U described speed and power well Dominic. Love this sailing vid, looks like u going as fast as the polish gang, but their proas are fine, very fine.... U got a fast boat! Bigger CC, I used to make them on the beach, plastic held by 2 wooden battens screwed together, looks like what u got....?.... How close can u go? the ultimate question.... how much 45??? Keep Shunting brah Balkan Shipyards
loving watching the flow of steering with setting the mast angle and mainsheet then the powering / depowering with the cord that lifts & lowers the boom i guess its the relationship between you and the boat that is a buzz ... i have got back into sailing bcos surf for a 60+ with back issues etc a bit crowded , i sail lake macquarie australia on a 90's aclass , when i first got it -both rudders lited off in about 15knots; even though pinned [al tube rudder stocks bent with pressure] anyway once i got the rudders aboard it wasnt that hard to steer just with the traveller and cunno ... really enjoying these thanks Alex
Yes, I also love how I can balance it. In moderate conditions I can cleat the main sheet and it just keeps on going the same direction (can't really move around though because that would change center of mass which has a big effect) have you seen the Patín catalán? it's a one-design beach cat (from 1942!!!) that has neither rudder nor centerboard!
@@dominictarrsailing it is a euro thing , Spain or Portugal .. i think i have .. hulls close and not that bouyant .. ill look them up , i missed that they didnt have foils or rudders .. thanks again
yes, and also it has control lines either side, so you can trim it forward or back. When shunting to windward I have it straight in the middle, though if I really want to point high I pull it forward a bit! on a reach I pull it back, even so it comes out. Apart from sending a lot of spray up it works very well and is extremely simple. It's a bit noisy in smooth water but once you are sailing hard that doesn't matter. I think I should try stepping it out from the ama and see if it throws less spray
i’ve been wanting to build a proa, have most of what i’ll need worked out but trying to figure out the best way to secure the mast as it needs to pivot, saw one video where they used a joint with hinges in both directions but also have been thinking perhaps rope wrapped around the mast base and a wood socket for it to go into with a hole in the middle for the rope to go down into and secure the mast leaving it to pivot, been watching your videos and trying to see how you’ve done it, could you video that part?
sure I will do that. Yeah you don't need something complicated there. Mine just sits in a loose wooden socket. There is a fair amount of compression on the mast while sailing normally so it doesn't need to be held in, but it's nice if the mast doesn't fall when caught aback, so I have a line set up to tie the foot of the mast loosely to the step. The position of the fore/aft stays are more important. They need to be able to slip as the mast tilts fore and aft, and also have adjustment so you can tilt the mast to windward or leeward (windward for going downwind, leeward for upwind). On my setup the tack comes above the deck when shunting, inspired by the marshallese style, this also means the mast tilts more, and I can even make the yard be vertical. At first I had my fore/aft stays at the ends, but that snagged during shunting too often so I moved them in and it was much better.
I think I saw a similar effect to my boat where when the bow is pressed down it heads up. But sometimes you get a kind of planing effect where the bow pops out and the boat suddenly bears away. Did you notice that behaviour? I think it’s a combination of the flat bottom and sharp forefoot.
Yes! this boat does that! in fact it happens in this video but I quickly steer back ua-cam.com/video/n56bsey3O8A/v-deo.html you go very fast like that but I didn't have sea room in that direction. I wouldn't say I notice a distinct "popping up" but the sudden bearing off is hard to miss! Is your proa still sailing?
Nice ride. One reason why you may not go faster ( I think 10 knots is great ) Could have something to do with the bottom shape. You need an upward curvature in the bow (front) to get safely through waves. But a more straight line from midship to stern would probably increase maximum hull speed.... I think. Imagine a "speed boat" with an upsweeps stern. it would never get out of the water. It would "suck" itself down. I remember when my dad had 12 sailboats (all of the same model), on tow behind his motorboat (there was absolutely 0,0 wind ).. up till about 6 or 6,5 knots he used very little motor power.. But at full power the speed did not go up.. So 6-6,5 knots was the max hull speed of the sailboats in a complete upright position.
then you couldn't adjust it backwards and forward for different points of sail! I think it helps a lot to rake it back for a beam reach, and sometimes I even have forward past the center to point really high in light wind
the pivoting lee board is also extremely simple to construct, and also avoids entirely having a dagger board slot in the hull which means inside corners that are difficult to work on or repair
What's the hull length? That seems a fair turn of speed for a short hull. I'm now wondering what the top speed is my sailing canoe has achieved over the years. I reckon I need to clear the memory on my old phone and install Navionics or something. Thanks for your vlogs Dom.
4.2 meters long! and main hull came out 0.36 wide, so just under 12:1 hull ratio (11.66:1). and only 6 square meter sail. So quite modest all round! although it's quite light, 60kg fully rigged!
Way back in the design and build phase, I think you said that you planned for the vaka to be planing rather than slicing. Any thoughts on how that is working out in practice?
I don't remember saying that. hmm had to rewatch my build video. Didn't mention anything like that. My main design objectives was to give it enough load carrying ability (240kg, 3 people), be compact enough to fit on board my catamaran, be fast and simple to build and not use much material. Also, I needed a flat bottom because I knew I'd need to drag it along beaches and mud flats sometimes, a V hull isn't good for that. So the performance was really just a happy accident!
That is fabulous! 🎉 Thanks, Dominic, for bringing us along! 🙏🙂
you are welcome thank you for watrching and commenting!
U described speed and power well Dominic.
Love this sailing vid, looks like u going as fast as the polish gang, but their proas are fine, very fine.... U got a fast boat!
Bigger CC, I used to make them on the beach, plastic held by 2 wooden battens screwed together, looks like what u got....?....
