Understanding Scapegoat Abuse and Structural Dissociation
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- Опубліковано 17 лис 2024
- Did you know that family scapegoating abuse (FSA) can lead to C-PTSD and Structural Dissociation? In Episode Two of this new series for FSA Adult Survivors, Therapists, and Clinicians, Rebecca C. Mandeville (author of the best-selling book on family scapegoating, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed') discusses signs and symptoms of Structural Dissociation that results from Family Scapegoating Abuse (FSA) and Complex Trauma. I'll be discussing how 'RIGHTEOUS RAGE' experienced in early childhood can turn into TOXIC SHAME, as well as how Structural Dissociation can be treated, next week. IMPORTANT: This video addresses PRIMARY and SECONDARY Structural Dissociation, not TERTIARY (Dissociative Identity Disorder). Read my article on Structural Dissociation to learn more: familyscapegoa...
Join my online educational and peer-support community for FSA adult survivors on Substack. Learn more by visiting familyscapegoa...
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Rebecca C. Mandeville is a thought leader and recognized expert in abusive family systems. She is also the author of 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed: Help and Hope for Adults in the Family Scapegoat Role' and a Clinical Expert in UA-cam's Health Partner Program. Learn more by visiting www.apha.org/n...)
*🔥Trigger Warning: If you feel activated watching this video, turn it off and perhaps return to it at another time or consult a licensed Mental Health professional.
Viewer comments contain descriptions of child abuse and neglect and can also be activating. Relate to this video? I'd love to hear from you in the comments.*
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💡DISCLAIMER ONE: This channel's focus is on understanding and recovering from what I named 'family scapegoating abuse' (FSA). It is NOT a substitute for clinical assessment or treatment. It is suitable for both Adult Survivors and Clinicians. I am unable to advise you on your specific family situation. READ FULL DISCLAIMER: www.scapegoatr...
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#dissociation #clinicalpsychology #scapegoat #cptsd #traumainformed #scapegoating #toxicfamily #narcissisticfamily #dysfunctionalfamily #narcissisticabusesurvivor
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Much thanks for the positive validation ❤️ theres no where else to go but forward now 🙈🙉🙊
Mine started in-utero. My sister, youngest of three older sisters 8,11, and 12 years older, hated me while I was still in the womb. 87 years later when my mother passed, all 3 sisters attacked mercilessly. I suddenly realized my mother was the only one keeping all 3 sisters at bay. Dad was always a yeller, but the three sisters, now in their 60's have far more aggression and far less empathy than Dad. I don't blame Dad 1 because he now dead and 2 because my sisters were and still are far worse. I was successful
Over sharing is a big issue for scapegoats. They had to give explanations about everything in their childhood and unsuccessfully tried to defend themselves of siblings' false accusations. To name a few. There's also a wrong belief about people won't hurt you if you are nice enough, and to these people it can't never be good enough.
Bingo. Video to come...
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse
Cool! Thank you 😊
Yes… this is so true to my situation as well.
Oh, yes
So true Cristina. I had to explain every little thing to my father. All of my explanations didn’t help matters anyway. To this day I think everything I do is wrong as it always was in his eyes. Being constantly bullied by everyone I took on the notion that if I am just sweet enough I could get people to stop bullying me. Little did I know that approach made matters worse and I attracted more bullies throughout my life. I had no boundaries. The first thing I learned in my recovery was that boundaries are essential. I’m getting better at that. No need to defend ourselves (that way) all the time to people when it’s not necessary. They often appreciate you more when you show them you can’t be ‘walked on’.
Well im in my 50s and they did a great job destroying my self esteem my career my reputation .. I have all those symptoms ... my abusers are all blessed with home , marrige , money ,. Where as Im still healing and still swimming in deep water .. I have not made any friends nor go out dont even talk hardly anymore , I feel like I am in a void , being alone is safe but its lonely .
Same boat here & also age 50. Read up on how to do proper EMDR it is a miracle. Healing can happen. ❤
I empathise.. they all have money. Since I was a child I was constantly told ‘don’t think about money’ ‘money doesn’t matter’ I now know I was just being dismissed, like I was about all my basic needs..’ so sorry you are in this situation. I hope you can improve your finances in a safe way.
Im in that position as well , i got to 55 and just snapped , i think it was something to do with the lockdown...i almost got to the point of not triggering family then suddenly i was wrong again because i didnt want a jab...they wanted me to sit in the feking garden in october so i didnt bring germs in the house, then i got cancer and their response was unbelievable, so bad that i decided as soon as i was able we were going no contact.
i was just thinking yesterday my life is great at the moment (mum died last year, 4 weeks after her jab) but i am somewhat isolated
@@NOT_SURE..i didnt get the jab either and cop judgement good on you for not caving into the pressure and fear
I relate to this so deeply. My mother is a covert narcissist. Im oldest of 5. My mother got pregnant with me at 16. Ive always been her source of humiliation. She will never admit this and invalidated my feelings and would do sneaking underhanded things to me all my life. Even though mu siblings have seen a lot of this they all 4 deny any of it. the denial and invalidation and gaslighting from my entire family has been the worst part of it all. I could take the beatings, shame and all of it easier than the invalidation. Its such a crippling hurt to know your entire family hates you while you love them so much.
Yes, it is a pain (often unrecognized by anyone) that is like no other. I have a video on traumatic invalidation and there is an article my colleague Dr Watson wrote on the same topic; please watch / read if you haven't yet, you will see why when you do. ua-cam.com/video/8BQ5Vrarp1g/v-deo.html
This is my story as well ❤️🩹 And, they all baby and adore my abusive Mother - she rarely, if ever shows her abusive/neglectful side in public. It's all Doris Day outwardly, but SO fake it's hard to understand how everyone pretends not to see who she is underneath. Despicable 😢
@@kimberlymccracken747 YESSSSS!! Its just comforting to know there are other people who understand after all these years
Remember that this is a methodical and pre-planned attack on your character so the lies have been in existence long before you ever realized what was going on.
Omg.. it was so bad for me as a child up until this day. Everybody’s a narc, x boyfriend, sisters, brothers, co workers, boss everybody!! I’ve been a target all my life. I spend my time alone.. it’s safe.😢
'Safe', as in the nervous system has a chance to settle down and not be constantly activated (?) Hopefully you have looked into the possibility of complex trauma. Linking you to a list of resources I put together for FSA adult survivors in case something catches your eye: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/updated-fsa-recovery-resources-2023/
You need to find safe people…can be difficult if you’re not aware of who you are attracting. FSA survivors (I’m one too) tend to attract abusers, narcissists, etc. until we wake up and become fully aware of our surroundings and only choose safety. It’s now an easy journey.
Oops…NOT an easy journey!!
