@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac small buttons are annoying. too many buttons are annoying. my br2 remote is maybe a bigger version of their aluminum one bryston ran a truck over it to prove it would still work which while fun was annoying as well.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac did you try these out with any of your First Watt amps? I recently got a First Watt M2, and would love to know if these go well with it. Any thoughts?
Long live the CD! Some vinyl and streaming lovers wish that all CDs would disappear from the face of the earth. Too bad! They are still here and will be here for the foreseeable future, and they still sell tens of millions of them every year!
I also still love CDs. Just also bought a Pro-Ject Pre Box s2+ which I use as Dac with my Marantz CD6006. Love this tiny little box. Might be worth a review as well...
A lot of us are getting used to the idea of buying external linear power supplies for various pieces of equipment. In fact, some manufacturers will tell you that the wallwarts and bricks they supply with their equipment is "adequate," BUT, they advise that you buy yourself a decent linear supply to extract all the juice from the product. Out on the fringes there are DIGIphiles who insist on external linear supplies for the computers that serve up the music. Can you hear that WHOOSHING sound? That's more of my money heading into the void. And like any other addict, I CAN'T STOP MYSELF!!! :) Thanks Steve. Your reviews are always entertaining.
Steve, regarding power supply - they actually offer upgrade paths for those wall warts. They're sold separately but hope you can convince them to send you those too so you can evaluate if they're worth the upgrade.
I'm like you Steve when it comes to CDs/LPs/SACDs (physical formats), I don't use any streaming yet, in any way, because I love my discs and I only want to use them.
Hi Steve. How does the Project Two boxer over I2S compare to the Jays and the Denefrips Aries over I2S? This seems a fairer test to me. Thanks Steve. Loving your content.
Besides subjective comments like “It really sounds great”, or something to that effect, I’d like to see an audio test between a $400 CD player and a $4000 one to check if people can really tell the difference. And, more importantly, if any difference exists is it worth the price differential.
you nailed it. Here is a system with 3 high level components (Focal Scala v2 speakers, Chord pre and Chord amp) combined with $300 spinner (bluray Panasonic player), cheap AQ speaker cables, and $0.5 RCA cables between the player and preamp and between preamp and amp, stock power cables: ua-cam.com/video/-FrUX_VV4L8/v-deo.html I will be adding better source, dac, cables, step by step to see improvements
Why don't you try it for yourself? Go to an audio dealer or audio show and ask for a demo and be open to hearing the difference. As to determining value for money, that's a private decision, not a mathematical truth, in the same way a $5000 whisky or $multi-million private jet depends on personal mores/valuations
i have the jay cdt2 in for testing and i did a blind a/b test with my cheap dvd player, mitchell and johnson budget cd player and NadM50 cd transport and i could hear the differences every single time with the same dac through my ATC speakers and so can everybody else, you don't need golden ears for that, the M50 and Jay's were pretty close but you could still hear lot's of little differences, that doesn't mean the Jay's is ten times better than for example the mitchell and johnson but it is a lot better and sounds amazing, the mitchell sounds good, the M50 great, the dvd sounds like crap, the system i tested this is about 12000 dollars so you do need a good enough system to be able to hear the differences
Steve , I think sound difference can be due to I2S and separated data and clock signals along with sync of clock on transport and DAC than sound of other transport. How did Project sound thru coax or AES into Project Dac vs both thru I2S ..... it is a really interesting question?
Thanks for the great review, Steve! Until I have saved enough shekels, I’ll continue to enjoy my treasured CD collection played through a Cambridge CXC CD transport and Project Pre Box S2 DAC at about 1/4 the cost. Long live the CD format!
Hi Steve, I wish you would of used AES output on BOTH the Jay’s and Pro-Ject. That would of really helped the comparison, especially since you said how much better the I2S was on the PJ.
@@mkwilson38 A fair comparison is aes to aes. I2s is superior to aes… thus the project transport would have better SQ. Definitely not a fair comparison…. One had to read between the lines with reviews. They can be very deceiving.
I was able to get hold of a used CD box. After switching from PC audio back to CD, I had a significant improvement in sound with the Audiolab 6000 CDT. It was actually just a test with the 6000 CDT. The Pro-Ject drive runs in a very high-quality environment (see my homepage) and it's just amazing what sound it gets out of profane CDs. It is operated on a special isolating transformer, but a high-quality power supply will further increase the sound, we'll save. Thank you Steve, your video made a significant contribution to the decision, along with some test reports.
Wish you would cover the lower priced Project, the Nuprime, the Cambridge, and the Audiolab which are under $1000. What's great about the new transports is they can play CD-R discs. Not clear whether they load a buffer and then do error correction like my NuForce CD player.
@@mauanderuk All 40+ CD players from the 80s and 90s that I tried played CDrs. Best-Kyocera 1984 310 and 410 players (light in the bass and not detailed but lovely). EAR Acute in 2005 killed all those players.
steve you hit on something here you said, you said a cd was well recorded one of the best recorded. can you do a segment on your best recorded cd's or sacd's.on best sound alone not musical content
Had the transport on trial at home for a week now, and Sound quality is 10/10 (for the price and my system). (Previously owned, Micromega T-Drive, Naim CD5X and CDS3). Built quality is so and so : 5/10. Shape and form nice and minimal, so what can go wrong with a transport? Well for starters, you do need to be careful dropping the lid. It doesn't ease out as it drops and the sharp edges could hurt your fingers. Remote Control edges too. Reading CD contents is worryingly loud, and the UI on the display is terrible. (I mean that missing disc icon, is out of 80s Word clip art for God sake), plus I managed to crash (!?) the OS twice trying to inverse the display color. How do you do that anyway???? Steve?
I’m glad I never threw out my CD collection, most of which dates from the 80s and 90s and before the loudness wars began. Used CDs are in a sweet spot right now, it will be interesting to see whether they will experience a price resurgence like vinyl has. I was amongst the earliest owners of the original Sony CDP-101 and it’s amazing to see how far we’ve come in terms of Redbook playback since then with outboard DACs and CD transports.
