuse the original part!
Since you can't get the new part at this time, you really don't have a choice, so no. Seeing how easy a drill bit chewed through that bolt tells us why they break so easily.
Yes, because it was a self-tapping screw. They pretty much 'become one' with the parent metal of the bushing.
@@percyfaith11 Less than $25 USD...p.s., My Mom loved Percy Faith ...Moon River : )
Many parts like that are made from powdered metal which will not expand with heat like a piece of steel or cast iron would.
I too have had very little success with E-Z Outs. For something like this that is so easily clamped in a drill press, I measure one of the bolts to determine the inside diameter of the threads and use a drill just under that diameter to drill out the broken bolt. If you are lucky enough to drill right thru the center, you can just use a pick or tweezers to remove the bolt threads remaining. This works well when you can utilize a drill press as it is too difficult to drill an accurate hole with a hand drill. Sometimes just pounding on the flange near the broken bolt will help break the bond from corrosion. There is a mechanics' law that assures bolts will always break at the most inconvenient time. Drilling the holes and using nuts and bolts is definitely the way to go. A little never seize might help avoid future problems if you do manage to remove the broken bolt. I really enjoy your channel, can't count how many times you have helped me solve some problem. Thank you.
That is a time to use anti size on this matter of keeping the bolts from breaking
The quick, easy, and simple method works. That is the one to use. Time is precious and costly these days.
Nice work. I usually drill them out like you did, If necessary I will tap it one size larger. Thanks for the video.
Just want to say thank you for having a nice intro to all your videos. You are one of the few that don't burst my ear drums.. keep up the good content
The exact reason I anti seized all of my outdoor power equipment years ago. It takes some time but pays off in the end.
Most of this cases (broken bolts) in my life end up similar to this ;) Thanks for sharing the reality!
My experience is that threaded inserts are the way to go if you have to have threads in part. Works well in snowmobile cross shafts, seems dissimilar metals aluminum to steel bolts are always a problem. Thanks for all the videos Donny they really helped me
Another great DIY video!
There is always a few broken bolts that you are trying to extract and will get ya because they don't budge. I usually have good success welding a nut that is slightly smaller centered on the broken bolt and using a wrench/ratchet to extract it. That method is not guaranteed either but your plan B fix is awesome sir..Well done my friend.
I love your deadpan, "that's insane".
Great fix. 'Keep it simple, stupid' method.
Awesome! That's a Permanent & Better Fix!
Thank you Donyboy for sharing your tips on removing or drilling out a broken bolt. Awesome job sir. 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
It's never a waste of time to share your experience and talent with the rest of us Dony. You have a gift when it comes to repairing small engine equipment and sharing your incredible experience shows how much you care not only about your customers but the people like myself who enjoy watching your videos. 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you, Don. That is the exact issue that I have with a Ariens snowblower! I saw that the bushings were on back order! Now I can repair the unit without waiting for the new bushings! Thank you very much! You just saved me some money!
You can do it right on the machine!
@@donyboy73I did that on my machine last year, the only difference is I’m used a nylon lock nut. It’s so disappointing ariens doesn’t never seize things. My machine new was $2100 and no never seize on any bold or nut, no never seize or grease an the axles.
jeeeze i paiod 2600 and that was with 150 off@@hoover1412
If one has experience with that particular type of bushing (multiple attempts with that brand in the past) I agree it’s a waste of time. But, it seems that broken bolts in almost any piece of equipment is a challenge. A great deal of effort and time is required unless you’re trying to save a part that is nearly irreplaceable. Another excellent video!!
Thank you for your show
Thanks for your time and energy making this video.
GREAT video. Many thanks!!!
thanks for the info
I think part of the issue is the bolt and the bushing are dissimilar metals - not unlike trying to remove a broken steel bolt from a riding lawnmower's aluminum deck spindle. I have occasionally been successful removing broken bolts from deck spindles, but, like your video, I usually end up drilling them out and just using a nut and bolt.
Regarding it being a waste of time, it depends on the amount of time you have - if you're working in a shop like you are, then yes. If you have nothing better to do, why not try all available options before just drilling it out?
Must be!
I've never had much sucess with those type of extractors, I find the taper on them "forces" the bolt to expand outwards, compounding your issue. I have a set of Rothenberger splined parallel extractors that work much better (same as Snap On/Blue Point ?)
I would have tried drilling it with a normal drill from the back side first, sometimes the drill "catches" and pushes them through, but you cant beat a welded on washer and nut like someone else mentioned ?
Excellent video, thank you!
