Dave you are extremely helpful with that video. You explain everything in a perfect way, I've always had problems with the structure of files in Kronos. Thanks to you this matter is getting less and less foggy. You're the man :)
This was very useful as I had given up on ever loading any new sounds to the Kronos due to it messing up all the combie timbers and yes you speak too, which is a bonus.
Thank you very much. This helps explain the layout of the Kronos file structure by engine type. Although there are 9 engines running the Kronos they are based on 2 basic underlying style engines, the HD-1 and the EXi. Now to figure out what I want to keep and what I want to add.
Hello, this is best video on how to use the pcg tool. Thanks for q great explanation. I have a que- does the sample/multisample also get copied to the backup file in your example?
Good question! Samples are saved as .KSC, PCG is only Programs, Combi's, Global settings, etc. So generally if you do a Save PCG, no samples get saved.
Hi, Great to see you covering topics like this! Very easy to follow.....which is what's needed! Is there any chance that you could help users understand how to dig themselves out of a hole when they do several "back ups" on their Kronos and don't quite know what is what, because all they've done is hit save several times and have possibly used up too much space for no reason.Often ending up not really knowing what to get rid of and what to keep! In short a structured approach from beginning to end of navigating the Kronos. But most importantly demonstrating this by showing common mistakes that people make...and the consequences!
Thanks Tony! Great idea - Unfortunatly the absolute best way to organize your Kronos honestly is simply to use FTP and treat it like a computer hard drive... And that option is only available to those of us who either: A) Are crazy enough to plug an ethernet cable into the motherboard directly B) Can find an external USB-to-Ethernet adapter I think I've made a video about the FTP stuff before, but if I haven't, maybe I should. But a FAQ of "I messed up my Kronos. How do I fix?" might be a great idea!
+David Champagne I rescued my kronos by reloading factory defaults from the CD, then reloading the user libs , qui did a video but your style is easier to follow.....you speak.
Hello Dave, I’ve applied the same principles of moving sounds within the Korg Krome using the examples you’ve shown with Kronos and PCG tools, while these work in the same way there’s still the issue of IMG files at least with the Krome. There are Sample and Meta IMG files which if not loaded won’t provide the sound of the third party file I am moving, if I include them they overwrite the existing files and so my other loaded sounds (M1) produce no sounds but the new sound is fine and visa versa , how can I get my M1 sounds to stay retained as they are and also include the new sound. It seems to me that the Krome can only load one set of IGM files to a particular sound, is there a way around this. My thanks in advance for any light you can shed on this problem.
That... Is a fantastic question. Being blunt - I have no idea how the Krome manages sounds/samples. When it comes to sample control via PCG Tools - there isn't any. It will handle PCG files (Programs, Combis, etc.) but samples and sequences are outside of it's realm of control I'm afraid. I don't have any good answer for you since I have no idea how the Krome 'works' from a sampling aspect. Sorry! Maybe reach out to Michel Keijzers - he's the one who wrote the tool and might be able to offer some insight that I can't.
David Champagne Thank you for your reply, You may well be right about the limited possibilities with the Krome’s handling capacity in regard to these type of files but I’ll do as you suggest and try making contact with Michael Keijzers to see if there’s still something I’m over looking. Once again thanks for your help ..Oh and great video tutorials too by the way, I’m working my way through them slowly !
Hi! I'm using PCGTools 3.2.0 and i can't copy and paste one PCG to another. But i can copy and paste on the same PCG. Please can you help me with that ? Thanks.
The problem with this kind of program is, we are not stacking bricks, we are arranging sound or wave sets which are appealing to the ear. The PCG program does not allow you to sample these combinations and secondly, the combinations which are configured within PCG may in fact have unintended artifacts. Theoretically these combinations look good but they are not being heard, only after they reside back in the synth. How do you build combos without listening to them first? The better option is to have a virtual keyboard which is linked back through the synth.
This application isn't for programming. It's for moving sounds around. Layering to hear how things sound should be done at the synth level while you're in front of it. When you make a combi and move programs around, this will retain the original links so you don't break your sounds when you move them. I get the impression that you're missing the point of this program.
Hi, when copying and pasting a complete bank from one PCG file to another, it takes a really long time and the programs doesn't match completely with the Combinations so I end up exiting PCG tools and finishing the process manually in the Kronos. I have had PCG tools repaired a couple of times and still get this situation. Have you experienced this? I would like a smooth Copy/Paste from one PCG to another. Thanks in advance and also, thank for all your videos.
Not using PCG Tools no. The problem comes down to a couple of issues: Are the source sounds between the Triton and the M3 the same? Do they sound the same? Are they in the same sample location? Are the engines the same or close? What about if the M3 has more/less IFX that aren't allocated in the Triton (or vise-versa), how is that handled? There's a lot of technical considerations there. I don't know if the M3 can even import PCG files created on the Triton. I don't think so though, but I'm not an expert in those specific synths.