Wow! The ol' first gen Sony! Perfect Sound Forever, right? How far we've come indeed. I didn't jump into CD playback until '86 or so. I believe I bought a Kyocera player as my first. Not sure but I believe it was pre-owned but new.
@FOH3663 Ha, yeah that was the slogan wasn’t it. I had just graduated and started my first job and it was my first major “audiophile” purchase. My credit card didn’t even have a high enough credit limit to buy it, had to get a relative to buy it for me.
Have we? My DAC is a modern implementation of those same TDA1540D chips in the 101and it sounds fantastic, and I would not trade it for a DAC using a modern DAC chip. The TDA1540D was a 14 bit chip, the first Sony chip was a 16bit chip, yet the players with the Philips chips back then sounded way better than players with Sony's first chip.
Hi Steve, here’s a record you should be using as reference, if you aren’t already. Frank Zappa and the Mothers “One Size Fits All”. It ticks all the boxes when it comes to dynamics, transparency, and all around fun!
Yes, but it specifies "hybrid-SACDs" so likely it only reads the CD layer.
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They reminds me a wonderful minicomputer AIWA system from the 80's , C50/P50/T50. 50w the p/channel, all discrete, tropical transformer and 12.000 mf caps.I still have it and sound amazing.
Great review of a product I would never consider purchasing. The lack of SACD capability is unforgivable in my book. But I still watched the review! It was interesting enough to listen for 15 minutes.
So not all I2S interfaces are compatable? Obviously your Jay's transport and Denafrips DAC play nice together, but how about with kit from elsewhere other than China LLC?
Ok Steve, you did not mention how the Project DAC compares with your terminator ? Any insights you can give would be helpful. I have a friend that bought the transport based on your review and said it is the best he ever had in his system. Thanks.
What happened? I passed out when I heard the prices. I know mid-fi hi-fi. Actually, I was thinking if I bought the Griffin for 28k I could keep it in my garage where the car should be.
I would like to know what Steve thinks about the Project CD transport versus the newer PS Audio Perfect Wave transport which is when at $3999, similar in price. Does the Project require an upgraded power supply than the walwart to obtain better sound?
When the DVD standard was originally developed it had the option of taking over from CD’s 16-bit 44,100 sample-rate (1.4 megabits/sec) with its 24-bit 96,000 sample-rate (4.6 megabits/sec) the HD media issue would have been resolved forever (IMHO 192k is a complete waste of time WHEN using a DAC designed for 96k - not 192k... the latter’s output filters are set an ‘ultrasonic noise’ octave too high to properly deal with 96k). Unfortunately, like the CD, it had no way to protect the data from copying - so it was killed off by the record companies who refused to use it ... very sad!
damn this was a missed opportunity. I am looking for a DAC, that is not made in China thank you very much, and I am keep searching about information about ProJect Pre Box RS2 Digital, and there is none. The best you get is a spec sheet, but how does it compare to the stuff around it, details, sound stage, is it more wide 2d or more in depth, does the DAC sound better then let's say Qutest (just because that is pure DAC). You got options. We got options for half of the price with ADI-2, that is nothing new, but how it performs in relations with things around it? A missed opportunity indeed.
I need to add a CD player to my system and wanted to keep it at around $500. What do you think about possibly a used Pioneer Elite? If so any recommend models? How about a Denon? Any previous owners out there to weigh in?
I’ve owned a bunch of CD players/transports over the years and they all crap out after 7 years or so. It’s been described to me as “laser fade”. I wonder if this transport will last longer. I’m still buying CDs. Some good bargains out there.
I haven't heard that term, also I have players that are still going strong after 17 years of contstant use! I even own a Magnavox CD player made in 1989 that plays and sounds fantastic!
I wish I had that luck! I had a Magnavox in the 80’s too. That actually lasted about 10 years, then a Marantz 5 disc, then a Sony 5 disc. I’m currently using a Sony Blu-Ray as a transport. The Marantz and Sony would stop playing certain CDs, and they’d skip, even after cleaning the lense.
Still using the Marantz CD-56 I bought new in 1985. It's never needed a service, just keeps on trucking. I also have an old Panasonic SL-PJ325A with the same mechanism. Those vintage Philips CDM4/19 mechanisms may well survive the eventual heat death of the universe.
I have been using a cheap Sony transport in an EAR Acute CDP for 15 years with at least 5000+ hours on it and it tracks just fine. Do you ever clean your laser lens? I do every 3 to 6 months.
I have some Marantz players using the CDM4/19 and they are still reading great, in fact I have not heard of a laser failing with this mechanism apart from user error like in turning up the laser power and burning them out. It's usually other issues and not the actually mech or laser. Then there are players with the CDM1 Mkll and they are all still going strong also. The Jay's CDT2 uses new old stock CDM4/19.
Appreciate the reviews, as always. No way in hell I’m buying a three thousand dollar transport with a laptop-like power supply (though you just know Pro-ject will soon offer a $1500 or so separate power supply) with cheesy remote and controls, and won’t necessarily play well with other I2S- capable units. And if anyone missed it, 1.) the number of CD’s you own shouldn’t figure into the amount of money you spend for a transport, and 2.) the fact that another unit with the same transport unit costs $28k doesn’t make THIS one a good deal.
@@stephenfleschler9682 Steve seem to have liked this one better than the Jay's, but I'm also not a fan of wall-warty ps's (especially at $3000), and you'd better make sure you can return this and get all of your money back if this doesn't work in your system. Vinshine/Denafrips will only take returns if your unit is defective, and do not offer refunds of any kind - don't know about the Jay's distributers. And of course, your system needs to be of a high enough quality that you could tell the difference between the three, whatever difference there may be.