Since reading your book and feeling like finally I am being authenticated I am releasing significant pain and anger I have experienced terrible rejection from my sisters and from my Mother in the past who is now deceased. I have been overwhelmed by memories, sorrow and rage. No-one in my family acknowledges the cruelty. I am overwhelmed so I am going to rest for a few days. They say "the truth will set you free".....that is my hope.
It is a process, indeed, Gloria. I'm glad you are feeling validated by my work on FSA. I'm also glad you are taking breaks as needed - Trust your body's innate wisdom (and the wisdom of your nervous system!)
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thank you for the response to trust my bodies innate wisdom. I am paying attention to "my parts". I am listening to myself and being pleased at my bodies wisdom. Wow! She is so intelligent and they told me " I was dummer than a box of rocks!" They missed who I was.
Yep - missed it by a mile (or more!)
All the symptoms you describe on your videos I hve experienced, not just now and then. It made me into a completely dysfunctional human being on every level in my life. Being a mother, my jobs, my relationships and my whole life. I was told it was bipolar disorder and suffered with drug addiction for over ten years. I never realized just how f***ked up my life was. I’m 58 yrs old and just learning what happened to me. What makes me sad is how could not one doctor or therapist not know the symptoms of childhood emotional abuse. Until this gets out onto mainstream TV, people will continue to fall through the cracks.
The knowledge is slowly getting out there. Half of my Continuing Ed Unit flyers seem to be about Complex Trauma - and also Narcissistic Abuse. I can only hope that my work on what I named 'Family Scapegoating Abuse' / FSA (which can happen in ANY dysfunctional system, not just a narcissistic one) has wider reach over time - I do have therapists, clinicians, psychiatrists who have read my book and follow my channel here and they are working with their clients differently now as a result and are better able to identify complex trauma and FSA symptoms.
Thank you for your story. I'd like to say it was the exact same thing with me, from my mother repeatedly putting me in the juvenile detention home (for truancy, not any actual crimes) once I got into the system and had a Probation Officer she would call every time I stayed over at my boyfriend's and the police would come and RAID the place, haul me off in handcuffs to the DH for missing school, abusive absent (thank God) malignant NPD father... I always believed my teenage rebellion stemmed from the onset of Bipolar Type 2. The rage, the anger, the acting out. Yet I was fortunate to finally graduate high school, go to college (Here I take the opportunity to thank my younger self with the realisation that I WAS MY OWN FAIRY GODMOTHER!) dedicate tremendous energy to a career, succeed and move to Europe 20 years ago. Was always so busy with working 50-60 hours a week (like Cinderella) it wasn't until being victim of a terrorist attack here in France that EVERYTHING resurfaced and I was unable to function. Unable to work. Did I received any support from FOO? No, just more shaming and abuse. What I'm here to say is that everyone's life takes its own course and for what it's worth, be grateful for the fact that you know NOW there is nothing wrong with you. I'm 56 trying hard to stay positive and take good care of myself for the first time ever and find some hope for the future once I move past all of the PTSD and CPTSD. Good luck on your journey.
This is fascinating. I’ve never heard it described like this before. I did 18 months of internal family systems work on my own through covid. I imagined my self as a soccer coach and my parts as the players. Every morning we would gather at the bleachers next to the soccer field and we checked in. Some parts were very young, some older. Boys, girls, androgynous parts. We talked every day for 18 months. They told me what they were struggling with and I guided them, reassured them as their leader. Slowly, the group got smaller and smaller. My impression was they were integrating into my executive self. It’s been over a year since I’ve done this exercise. I feel pretty whole now. A few months ago I had a traumatic memory come up. Before then, I just had fragments. This time the entire memory came up complete with sounds, smells,what was said, what happened. It played out like a movie. I wasn’t scared. I felt very protective. It was like my adult integrated self could finally process that memory. When it was done playing, I was done with it. It was processed. I attribute my ability to recall and process that memory to the parts work I did and the resulting integration. Thank you for this. It gave me insight I didn’t have before. ❤️🙏
Such a beautiful description of both integrative work and tending to escavated survival parts. I am sure your comment will bring hope to those who are still experiencing themselves as somewhat fragmented. Integration is possible - I say this from both personal and professional experience, btw. But a healing container is needed. One will have trouble doing this kind of work if they are still being traumatized within their 'split' / fragmented family system.
I'm envious. I got a new memory a few months ago and all I did was scream for about an hour then stay in bed weeping for about a week. And now I'm more miserable than ever. I wish I had a happy story like you.
I finaly start to talk to myself when Im overwhelmed. I was in narc abusive relationship came bact to mother's house she us also abusive verbaly but Im catching time to talk nicely to myself and all that anger sadness but still don't know what to do with somatic part
“Noticing” as a practice is helpful. Gives me a place to pause and not default into action. It’s a helpful tip. Thanks.
Yes, it is a gentle, trauma-informed practice that is perfect for expanding awareness. With awareness, we eventually have more choices in regard to our we are moving through life.
"Noticing" ....through your book and through you suggesting DR JANINA FISHER WORKBOOK is a good useful tool for we FSA Survivors to have in our toolbox.
I used it this past Tuesday as I had lunch with another. I noticed when I became uncomfortable as smugness was extended to me. I thought about it when I got home. The next morning I journaled about it. In that process I became aware I HAD A CHOICE in how I would define and align the relationship. Didn't see the bud for the blossom of a friendship. Put the relationship in the Association Category. No blame, no shame. Just accepting what is. Knowing it will help guide on the amount of time I give to the relationship and what I (don't) share.
It was freeing! I like this NOTICING on the path of discovering and recovery. Thank you Rebecca.
@@janegreen5301 Beautiful example of 'just noticing', then 'hearing' yourself, and tending in a nurturing manner to your self and your relational needs. Sometimes a friend is not on one's "A-list" and that's okay!
I never thought of this as a trauma-response - when I was younger (a teen and 20-something), people would often point at me and ask, "What happened to you?" I'd look at where they were pointing and find dried blood or a wound. I had no memory of bumping into, hitting or being gashed by something, and by the time it was noticed, oftentimes the blood was already dried.
I also 'lose time' a lot. It's normally not a lot of time, 10-15 minutes sometimes, but it happens from time to time. I'll be upstairs and notice the time then walk down stairs, and something like 9 minutes has passed by. I know for a fact it does not take 9 minutes to walk down the stairs of a 1300 SF 2-story house.
Amnesia is the reason why I'm here. Repressed memories have been coming back for over a year now, and have explained me every dream, prayer, action, and existence.
I used to say I was "born with Alzheimer's" because I had such a bad memory, even as a young teen. People thought I was 'ditzy'.