Brilliant program, must be a Dutch Guy for sure haha, but have a QS, what with my allready changed sounds who are in the Kronos, must they first be loaded into PCG tool. Dont know f i understood it all, maybe better to have a conversation with micheal.
Hey Dave, great video. I did exactly the same steps. Copying the programs works fine so far. But after copying the combis only the exit Button is highlighted. If I press it I receive a warning. So if I leave the refernces of the copied combis did not change. Can you help me? BR Dirk
You have to check the clipboard at the very bottom in red lettering. If there's anything there, you need to make sure it's pasted into your destination too. That's likely what the warning was, but without more info is hard to tell. That would be my first thought though.
@@AudoraAudio That was the right hint - now I made it. Maybe the behaviour has changed a little bit. If I put a combi to the clipboard all used programs are on the clipboard as well. So it's even faster than shown in your video. Nevertheless great explanation! Thanks again.
Hello friend, I have a question and hope you will answer and help me. I am trying to combine some sounds from different sets for my KORG M3, but when I try to paste a sound from Programs, a window opens saying that "The patches in the clip board are from an incompatible OS version and can not be copied." Why is this happening, and how can I make a new set for KORG M3? PS. I am using PCG Toos v 3.1.0 Thanks in advance!
The OS issue is related to incompatible PCG files. Different PCG files will have different OS versions that make up what's in the PCG file. It's true with the Kronos as well; if you try and combine files from different OS's you'll get the same error. That said, I'm not sure how to fix it in the software. My guess is that loading and saving the file again using the M3 should bring the PCG up to the current version so you can easily combine them. Give that a try and see what happens.
Question: When I make combi's, I will usually copy from program to a specific timbre in the new combi. When I copy that, is it actually being stored in the combi or is it just a pointer to the original program? I guess I could test this, but haven't done so yet. I'd like to edit the program within the combi without affecting the original program. Comment: THANK YOU for making this, I was always wondering how to change program/combi numbers when I'd get new patches (many of yours for example :) ). It never occurred to me to cut and paste within PCGtools, but that makes sense, I can now put new stuff where I want it to go. I got tired of thinking I had to move stuff around to make room for my net programs/combis.
Hi there, Great question - Yes you're completely right. A combi is nothing more than a reference container that points to programs. It also contains KARMA scenes and modules, controller assignments, midi channel assignments, effects routings and that sort of thing. That said, it definitely does NOT contain 'sound data' as one would typically think of it. It's just a reference pointer. So to edit the program, here's my suggestion: Edit the way you normally would, however when you save the program you've just edited from within the combi, save it to a different slot instead of remaining in the internal memory. That way, you can retain the factory sounds and still make your own versions of the existing programs for sounds/songs that you need. Give that a try!
Dave, this got me thinking, so I just did a test on my Kronos LS. I created a new (Test) combi and copied 2 different piano patches to timbre 1 and 2 (I used the Copy from Program function). I saved the combi and verified it was what I was expecting when switching back and forth. I then went and modified one of the piano programs and wrote it. I changed programs and then changed back to my modified program to make sure my changes were there and it was changed. I then went back to the combi, but my 2nd timbre (the program I had just modified) was playing the original sound, not my modified sound. Apparently, a combi is more than just a pointer to a program. Remember though, I copied from program, I didn't just modify the timbre from the combi screen. I have always copied, that brings TFX, IFX, KARMA and what ever else you select to copy. I need to look more into this, but this makes more sense than just a pointer to a program. Since I make a combi for most of my songs in 2 bands (splits, transpose, MIDI in, etc.), I can't imaging what would have happened if I wrote over a program that was included in a combi. On the flip side though, on my Korg M50, I was down to just one combi I was using for one song (Whip It, Devo). I tried to use the original program and not use combi mode, but I had modified the program so much in the combi, the stock program sounds nasty now :) Things that make you go hmmmmmm
I've actually experienced this in the form of a bug. You know how the Compare button caches what the former state of a program/combi is since last save right? Well, I've had it happen where the combi was playing the wrong sound entirely despite me manually choosing a different sound entirely. I had to save the combi and in some cases actually restart the Kronos for it to pick up the change. I don't know if this is specific to 3.1.2, but I've had that happen. Now that said, I just tried exactly the steps that you did, and I get different results. Definitely things that make you go hrmmm... **edit** As a side note, imagine what you're saying is correct and INTENTIONAL by Korg. How do you modify the sound from the combi level, where is it stored, and what if you change a sound and it doesn't change in the combi, but then need the sound in the combi changed? Where do you go to edit that? Another question - *what* change did you make exactly? Certain changes in the program will have no effect (like effects, Karma, and so on since like you mentioned, it simply pulls those settings from the program level into the combi) I'm curious which modifications to the program you made. Maybe try a different example where you have two HD-1 programs in a combi, and then change the waveform within one of the HD-1 programs. This should sound completely different (Change from a piano sound to say, an oboe waveform.) Let me know what happens there.
