Why no rudder??? The rudder never even moved. Left rudder would have easily saved that from happening, but I assume the whole radio was locked out? Beautiful Mike McConville Decathlon.
Sad to see a beautiful plane destroyed, On slow motion only surface that seemed to move was left aileron? Obviously the radio stopped communicating with the receiver, Curious if batteries and radio were checked after the crash?
Whatever you fly, Spektrum, Graupner, Futaba, Taranis, Multiplex, Jeti or anything else: Things like this can happen. All of the mentioned RC systems (incl. Spektrum ! :-) ) are not bad but they are not immune against failure. Maybe a double receiver would have saved it. Maybe it was a brownout by lack of voltage. Then a double receiver wouldn't have helped anyway. It could have been also a transmitter failure. If you fly RC-planes it's not a question if you crash but when you crash. I flew Spektrum many years and had not any issues wiht it. Now I've changed to Taranis because of the programming possibilities and and so far I also have no issues with it.
Here's a thought to ponder. Not knowing what the post flight investigation revealed and going on just what is presented in the video. I see the control check while taxiing out at 2:37. Both ailerons work and are opposite to each other. Then at 3:07 another aileron input was given and they both still work but we don't know which direction the sticks are being deflected. (The title and length of video makes me look for reversed ailerons off the bat) It also looks suspicious that he is making a left turn on the ground with rudder and the ailerons are in right roll position at this point. This is not a reflexive movement unless there was a strong wind from the right. They are checked again quickly at 3:17 prior to Take-off. From this point on, I see no further movement from the RIGHT aileron. In theory, with the combination of a bad (dead) RIGHT aileron servo and reversed ailerons, a crash would look exactly like this one. The pilot could be giving Left Aileron commands and getting the left servo to go more right (down) while the "dead" Right Aileron Servo does nothing and remains neutral. Thus prolonging the imminent Unscheduled Landing. I am fairly certain that at some time during the fatal roll, the pilot would be giving FULL LEFT stick commands. I only see downward deflection in the Left Aileron. I don't discount a noisy (bad) pot in either servo but they usually don't cause the Rx to sign off. I wasn't the last person to hook up the ailerons backwards. That was back in 1978 when there were no switched on the Tx. It was a field servo swap.
Just found this. Dad had a green and white Citabria with the bat wing paint scheme. Was a fun little craft and we flew it everywhere. Pulled about 2 g's curling around the inside of the Mt St Helens crater,,below the crater lip. Could smell the rotten eggs from the cindercone and had a direct overhead view to hell on earth. Did my first snap roll ever in it,,scared the bejezzus out of me as a kid. It was also used for towing gliders. Rented it out a few times to other pilots at the field who would hand over enough cash. One of them ended up bending a strut playing a bit to hard with it. Fixed,,signed off,, and sold. So sad that the model hit the hardpan, some definite hyjinks with the aileron. One thing I have seen and heard,,is that the more money you spend on a heavy model,,,the louder soundbite of it when it crashes to bits. The high upside is that no one was hurt(thank the gods) and that they make those kits affordable everyday, new or used.
@kh40yr My dad became a private pilot shortly after I was born. He bought a '49 C-170A and he and I went somewhere every weekend in that plane starting when I was 5yo until I was 16. We had our own airstrip so it was only a matter of walking 50' from the house to get in it. I remember one day, I was 13yo, he called it a lead sled. I took offense to that remark. I had many, many hours logged in that right seat, watching for traffic or learning to navigate from VOR to VOR. Our ceiling was about 13,500. We were over a mountain range when suddenly we hit some really rough turbulence. I remember looking out the window at the wing and watching it "bend". Scared the crap outta me! Once we were in smooth air we picked up the nose, cut the throttle, threw in some rudder and spiraled down to a lower altitude. That was short lived however since I didn't pop my ears good enough, so back up we went, this time we came down a little slower. I regarded that plane as a close member of our family. My dad flew it twice from our home in Southern California to Central America where he photographed from the air a lot of the Mayan pyramids peeking out of the jungle. He was fascinated with the ancient Mayan culture. That plane brought him back home safely twice. My dad and I flew all over the western USA to go fishing or exploring forestry strips in the back country or even old abandoned ghost towns. To think that he called her a lead sled was just unforgivable to me at the time. Then for my 14th birthday he surprised me. We flew down to our local airport, only this time we landed on the sailplane side. He did a check ride in a green and white Citabria and then the two of us went for a ride. HOLY COW was all I remember! We went and did some loops over a class mates house, then flew away inverted. I know that looked cool. Good thing my friend didn't see the dirt we were eating off the floor! Not cool. It was a great birthday except for one thing. We had to return the Citabria back to the airport and take that damn lead sled home! LOL. Those two planes are like night and day. I guess renting a Citabria back in 1979 was expensive? According to my dad, I think he said, not positive, but I think rental was $45/hr + fuel? I could be wrong. That was many years ago and I still remember to this day how responsive and agile that plane was compared to the z170, just amazing. I saw it one more time. We had a sail plane land at our house, he'd lost his thermals. So we called up the airport and that same green and white Citabria came and towed it off our strip. I think there was some concern, our runway was a 10' x 1300' dirt strip, fortunately the last 600' went slightly downhill. At 16yo I graduated high school and I had just gotten my driver's license only a couple months prior. I discovered drive-in movies and girls so flying was no longer important to me. Besides, the opportunity would ALWAYS be there, or so I thought. A year later my dad lost his medical at age 55, a year after that he sold the old lead sled and took up with ultralights. He