I trusted everyone. Way too much. I 'went away' when boys tried to touch me, because I figured they would not want to if I showed no interest. I have guilt and remorse for night 'fighting back' enough - but it was because I was relying on an unconscious learned trauma response, rather than my own sense of what I did or did not want. I dated people as a favor to friends, who I thought were completely unattractive. I married two men my parents approved of, who treated me like garbage.
my heart goes out to you.
This, so much this- I married individuals in part as a way of trying to convince them that I was *worthy* of being treated well. I’ve given up on relationships for now, I cannot begin to imagine how I could possibly have a healthy one unless I stop caring about having one, stop having a problem with leaving at the first sign of dodgy behaviour.
I had exactly the same memory thing, the same thing with injuries and lost time.
Scapegoat in a multi generational family of malignant narcissist abuse, disorganized attachment. I have poly fragmented D.I.D due to multiple abusers in my own family. Thank you for this video. Survived infancy trauma til now. Still coming out the other side
You're very welcome. You might check out the channel from @thisbetheverse here on UA-cam - they are a featured channel at the bottom of my home page here.
I remember almost nothing of my childhood I blocked it out. I can recall a few important events but that it.
I would love to have a video of yours address fear of success and failure. I'm an artist and writer and I don't lack ideas, I just sit on all of them, afraid to dive in! I'd love to understand how being the family scapegoat plays into one not chasing after their dreams ❤❤❤
Thank you!! Still reading your book!
That's a great idea! I'll add it to the list. This has been coming up a lot lately here and elsewhere.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabusethank you for the reply!
I 100% relate.
Thank you so much Rebecca. My mother and ex completely destroyed my life and subsequently i found your book. It was a game changer for me and led me down the path of healing. I too was an unwanted pregnancy, although im the middle of 5 children. She gave me the role of Cinderella and never relinquished it. I'm 5000 miles away from them now and its been good to be free and be able to start healing. Im 58, please anyone reading this, keep going back until you find the source of your pain, be prepared to hurt and dont do it alone. Like me, most of us do not have support, but online support groups are there, youre not alone!! Thank you again!!
Thank you for this, Kim. I do also now offer an online FSA survivor community, it is 2nd from the top on my resource list here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
You are very kind. 💙Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
You are so welcome.
Dr. Daniel Amen made recently a very valuable point: we treat an organ without diagnosing properly. Like looking at a house and guessing what is going on inside. Is my brain capable to make changes or am I lacking certain minerals or other biochemical aspects? CPTSD changes the brain, so does repetitive behaviour.
52 years of tremendous trauma and only found out I've been the scapegoat my entire existence. I fled for my literal life 2 months ago and basically have had almost every symptom. Was given by my mother to a child sex ring family that controlled my entire life even after I moved out on my own, the details are just overwhelming of all that has happened. I stupidly went to the local police only to learn that they are friends with the family and I've been praying for a miracle cause my life is still in danger. So I'm doing the best I can but I do thank you for your videos because it is giving me a lot of understanding.
🙏
I love you baby girl. My heart hurts for you. If I could only find you rescue you, save you? Help.
You're not broken and ruined. You are precious and your spirit is strong! Look at you! You do believe in you because you're fighting for you!
Please don't stop until you are free. Then look in the mirror and be so proud of you!
All I can do is pray, but I'm etching you in my heart!
Never give up!
Is there anything worse that can happen someone than this, or is this as bad as it gets, this has ruined my whole life, im 55 now and just recently discovered the truth, narcicisstic abuse really sucks , on top of the fact its your own family doing it to you you just dont know , how could you, the violence , the beatings, when your a little boy you hide because you dont want anyone to see you cry, so you hold it in, your afraid to say i love you, then one day you realize your numb, instead being good to you they break you down and xestroy you mentally by the time i got to high school i felt so bad about myself i couldnt look at anyone, thats about as wrong asit gets, good luck my friends. Best wishes
In my clinical opinion, this form of abuse (what I named 'family scapegoating abuse' or FSA) is one of the most damaging forms of abuse imaginable, as you rightly note in your comment. What makes it even more tragic is the scapegoated child or adult child is typically not believed if they try to explain what is happening to them and why it is so damaging. Even a therapist might say, "You need your family, you should try to work it out," etc, pouring salt onto the gaping wound. There is also no social recognition of FSA or support for survivors, who are usually told to "just get over" their childhood. We do not tell victims of spousal abuse to "work it out" with their abuser, but this is basically what victims of FSA are told. To their detriment. Hopefully you'll get a chance to read my book on FSA (which is research-supported), 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed'. Recovery is possible - but not easy.
Thank you for all your helpful information, I just love your channel you’re helping me so much. But without going into a deep dive, can we assume that a little girl that is five years old exposing herself to classmates, is a sign of some type of abuse when she is told by the teacher that’s not appropriate, she doesn’t understand, and when the parent was notified, nothing was ever said or questioned the little girl why that was going on and trying to get to the root of the problem I know that a loaded question to ask without having any background information but in your professional opinion is that very likely that abuse was going on? And also a child being in a very strict Penecostal home the only places that she went was either church four times a week or school and may be to see her grandparents but that was it. Thank you very much for any input. I appreciate it.!
@terrimoore8962 Clinically, I would see this as a cry for help of some kind on the child’s part, and further exploration (and appropriate concern and care) would be warranted. I am not able to speak on specific situations here on UA-cam (per my disclaimer) but hopefully this helps a bit.
Rebecca this isnt my question, the person that askef it hit reply after reading one of my posts, i t went to me instead of you, i just want to make sure she got het answet you took the time to provide to her
Best wishes ❤️
Thank you, David. I'll tag the other comment.
I had many scary “ jokes” played on me with vacuum cleaner sounds and being told she wasn’t my mother until I was convinced and cried then was told she’s only kidding. It destroyed my trust and my nervous system
Understandably! Parents behaving as emotional terrorists with their young children is indeed a form of psycho-emotional abuse and can be traumatizing.
I’m going to take a break from your content, but it is such a blessing to find it. My divorce brought up so much from my childhood. The most painful part is seeing how my FOO led me to a malignant narcissist husband who continues to be emotionally destructive to me and our kids. There is nothing more heartbreaking than them each telling me how tense they feel but knowing I can’t tell them it’s the narcissist downstairs that puts us all in flight or freeze mode. Thank you for this content. I’m going to purchase the book and try not to procrastinate forever to read it.
Ahh the same thing is happening to me and it's like family of origin and narc husband are interchangeable in my mind and it's so hard for me to stay in the present and respond to what is being done to me in the moment
I cannot thank you enough...I am REALLY trying to finally work on this..
You, Dr.Jay Reid and Jerry Wise have REALLY MOVED ME FORWARD..
As painful as this is...I have to try to salvage my old age.
Thank you.
