@@pyxelm which character was that? I've only watched Torchwood all the way through once and then Cyberwoman again to wonder how Chibnall went from that and Day One to Ascension of the Cybermen and The Timeless Children.
Can we talk about how on point Tenant’s hair was in this episode? Not only does it look cool, but it’s an Elvis-style pompadour, because that’s who they initially set out to see
The funniest thing in this episode is when the doctor says " I know you can't wrap your hand around your elbow and make your fingers meet." When being interrogated by the inspector and the hunchman behind him tires it. It's so small but so funny
I actually didn’t like that Tommy decided to go to his father. It makes sense that Rose still has those issues and overlooks what he did but he was a toxic presence and needs at least a while to reflect before he could start integrating again. Tommy going to him seconds after he gets kicked out makes it fall flat.
Sadly in a lot of toxic/abusive relationships the onus for change is put on the victim. I realize this episode didn't have enough space to really focus on this and the ending didn't leave room for a deep view of abusive relationships, but the topic deserves more than this pat v ending.
Tommy wasn't forgiving him or asking him to come back, it was just talking before he leaves, which means only being separated on a much more positive circumstances. (if you had actually watched the scene, you would notice that Tommy took the bag from his Dad, but didn't come back and just continued walking, meaning he didn't want to dad to come back, but just wanted to help) stop misunderstanding the scenarios
It’s always strange when a tv show does an episode in which a monster is using a tv to kill people (or similar), playing on the general fear (or distrust of tv. The message is that TV is bad, yet the makers obviously don’t want you to take that seriously otherwise you would stop watching and they would be out of business. Which makes me think it’s ironic, making fun of the people who say that tv is bad. And ultimately tv is not the villain it’s how it’s used.
It's even weirder in the context of the primordial British TV programmes of the 1950s - one channel, and even that not broadcasting 24/7, totally non-commercial, and with an obvious public-service imperative. "TV is evil" makes more sense in the context, of say, the American cable explosion of the 90s.
The ending where Rose asks Tommy to go to his dad makes me so mad. You don't just tell someone to go back to someone who made their life worse, even if they're family.
Yeah as someone who grew up in that environment I can tell you that made me really mad. Teaching people that the most virtuous thing you can do is forgive someone makes them liable to continuesly endure abuse and enable their abusers behaviour. I hated this moment in the episode.
another claim of ignorants. she didn't ask Tommy to forgive his Dad or make him return. it was just talking before he leaves. maybe if you weren't this much bias, you would notice that Tommy even took his bag, but didn't make him return, just kept walking, meaning he just wanted to help the Dad with the bag, which means just talking and being separated on positive circumstances and no, it doesn't translate in forgiving.
9:38 nope, nope, nope, bad message, you're not obliged to forgive abusive relatives. It's a nice ending on the surface, I'm just really uncomfortable with the message behind it.
He isn't obliged to forgive his abusive father, however the message isn't "forgive all morally wrong people who commit heinous acts". It is, "perhaps sometimes, forgiveness and reconciliation, can be attained or happen". You make it sound or imply that the boy was essentially forced by the Doctor and Rose to forgive him, but he wasn't. The decision was at his own volition and discretion, he still isn't going back to that house, probably in a very long time or never again, however his son at least walks his father to the station, where he would most likely not see him again.
@@AshanBhatoa Forgiveness and reconciliation requires lots of time, by being even a little nice to him *that* soon, the boy is undercutting the consequences of his Dad moving out, so the Dad isn't going to feel the loss and reflect on what he's done. Not to mention he's undercutting the work his mother did by finally being strong enough to get rid of him. And whether he was forced is up for debate, he probably didn't want to be judged by them
Look, I love Who, but it not being a "weird show" goes right out the window in the pilot. "Killer Mannequins" or "Sentient Plastic", neither one says ,"Yeah. This is normal." Lol. I want to be clear, though. I'm glad they did it that way. When that's how you "re-introduce" your show; nothing is off the table. I think it's why I typically don't mind the more "bizarre" episodes. I sat through "sentient plastic" as a villain and said, "Sure, let's see what else you have."
@@richardmorris8902 I don’t mind it neither. But many people reduce it to only being some goofy/stupid show, instead of realizing that it has some fleshed out writing behind it (sometimes). And it’s not easy to convince them with the rather obscure episodes like this one.
Doctor WHo is by definaition a wierd show, this episode is the oposite, its the Kind of Epiosode id show my mother or people who doont like Sci fi in genral
I think this was one of the doctors best episodes that scean where he gives the Dad a dressing down and makes him look at his actions the look on his face where he's like shocked that anyone would talk to him and he has no reply is gold and shows that the doctor is not only a match for monsters from the stars but an everyday hero
There's nothing hopeful nor heartwarming about forgiving an abusive or deadbeat parent. It's a toxic trope written by people who have no idea what they're talking about.