loved those things. He had a new heart valve installed at age 80. He told me if things worked out he'd get his medical back, buy a C-172, no more battling a crosswind in a taildragger, and fly back to Central America. Technology had made some major advances regarding the explorarion of Mayan ruins. Sadly, he passed away two months after his heart operation. In the hangar at his home in Nevada, he left me an ultralight, which, no, I can't fly a kite while sitting in it! (I'm afraid of heights! I need to be in a cockpit of some sort. I don't dangle my feet out in mid air like some Flintstone vehicle!) He also left me an experimental light sport aircraft. He'd bought it in Wisconsin and brought it home to Nevada. Because of his bad heart at the time he couldn't pull start it so he was in the process of installing an electric starter. He never finished. I had to fly this plane so I did. It'd been 30 years since I'd last flown, but if you pull back on the stick the plane goes up. Some things never change. :) I only put about 2 hours on it, then sold it. My priorities at the time were here on the ground raising my two kids and caring for my elderly mother. Today I have no priorities other than to enjoy life. My kids are grown and gone and my mom is undoubtedly with my dad somewhere doing God knows what! A GA license just wouldn't be practical for me now. That's something my dad had wanted me to get when we owned the 170. I didn't and that was just one of many mistakes I've made in Life. There's a few lawyers I've hired in the past that could fill you in on other mistakes I've made! :) However an LSA license is something I'm considering. With 5 acres I can fly from home again. Sorry, I didn't mean to write a novel. Thanks for posting your comment. I really did enjoy reading it. I brought back some good memories of a green and white Citabria!
Reckon the port aileron servo went home on it's own. Left rudder and full down might have saved it. Crying shame mate. Guess it's easy to make suggestions when you're not on the sticks though. Safe landings.
We must do everything possible on the ground before maiden flights, especially with gas powered airplanes. Go back 15 years or before 2.4 ghz systems, it would be sinful not to have performed a power on, 360 degree range check. This check is the last and mandatory of a long list to ensure we have done everything on the ground for a successful maiden. If it were a system failure, which by all appearances it was, it most likely would have been caught. Sorry for your loss. Hopefully this loss will encourage others to do a little extra on their next project. I'm glad your back in the air.
I built a KR2 homebuilt aircraft with VW engine and did a lot of high speed taxi tests before I got altitude and left the airport. This may have saved your aircraft but seems like most modelers fly "freestyle" without pilot training. Hope the rebuild is relatively painless. Thanks, Paul in Thailand building a long wing Super Privateer amphibian
how other pilots fly has no bearing on this.. wasnt doing anymore than taking off.. clearly was a controls failure.. as to the rest of your comment was random, pointless, and had no relation to the subject matter..
First off, that was PAINFUL to watch, my heart goes out to the poor bugger, all the time and effort, and such a lovely job on that pig of a colour scheme. I have painted that in 1/3, 1/4, 1/5 and 1/6 scales, and it's a bastard to do. Anyway, I might get some flack for this, but, in my humble opinion, that was pure pilot error that cost that model. ANYONE with eyes can see, it's banking it's wing almost BEFORE breaking ground, i understand that it's at rotation speed, but even the 100cc Hanger 9 LEAD SLED Bellanca Citabria Decathlon is off at under 80kph. That model was recoverable, all it needed was an abort. If the pilot had thought to cut the throttle right after it started it's bank, then added some left rudder and about 15% down elevator to drop the nose some, it would have leveled, straightened and been able to land run out and bounce to a stop. Might have been bent U/C but not a total loss. One other point, if the peanut gallery in the background are speaking of this poor man's lovely model, then all his mates expected it to fold up in flight anyway. Listen close to the audio, one gent re-utters another's concern over glue joints, and they are discussing wings and mounts. So i expect that the model wasn't up to their standards........but i wonder did they inform the poor fellow. And if you watch the slo-mo replay closely, there isn't ONE corrective input on ANY surface after the model leaves terra-firma. HE FROZE and watched it dive to the deck...even with radio failure on 1 aileron servo, the other one didn't move, neither did the rudder or elevator, and the throttle stayed WIDE open. You tell me HE didn't lock up.
If you ever flew RC model planes...you would know that if the left Aileron goes up and down...then the right aileron should do the same but opposite...@ 2:33 and 3:05 you can clearly see him checking all surface without a problem. But @ 4:11 only the left aileron is moving without any input tells you he didn't have radio control.
I had a plane that lost it ailerons in flight I used my rudder as soon as i figured it had no ailerons and it did NOTHING to correct the angle (the rudder was working fine but from the video I don’t think anything was working) Instead of trying to restore the control it would have been a better idea to cut throttle rather than try and control the plane with non existent controls in my case. By the looks of things he lost everything.
As sure as anyone can be after the fact, the pilot said he felt like he lost all control. Although he was focused on the ailerons he did say he thought he had tried to pull more altitude as it was headed into a roll with no effect. As you can see the left aileron stopped moving at one point and stayed in one spot which might be evidence of that. If he lost everything it would me a mute point that he tried the rudder.
Agree. Watched the slo-mo and never saw any control movement from any surface once it got airborne. Likely loss of power to the receiver. As it rolled left, never saw the right aileron move to counteract, nor rudder, nor elevator. Loss of all control - the loss of the left aileron servo was likely the telltale that battery power was insufficient, but not noticed. All of us Monday morning quarterbacks know what happened - but at the time, at that instance, no one knew or could predict. Make sure your battery is of sufficient capacity to support several large servos and the receiver.