Dony
You may have softened your extractor by running it into a super hot part like that
Try soaking part in acetone for 10 min first
And rock back and forth if you can
There are sooo many ways free bolts
Great vid as usual
Good work Don, yours is the logical method to do this.
Very interesting thank you for the video
Fantastic video! Gives folks a better understanding of the job it takes to fix things!✌✌😎😎
Screw and nut is unbeatable
Thanks Dony
Thanks for the video and the advice, especially seeing I own an Ariens snowblower. Keep up your great work. It is appreciated.
TY for Sharing
Good video. 👍
Hi Dony, I believe that is sintered metal which is powerded heated super hot and stamped it's very hard and won't act like a normal metal.
I have had SOME luck with left handed drill bits.
The bolt method is the way to go!!
Great video Dony 👍
As I mentioned before, best way to remove that broken bolt is to weld a washer on it first and then a nut to the washer. Makes welding much easier than trying to go through the hole in the nut.
Don’t forget when you try to loosen it very slight back-and-forth movements with penetrating spray.
If it’s below flush , just put dots of weld on the end until high enough to weld the washer onto it. I’ve done this for years.
P.S. if you heat it red hot like that, put it under cold water first and cool the touch.
I would love to talk to you about this.
I did same tecnique as yours and never failed once
If it's below flush I cut a stub of copper pipe and put it in the hole to protect the threads and then weld as normally. You used to be able to get stick electrodes called xtractalloy which were fantastic for broken bolts below flush, but Lawson doesn't like selling to individuals, so unless you know someone with an account, good luck getting a hold of them.
Not everyone has a welder.
@@jamesweber4938 If you regularly work on your own stuff, getting a cheap flux core machine is absolutely worth it. It's like the day you step up from a 6-in-1 screwdriver and crescent wrench to a real socket set. Whole new worlds of possibilities open up to you.
Best thing to do there is to remove the bolts when new or later on and put never-seize on the threads and reassemble.
Din,
Great fix and video - thank you.
It seems the new replacement parts come _unthreaded._ Perhaps the factory parts were the same and they used self tapping bolts - which seized and broke. All to save the cost of 6 nuts.
Paul (in MA)
Logical.
👍👍👍.Thank you
Drill it out completely, re tap with new threads.
Haven't had much luck either , good video.
Good video. Somewhat surprising that removal failed. I had a similar experience and reasoned that the screw had become part of the metal and re-tapped it to original thread. It worked.
If you don't have access to a new part definitely worth the time. I don't think I've ever gotten a rusted bolt out with an "E Z Out". I would have drilled the broken bolt with gradually larger bits. When I see the tops of the threads of the bushing I'd stop the larger bits and use a chisel that I've modified to go right down the hole using plenty of penetrating oil. Because I never quite go down the middle of the bolt when I drilled it, I would start chiseling kind of the medium thick part of the bolt and peel the metal away from the threads like a shear. Usually it would come out as a curl and the rusted bolt would relent. Chase the treads with a tap and use a new bolt. If you try an E Z Out and it doesn't work, you can still use this drill out process. I'm pretty sure that's how I found this method. Thanks Dony.
As for your fix in the end I would have to say, it was a waste of time. But I like to challenge myself sometimes and try to remove broken bolts anyway. On occasion if I can drill dead center of the broken bolt, I drill it out to the minor diameter of the thread size, then run a tap through. At this point you are just removing a small amount of metal with the tap.
Chineezzium ungraded bolts that actually cut the tread in the bushing hole . That's why the bolt looks a bit triangular (as I'm sure you know) , I had 3 of the 6 (both sides) break on me did exactly what you did . 😂 cheers man . Keep on keeping on.
It was a good video for teaching us, but sometimes the quick and easy way is the best way.
That’s one fancy new vice you have there you city boys got the good stuff all the time .
Heating and quenching may have hardened the bolt by what looks like the extractor not biting into it anymore. I appreciate you taking your time to educate us.
You did fine , Its never a waist if someone ask you to fix it , and they know its on back order . I would of drilled it and tap it just me .
Most of the time i usually just drill straight through and put a nut and bolt but i have some good luck with extracting a broken bolt
I have found that when the hole and threads go all the way through I have been able to use a right hand drill and it usually grabs and the bolt will go straight through.
I have a complete set of left-handed, carbide drill bits and I would have tried stepping up to the next larger drill bits.
When you turned the part around, you were actually tightening the bolt by using a left-handed drill bit. Think about it!
I think this summer I’ll buy parts for my snowblower that are the most common required and could be needed in the future. Ie: belts, bushings, friction disk, cables, sheer pins, etc. A list of these most common parts would be awesome. They’ll never lose value and will be added value if I’ll sell my snowblower. Might be overkill but I’d hate to need a part and find out there’s a minimum 3 week wait.
