This is not "inexplicable." The British Gunners who witnessed the crash landing of the empty B-17 reported that the parachutes were till on board when in fact what they had seem were the empty packs, the chutes having been used when the Pilot ordered the aircraft abandoned. The crew were all found safe and sound after they had bailed out. The aircraft crash landed because the Pilot had set the autopilot and reduced throttles, so the aircraft would maintain level flight in a long slow dive. Its a weird set of coincidences but really not a mystery.
After WWII B-17's could be purchased for $2500 surplus with a full tank of fuel to fly it away. One was sold to a pilot from Portland, Oregon. A single engine pilot, he crashed the first airplae and complained it was defective. They gave him another airplane, but balked at giving him another tank of fuel. He had no more money and finally talked them into giving him more fuel. He flew the airplane to Troutdale Airport near Portland and landed without incident with only 37 hours flying time. He was refused permission to truck the airplane to Milwaukie, Oregon, just South of Portland, so he and a group of friends got together one Sunday night around midnight and drove the airplane to Milwaukie, where it was found sitting in a field Monday morning. The airplane became the cover over gas pumps at a station known for many decades as The Bomber. In the early days you could climb a ladder and go inside of the airplane, but vandals stopped that. Today the airplane has been moved to Salem Airport where it is being restored and one day will once again grace the skys of this great nation.
After the war my uncle who was a pilot in the South Pacific went to Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio where they were selling surplus military aircraft. There were lines of different type aircraft a half mile long. Out of one of those lines he purchased a P-51D with tanks topped off for the sum of $1500. There were hundreds more available most were scrapped unfortunately.
My Great Uncle Ashley Bean was a B-17 Pilot, He was Shot down over Germany and was a POW. A few years before he past a flying B-17 came to our state and he got to fly one more time in a B-17.
My uncle was shot down and broke his leg when he parachuted out spent 6weeks in the German forest before being captured. Spent 9 months a pow before being rescued. Those were some tough old birds.
The test pilot Ployer P Hill had an airbase named after him in Northern Utah. It was first named Ployer Field and later named Hill Field, it's now called Hill AFB.
The US Forest service used B17s as fire bombers in Montana losing one Aug. 1967 to an engine fire on take off. (Huckleberry Mtn. Fire in Glacier National Park). I saw it flying into the Park on a run through Bad Rock Canyon and later took photos of it at the crash site. In ‘75 and ‘76 at West Yellowstone, MT I helped with smoke jumpers doing training where a B17 and a C 47 were used for a simulated fire attack training. I had a chance to go through the B17g, I was impressed by the fact that the usage wear on the plane was extraordinary, with wear patches around every toggle switch at the pilots position and fatigue cracks around the engines.
My grandpa was the lead designer for the B 17 and my grandma and her 2nd cousin were the test pilots. I remember as a kid seeing old grandma put that bird through her paces in front of a big crowd that included Cary Grant , WC Fields and Albert Einstein.
The truth is,The bomber did land itself but a belly landing..the wheels were up,The chutes were used,The canvas bags that held them were left in the fuselage..no jackets were found except the light windbreaker type..nobody is going to take their heavy jackets off at altitude in cold weather November
@@BogusJNutherwebb I looked into this story more than 30yrs ago and back then,It was just an oddball event that had happened All I could find on it was that it had belly landed,wheels up and had been badly damaged,fuel tanks empty Nobody onboard Autopilot was engaged. No parachutes,no jackets except for the light cotton windbreaker types. This happened in November..so at altitude Nobody was going to take off their fleece jackets..and they are not going to take them off to bail out. Nobody interviewed thought any mysterious ideas or spooky events. It was certainly not a common event but nothing creepy. Things have been changed,added,removed from the story ad nauseum.
The flying at air shows is not just a tribute to those that gave there life's for freedoms and the crews that survived but suffered, it's also an important link with the past. Those that do not head the leasons of the past are fated to repeat the errors of the past. Ultimately no one wins in war and only the weapons companies benefit.
I will disagree. Yes, both sides suffer but the ideas of fascism and military dictatorship had to be expunged from the planet. All ideas are NOT equal.
A few weeks ago a B17 flew right over my house, at an altitude of about 2000ft, the sound it made was amazing, like an army of Harley Davidsons passing by
G’day Dark, That first yarn is a bit beneath you. Asking us to believe that any aircraft, autopilot or not, of that vintage, could automatically deploy its landing gear is damaging your reputation. If you had taken the time to really research that particular incident you’d know that it was a ‘belly landing’; sure, it was a one in a million shot that it descended gradually, in level flight, as the weight of the fuel was used up and landed. But you misrepresented it as if it was a normal landing at a prepared landing strip. You should have known that was nothing but ‘horse feathers’. Most importantly, the crew were accounted for, having used their parachutes, leaving the chute covers to be found after the aircraft landed. Oddly, you did this video about B-17s from an overly positive standpoint. Sure, they were amazing technology for their day, however, the USAAF’s decision to do daylight raids over occupied Europe and Germany cost extra thousands of American lives. The RAF had originally attempted daylight raids and swiftly shelved them. They repeatedly advised the 8th Air Force not to do this but were ignored. Eventually, after the B-17 losses were so high they had to be kept secret from the press and even from elements within the US military and Congress. Raids were brought to a halt while desperate efforts were made to extend the range of USAAF escort fighters like the outstanding P-51 Mustangs which were originally created due to an order from the RAF. Night raids were significantly more difficult with much reduced accuracy until ‘area’ or ‘carpet’ bombing was adopted by using Mosquitos as Pathfinder target markers. I know it’s not easy to tell every part of a story in less than 20 minutes but you’ve been around long enough to know you don’t need to embellish or alter facts to attract views. You also don't need 'clickbait' thumbnail pics. Cheers, Bill H.