I'm about to head to LA for 2 gigs so I can't test further until Sunday. The change I made was turning on the tremolo switch on the Rhodes (I think it was the Logical Song, don't recall). I wanted something I could easily hear. I never used the Compare button nor did I reboot the Kronos. Do you "Copy from Program" and select options (and timbre number)? My set up was copy Piano program (first one) to timbre 1 and copy Rhodes (don't recall program number) to timbre 2. I then turned on tremolo on the Rhodes patch in Program mode, saved it went back to the combi and that did NOT change. I was able to "Copy from Program" the modified Rhodes program to the existing Rhodes timbre and it came over with the tremolo turned on. I'll get back to you Sunday evening.
Okay, that makes sense why it didn't change - Something that is a midi control function, Karma effect or IFX/TFX/MFX would be independent of the actual sound of the program itself since it's a midi controllable function. If you change the raw fundamental of the sound however (Change from one physical engine to another), this is where the combi will 'sound wrong' since the program sound source is being called on by the combi and doesn't store that kind of information. **edit - Yes, I tend to copy from program as well as manually enter, but the difference here is in what's being changed. Global LFO for example would be handled at the Combi level even though you can copy the settings from a program by example**
Hi Dave, I’ve emailed you - I’ve bought some sounds from you, I want to load them into my Kronos so they are always there when I turn the machine on and off, can’t I load them from a USB? I dunno how to do it 😰 can’t use PCG tools
Hi David, tnx for this video. I'm rapidly climbing the learning curve of my nu Kronos 88 LS. I've expanded my sounds palette with many (selected) EXs and KSC libraries, and now I need to know how to combine with PCG Tools the internal Kronos sounds (PCGs) with the PCGs of my expansion (knowing i must first load the samples if the expansion libraries needs samples). I mean: how i export out of Kronos the PCGs of the expansion (may brutally i copy from the HDINTERNAL to a thumb drive?) and put them on my pc and then work on it with PCG Tools? TNX for your help.
EX's are a little bit more tricky because while they load samples into a 'hidden' spot of memory, there's no direct PCG that you have direct access to which means moving things around can be more tricky. The biggest thing is to do a 'Save All" of your Kronos. Once the sample libraries are installed in the Kronos, they can be referenced from anywhere in the program banks. That's the biggest thing to start. So here's likely what I would do: I would do a Save All, and then load one expansion. Save all again but with a different name (to get the PCG files) and continue doing that. Once you have a series of PCG files, you can take 'what's new' from each PCG and merge it into the original backup you made. The samples from the new EX's will still be there no matter what, so the biggest thing is getting the programs/combi's to reference them how they were intended to be used. I'd approach it that way but I've never actually tried to merge new/additional EX's myself. Maybe give that a try and report back here?
I'll feedback here my experience. Right now I've accomplisced the 1st task: to connect via USB/Ethernet the Kronos to my router and YESSS it FTPss! Now I have all the PCGs of all the factory and installed expansions sounds on my pc. The first thing I'll try is make my "frankenstein" PCG and see if all the referenced "child" file (samples and so on) will be loaded along the my "handmade" PCG with PCG Tool.
BTW... in one of your videos (Man you are my FIRST source of knowledge!!! your explanation are so clear and "hands-on"!)... saying... in one of your videos you play a few notes of Smoke on the Water... with a GREAT John Lord's Hammond sound!!! May I ask what patch you used for that sound?! Tnx!
UPDATE: It works!!! SO: yes... PCG Tools can manage and mix patches from the expansions EXs and KRS and build your "custom" PCG. But for the EXs you need to load (append) all the KSC related to the PCGs you mixed in your custom PCG. This introduce a limit i think: if your custom PCG contains patches from many EXs the risk is that the virtual memory can't load all those KSCs. The workaround i think is to build a "custom KSC" too (maybe a sample converter/tanslator like Korg Creator can do that!), so you can put inside the KSC only the samples related to you custom PCG. But the relation/childhood between the patches in the custom PCG and the samples in the custom KSC must be correct. To do this you must know: 1) what specific samples every patches uses 2) how to build the custom KSC with all the correct relationship with the patches. What you think about that? Do you know how to see the relationship between a patch and his related samples? And how to build a custom KSC with all the correct relationship/childhood?