Crying shame! That same shit happened to my airplane one time when the aileron servo failed at level flight about 50 feet up but thankfully I was able to land it safely via rudder control.
***** I was told there were several connections that "could" have caused the problem but nothing was ever identified and one other thought process was that a bind prior to that flight might not have been done correctly. I do not know what the system was.
Any idea of what receiver/trans he was using? You can clearly see him perform a surface check before take off... The way it glitched then locked up leads me to believe his receiver/transmitter failed.. Or he had major range/interference issues.
There is something called a range check, completely different from checking the controls.Oh well, it happen to all of us at one time or another... Thanks for sharing the video. Note to self: Futaba all the way
For your info: I've seen many time Futaba 2,4 ghz radio have problems with loss of signal, sometime happens! Futaba, Hitec, Multiplex.....when destiny say no, is NO!! Anyway, crash a plane is always a very sad thing.....
BigTeeEldorado Well it looked like none of the other servos were even functioning. Even though the left aileron was moving around wildly, it could have just been because the pilot was realizing at that point he is not getting any stick reaction from the model at that point and just trying to assert some kind of control. As there was zero movement from the other surfaces such as the right aileron shows the receiver system was pretty much dead from the takeoff run just after throttling up.
tisoy909 Post crash he said he was able to pull a little elevator in order to get some altitude to work with but was never able to counter the roll. You can see the slight nose up attitude change after lift off. None of which eliminates signal loss as a factor, the receiver could have re-set several times in that duration. Unfortunately though nothing was ever positively identified that I know of. The focus has always been on the signal to that one servo and the potential that a shorted wire or bad potentiometer in the servo caused feedback issues. Which could have resulted in the receiver locking up / browning out. In effect control-no control-control-no control.
BigTeeEldorado Yeah I agree for the most part he did establish a decent climb angle in the beginning, giving time to work with establishing control. But look at the right aileron, it had not moved at all from liftoff to impact. perhaps he didn't use any elevator at all after liftoff but im certain he was surely yanked full yolk Left which should have given him full right Aileron down. Maybe he didn't need or feel to use elevator but im certain most of us would be on full left aileron. Was he on a powerbox or powersafe?
My Decathlon was a little on the heavy side and would tip stall on a full power hard take off. If I took off and built up speed slowly I had no problems.
Beautiful aircraft. Heart breaking to watch. I have seen this video many times, don't know if I have commented. I know the work it take to build an aircraft like this one. I hope you didn't give, try again. It's worth the effort.
He might have lost the radio link about the time it broke ground. Left aileron was up and own, seemingly randomly while the right never moved. Might have tried to cut power with no reaction. Happened to me once on a friends airplane. Almost cried! Total loss. He was cool about it, thank goodness.
I would guess it was the Rx pack, it had enough voltage for a preflight check but once airborne there is more force against the control surfaces and then leads to loss of control. i lost a 50cc biplane the exact way.
I had a aileron servo fail on me in my Dauntless Did the exact same thing....lucky I caught it before flying. It would have done the same thing. Also had a elevator servo do the same on a Christian Eagle. Sad to see the Decathlon go in....nice plane.
Lost ailerons? Looks like he was trying to counter with rudder but not enough dihedral on those birds to allow for an effective roll. Very painful to watch. Sorry for the loss.
range check before every flight is a must when you have that much money invested. I flew one weekend with no problems and the next week I had a radio glitch and save a the plane from crashing RANGE CHECK always. looked like nothing moved no rudder no right aileron movement either this make me think there not bonded or has a radio glitch. sad to see such a beautiful plane crash. Sorry
HOLA. EN EL MINUTO 3:35 EL ALERÓN DERECHO YA NO SE MUEVE. PROGRAMACIÓN DEL RADIO ? FALLO EL SEEVO ? SE DESCONECTO? QUE DOLOR PERDER UN AVIÓN TAN BONITO.
Clayton this was a few years ago and the best potential cause we could come up with was a bad servo or short in the wiring caused the receiver to lock out.
RoboTekno same here. Just bought a futaba 18sz. The menu's is something I hardly can get used to. I'm trying for 1 week now to. Mix my elevator down with flaps haha. With my spektrum it was easy. Always used spektrum. But to much weird thing. Just bought a krill extra41% and a decathlon 40% and I didn't wanted to take any risks. That's why I switched to futaba. With my rc cars same story.
This was a long time ago and honestly I do not remember. But probably more to the point the technology today is much different then it was when this accident occurred so not really as relevant.
So sorry to see that plane crash like that but I always carry a sheet on my truck for if and when I crash my big ones I put all the parts in the sheet and then bring it back to my truck sorry for your loss
Late comment here, but this was unfortunate. I see many comments about maybe pilot error but I think this was more pilot misfortune. The ailerons were both functioning in the preflight but the right aileron died on takeoff. Maybe the wire disconnected, maybe the servo shorted out . But it clearly happened after the roll out. Ya, in the split seconds he had to react maybe he could have cut the engine or tried to rudder it back, but its hard sometimes to respond like we wish we could have after a crash. Sorry to see the crash.