@@transit130 This makes at least three of us... and who knows how many others! Personally , once I have already clicked on it, I can even watch a video with imprecisions or embellishments and clickbaits, but will never subscribe (and even less support!) such a channel: there is enough BS and wrong infos about WW2 on YT to keep supporting more...
this is why I now try to avoid watching any Dark Docs stories. Tired of all the inconsistencies, which I think is deliberate. They fall into the "Fake News" category.
Never flown a fort but flown in one Sally B , we were bounced by a pair of spits on a simulated attack jeeeze it was amazing ,how the eff these men fought in these machines is quite frankly beggaring belief RIP all brave men who perished in these missions
I just saw a B-17 yesterday. I knew what it was as soon as I heard it, it's a tell-tale sound and I've heard her a few times before. And I rushed to the top level of my apartment building to watch her slowly fly by. She was shiny metal, not the typical olive drab. I watched until I couldn't see or hear her anymore... 85 years old and still flying straight and true.
The checklist, as most know, is key to safety. It may have come from Aircraft after learning the hard way, but smart truck drivers heavy equipment operators and others use it every day. So did I when I was driving Comercial truck and running excavators. It's just good sense in a world that hasn't much common about sense these days.
I flew on one of these a couple months after the door incident earlier this year. It had mechanical issues before takeoff, and after a lengthy test flight, was able to take off with passengers. I texted my friend "oh great, it's a Boeing too"
@@zchris87v80If it actually had significant issues before takeoff then it either wouldn’t have taken off or you wouldn’t be here today to regurgitate the common media fearmongering
My Grandfather , Harry F. Bowling, was a B17 pilot. Shot down near the end of the war he spent the last months of the war in Stalog 9. He passed away in 1997.
During an air show in Reading PA I remember paving a driveway and seeing a B17 flying around the area and you never expect how big the plane actually is until you’ve seen it irl. The B17 was absolutely huge for its time.
I saw a B-17G in Lebanon, TN in the 80's at an airshow. I think it was called Aluminum Overcast. The show had a mock dogfight between a P-51 Mustang (Miss Coronado) and a Messerschmitt 109 (Last Act of Defiance) . The show was amazing!!!
The B17 is my favorite aircraft of all time! Such a beautiful and graceful ships. I drooled over the B17F at The Museum of Flight by Boeing Field. I never get tired of hearing about 'OL 666, and her heroic men that flew her. I got to see real deal Rosie The Riveters at the Museum of Flight, and also got to meet a very neat lady that was a B17 ferry pilot. I have so much admiration and respect for our WWll veterans and civilians who won WWll!
I believe a comment from Lancaster crews on first being shown a B17 was yeah, lovely 'plane, but where do the bombs go? All the various heavies crews were true heroes. Unbelievable, screwing their courage to the sticking point, (to awfully misquote) time after time...
WW2 aviation enthusiasts MUST attend EAA Airventure at least once! Watching and hearing B-17s, B-29s, P-51s, P-40s and the like is beyond fantastic. When I lived just south of ATW, north of Oshkosh WI, I would watch Aluminum Overcast, EAA's B-17 flying overhead and doing touch-and-goes when they were training and checking out their pilots.
I got to fly in a B-17 from the CAF back in the 1970s when I was a teenager. Luckily, I don't have claustrophobia. Back then I built every WWII aircraft model I could find. One of my neighbors had a P-51 Mustang. It had a bubble canopy, but I don't remember which exact version it was. I helped that neighbor maintain and work on it. That Merlin engine was awesome with the supercharger.
It is 21 November 1944A B-17G Flying Fortress, 43-38545, sustained damage from flak fire the pilot gave the order to bail out. The aircraft continued its flight, gradually descending until it landed in a field in Belgium it came to a stop itself. Later the crew of nine survived and returned to duty
I used to be the lead in the Boeing B&W Photo Lab. I don’t know how many photos of B-15s, B-17s, B-29s I printed but it was a lot. Also prints of the Boeing Flying Boat. Those had 3 different tail variations.
One of the dumbest actions of the usaaf was in the beginning of "strategic bombing" was to armor the planes where the bullet holes were instead of where they weren't
@@nicholasbell9017 ...think about it - if the plane survived the bullets that wasn't the critical area to protect. If the planes didn't back they probably got hit in the critical places - no one is going to see those holes, the plane didn't come back.
@@78tag wenn man jedes wort punktgenau für bare münze nimmt ohne mal vorher selbst den kopf einzuschalten. du glaubst doch nicht ernsthaft das die wie dumme chimpansen einfach panzerung "auf" die einschusslöcher genietet haben oder? dir ist schon bewusst das man vorher bewertet hat welcher schaden wo angerichtet hätte werden können?
Some B-17's survived to be used as tankers fighting forest fires into the 70's. One even had a long career as a roof over a service station in Portland, Oregon, and, as recently as 2023, was being restored with the plan to have it fly again.
The US Storm Center used them for years to fly into hurricanes and gather information. This was well before we could use satellites were used to gather the same information. Later Jets were used, but the B-17's were used because they could handle the severe conditions inside the storms.
Going to airshows when I was a kid ,I've explored many B17's. Back in the day sat in the belly ball, pilot seat ,bombers seat everywhere through out. Those days are gone.
@@garryferrington811when 909 spun on takeoff and crashed it was her second time: I saw her cross PA 60 before she overshot the runway in Beaver County PA and was rebuilt. Saw her in ???’06 at the Allegheny County Airport and again in ‘19 from a distance at ? Hazleton ?PA. Engine failure a few months later, maybe due to the wrong fuel.