I'll try the way you suggested... but you must know that all the expansion EXs have it's own PCG file! So i think things are not so different from the internal factory sounds. The problem - my 5cents! - is that we need to know the reference chain from a sound in the PCG to all the related samples/multisamples and their location. For what i know PCG Tools can't do that (maybe Korg Creator can do!) ... but the goal is: to build a custom PCG from all the factory AND optional PCGs and build a related KSC file that contains only the necessary samples for those sounds with the correct relation/childhood and location. I promise: I'll post here my news about that! BUT... gimme that Jon Lord hammond hint!!! ;-) It's a your "tweak"?!
It doesn't - it's a .NET Windows application. You would need to either use Parallels or run a virtual machine with Windows in it to get this to run on a Mac!
@@AudoraAudio I dont think it will work, cause from different sets, there are different 3rd party multisamples. so when I chose different programs from different sets PCG tools will not recall those samples and multisamples from the different sets and put them into the new created set of folders..
@@amk-channel1 Sample references are different than program references. You can move programs around without impacting the samples, as long as the samples are loaded in the Kronos generally speaking. (If your samples load on startup, it doesn't matter where the program is that uses the samples)
@@AudoraAudio Dear Dave, first let me thank you alot for your replies.. lets imagine the following situation: we have 3 different sets (back ups) that contain their own .pcg, .ksc and the multisample, samples folder.. I like several programs and combis from each one of those sets.. they are not yet loaded into the Kronos.. I want to merge those programs and combis from those 3 sets into one set and then load them into the kronos. I can not solve this problem for 6 years now 😅.. I purchased Korg Creator, it deal with HD samples, but not all the set. pcg tools deal with program and combi but don't bring the samples along with the programs.. I really dont know what to do 😭 many thanks for you again for your concern and replies not only for me, and thanks for your nice videos tbat show great efforts to help others..
Did you use this program to make your initial back ups? If not, what is the best way to do it. Since I've owned my Kronos, I have yet to find and app or some way to backup all my programs and combis. It's such a drag doing it the factory suggested way, which makes you name your already named program or combi, save the different file types and put it in a different location. Has to be a better, more efficient and quicker way.
This program doesn't talk to the Kronos at all. It's an offline application that edits backups. The easiest way to make a backup is just go to Disk mode and do a "Save all" and that'll save the current state of your Kronos.
@@AudoraAudio Yes. But that's the problem. Could there not be a batch "save" "save backup" for these files, instead of one at a time, retitling each program and combi. Takes so long for just one, and I have a lot.
@@salmonella4u I guess there's a misunderstanding because a save all just does a complete backup. There's no need to title every combi and program. It's just a save all with keeps everything you have intact.
@@AudoraAudio Every time I do a "SAVE ALL", It still has the place where I have to fill in the title of the program or combi, regardless of a program or combi already having a title. If I leave it blank, then I assume, the title that should be there, isn't there. I never just ignored the "name program" or "name combi" for saving it.
@@salmonella4u When you do a save all, you're not saving a single combi or program. You're saving ALL programs and combis at the same time. It's saving to the hard drive and the name is so you can share the file or do it's organized in your hard drive or USB stick.
The only way is to lock samples. You can't lock a PCG file, and you can only submit your collection to Korg to get it locked. You need to become an approved seller and Korg had specific standards with selling sounds through them. It's not easy unfortunately.
The link is broken, but it's not my link. A quick google search gives me this: www.kronoshaven.com/pcgtools/?fbclid=IwAR2BBbvmmDBeJxgWk2APAXdJCAXDDAvflLqlvtsCQMFpsz9D-34FikaF17c
Samples and Sample information isn't contained in PCG files (Only Programs, Combi's, Global settings, Drum kits, Wave Sequences, Setlists, and similar non-sample data. Sequences/song data isn't stored in a PCG either) PCG tools won't manipulate samples at all. Those are handled separately, but this tool will allow you to manipulate the location of programs and combis that reference the samples.
Dave you are extremely helpful with that video. You explain everything in a perfect way, I've always had problems with the structure of files in Kronos. Thanks to you this matter is getting less and less foggy. You're the man :)
This was very useful as I had given up on ever loading any new sounds to the Kronos due to it messing up all the combie timbers and yes you speak too, which is a bonus.
Thank you very much. This helps explain the layout of the Kronos file structure by engine type. Although there are 9 engines running the Kronos they are based on 2 basic underlying style engines, the HD-1 and the EXi. Now to figure out what I want to keep and what I want to add.
Very useful tuto, as always. It's really too bad you cannot do more videos anymore, it was so helpful !
Thank you very much for making this video!
Hello, this is best video on how to use the pcg tool. Thanks for q great explanation. I have a que- does the sample/multisample also get copied to the backup file in your example?
Good question!
Samples are saved as .KSC, PCG is only Programs, Combi's, Global settings, etc. So generally if you do a Save PCG, no samples get saved.