Can't go wrong with that!
Soaking in cold water while red hot can actually harden the broken stud and render it impossible for and EZee out to bite in to it. I was wondering why you didn't drill from the end of the stud which
already had a Centre in it. Great fix.
There's a.few other options which I may consider :-
1. Drill the hole out slightly undersized then run a thread tap through the thread to see if the thread cleans up or go to option 2.
2. Drill it out then tap the hole out to accept a helicoil of the same bolt size.& Pitch
3. If you don't mind being a bit bodgy then drill & tap the hole out oversized then fit a bigger bolt
4. This might not be economically viable in a business but weld the hole up then machine or grind the weld down then re tap the thread back out to its original size if it's made out of billet steel,I am not sure how welding cast steel would affect its strength.
I wouldn't go as far as fitting a Time sert because they might cost more than the part is worth but Helicoils are much cheaper than them so they might be economically viable to use !
It's worth it especially if the parts are unavailable and or you need your equipment TODAY! And the thru bolt won't work on every application.Hell yeah 👍
At the end of the day email Ariens with the customer's address and tell them how much you charged. Suggest they reimburse. They should have put out a bulletin to anti seize.
I have retapped many of them and is the easiest way to do the job but I do like your approach
I'm surprised the old bolt drilled out so easily. I agree my dad always used to sat nothing beats a nut and a bolt.
I have never had much success with spiral extractors - I have had luck with square extractors and or using a drill press to drill out the bolt to its original tap size and then picking out the bolts treads / cleaning the threads with a tap.
I am only a grain of sand on this planet! Still I believe you were turning the extractor in the wrong direction, for it would have gone out the other side since that side was open.
On a couple of occasions I've had success with freezing the part, metals expand at different rates, they contract at different rates. 30 minutes in the freezer will tell the tail. The bolt and nut solution works. Once tightened, weld the nut in place.
Mine broke. Rather than take apart the auger to get to the bushing, I drilled out the broken bolt and put a stainless bolt and nut through it. Works great.
I've almost never had any luck with drilling and using an EZ-out extractor. Left handed drill bits work fine if the bolt is loose to begin with. My go-to method is to TIG weld a nut onto the broken bolt. It can be done even if the bolt is broken off below flush. Using TIG, I have a better than 90% chance of getting the broken bolt out. You can also drill it out with high precision on the Bridgeport mill. I know it's faster and more practical to use a bolt in this case. A lot of work I do is on antique equipment where there is no chance of getting a replacement part.
A needle point tungsten carbide bit on a dremel pen can be used to slice it in two so you can pick it out. It will leave a groove in the thread though. Also if you can get a starting point on the thread and it's thin enough, you can chase it out with a tap.
Looks like the heat was going to muck up your extractors.
If you know what the thread is then it’s worth a try to put a tapping drill through if you have your hole in the centre.
You can either pick out what’s left of the old bolt from the thread or run an actual tap through to clear it out.
Your right though it starts to become a “Special Project” rather than actually being worth the trouble.
grouse as video there Donny mate and from my view that,s not at all a waste of time video to watch when saving the original part for sure and yep from my view that old bolt had to be seized in the threads for sure from my view and luckily a nut and a bolt is a good idea in your case for sure compared to the original factory design on those units for sure on that snowblower and cheers from Australia 🐨🐑🦘🌴🇦🇺 to your area in Canada Ontario 🇨🇦 🍁 and i hope your Winter/Flu season over there is going ok too.
there's a machine called an edm that will burn out a broken tap , extractor , etc . w/out damaging threads . probably expensive , and certainly not needed here , but on a rare or expensive part , it might be worth having it done .
You could use an EZ out. I have used them all the time
FOR PENETRATING FLUID TRY EQUAL PARTS ACETONE TO AUTOMATIC TRANSMISSION FLUID WORKS GREAT,,,THAT WAS A TIP FROM STEVES SMALL ENGINE SALOON IT WORKS GREAT ON RUSTY BOLTS 😁👍
Galvanic action by disimilar metals is a different animal.
I used an oil to put on after heating different parts. Never tried on that part. Have you tried drilling with tap drill and retapping?
You could but the bolt nut method is better in my opinion.
I almost thought that when you drilled it out you could put a helicoil in it but that may just weaken it and this solution is the Occam's Razor to mine anyway (KISS rule).
Same exact thing happened on my 2017 ariens platinum, the bolt backed out and stripped the threads. I was going to retap it and use a bold but opted for a bold with a nut because it’s a better connection
I’ve gone through most of my machine and never seized everything I could to avoid the issue in the future
You will not regret spending the time to anti seize threaded fasteners. It may be the smartest thing you’ve done this week!