Should have tinted the opening scenes green and played "Take A Ride" for the opening sound track... Dad told me some hair raising stories about B-17's that barely made it back with what was left of their crews. He never mentioned an empty one that landed itself, though.
But what about the other post-war mission for many B-17's including the movie "Memphis Belle" plane? Many were used as firebombers protecting the homefront once again but this time from wildfires.
666 was scrapped due to how badly shot up it was after that photorecon mission. Somebody started counting all the holes in it but gave up, saying "After the first 100 holes it really didn't matter." (Quote from memory.)
No special feat. This is me most weekends. Head out on mission, get wrecked and wake in the morning to find my landing was automated and also pure fluke. Well what do you know, I'm a B-17!
My father-in-law was the copilot of the B-17 in Europe during World War II in April of 1943 while on a mission over France he was shot down by none other than the famous German Ace Pips Priller and then spent the rest of the war in the famous camp Stalag Luft lll and was the end part of the infamous winter death march from Stalag Luft lll to Stalag 7A in moosburg Germany.
There must have been a record of who the crew was. It should be possible to find some trace of what happened to them it is inconceivable that they would have jumped without parachutes so there must be some record of what happened to them.
Gesh you people are so spoiled... If you can't handle this than you wouldn't make it with the history channel in the cable days before youtube was around😂
@@oodragondrew Not with my provider it wasn’t. And It is not the it is now when we pick and choose what we watch and when we watch it. Too many ads? Record it and FF through them or my TV has AI that deletes the ads.
My great uncle was a mechanic .He saw aircraft land on Saipan, so full of holes they didn't know where to start. But got most back in the air to make more runs.😊
I have two radio control B 17s models. Fun to fly in a scale like manner. Where it really shines is when we get several in the air and fly a formation pattern around the field.
And the flaps set themselves into landing position and the plane deployed its own landing gear. Now even Cessna pilots know what happens when you "dirty up the airfoil." You have to add down elevator to compensate. Then you deploy the landing gear and you'll have to give the plane some power to compensate for the drag. Then it made a straight in approach at just the right altitude and airspeed after balancing speed and drag. Then there is the flare and touchdown. When the wings come into ground effect the throttles are pulled back to idle and the plane goes into a controlled stall that puts the wheels down gently. That's not what a 1944 autopilot could do. That's why the human pilot is there. This unmanned aircraft just managed to find that heading leading straight into a runway out of all the possible vectors over three countries. Then after all that, the plane shuts off it's magnetos and fuel for the four engines and just sits there. NOPE. This story is a fairy tale for the guilliable.
The gear was down to slow down when the crew bailed (the parachutes were NOT still on board, just the empty packs), and the plane didn't make a "perfect landing", it broke apart.
This is bollocks, the B-17's autopilot, the Sperry A-3, was quite advanced for its time and could hold a steady course, maintain altitude, and control bank and pitch to an extent. However, it wasn't capable of the sophisticated automated navigation and definetly not the landing systems we see today in most commercial and military aircraft. The A-3 autopilot required manual input for navigation changes, so a crew member had to adjust headings or control descent. While it could assist with level flight and reduce the crew's workload, it wasn’t designed to handle the entire process of navigating back to an airfield or executing a landing sequence autonomously. In cases where the crew was incapacitated, the plane could maintain a stable course, but it couldn’t “find” its way back to a specific location or perform a controlled landing on its own. A pilot or copilot would still need to take control to make necessary heading adjustments, align with the runway, and execute the landing approach. The pilots could point the aircraft in the general direction they wanted the aircraft to go, they could reduce engine power to ensure that the altitude dimished overtime, perhaps even crash landing in a known area, there are many examples where pilots of seriously damaged Allied bombers pointed their aircraft out to sea and reduced engine power to ensure it crashed in the sea, if it made it, before the bailed out. There were experimental developments of autoland systems before the BAC Trident became the first aircraft with it fitted as standard, primarily in military and research contexts. In the 1950s, the U.S. military and several aviation research organisations conducted early experiments with automatic landing systems to improve safety in adverse weather and for carrier operations. One significant early development was by the U.S. Navy and the Cornell Aeronautical Laboratory, which experimented with an autoland system on a modified Grumman F6F Hellcat during the late 1940s. These tests aimed to enable safe landings on aircraft carriers in poor visibility, but the technology was still experimental and not fully autonomous, it was abandoned in late 1949 following 8 crash landings and the death of the crews. In the 1950s, the U.S. Air Force took up the mantle and began experimenting with autoland systems for bomber and reconnaissance aircraft, such as the Boeing B-47 Stratojet, these systems were developed to assist, again, in landing under adverse conditions, particularly to address the demands of high-speed jet landings and ensure safe operations, especially in poor visibility. However, these systems were not fully autonomous and required some level of pilot monitoring, and often, intervention. The most advanced experimental system of the time was developed by NASA and the U.S. Air Force during the late 1950s and early 1960s as part of the Automatic Landing System (ALS) project, which tested autoland technology on various military aircraft, including modified jet fighters and bombers. These experiments paved the way for more reliable autoland systems but were primarily focused on research and not widely implemented, they were dependent on aircraft only systems that did not take signals or information from the ground. The first truly operational autoland system, which enabled an aircraft to land without requiring pilot input, was developed in the early 1960s. British Aircraft Corporation (BAC) was instrumental in developing this technology in collaboration with Smiths Industries for the Hawker Siddeley Trident airliner. The Trident became the first aircraft and the first commercial airliner with an operational, independent, autoland capability, achieving its first automatic landing in 1965. This system used radar and advanced avionics to guide the aircraft through the descent and landing phases. It relied on a combination of ground-based Instrument Landing System (ILS) signals and onboard sensors to maintain alignment with the runway. Autoland was initially designed to assist pilots in landing during low-visibility conditions, making commercial aviation safer in foggy or adverse weather. While the Trident was the first airliner with autoland, other aircraft soon followed, such as the Boeing 727, 737, 747 and McDonald Douglas DC-10, which were also equipped with autoland systems by the late 1960s and early 1970s. Today, autoland systems are common in commercial aviation and are essential for safe landings in poor visibility.