Andrew Halliwell I grew up without a dad, and if I was in Rose’s place I’d say good riddance to the guy. When you’re an abuser, you loose any right to have a relationship with your victims.
I kinda liked The Wire as a villain. Yes she is OTT and camp but it's weirdly chilling to have such a deadly enemy disguised as a prim and proper newswoman. I also kinda liked how Rose was "captured" by The Wire, as it ups the stakes and gives the Doctor more of a reason to stop her. It actually makes her feel like a proper threat. The ideas in this episode could work in a modern sense with smartphones/screens and such too.
Despite people may say this isn't a strong episode I applaud you for words at 10:27 "Just a low stakes episode you could put on during lunch time" which helps make it an acceptable stand-alone episode with less guilt to watch compared to other stand-alone episodes that you may have more of a chore re-watching, if that makes sense. Also a thumbs up for mentioning the Magpie Electricals Easter eggs in future episodes.
I quite liked this episode but I think the ending with the doctor and rose sending Tommy back to a father who is literally physically and psychologically abusive was incredibly confused and damaging.
Is it just me, or did you purposely show Rose looking at the back of a tv at 6:42 whilst describing her as “picking up on the Magpie Electricals *lead* of her own *accord*”? :-D
So you think Rose gaslighting Tommy and encouraging him to stay with an abuser is hopeful and heart-warming? Not impressed. Tommy does not owe his dad anything.
I neither love nor hate this episode. Great characters, forgettable villain. Adore Ten and Rose (together and as individuals) in it, though. And I loved that little bit where initially the DI is standing with Ten sitting, then the roles flip with Ten standing over the DI with "Tell me everything you know"!
I think this is a better episode than people give it credit. But my undying memory will always be my brother's disappointment when Rose turned out to be ok in the end. "Can’t she actually die yet!" He said. We all know she was leaving so he was impatient for her to leave. To this day I’m not certain if he genuinely hated Rose or if he was just excited to see who the new companion would be. 🤷♂️
The whole thing felt a bit surreal in the way it was shot as well, kind of like a villain's lair in the old Batman series. I was kind of expecting a fourth wall break given the episode's context.
I like watching this episode because of the Doctor and Rose stuff, and the setting is pretty unique for Doctor Who too. The Villan is really awful though and brings down a otherwise pretty good episode
I like the episode because I always get way too invested in The Doctor and Rose’s relationship. I’m surprised you didn’t mention the ending where they are so optimistic about their future together, which repeat viewers know is about to come to a crushing end. You did hit the nail on the head though regarding that the episode is only enjoyable in a specific way that ignores the majority of its content.
Rose isn’t independent in series too... Tooth and claw - got everyone out of the chains Girl in the fireplace - went exploring with Mickey Age of steel- went to save Jackie with Pete Idiots lantern - investigated on her own Satin Pit- pulled the crew together and saved them Fear her - saved the doctor Army of Ghosts Doomsday- investigated on her own then faced the Daleks on her own. Not really true is it -_-
This is one of the early episodes I watched of DW and there were 2 moments that I felt were really cool to see as a new viewer. The first was the reveal of the faceless grandmother. I would have been terrified of something like that, but the Doctor went right up to her and probed her face with his sonic. Instead of acting on fear, her acted on curiosity. The second was the Doctor's furious reaction to Rose getting her faced sucked off. I think these two moments cemented my particular view of the Doctor; highly inquisitive and unstoppably fierce.
I think it would actually make for an interesting future episode if they had The Wire manage to break out of the tape into present day & use things like wi-fi, mobile networks and/or the cloud to eat people’s faces as well as the TVs, I know Moffat already did something slightly similar in Bells of Saint John, but it would still in my mind be an interesting take on the technological fears, tropes & conspiracies we have today like people obsessively looking at their phones & social media constantly, not to mention it would up the stakes a bit as The Wire could potentially do it to the whole world at any time instead of just the majority of England watching a once in a lifetime event
9:42 I vehemently disagree here. No one should ever be told to play nice with their abuser, anyone says that you should still be a bit nice to them cause they're your family is talking rubbish. He's not being stubborn he's well within his rights to feel that way. I get that people can be redeemed, but time and distance need to happen before that. This man needs time away from his family so he can reflect on what he lost and feel the consequences. By having the main characters say "go to him" this episode completely torches its themes. It's one of the worst episodes of Dr Who period for me. I think the writer even agrees with me on this cause Gatis years later wrote Crimson Horror, that has a similar set up to this only the woman doesn't forgive her abusive mother. I wonder if he took issue with the ending to this like I did and wanted another go at the subject matter.