@@37yearsofanythingisenough39 especially the cutting edge, said shoes and belly pan, those bolts are the ones most likely to rust and fuse in there
Would it have been easier to drill it out with the proper sized drill bit and re-tap it? I've done it before with good results.
Either way works but I prefer the bolt nut method!
Parts like that bushing are made from powdered metal, heated and pressed at high preasure. These type of parts are often refered to as "Pressings", and not as "castings", I would not have heated the bushing for fear of weakening the metal. I would have chosen to drill the broken bolt out and through bolted it (as your final choice). You could also choose to use a helicoil insert. Shop labor to save a $15 part has to be a major consideration.
I really enjoy your video's. You give lots of useful inormation (for those of us inclined to 'Fix or Repair' rather than discard and buy new.)
Great video if you’re careful when I’ve done before you can put a heel coil in there and it works just fine but your fix seem to work👍
Helicoil
This reminds me of the Roberta Flack song
Killing me softly with his song"
I have NEVER had an incident like this where the extractor worked. Have done the exact thing as you did. I find that if the bolt is stuck so bad it twisted off then save the tome and stress. Just drill it out and tapp it over.
Good example is that small bolt that holds the muffler bracket on the top (cylinder head)of the tecumseh engine . 1 time it came out, ok.
Thanks
What I find is, once you heat it up and try using your extractor, you ruin your extractor.
Been down this road exactly.....in this case, I drill out carefully in increments until I can pass through the correct chase tap. On that type of metal, the heating process never works. There's enough meat.....I like your idea of drilling out and using a nut/bolt combo.
In a similar ordeal, I recently used a drill/tap combination bit and solved the issue in one single move. Anyway, just as you said, I never met success with extractor bolts unless the broken bolt was loose which is rather rare. Regards !
I always drill them out I've never been able to get a spiral extractor to work
I had a broken bolt in a tractor mower deck blade spindle which I could not get out with an extractor bit. I drilled it out with the size bit for a 4x24 or 4x32 tap (whichever it was), tapped new threads and used a new bolt. It was a little off center, so I widened the deck hole on that side. I marked which was the repaired threads on the spindle so it will be easily identified if I ever have to take it off again. Now I see that I could have used a bolt and nut, but this worked for me. I'll do it your way if I ever run into this again. Thanks, Don.
Question: Could you have just tapped new threads? And maybe some Anti-Seize on the bolt threads and the bushing and nut threads would prevent locking up again. I use it one most everything now, thanks to you.
I've had some luck drilling out tap size of hole and then cutting new threads with tap. Tap basically removes remainder of bolt. I almost did the full bolt on a spindle . Luckily my threading technique worked as it turned there was no room for a bolt head head between pulley and spindle housing.
What brand of lh drill bits and extractors are you using in the video?
Tapping size drill and re thread with tap is another possibility
Use the tap drill size and it will clean all bolt remnants out. Run the.proper tap to clean it out and your done. 5 mins topps
Why not drill and retap the bolt hole?
Exactly what i was thinking.
I gave up using easyout extractors years ago, I dont think Iv had success with them but tried many times anyway.
there is one other way of doing it, use the right size tap drill #7 for 1/4-20, and then just retap it.
Maintainance item, for good weather, try to remove and give a coat of never seize. I think my Briggs has the same setup
Have not drilled out broken bolts in 20 plus years of repairs. I use the weld a nut method even when they are below the surface mig or tig depending on the situation. I don't even own extractors.
Your Traxxas Slash needs some TLC?!
One thing to try in a case like this, where there is easy access to the part, is to put the part on your anvil and hit it on the opposite side of the broken bolt with a sledge hammer. That will release the binding in the threads. And you can then try to drill it out.
In the end though, drilling straight through might be the best solution. Next time the bolt can break if it wishes, but you just put another one in.
Those manufacturer's bolts were way too soft. You could see how soft they were when you drilled them. Good video.
...great effort to remove that broken bolt Don....tell me, by heating like you did and dunking in cold water,
does that change the properties of the metal and make it more brittle and therefore more likely to break?
.....thanks for the video and keep 'em coming..... :)
oh yes it does
Thanks for the details on what can be done to try and extract them. One question......wouldn't anti seize compound be a good idea to add when reinstalling the "bolt fix"?
Yes anti-seize is a must!
With it all the way through wonder if RH would have been a choice.
Have you ever drilled, heat ,coat with crayon in threads. Then use extractor kit? Saw this method on engine parts.