@@homerjones3291 I have 7,000 CDs. I have a high end system (not SOTA $70K) in a custom SOTA listening room ($160K). I will hear the slightest differences. My DAC is the DV2v COS Engineering, not at the level of my analog front end but very good. It just seems like the Avatar and the Jay's Audio are nearly identical units built or designed by the same factory, the Avatar 3 kg lighter but with 2 year newer technology. I saw a review that stated that the Avatar absolutely needs 200 hours to break in while users of the Jay's Audio are very happy listening to it brand new while it breaks in. I do not want to spend another $2K on a linear power supply for a $3K transport with non-IEC connections. The Pro-ject is out (also, it maybe less reliable based on its build).
It doesn't do sacd. The new(er) Atlas VRDS like in say an Esoteric player is , just, how do I describe the sound, it took my breadth away. Yeah I know their is a price difference but the sound and the over the top build quality is in another world. And it made me reconsider what is value in a product. But I'll get to be able to compare them soon as a local dealer carries both. I can go on about some comparisons (observations) but the Project stuff for me, any of it fails that wow factor, that thing that makes you go yeah, that's nice.
Usually you get a good review, from steve but this is so lacking in info that is not even funny. the worst part is you can't find any other review in English for ProJect Pre Box RS2 Digital. So can it outperform a 700Euro cheaper Qutest? sound stage, bass impact, sound separation... what do I get for 2000 Euro? just a box and components and some buttons to push? You can get that for $5.
If the transport is truly a slave to the preamp DAC, how on earth can any transport impart any difference to the signal path? Its all ones and zeros, either you account for them all or you don't.
It is only 1's and 0's in pure mathematics. A transport is an electromechanical device & it can have errors, which are corrected by interpolation (i.e. an educated guess). The system does the best it can but is not perfect.
If you can afford these units, you can afford a linear power supply. But in testing, there was no improvement with a linear but there was an improvement with an ifi wall wort.
I have the transport and purchased a LTA Linear Power Supply specifically made for the RS2-T. The sound improvement is significant compared to the switching supply that came with the transport. I also added Fern & Roby isolation feet, Transparent Premium Power cable and reference interconnect. Couldn’t be more pleased with the upgraded setup.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I based my comment on watching this video: ua-cam.com/video/X65ijUhqYxo/v-deo.html The entire video is informative. But at the 5 minute mark, Hans sums it up. It is my understanding that it boils down to, for example, already having your 44.1 kHz file converted to (perhaps) 88.2 kHz vs. having your gear convert it to 88.2 kHz on-the-fly. Either way, your DAC chip sees an 88.2 kHz data stream. Is my understanding correct or oversimplified? By the way, I recommend folks never use google services if possible (of course, youtube is a google service). But use duckduckgo.com instead of google.com (if your privacy matters to you).
Always love your reviews. If the HDMI/i2s pin out of the Jay's is not compatible with the Project DAC, does that mean the Project Transport will not be compatible with Denafrips DACs and other DACs with the same pin out as the Jay's? Seems like a negative for the Project transport if this is so. I also don't see the comparison as apples to apples, i2s most of the time has a clear advantage, so is the Project better than the Jay's, seems that question has not been answered.
Right with ya on the CD format or more accurately, the "physical format". I don't rip or listen to streams, downloads and such. I'm vinyl and CD all the way. My CD library is about 900 currently. Small compared to yours, but respectable. (Record library sits around 650) and never the two to meet unless I make a CD copy of a vinyl LP. I like Project and love Heinz and his wife because they think of everybody and are very passionate about audio. That said I am not that impressed by these two offerings, but mostly based on personal tastes. I'm old school and traditional, so I am not a fan of small boxes outside of necessity. I'm also not a fan of top-loading CD transports. One needs table top space instead of a shelf unit and I have had top-loaders before and find them a bit wonky. That one in particular is way over-priced in my opinion (which is unusual for Project). As for DACS or that particular one. I do really like the switch of solid state and tube. I can imagine that CDs sound different using tubes. Likely a nice subtle taming to the square waves of the 1's and 0's. That said, I also believe a DAC should be a DAC and should not cost over $800 to $1000. I feel beyond that price, we get into heavy diminishing returns and not and no detectable improvements. However, I understand that this is a preamp and a dac, so if I had zero space, needing a tiny system and was all digital needing a preamp and dac, this one would be on my short list. I would like to try a separate transport and dac someday though. I currently use a Marantz CD 5004 for my second system. A solid CD player, make no mistake, but it is a CD player. I also run a Marantz ND8006, which does everything but the dishes and while it is far costlier than the CD5004 and an equally solid player, which can also be used as a stand alone dac, the dac in it is not that impressive. Seems like there is room for improvement, which to me is rather disappointing. Unfortunately, heavy budget constraints don't allow for an outboard dac these days. I'd love a try of the Danafrips Ares someday, but you can't even find them on the used market. They have the Ares 2 now, which is far more expensive.
Steve, It seems counter-intuitive to me when you say you will never burn your cd collection because of the tactile pleasure they give you when handling them. If a CD is converted and played as a file rather than a disc, the SQ is improved, correct? Herein lies the conundrum- As an audiophile, you are tweaking away all your life but won't give up the tactile pleasure? Or do you not find a listening difference between a CD and a file??
How can the CD material SQ improve via HDD storage, subsequent playback of the file, when compared to CD playback? Serious question, I don't know, and I don't know how it could be possible over quality CD playback. I guess I'm a tactile format enthusiast as well, I don't rip/store anything.
Then in between, Denafrips Avatar also has been reviewed as less bloomy and more incisive transients than the Jay's at less money. HOWEVER, notice that the Pro-Ject uses a European? power connection, not U.S. IEC. Will I have to have custom made power cords for this unit to a linear power supply? Maybe this isn't the best unit when using high end cabling for the Jay's or Avatar units. Price is sufficiently close. 3/25/20 Review no longer available. Avatar no loner available.
I still use my Linn Akurate ds1..blows the socks off all the pro-ject dac/streamers. You can now buy Linn for £2000 used. Cool product but imo still not worth it.