Out of all the insane stories I've heard over the years about WWII this is one I just can't swallow. Considering how hot the military was for good war propaganda, this really smacks of it.
*B-17 in real life:* [Able to take so much damage that it could even potentially survive gliding to a landing with no one at the controls] *B-17 in War Thunder:* “Oh no, I took one shot to my fuselage from a machine gun round, now I’m going to tear myself apart :(
This is not "inexplicable." The British Gunners who witnessed the crash landing of the empty B-17 reported that the parachutes were till on board when in fact what they had seem were the empty packs, the chutes having been used when the Pilot ordered the aircraft abandoned. The crew were all found safe and sound after they had bailed out.
The aircraft crash landed because the Pilot had set the autopilot and reduced throttles, so the aircraft would maintain level flight in a long slow dive.
Its a weird set of coincidences but really not a mystery.
You a Sabbath fan?
You are correct.....Well said
Hell yeah triple 6 all the way@davidjackson2690
Maybe an other worldly green orb chased the plane and then entered it and turned the crew into the undead?
@@mikehawkins6272 those damn foo fighters
After WWII B-17's could be purchased for $2500 surplus with a full tank of fuel to fly it away. One was sold to a pilot from Portland, Oregon. A single engine pilot, he crashed the first airplae and complained it was defective. They gave him another airplane, but balked at giving him another tank of fuel. He had no more money and finally talked them into giving him more fuel. He flew the airplane to Troutdale Airport near Portland and landed without incident with only 37 hours flying time. He was refused permission to truck the airplane to Milwaukie, Oregon, just South of Portland, so he and a group of friends got together one Sunday night around midnight and drove the airplane to Milwaukie, where it was found sitting in a field Monday morning. The airplane became the cover over gas pumps at a station known for many decades as The Bomber. In the early days you could climb a ladder and go inside of the airplane, but vandals stopped that. Today the airplane has been moved to Salem Airport where it is being restored and one day will once again grace the skys of this great nation.
Wow, never heard this bit of lore, thanks!
I remember seeing in on family trips to visit relatives in Florence OR. By that time they weren't letting people go aboard.
$2,500 was alot of money back then
@@johnkelly4233 In today's money that's $37K. The new owner would make that back in a couple months or less giving rides on it.
After the war my uncle who was a pilot in the South Pacific went to Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio where they were selling surplus military aircraft. There were lines of different type aircraft a half mile long. Out of one of those lines he purchased a P-51D with tanks topped off for the sum of $1500. There were hundreds more available most were scrapped unfortunately.
My Great Uncle Ashley Bean was a B-17 Pilot, He was Shot down over Germany and was a POW. A few years before he past a flying B-17 came to our state and he got to fly one more time in a B-17.
My dad was a B-17 rear gunner, survived two crash landings. Received credit for two German kills and had his seat shot from under him.
My uncle was shot down and broke his leg when he parachuted out spent 6weeks in the German forest before being captured. Spent 9 months a pow before being rescued. Those were some tough old birds.
A True Veteran Day Tribute
Thanks for sharing
Holy shit....That's AMAZING !!!
The test pilot Ployer P Hill had an airbase named after him in Northern Utah. It was first named Ployer Field and later named Hill Field, it's now called Hill AFB.
The US Forest service used B17s as fire bombers in Montana losing one Aug. 1967 to an engine fire on take off. (Huckleberry Mtn. Fire in Glacier National Park). I saw it flying into the Park on a run through Bad Rock Canyon and later took photos of it at the crash site. In ‘75 and ‘76 at West Yellowstone, MT I helped with smoke jumpers doing training where a B17 and a C 47 were used for a simulated fire attack training. I had a chance to go through the B17g, I was impressed by the fact that the usage wear on the plane was extraordinary, with wear patches around every toggle switch at the pilots position and fatigue cracks around the engines.
My mother was a rosy she work in two plants one in Kansas one in Cal.
These B-17 videos are a bit personal for me. My dad’s oldest brother was a fort pilot. Survived two tours with the 8th AF and 41 missions credited.
Godspeed unc
As Vietnam veteran please tell your dad,thank you, from me
My grandpa was the lead designer for the B 17 and my grandma and her 2nd cousin were the test pilots. I remember as a kid seeing old grandma put that bird through her paces in front of a big crowd that included Cary Grant , WC Fields and Albert Einstein.
Full respect to your uncle
@@John-k6f9kwhat an absolutely awesome story! Thanks for sharing it with us all.
🇺🇸🏴🇺🇸🏴🇺🇸🏴
The truth is,The bomber did land itself but a belly landing..the wheels were up,The chutes were used,The canvas bags that held them were left in the fuselage..no jackets were found except the light windbreaker type..nobody is going to take their heavy jackets off at altitude in cold weather November
Thank you. I was more than a little annoyed that we got half a story.
Not bailing out in those days at altitude without that jacket in any time of year.
Did it actually and accurately land on a landing strip? How in the heck.....