How close can u go? the ultimate question.... how much 45???
Keep Shunting brah
Balkan Shipyards
loving watching the flow of steering with setting the mast angle and mainsheet then the powering / depowering with the cord that lifts & lowers the boom i guess its the relationship between you and the boat that is a buzz ... i have got back into sailing bcos surf for a 60+ with back issues etc a bit crowded , i sail lake macquarie australia on a 90's aclass , when i first got it -both rudders lited off in about 15knots; even though pinned [al tube rudder stocks bent with pressure] anyway once i got the rudders aboard it wasnt that hard to steer just with the traveller and cunno ... really enjoying these thanks Alex
Yes, I also love how I can balance it. In moderate conditions I can cleat the main sheet and it just keeps on going the same direction (can't really move around though because that would change center of mass which has a big effect)
have you seen the Patín catalán? it's a one-design beach cat (from 1942!!!) that has neither rudder nor centerboard!
@@dominictarrsailing it is a euro thing , Spain or Portugal .. i think i have .. hulls close and not that bouyant .. ill look them up , i missed that they didnt have foils or rudders .. thanks again
Love the lee board setup. It looks like it can kick back in shallow. Versatile little boat. Inspiring.
yes, and also it has control lines either side, so you can trim it forward or back. When shunting to windward I have it straight in the middle, though if I really want to point high I pull it forward a bit! on a reach I pull it back, even so it comes out. Apart from sending a lot of spray up it works very well and is extremely simple. It's a bit noisy in smooth water but once you are sailing hard that doesn't matter. I think I should try stepping it out from the ama and see if it throws less spray
i’ve been wanting to build a proa, have most of what i’ll need worked out but trying to figure out the best way to secure the mast as it needs to pivot, saw one video where they used a joint with hinges in both directions but also have been thinking perhaps rope wrapped around the mast base and a wood socket for it to go into with a hole in the middle for the rope to go down into and secure the mast leaving it to pivot,
been watching your videos and trying to see how you’ve done it, could you video that part?
sure I will do that. Yeah you don't need something complicated there. Mine just sits in a loose wooden socket. There is a fair amount of compression on the mast while sailing normally so it doesn't need to be held in, but it's nice if the mast doesn't fall when caught aback, so I have a line set up to tie the foot of the mast loosely to the step. The position of the fore/aft stays are more important. They need to be able to slip as the mast tilts fore and aft, and also have adjustment so you can tilt the mast to windward or leeward (windward for going downwind, leeward for upwind). On my setup the tack comes above the deck when shunting, inspired by the marshallese style, this also means the mast tilts more, and I can even make the yard be vertical. At first I had my fore/aft stays at the ends, but that snagged during shunting too often so I moved them in and it was much better.
I think I saw a similar effect to my boat where when the bow is pressed down it heads up. But sometimes you get a kind of planing effect where the bow pops out and the boat suddenly bears away. Did you notice that behaviour? I think it’s a combination of the flat bottom and sharp forefoot.
Yes! this boat does that! in fact it happens in this video but I quickly steer back ua-cam.com/video/n56bsey3O8A/v-deo.html you go very fast like that but I didn't have sea room in that direction. I wouldn't say I notice a distinct "popping up" but the sudden bearing off is hard to miss!
Is your proa still sailing?
Nice ride. One reason why you may not go faster ( I think 10 knots is great ) Could have something to do with the bottom shape. You need an upward curvature in the bow (front) to get safely through waves. But a more straight line from midship to stern would probably increase maximum hull speed.... I think. Imagine a "speed boat" with an upsweeps stern. it would never get out of the water. It would "suck" itself down. I remember when my dad had 12 sailboats (all of the same model), on tow behind his motorboat (there was absolutely 0,0 wind ).. up till about 6 or 6,5 knots he used very little motor power.. But at full power the speed did not go up.. So 6-6,5 knots was the max hull speed of the sailboats in a complete upright position.
is there any reason why the leeboard could not have a case so it stays in the same position?
then you couldn't adjust it backwards and forward for different points of sail! I think it helps a lot to rake it back for a beam reach, and sometimes I even have forward past the center to point really high in light wind
the pivoting lee board is also extremely simple to construct, and also avoids entirely having a dagger board slot in the hull which means inside corners that are difficult to work on or repair
This is the little proa you built on your boat? I guess the camera angle makes it look a lot smaller.
hehe yeah it sure is. too much fish eye, but was necessary to get everything in the shot
Did you make this run in the Upper Harbour, Auckland.
yes that's beach haven in the back ground!
What's the hull length? That seems a fair turn of speed for a short hull. I'm now wondering what the top speed is my sailing canoe has achieved over the years. I reckon I need to clear the memory on my old phone and install Navionics or something. Thanks for your vlogs Dom.
4.2 meters long! and main hull came out 0.36 wide, so just under 12:1 hull ratio (11.66:1). and only 6 square meter sail. So quite modest all round!
although it's quite light, 60kg fully rigged!
Way back in the design and build phase, I think you said that you planned for the vaka to be planing rather than slicing. Any thoughts on how that is working out in practice?
I don't remember saying that. hmm had to rewatch my build video. Didn't mention anything like that. My main design objectives was to give it enough load carrying ability (240kg, 3 people), be compact enough to fit on board my catamaran, be fast and simple to build and not use much material. Also, I needed a flat bottom because I knew I'd need to drag it along beaches and mud flats sometimes, a V hull isn't good for that. So the performance was really just a happy accident!
I'm glad to see the flat bottom worked out because my most recent little boat also has a flat bottom for the same reason.
👍!!!
scary
@@luburan1973 if you want a scary one try the "strong wind advisory" video ;)