Fatal attraction is like part 2 of a Micheal Douglas is a Wanker to women trilogy. First is War of the Roses, then is Fatal Attraction and finally Basic Instinct.
I always thought that the discrepancy between their daughters age was because Dan didn’t really know how old she was while Beth did, kind of showing he’s a bit detached in certain areas
The part about Dan's wife infantalizing him is so true. It's so common in heterosexual relationships for a woman to be "mother" to her boyfriend/husband and for him to act like a 12 yo. When you are being put in a role of a caretaker, like a woman often is, you do start to infantalize your partner. She repeatedly reminds him to walk the dog because he probably forgets to do that often. For him walking the dog is optional. If he doesn't do that, no worries because the wife will. She feels like the only responsible one here and accepts it...for now. This mother-son dynamic in romantic hetero relationships makes me sick to the point I want to vomit also because this is the type of a woman more traditional men call "wife material". I don't want to be a mommy to my romantic partner I have sex with. So why do men want to be romantic/sexual with someone who basically replaces their mommy? It's perverse. 🤮
Its one of those things you hear about a lot, part of me blames television. I do think media can shape some of our ideals about relationships, for example with post 2018 me too eyes, a lot of movies we thought of as "romantic" actually exhibit obsessive and stalker behavior or wildly inappropriate power inbalances in relationships. Things we thought omg thats so romantic are now like...what the hell? Like persistently perusing someone who shows zero interest until you break their resolve. I think sitcoms often portrayed the infantilization of men almost normalizing it. Usually a nagging wife, husband that thinks his responsibilities clock out when he does for work, saying things like he is "babysitting" his own children when left to his own devices. It was normalized, even if the woman in the show has a career, that she has an "adult child" to care for.
@@BewitchCraft I never found stalker-mentality or the crossing of boundaries romantic. And the only person, who tends to be a stalker was my ex with bpd/npd. She stalked a male friend of her. Fortunately, I also never experienced a lot of men who acted like children. There was maybe one who was a bit obsessed with his mother (in a negative way), but the most are fine. (However, I just have left-leaning male friends). It is really gross and disturbing to be in a relationship with your ,,mother''. They should search professional help.
you are overdramatic for no reason, in the movie he's the one bringing money while she stays at home, she's not his mommy she's more like his kid because he's the one paying for everything, if SHE was the one paying for everything then the mommy analogy would make sense.
I really appreciate how hard Glenn Close fought to keep the film's original ending over the slasher ending that was filmed to appease the test audiences who wanted to see Alex Forrest punished. Nothing Alex does in the film is excusable, but the original alternate ending had a much more realistic outcome, as Glenn had found during her research on Alex's mental illness that people with BPD or dissociative identity disorder are much more likely to harm themselves than to go out of their way to harm other people. That and it allowed for Dan to get a slight dosage of karma even as it is implied he will likely be exonerated when his wife finds Alex's cassette tape
I think its really interesting how Glenn went to psychologists and experts in order to understand her character, and used that to try and give Alex some nuance and humanity. While production used the same 'research' to make the character monstrous, sort of alien, and perhaps even deserving of her fate. All while Dan is given what amounts to a PR shine-up, complete with not verbally acknowledging his own faults, downplaying/lying, and playing up HIS humanity. I think this movie actually should have left us feeling hollow and unsatisfied, the way many people are in the wake of cheating. Also, I think Alex was only as human as she was because of Glenn, and hopefully she is proud of that if nothing else
Completely agree with both of you. Glenn Close was phenomenal in this film. She portrayed a person with BPD with such finesse although the film got carried away with trying to make her some psycho killer. Also it takes two to cheat so the criticism for Douglas's character is warranted.
You "borderline whisperers" are hilarious in these comments. A lot of people with cluster B personality disorders destroy other people's lives for their own selfish reasons and there's a good reason BPD is in that category.
If Dan didn't cheat in the first place, none of this would have happened. You CANNOT control how your partner behaves when you cheat and bring people into your marriage/relationship. He is a huge contributing factor to the demise of his family.
@@afrosamourai400 Nono, let's not pretend that you, as a married person, don't have a responsibility to choose not to cheat. Alex does not owe Beth anything as she's not the one married to her; Dan is. Dan is the one who owes Beth an explanation; he's the one who has to get a divorce, etc. When you're married you owe respect and understanding that you cannot sleep with anyone regardless of temptation. We're not animals, we can choose who to sleep with and why.
@@afrosamourai400girl he knew he was married and still went out and had an affair w someone who wasn’t his wife. They’re both at fault. The way you want to only put the blame on her is very…interesting to say the least.
Glenn Close should have won an Oscar by now, and she should have gotten it for this film. She's one of the most Oscar snubbed people in Hollywood, rivaled only by Amy Adams.
Dan was a coward. Dan was unfaithful and never considered if the wife finds out what she would do. He knew all along she'd forgive him, she's a stay at home mom. Financially at least trapped. I like to think Marybeth takes some time to get a job, to saves money, then gets a divorce. I don't know how emotionally you could forgive a man who put you in a position to end someone else's life. And honestly all moms possess the strength to do the extreme to save their child. As for Alex, I watched it twice once at 10 years old and was terrified. At 25 I felt sorry for her. I actually think realistically Alex wouldn't have gone to that extreme. And it is problematic that the situation with the baby was never addressed. Like a clip where he asks the police "was she pregnant?" So they can say "the autopsy doesn't indicate that." Something! I love Joshua Jackson and Lizzie Caplan so I will watch it but it sounds they really did a hatchet job on this story line.
@@annwilliams6438not at all! You guys don’t know anything about bpd! You don’t see all pregnant women going psycho killer do you? This is such a dangerous and misleading line of thought, to blame anything on hormones!
@@evaphillips2102 Haven't watched the movie but what I get from the vid she was suffering long before she got involved with him. I can sympathise with that.
Please never lament having a video that's too long or assume no one cares. I could listen to your videos for hours on end and I wouldn't get sick of them. Keep up the long form content!
Not only did i never find Dan to be a likeable character, but i also never understood why two attractive women would be fighting for him. His wife - and his mistress - are so far out of his league, that i always found the movie to be off putting.
It was one of the things I never could get behind in his films - the projection of this "everyday" looking man being hounded by these exceptionally beautiful women. It's in so many of his films
To this day, Glenn Close has been approached by men who thanked her for saving their marriage, since they were debating on having an affair, but then stopped when they realised that the woman could be a psycho like Alex.
That is depressing. Like you couldn't just talk to your wife or divorce, you had to be scared of experiencing consequences for your shitty actions. The men I mean, not you.
I do think the difference in ages is subtle smart dig at how men never know their own kid’s birthdays or personal info the way the mom does bc they’re more checked out about that part since it’s not “men’s” work
@@Woodman-Spare-that-treeokay, Please don't use the phrase 'transvestite.' That is a derogatory term. Trans man/woman or Trans person is the proper terminology.
Well, I guess the studios failed because I still rooted for Alex and not Dan 😂 I'm 100% on her side on the interpersonal side of things (not... the vandalism and attempt to murder ppl 😂)
Literally watched this movie last week (for the 6th) time it never gets old Glenn Close and Anne Archer are just phenomenal. Anne (Beth the wife) is especially amazing during Bens confession, it’s a rollercoaster of emotions and bringing you with her.