+Keyon Vossough The aileron movement was not noticed until the video was viewed much later on a large screen. No one noticed the behavior of the ailerons because the airplane was farther away than the zoomed in video suggests. The cameraman could not see that level of detail on the cameras small viewing screen and was just trying to keep the plane in frame.
I put my money on RX battery voltage. Those hungry high torque digital servos ate up his pack before takeoff. Digital servos that are under spec voltage Show these exact symptoms. Not respond, flutter, lose center, can't hold. But if your in RC for very long this IS going to happen to you too, even when nothing has been left unchecked, tested, verified a dozen times etc. Don't fly RC planes/helis if you can't accept and afford what just happened here.
Bisognerebbe sapere, se i servi degli alettoni,erano collegati con un cavo y,magari ha fatto un falso contatto,oppure nel programma della radio ,era stato inserito erroneamente un mixer ,alettoni - throttle, Ciao
I see no antenna on the transmitter. Was he using the newer 2.4gz guaranteed to have an issue equipment that so many people like to use? I have been told that depending on brand, you must have 2 or 3 receivers spread apart due to their poor performance. The local clubs near me still let you use the 72mz radios because they don't fail. The whole push for the 2.4gz cam from grown adults not wanting to share channels. It is my understanding that the range on the 2.4gz is only about 1000 feet, were as the 72mz was fully reliable past a kilometer (3000 feet plus).
Zaphod7835 Ask John Wennerstrom, he's a sales associate at Model Land here in Calgary, he'll tell you the exact same stories. Both him and I have had problems with Spektrum AND JR and since we switched to Futaba we've had no issues. I really think that I've just had horrible luck with it, because a lot of other guys I've talked to at all these events have had no problems with their DX or JR radios.
Definitely not a CG or airframe problem. I'd say the radio/servos failed on him, or some voltage in the battery wasn't right, causing the ailerons to lock up. This has happened to me before with a Sundowner pylon racer. I've had a LOT of issues with Spektrum/JR radios over the past few years. My dealer actually told me that when he was at a huge international RC airshow in CA around 6 or 7 years ago, the Spektrum radios were actually BANNED from the event due to all the problems arising with them. Futaba is definitely your best bet, I just got myself a new 14SG so I won't have any more lockouts at all the airshows I attend this summer up here in Alberta. Sure don't want to lose something like this again!!
ua-cam.com/video/nAQDijspZh0/v-deo.html
There is something wrong with the aileron - just one is working !
3:33
I am a huge fan of the Decathlon style planes. They are just gorgeous! This was very painful to watch. I can't even imagine how the owner felt.
Why no rudder??? The rudder never even moved. Left rudder would have easily saved that from happening, but I assume the whole radio was locked out? Beautiful Mike McConville Decathlon.
rudder would hold the plane in the air for a few extra seconds. But then what. The pilot had no chance with a runaway aileron.
Seeing the pilot's reaction just made it worse... I felt it! :o(
Sad to see a beautiful plane destroyed, On slow motion only surface that seemed to move was left aileron? Obviously the radio stopped communicating with the receiver, Curious if batteries and radio were checked after the crash?
Whatever you fly, Spektrum, Graupner, Futaba, Taranis, Multiplex, Jeti or anything else: Things like this can happen. All of the mentioned RC systems (incl. Spektrum ! :-) ) are not bad but they are not immune against failure. Maybe a double receiver would have saved it. Maybe it was a brownout by lack of voltage. Then a double receiver wouldn't have helped anyway. It could have been also a transmitter failure. If you fly RC-planes it's not a question if you crash but when you crash.
I flew Spektrum many years and had not any issues wiht it. Now I've changed to Taranis because of the programming possibilities and and so far I also have no issues with it.
Here's a thought to ponder. Not knowing what the post flight investigation revealed and going on just what is presented in the video.
I see the control check while taxiing out at 2:37. Both ailerons work and are opposite to each other.
Then at 3:07 another aileron input was given and they both still work but we don't know which direction the sticks are being deflected. (The title and length of video makes me look for reversed ailerons off the bat)
It also looks suspicious that he is making a left turn on the ground with rudder and the ailerons are in right roll position at this point. This is not a reflexive movement unless there was a strong wind from the right.
They are checked again quickly at 3:17 prior to Take-off.
From this point on, I see no further movement from the RIGHT aileron.
In theory, with the combination of a bad (dead) RIGHT aileron servo and reversed ailerons, a crash would look exactly like this one.
The pilot could be giving Left Aileron commands and getting the left servo to go more right (down) while the "dead" Right Aileron Servo does nothing and remains neutral. Thus prolonging the imminent Unscheduled Landing.
I am fairly certain that at some time during the fatal roll, the pilot would be giving FULL LEFT stick commands. I only see downward deflection in the Left Aileron.
I don't discount a noisy (bad) pot in either servo but they usually don't cause the Rx to sign off.
I wasn't the last person to hook up the ailerons backwards. That was back in 1978 when there were no switched on the Tx. It was a field servo swap.
Just shut up you wanker. You wasn’t there was you ?
Just found this. Dad had a green and white Citabria with the bat wing paint scheme. Was a fun little craft and we flew it everywhere. Pulled about 2 g's curling around the inside of the Mt St Helens crater,,below the crater lip. Could smell the rotten eggs from the cindercone and had a direct overhead view to hell on earth. Did my first snap roll ever in it,,scared the bejezzus out of me as a kid. It was also used for towing gliders. Rented it out a few times to other pilots at the field who would hand over enough cash. One of them ended up bending a strut playing a bit to hard with it. Fixed,,signed off,, and sold. So sad that the model hit the hardpan, some definite hyjinks with the aileron. One thing I have seen and heard,,is that the more money you spend on a heavy model,,,the louder soundbite of it when it crashes to bits. The high upside is that no one was hurt(thank the gods) and that they make those kits affordable everyday, new or used.