Thank you for letting me know my content is helpful - It is never too late to recover. Glad you're here.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I'm 68 and working on getting clarity. Makes me angry that I didn't do this a long time ago but I was deep in the belief that I was the problem until recently.
It's quite hard to listen to this, so I'm listening in sections! It's hard because of how strongly I can relate to what you are saying!!
I am the 8th child in a very disordered, narcissistic family. I was supposed to be adopted, but at the last hour my mother bought me home, much to my violent sociopathic father's rage. For as long as I can recall I was rejected, blamed and shamed by both my father and other 7 siblings. I had to comply and split off parts of myself in the way you are describing to survive. This pattern continued after my parents death, with my siblings throughout adulthood. I'm 60 now and have struggled with these sibling problems. I decided to break away about 5 years ago, but have had to have contact again recently because of my eldest siblings death. It never changes, and I look forward to being fully no contact again. This stuff can affect your whole life, if you let it!! It's truly a terrible experience.
Hi Amanda, obviously you 'get' the title of my book, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed'. If you haven't yet read it, you may want to. Many people find it helpful.
Thank you Rebecca, yes I've just ordered it! I'm in the UK so your videos are helping people globally xxx
@@amandajohnson-williams7718
You don't have to break the no contact.
You don't.🙏
@@nomudnolotusnodragonnogoldyes! This! ❤ This is such an important and helpful thing to know/hear
@@nomudnolotusnodragonnogold
I only broke the NC by email only, as my eldest sisters estate has been left to the 7 surviving siblings. After my experience I wasn't willing to forgo my rightful inheritance, email does seem impersonal enough. I still don't like the contact, and the sorting out of the estate seems to be taking a very good time, mainly because a narcissistic family has no desire to functional agree on anything it seems. So it's just a solicitor working on it. I didn't attend the funeral as I'd no desire to see any of them. I had a respectful day on my own at home and lit a candle for my eldest sisters passing. She wasn't married, and had no children, hence the rest of us have jointly inherited her Estate. It won't happen again because they are all married with kids. I look forward to it being resolved so I can go back to complete NC.
This was me. It was from birth. I didn’t understand hate from love and good from bad because of this. Add to that all the labels. Bpd DA and MPD SP lol. I was fractured. Meditation and coming back to one no self no thing is how I healed. It had to be spiritual therapy abuse was so bad.
I'm relieved to know you found a pathway to the light. Linking you to a resource list I put together for FSA adult survivors in case you are wanting more support: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/updated-fsa-recovery-resources-2023/
Rebecca I really like your approach in thanking the survival parts of ourselves. I try to practice gratitude as much as possible. I will also thank my body and my brain for getting me to this point.
Wonderful! And thank you.
Thank you for all these videos. It’s 3 am and currently dealing with family siblings and inheritance, and their using it as continued forms of abuse and control. Has very much dissociated me the last few days and I find these videos are very validating for me. Thank you
I've seen that sort of thing far too many times, where the siblings attempt to take the inheritance from the scapegoat victim, saying they are crazy or incompetent or what-have-you. A few people I advised to get an attorney did so - AND WON. In one case, the sibling that tried to take off with the inheritance was an attorney - He lost the case in court and the judge also chewed him out and gave him a good scolding - he was humiliated in front of of his colleagues and peers. I love hearing stories like these.
Thank you Rebecca. Good to hear! I shall not give up. The main ring leader seems to be my older sister. My existence to her feels a bit like the Snow White fairytale - even though she has everything. My brothers have sabotaged me too post divorce. Am tempted to legally sue for the lot, as I’m now being made aware of how this role from childhood has set me up for continued abuse in relationships and workplace settings, but I doubt the courts would be ready to acknowledge this. I’m fortunately no longer in the same country as them, but still can’t seem to sort my life out here with a steady income in a healthy environment. We have a lawyer overseeing things, and have included him in our correspondence, and I feel a bit comforted now, with him at least seeing it for his himself after 4 years of my mistreatment. Will be going no contact ASAP and may try get my own lawyer too. Thanks again. I did really feel a bit crazy the other day, and now doubting my own competence a bit, (after her recent attempt at micro managing me), but know too, it’s the abuse speaking.. Will rewatch your videos.. 😊 Have also developed health issues in the last few years. Anyhow, thanks for listening and helping us. x
My siblings tried to cut me out of my father's Will, 9 years ago, they are now trying it again over my eldest sisters Will!! It's SO wrong!!
We need to put these psychopaths in PRISON- NOW-INSTEAD OF CONSTANTLY ALLOWING THEM TO HAVE CHILDREN.
It amazes me that we have to study more for a driver’s license exam than we do to have children. No education required. Family Systems and early childhood development should be required courses in high school.
It’s me…. This is what I live with all day, every day. Structural Dissociation. Finally. A name for it ❤
Yes!! Fills in many gaps for most FSA adult survivors with complex trauma.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse now can I get past this and be “in reality” again?
@@michellefarmer1841 Well, as a transpersonalist, I have many thoughts on being 'in r/Reality' - Do you mean living as an integrated self or...?
I don’t feel I live inside myself. My spirit/soul is dissociated from my body. I meditate and sit quietly often. I listen to frequency while I’m sleeping. I quit drinking about 2 years ago. I always associated to be the drinking or hungover feeling.
I thought the detached feeling was associated to my drinking. Now that I’m sober, I know it’s not. ❤
My parents are both Narcs, covert and overt, both mailgnant in different ways. All my siblings, three of them, have turned into Narcissists, my children's father is a Narcissist and my kids are very narcissistic, probably Narcissists. I've been bullied by all of them for all my life until ending contact with my family when I was 42 and my children ending contact with me, several years ago. The worst is, that all of them are so good at painting themselves the victims, while I, a hypersensitive Introvert, totally isolated from a very, very young age have been sexually, physically and emotionally been abused, the only one of us, btw. I am tired of feeling (being made feel ) sorry for my siblings who act oh so superior, intelligent and above it all.
It is indeed so very difficult to be in the scapegoat role. Linking you to a list of resources I put together for FSA adult survivors in case you need additional support at this time: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/updated-fsa-recovery-resources-2023/
"family scapegoating abuse" .... O.o .... Wow, I had to pause the video at 3 seconds. That is a phrase I'd never heard before, but it really shocks me and surprises me, and hits to the core. I wonder if that's what I've been through? I wanna watch more and find out.
Hi there, my book has a self test and other information regarding this research-based term I created, you may want to check it out (Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed, links to it in video descriptions.)
This IS madness. Plain and simple. Compromising our sacred truth, writ large and exploited by the ruthless, is the blueprint for this hellscape.
Well said. Thank you.