Imo fatal attraction is less about mental illness and more about the AIDS crisis and the fears about heterosexual HIV transmission that were hitting a peak in 1987. The message is that if you cheat on your wife without wrapping it up, a relentless stalker will return to dispatch you and everyone you love.
neither of them had AIDS though i was thinking the message is don't mess w/ married ppl or if youre the married person dont go cheating on your spouse either. this applies to everyone.
play misty for me was the original...jessica walter was just so frightening...that maniac look in her eyes... clint eastwood said he'd never work with her again cuz she gave him the creeps
You need to do a video on Swarm. Dominque Fishback kills it, and rarely does a black woman get to be the protagonist of a show and be a psycho. The caliber of character and acting was Travis Bickle/deniro level
It’s rare because we aren’t seen as “complex women with severe mental issues” when we act like this. Donald Glover himself said his protagonist was written to be more “like an animal” than a human being.
IMO, he is partially to blame for her increasing aggression...comparing us women being nice to a guy to wade him off, versus sleeping with someone again and again...knowing they're desperate for you, is beyond dumb.
no, he is not - he is at fault for cheating, and many other things, but her increasing aggression is entirely her own fault. If the genders were reversed, would you still feel as you claim you do?
@xBINARYGODx "..the genders are reversed", all the time... most of the time, irl. It's a huge problem globally and the women are usually blamed, ignored, and/or killed. So you don't really need to include that, and it kinda changes things anyways
@@xBINARYGODx You know how'd they call a woman if the roles were reversed. She would be blamed for EVERYTHING. And there would be no happy ending. Usually heroines like that must die (it's a whole trope. Vamp or Femme Fatale. They almost always die. Just watch few film noir movies)
@xBINARYGODx They cannot be reversed the way you're thinking because the two sides are not the same and are not treated the same in society. Something he does will not be judged the same as something she does. It is a tiring "point" and it doesn't not work. Men are not losing out no matter how much you want to feel like they are for some reason. Their ag gression is very much accepted as just a part of them.
I just miss when movie stars were allowed to be kinda funky looking, like real people with a variety of faces that actually moved when they cried or laughed. SIGH.
Terrific analysis, easily the best on UA-cam. I personally preferred the original ending with Alex taking her own life. To me, it fit her mental instability better. I love the idea that we don't know if she did it intensively to frame dan, to make him feel guilty or if she just didn't feel worthy of life any more. It could be all of thee above. It's a fantastic simple story that like you mentioned is a rochaq test of what would you do and how would you react? I love that the characters aren't simple black and white and not everything needs to be explained. We can come to our own conclusions and create our own stories continuing the author's. That's what a good story teller does. Leave you wanting more. The remake mini series was terrible and like you said over explains everything. It was really dull and predictable. It's a shame because in modern times this could have been really interesting with social media, mobile apps, cell phones, cell phone combination locks and if you have access to your spouses password and having easier access to see if your spouses eye is wondering. Oh, well. Maybe one day 🤞
no one gets to the point of boiling a bunny when they have 0 past trauma. people without trauma don't just do messed up stuff, and next to no one has 0 trauma. i'd bet no one has none. that level behavior doesn't just come out of nowhere. something made her that way, there's so many stereotypical attachment patterns. glenn's analysis is her own and hell, she played the character herself, she knows better than us about alex. i don't really interpret it the way glenn does, however it's extremely blatantly neon obvious alex has trauma, that must have happened between probably the ages of 13-16, as that's where the emotional intelligence of her attachment to dan lands. it didn't take me to age 36, maybe about 23, and i never went as far as she did, but i struggled with the same type of extreme jealousy and falling for emotionally unavailable and immature men that purposefully manipulate you the way he does to alex. except it's not that dan is his late 30s and alex is a 18-25 young woman, she's his age. she has arrested development in her, specifically targeted on her emotional attachments to men, sex, intimacy, love, and self worth. which never got healed because in the capitalistic blowout heyday of the 80s, her "girlboss" life was given her social validation by everyone around her that "nothing was wrong with her". because no one cares about your mental health, especially not in the 80s, if you're able to show you are "succesful". dan and alex are both bad people, and both because they were neglected emotionally as children/not taught anything about how to actually BE humans other than going to work, coming home, fulfilling responsibilities, and doing it all over again. except dan didn't even get taught how to properly fulfill responsibilities by either parent. his dad ignored him and his mom "boymom'd" him and coddled him, turning him into an adult child just like alex. they are both about 13-16 years old emotionally, yet the consequences are adult. if anything close to glenn's, i interpret it as that both dan and alex were shaped by emotional incest from their parents. as well as alex has clearly been used by men before very young and still hasn't learned there's no protecting yourself from them besides simply just not engaging with them at all, she finally learned none of them ever loved her, not dan, not any of them. they're playing house, in a very screwed up and toxic way, completely separate to how the other one is. they're coping by reenacting their parent's dysfunctions to feel normal.
Thanks for that. It rings loud bells in my own life, which has been spent ricocheting from one married man to the next. However there is one point I would disagree with you about. In my experience Dan does not behave the way he does because he was coddled by his mother . He behaves that way because his mother abandoned him, either emotionally or by actually being physically absent. Dan’s wife then fulfils the role of Dan’s substitute mother, and Alex fulfils the role of girlfriend, and Dan sees nothing wrong with that arrangement because in his own psyche he is still (as you say in your comment above) a teenager.
@@oooh19. Not many years ago it was normal for People to raise bunnies in their back garden for food. The concept of a bunny being a non-edible pet is a modern idea.
I am fascinated to hear there as an intention to make her character sympathetic because I believe it failed at the time - I honestly don't recall any debate back then - it was black and white, at least socially I remember my parents and elders discussing this film when I was a kid and Glenn Close as considered a certifiable, undiagnosed looney, "man's worst nightmare" and whore. Michael was a good guy who made a mistake. So I think it's only in hindsight most audiences have empathy for Alex.
Looking back, i think i prefer the original ending. Though that final shot of the family portrait in the released version still leaves me uneasy and sad for this family. And one more side note: How the hell Ellen was able to sleep with all that commotion going on in the bathroom 😂
There's actually been plenty of studies that show its better for a woman to have a baby in her 30s. Over 35 is no issue either. Unless there's some other underlying medical issue, the advancement of medical science has reversed preconceived notions.
True its old men who are the problem and why we have so many people with issues. You can google it, old men sperm causes lots of higher risks. Old men forcing marriages with young women even to this day is the cause for a lot of shit.
I’ve watched this film more times than I care to admit…after all these years and times watched, how did I ever miss that connection! 😂 Good lookin out!
Wow this was fantastic. I'm def subbing and checking out your other vids. .This essay must've been quite a bit of work! Thanks so much for sharing your insights.
She was not written as a Bordeline woman… it is so revelatory just how threatening an independent woman still is one who refuses to be treated like shit… of course she is the villain… never th man! The patriarchy won in the end. Michael Douglas character was absolutely vile…and the wife in the end “saved” the “sanctity” of the Home over the Fallen Woman…🙄
She was not written as a Bordeline woman… it is so revelatory just how threatening an independent, complicated sexual woman; she refuses to be treated like shit… and to hold a mirror up to Dan. The patriarchy won in the end. Michael Douglas character was absolutely vile…
The movie character WAS BONKERS!!! She wasn’t a complicated sexual woman! She was masking a deeply disturbed pathology. She hid her mental illness behind her sexual mystery and availability.