The idea of the television stealing a person's face is an old one. Marshal Mcluhan talked about the media of television and all new technology creating a kind of disembodiment, where a person's face, words and even personality lives on in visual media long after the actual individual has died. Numerous of the presenters, so-called experts and various pundits on television have been referred to as 'talking heads' because we often know very little about them other than their faces. Sometimes you can even catch a dog looking down under the television trying to find the feet and legs of the face on the screen. I think this episode started with a good idea that could have been better.
If im honest, despite what you said this is one of the episodes i have always remembered, and i still reference to this day. It might not have been amazing but it was certainly memorable for me. :-)
I can see your issues with the story, but i absolutely love the shots. Especially the one with the doctor and the inspector sitting on a table, where at first the inspector stands, ans while the dynamic shifts, tennant is standing and the inspector isnt. Also, the theme of the episode is control through fear. It is explored in the family, and macpie is the final form. He doesnt need to be characterised more, because the wire took his every possiblity of being himself.
The Wire saying how HUNGRY she is: "I AM TALKING!" Me: *"AND I'M NOT LISTENING!"* I like the episode, just wanted to make a joke cause that one of my fav Tenth Doc lines XD
While it was executed questionably, I appreciate that the family resolution is not a one-dimensional villain being mercilessly cast aside nor a nonsensical last-minute redemption, but an act of kindness toward a man who is still a horrible jackass.
The main issue I have with this episode is the pro-British imperialist elements, which isn't a huge part of the episode but it's still definitely there, and I REALLY don't like the line "We need something to be proud of now that we're losing the Empire", as if the Empire is something to be proud of, and it's never really challenged by the story (it's kind of funny how Series 2's last story has a very obvious metaphor for British Imperialism in the form of Torchwood I mean it's not even subtle) The best part of The Idiots Lantern is definitely how it depicted abusive relationships, that part was really well done. Everything else though? Yeah unfortunately it's not really worth it.
i havent watched this epiosode in years, but did anyone else notice the video tape that the wire is trapped inside has gallifreyian letters on it? at 8:53 you can see them scribbled out
This episode was the first time I ever heard the term "Detective Inspector". Seems such a redundant title made up of 2 exact synonyms, along the lines of "Teacher Instructor" or "Writer Author".
This and Fear Her were the only two episodes of this series I had to force myself to watch all the way through. No joke, even Love & Monsters had at least some appealing quality to it. And everyone knows why Fear Her is considered bland. This one is also a chore. There is no mystery since you know who the villain is and who works for them from the first few minutes of the episode. There's no suspense because the moment Rose gets defaced you know that they're gonna revert everything back to normal before it ends. The dialogue is also pretty uninspired and the message is on the nose and very dated. Also it wasn't really that original even back when it came out.
I remember being terrified of this episode as a child. The blank faces terrified me. I remember my mum coming into my room at one point and me asking her to turn on the light so I knew she had a face.
I always found the ending very strange seeing it more is the doctor and Rose sending the kid back to his abusive dad I don’t know that’s just how I see it and from that angle it looks a bit strange
I was definitely told that! I was also told a lot of weird things. If "the wind changed" while I was pulling a face, it would get stuck that way (which from about six I realised made no sense if I was indoors). Eating the crusts of my sandwiches would "put hairs on my chest" (which, as a prepubescent boy, I thought was disgusting).
Idiots Lantern has fragments of nice concepts and characters that have been submerged in meh. It's so annoying watching episodes with do much potential but then it's squandered.
I quite like this one. It may not be very original and it does have its problems but I think much like The Long Game and The Lazarus Experiment, it's a fairly traditional and bog-standard episode. It's not aiming to be anything more than just a way to keep the audience entertained for 45 minutes. I do enjoy Euros Lyn's direction, the idea to use a lot of Dutch angles does help create a sense of unease and tension. The faceless people are a fairly creepy idea, and I do quite like the Wire during the first half, especially the way Maureen Lipman gels a cheery motherly attitude with the dark and horrifying things she does. I'm not too keen on her in the second half, where she just spends the second half shouting "FEEED MEEEE!" like a petulant toddler. The family drama is fairly decent and helps lend the episode some emotional weight, although the scene where Rose persuades Tommy to go to his father does leave a bad taste in my mouth (Council of Geeks' review sums it up pretty well). I enjoy Tennant's more unhinged and angry performance in this story, and it's great to see Rose take more of an initiative and act in a more Doctor-y role, something we see a lot of in the second half of this series. Maybe I'm somewhat biased towards this episode since it actually takes place not that far from where I lived as a child (Muswell Hill), but The Idiot's Lantern is a story that I enjoy in spite of its many many flaws
I agree on this being a low stake episode and yet they had the opportunity to make it into a great stakes episode, when you realise that 27 million people in the UK and millions more across the world watched Elizabeth the second's coronation but they focus in a single family, imagine the power the wire would have with that amount of people
I wasn't told that watching too much tv gave you square eyes when I was young. But, I was told that using a computer too much would give you square eyes, so... yep
And then you get me who only watches this for the music hah, sadly the music used in this episode is not part of the Soundtrack (OST) That you can listen to or buy which is a massive shame, the song that plays during the climax (the build up to trapping the wire) is one of my favorite bits of music in the entirety of Doctor Who and just like many films, it is the Music that brings it ot life.