@kh40yr
My dad became a private pilot shortly after I was born. He bought a '49 C-170A and he and I went somewhere every weekend in that plane starting when I was 5yo until I was 16. We had our own airstrip so it was only a matter of walking 50' from the house to get in it.
I remember one day, I was 13yo, he called it a lead sled. I took offense to that remark. I had many, many hours logged in that right seat, watching for traffic or learning to navigate from VOR to VOR. Our ceiling was about 13,500. We were over a mountain range when suddenly we hit some really rough turbulence. I remember looking out the window at the wing and watching it "bend". Scared the crap outta me! Once we were in smooth air we picked up the nose, cut the throttle, threw in some rudder and spiraled down to a lower altitude. That was short lived however since I didn't pop my ears good enough, so back up we went, this time we came down a little slower.
I regarded that plane as a close member of our family. My dad flew it twice from our home in Southern California to Central America where he photographed from the air a lot of the Mayan pyramids peeking out of the jungle. He was fascinated with the ancient Mayan culture. That plane brought him back home safely twice. My dad and I flew all over the western USA to go fishing or exploring forestry strips in the back country or even old abandoned ghost towns. To think that he called her a lead sled was just unforgivable to me at the time.
Then for my 14th birthday he surprised me. We flew down to our local airport, only this time we landed on the sailplane side. He did a check ride in a green and white Citabria and then the two of us went for a ride. HOLY COW was all I remember! We went and did some loops over a class mates house, then flew away inverted. I know that looked cool. Good thing my friend didn't see the dirt we were eating off the floor! Not cool.
It was a great birthday except for one thing. We had to return the Citabria back to the airport and take that damn lead sled home! LOL. Those two planes are like night and day.
I guess renting a Citabria back in 1979 was expensive? According to my dad, I think he said, not positive, but I think rental was $45/hr + fuel? I could be wrong. That was many years ago and I still remember to this day how responsive and agile that plane was compared to the z170, just amazing. I saw it one more time. We had a sail plane land at our house, he'd lost his thermals. So we called up the airport and that same green and white Citabria came and towed it off our strip. I think there was some concern, our runway was a 10' x 1300' dirt strip, fortunately the last 600' went slightly downhill.
At 16yo I graduated high school and I had just gotten my driver's license only a couple months prior. I discovered drive-in movies and girls so flying was no longer important to me. Besides, the opportunity would ALWAYS be there, or so I thought. A year later my dad lost his medical at age 55, a year after that he sold the old lead sled and took up with ultralights. He loved those things. He had a new heart valve installed at age 80. He told me if things worked out he'd get his medical back, buy a C-172, no more battling a crosswind in a taildragger, and fly back to Central America. Technology had made some major advances regarding the explorarion of Mayan ruins. Sadly, he passed away two months after his heart operation. In the hangar at his home in Nevada, he left me an ultralight, which, no, I can't fly a kite while sitting in it! (I'm afraid of heights! I need to be in a cockpit of some sort. I don't dangle my feet out in mid air like some Flintstone vehicle!) He also left me an experimental light sport aircraft. He'd bought it in Wisconsin and brought it home to Nevada. Because of his bad heart at the time he couldn't pull start it so he was in the process of installing an electric starter. He never finished. I had to fly this plane so I did. It'd been 30 years since I'd last flown, but if you pull back on the stick the plane goes up. Some things never change. :) I only put about 2 hours on it, then sold it. My priorities at the time were here on the ground raising my two kids and caring for my elderly mother.
Today I have no priorities other than to enjoy life. My kids are grown and gone and my mom is undoubtedly with my dad somewhere doing God knows what!
A GA license just wouldn't be practical for me now. That's something my dad had wanted me to get when we owned the 170. I didn't and that was just one of many mistakes I've made in Life. There's a few lawyers I've hired in the past that could fill you in on other mistakes I've made! :) However an LSA license is something I'm considering. With 5 acres I can fly from home again.
Sorry, I didn't mean to write a novel. Thanks for posting your comment. I really did enjoy reading it. I brought back some good memories of a green and white Citabria!
You can only blame yourself for a piss-poor preflight inspection.
Sorry for your loss.
Thanks for sharing.
I've been to your flying sight.
"site"
Reckon the port aileron servo went home on it's own. Left rudder and full down might have saved it. Crying shame mate. Guess it's easy to make suggestions when you're not on the sticks though. Safe landings.
The whole time I was thinking the same. Rudder in an emergency. But I wouldn't have done much better.
Even with one aileron it should have been able to fly level? OIr was something else wrong? (like wrong input/reverse etc)
We must do everything possible on the ground before maiden flights, especially with gas powered airplanes. Go back 15 years or before 2.4 ghz systems, it would be sinful not to have performed a power on, 360 degree range check. This check is the last and mandatory of a long list to ensure we have done everything on the ground for a successful maiden. If it were a system failure, which by all appearances it was, it most likely would have been caught. Sorry for your loss. Hopefully this loss will encourage others to do a little extra on their next project. I'm glad your back in the air.