@ oh stop with the antiquated argument. She is a free agent- HE is not. It was his recklessness that put his family in danger. The moral dubiousness of her actions have been played and overplayed- it is men like Michael Douglas’ character and the maternal like wives that they seem to (or get turned into )marry,that are so predictable in their selfishness that we can’t seem to ever get our heads round another framing of the femme fatale/ mentally unstable destruction arc/trope. The wife saved him from his choices as she seemed to do the entire film and he remained as feckless and shameless as ever. If not more humiliated in the eyes of his already emasculating wife. The film for me shows the moral and ethical implications of following desire under strict patriarchal norms and mores. Sex is more complicated than our culture permits us to see it as. And for women, traumatized women particularly there are a plethora of psychological/ hormonal/ attachment issues that arise ( I single out women here because we have been placed in this role both by biology and patriarchy)- where was his care for her being? She was an object to be consumed. Women are only fooled by this trick of patriarchy for so long- she is older which was part of what compelled me and I also disagree with how she is portrayed at work- no one would blink an eye if it was a man. Alex demanded her respect especially in the area she knew she had power- being sexual and living independently. He on the other hand was an insipid,gutless wonder the entire film- I’d have hoped that the wife and daughter left him to his own devices the wife recoiling at her choice of husband and foraging a new non domesticated future with daughter in tow …or even holding her husband accountable for his actions that endangered her family and shattered trust- way more interesting than the quietly gothic ending of “the WASP family unit united against the threat of the abject woman 😂… that Dad bought into our lives. But if you felt like you “burned me”by adding a derivative comment… ok 👍🏽
Also, the fact that Glenn later played Cruella de Vil, whom Disney made into a career woman and man hater in Opposition to Anita who wanted a family. Practically the same role twice.
I swear I thought their kid was a boy when I first saw this movie. I’m close to the same age, and that girl would’ve been torn apart by bullies if she’d gone to my school with that boy haircut and clothes at the time. I guess some things have improved..
This movie was trying to make Dan sympathetic because he didn't initiate the affair with Alex, and tried justifying his cheating because Dan felt infantilized by Beth. Beth didn't need to infantilize Dan at all, though. He did that all on his own using weaponized incompetance, so naturally Beth started acting sort of like a "mom" to him too. Most wives would eventually be turned off by that and wouldn't want to sleep with their husband if they had to be a mom to them too, but that wasn't the case with Beth and Dan. They still had some semblance of a sex life.
The movie that comes to mind when you mention the psycological drama choice for this film to be i thought about that film Damage (1992) with Juliette Binoche; along with a tragedy comes the aftermath of those wrong choices but nor the event of that tragedy is exploitative or showy; everyone's faith is absolutly pessimistic and devastating from the emotional aspect that many people wouldn't appreciate that kind of take on these stories... I agree on your point about true crime making audiences way more distant and indifferent to anything non exploitative...
I am 26, born in 1998 so naturally it is hard for me to understand the zeitgeist of when this movie came out. I recently watched a few older movies as I watched Misery and really liked it. This movie did not scare me it just made me really sad 😂. Alex, the go getting insane business broad is naturally the villain. The mom whose name I have forgotten which says enough is the good, caring mother figure so she is the hero. In the end the good mother forgives her husband and life goes on as normal. No consequences only for the crazy villain. Actually an extremely insightful and depressing period piece if you ask me. If Alex were real and alive today I would hope she gets helped by a mental health professional and moves on happily. And for "the mother" I hope there would be facilities to leave that sleazy asshole
You may have done this already, but if you are at all interested in the zeitgeist of this era in American film and culture check out You Must Remember This podcast . The erotic 80s and 90s episodes are great for adding context to the erotic thrillers and other sex and gender focused media of those decades. The episode on Fatal Attraction is excellent.
I have to agree with Brian de Palma. Douglas's complete lack of likeability makes the movie totally black and white for me. He's a narcissist, and she was broken.
Fab! Just saw an essay on Hagsploitation, so that tracks. Glad to see how far we come regarding bodily autonomy and virtue dog whistles^^ Seen Douglas as a wannabe sugar zaddy in Will & Grace, preferred Rules of Attraction;o) First wives club's film adaptation reprieved the worst husband and while Roseanne Barr is... problematic, I still loove She-Devil, what a character arc for that prancing wimpy horndog of a husband.
If you are truly interested in studying female stalkers, I have a female stalker and I could really use someone to investigate this whole thing! I have not been able to get any legal help or convince anyone in a position of authority to help me. She's almost had me killed
Can we get an analysis of Lolita (1997)? Of course the film has its flaws, and it doesn't even compare to the book. But i would love an in-depth discussion about it.
Hey, Cher winning the Oscar for Moonstruck was well deserved. Meryl Streep winning the Oscar for best actress 3 times, however... That's a different story (especially for The Iron Lady 😐).
Having seen both endings, the studio was right to change it. The original ending was just kind of meh. Yeah it’s thematically rich and blah blah blah. But it’s also a pretty flat and unengaging. Alex was going more and more over the top, so her completely loosing it at the end makes sense. Plus no matter how you look at it, Douglas get away with it in both versions.
I heard somewhere that the story of Fatal Attraction is Loosely based on the actress Sean Young and her pursuit of the actor James Woods when they were filming a movie. He turned down her advances and she became extremely aggressive and even sent a mutilated doll splashed with iodine to his doorstep.
The spiritual sequel to Fatal Attraction is 101 Dalmations where Glenn Close also plays a cateer woman who is portrayed as an ubstable raging monster who does horrible things to amall cute animals, (which isnt fully fair cause she would have paid a very good price for those puppies!) the movie also goes hard on themes of motherhood and domesticity vs the pitfalls of the career woman, as explored in Susan Faludis "Backlash: the undeclared war against american woman"
@cramp4221 for real tho, once you see it you can't unsee it (like when the nanny/house keeper goes on a monologue about the virtues of motherhood and Anita has absolutely no passion for her job...as a fashion designer and is like "oh well gonna have a bb now byyyeeee")
They probably couldn't give her character a diagnosis because I don't think BPD even had a name yet or wasn't being studied as much. I have BPD as well and I can see some of it in this movie. But since it's a movie. Everything about it is turned up by a million for the camera. Also random. But another female stalker is Rumi from Perfect Blue. The movie shows Me Mania being the main stalker. But Rumi was orchestrating everything behind the scenes.
51:42 I just want to know the irony by comparison to another movie, My Best Friend's Wedding. In that film, Julia Roberts' character tries to sabotage her friend's wedding to another woman after realizing she still has feelings for him. With that said, that also had an alternate ending that involved her, having respected him moving on, and supporting him by even still going to his wedding, after he and his new bride leave, she ends up meeting another guy at the wedding that expressed interest in her, and it's implied Indian that he ends up being potentially heard you love interest. Well, that's just didn't like that, because they thought it was rewarding her for her bad behavior, and wanted to see it ending in about her being alone as penance for her actions. Mind you, the worst thing she did (albeit besides her failed attempts to thwart their engagement) was kiss him. By comparison, Michael Douglas' character in Fatal Attraction had a full on affair, which led to the other woman HE GOT PREGNANT almost KILLING HIS WIFE. And they felt an ending that involved him going to jail as a result of his actions was "too extreme"?? Just goes to show the bias of people perceiving a man being unfaithful and causing havoc as a result, versus when it's a woman put in a similar position, even when her actions are nowhere near as extreme.
Your analogy is bad LOL, the punishment is for trying To destroy Another woman's happiness, dan didn't try To destroy Alex stable relationship, it was litteraly Alex who slept with a married man and then tried To kill his wife, Julia roberts character is more Alex than Dan.
Although not all people with mental disorders are psycho, all psycho people have some kind of mental disorder. Normal people just don't stalk or harm others. There is definitely a disconnect up there.
No, CPTSD or PTSD, or trauma does NOT have the same characteristics as BPD. I have dealt with and lived with people who were diagnosed with BPD and believe me this character definitely would be more a resemblance to BPD than any other real life, trauma related disorder. In fact BPD isn't necessarily due to trauma. It's a character so yes, there's no actual diagnosis of course but based on a lot of research I have done I can say trauma and BPD are definitely very different types of disorders. And I am not saying that you said it does, I am just throwing that out there.