Hi Steve, I'm a big fan of your channel & love your reviews & general enthusiasm for all things audio. Having said that, the CD transport is a total waste of money & I can't imagine a worse way for one to inject $3K into their audio system. If you're a big fan of minimal gains for tons of cash then this CD transport is right up your alley.
@@moto-rambler After using an EAR Acute for 15 years, I purchased a COS Engineering D2v DAC. It made a substantial difference in all sound dimensions. The Acute is lush, warm, forward and inviting but the DAC is like going from a mid-priced Grado cartridge to a Benz LP cartridge. Now I am looking to upgrade my transport from the EAR to either a Pro-Ject, Jay's Audio or Denafrips Avatar. I suspect that the DAC made a bigger difference than a new transport will make. What does Steve think?
I see it as a steal a bargain like the bird cheap. Even with a Linear Power Supply. I bought one and plan to buy another as a backup. I was leaning towards Audio Note until a local dealer let me know he was able to secure a few units. They have been impossible to get them in Canada. Take a look at Audio Note transports. The level 5 and 6 pricing. It will put things in perspective.
4:07 This is a horid circuit design! Capacitors meltdown guaranteed within a few years of intensive use. Bad product as pretty much everything that comes out from a Pro-Ject shop.
That's not necessarily true for all Pro-ject products. Now, in this case I can agree with you though. Top loaders by design from anyone are known to be problematic after a time. I have found that if you stick with their analog products, including the phono preamps, you can't really go wrong. You do know that EAT is the higher-end of Pro-ject run by Heinz's wife. Both people are wonderful by the way.
@@ericelliott227 I still bring out my top-loading Sony portable from 1985 on occasion. (I used to use it daily for about 5 years.) It still plays fine.
There is a reason they don't sell cds in stores anymore. Nobody wants them. Most are going out of print. Streaming is only legal way to access. I have 4000 cds. But worry that I got stuck. Little to no resale value. We shall see. But I enjoy them as my preferred medium. I have also heard that if the music company can't sell 10000, they don't re-release oop music.
They still sell tens of millions of CDs every year, but in your delusional little world that means "nobody wants them." M'kay. Enjoy your rented music "collection" which could disappear at any moment.
@@mikrophonie5633 You are correct. But the cd collapse since 1999 is 100's of millions. Delusional? Costco stopped selling them, Borders went under, Barnes and Noble is a shell, Best Buy is out of them, and mom and pop cd /record stores are hanging on by a thread. And on Amazon and ebay many cds are used only b/c they are not making new ones. And many excellent cds are oop. Can only find used. I have 3500 cd library. No streaming for me.
@@mondoenterprises6710 There are plenty of record stores in L.A. that still sell them, and people can get them cheaper new on Amazon than at Borders, B&N, Best Buy, etc. so no surprise they've stopped selling them. Their selections were never that great anyway and they never focused on CD, more books and electronics. Yes CD sales have declined since 2000 but like I said tens of millions are still sold each year. Mid-year 2019 sales report shows 18.6 million CD units sold, so for the year it's probably around 36 million or so. www.riaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Mid-Year-2019-RIAA-Music-Revenues-Report.pdf
I have over 1000 and still buying. I don't think I will ever feel the need to stream. Plus, if you really love the artist, they get a better royalty when you buy CDs. Or vinyl. I just purchased the new James Taylor CD from Target. Great stuff.
Not in the market for a transport but you're a compelling reviewer so I watched.
Thanks, that means a lot to me.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac small buttons are annoying. too many buttons are annoying. my br2 remote is maybe a bigger version of their aluminum one bryston ran a truck over it to prove it would still work which while fun was annoying as well.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac did you try these out with any of your First Watt amps? I recently got a First Watt M2, and would love to know if these go well with it. Any thoughts?
Long live the CD! Some vinyl and streaming lovers wish that all CDs would disappear from the face of the earth. Too bad! They are still here and will be here for the foreseeable future, and they still sell tens of millions of them every year!
I also still love CDs. Just also bought a Pro-Ject Pre Box s2+ which I use as Dac with my Marantz CD6006. Love this tiny little box. Might be worth a review as well...
Can you expand a bit on how you feel on that unit? Do you hook it to phone or PC to stream also? Thx
A lot of us are getting used to the idea of buying external linear power supplies for various pieces of equipment. In fact, some manufacturers will tell you that the wallwarts and bricks they supply with their equipment is "adequate," BUT, they advise that you buy yourself a decent linear supply to extract all the juice from the product. Out on the fringes there are DIGIphiles who insist on external linear supplies for the computers that serve up the music. Can you hear that WHOOSHING sound? That's more of my money heading into the void. And like any other addict, I CAN'T STOP MYSELF!!! :)
Thanks Steve. Your reviews are always entertaining.
Steve, regarding power supply - they actually offer upgrade paths for those wall warts. They're sold separately but hope you can convince them to send you those too so you can evaluate if they're worth the upgrade.
I'm like you Steve when it comes to CDs/LPs/SACDs (physical formats), I don't use any streaming yet, in any way, because I love my discs and I only want to use them.
CDs are alive and well
The Pro-Ject CD Box RS2 T plays now CD Audio, CD-R, CD-RW andHybrid SACD
Hi Steve. How does the Project Two boxer over I2S compare to the Jays and the Denefrips Aries over I2S? This seems a fairer test to me. Thanks Steve. Loving your content.
Besides subjective comments like “It really sounds great”, or something to that effect, I’d like to see an audio test between a $400 CD player and a $4000 one to check if people can really tell the difference. And, more importantly, if any difference exists is it worth the price differential.
you nailed it.