@@BogusJNutherwebb I looked into this story more than 30yrs ago and back then,It was just an oddball event that had happened
All I could find on it was that it had belly landed,wheels up and had been badly damaged,fuel tanks empty
Nobody onboard Autopilot was engaged.
No parachutes,no jackets except for the light cotton windbreaker types.
This happened in November..so at altitude Nobody was going to take off their fleece jackets..and they are not going to take them off to bail out.
Nobody interviewed thought any mysterious ideas or spooky events.
It was certainly not a common event but nothing creepy.
Things have been changed,added,removed from the story ad nauseum.
Yeah, this is why I decided to quit listening to Dark Docs, and then fell for this one. I want make that mistake again...
My first model at the age of 9 and now 63 years later I still love building the B-17.
There are some insane model kits of the Fort these days, and in giant scales. That's one I've never quite wanted to tackle. 😅😅
I’ve been thinking about scratch building around a 5ft wingspan RC model. I’ve built a few simple models, this would be a great challenge for sure…
Where's the plane with its nose blown off that was in the thumbnail? Never thought I'd be a victim of clickbait on this channel.
LOL...I think that's the correct term for responding to satire.😁
The flying at air shows is not just a tribute to those that gave there life's for freedoms and the crews that survived but suffered, it's also an important link with the past.
Those that do not head the leasons of the past are fated to repeat the errors of the past.
Ultimately no one wins in war and only the weapons companies benefit.
Oh, I would argue that all the congressmen and senators that are heavily invested in defense stocks win.
I will disagree. Yes, both sides suffer but the ideas of fascism and military dictatorship had to be expunged from the planet. All ideas are NOT equal.
Far right is sweeping across Europe one more time, i guess WW3 has already started
Nah. It’s a waste of fuel and resources. Covered up with this bullshit you just respewed
Sorry, fascism is back and about to take over the country. All those sacrifices were made in vain.
A few weeks ago a B17 flew right over my house, at an altitude of about 2000ft, the sound it made was amazing, like an army of Harley Davidsons passing by
Was it silver or camo-colored? If silver, it was probably Aluminum Overcast; camo might have been Sally B.
@@thatjeff7550 I only heard it, never saw it.
Gotta love those big Pratt and Whitney radial engines...sweet music to old pilots....
They should have saved this plane as a museum piece!!
G’day Dark, That first yarn is a bit beneath you. Asking us to believe that any aircraft, autopilot or not, of that vintage, could automatically deploy its landing gear is damaging your reputation.
If you had taken the time to really research that particular incident you’d know that it was a ‘belly landing’; sure, it was a one in a million shot that it descended gradually, in level flight, as the weight of the fuel was used up and landed.
But you misrepresented it as if it was a normal landing at a prepared landing strip. You should have known that was nothing but ‘horse feathers’.
Most importantly, the crew were accounted for, having used their parachutes, leaving the chute covers to be found after the aircraft landed.
Oddly, you did this video about B-17s from an overly positive standpoint. Sure, they were amazing technology for their day, however, the USAAF’s decision to do daylight raids over occupied Europe and Germany cost extra thousands of American lives.
The RAF had originally attempted daylight raids and swiftly shelved them. They repeatedly advised the 8th Air Force not to do this but were ignored.
Eventually, after the B-17 losses were so high they had to be kept secret from the press and even from elements within the US military and Congress.
Raids were brought to a halt while desperate efforts were made to extend the range of USAAF escort fighters like the outstanding P-51 Mustangs which were originally created due to an order from the RAF.
Night raids were significantly more difficult with much reduced accuracy until ‘area’ or ‘carpet’ bombing was adopted by using Mosquitos as Pathfinder target markers.
I know it’s not easy to tell every part of a story in less than 20 minutes but you’ve been around long enough to know you don’t need to embellish or alter facts to attract views. You also don't need 'clickbait' thumbnail pics.
Cheers, Bill H.
Bill Halliwell, for some time now Ive been thinking the same. I`m glad someone else has noticed.
@@transit130 This makes at least three of us... and who knows how many others! Personally , once I have already clicked on it, I can even watch a video with imprecisions or embellishments and clickbaits, but will never subscribe (and even less support!) such a channel: there is enough BS and wrong infos about WW2 on YT to keep supporting more...
this is why I now try to avoid watching any Dark Docs stories. Tired of all the inconsistencies, which I think is deliberate. They fall into the "Fake News" category.
Totally correct, sir.
Yes, THIS VIDEO for me, was one step too far in the Fake BS trhat he posts more and more- I'll be unsubbing - Good luck!
The fat electrician "old 666" vid is absolutely awesome and gives so much more depth
@jeast417 Mr fat cheeto he is awesome
This could be considered click bait.
@@tomjones4318 Positive 'Stars and Stripes' propaganda. Nothing wrong with an uplifting story when needed.
Twelve O'Clock High is a fantastic film. Highly recommended.
You are going to call your plane The Leper Colony and you will get every misfit in the squadron.
I grew up watching that movie, but liked the TV Show more than the movie.
Never flown a fort but flown in one Sally B , we were bounced by a pair of spits on a simulated attack jeeeze it was amazing ,how the eff these men fought in these machines is quite frankly beggaring belief RIP all brave men who perished in these missions
Indestructible is the name of the book about how one man was pivotal in changes to the planes and strategies of the Pacific theater.
B-17 is a most beautiful airplane, along with DC-3/ 10, P-51,P-38, P-40! Great feats of imagination and need for endurance
I just saw a B-17 yesterday. I knew what it was as soon as I heard it, it's a tell-tale sound and I've heard her a few times before.
And I rushed to the top level of my apartment building to watch her slowly fly by.