I love the cultural issues this movie brought. The "free sex" movement the pill brought exposed the fallacy that men and women can use each other sexually without consequence. That we cant actually divest ourselves of the responsibility that comes with sexual intimacy .... We cant truly use one another as sexual objects with love and real compassion ! You must be completly detached to be sucessfully sexually promiscuous, and this naturally affects the level of passion ❤
Madame Butterfly ending would have made this a quasi Shakespearean tragedy, IF, done correctly. The BUNNY; Is relevant in the fact that one way to confirm a woman's pregnancy, pre modern pregnancy tests, was to use the 'A-Z or Friedman Test', in which a human females urine was injected into an immature female mouse, (or later, rabbit) and a few days later the mouse, or more commenly rabbit, was killed. Then it was autopsied to see if, even though immature, they'd gone into 'heat' (giving signs ready to breed). If the urine was from a pregnant human female, this would occur in the mice/rabbits. A sign the human female whose urine was used was, pregnant. (Hormonal reaction in the mouse/rabbit) A term, though not exactly accurate, from this time was indicating a woman was pregnant because 'The rabbit died'. Alex, was in this way, at least to me, confirming she was indeed, pregnant. 2nd Edit; I'm a fan of long videos, enjoyed this. Subscribed.
52:34 it doesn’t let the audience know that Dan will ultimately be cleared… it suggests that WILL HIS WIFE FORGIVE HIM ENOUGH to give that tape to the police or will she let him go to prison
I feel sad for Alex I don’t think she deserves to die they not only killed her but their unborn baby they could’ve helped her instead of killing her and unborn baby it’s makes me mad and sad I can relate to Alex in way my ex was always cheating on me I never felt like his I always felt like the another woman even though I wasn’t it was painful and really sad I felt so lonely in relationships I have been out of it and find love again it still hurts and I am happy now my relationship I still feel for Alex thank you for video please make more I love you
Modern psychologists don't love the Rorschach, diagnosis alone has also fallen out of fashion. Having said that, the video was really interesting and enjoyable.
I find it important to mention that older mothers have a research-proven tradition of selecting *older partners.* Eggs are created at the beginning of our lifetime and gradually reduce in number. That "decline in quality" of male DNA mentioned in this video is very significant. The optimal age of male fertility and reproductive health is 25-40. A younger man's swimmers are healthier and more motile; more able to survive the harsh environment of a womb long enough to find an egg. Birth defects may not be a worry for older mothers with a younger partner, and fertility may be less of a worry as well. So if anyone's like Alex or older, but still hoping to be a mother, she's better off not choosing a 50-year-old. Maturity is individual, not guaranteed with age.
Great analysis. Love this movie, i wanted to see it when it came out but my mother refused. One quibble: Alex isnt sick with envy when he gives his daughter the rabbit. She's pregnant. It's morning sickness.
Alex is not the victim. She is the villain. She went after a married man. She cooked a bunny. She poured acid on a car. She slit her wrists. She's a very toxic woman.
I think Alex has BPD. Psychologically speaking, it's interesting that she has abandonment issues but goes after a married man who will probably stay with his wife, causing her pain. But maybe it's the process of "being chosen". If she has an affair w/a married man and he chooses her over his wife, it's a grander conquest and boosts her deflated ego, soothing her abandonment wound 😢
He never should have seen her the 2nd time, that gave her some hope that maybe he did have feelings for here, because playing with the dog in the park and having lunch at her place that's a date, that's something a couple would do
I subscribed based on this critique video. excellent! On a different topic (movie) the book Alien Woman (about the first four Alien movies) by Ximena Gallardo C and C Jason Smith is a very good feminist read on those movies
Fatal attraction is like part 2 of a Micheal Douglas is a Wanker to women trilogy. First is War of the Roses, then is Fatal Attraction and finally Basic Instinct.
Lol
The Wanker Trilogy
Fellowship of the Wanker
The Two Wankers
The Return of the Wanker
Old fashioned gender roles
2½ wankers
😂😂😂
I always thought that the discrepancy between their daughters age was because Dan didn’t really know how old she was while Beth did, kind of showing he’s a bit detached in certain areas
I thought so too at first but we don't really know who is right, depends on your own perception, so giving him the benefit of the doubt
@@antiheroines-you-love But that's the point; he doesn't deserve the benefit of your doubt.
He thinks she’s older because he has been thinking about how many years it was since his wife told him she was pregnant! GENIUS!
The part about Dan's wife infantalizing him is so true. It's so common in heterosexual relationships for a woman to be "mother" to her boyfriend/husband and for him to act like a 12 yo. When you are being put in a role of a caretaker, like a woman often is, you do start to infantalize your partner. She repeatedly reminds him to walk the dog because he probably forgets to do that often. For him walking the dog is optional. If he doesn't do that, no worries because the wife will. She feels like the only responsible one here and accepts it...for now.
This mother-son dynamic in romantic hetero relationships makes me sick to the point I want to vomit also because this is the type of a woman more traditional men call "wife material". I don't want to be a mommy to my romantic partner I have sex with. So why do men want to be romantic/sexual with someone who basically replaces their mommy? It's perverse. 🤮
Thank you for that post.
Its one of those things you hear about a lot, part of me blames television. I do think media can shape some of our ideals about relationships, for example with post 2018 me too eyes, a lot of movies we thought of as "romantic" actually exhibit obsessive and stalker behavior or wildly inappropriate power inbalances in relationships. Things we thought omg thats so romantic are now like...what the hell? Like persistently perusing someone who shows zero interest until you break their resolve. I think sitcoms often portrayed the infantilization of men almost normalizing it. Usually a nagging wife, husband that thinks his responsibilities clock out when he does for work, saying things like he is "babysitting" his own children when left to his own devices. It was normalized, even if the woman in the show has a career, that she has an "adult child" to care for.
@@BewitchCraft
I never found stalker-mentality or the crossing of boundaries romantic.
And the only person, who tends to be a stalker was my ex with bpd/npd. She stalked a male friend of her.
Fortunately, I also never experienced a lot of men who acted like children. There was maybe one who was a bit obsessed with his mother (in a negative way), but the most are fine. (However, I just have left-leaning male friends).
It is really gross and disturbing to be in a relationship with your ,,mother''. They should search professional help.
@@BewitchCraft no wonder so many ppl are single.
you are overdramatic for no reason, in the movie he's the one bringing money while she stays at home, she's not his mommy she's more like his kid because he's the one paying for everything, if SHE was the one paying for everything then the mommy analogy would make sense.
I really appreciate how hard Glenn Close fought to keep the film's original ending over the slasher ending that was filmed to appease the test audiences who wanted to see Alex Forrest punished. Nothing Alex does in the film is excusable, but the original alternate ending had a much more realistic outcome, as Glenn had found during her research on Alex's mental illness that people with BPD or dissociative identity disorder are much more likely to harm themselves than to go out of their way to harm other people. That and it allowed for Dan to get a slight dosage of karma even as it is implied he will likely be exonerated when his wife finds Alex's cassette tape
I think its really interesting how Glenn went to psychologists and experts in order to understand her character, and used that to try and give Alex some nuance and humanity. While production used the same 'research' to make the character monstrous, sort of alien, and perhaps even deserving of her fate. All while Dan is given what amounts to a PR shine-up, complete with not verbally acknowledging his own faults, downplaying/lying, and playing up HIS humanity. I think this movie actually should have left us feeling hollow and unsatisfied, the way many people are in the wake of cheating.
Also, I think Alex was only as human as she was because of Glenn, and hopefully she is proud of that if nothing else
Completely agree with both of you. Glenn Close was phenomenal in this film. She portrayed a person with BPD with such finesse although the film got carried away with trying to make her some psycho killer. Also it takes two to cheat so the criticism for Douglas's character is warranted.