Here is a system with 3 high level components (Focal Scala v2 speakers, Chord pre and Chord amp) combined with $300 spinner (bluray Panasonic player), cheap AQ speaker cables, and $0.5 RCA cables between the player and preamp and between preamp and amp, stock power cables:
ua-cam.com/video/-FrUX_VV4L8/v-deo.html
I will be adding better source, dac, cables, step by step to see improvements
Why don't you try it for yourself? Go to an audio dealer or audio show and ask for a demo and be open to hearing the difference. As to determining value for money, that's a private decision, not a mathematical truth, in the same way a $5000 whisky or $multi-million private jet depends on personal mores/valuations
i have the jay cdt2 in for testing and i did a blind a/b test with my cheap dvd player, mitchell and johnson budget cd player and NadM50 cd transport and i could hear the differences every single time with the same dac through my ATC speakers and so can everybody else, you don't need golden ears for that, the M50 and Jay's were pretty close but you could still hear lot's of little differences, that doesn't mean the Jay's is ten times better than for example the mitchell and johnson but it is a lot better and sounds amazing, the mitchell sounds good, the M50 great, the dvd sounds like crap, the system i tested this is about 12000 dollars so you do need a good enough system to be able to hear the differences
@@geoffreyvanhouwaert8677 for how much did you buy cdt2? Did you buy directly from China?
I've heard there are reliability issues with Jay
@@moonlight-kh6uz hi,
They come from Boelsz Audio in the Netherlands.
Steve , I think sound difference can be due to I2S and separated data and clock signals along with sync of clock on transport and DAC than sound of other transport.
How did Project sound thru coax or AES into Project Dac vs both thru I2S ..... it is a really interesting question?
Whats better the Pro ject transport or the Jays audio transport?.
Thanks for the great review, Steve! Until I have saved enough shekels, I’ll continue to enjoy my treasured CD collection played through a Cambridge CXC CD transport and Project Pre Box S2 DAC at about 1/4 the cost. Long live the CD format!
Have the the little pre box s2+.... Great!
Hi Steve, I wish you would of used AES output on BOTH the Jay’s and Pro-Ject. That would of really helped the comparison, especially since you said how much better the I2S was on the PJ.
damn,, that was a very sneaky sales pitch..... not justified..
@@auggysimcity nothing sly here.. That was a genuine suggestion.
@@mkwilson38 A fair comparison is aes to aes. I2s is superior to aes… thus the project transport would have better SQ. Definitely not a fair comparison…. One had to read between the lines with reviews. They can be very deceiving.
@@auggysimcity ah, I see your angle….and I agree!
Correct, I love Steve, but this was not an apples to apples comparison.
I like Elvis Costello.
Nice review of the hardware!
I was able to get hold of a used CD box. After switching from PC audio back to CD, I had a significant improvement in sound with the Audiolab 6000 CDT. It was actually just a test with the 6000 CDT. The Pro-Ject drive runs in a very high-quality environment (see my homepage) and it's just amazing what sound it gets out of profane CDs. It is operated on a special isolating transformer, but a high-quality power supply will further increase the sound, we'll save. Thank you Steve, your video made a significant contribution to the decision, along with some test reports.
Wish you would cover the lower priced Project, the Nuprime, the Cambridge, and the Audiolab which are under $1000. What's great about the
new transports is they can play CD-R discs. Not clear whether they load a buffer and then do error correction like my NuForce CD player.
My 30 year old cd player plays cdr/rw just fine
@@mauanderuk All 40+ CD players from the 80s and 90s that I tried played CDrs. Best-Kyocera 1984 310 and 410 players (light in the bass and not detailed but lovely). EAR Acute in 2005 killed all those players.
steve you hit on something here you said, you said a cd was well recorded one of the best recorded. can you do a segment on your best recorded cd's or sacd's.on best sound alone not musical content
Search for albums that has used "mastering"
I’m right there with ya Steve on theCD format. I’ve been looking at picking up a new transport
how does it compare to the audiolab 6000cdt ?
Had the transport on trial at home for a week now, and Sound quality is 10/10 (for the price and my system).
(Previously owned, Micromega T-Drive, Naim CD5X and CDS3).
Built quality is so and so : 5/10.
Shape and form nice and minimal, so what can go wrong with a transport?
Well for starters, you do need to be careful dropping the lid. It doesn't ease out as it drops and the sharp edges could hurt your fingers. Remote Control edges too.
Reading CD contents is worryingly loud, and the UI on the display is terrible. (I mean that missing disc icon, is out of 80s Word clip art for God sake), plus I managed to crash (!?) the OS twice trying to inverse the display color. How do you do that anyway???? Steve?
the shill was there all along... we just didnt realize it.
Redbook fun with a dual box solution. Have to read up on the "I squared" interface. Always something new to learn.
I’m glad I never threw out my CD collection, most of which dates from the 80s and 90s and before the loudness wars began. Used CDs are in a sweet spot right now, it will be interesting to see whether they will experience a price resurgence like vinyl has. I was amongst the earliest owners of the original Sony CDP-101 and it’s amazing to see how far we’ve come in terms of Redbook playback since then with outboard DACs and CD transports.
Wow! The ol' first gen Sony!
Perfect Sound Forever, right?
How far we've come indeed.
I didn't jump into CD playback until '86 or so. I believe I bought a Kyocera player as my first. Not sure but I believe it was pre-owned but new.
@FOH3663 Ha, yeah that was the slogan wasn’t it. I had just graduated and started my first job and it was my first major “audiophile” purchase. My credit card didn’t even have a high enough credit limit to buy it, had to get a relative to buy it for me.
Have we?
My DAC is a modern implementation of those same TDA1540D chips in the 101and it sounds fantastic, and I would not trade it for a DAC using a modern DAC chip. The TDA1540D was a 14 bit chip, the first Sony chip was a 16bit chip, yet the players with the Philips chips back then sounded way better than players with Sony's first chip.
Steve how does the pre-amp portion sound?
Hi Steve, here’s a record you should be using as reference, if you aren’t already. Frank Zappa and the Mothers “One Size Fits All”. It ticks all the boxes when it comes to dynamics, transparency, and all around fun!
And Studio Tan....an amazing and detailed recording.
According to the Pro-Ject website link above it DOES play SACD
Yes, but it specifies "hybrid-SACDs" so likely it only reads the CD layer.