Yes I am very concerned about how my six-year-old is acting out being scapegoated by my family right now
As I say in my book (Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed) the scapegoating of a child is passed down in dysfunctional family systems like a toxic, poisonous recipe the FSA target is forced to eat. These families typically have unrecognized intergenerational trauma and unconscious systemic anxiety, which can be driving the scapegoating abuse. Alternatively, in a narcissistic family system, the scapegoating 'recipe' may or may not be passed down to the next generation, as the Family Projective Identification Process may or may not be going on. Sometimes it is the narcissistic family power-holder driving the scapegoating of a particular child in a conscious and intentional manner.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse yes my my aunt my mother's youngest sister is the scapegoat of her 5siblings. I will definitely be getting your book
Good to hear, Tara. I hope you find my book helpful.
Lots of Structural Dissociation Symptoms growing up, adulthood (continue to resolve)
1. Numb, detached - as a young, isolated teen (my mother seemed to have a huge problem with me having any kind of a social life, although it was permissible for my siblings), I welcomed hurt feelings over no feelings at all.
2.?
3. Frequently Losing, misplacing things all my life.
4. Yes
5.?
6. Lack of motivation and stamina - all my life
7.sometimes
8. Sometimes
9.yes....always last to leave the dinner table....would hold food in my mouth and just suck, suck, suck as a toddler onward....just zone out....all my life
10. Very isolative to the point of being scary...75-100% On MBTI Introversion Scale.
11.yes
12. Partial amnesia..yes...my mother used to remark how I remembered so little of my childhood, while my siblings remembered just about everything.
Nebulous identity - used astrology a lot to see myself in a somewhat integrated whole with a circular boundary, sort of like the Native Americans and their sacred healing circle.
Co-occurring dx Paranoid, Depression, Avoidance, Compulsive with ASD1. I'm thinking ASD1 WITH C-PTSD.
Have read extensively on DID, MPD, etc. Saw some of myself in others like this, but didn't test accordingly. Have soooo much respect for these folks, just trying to get through the day.
PhD who diagnosed me 6 years ago was surprised I didn't test PTSD. We thought maybe I had worked through enough stuff by age 60. But C-PTSD not well known back then.
Look forward to next week's video on treatments for the C-PTSD. May need to break down and get Janine's workbook after all, although I've done and continue to do a lot of work through The Emotion Code/The Body Code. Middle of night, early morning most receptive for accessing subconscious.
Thank you....
You're welcome. I'll actually be discussing treatments specifically for Structural Dissociation, which even many trauma-informed therapists are not aware of yet.
You always speak to my inner child in ways no one else understands. Thank you sweetheart 🙏💕☮️
It’s been three years for me of no contact and I’m going through this really weird phase where I have no clue who I am. I don’t know what is the trauma I don’t know what is really me and it’s very upsetting and it makes me very angry.
I hope that you can find help and support for this - My resource list here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I had wisdom teeth grown in side ways in my gums that I had removed at 35 and the dentist couldn’t even understand how I felt no pain. So yea dealing with pain and not even knowing it is definitely a thing. Time lapses are a thing, which makes it difficult to trust yourself when remembering an incident or crisis and trying to defend yourself.
Time lapses suggest structural dissociation related to complex trauma. I have a video on this in my Clinicians playlist here on my channel.
I always thought I just had a high pain tolerance, but this theory makes a lot of sense.
I had a compounded cusp tooth , rather than pay for braces , my negligent abusive parents had a free extraction performed , the only dentistry i had as a child , caused permanent damage , left my mouth a mess , couldn't even smile . That was the least of the damage they caused
I have noticed my parts. I love us all. Sometimes I need their help. Sometimes they help, sometimes not. I can't control us, I can notice us. I just bought your book, I am looking forward to reading it. Thank you so much for your channel and book!
You'll likely appreciate that I recently suggested to a client they have a "Part's Party" where they celebrate all of their parts that helped them to survive FSA. I think I will do a video on this soon!
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse 🙏♥️
bought your book "Rejected, Shamed & Blamed" along with the workbook 'Transforming Living Legacy of Trauma". We were diagnosed C-PTSD-DID 11 years ago at the age of 53. have spent 7 of the last years in trauma therapy full time. Still, didn't know that there was such a close connection between the 'scapegoating' and the C-PTSD-DID until reading your book. that has been a real eye opener. Its been the missing piece, albeit in plane sight that has helped us to put together our chronological biographical history. we have come a long way in our healing journey, but still suffer from many of the symptoms of the 'scapegoated child'. we are looking forward to learning more and experiencing much more healing. thank you for your work with trauma research... we appreciate you sharing your knowledge with us so much.
You're very welcome. You (and others?) may want to check out one of the channels I feature here from a creator also diagnosed similarly, I believe. Link to the channel here: www.youtube.com/@thisbetheverses
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse thank you for your quick reply. We will definitely check out the channel suggested. appreciate any and all resources
You're welcome. You can let them know I referred you (and others who may be present!)
Feeling chronically numb, emotionally detached...
Life in a nutshell.
Yes, there is righteous rage beneath.
But i will not lash out at anyone unless they put their hands on me in a negative way...
Then, its open season.
Run...
Run far, far, far away... the rage will have its moment in the sun. ☀
And there will be no empathy for those with none to begin with...
Booyah. 🎤 drop
22:13 minutes long video.
I’ve flipped from being too trusting to being too counter avoiding. Everything hit me a couple of years ago and it’s taken a while for it all to sink in and now I can barely leave the house I’m so terrified of people. I believe I have the structural disorder and one of the symptoms that is really hard for me is the personalities who operate through me. One is my inner critic who really is my mother. The other is a rebellious teenager who is me as a teen. Then I find myself stuck there with them bickering and I have to ask them to stop but because they are not actually *voices* but parts of myself then they don’t stop. And then I just give up and watch tv and have a glass of wine and go onto social media and space out by having those conversations in my head where I’m trying to explain myself in make believe situations so I’m not even paying attention to the tv or anything I’m doing and certainly not do anything for myself. Im barely functioning at the moment because now it’s all so clear and I am exhausted from *hearing* how badly I do everything all day long and so I just don’t do anything at all. Is there a way to learn to turn off the nasty voice? My inner adult is quite reasonable but I don’t listen to that part of me because the nasty voice (mother) drowns me out relentlessly. The inner teen is there trying to defend herself and I don’t think she’d be here if the witchy mother wasn’t here. Sorry for the TL;DR, I’m just really really stuck and I don’t know what to do.
Thank you for your work. I’ve just found it and I feel like this is the best place for me.
Glad you found my channel and I do hope it is helpful. You also may want to read my book, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed' - Many FSA adult survivors find it equally helpful.
Hi Rebecca, thanks for the video.