I enjoyed this at the time. But afterwards, watched Sapphire and Steel for the first time in 30 years. It struck me that a lot of the RTD era featured stories and ideas that were more reminiscent of the latter. This story is one. It would work out almost exactly the same with the celestial agents, or whateve they were, investigating. A few tweaks would be all that was needed. "Fear Her" is another that with only a few changes would make a S&S style story. Goodness only knows what show "Love and Monsters" would be more suited to though.
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The bit I like most in this episode is the bit where that veteran dad is like. I am TALKING and then the doctor says AND IM NOT LISTENING!
IM NOT LISTENIN-GAH
@@princessjuleit 😂😂😂😂😂😂
Fun fact, the actor of Tommy later went on to voice a young Davros in Innocence (first audio story of Big Finish's I, Davros series).
He now runs a successful football UA-cam channel
i think i recognise the girl who played Jasmine Pierce from torchwood
@@pyxelm which character was that? I've only watched Torchwood all the way through once and then Cyberwoman again to wonder how Chibnall went from that and Day One to Ascension of the Cybermen and The Timeless Children.
Jedi Spartan 38 The little girl from the fairy episode.
Mental_Toast RORY
Can we talk about how on point Tenant’s hair was in this episode? Not only does it look cool, but it’s an Elvis-style pompadour, because that’s who they initially set out to see
The funniest thing in this episode is when the doctor says " I know you can't wrap your hand around your elbow and make your fingers meet." When being interrogated by the inspector and the hunchman behind him tires it. It's so small but so funny
I actually didn’t like that Tommy decided to go to his father. It makes sense that Rose still has those issues and overlooks what he did but he was a toxic presence and needs at least a while to reflect before he could start integrating again. Tommy going to him seconds after he gets kicked out makes it fall flat.
Sadly in a lot of toxic/abusive relationships the onus for change is put on the victim. I realize this episode didn't have enough space to really focus on this and the ending didn't leave room for a deep view of abusive relationships, but the topic deserves more than this pat v ending.
@@NeilBlumengarten Absolutely correct
Tommy wasn't forgiving him or asking him to come back, it was just talking before he leaves, which means only being separated on a much more positive circumstances. (if you had actually watched the scene, you would notice that Tommy took the bag from his Dad, but didn't come back and just continued walking, meaning he didn't want to dad to come back, but just wanted to help) stop misunderstanding the scenarios
It’s always strange when a tv show does an episode in which a monster is using a tv to kill people (or similar), playing on the general fear (or distrust of tv. The message is that TV is bad, yet the makers obviously don’t want you to take that seriously otherwise you would stop watching and they would be out of business. Which makes me think it’s ironic, making fun of the people who say that tv is bad. And ultimately tv is not the villain it’s how it’s used.
It's even weirder in the context of the primordial British TV programmes of the 1950s - one channel, and even that not broadcasting 24/7, totally non-commercial, and with an obvious public-service imperative. "TV is evil" makes more sense in the context, of say, the American cable explosion of the 90s.
)
The wire is the type of villain, where everyone thinks it'd be a terrible idea to bring them back, and then the episode is one of the best.....
The TARDIS takes them somewhere different....England....again.
They always go to England!
Because it is an English show and they want to save MONEH
hey, they go to cardiff quite a lot in season 1 and 2
@@grimmestreaper2707 They need a plan.
First Half of Season 6 was set in America
The ending where Rose asks Tommy to go to his dad makes me so mad. You don't just tell someone to go back to someone who made their life worse, even if they're family.
Yeah as someone who grew up in that environment I can tell you that made me really mad. Teaching people that the most virtuous thing you can do is forgive someone makes them liable to continuesly endure abuse and enable their abusers behaviour. I hated this moment in the episode.