They reminds me a wonderful minicomputer AIWA system from the 80's , C50/P50/T50. 50w the p/channel, all discrete, tropical transformer and 12.000 mf caps.I still have it and sound amazing.
I believe Pro-ject also sells a linear power supply to go with their equipment.
This makes more sense to me at this price point.
Great review of a product I would never consider purchasing. The lack of SACD capability is unforgivable in my book. But I still watched the review! It was interesting enough to listen for 15 minutes.
Brian Moore Thanks so much! But I also read reviews of stuff I can’t afford like Ferraris for example, it’s fun.
❤😂😂 7:12 😂😂❤
So not all I2S interfaces are compatable? Obviously your Jay's transport and Denafrips DAC play nice together, but how about with kit from elsewhere other than China LLC?
Ok Steve, you did not mention how the Project DAC compares with your terminator ? Any insights you can give would be helpful. I have a friend that bought the transport based on your review and said it is the best he ever had in his system. Thanks.
How does the Audiolab 6000 CDT stack up at 1/3 the price?
@dave z Have yet to take mine out of the box!
I had the 6000cdt go head to head with the cxc and in the end I much prefer the cxc. The cxc extracts a bit more detail in the music.
@@victorian9221 about 10 percent more detail.
Steve again with a review that has absolutely no actual footage of the product you are reviewing. Amazing!
What happened? I passed out when I heard the prices. I know mid-fi hi-fi. Actually, I was thinking if I bought the Griffin for 28k I could keep it in my garage where the car should be.
Hey Steve, don't they have the Linear Power Supply for the RS Line components....
It’s wonderful but - How do you change the display to black?????OK apologies it’s easy press Mode whilst CD in stop. Press STOP to change to black
I would like to know what Steve thinks about the Project CD transport versus the newer PS Audio Perfect Wave transport which is when at $3999, similar in price. Does the Project require an upgraded power supply than the walwart to obtain better sound?
When the DVD standard was originally developed it had the option of taking over from CD’s 16-bit 44,100 sample-rate (1.4 megabits/sec) with its 24-bit 96,000 sample-rate (4.6 megabits/sec) the HD media issue would have been resolved forever (IMHO 192k is a complete waste of time WHEN using a DAC designed for 96k - not 192k... the latter’s output filters are set an ‘ultrasonic noise’ octave too high to properly deal with 96k). Unfortunately, like the CD, it had no way to protect the data from copying - so it was killed off by the record companies who refused to use it ... very sad!
Did you try these out with any of your First Watt amps? I recently got a First Watt M2, and would love to know if these go well with it. Any thoughts?
I won’t let CD go
Steve, I 2nd Gene's request for a segment on your best recorded CDs based on sound quality - not necessarily the music itself.
would you please comment between the Pro ject Transport & DAC combo to the Luxman D10x single box player? I know the Luxman D10x is much more money.
Which Dac, the Project, or the Terminator in your opinion would work better with the Project cd transport?
What’s the odds on you getting the DAC BOX RS2??
damn this was a missed opportunity. I am looking for a DAC, that is not made in China thank you very much, and I am keep searching about information about ProJect Pre Box RS2 Digital, and there is none. The best you get is a spec sheet, but how does it compare to the stuff around it, details, sound stage, is it more wide 2d or more in depth, does the DAC sound better then let's say Qutest (just because that is pure DAC). You got options. We got options for half of the price with ADI-2, that is nothing new, but how it performs in relations with things around it? A missed opportunity indeed.
I need to add a CD player to my system and wanted to keep it at around $500. What do you think about possibly a used Pioneer Elite? If so any recommend models? How about a Denon? Any previous owners out there to weigh in?
Toshiba SD 9200. I solved the vibration glitch. Smoking CD sound. Cheap on ebay. I can explain fix if you get one.
The DAC looked like a hybrid system of tube and solid state. May consider just to buy the DAC without CD transport
I’ve owned a bunch of CD players/transports over the years and they all crap out after 7 years or so. It’s been described to me as “laser fade”. I wonder if this transport will last longer. I’m still buying CDs. Some good bargains out there.
I haven't heard that term, also I have players that are still going strong after 17 years of contstant use! I even own a Magnavox CD player made in 1989 that plays and sounds fantastic!
I wish I had that luck! I had a Magnavox in the 80’s too. That actually lasted about 10 years, then a Marantz 5 disc, then a Sony 5 disc. I’m currently using a Sony Blu-Ray as a transport. The Marantz and Sony would stop playing certain CDs, and they’d skip, even after cleaning the lense.
Still using the Marantz CD-56 I bought new in 1985. It's never needed a service, just keeps on trucking. I also have an old Panasonic SL-PJ325A with the same mechanism. Those vintage Philips CDM4/19 mechanisms may well survive the eventual heat death of the universe.
I have been using a cheap Sony transport in an EAR Acute CDP for 15 years with at least 5000+ hours on it and it tracks just fine. Do you ever clean your laser lens? I do every 3 to 6 months.
I have some Marantz players using the CDM4/19 and they are still reading great, in fact I have not heard of a laser failing with this mechanism apart from user error like in turning up the laser power and burning them out. It's usually other issues and not the actually mech or laser. Then there are players with the CDM1 Mkll and they are all still going strong also. The Jay's CDT2 uses new old stock CDM4/19.
Yes. Ok. But at 2400 bucks is it the best tubed DAC we can possibly get ?
The answer is a big YES
Ripping CD's is a tough task lol. I switched to digital because CD's and vinyl just takes up too much space.
Appreciate the reviews, as always. No way in hell I’m buying a three thousand dollar transport with a laptop-like power supply (though you just know Pro-ject will soon offer a $1500 or so separate power supply) with cheesy remote and controls, and won’t necessarily play well with other I2S- capable units. And if anyone missed it, 1.) the number of CD’s you own shouldn’t figure into the amount of money you spend for a transport, and 2.) the fact that another unit with the same transport unit costs $28k doesn’t make THIS one a good deal.