As I went through Dr Janina Fisher workbook I simply couldn't understand this STRUCTURAL DISSOCIATION language. Your video has helped tremendously. Thank you. Gradually, I've noticed, I don't become overwhelmed with yet more information that describes my life, but find it fascinating to learn and grow and discover.
You might be happy to know that in sharing your work with another your book and Janina Fisher workbook are now in the hands of their therapist. You are making a very good difference in our lives, Rebecca. We thank you and appreciate you. Jane
Wonderful to hear, Jane - thank you for letting me know!
Thank you Rebecca for another informative educational video. I also really appreciate you explaining some techniques to use. I get so much information from the comments as well. Thanks to the viewers that share so openly and with such vulnerability, knowledge, and experiences to benefit the community.
You are most welcome! I enjoy this YT community very much.
Great video.🙏😘
Queen of pain.
Been waiting 2 years on major spine surgery.
I brush it off and keep on going on.
I know no one who could handle my pain.
I tick so many of these boxes. Smh.
Demon marc mum.
These psychopaths are pure evil.
Thank you! It is part of a clinical series playlist here on my channel's home page, but also for FSA adult survivors as well.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Appreciate your content.🙏
My life in a video, so sad most therapists have missed this. I have ordered the book thankyou
Yes, this form of systemic maltreatment / abuse is tragically under-recognized. Linking you to a list of resources I put together for FSA adult survivors if you need additional support at this time: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/updated-fsa-recovery-resources-2023/
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse thank you so much
I too was a mental health nurse/ therapist
Although it’s been soooo difficult
So much dissociation
So much study
So much search
So much loss
So many split parts
So many broken relationships
So much solitude
They didn’t take my heart
They didn’t take my dogs
They didn’t take my memory of seeing the light/god in everything as a young one
I held on to that
With a determination
Yo make it home
After I left that not home
Love to you for giving me this gift of finally knowing I can get / home
To
Myself ❤️
Beautifully said - (and I personally relate to every word, as I'm sure many here will as well - just add in 'dogs' and 'horses' for me...!)
Hi, I'm interested in hearing about the abuse survivor being too trusting. As a kid I was suspicious of people but kept my suspicions mostly to myself. I always felt obligated to show trust to people who were acting in what appeared to be a kind manner for fear of angering them and getting the flip side of the conditional kindness they were dishing out in the moment. Giving undeserving or scary people trust was also a way of appeasing them and hoping that by doing so you could fend off their doing something worse to you until you could actually get out of their company. Of course appeasement feels horrible when your trust is abused so I did my best to also avoid human interaction as much as possible which can also mess up one's life.
Hi Lorna, I've had a few requests for this today so I will get a video out about this soon. This is something I added myself to symptoms of structural dissociation, it is not from Janina Fisher. I was the same way, which is why I know this can happen with FSA adult survivors.
Yes, I did lots of "comply politely and act friendly,
and hope hope hope that I can slip away to safety."
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thanks, looking forward to it.
@@whereisyourhumanity7557 I hear you. We can learn to get better at speaking our minds. It can cause anxiety but with baby steps and practice we can get better at it.
Your experience with families for 20 years shows. You explain things in a way that validates my existence, and also relieves a lot of pain. I would suggest UA-cam to take the stamp down. But then that would cause a lot of court rooms to lose money and counselors who are ineffective and we can’t have that.
What stamp? And thank you.
The stamp that says “from a mental health professional licensed in the US.” I call it a propaganda stamp that UA-cam puts on some videos that they think has miss information.
It is actually confirming that I am a licensed practitioner and am a UA-cam Health Partner. Versus someone who has no clinical background or experience as a practitioner who speaks on these types of topics.
I was the second child, left to "cry it out" in infancy, was screamed at for small things, beat into amnesia for having negative emotions, not allowed to have anything my own without one of the parents claiming part of the fun or controlling how I had fun, belongings were consistently taken away and given to "less fortunate" kids, pets were treated like disposable objects, was shamed for my gender, religious abuse, consistent displacement and kept from safe people who tried to help me and my sister.
I am a dissociative system of at least 16 parts. Some 'parts' took on the form of the abusers, others are Non-human, some are me at different ages, some are the other gender or are gender fluid.
Thank you for sharing your experience. More people need to be aware of the impact of this form of abuse, and abusive family systems in general.
Something that has helped me beyond measure even though it wasn't always clear when enduring the lack of love from my abusers. Here it is: the even though I was failed by my caregivers - God loves me. How knowing this helped me survive and overcome. Reading the scriptures the teachings of Christ replaced the false doctrines I was taught and made to feel. In turn I replaced them with gospel truths that over time corrected what is true and what is not. Today I have come away winning the battle that was placed on me from a very early age. Give credit to the atonement of Christ. Wishing you all the best on this painful and tough journey. You can get through this.
Amazing work thank-you. The topic of scapegoating is so important to learn more about for so many people who have suffered. I share much of your information with my clients whenever possible.
Good to hear, Suzka, thank you for sharing my work on FSA. I did just start a playlist for therapists and clinicians, which is on my home page here. More to come!
I'm binging your videos
For me it began the day i was born, as it did for many others i imagine.
Yes, this can happen. It can start even In Utero as well (unwanted pregnancy, etc).
Yes,. I relate to lots of this. I was diagnosed with CPTSD in 2017 and have had lots of EMDR therapy. Some of this still hangs on. I imagine it will for life
There are additional therapies that can help C-PTSD symptoms, you might watch the video I did after this one on Dr. Janina Fisher’s TIST model (Trauma-Informed Stabilization Treatment).
This is just so profound! I relate to everything youve said....a hundred fold!!! Im noticing...thanks Rebecca
You're very welcome! More FSA survivor resources here, including link to a new FSA adult survivor support community I have formed online on Substack: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I was thinking about one I might add to the list and that is being almost on auto-pilot/going through the motions or seeming normal to others while almost wearing a mask. While this is something we all do to an extent, I can attest that it was on a much more significant level when I was younger and less integrated.
There is a recognized trauma-related 'disorder' that captures this - see if you relate - a state in which one's thoughts and feelings seem unreal or not to belong to oneself, or in which one loses all sense of identity.
www.psychologytoday.com/us/conditions/depersonalizationderealization-disorder
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yes,
or being a chameleon - able to adapt to situations almost like an actor. Taking on identities based on the situation/circumstances. (This can be helpful in many ways in business and social settings as long as there is no harm or misinformation intended.)
@@kimberlymccracken747 If one is on the autism spectrum / neurodivergent, this can also relate to something called 'masking'; however, it also can simply be a powerful adaptive survival strategy: "I will be what I sense others need me to be to fit in and belong".
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Interesting 🤔 And, I suppose on the positive side there's a large degree of emotional intelligence if, as I said before, there is no manipulative quality.