She was shiny metal, not the typical olive drab.
I watched until I couldn't see or hear her anymore... 85 years old and still flying straight and true.
The checklist, as most know, is key to safety. It may have come from Aircraft after learning the hard way, but smart truck drivers heavy equipment operators and others use it every day. So did I when I was driving Comercial truck and running excavators. It's just good sense in a world that hasn't much common about sense these days.
Back when Boeing meant top quality.
I flew on one of these a couple months after the door incident earlier this year. It had mechanical issues before takeoff, and after a lengthy test flight, was able to take off with passengers. I texted my friend "oh great, it's a Boeing too"
There be truth in that.
Better a Boeing than a Chinese 737 copy.
Back before the US turned into a right wing fascist pariah state. Before it was embarrassing to be American.
@@zchris87v80If it actually had significant issues before takeoff then it either wouldn’t have taken off or you wouldn’t be here today to regurgitate the common media fearmongering
My Grandfather , Harry F. Bowling, was a B17 pilot. Shot down near the end of the war he spent the last months of the war in Stalog 9. He passed away in 1997.
During an air show in Reading PA I remember paving a driveway and seeing a B17 flying around the area and you never expect how big the plane actually is until you’ve seen it irl. The B17 was absolutely huge for its time.
The story of Old 666 was told in an episode of the History Channel show "Dogfights". It's the episode called "Long Odds" and can be watched on YT.
I saw a B-17G in Lebanon, TN in the 80's at an airshow. I think it was called Aluminum Overcast. The show had a mock dogfight between a P-51 Mustang (Miss Coronado) and a Messerschmitt 109 (Last Act of Defiance) . The show was amazing!!!
The B17 is my favorite aircraft of all time! Such a beautiful and graceful ships. I drooled over the B17F at The Museum of Flight by Boeing Field. I never get tired of hearing about 'OL 666, and her heroic men that flew her. I got to see real deal Rosie The Riveters at the Museum of Flight, and also got to meet a very neat lady that was a B17 ferry pilot. I have so much admiration and respect for our WWll veterans and civilians who won WWll!
There was also once a B17 tail that flew and landed after the rest of the aircraft had been torn away by flak during the war.
That tail's name? Albert Einstein.
Some Forts found post-war employment as crop dusters. Back in the '60s you'd see them at rural airports.
❤❤❤❤❤ Thank you for telling this story
Thats crazy, it reminds me of the astounding stories episode that aired in the '80s!
It is the origin of the episode you speak of. Good memory,,cudos
My great uncle MIA 5-31-45, 94 BG 332 Squadron 😮
I believe a comment from Lancaster crews on first being shown a B17 was yeah, lovely 'plane, but where do the bombs go?
All the various heavies crews were true heroes. Unbelievable, screwing their courage to the sticking point, (to awfully misquote) time after time...
Despite their impressive sight most WW2 bombers only managed to drop around 30% of their bombs anywhere near their actual target.
WW2 aviation enthusiasts MUST attend EAA Airventure at least once! Watching and hearing B-17s, B-29s, P-51s, P-40s and the like is beyond fantastic. When I lived just south of ATW, north of Oshkosh WI, I would watch Aluminum Overcast, EAA's B-17 flying overhead and doing touch-and-goes when they were training and checking out their pilots.
And you can still find the B-17's gear handle today in the cockpit of the lords Chariot the 737
I got to fly in a B-17 from the CAF back in the 1970s when I was a teenager. Luckily, I don't have claustrophobia. Back then I built every WWII aircraft model I could find. One of my neighbors had a P-51 Mustang. It had a bubble canopy, but I don't remember which exact version it was. I helped that neighbor maintain and work on it. That Merlin engine was awesome with the supercharger.
Homie is literally just reading a whole page from 2015 with pictures added on top.
It is 21 November 1944A B-17G Flying Fortress, 43-38545, sustained damage from flak fire the pilot gave the order to bail out. The aircraft continued its flight, gradually descending until it landed in a field in Belgium it came to a stop itself. Later the crew of nine survived and returned to duty
I used to be the lead in the Boeing B&W Photo Lab. I don’t know how many photos of B-15s, B-17s, B-29s I printed but it was a lot.
Also prints of the Boeing Flying Boat. Those had 3 different tail variations.
The B-17 and DC-3 were great airplanes of their day. Amazing how althogh they returned so damaged, yet still managed to still fly.
The bomb sight was still in the plane when it landed. I'm betting the bombardier caught hell when he got home.
Amazing Video!! Thank you Sir.👍🇺🇲
I love the narrators voice. I keep expecting him to say ''Go ahead punk, make my day''
What happened to the crew of the phantom. What did they say ???
One of the dumbest actions of the usaaf was in the beginning of "strategic bombing" was to armor the planes where the bullet holes were instead of where they weren't
I like your sense of humour.
Triple Six became the harbinger of death it was numbered to be. It just took a few men with a little devil in them to convert it
@@nicholasbell9017 ...think about it - if the plane survived the bullets that wasn't the critical area to protect. If the planes didn't back they probably got hit in the critical places - no one is going to see those holes, the plane didn't come back.
@@78tag wenn man jedes wort punktgenau für bare münze nimmt ohne mal vorher selbst den kopf einzuschalten.
du glaubst doch nicht ernsthaft das die wie dumme chimpansen einfach panzerung "auf" die einschusslöcher genietet haben oder?
dir ist schon bewusst das man vorher bewertet hat welcher schaden wo angerichtet hätte werden können?
What we now know as "confirmation bias".
Some B-17's survived to be used as tankers fighting forest fires into the 70's. One even had a long career as a roof over a service station in Portland, Oregon, and, as recently as 2023, was being restored with the plan to have it fly again.