Is it true that it has a cheap power supply? The Jay's Audio and Denafrips Avatar have beefy twin toroidal power supplies.
@@stephenfleschler9682 Steve seem to have liked this one better than the Jay's, but I'm also not a fan of wall-warty ps's (especially at $3000), and you'd better make sure you can return this and get all of your money back if this doesn't work in your system. Vinshine/Denafrips will only take returns if your unit is defective, and do not offer refunds of any kind - don't know about the Jay's distributers. And of course, your system needs to be of a high enough quality that you could tell the difference between the three, whatever difference there may be.
@@homerjones3291 I have 7,000 CDs. I have a high end system (not SOTA $70K) in a custom SOTA listening room ($160K). I will hear the slightest differences. My DAC is the DV2v COS Engineering, not at the level of my analog front end but very good. It just seems like the Avatar and the Jay's Audio are nearly identical units built or designed by the same factory, the Avatar 3 kg lighter but with 2 year newer technology. I saw a review that stated that the Avatar absolutely needs 200 hours to break in while users of the Jay's Audio are very happy listening to it brand new while it breaks in. I do not want to spend another $2K on a linear power supply for a $3K transport with non-IEC connections. The Pro-ject is out (also, it maybe less reliable based on its build).
Uses a CD/DVD drive you can buy in Australia for $30 dollars HD 850
It doesn't do sacd. The new(er) Atlas VRDS like in say an Esoteric player is , just, how do I describe the sound, it took my breadth away. Yeah I know their is a price difference but the sound and the over the top build quality is in another world. And it made me reconsider what is value in a product. But I'll get to be able to compare them soon as a local dealer carries both. I can go on about some comparisons (observations) but the Project stuff for me, any of it fails that wow factor, that thing that makes you go yeah, that's nice.
Moving up to the Bryston BDA-1 for 550 bucks to my door. Will use the Rega Planet 2000 as a transport. Top loading with the star trek lid.
I am not sure where you buy these in the US?
Usually you get a good review, from steve but this is so lacking in info that is not even funny. the worst part is you can't find any other review in English for ProJect Pre Box RS2 Digital. So can it outperform a 700Euro cheaper Qutest? sound stage, bass impact, sound separation... what do I get for 2000 Euro? just a box and components and some buttons to push? You can get that for $5.
Man am I looking forward to the Schiit CD Transport, here's hoping it hangs with the big boys for less.
If the transport is truly a slave to the preamp DAC, how on earth can any transport impart any difference to the signal path? Its all ones and zeros, either you account for them all or you don't.
It is only 1's and 0's in pure mathematics. A transport is an electromechanical device & it can have errors, which are corrected by interpolation (i.e. an educated guess). The system does the best it can but is not perfect.
It's not as simple as just 1 & 0's, although a lot of folk think it is as simple as that.
If you can afford these units, you can afford a linear power supply. But in testing, there was no improvement with a linear but there was an improvement with an ifi wall wort.
I have the transport and purchased a LTA Linear Power Supply specifically made for the RS2-T. The sound improvement is significant compared to the switching supply that came with the transport. I also added Fern & Roby isolation feet, Transparent Premium Power cable and reference interconnect. Couldn’t be more pleased with the upgraded setup.
@6:24
"It has over-sampling. It has up-sampling"
Those two are the same thing? What am I missing?
No they are not the same thing, but it’s hard for me to put into words what the differences. Google it!
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I based my comment on watching this video:
ua-cam.com/video/X65ijUhqYxo/v-deo.html
The entire video is informative. But at the 5 minute mark, Hans sums it up.
It is my understanding that it boils down to, for example, already having your 44.1 kHz file converted to (perhaps) 88.2 kHz vs. having your gear convert it to 88.2 kHz on-the-fly. Either way, your DAC chip sees an 88.2 kHz data stream.
Is my understanding correct or oversimplified?
By the way, I recommend folks never use google services if possible (of course, youtube is a google service). But use duckduckgo.com instead of google.com (if your privacy matters to you).
oversampling and upsampling are not the same thing.
Always love your reviews.
If the HDMI/i2s pin out of the Jay's is not compatible with the Project DAC, does that mean the Project Transport will not be compatible with Denafrips DACs and other DACs with the same pin out as the Jay's?
Seems like a negative for the Project transport if this is so.
I also don't see the comparison as apples to apples, i2s most of the time has a clear advantage, so is the Project better than the Jay's, seems that question has not been answered.
Hey Steve first time coming across this video. You said, “for you vinyl people. You’re not vinyl people? Hmm …
Preamp? I already have preamp, so one customer less.
Right with ya on the CD format or more accurately, the "physical format". I don't rip or listen to streams, downloads and such. I'm vinyl and CD all the way. My CD library is about 900 currently. Small compared to yours, but respectable. (Record library sits around 650) and never the two to meet unless I make a CD copy of a vinyl LP.
I like Project and love Heinz and his wife because they think of everybody and are very passionate about audio. That said I am not that impressed by these two offerings, but mostly based on personal tastes. I'm old school and traditional, so I am not a fan of small boxes outside of necessity. I'm also not a fan of top-loading CD transports. One needs table top space instead of a shelf unit and I have had top-loaders before and find them a bit wonky. That one in particular is way over-priced in my opinion (which is unusual for Project). As for DACS or that particular one. I do really like the switch of solid state and tube. I can imagine that CDs sound different using tubes. Likely a nice subtle taming to the square waves of the 1's and 0's. That said, I also believe a DAC should be a DAC and should not cost over $800 to $1000. I feel beyond that price, we get into heavy diminishing returns and not and no detectable improvements. However, I understand that this is a preamp and a dac, so if I had zero space, needing a tiny system and was all digital needing a preamp and dac, this one would be on my short list.