I built a KR2 homebuilt aircraft with VW engine and did a lot of high speed taxi tests before I got altitude and left the airport. This may have saved your aircraft but seems like most modelers fly "freestyle" without pilot training. Hope the rebuild is relatively painless. Thanks, Paul in Thailand building a long wing Super Privateer amphibian
how other pilots fly has no bearing on this.. wasnt doing anymore than taking off.. clearly was a controls failure.. as to the rest of your comment was random, pointless, and had no relation to the subject matter..
Absolutely agree he just wanted to say something negative about this particular pilot
And what does building a VW plane have to do with this anyway
First off, that was PAINFUL to watch, my heart goes out to the poor bugger, all the time and effort, and such a lovely job on that pig of a colour scheme. I have painted that in 1/3, 1/4, 1/5 and 1/6 scales, and it's a bastard to do. Anyway, I might get some flack for this, but, in my humble opinion, that was pure pilot error that cost that model. ANYONE with eyes can see, it's banking it's wing almost BEFORE breaking ground, i understand that it's at rotation speed, but even the 100cc Hanger 9 LEAD SLED Bellanca Citabria Decathlon is off at under 80kph. That model was recoverable, all it needed was an abort. If the pilot had thought to cut the throttle right after it started it's bank, then added some left rudder and about 15% down elevator to drop the nose some, it would have leveled, straightened and been able to land run out and bounce to a stop. Might have been bent U/C but not a total loss. One other point, if the peanut gallery in the background are speaking of this poor man's lovely model, then all his mates expected it to fold up in flight anyway. Listen close to the audio, one gent re-utters another's concern over glue joints, and they are discussing wings and mounts. So i expect that the model wasn't up to their standards........but i wonder did they inform the poor fellow. And if you watch the slo-mo replay closely, there isn't ONE corrective input on ANY surface after the model leaves terra-firma. HE FROZE and watched it dive to the deck...even with radio failure on 1 aileron servo, the other one didn't move, neither did the rudder or elevator, and the throttle stayed WIDE open. You tell me HE didn't lock up.
+1:) MaxDK.
If you ever flew RC model planes...you would know that if the left Aileron goes up and down...then the right aileron should do the same but opposite...@ 2:33 and 3:05 you can clearly see him checking all surface without a problem. But @ 4:11 only the left aileron is moving without any input tells you he didn't have radio control.
What a shame!! Was the rudder channel working? I would have tried to save it with hard left rudder. I saw no rudder input at all.
ctrcflyin2011 The pilot said felt like he lost all control so he was unable to add any rudder
Pilot error.
I had a plane that lost it ailerons in flight I used my rudder as soon as i figured it had no ailerons and it did NOTHING to correct the angle (the rudder was working fine but from the video I don’t think anything was working) Instead of trying to restore the control it would have been a better idea to cut throttle rather than try and control the plane with non existent controls in my case. By the looks of things he lost everything.
As sure as anyone can be after the fact, the pilot said he felt like he lost all control. Although he was focused on the ailerons he did say he thought he had tried to pull more altitude as it was headed into a roll with no effect. As you can see the left aileron stopped moving at one point and stayed in one spot which might be evidence of that. If he lost everything it would me a mute point that he tried the rudder.
Agree. Watched the slo-mo and never saw any control movement from any surface once it got airborne. Likely loss of power to the receiver. As it rolled left, never saw the right aileron move to counteract, nor rudder, nor elevator. Loss of all control - the loss of the left aileron servo was likely the telltale that battery power was insufficient, but not noticed. All of us Monday morning quarterbacks know what happened - but at the time, at that instance, no one knew or could predict. Make sure your battery is of sufficient capacity to support several large servos and the receiver.
It hurts to loose a nice model ,
I fell and know your pain
Crying shame! That same shit happened to my airplane one time when the aileron servo failed at level flight about 50 feet up but thankfully I was able to land it safely via rudder control.
Ohhh dude.. i´m so sorry for ya… keep your head up !
Was the radio problem ever figured out? What kind of radio system was it?
***** I was told there were several connections that "could" have caused the problem but nothing was ever identified and one other thought process was that a bind prior to that flight might not have been done correctly. I do not know what the system was.
Any idea of what receiver/trans he was using? You can clearly see him perform a surface check before take off... The way it glitched then locked up leads me to believe his receiver/transmitter failed.. Or he had major range/interference issues.
Sorry I don't know
A bad one.
at 3:35 pause the video, look at the left aileron moving and the right completely stopped, it must have been a failure of some left aileron servo.
There is something called a range check, completely different from checking the controls.Oh well, it happen to all of us at one time or another... Thanks for sharing the video. Note to self: Futaba all the way
For your info: I've seen many time Futaba 2,4 ghz radio have problems with loss of signal, sometime happens! Futaba, Hitec, Multiplex.....when destiny say no, is NO!! Anyway, crash a plane is always a very sad thing.....
Is this the H9 100CC decathlon? Did he range check first, damn that sucks, it hurt to watch.
Not sure about the model but he did range check it.