As someone who was raised by abusive parents, I agree with you 1000%
@@chloemcdermott3293*exactly!*
It makes sense for Roses character with her growing up without a Dad.
another claim of ignorants.
she didn't ask Tommy to forgive his Dad or make him return. it was just talking before he leaves. maybe if you weren't this much bias, you would notice that Tommy even took his bag, but didn't make him return, just kept walking, meaning he just wanted to help the Dad with the bag, which means just talking and being separated on positive circumstances and no, it doesn't translate in forgiving.
9:38 nope, nope, nope, bad message, you're not obliged to forgive abusive relatives.
It's a nice ending on the surface, I'm just really uncomfortable with the message behind it.
He isn't obliged to forgive his abusive father, however the message isn't "forgive all morally wrong people who commit heinous acts". It is, "perhaps sometimes, forgiveness and reconciliation, can be attained or happen". You make it sound or imply that the boy was essentially forced by the Doctor and Rose to forgive him, but he wasn't. The decision was at his own volition and discretion, he still isn't going back to that house, probably in a very long time or never again, however his son at least walks his father to the station, where he would most likely not see him again.
@@AshanBhatoa - but Rose talked him into it, as though to suggest that Tom's original decision to leave him was wrong.
@@nightowl8477 which is entirely in character for Rose.
@@AndrewHalliwell - it doesn't matter if it's in-character or not, it's a terrible, terrible message.
@@AshanBhatoa Forgiveness and reconciliation requires lots of time, by being even a little nice to him *that* soon, the boy is undercutting the consequences of his Dad moving out, so the Dad isn't going to feel the loss and reflect on what he's done. Not to mention he's undercutting the work his mother did by finally being strong enough to get rid of him. And whether he was forced is up for debate, he probably didn't want to be judged by them
Lipman’s performance as The Wire is TOP notch, may i say
HUNGRY
*Thank you, Television Writer Mark Gattis for lecturing me on why television is bad.*
Don't worry, in a few weeks you'll get Doctor Who fanboy Russell T Davies lecturing you on why the Doctor Who fandom is bad.
@@alexpotts6520 - it's a little more complex than that, in fairness.
I was always curious what the dog would have looked like with no face.
They didn't have the budget for it ;)
Urgh
It might’ve resembled the ones from Barcelona. The planet, not the city
Tennant's hair in the episode was spectacular
The kind of episode I don't mention when I want to convince my friends that DW is a not a weird show.
I liked it though.
Yeah this is one of those you only want to see if you already know about Doctor Who
@@HarboWholmes Yeah, I agree.
Look, I love Who, but it not being a "weird show" goes right out the window in the pilot.
"Killer Mannequins" or "Sentient Plastic", neither one says ,"Yeah. This is normal." Lol.
I want to be clear, though. I'm glad they did it that way. When that's how you "re-introduce" your show; nothing is off the table. I think it's why I typically don't mind the more "bizarre" episodes. I sat through "sentient plastic" as a villain and said, "Sure, let's see what else you have."
@@richardmorris8902 I don’t mind it neither. But many people reduce it to only being some goofy/stupid show, instead of realizing that it has some fleshed out writing behind it (sometimes).
And it’s not easy to convince them with the rather obscure episodes like this one.
Doctor WHo is by definaition a wierd show, this episode is the oposite, its the Kind of Epiosode id show my mother or people who doont like Sci fi in genral
I think this was one of the doctors best episodes that scean where he gives the Dad a dressing down and makes him look at his actions the look on his face where he's like shocked that anyone would talk to him and he has no reply is gold and shows that the doctor is not only a match for monsters from the stars but an everyday hero
There's nothing hopeful nor heartwarming about forgiving an abusive or deadbeat parent. It's a toxic trope written by people who have no idea what they're talking about.
I always found Rose telling Tommy to go to his dad as a bad message. You hold no obligation to abusers, especially if they’re your family.
I feel the exact same way
@@seanalbro3689 got to see it from her point of view though. She lost her dad, remember.
@@AndrewHalliwell It's understandable, of course, but it's still a bad message, you can just understand why Rose would have that notion.
@@AndrewHalliwell The Dr should still have said "no Rose, you're letting your own baggage taint your view"
Andrew Halliwell I grew up without a dad, and if I was in Rose’s place I’d say good riddance to the guy. When you’re an abuser, you loose any right to have a relationship with your victims.
I kinda liked The Wire as a villain. Yes she is OTT and camp but it's weirdly chilling to have such a deadly enemy disguised as a prim and proper newswoman. I also kinda liked how Rose was "captured" by The Wire, as it ups the stakes and gives the Doctor more of a reason to stop her. It actually makes her feel like a proper threat.