@@AudoraAudio thanks for your reply.
this was the best thing for keyboardists i guest ...
thank you for sharing :) greetings :D
Thank you for the explanation. Extremely helpful.
Thanks for the reply and the link to this tutorial, appreciated
Thank you for making this video!
Hi,
Great to see you covering topics like this! Very easy to follow.....which is what's needed!
Is there any chance that you could help users understand how to dig themselves out of a hole when they do several "back ups" on their Kronos and don't quite know what is what, because all they've done is hit save several times and have possibly used up too much space for no reason.Often ending up not really knowing what to get rid of and what to keep! In short a structured approach from beginning to end of navigating the Kronos. But most importantly demonstrating this by showing common mistakes that people make...and the consequences!
Thanks Tony!
Great idea - Unfortunatly the absolute best way to organize your Kronos honestly is simply to use FTP and treat it like a computer hard drive... And that option is only available to those of us who either:
A) Are crazy enough to plug an ethernet cable into the motherboard directly
B) Can find an external USB-to-Ethernet adapter
I think I've made a video about the FTP stuff before, but if I haven't, maybe I should.
But a FAQ of "I messed up my Kronos. How do I fix?" might be a great idea!
+David Champagne I rescued my kronos by reloading factory defaults from the CD, then reloading the user libs , qui did a video but your style is easier to follow.....you speak.
Excellent video.. Could you please help with a video or instructions on loading updated pcg to Kronos via USB. I'm still a little confused on that
Hello Dave, I’ve applied the same principles of moving sounds within the Korg Krome using the examples you’ve shown with Kronos and PCG tools, while these work in the same way there’s still the issue of IMG files at least with the Krome. There are Sample and Meta IMG files which if not loaded won’t provide the sound of the third party file I am moving, if I include them they overwrite the existing files and so my other loaded sounds (M1) produce no sounds but the new sound is fine and visa versa , how can I get my M1 sounds to stay retained as they are and also include the new sound. It seems to me that the Krome can only load one set of IGM files to a particular sound, is there a way around this. My thanks in advance for any light you can shed on this problem.
That... Is a fantastic question. Being blunt - I have no idea how the Krome manages sounds/samples. When it comes to sample control via PCG Tools - there isn't any. It will handle PCG files (Programs, Combis, etc.) but samples and sequences are outside of it's realm of control I'm afraid.
I don't have any good answer for you since I have no idea how the Krome 'works' from a sampling aspect. Sorry! Maybe reach out to Michel Keijzers - he's the one who wrote the tool and might be able to offer some insight that I can't.
David Champagne Thank you for your reply, You may well be right about the limited possibilities with the Krome’s handling capacity in regard to these type of files but I’ll do as you suggest and try making contact with Michael Keijzers to see if there’s still something I’m over looking. Once again thanks for your help ..Oh and great video tutorials too by the way, I’m working my way through them slowly !
תודה רבה הסבר מועיל מאוד💯💯💯
יש לי שאלה, האם זה טוען אוטומט דגימות חדשות? סמפלים חדשים
Thanks, very helpful!
Hi! I'm using PCGTools 3.2.0 and i can't copy and paste one PCG to another. But i can copy and paste on the same PCG. Please can you help me with that ? Thanks.
Great video so helpful many thanks my friend :)
The problem with this kind of program is, we are not stacking bricks, we are arranging sound or wave sets which are appealing to the ear. The PCG program does not allow you to sample these combinations and secondly, the combinations which are configured within PCG may in fact have unintended artifacts. Theoretically these combinations look good but they are not being heard, only after they reside back in the synth. How do you build combos without listening to them first? The better option is to have a virtual keyboard which is linked back through the synth.
This application isn't for programming. It's for moving sounds around. Layering to hear how things sound should be done at the synth level while you're in front of it. When you make a combi and move programs around, this will retain the original links so you don't break your sounds when you move them.
I get the impression that you're missing the point of this program.
Hi, when copying and pasting a complete bank from one PCG file to another, it takes a really long time and the programs doesn't match completely with the Combinations so I end up exiting PCG tools and finishing the process manually in the Kronos. I have had PCG tools repaired a couple of times and still get this situation. Have you experienced this? I would like a smooth Copy/Paste from one PCG to another. Thanks in advance and also, thank for all your videos.
Thank you very much!!! what about samples? what can we do if the prog has samples from other set? if you know please help me!!! thnks
Hi! It's possible to convert Triton's Pcg to M3 Pcg? Thanks!!!!
Not using PCG Tools no. The problem comes down to a couple of issues:
Are the source sounds between the Triton and the M3 the same? Do they sound the same? Are they in the same sample location? Are the engines the same or close? What about if the M3 has more/less IFX that aren't allocated in the Triton (or vise-versa), how is that handled?