Somehow, this incident failed to make the list of incidents for B-17s in Wikipedia . . . . yet another mystery!
Was the crew very Caucasian?😂
The US Storm Center used them for years to fly into hurricanes and gather information. This was well before we could use satellites were used to gather the same information. Later Jets were used, but the B-17's were used because they could handle the severe conditions inside the storms.
Going to airshows when I was a kid ,I've explored many B17's. Back in the day sat in the belly ball, pilot seat ,bombers seat everywhere through out.
Those days are gone.
Can someone please tell me if I understood this correctly: The Phantom B17 had all it's parachutes still on board?
No, what was found were empty chute packs.
Sadly, we've lost a few and their aircrews that were in private hands due to accidents these last few years.
RIP to the crews of Texas Raiders and N6367, 11/12/2022, Wings Over Dallas
@@svn-wq4fm Yup, now that's a sad video to watch.
They're all worn out and shouldn't fly any more.
@@garryferrington811when 909 spun on takeoff and crashed it was her second time: I saw her cross PA 60 before she overshot the runway in Beaver County PA and was rebuilt. Saw her in ???’06 at the Allegheny County Airport and again in ‘19 from a distance at ? Hazleton ?PA. Engine failure a few months later, maybe due to the wrong fuel.
How did the throttles get pulled back?
It's absolutely amazing how these planes and crew made it back
Any record of the crew being captured?
Zeamer's Eager Beavers is a wonderful story that needs to be made into a film.
Should have tinted the opening scenes green and played "Take A Ride" for the opening sound track...
Dad told me some hair raising stories about B-17's that barely made it back with what was left of their crews. He never mentioned an empty one that landed itself, though.
Hard to believe. Who should have engaged the landing gear on that self-landing B17?
How it flew and landed is one thing. But what happened to the crew? And apparently without parachutes.
But what about the other post-war mission for many B-17's including the movie "Memphis Belle" plane? Many were used as firebombers protecting the homefront once again but this time from wildfires.
"Coming in on a wing and a prayer," indeed.
That can’t be true. How
This would have been a good start for a Twilight Zone episode.
It's already been filmed, either the TZ or the outer limits. A commercial flight lands and taxis to the gate with no crew or passengers.
What happened to the airframes 666 and the mystery bomber ? Were both parked because of damage, then scraped ?
666 was scrapped due to how badly shot up it was after that photorecon mission. Somebody started counting all the holes in it but gave up, saying "After the first 100 holes it really didn't matter." (Quote from memory.)
No special feat. This is me most weekends. Head out on mission, get wrecked and wake in the morning to find my landing was automated and also pure fluke.
Well what do you know, I'm a B-17!
I hate that I sometimes have to turn on the captions to make out what you're saying.
The narrator sounds scared stiff to me as if he’s trying to get it out before something dreadful occurs to him .
My father-in-law was the copilot of the B-17 in Europe during World War II in April of 1943 while on a mission over France he was shot down by none other than the famous German Ace Pips Priller and then spent the rest of the war in the famous camp Stalag Luft lll and was the end part of the infamous winter death march from Stalag Luft lll to Stalag 7A in moosburg Germany.
Grampa Roy was B 17's ETO. Maybe a first EWO?
It really is a window to the past. When I see one take off or land, my mind goes back to the times it was built for.
'Dumbo' was the nickname for PBY Catalinas, not B-17 rescue ships.
There must have been a record of who the crew was. It should be possible to find some trace of what happened to them it is inconceivable that they would have jumped without parachutes so there must be some record of what happened to them.
To all advertisers... I am NOT going to watch 2 adverts before watching a video. You are simply wasting money.
If you are using Firefox browser, you can get Adblocker for youtube.
If I'm interrupted watching a video I avoid this product whatever it is like the plague I would never buy it , I understand your sentiment completely
Gesh you people are so spoiled... If you can't handle this than you wouldn't make it with the history channel in the cable days before youtube was around😂
@@oodragondrew
Not with my provider it wasn’t.
@@oodragondrew
Not with my provider it wasn’t.
And
It is not the it is now when we pick and choose what we watch and when we watch it.
Too many ads? Record it and FF through them or my TV has AI that deletes the ads.
Not true the crew bailed out.
I did not watch this video to get a history of the B17. The title is misleading.Also, is the damaged B17 in question the one pictured ?
I'd speculate there was a secret experimental self-landing feature, except by now it would be declassified.
Damn bro that AI thumbnail is wild
It's not ai, it's a real photo
@@truckrobo147 bro changed it. It was not that originally
It's crazy how many of today's fighters carry more weight than the B-17
Same thing happened with a P-38. No one knew how it landed itself.
My great uncle was a mechanic .He saw aircraft land on Saipan, so full of holes they didn't know where to start. But got most back in the air to make more runs.😊
Why is the audio changed ? The previous was great, and better, correct, images.
I have two radio control B 17s models. Fun to fly in a scale like manner. Where it really shines is when we get several in the air and fly a formation pattern around the field.
And the flaps set themselves into landing position and the plane deployed its own landing gear. Now even Cessna pilots know what happens when you "dirty up the airfoil." You have to add down elevator to compensate. Then you deploy the landing gear and you'll have to give the plane some power to compensate for the drag.
Then it made a straight in approach at just the right altitude and airspeed after balancing speed and drag. Then there is the flare and touchdown. When the wings come into ground effect the throttles are pulled back to idle and the plane goes into a controlled stall that puts the wheels down gently. That's not what a 1944 autopilot could do. That's why the human pilot is there. This unmanned aircraft just managed to find that heading leading straight into a runway out of all the possible vectors over three countries. Then after all that, the plane shuts off it's magnetos and fuel for the four engines and just sits there. NOPE. This story is a fairy tale for the guilliable.