The scapegoating seems to also manifest in other social areas now. There appears to be a link between scapegoating and intersectionalism, a deeper issue for certain gender:minority segments in other demographics in a population.
I agree. Not just now, but for eons and eons within various human-created systems. If you go to the Community tab on my home page here, and go to my earliest posts, there is a Ted Talk with a speaker (older guy with a beard) saying much the same thing. Scapegoating is in the title. Short, but comprehensive. I also discuss this in one of my videos, can’t remember which one. I use the analogy of the Russian dolls - system within a system within a system…and scapegoating abuse exists in all of these systems in one form or another between those who hold power - and those who don’t, and it is fueled for the most part by projection - similar to what happened to poor ‘Piggy’ in the novel ‘Lord of the Flies’.
My first memory from infancy only came to me when I was almost 40. I remember my mother taking me for a walk in a pram, I was lying in it, and for some reason I cried. Was I wet? hungry? don't know. All I remember that she hissed: "If you don't stop crying, I will abandon you here right now!" And indeed, she slowly walked away, wearing her smart grey suit with a pink blouse. I started crying a lot louder. She came back, took me home, shaking the pram violently and hissing abuse at me.
Another one, I was having a bath, already a toddler. In a small portable bath. A business partner of my father came in, and I was petrified, I was naked. They all just laughed at me.
So did my mother and the golden sister when I was about eleven, and they forced me go to the beach without a bra, and my breasts were already showing. Mother wouldn't buy me a bra until it was too late to get me in the right shape. How I hated them. My sister tried to tear off my bra again in the 80's, when topless was the rage, to show she had better breasts.
Important memories. It can be intriguing to ask oneself: "How was my body remembering these incidences throughout my life prior to these cognitive memories coming up for me?"
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse After hearing you minutes ago, I think my mind was blocking the pain. Until I was strong enough (mother dead, sister far away and harmless) Gosh, I have material for a series of books, but I feel like blocking the memories again, just grateful I am still alive and almost sane, although not an average person. Thank you for your wonderful podcasts.
You're welcome, LL. We know now in the field of complex trauma treatment that there is no need to chase the memories cognitively - the body remembers via 'implicit memory'. This is why somatic work is critical in treating complex trauma, along with 'parts' work (as opposed to 'inner child' work, which can bypass important aspects of parts, including adult parts).
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse This explains a lot! When I was about 14 and under a lot of pressure to be the best performing student in class of over 30, after passing (successfully) the year's exam, I remember walking with a friend from an ice cream parlour. I felt like I walked beside my body and felt like it sort of shrank and tingled, how could I feel two bodies at the same time? Was it my astral body next to the earthly one? I briefly experienced something similar again a year or so later.
I guess, I have 'pulled myself together" LOL 😋
Firstly, you look amazing, flawless - and then have written a wonderful book to boot! Thank you for that; I've had it quite a while and now I get to put a lovely face to what I'm re-reading. Secondly, you are sharing extremely important nuggets of gold. Would you be able to mic yourself? The audio is rather low, and I don't want to miss a single thing you have to say. Thank you in advance for this affirming material. You're helping so many people to heal and grow. Thank you, sincerely, for helping us all.
Thank you for your kind words! 🙏 I discovered how to increase the audio so most videos now are louder.
Exactly thanks Mom and Dad
Woow. Excellent video. I identify with these. Thanks
You're so welcome!
You're a credit to the LMFT profession. I'm guessing miles above your industry peers. Uncle was diagnosed with DID. No one from that household walked away okay. Sister told me this year I was always "going into a daze" when I was 6-8 years old. I noticed it once when I was 8. Mom called me in the house. I sat next to sis on the front porch, dissociated, started removing my clothes. I snapped out of it wonder what the hell was going on. From that day I developed a tick and turned angry, mean and violent. NB: As you went down the list I cried.
Thank you 🙏
I used to "zone out" a lot, too.
@@kimberlygabaldon3260 little child me gives little child you a little child hug. Everything is going to be okay.
Interesting - I’ve never heard of this. Great video!
Thank you! The community we are cultivating here makes it fun for me to share these more clinical videos as people are actually interested in family systems.
Just ordered your book, I’m excited to use it as a guide
Good to hear!
Im 60. I still remember around maybe 11 or so?.... after one horrible unjustified punishment/beating...
When i was once again told:
"Shut up! Stop crying! Do you want me to give you something to cry about!"
I was hyperventilating. It wasn't even my fault. I just wanted to be believed, to be forgiven, for my siblings to just once admit they lied again to put the blame on me..
I couldn't catch my breath.
So I got something to REALLY cry about.
When he was done, i crawled up the steps and got in my closet with Raggedy Anne. Her cloth hands again soaking up my tears.
With all my might i vowed to myself i would never cry again. They wanted me to cry. And wouldnt ever again satisfy them at my own expense.
The abuse would continue.. the blame, the punishments, shame, public humility. All the way through highschool. Years.
Not one fucking tear. Not one. Ever. I would damn myself to hell where i belonged anyway.
April. 1982.
My very best friends since grade school, two guys my age. Peers, buddies, trusted souls. No crushes, no sex, just buds.
Paul smoked pot with me.
Tom had a car and often peppermint schnapps. Unexpectedly one schnapps drinking night Tom began complimenting me. He had made a list of my character qualities, the reasons he admired me, why he adored my soul. Just honest, simple appreciation that i was his friend. It had been 6 or so years and i couldnt even remember how. I couldn't believe anything of it...but i knew it was true. I felt emotion. Something wanted to express something i didnt even recognize it anymore.. so i reminded myself how unworthy i was. How even my fam knew i wasnt loveable. Hate. Self hate. Just hate . Just. Just hate you just hate you. With ever chug of that peppermint schnapps my truth returned. He wouldnt just stop talking. He wanted me to hear his feelings. The nottle was gone. And i was tiny.
But i beat the fucking shit out of his face anyway.
...
See. I told ya. You're wrong
Im right.
Simon and Garfunkle came on the radio...
....🎶 ..."and a rock feels no pain.
.. 🎶 ... and an island never dies.
Such is the legacy of FSA. You are such a powerful writer, Susan. Thank you for sharing both your memories, and your gift with words in regard to so poignantly describing the pain of this form of abuse, with all of us here. I imagine you may already know about toxic shame (which supports and fuels this self-hatred instilled in us when young), but if not, there is a chapter in my book about it (Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed) and I did a video on it here: ua-cam.com/video/OBo4ky0ADTU/v-deo.html
is It in prison now?
Rebecca....as always Thank You never seems enough. You continue to enlighten educate fascinate comfort reassure validate & encourage which is has a value beyond price, may you go down in the anuals of psychotherapists and be forever shining your light for scapegoats past present & future. You are a legend! I applauded all that you do.
Thanks again & again and again....