There's a lot of technical considerations there. I don't know if the M3 can even import PCG files created on the Triton. I don't think so though, but I'm not an expert in those specific synths.
Brilliant program, must be a Dutch Guy for sure haha, but have a QS, what with my allready changed sounds who are in the Kronos, must they first be loaded into PCG tool. Dont know f i understood it all, maybe better to have a conversation with micheal.
Hey Dave, great video. I did exactly the same steps. Copying the programs works fine so far. But after copying the combis only the exit Button is highlighted. If I press it I receive a warning. So if I leave the refernces of the copied combis did not change. Can you help me? BR Dirk
You have to check the clipboard at the very bottom in red lettering. If there's anything there, you need to make sure it's pasted into your destination too. That's likely what the warning was, but without more info is hard to tell. That would be my first thought though.
@@AudoraAudio That was the right hint - now I made it. Maybe the behaviour has changed a little bit. If I put a combi to the clipboard all used programs are on the clipboard as well. So it's even faster than shown in your video. Nevertheless great explanation! Thanks again.
Hello friend,
I have a question and hope you will answer and help me.
I am trying to combine some sounds from different sets for my KORG M3, but when I try to paste a sound from Programs, a window opens saying that "The patches in the clip board are from an incompatible OS version and can not be copied." Why is this happening, and how can I make a new set for KORG M3?
PS. I am using PCG Toos v 3.1.0
Thanks in advance!
The OS issue is related to incompatible PCG files. Different PCG files will have different OS versions that make up what's in the PCG file. It's true with the Kronos as well; if you try and combine files from different OS's you'll get the same error.
That said, I'm not sure how to fix it in the software. My guess is that loading and saving the file again using the M3 should bring the PCG up to the current version so you can easily combine them.
Give that a try and see what happens.
@@AudoraAudio
Sounds a smart idea, I'll give it try.
Thank you for your reply.
Question: When I make combi's, I will usually copy from program to a specific timbre in the new combi. When I copy that, is it actually being stored in the combi or is it just a pointer to the original program? I guess I could test this, but haven't done so yet. I'd like to edit the program within the combi without affecting the original program.
Comment: THANK YOU for making this, I was always wondering how to change program/combi numbers when I'd get new patches (many of yours for example :) ). It never occurred to me to cut and paste within PCGtools, but that makes sense, I can now put new stuff where I want it to go. I got tired of thinking I had to move stuff around to make room for my net programs/combis.
Hi there,
Great question - Yes you're completely right. A combi is nothing more than a reference container that points to programs. It also contains KARMA scenes and modules, controller assignments, midi channel assignments, effects routings and that sort of thing. That said, it definitely does NOT contain 'sound data' as one would typically think of it. It's just a reference pointer.
So to edit the program, here's my suggestion: Edit the way you normally would, however when you save the program you've just edited from within the combi, save it to a different slot instead of remaining in the internal memory. That way, you can retain the factory sounds and still make your own versions of the existing programs for sounds/songs that you need.
Give that a try!
Dave, this got me thinking, so I just did a test on my Kronos LS. I created a new (Test) combi and copied 2 different piano patches to timbre 1 and 2 (I used the Copy from Program function). I saved the combi and verified it was what I was expecting when switching back and forth.
I then went and modified one of the piano programs and wrote it. I changed programs and then changed back to my modified program to make sure my changes were there and it was changed. I then went back to the combi, but my 2nd timbre (the program I had just modified) was playing the original sound, not my modified sound. Apparently, a combi is more than just a pointer to a program. Remember though, I copied from program, I didn't just modify the timbre from the combi screen. I have always copied, that brings TFX, IFX, KARMA and what ever else you select to copy.
I need to look more into this, but this makes more sense than just a pointer to a program. Since I make a combi for most of my songs in 2 bands (splits, transpose, MIDI in, etc.), I can't imaging what would have happened if I wrote over a program that was included in a combi. On the flip side though, on my Korg M50, I was down to just one combi I was using for one song (Whip It, Devo). I tried to use the original program and not use combi mode, but I had modified the program so much in the combi, the stock program sounds nasty now :)
Things that make you go hmmmmmm
I've actually experienced this in the form of a bug. You know how the Compare button caches what the former state of a program/combi is since last save right?
Well, I've had it happen where the combi was playing the wrong sound entirely despite me manually choosing a different sound entirely. I had to save the combi and in some cases actually restart the Kronos for it to pick up the change. I don't know if this is specific to 3.1.2, but I've had that happen.
Now that said, I just tried exactly the steps that you did, and I get different results.
Definitely things that make you go hrmmm...
**edit**
As a side note, imagine what you're saying is correct and INTENTIONAL by Korg.
How do you modify the sound from the combi level, where is it stored, and what if you change a sound and it doesn't change in the combi, but then need the sound in the combi changed? Where do you go to edit that?