00:50 the guy says its a 55cc
BigTeeEldorado Well it looked like none of the other servos were even functioning. Even though the left aileron was moving around wildly, it could have just been because the pilot was realizing at that point he is not getting any stick reaction from the model at that point and just trying to assert some kind of control. As there was zero movement from the other surfaces such as the right aileron shows the receiver system was pretty much dead from the takeoff run just after throttling up.
tisoy909 Post crash he said he was able to pull a little elevator in order to get some altitude to work with but was never able to counter the roll. You can see the slight nose up attitude change after lift off. None of which eliminates signal loss as a factor, the receiver could have re-set several times in that duration. Unfortunately though nothing was ever positively identified that I know of. The focus has always been on the signal to that one servo and the potential that a shorted wire or bad potentiometer in the servo caused feedback issues. Which could have resulted in the receiver locking up / browning out. In effect control-no control-control-no control.
BigTeeEldorado Yeah I agree for the most part he did establish a decent climb angle in the beginning, giving time to work with establishing control. But look at the right aileron, it had not moved at all from liftoff to impact. perhaps he didn't use any elevator at all after liftoff but im certain he was surely yanked full yolk Left which should have given him full right Aileron down. Maybe he didn't need or feel to use elevator but im certain most of us would be on full left aileron. Was he on a powerbox or powersafe?
I thought he was rolling into a knife edge take off at first.
My Decathlon was a little on the heavy side and would tip stall on a full power hard take off. If I took off and built up speed slowly I had no problems.
Beautiful aircraft. Heart breaking to watch. I have seen this video many times, don't know if I have commented. I know the work it take to build an aircraft like this one. I hope you didn't give, try again. It's worth the effort.
That has so much realistic detail the very cool plane
Ppppppppppppppppppppppppp
Does it fly again?
Unfortunately no there wasn’t much left
Is the pilot ok? He was out of control at rotation, yet stayed in the throttle. I don't get that.
He might have lost the radio link about the time it broke ground. Left aileron was up and own, seemingly randomly while the right never moved. Might have tried to cut power with no reaction. Happened to me once on a friends airplane. Almost cried! Total loss. He was cool about it, thank goodness.
No rudder use, The driver just went along for the ride, way behind the toy plane!
The rudder never budged. Tragic.
I would guess it was the Rx pack, it had enough voltage for a preflight check but once airborne there is more force against the control surfaces and then leads to loss of control.
i lost a 50cc biplane the exact way.
sorry man but did he do a proper flight check?
Yes, you can see him checking out the controls after he assembled the plane.
Yes, you can see him checking out the controls after he assembled the plane.
I had a aileron servo fail on me in my Dauntless Did the exact same thing....lucky I caught it before flying. It would have done the same thing. Also had a elevator servo do the same on a Christian Eagle. Sad to see the Decathlon go in....nice plane.
Receiver brownout?
Nothing worse than when a model is in a "point of no return" situation and some twat is shouting commands from the pit area........
Where is this field ? California ?
Vdubin64 Boulder City Nevada
Where was this
matthew sanders Eldorado Dry Lake bed Boulder city Nevada
Lost ailerons? Looks like he was trying to counter with rudder but not enough dihedral on those birds to allow for an effective roll. Very painful to watch. Sorry for the loss.
range check before every flight is a must when you have that much money invested. I flew one weekend with no problems and the next week I had a radio glitch and save a the plane from crashing RANGE CHECK always. looked like nothing moved no rudder no right aileron movement either this make me think there not bonded or has a radio glitch. sad to see such a beautiful plane crash. Sorry
does the full scale Decathlon also have a symmetrical wing?
Yes. Both the Super and Extreme have symmetrical wings.
What relevance is that ? Wanker
What engine?
Why ?
This stuff made me switch to boats.... Flight was going well until I hit power lines and it took the wings off !
That plane looked very well before it crashed
Might be the result of using an aileron Y cable with a reversing chip. They were notorious for failing and are no longer made.
HOLA. EN EL MINUTO 3:35 EL ALERÓN DERECHO YA NO SE MUEVE. PROGRAMACIÓN DEL RADIO ? FALLO EL SEEVO ? SE DESCONECTO? QUE DOLOR PERDER UN AVIÓN TAN BONITO.
What happened?
Clayton this was a few years ago and the best potential cause we could come up with was a bad servo or short in the wiring caused the receiver to lock out.
@@BigTeeEldorado what a pity this plane crashes, electronic things can stop working without sudently.
This is why I don't fly Spektrum or JR anymore :-P
RoboTekno same here. Just bought a futaba 18sz. The menu's is something I hardly can get used to. I'm trying for 1 week now to. Mix my elevator down with flaps haha. With my spektrum it was easy. Always used spektrum. But to much weird thing. Just bought a krill extra41% and a decathlon 40% and I didn't wanted to take any risks. That's why I switched to futaba. With my rc cars same story.
RoboTekno been flying spektrum for years without issue. It was a separate issue, could have been servo malfunction or servo leads separation.
Spectrum Invented the word Brown out! Dsm, dsm2, DISASTERS just waiting to happen!
military grade on the Simpsons ...Maybe!
Or random loss of signal, what everyone expects from spectrum, when it goes down NO control surfaces are moving only the left aileron, aimlessly!
What a stupid ass comment.
4:53 UFO interference.
What transmitter and receiver models were used please?
This was a long time ago and honestly I do not remember. But probably more to the point the technology today is much different then it was when this accident occurred so not really as relevant.