You "borderline whisperers" are hilarious in these comments. A lot of people with cluster B personality disorders destroy other people's lives for their own selfish reasons and there's a good reason BPD is in that category.
@@jackchop1576that is FALSE and you’re fear-mongering!
If Dan didn't cheat in the first place, none of this would have happened. You CANNOT control how your partner behaves when you cheat and bring people into your marriage/relationship. He is a huge contributing factor to the demise of his family.
stop excusing trash women she could have any man she wanted but she chose a married one then acted as if she was the victim...please!!
@@afrosamourai400 Nono, let's not pretend that you, as a married person, don't have a responsibility to choose not to cheat. Alex does not owe Beth anything as she's not the one married to her; Dan is. Dan is the one who owes Beth an explanation; he's the one who has to get a divorce, etc.
When you're married you owe respect and understanding that you cannot sleep with anyone regardless of temptation. We're not animals, we can choose who to sleep with and why.
@@afrosamourai400 She chose and HE VOLUNTARILY WENT! That's on HIM. No one MADE HIM do ANYTHING.
@@cadillacdeville5828 she knew he was married! stop that, did she think he would end his life with her psycho ass? please...
@@afrosamourai400girl he knew he was married and still went out and had an affair w someone who wasn’t his wife. They’re both at fault. The way you want to only put the blame on her is very…interesting to say the least.
Glenn Close should have won an Oscar by now, and she should have gotten it for this film. She's one of the most Oscar snubbed people in Hollywood, rivaled only by Amy Adams.
I agree
And Angela Basset!
@bribrilolzOG 🫰🥀💐🌹
Glenn Close owns several farms and bought land for her children and her step sons… she’s fine. 😅
Or for Dangerous Liasons, Albert Nobbs or The Wife...
Dan was a coward. Dan was unfaithful and never considered if the wife finds out what she would do. He knew all along she'd forgive him, she's a stay at home mom. Financially at least trapped. I like to think Marybeth takes some time to get a job, to saves money, then gets a divorce. I don't know how emotionally you could forgive a man who put you in a position to end someone else's life. And honestly all moms possess the strength to do the extreme to save their child.
As for Alex, I watched it twice once at 10 years old and was terrified. At 25 I felt sorry for her. I actually think realistically Alex wouldn't have gone to that extreme. And it is problematic that the situation with the baby was never addressed. Like a clip where he asks the police "was she pregnant?" So they can say "the autopsy doesn't indicate that." Something!
I love Joshua Jackson and Lizzie Caplan so I will watch it but it sounds they really did a hatchet job on this story line.
Also, I agree with you 😉
Amen to the pregnancy concept. Even to the point of, if she was pregnant, did she have hormonal problems that contributed to her behavior?
Brilliant and astute observations
@@annwilliams6438 exactly! it could be an explanation for some of her behavior maybe not all of it
@@annwilliams6438not at all! You guys don’t know anything about bpd! You don’t see all pregnant women going psycho killer do you? This is such a dangerous and misleading line of thought, to blame anything on hormones!
I feel like young male viewers would have even less empathy for Alex these days, sadly
Very much so...
What is there to sympathize with? She knowingly got involved with a married man. You get exactly what you deserve if that’s how you move.
@@evaphillips2102 Haven't watched the movie but what I get from the vid she was suffering long before she got involved with him. I can sympathise with that.
@@bjorx88 accountability doesn’t care 🤷🏾♀️ you don’t get to just hurt people because you’re struggling.
You are assuming young males would ever watch this movie instead of clips of family guy with a game playing in the lower half on TikTok
Please never lament having a video that's too long or assume no one cares. I could listen to your videos for hours on end and I wouldn't get sick of them. Keep up the long form content!
Agreed,
Seems like every angle taken fills a void I've been searching for in fem-film theory ❤🎥
And so JAM packed with angles! 💥🎥🤯
You're so kind, thank you✨
@@antiheroines-you-loveI watch listen to your videos multiple times, so yey to long videos
literally i love listening to her voice before i go to bed it's so calming
Vve32²qdx2zq🎉w!z2 22221s6😊1😅😅so www zzzzz zzź zs2ss55srast ta5s 5s5😮s5aa5s5 5😅stttz9😅❤ssàß45zsSe4😂😂e😅@@antiheroines-you-love
Not only did i never find Dan to be a likeable character, but i also never understood why two attractive women would be fighting for him.
His wife - and his mistress - are so far out of his league, that i always found the movie to be off putting.
It was one of the things I never could get behind in his films - the projection of this "everyday" looking man being hounded by these exceptionally beautiful women. It's in so many of his films
Same. I now wonder what this movie would’ve been like if Brian DePalma had won out.
To this day, Glenn Close has been approached by men who thanked her for saving their marriage, since they were debating on having an affair, but then stopped when they realised that the woman could be a psycho like Alex.
That is depressing. Like you couldn't just talk to your wife or divorce, you had to be scared of experiencing consequences for your shitty actions.
The men I mean, not you.
That only makes men look worse lmao
We must have the same algorithm bc why do I see you on every video I watch 😅
@@broadwaygodess630 Haha, must be a pure coincidence! 😹I adore your screen name, I'm also a huge musical theatre fanatic.
I thought this was a passive joke its fascinating its true ALLEGEDLY 💛
This movie has the most well executed final confrontation i've seen. Glenn Close gave her ALL in this film.
My thoughts!
I do think the difference in ages is subtle smart dig at how men never know their own kid’s birthdays or personal info the way the mom does bc they’re more checked out about that part since it’s not “men’s” work
that's honestly ridiculous!
@@oooh19yes, and? That’s not my fault that’s how men are 🙄
Glenn Close plays a MALE pirate in Hook and it took like 20 years for anyone to notice/point it out.
No one should ever doubt her range and ability.
Glenn played a transvestite F to M in another film about servant life , the name of which I have forgotten but she was very good in it.
@@Woodman-Spare-that-treeokay, Please don't use the phrase 'transvestite.' That is a derogatory term. Trans man/woman or Trans person is the proper terminology.
Well, I guess the studios failed because I still rooted for Alex and not Dan 😂 I'm 100% on her side on the interpersonal side of things (not... the vandalism and attempt to murder ppl 😂)
Dan shouldn't have cheated, and when he did, he should have taken her to the hospital when she harmed herself. Actual villain.
sleeping with a married man is ok now?
alex's bedroom kind of looks like a padded cell
I kinda liked it tho 😅
😂😂😂
you'd think being a career woman w/ money in the 80s she'd have better home decor?
How fitting 😂
Literally watched this movie last week (for the 6th) time it never gets old Glenn Close and Anne Archer are just phenomenal. Anne (Beth the wife) is especially amazing during Bens confession, it’s a rollercoaster of emotions and bringing you with her.
Imo fatal attraction is less about mental illness and more about the AIDS crisis and the fears about heterosexual HIV transmission that were hitting a peak in 1987. The message is that if you cheat on your wife without wrapping it up, a relentless stalker will return to dispatch you and everyone you love.
I know about this theory, but James Dearden said it wasn't about it, still interesting interpretation
I can see how that would apply. Especially because Dan didn't think to use rubbers.
neither of them had AIDS though i was thinking the message is don't mess w/ married ppl or if youre the married person dont go cheating on your spouse either. this applies to everyone.
play misty for me was the original...jessica walter was just so frightening...that maniac look in her eyes... clint eastwood said he'd never work with her again cuz she gave him the creeps
I love that movie. Jessica Walter was terrifying. Evelyn was way worse than Alex. Clint Eastwood's character was beyond clueless.😂😂
You need to do a video on Swarm. Dominque Fishback kills it, and rarely does a black woman get to be the protagonist of a show and be a psycho. The caliber of character and acting was Travis Bickle/deniro level
I enjoyed that show alot. Good idea!