Another question - *what* change did you make exactly? Certain changes in the program will have no effect (like effects, Karma, and so on since like you mentioned, it simply pulls those settings from the program level into the combi)
I'm curious which modifications to the program you made.
Maybe try a different example where you have two HD-1 programs in a combi, and then change the waveform within one of the HD-1 programs. This should sound completely different (Change from a piano sound to say, an oboe waveform.)
Let me know what happens there.
I'm about to head to LA for 2 gigs so I can't test further until Sunday.
The change I made was turning on the tremolo switch on the Rhodes (I think it was the Logical Song, don't recall). I wanted something I could easily hear. I never used the Compare button nor did I reboot the Kronos.
Do you "Copy from Program" and select options (and timbre number)?
My set up was copy Piano program (first one) to timbre 1 and copy Rhodes (don't recall program number) to timbre 2. I then turned on tremolo on the Rhodes patch in Program mode, saved it went back to the combi and that did NOT change. I was able to "Copy from Program" the modified Rhodes program to the existing Rhodes timbre and it came over with the tremolo turned on.
I'll get back to you Sunday evening.
Okay, that makes sense why it didn't change - Something that is a midi control function, Karma effect or IFX/TFX/MFX would be independent of the actual sound of the program itself since it's a midi controllable function.
If you change the raw fundamental of the sound however (Change from one physical engine to another), this is where the combi will 'sound wrong' since the program sound source is being called on by the combi and doesn't store that kind of information.
**edit - Yes, I tend to copy from program as well as manually enter, but the difference here is in what's being changed. Global LFO for example would be handled at the Combi level even though you can copy the settings from a program by example**
Hi Dave, I’ve emailed you - I’ve bought some sounds from you, I want to load them into my Kronos so they are always there when I turn the machine on and off, can’t I load them from a USB? I dunno how to do it 😰 can’t use PCG tools
Thanks Wayne, I did get your email. I'll get back to you with a full answer when I can!
Hi David, tnx for this video. I'm rapidly climbing the learning curve of my nu Kronos 88 LS. I've expanded my sounds palette with many (selected) EXs and KSC libraries, and now I need to know how to combine with PCG Tools the internal Kronos sounds (PCGs) with the PCGs of my expansion (knowing i must first load the samples if the expansion libraries needs samples). I mean: how i export out of Kronos the PCGs of the expansion (may brutally i copy from the HDINTERNAL to a thumb drive?) and put them on my pc and then work on it with PCG Tools? TNX for your help.
EX's are a little bit more tricky because while they load samples into a 'hidden' spot of memory, there's no direct PCG that you have direct access to which means moving things around can be more tricky.
The biggest thing is to do a 'Save All" of your Kronos. Once the sample libraries are installed in the Kronos, they can be referenced from anywhere in the program banks. That's the biggest thing to start.
So here's likely what I would do:
I would do a Save All, and then load one expansion. Save all again but with a different name (to get the PCG files) and continue doing that.
Once you have a series of PCG files, you can take 'what's new' from each PCG and merge it into the original backup you made. The samples from the new EX's will still be there no matter what, so the biggest thing is getting the programs/combi's to reference them how they were intended to be used.
I'd approach it that way but I've never actually tried to merge new/additional EX's myself. Maybe give that a try and report back here?
I'll feedback here my experience. Right now I've accomplisced the 1st task: to connect via USB/Ethernet the Kronos to my router and YESSS it FTPss! Now I have all the PCGs of all the factory and installed expansions sounds on my pc. The first thing I'll try is make my "frankenstein" PCG and see if all the referenced "child" file (samples and so on) will be loaded along the my "handmade" PCG with PCG Tool.
BTW... in one of your videos (Man you are my FIRST source of knowledge!!! your explanation are so clear and "hands-on"!)... saying... in one of your videos you play a few notes of Smoke on the Water... with a GREAT John Lord's Hammond sound!!! May I ask what patch you used for that sound?! Tnx!
UPDATE:
It works!!! SO: yes... PCG Tools can manage and mix patches from the expansions EXs and KRS and build your "custom" PCG.
But for the EXs you need to load (append) all the KSC related to the PCGs you mixed in your custom PCG.
This introduce a limit i think:
if your custom PCG contains patches from many EXs the risk is that the virtual memory can't load all those KSCs.
The workaround i think is to build a "custom KSC" too (maybe a sample converter/tanslator like Korg Creator can do that!), so you can put inside the KSC only the samples related to you custom PCG.
But the relation/childhood between the patches in the custom PCG and the samples in the custom KSC must be correct.
To do this you must know:
1) what specific samples every patches uses
2) how to build the custom KSC with all the correct relationship with the patches.
What you think about that?
Do you know how to see the relationship between a patch and his related samples?