I would like to try a separate transport and dac someday though. I currently use a Marantz CD 5004 for my second system. A solid CD player, make no mistake, but it is a CD player. I also run a Marantz ND8006, which does everything but the dishes and while it is far costlier than the CD5004 and an equally solid player, which can also be used as a stand alone dac, the dac in it is not that impressive. Seems like there is room for improvement, which to me is rather disappointing. Unfortunately, heavy budget constraints don't allow for an outboard dac these days. I'd love a try of the Danafrips Ares someday, but you can't even find them on the used market. They have the Ares 2 now, which is far more expensive.
Steve,
It seems counter-intuitive to me when you say you will never burn your cd collection because of the tactile pleasure
they give you when handling them. If a CD is converted and played as a file rather than a disc, the SQ is improved, correct?
Herein lies the conundrum- As an audiophile, you are tweaking away all your life but won't give up the tactile pleasure? Or do you not find a listening difference between a CD and a file??
How can the CD material SQ improve via HDD storage, subsequent playback of the file, when compared to CD playback?
Serious question, I don't know, and I don't know how it could be possible over quality CD playback.
I guess I'm a tactile format enthusiast as well, I don't rip/store anything.
@@FOH3663 Perhaps Mr. G would address your question in a future video?
Then in between, Denafrips Avatar also has been reviewed as less bloomy and more incisive transients than the Jay's at less money. HOWEVER, notice that the Pro-Ject uses a European? power connection, not U.S. IEC. Will I have to have custom made power cords for this unit to a linear power supply? Maybe this isn't the best unit when using high end cabling for the Jay's or Avatar units. Price is sufficiently close. 3/25/20 Review no longer available. Avatar no loner available.
My experience with Pro-Ject products is bad quality control.
I still use my Linn Akurate ds1..blows the socks off all the pro-ject dac/streamers.
You can now buy Linn for £2000 used.
Cool product but imo still not worth it.
Heard the price, goodbye!
Please , let's see something the average person can afford !
lots of vintage bargains out there, new is not always better.
Hi Steve, I'm a big fan of your channel & love your reviews & general enthusiasm for all things audio. Having said that, the CD transport is a total waste of money & I can't imagine a worse way for one to inject $3K into their audio system. If you're a big fan of minimal gains for tons of cash then this CD transport is right up your alley.
Just say you're into streaming or vinyl.
@@stephenlasko9217 i have plenty of cd's. My comment was specifically to the snake oil that is the cd dac & cd transport "separates".
@@moto-rambler After using an EAR Acute for 15 years, I purchased a COS Engineering D2v DAC. It made a substantial difference in all sound dimensions. The Acute is lush, warm, forward and inviting but the DAC is like going from a mid-priced Grado cartridge to a Benz LP cartridge. Now I am looking to upgrade my transport from the EAR to either a Pro-Ject, Jay's Audio or Denafrips Avatar. I suspect that the DAC made a bigger difference than a new transport will make. What does Steve think?
@@moto-rambler A good transport can bring a lot to the table, It's not snake oil when it sounds better.
my free estimate is it is overpriced from $1000 to $1500 at minimum
I see it as a steal a bargain like the bird cheap. Even with a Linear Power Supply. I bought one and plan to buy another as a backup. I was leaning towards Audio Note until a local dealer let me know he was able to secure a few units. They have been impossible to get them in Canada. Take a look at Audio Note transports. The level 5 and 6 pricing. It will put things in perspective.
I would let CD go
You only.have one cd ?
I don't like the LCD screen, too big and dump, lazy design
4:07 This is a horid circuit design! Capacitors meltdown guaranteed within a few years of intensive use. Bad product as pretty much everything that comes out from a Pro-Ject shop.
That's not necessarily true for all Pro-ject products. Now, in this case I can agree with you though. Top loaders by design from anyone are known to be problematic after a time. I have found that if you stick with their analog products, including the phono preamps, you can't really go wrong. You do know that EAT is the higher-end of Pro-ject run by Heinz's wife. Both people are wonderful by the way.
@@ericelliott227 I still bring out my top-loading Sony portable from 1985 on occasion. (I used to use it daily for about 5 years.) It still plays fine.
Overpriced crap.
why you think so? have you even tried it?
Yep as usual, another overpriced box that sounds no better than a Shitt! And people wonder what happen to the old Audio stores.
Schiit's affordable products are distorted compressed "house sound" garbage. Not everyone's into that.
There is a reason they don't sell cds in stores anymore. Nobody wants them. Most are going out of print. Streaming is only legal way to access. I have 4000 cds. But worry that I got stuck. Little to no resale value. We shall see. But I enjoy them as my preferred medium. I have also heard that if the music company can't sell 10000, they don't re-release oop music.
They still sell tens of millions of CDs every year, but in your delusional little world that means "nobody wants them." M'kay. Enjoy your rented music "collection" which could disappear at any moment.
My target still sells them.
@@mikrophonie5633 You are correct. But the cd collapse since 1999 is 100's of millions. Delusional? Costco stopped selling them, Borders went under, Barnes and Noble is a shell, Best Buy is out of them, and mom and pop cd /record stores are hanging on by a thread. And on Amazon and ebay many cds are used only b/c they are not making new ones. And many excellent cds are oop. Can only find used. I have 3500 cd library. No streaming for me.
@@mondoenterprises6710 There are plenty of record stores in L.A. that still sell them, and people can get them cheaper new on Amazon than at Borders, B&N, Best Buy, etc. so no surprise they've stopped selling them. Their selections were never that great anyway and they never focused on CD, more books and electronics. Yes CD sales have declined since 2000 but like I said tens of millions are still sold each year. Mid-year 2019 sales report shows 18.6 million CD units sold, so for the year it's probably around 36 million or so. www.riaa.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/Mid-Year-2019-RIAA-Music-Revenues-Report.pdf
I have over 1000 and still buying. I don't think I will ever feel the need to stream. Plus, if you really love the artist, they get a better royalty when you buy CDs. Or vinyl. I just purchased the new James Taylor CD from Target. Great stuff.