It’s rare because we aren’t seen as “complex women with severe mental issues” when we act like this. Donald Glover himself said his protagonist was written to be more “like an animal” than a human being.
@@evaphillips2102and that’s why Donald Glover is seen as an incel by several black women to this day.
a Gone Girl video would be amazing.
Yes👍
Over done
IMO, he is partially to blame for her increasing aggression...comparing us women being nice to a guy to wade him off, versus sleeping with someone again and again...knowing they're desperate for you, is beyond dumb.
no, he is not - he is at fault for cheating, and many other things, but her increasing aggression is entirely her own fault. If the genders were reversed, would you still feel as you claim you do?
@xBINARYGODx "..the genders are reversed", all the time... most of the time, irl. It's a huge problem globally and the women are usually blamed, ignored, and/or killed.
So you don't really need to include that, and it kinda changes things anyways
@@xBINARYGODx You know how'd they call a woman if the roles were reversed. She would be blamed for EVERYTHING. And there would be no happy ending. Usually heroines like that must die (it's a whole trope. Vamp or Femme Fatale. They almost always die. Just watch few film noir movies)
@xBINARYGODx They cannot be reversed the way you're thinking because the two sides are not the same and are not treated the same in society. Something he does will not be judged the same as something she does. It is a tiring "point" and it doesn't not work. Men are not losing out no matter how much you want to feel like they are for some reason. Their ag gression is very much accepted as just a part of them.
The effort you put into these videos cannot be understated. You deserve all the support you can get! 💖
Omg thank you so much✨
I look forward to every time you post, and this one is an hour😩
I just miss when movie stars were allowed to be kinda funky looking, like real people with a variety of faces that actually moved when they cried or laughed. SIGH.
Terrific analysis, easily the best on UA-cam.
I personally preferred the original ending with Alex taking her own life. To me, it fit her mental instability better. I love the idea that we don't know if she did it intensively to frame dan, to make him feel guilty or if she just didn't feel worthy of life any more. It could be all of thee above. It's a fantastic simple story that like you mentioned is a rochaq test of what would you do and how would you react? I love that the characters aren't simple black and white and not everything needs to be explained. We can come to our own conclusions and create our own stories continuing the author's. That's what a good story teller does. Leave you wanting more.
The remake mini series was terrible and like you said over explains everything. It was really dull and predictable. It's a shame because in modern times this could have been really interesting with social media, mobile apps, cell phones, cell phone combination locks and if you have access to your spouses password and having easier access to see if your spouses eye is wondering. Oh, well. Maybe one day 🤞
no one gets to the point of boiling a bunny when they have 0 past trauma. people without trauma don't just do messed up stuff, and next to no one has 0 trauma. i'd bet no one has none. that level behavior doesn't just come out of nowhere. something made her that way, there's so many stereotypical attachment patterns.
glenn's analysis is her own and hell, she played the character herself, she knows better than us about alex. i don't really interpret it the way glenn does, however it's extremely blatantly neon obvious alex has trauma, that must have happened between probably the ages of 13-16, as that's where the emotional intelligence of her attachment to dan lands. it didn't take me to age 36, maybe about 23, and i never went as far as she did, but i struggled with the same type of extreme jealousy and falling for emotionally unavailable and immature men that purposefully manipulate you the way he does to alex. except it's not that dan is his late 30s and alex is a 18-25 young woman, she's his age.
she has arrested development in her, specifically targeted on her emotional attachments to men, sex, intimacy, love, and self worth. which never got healed because in the capitalistic blowout heyday of the 80s, her "girlboss" life was given her social validation by everyone around her that "nothing was wrong with her". because no one cares about your mental health, especially not in the 80s, if you're able to show you are "succesful".
dan and alex are both bad people, and both because they were neglected emotionally as children/not taught anything about how to actually BE humans other than going to work, coming home, fulfilling responsibilities, and doing it all over again. except dan didn't even get taught how to properly fulfill responsibilities by either parent. his dad ignored him and his mom "boymom'd" him and coddled him, turning him into an adult child just like alex. they are both about 13-16 years old emotionally, yet the consequences are adult.
if anything close to glenn's, i interpret it as that both dan and alex were shaped by emotional incest from their parents. as well as alex has clearly been used by men before very young and still hasn't learned there's no protecting yourself from them besides simply just not engaging with them at all, she finally learned none of them ever loved her, not dan, not any of them. they're playing house, in a very screwed up and toxic way, completely separate to how the other one is. they're coping by reenacting their parent's dysfunctions to feel normal.
well said
as a bunny owner i gotta say how sweet yet sassy bunbuns can be. you must be a terrible person to attack such a precious creature!
yall are trying so hard to excuse a psycho lmfao, some people are just crazy it's not that deep, she is crazy! that's it!!
Thanks for that. It rings loud bells in my own life, which has been spent ricocheting from one married man to the next. However there is one point I would disagree with you about. In my experience Dan does not behave the way he does because he was coddled by his mother . He behaves that way because his mother abandoned him, either emotionally or by actually being physically absent. Dan’s wife then fulfils the role of Dan’s substitute mother, and Alex fulfils the role of girlfriend, and Dan sees nothing wrong with that arrangement because in his own psyche he is still (as you say in your comment above) a teenager.
@@oooh19. Not many years ago it was normal for People to raise bunnies in their back garden for food. The concept of a bunny being a non-edible pet is a modern idea.
I will never forget Glenn close in that movie, I was a kid when i watched it and she used to scare me lol
i love your videos So Much!! when you post it feels like i got a Cool-Girl magazine (like Nylon) in the mail. 😊
such a treat
I am fascinated to hear there as an intention to make her character sympathetic because I believe it failed at the time
- I honestly don't recall any debate back then - it was black and white, at least socially I remember my parents and elders discussing this film when I was a kid and Glenn Close as considered a certifiable, undiagnosed looney, "man's worst nightmare" and whore. Michael was a good guy who made a mistake. So I think it's only in hindsight most audiences have empathy for Alex.
MOONSTRUCK WAS A GREAT MOVIE 😢
Yeah, I liked it a lot
Those people were a mess.
The first Fatal Attraction was Clint Eastwood’s “Play Misty for Me”
Looking back, i think i prefer the original ending. Though that final shot of the family portrait in the released version still leaves me uneasy and sad for this family. And one more side note: How the hell Ellen was able to sleep with all that commotion going on in the bathroom 😂
The risk of older pregnancies are highly exaggerated if you look into the actual stats
But men as well who aren't healthy and older also affects the success rate of a pregnancy. Overweight, smoking, drinking...it affects the sperm.
Pregnancy in your early to mid thirties is hardly a highly exaggerated risk!
There's actually been plenty of studies that show its better for a woman to have a baby in her 30s. Over 35 is no issue either. Unless there's some other underlying medical issue, the advancement of medical science has reversed preconceived notions.
True its old men who are the problem and why we have so many people with issues. You can google it, old men sperm causes lots of higher risks. Old men forcing marriages with young women even to this day is the cause for a lot of shit.
“I love animals, I’m a great cook”. Best line ever!!! 😂
Hilarious !!!!
I’ve watched this film more times than I care to admit…after all these years and times watched, how did I ever miss that connection! 😂 Good lookin out!
Wow this was fantastic. I'm def subbing and checking out your other vids. .This essay must've been quite a bit of work! Thanks so much for sharing your insights.