The ideas in this episode could work in a modern sense with smartphones/screens and such too.
I could never forget this episode, this gave me nightmares back in the day
Despite people may say this isn't a strong episode I applaud you for words at 10:27 "Just a low stakes episode you could put on during lunch time" which helps make it an acceptable stand-alone episode with less guilt to watch compared to other stand-alone episodes that you may have more of a chore re-watching, if that makes sense.
Also a thumbs up for mentioning the Magpie Electricals Easter eggs in future episodes.
This episode for me is basically the perfect example of amazing concept, dreadful execution
Eh, decent execution
yeah it’s far from dreadful, it’s just okay
I still remember the next week trailer for this episode and still to this day sometimes say to myself, HUNGRYYYYYYY.
The Tenth Doctor:”I am YELLING!”
I quite liked this episode but I think the ending with the doctor and rose sending Tommy back to a father who is literally physically and psychologically abusive was incredibly confused and damaging.
they didn't send Tommy to go back to the father. it was just talking
This scared the shit out of seven-year old me, and that cements it as a personal favourite for sure.
Is it just me, or did you purposely show Rose looking at the back of a tv at 6:42 whilst describing her as “picking up on the Magpie Electricals *lead* of her own *accord*”? :-D
as a kid this was one of my fav episodes like just sitting on the floor and watching the reveal of rose was like woah
So you think Rose gaslighting Tommy and encouraging him to stay with an abuser is hopeful and heart-warming? Not impressed. Tommy does not owe his dad anything.
I neither love nor hate this episode. Great characters, forgettable villain. Adore Ten and Rose (together and as individuals) in it, though. And I loved that little bit where initially the DI is standing with Ten sitting, then the roles flip with Ten standing over the DI with "Tell me everything you know"!
The Villan for this episode is pretty awful, but the character writing is pretty good especially for the Doctor and Rose
Yeah, I think the interplay of Rose and The Doctor with the Connely family was my favourite bit
I love them effort you put into these videos! I legit drop everything I’m doing to watch! Thank you 💛
I love the Doctor and Rose’s era so much that I give even the mediocre episodes a pass. I’d still put this one above Fear Her and Love and Monsters.
I think this is a better episode than people give it credit. But my undying memory will always be my brother's disappointment when Rose turned out to be ok in the end. "Can’t she actually die yet!" He said. We all know she was leaving so he was impatient for her to leave. To this day I’m not certain if he genuinely hated Rose or if he was just excited to see who the new companion would be. 🤷♂️
The whole thing felt a bit surreal in the way it was shot as well, kind of like a villain's lair in the old Batman series.
I was kind of expecting a fourth wall break given the episode's context.
I like watching this episode because of the Doctor and Rose stuff, and the setting is pretty unique for Doctor Who too.
The Villan is really awful though and brings down a otherwise pretty good episode
As per, another fascinating review from you! I'm really looking forward to what you're going to say about the next two-parter! Keep it up, mate!
So is no one gonna talk about how every time Eric gets angry he waves his arms around like an idiot, hate him as a character but find that funny
I like the episode because I always get way too invested in The Doctor and Rose’s relationship. I’m surprised you didn’t mention the ending where they are so optimistic about their future together, which repeat viewers know is about to come to a crushing end. You did hit the nail on the head though regarding that the episode is only enjoyable in a specific way that ignores the majority of its content.
Rose isn’t independent in series too...
Tooth and claw - got everyone out of the chains
Girl in the fireplace - went exploring with Mickey
Age of steel- went to save Jackie with Pete
Idiots lantern - investigated on her own
Satin Pit- pulled the crew together and saved them
Fear her - saved the doctor
Army of Ghosts Doomsday- investigated on her own then faced the Daleks on her own.
Not really true is it -_-
This is one of the early episodes I watched of DW and there were 2 moments that I felt were really cool to see as a new viewer. The first was the reveal of the faceless grandmother. I would have been terrified of something like that, but the Doctor went right up to her and probed her face with his sonic. Instead of acting on fear, her acted on curiosity. The second was the Doctor's furious reaction to Rose getting her faced sucked off. I think these two moments cemented my particular view of the Doctor; highly inquisitive and unstoppably fierce.