And how to build a custom KSC with all the correct relationship/childhood?
I'll try the way you suggested... but you must know that all the expansion EXs have it's own PCG file! So i think things are not so different from the internal factory sounds.
The problem - my 5cents! - is that we need to know the reference chain from a sound in the PCG to all the related samples/multisamples and their location.
For what i know PCG Tools can't do that (maybe Korg Creator can do!) ... but the goal is: to build a custom PCG from all the factory AND optional PCGs and build a related KSC file that contains only the necessary samples for those sounds with the correct relation/childhood and location.
I promise: I'll post here my news about that! BUT... gimme that Jon Lord hammond hint!!! ;-) It's a your "tweak"?!
Hi Dave, I am on a Mac and can 't get the application link to work. Does it work for Macs?
It doesn't - it's a .NET Windows application. You would need to either use Parallels or run a virtual machine with Windows in it to get this to run on a Mac!
Ok, thanks. Working on that option. Just trying to figure out the best way not to delete sounds when I am inputting new created sounds.
is there any software or way to combine different programs from different sets and put them into one new set ??
PCG Tools can do that too!
@@AudoraAudio I dont think it will work, cause from different sets, there are different 3rd party multisamples. so when I chose different programs from different sets PCG tools will not recall those samples and multisamples from the different sets and put them into the new created set of folders..
@@amk-channel1 Sample references are different than program references. You can move programs around without impacting the samples, as long as the samples are loaded in the Kronos generally speaking. (If your samples load on startup, it doesn't matter where the program is that uses the samples)
@@AudoraAudio Dear Dave,
first let me thank you alot for your replies..
lets imagine the following situation:
we have 3 different sets (back ups) that contain their own .pcg, .ksc and the multisample, samples folder..
I like several programs and combis from each one of those sets..
they are not yet loaded into the Kronos..
I want to merge those programs and combis from those 3 sets into one set and then load them into the kronos.
I can not solve this problem for 6 years now 😅..
I purchased Korg Creator, it deal with HD samples, but not all the set. pcg tools deal with program and combi but don't bring the samples along with the programs.. I really dont know what to do 😭
many thanks for you again for your concern and replies not only for me, and thanks for your nice videos tbat show great efforts to help others..
how to copy sound in main list from set on pcg to another set in another pcg
Did you use this program to make your initial back ups? If not, what is the best way to do it. Since I've owned my Kronos, I have yet to find and app or some way to backup all my programs and combis. It's such a drag doing it the factory suggested way, which makes you name your already named program or combi, save the different file types and put it in a different location. Has to be a better, more efficient and quicker way.
This program doesn't talk to the Kronos at all. It's an offline application that edits backups. The easiest way to make a backup is just go to Disk mode and do a "Save all" and that'll save the current state of your Kronos.
@@AudoraAudio Yes. But that's the problem. Could there not be a batch "save" "save backup" for these files, instead of one at a time, retitling each program and combi. Takes so long for just one, and I have a lot.
@@salmonella4u I guess there's a misunderstanding because a save all just does a complete backup. There's no need to title every combi and program. It's just a save all with keeps everything you have intact.
@@AudoraAudio Every time I do a "SAVE ALL", It still has the place where I have to fill in the title of the program or combi, regardless of a program or combi already having a title. If I leave it blank, then I assume, the title that should be there, isn't there. I never just ignored the "name program" or "name combi" for saving it.
@@salmonella4u When you do a save all, you're not saving a single combi or program. You're saving ALL programs and combis at the same time. It's saving to the hard drive and the name is so you can share the file or do it's organized in your hard drive or USB stick.
Please tell me how to make our pcg lock to prevent free share..means end to end user .this means ithas plays only on the board to whom I sold
The only way is to lock samples. You can't lock a PCG file, and you can only submit your collection to Korg to get it locked. You need to become an approved seller and Korg had specific standards with selling sounds through them. It's not easy unfortunately.
@@AudoraAudio thanks for your reply ...
The link is not working. Can you help me sir?
The link is broken, but it's not my link. A quick google search gives me this:
www.kronoshaven.com/pcgtools/?fbclid=IwAR2BBbvmmDBeJxgWk2APAXdJCAXDDAvflLqlvtsCQMFpsz9D-34FikaF17c
Work copy past samples ?
Samples and Sample information isn't contained in PCG files (Only Programs, Combi's, Global settings, Drum kits, Wave Sequences, Setlists, and similar non-sample data. Sequences/song data isn't stored in a PCG either)
PCG tools won't manipulate samples at all. Those are handled separately, but this tool will allow you to manipulate the location of programs and combis that reference the samples.
Is there one for krome?
I think this works for Krome PCG files too.
Marche pour.korg krime??
Non, c'est seulement pour le Korg Kronos.