Thank you for watching✨
I love your videos and your voice! Please continue to make unnecessarily long ones for us :)
thank you for this💖
She was not written as a Bordeline woman… it is so revelatory just how threatening an independent woman still is one who refuses to be treated like shit… of course she is the villain… never th man!
The patriarchy won in the end.
Michael Douglas character was absolutely vile…and the wife in the end “saved” the “sanctity” of the Home over the Fallen Woman…🙄
She was not written as a Bordeline woman… it is so revelatory just how threatening an independent, complicated sexual woman; she refuses to be treated like shit… and to hold a mirror up to Dan.
The patriarchy won in the end.
Michael Douglas character was absolutely vile…
The movie character WAS BONKERS!!! She wasn’t a complicated sexual woman! She was masking a deeply disturbed pathology. She hid her mental illness behind her sexual mystery and availability.
She sleeps with married men but refuses To be "ignored"? Please😂😂😂😂
@ oh stop with the antiquated argument. She is a free agent- HE is not. It was his recklessness that put his family in danger. The moral dubiousness of her actions have been played and overplayed- it is men like Michael Douglas’ character and the maternal like wives that they seem to (or get turned into )marry,that are so predictable in their selfishness that we can’t seem to ever get our heads round another framing of the femme fatale/ mentally unstable destruction arc/trope.
The wife saved him from his choices as she seemed to do the entire film and he remained as feckless and shameless as ever. If not more humiliated in the eyes of his already emasculating wife.
The film for me shows the moral and ethical implications of following desire under strict patriarchal norms and mores.
Sex is more complicated than our culture permits us to see it as. And for women, traumatized women particularly there are a plethora of psychological/ hormonal/ attachment issues that arise ( I single out women here because we have been placed in this role both by biology and patriarchy)- where was his care for her being? She was an object to be consumed. Women are only fooled by this trick of patriarchy for so long- she is older which was part of what compelled me and I also disagree with how she is portrayed at work- no one would blink an eye if it was a man. Alex demanded her respect especially in the area she knew she had power- being sexual and living independently.
He on the other hand was an insipid,gutless wonder the entire film- I’d have hoped that the wife and daughter left him to his own devices the wife recoiling at her choice of husband and foraging a new non domesticated future with daughter in tow …or even holding her husband accountable for his actions that endangered her family and shattered trust- way more interesting than the quietly gothic ending of “the WASP family unit united against the threat of the abject woman 😂… that Dad bought into our lives.
But if you felt like you “burned me”by adding a derivative comment… ok 👍🏽
Also, the fact that Glenn later played Cruella de Vil, whom Disney made into a career woman and man hater in Opposition to Anita who wanted a family. Practically the same role twice.
career women don't necessarily hate men
I swear I thought their kid was a boy when I first saw this movie. I’m close to the same age, and that girl would’ve been torn apart by bullies if she’d gone to my school with that boy haircut and clothes at the time. I guess some things have improved..
Given current events, this is where popular culture is headed again. But now it'll be on your phone.
Insightful and well-researched, as always ❤
I listen to your vids to chill out, you have a very soothing voice
This movie was trying to make Dan sympathetic because he didn't initiate the affair with Alex, and tried justifying his cheating because Dan felt infantilized by Beth. Beth didn't need to infantilize Dan at all, though. He did that all on his own using weaponized incompetance, so naturally Beth started acting sort of like a "mom" to him too. Most wives would eventually be turned off by that and wouldn't want to sleep with their husband if they had to be a mom to them too, but that wasn't the case with Beth and Dan. They still had some semblance of a sex life.
The movie that comes to mind when you mention the psycological drama choice for this film to be i thought about that film Damage (1992) with Juliette Binoche; along with a tragedy comes the aftermath of those wrong choices but nor the event of that tragedy is exploitative or showy; everyone's faith is absolutly pessimistic and devastating from the emotional aspect that many people wouldn't appreciate that kind of take on these stories... I agree on your point about true crime making audiences way more distant and indifferent to anything non exploitative...
I'ma check that out,
Damage, 1992 🎥🧐
Oh yeah that movie was insane.
omg I totally forgot about that movie, that ending was an intense, traumatic experience
as a fan of this film, this is a very good essay!
Yay! Missed your videos
I am 26, born in 1998 so naturally it is hard for me to understand the zeitgeist of when this movie came out. I recently watched a few older movies as I watched Misery and really liked it. This movie did not scare me it just made me really sad 😂.
Alex, the go getting insane business broad is naturally the villain.
The mom whose name I have forgotten which says enough is the good, caring mother figure so she is the hero.
In the end the good mother forgives her husband and life goes on as normal. No consequences only for the crazy villain.
Actually an extremely insightful and depressing period piece if you ask me. If Alex were real and alive today I would hope she gets helped by a mental health professional and moves on happily. And for "the mother" I hope there would be facilities to leave that sleazy asshole
You may have done this already, but if you are at all interested in the zeitgeist of this era in American film and culture check out You Must Remember This podcast . The erotic 80s and 90s episodes are great for adding context to the erotic thrillers and other sex and gender focused media of those decades. The episode on Fatal Attraction is excellent.
Thanks a lot!! I hadn't heard of that yet @@joygasm916 :)
Very good video!!
What do you use to get your clips? Do you use Streamable or something similar or do you just screen record your computer?
great video! and it was not too long. thanks for your work.💙
I have to agree with Brian de Palma. Douglas's complete lack of likeability makes the movie totally black and white for me. He's a narcissist, and she was broken.
this is exactly what i wanted, thank you
Love your videos. Thoughtful and balanced ❤
Fab! Just saw an essay on Hagsploitation, so that tracks. Glad to see how far we come regarding bodily autonomy and virtue dog whistles^^
Seen Douglas as a wannabe sugar zaddy in Will & Grace, preferred Rules of Attraction;o) First wives club's film adaptation reprieved the worst husband and while Roseanne Barr is... problematic, I still loove She-Devil, what a character arc for that prancing wimpy horndog of a husband.
If you are truly interested in studying female stalkers, I have a female stalker and I could really use someone to investigate this whole thing! I have not been able to get any legal help or convince anyone in a position of authority to help me. She's almost had me killed
Can we get an analysis of Lolita (1997)? Of course the film has its flaws, and it doesn't even compare to the book. But i would love an in-depth discussion about it.
Hey, Cher winning the Oscar for Moonstruck was well deserved. Meryl Streep winning the Oscar for best actress 3 times, however... That's a different story (especially for The Iron Lady 😐).
I saw this movie only a few years ago + I was drawn to the humanity that Glenn Close brought to her role. This film actually made me very sad.
I would love to hear your take on Lila from My Brilliant Friend
Having seen both endings, the studio was right to change it.
The original ending was just kind of meh. Yeah it’s thematically rich and blah blah blah. But it’s also a pretty flat and unengaging. Alex was going more and more over the top, so her completely loosing it at the end makes sense. Plus no matter how you look at it, Douglas get away with it in both versions.
Ooh we are in for a treat!
The color white surrounding Alex in her apartment mimicked a white padded room in a psyc ward...
Seems like every angle taken fills a void of what i search for in fem-film theory ❤🎥
And so JAM packed with angles! 💥🎥🤯
LOVE THIS THANK YOU
Love this film so much. 💞
I heard somewhere that the story of Fatal Attraction is Loosely based on the actress Sean Young and her pursuit of the actor James Woods when they were filming a movie. He turned down her advances and she became extremely aggressive and even sent a mutilated doll splashed with iodine to his doorstep.