I love the kid's speech to his Dad sm
I think it would actually make for an interesting future episode if they had The Wire manage to break out of the tape into present day & use things like wi-fi, mobile networks and/or the cloud to eat people’s faces as well as the TVs, I know Moffat already did something slightly similar in Bells of Saint John, but it would still in my mind be an interesting take on the technological fears, tropes & conspiracies we have today like people obsessively looking at their phones & social media constantly, not to mention it would up the stakes a bit as The Wire could potentially do it to the whole world at any time instead of just the majority of England watching a once in a lifetime event
9:42 I vehemently disagree here. No one should ever be told to play nice with their abuser, anyone says that you should still be a bit nice to them cause they're your family is talking rubbish. He's not being stubborn he's well within his rights to feel that way. I get that people can be redeemed, but time and distance need to happen before that. This man needs time away from his family so he can reflect on what he lost and feel the consequences. By having the main characters say "go to him" this episode completely torches its themes. It's one of the worst episodes of Dr Who period for me.
I think the writer even agrees with me on this cause Gatis years later wrote Crimson Horror, that has a similar set up to this only the woman doesn't forgive her abusive mother. I wonder if he took issue with the ending to this like I did and wanted another go at the subject matter.
Another good moment this episode gave:
"I'm still talking!"
"And I'm not listening!"
00:15 In the Netherlands we hear this literally all the time.
Same here in denmark 😂
i saw that yakuza reference there ;)
now i'm just picturing kiryu unleashing sick tiger drops on cybermen
Cyber Dragon of Dojima
The idea of the television stealing a person's face is an old one. Marshal Mcluhan talked about the media of television and all new technology creating a kind of disembodiment, where a person's face, words and even personality lives on in visual media long after the actual individual has died. Numerous of the presenters, so-called experts and various pundits on television have been referred to as 'talking heads' because we often know very little about them other than their faces. Sometimes you can even catch a dog looking down under the television trying to find the feet and legs of the face on the screen. I think this episode started with a good idea that could have been better.
The ending to this episode is indeed super heartwarming.
the tardis is drawn to england i like to see the tardis as a separate character
This episode has some of the best one-liners
I liked the episode. Yes, there's no explanation as how the face sucking works, but I found everything else good and enjoyable.
If im honest, despite what you said this is one of the episodes i have always remembered, and i still reference to this day. It might not have been amazing but it was certainly memorable for me. :-)
I liked this episode, and even got to see this part in the doctor who exhibition in Cardiff (?) But was so scared of it!
I never noticed any of the Magpie Elec. easter eggs before.
This was my first ever episode of Doctor who. I came back the following week.
I can see your issues with the story, but i absolutely love the shots. Especially the one with the doctor and the inspector sitting on a table, where at first the inspector stands, ans while the dynamic shifts, tennant is standing and the inspector isnt. Also, the theme of the episode is control through fear. It is explored in the family, and macpie is the final form. He doesnt need to be characterised more, because the wire took his every possiblity of being himself.
The Wire saying how HUNGRY she is: "I AM TALKING!"
Me: *"AND I'M NOT LISTENING!"*
I like the episode, just wanted to make a joke cause that one of my fav Tenth Doc lines XD
While it was executed questionably, I appreciate that the family resolution is not a one-dimensional villain being mercilessly cast aside nor a nonsensical last-minute redemption, but an act of kindness toward a man who is still a horrible jackass.
6:59 sorry but I'm too immature to let that slide. I burst out laughing 🤣
The main issue I have with this episode is the pro-British imperialist elements, which isn't a huge part of the episode but it's still definitely there, and I REALLY don't like the line "We need something to be proud of now that we're losing the Empire", as if the Empire is something to be proud of, and it's never really challenged by the story (it's kind of funny how Series 2's last story has a very obvious metaphor for British Imperialism in the form of Torchwood I mean it's not even subtle)
The best part of The Idiots Lantern is definitely how it depicted abusive relationships, that part was really well done. Everything else though? Yeah unfortunately it's not really worth it.
I loved this episode purely for the relationship between Rose and the doctor, I love it.
I love how out of all the in-universe brands that Doctor Who could have chosen to run with, they chose Magpie Electricals
i havent watched this epiosode in years, but did anyone else notice the video tape that the wire is trapped inside has gallifreyian letters on it? at 8:53 you can see them scribbled out
"There is no power on this Earth that can sto..." That is great editing there dude. Love it. 😆
I have such a soft spot for this episode. Just everything about it I love.
I never knew that torchwood was in this episode
This episode was the first time I ever heard the term "Detective Inspector". Seems such a redundant title made up of 2 exact synonyms, along the lines of "Teacher Instructor" or "Writer Author".
This and Fear Her were the only two episodes of this series I had to force myself to watch all the way through. No joke, even Love & Monsters had at least some appealing quality to it. And everyone knows why Fear Her is considered bland. This one is also a chore. There is no mystery since you know who the villain is and who works for them from the first few minutes of the episode. There's no suspense because the moment Rose gets defaced you know that they're gonna revert everything back to normal before it ends. The dialogue is also pretty uninspired and the message is on the nose and very dated. Also it wasn't really that original even back when it came out.