@@BigTeeEldorado ok thank you...
awesome plane,,, sry about the crash, shit happens, especially with elektronics.. hope you get a good comeback;) MaxDK
left rudder????
nice flight maverick
So sorry to see that plane crash like that but I always carry a sheet on my truck for if and when I crash my big ones I put all the parts in the sheet and then bring it back to my truck sorry for your loss
Late comment here, but this was unfortunate. I see many comments about maybe pilot error but I think this was more pilot misfortune. The ailerons were both functioning in the preflight but the right aileron died on takeoff. Maybe the wire disconnected, maybe the servo shorted out . But it clearly happened after the roll out. Ya, in the split seconds he had to react maybe he could have cut the engine or tried to rudder it back, but its hard sometimes to respond like we wish we could have after a crash. Sorry to see the crash.
The throttle is reduced and the left wing rudder is used, that compensates for the aileron !!!!
Just after lift
off left aileron is going catty Wampus
Beautiful plane, a real shame to lose it!
Didn't he see the aileron or did the camera man give a warning because it was seen before take off
+Keyon Vossough The aileron movement was not noticed until the video was viewed much later on a large screen. No one noticed the behavior of the ailerons because the airplane was farther away than the zoomed in video suggests. The cameraman could not see that level of detail on the cameras small viewing screen and was just trying to keep the plane in frame.
@@BigTeeEldorado 3:33 just one is working
That's the Hobby. Things fail any time. But nice Knife Edge 😆
I put my money on RX battery voltage.
Those hungry high torque digital servos ate up his pack before takeoff.
Digital servos that are under spec voltage
Show these exact symptoms.
Not respond, flutter, lose center, can't hold. But if your in RC for very long this IS going to happen to you too, even when nothing has been left unchecked, tested, verified a dozen times etc.
Don't fly RC planes/helis if you can't accept and afford what just happened here.
Bisognerebbe sapere, se i servi degli alettoni,erano collegati con un cavo y,magari ha fatto un falso contatto,oppure nel programma della radio ,era stato inserito erroneamente un mixer ,alettoni - throttle,
Ciao
BUMMER. Gorgeous plane.
Aż przykro patrzec na to. Piekny model. Szkoda.
Not enough pre flight check. That's too much airplane not to thoroughly check it out before flight.
I watched and there was no control input to counter the roll and crash. pilot froze or lost of signal .sad to watch.
$ 5000 gone too hell i feel ya i lost a brand new ems hawker typhone hurts like hell
more like 2500 for the airframe. The rest is usually salvageable.
I see no antenna on the transmitter. Was he using the newer 2.4gz guaranteed to have an issue equipment that so many people like to use?
I have been told that depending on brand, you must have 2 or 3 receivers spread apart due to their poor performance.
The local clubs near me still let you use the 72mz radios because they don't fail.
The whole push for the 2.4gz cam from grown adults not wanting to share channels.
It is my understanding that the range on the 2.4gz is only about 1000 feet, were as the 72mz was fully reliable past a kilometer (3000 feet plus).
No connecting on the left rudder ,a think
No rudder control & power all the way to the cash site, shame the driver just went along for the ride!:-(
duele mucho cuando se nos rompe un modelo mucha bronca.
That slow roll and tip stall was heart breaking to watch I do feel the man's pain just saying.
Da pra ver claramente que o aileron direito nao estava funcionando.
Doesnt the rudder work...
Damn dude! I'm sorry to see that!
Did he tried pushing the rudder to the left maybe that would have felt they would have actually you would have actually landed safely
Moron
Not enough ground speed before take off, pilot error.
Algo mal enchufado habia, el derecho nunca funciono, nunca probastes antes de salir, pareces Miguelito Guerra
Looks like a classic stall spin accident…. Lower the nose and left rudder would have saved it.
he had zero control, ie: no power so servos were not working, either faulty battery/connections or RX.
Experts !
Now thats just to bad.... what happend?
Much like many radio controlled accidents nothing was ever definitively determine as the cause
Zaphod7835 Ask John Wennerstrom, he's a sales associate at Model Land here in Calgary, he'll tell you the exact same stories. Both him and I have had problems with Spektrum AND JR and since we switched to Futaba we've had no issues. I really think that I've just had horrible luck with it, because a lot of other guys I've talked to at all these events have had no problems with their DX or JR radios.
That's what happens when you fly brand X radios. Remember Quality is remembered well after the Price.
Definitely not a CG or airframe problem. I'd say the radio/servos failed on him, or some voltage in the battery wasn't right, causing the ailerons to lock up. This has happened to me before with a Sundowner pylon racer.
I've had a LOT of issues with Spektrum/JR radios over the past few years. My dealer actually told me that when he was at a huge international RC airshow in CA around 6 or 7 years ago, the Spektrum radios were actually BANNED from the event due to all the problems arising with them. Futaba is definitely your best bet, I just got myself a new 14SG so I won't have any more lockouts at all the airshows I attend this summer up here in Alberta. Sure don't want to lose something like this again!!
if only the pilot had used left rudder !
Ouch..... I am sorry
EMOTIONAL DAMAGE 🤦
Sad to watch...
It really sucks it crashed
4:54......UFO above the right wing.😁
Digital Servo Generyc It live bring me problems.
The problem is simple and very obvious tail heavy it’s tail heavy!......Put some weight on the head. Then it’s ok
I'm sorry for your plane man
check this one out: ua-cam.com/video/9Xt5ntYtNfE/v-deo.html
El metiche que te ayudo a poner el ala no la conecto
🤣😄
and the right one did not go up to counter act it.
O no;(((
LOLOLOL SMAAAASSSHHHH
Learn to fly the small stuff first...
Yes ! He could have saved it worth full left rudder !
That's a shame.