Sean Young was hot back in the day. James Woods has never been hot. Lol
Damn!! If real then it's craaaazy
The spiritual sequel to Fatal Attraction is 101 Dalmations where Glenn Close also plays a cateer woman who is portrayed as an ubstable raging monster who does horrible things to amall cute animals, (which isnt fully fair cause she would have paid a very good price for those puppies!) the movie also goes hard on themes of motherhood and domesticity vs the pitfalls of the career woman, as explored in Susan Faludis "Backlash: the undeclared war against american woman"
🤔
@cramp4221 for real tho, once you see it you can't unsee it (like when the nanny/house keeper goes on a monologue about the virtues of motherhood and Anita has absolutely no passion for her job...as a fashion designer and is like "oh well gonna have a bb now byyyeeee")
They probably couldn't give her character a diagnosis because I don't think BPD even had a name yet or wasn't being studied as much. I have BPD as well and I can see some of it in this movie. But since it's a movie. Everything about it is turned up by a million for the camera. Also random. But another female stalker is Rumi from Perfect Blue. The movie shows Me Mania being the main stalker. But Rumi was orchestrating everything behind the scenes.
51:42 I just want to know the irony by comparison to another movie, My Best Friend's Wedding. In that film, Julia Roberts' character tries to sabotage her friend's wedding to another woman after realizing she still has feelings for him. With that said, that also had an alternate ending that involved her, having respected him moving on, and supporting him by even still going to his wedding, after he and his new bride leave, she ends up meeting another guy at the wedding that expressed interest in her, and it's implied Indian that he ends up being potentially heard you love interest. Well, that's just didn't like that, because they thought it was rewarding her for her bad behavior, and wanted to see it ending in about her being alone as penance for her actions. Mind you, the worst thing she did (albeit besides her failed attempts to thwart their engagement) was kiss him. By comparison, Michael Douglas' character in Fatal Attraction had a full on affair, which led to the other woman HE GOT PREGNANT almost KILLING HIS WIFE. And they felt an ending that involved him going to jail as a result of his actions was "too extreme"?? Just goes to show the bias of people perceiving a man being unfaithful and causing havoc as a result, versus when it's a woman put in a similar position, even when her actions are nowhere near as extreme.
Your analogy is bad LOL, the punishment is for trying To destroy Another woman's happiness, dan didn't try To destroy Alex stable relationship, it was litteraly Alex who slept with a married man and then tried To kill his wife, Julia roberts character is more Alex than Dan.
Thanks!
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The discrepancy with the daughter's age is to show that he is so divested in his family that he genuinely doesn't know how old his child is
Thank you for the BRILLIANCE!!
Although not all people with mental disorders are psycho, all psycho people have some kind of mental disorder. Normal people just don't stalk or harm others. There is definitely a disconnect up there.
One of my absolute favorite movies! The tv show was a huge disappointment
No, CPTSD or PTSD, or trauma does NOT have the same characteristics as BPD. I have dealt with and lived with people who were diagnosed with BPD and believe me this character definitely would be more a resemblance to BPD than any other real life, trauma related disorder. In fact BPD isn't necessarily due to trauma. It's a character so yes, there's no actual diagnosis of course but based on a lot of research I have done I can say trauma and BPD are definitely very different types of disorders. And I am not saying that you said it does, I am just throwing that out there.
Well it’s commonly misdiagnosed as their characteristics mimic each other. Unless case by case.
7:58 Dan says the daughter is older because he is thinking of her since he heard his wife was pregnant SUPER SWEET and low key REAL
I love the cultural issues this movie brought. The "free sex" movement the pill brought exposed the fallacy that men and women can use each other sexually without consequence. That we cant actually divest ourselves of the responsibility that comes with sexual intimacy .... We cant truly use one another as sexual objects with love and real compassion ! You must be completly detached to be sucessfully sexually promiscuous, and this naturally affects the level of passion ❤
Madame Butterfly ending would have made this a quasi Shakespearean tragedy, IF, done correctly.
The BUNNY;
Is relevant in the fact that one way to confirm a woman's pregnancy, pre modern pregnancy tests, was to use the 'A-Z or Friedman Test', in which a human females urine was injected into an immature female mouse, (or later, rabbit) and a few days later the mouse, or more commenly rabbit, was killed. Then it was autopsied to see if, even though immature, they'd gone into 'heat' (giving signs ready to breed). If the urine was from a pregnant human female, this would occur in the mice/rabbits. A sign the human female whose urine was used was, pregnant. (Hormonal reaction in the mouse/rabbit)
A term, though not exactly accurate, from this time was indicating a woman was pregnant because 'The rabbit died'.
Alex, was in this way, at least to me, confirming she was indeed, pregnant.
2nd Edit; I'm a fan of long videos, enjoyed this. Subscribed.
@0:48 is that supposed to be a dig at Moonstruck? Because that movie was great, and her character was wonderful in it.
52:34 it doesn’t let the audience know that Dan will ultimately be cleared… it suggests that WILL HIS WIFE FORGIVE HIM ENOUGH to give that tape to the police or will she let him go to prison
what do u use to edit your videos🙏
I think the alternate ending is actually way more believable.
I feel sad for Alex I don’t think she deserves to die they not only killed her but their unborn baby they could’ve helped her instead of killing her and unborn baby it’s makes me mad and sad I can relate to Alex in way my ex was always cheating on me I never felt like his I always felt like the another woman even though I wasn’t it was painful and really sad I felt so lonely in relationships I have been out of it and find love again it still hurts and I am happy now my relationship I still feel for Alex thank you for video please make more I love you
Agree.
I think he was leaving it up to her to decide as he is already in a relationship and not due to lack of confidence.
How does being an editor for 2 weeks hint at career instability?
The mythical modern audience didn't watch the show.
Modern psychologists don't love the Rorschach, diagnosis alone has also fallen out of fashion. Having said that, the video was really interesting and enjoyable.
I find it important to mention that older mothers have a research-proven tradition of selecting *older partners.* Eggs are created at the beginning of our lifetime and gradually reduce in number. That "decline in quality" of male DNA mentioned in this video is very significant. The optimal age of male fertility and reproductive health is 25-40. A younger man's swimmers are healthier and more motile; more able to survive the harsh environment of a womb long enough to find an egg. Birth defects may not be a worry for older mothers with a younger partner, and fertility may be less of a worry as well. So if anyone's like Alex or older, but still hoping to be a mother, she's better off not choosing a 50-year-old. Maturity is individual, not guaranteed with age.
Great analysis. Love this movie, i wanted to see it when it came out but my mother refused.
One quibble: Alex isnt sick with envy when he gives his daughter the rabbit. She's pregnant. It's morning sickness.
That man in the short film is the dad in The Queen's Nose
Alex is not the victim. She is the villain. She went after a married man. She cooked a bunny. She poured acid on a car. She slit her wrists. She's a very toxic woman.
Louder please!!! People are crazy!!
I think Alex has BPD. Psychologically speaking, it's interesting that she has abandonment issues but goes after a married man who will probably stay with his wife, causing her pain. But maybe it's the process of "being chosen". If she has an affair w/a married man and he chooses her over his wife, it's a grander conquest and boosts her deflated ego, soothing her abandonment wound 😢
It's never too long
i need a video essay about season 2 of dirty John, with the actress from the fatale attraction TV show.
Never married. Can’t relate. Two daughters that I raised to success on my own.
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Two daughters out of wedlock is not a flex lol.
He never should have seen her the 2nd time, that gave her some hope that maybe he did have feelings for here, because playing with the dog in the park and having lunch at her place that's a date, that's something a couple would do
The font you use for their names, is the same font the adult toy company Adam and Eve uses
I subscribed based on this critique video. excellent! On a different topic (movie) the book Alien Woman (about the first four Alien movies) by Ximena Gallardo C and C Jason Smith is a very good feminist read on those movies