This was the only episode I was ever generally scared of. I couldn't go near a TV for weeks!!
I remember being terrified of this episode as a child. The blank faces terrified me. I remember my mum coming into my room at one point and me asking her to turn on the light so I knew she had a face.
I'm surprised by this because this was a very rememberable episode and it's probably one of my favs!
even the dog 8:27 XD
they could have breathed through their skin like a earthworm
I always found the ending very strange seeing it more is the doctor and Rose sending the kid back to his abusive dad I don’t know that’s just how I see it and from that angle it looks a bit strange
I always loved this episode personally. It was one of my favourites as a kid
The only real memory I have of this episode from when I first watched it is how much I hated David Tennent hair
Weirdly enough my mum said the same thing about the square eyes
I was definitely told that!
I was also told a lot of weird things. If "the wind changed" while I was pulling a face, it would get stuck that way (which from about six I realised made no sense if I was indoors). Eating the crusts of my sandwiches would "put hairs on my chest" (which, as a prepubescent boy, I thought was disgusting).
The fact he said only me will forever haunt me, I should have square eyes bye now.
I had the Wire's 'Sing while you're working' as my ringtone for several years. Somehow I have always liked this episode.
ah yes, Himiko Kikuchi - Flying Beagles.
There was an epilogue called the "BT incident" where the wire escaped or something, i think it might've been in a comic or a story on the wiki
Another quality video from Harbo
Still better than anything Chibnall's written. 😊
Idiots Lantern has fragments of nice concepts and characters that have been submerged in meh.
It's so annoying watching episodes with do much potential but then it's squandered.
I quite like this one. It may not be very original and it does have its problems but I think much like The Long Game and The Lazarus Experiment, it's a fairly traditional and bog-standard episode. It's not aiming to be anything more than just a way to keep the audience entertained for 45 minutes. I do enjoy Euros Lyn's direction, the idea to use a lot of Dutch angles does help create a sense of unease and tension. The faceless people are a fairly creepy idea, and I do quite like the Wire during the first half, especially the way Maureen Lipman gels a cheery motherly attitude with the dark and horrifying things she does. I'm not too keen on her in the second half, where she just spends the second half shouting "FEEED MEEEE!" like a petulant toddler. The family drama is fairly decent and helps lend the episode some emotional weight, although the scene where Rose persuades Tommy to go to his father does leave a bad taste in my mouth (Council of Geeks' review sums it up pretty well). I enjoy Tennant's more unhinged and angry performance in this story, and it's great to see Rose take more of an initiative and act in a more Doctor-y role, something we see a lot of in the second half of this series. Maybe I'm somewhat biased towards this episode since it actually takes place not that far from where I lived as a child (Muswell Hill), but The Idiot's Lantern is a story that I enjoy in spite of its many many flaws
OMG! Never noticed the Magpie Electronic easter egg! Watching this show for over a decade and there still stuff to notice XD
The second you said “Mark Gatiss” I groaned
I AM TALKING!
AND I’M NOT LISTENING!
I agree on this being a low stake episode and yet they had the opportunity to make it into a great stakes episode, when you realise that 27 million people in the UK and millions more across the world watched Elizabeth the second's coronation but they focus in a single family, imagine the power the wire would have with that amount of people
4:33 that is the most true thing I've heard all day
I'm so happy to see the ole New Who fans back together again
I can’t lie I love this episode. I can accept it’s flaws. It terrified me as a kid and the 50s atmosphere is on point
I wasn't told that watching too much tv gave you square eyes when I was young.
But, I was told that using a computer too much would give you square eyes, so... yep
"waste of a TV slot"
PREACH IT
Brilliant! Can't Wait For The Fear Her Review, Better Make It A Good Review, I Like The Episode.
And then you get me who only watches this for the music hah, sadly the music used in this episode is not part of the Soundtrack (OST) That you can listen to or buy which is a massive shame, the song that plays during the climax (the build up to trapping the wire) is one of my favorite bits of music in the entirety of Doctor Who and just like many films, it is the Music that brings it ot life.
I enjoyed this at the time. But afterwards, watched Sapphire and Steel for the first time in 30 years. It struck me that a lot of the RTD era featured stories and ideas that were more reminiscent of the latter. This story is one. It would work out almost exactly the same with the celestial agents, or whateve they were, investigating. A few tweaks would be all that was needed.
"Fear Her" is another that with only a few changes would make a S&S style story.
Goodness only knows what show "Love and Monsters" would be more suited to though.
No, the whole Rose/Tennant romance soap opera sould be forgoten.