So, what happened to the crew?
Yeah - seems like they could have finished that story
There's multiple accounts of planes landing without crew or pilot and be very damaged
if you believe a B-17 Number 666 landed itself on a runway, I have a presidential candidate to sell you.
He won.
The Memphis Belle was one of my favorite movies of the decade!
B17, even the British turned it down. You have to admire the American crews who were slaughtered in outrageous numbers over Germany.
Who lowered the landing gear?Was it a ghost that landed her?
Hill Air Force Base is name for Ployer Hill the pilot killed in the crash of the B-17.
Who lowered the landing gear? Autopilot was barely autopilot at that time.
The gear was down to slow down when the crew bailed (the parachutes were NOT still on board, just the empty packs), and the plane didn't make a "perfect landing", it broke apart.
@@owenbrau63 Thanks brother, this makes total sense. It was eating at the back of my mind.
Unanswered question: Were any of the Phantom B17's crew ever heard from again? What happened to them?
This is bollocks, the B-17's autopilot, the Sperry A-3, was quite advanced for its time and could hold a steady course, maintain altitude, and control bank and pitch to an extent. However, it wasn't capable of the sophisticated automated navigation and definetly not the landing systems we see today in most commercial and military aircraft.
The A-3 autopilot required manual input for navigation changes, so a crew member had to adjust headings or control descent. While it could assist with level flight and reduce the crew's workload, it wasn’t designed to handle the entire process of navigating back to an airfield or executing a landing sequence autonomously.
In cases where the crew was incapacitated, the plane could maintain a stable course, but it couldn’t “find” its way back to a specific location or perform a controlled landing on its own. A pilot or copilot would still need to take control to make necessary heading adjustments, align with the runway, and execute the landing approach.
The pilots could point the aircraft in the general direction they wanted the aircraft to go, they could reduce engine power to ensure that the altitude dimished overtime, perhaps even crash landing in a known area, there are many examples where pilots of seriously damaged Allied bombers pointed their aircraft out to sea and reduced engine power to ensure it crashed in the sea, if it made it, before the bailed out.
There were experimental developments of autoland systems before the BAC Trident became the first aircraft with it fitted as standard, primarily in military and research contexts. In the 1950s, the U.S. military and several aviation research organisations conducted early experiments with automatic landing systems to improve safety in adverse weather and for carrier operations.
One significant early development was by the U.S. Navy and the Cornell Aeronautical Laboratory, which experimented with an autoland system on a modified Grumman F6F Hellcat during the late 1940s. These tests aimed to enable safe landings on aircraft carriers in poor visibility, but the technology was still experimental and not fully autonomous, it was abandoned in late 1949 following 8 crash landings and the death of the crews.
In the 1950s, the U.S. Air Force took up the mantle and began experimenting with autoland systems for bomber and reconnaissance aircraft, such as the Boeing B-47 Stratojet, these systems were developed to assist, again, in landing under adverse conditions, particularly to address the demands of high-speed jet landings and ensure safe operations, especially in poor visibility. However, these systems were not fully autonomous and required some level of pilot monitoring, and often, intervention.
The most advanced experimental system of the time was developed by NASA and the U.S. Air Force during the late 1950s and early 1960s as part of the Automatic Landing System (ALS) project, which tested autoland technology on various military aircraft, including modified jet fighters and bombers. These experiments paved the way for more reliable autoland systems but were primarily focused on research and not widely implemented, they were dependent on aircraft only systems that did not take signals or information from the ground.
The first truly operational autoland system, which enabled an aircraft to land without requiring pilot input, was developed in the early 1960s. British Aircraft Corporation (BAC) was instrumental in developing this technology in collaboration with Smiths Industries for the Hawker Siddeley Trident airliner. The Trident became the first aircraft and the first commercial airliner with an operational, independent, autoland capability, achieving its first automatic landing in 1965.
This system used radar and advanced avionics to guide the aircraft through the descent and landing phases. It relied on a combination of ground-based Instrument Landing System (ILS) signals and onboard sensors to maintain alignment with the runway. Autoland was initially designed to assist pilots in landing during low-visibility conditions, making commercial aviation safer in foggy or adverse weather.
While the Trident was the first airliner with autoland, other aircraft soon followed, such as the Boeing 727, 737, 747 and McDonald Douglas DC-10, which were also equipped with autoland systems by the late 1960s and early 1970s. Today, autoland systems are common in commercial aviation and are essential for safe landings in poor visibility.
Thank you for sharing your incredible wealth of knowledge. Very well written with outstanding specifics.
Thank you for the knowledge and time pit into that reply
Why didn’t you show the restored B-17s?
Out of all the insane stories I've heard over the years about WWII this is one I just can't swallow. Considering how hot the military was for good war propaganda, this really smacks of it.
Did he ever mention the crew-less bomber landing after the promo/tease at the beginning?
Now do the tale of the Cornfield Bomber.
I thought the B-17s were powered by the P&W 1830?
What happened to the crew? What do the records say? POWs? What?
RAF pilots called it "the great big plane with the itty-bitty bomb."
If you think machines don't have characters, you've never worked on aircraft...
Was the crew ever found because the family should have been pissed off if the plane came home but their boys didn't
*B-17 in real life:* [Able to take so much damage that it could even potentially survive gliding to a landing with no one at the controls]
*B-17 in War Thunder:* “Oh no, I took one shot to my fuselage from a machine gun round, now I’m going to tear myself apart :(