Snowy x
You are so welcome - In helping others, I am also helping myself at the same time, and so I also am grateful to you all, and for your presence here. Your comment (above) means much to me as well!
Thank you for sharing your expertise on the matter. I appreciate your videos and your channel so much. Iam So happy that I have found you. ❤❤❤
So I’ve been diagnosed with ptsd, GAD, bipolar 1, which I think is (BPD) from scapegoating family abuse, & being able to watch you videos, & just being able to have the vocabulary for it feels healing. ❤️🩹
Yes, having names and terms does help - hence my coining many new ones to help describe the FSA phenomenon. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have a diagnostic consultation coming up for DID. I've been suspecting I may have DID for about 2 years now and have been learning a lot. Videos like this are extremely informative and helpful for those seeking to help themselves. Thank you. ❤
You're very welcome. You might check out the channel from @thisbetheverse here on UA-cam - they are a featured channel at the bottom of my home page here.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse sure thing. Thank you. I'll look into this immediately. ☆
You can tell them I sent you...
I just finished reading The Haunted Self and it confirmed what I suspected 😢
Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Sorry to hear it. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Thank you for your generosity in sharing these videos. God bless you.
So nice of you, thank you.
I would be interested in knowing more about any connections between the development of Structural Dissociation and Cyclical Vomiting which accompanies Migraines that has already been assessed and confirmed by more than one Medical Doctor.
Thank you, your compassion and deep understanding shine through. I am lucky to have a wonderful therapist whom I know is a deeply kind human being,and not just effective in a textbook way.💫💖🇨🇦
A gift to be treasured.
I've lost ¾ of my life to structural disorder. Even seeing a photo, I still can't remember the circumstances surrounding it. I don't remember place or places. I however remember all the emotions. I'm hyper sensitive and an emapth, it made it worse. Sadness and grief followed me since iI remember. I was never a child. But I'm learning and growing and I will thrive, not survive, in the end.
Yes! A good workbook to address Structural Dissociation is Dr Janina Fisher's workbook, Transforming the Living Legacy of Trauma - link here: www.amazon.com/Transforming-Living-Legacy-Trauma-Therapists/dp/1683733487/
Cheers. This video's very relevant for us.
We appreciate your time and energy making it. And your experiences that allowed you to.
Just noticing is something I personally (Not speaking for everyone else in my system), have just begun to be able to do. I've spent my life far less conscious, embodied or able to be cognitive and observe before recent days.
My current real fun barrier I'm working to overcome- is trying to just observe. Cause noticing anything I do, think, feel, say etc- triggers a barrage of inner critic self persecution attacks that are exhaustingly constant, brutal and intensely fast-paced.
Currently- we're using a toolbox in Pete Walkers book "C-ptsd from surviving to thriving"- to learn to thought stop and thought correct.
We're reading the toolbox's suggested responses aloud every morning, along with your video "Family Scapegoating Abuse Recovery Affirmations - Vol. 2 ".
Been about a week of doing this every morning. Its helping a bit. Dunno if it's gonna make it stop entirely. So far, its still a constant minute by minute (sometimes second by second) fight for me to try to just exist and observe myself without judgement and inner critic attacks kicking the ever-loving s*** out of me.
I am able to dis-identify with the critics attacks, and Constantly thought stop and thought correct- then work on grounding to the present, the room and to our body through the senses, trying to be more in the emotions and sensations somatically than in my mind. This is right now, as good as it gets. Draining would be putting it mildly.
I wonder- with no expectation- if you have any thoughts or resources that could be relevant.
Cheers.
- Vince
Hi Vince, so many family abuse survivors would be able to relate to all you share, above. My first thought is that this issue of the 'inner critic' may relate to - and have its roots in -'Toxic Shame'. Did you already read my book and my chapter on toxic shame? As I mentioned in a past video, FSA adult survivors in particular do not 'feel' shame. We 'are' shame. It can be so woven into' the identity that it is not something that can be tackled directly but requires skill and finesse. Let me know if this may be a possibility for you (and the others); toxic shame is why I say FSA is such a horrific form of 'invisible' systemic abuse. Innocent children grow up believing they are fundamentally bad, flawed, unworthy, and that something is 'wrong' with them but they have no idea what - and this is how they will go through life - terrorized by an inner, shaming critic - unless they begin to understand these more subtle aspects of systemic (family) abuse and how it can impact a child's brain development and sense of self (selves) .
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yeah. What you're saying makes sense to me.
Toxic shame is a big part of our existence for a lot of us in here. Previously saw it like interwoven symptoms of the same experiences. Inner critic attacks and toxic shame. Just saw them both as malware of equal levels- the feeling, the presentation of the feeling in the mind, virus programs from our family of origin and various abusers' instilling them growing up.
Reading your comment makes me think it could be like... Toxic shame is an internalised core belief about my identity? That feeds symptoms like the inner critic programs? Maybe a lens. helps shape and define how I perceive and interact with myself, selves, others in my system, my environment, internal and external, without me noticing its doing that or that's what that feeling and "story" and "interpretation" of something is. Cause it feels like intrinsic, physical, objective reality to me.
It feels like something that's. Its hard to explain. It don't feel like its in me. It feels like you say- like something I am. It feels like I don't "Feel ashamed of myself" or "Feel shame for what I'm doing". It don't register to me as "feeling shame" a lot of the time. Just like its a constant embodied, tangible core-deep feeling that lives inseparably to me, or like a constant ocean that suffocates and surrounds me. It just is. Then I feel constantly attacked and judged from all sides. I don't realise I'm projecting this feeling out onto the world and others around me. It feels like its there, coming from them already surrounding me- I guess cause it was. Flashbacks intensify it too I'm sure.
I knew toxic shame was a part of what we experience and how its protective, bit about how it develops. Not a lot more. I appreciate your bringing it more to my attention.
I'm gonna browse through the book we've got for the chapters on toxic shame.
No. We haven't read your book yet. Ordered it tonight. After this conversation. Gonna check it out when it arrives too.
- Vince
Hi Vince, glad you are ordering my book. I forgot to mention to you earlier (but it is in my chapter on Toxic Shame) that toxic shame is UNCONSCIOUS. So, if you read back this second comment you wrote here, you will see that you in fact provide a brilliant and astute description of what toxic shame is. I do not wish to ascribe feelings or states to you (all), but based on what you have written here, I'd say that this may indeed be a trail of breadcrumbs you may wish to follow as it may lead you (all) to productive places.
My book should also help to further your understanding of how child psycho-emotional abuse impacts targets / victims / survivors. I did check out your channel, btw, and I feel strongly that what you are doing is not only extraordinarily well done, but important. I hope that you (all), over time, find your channel getting more attention - that is, if you want such attention at this time. (Your fashion sense, needless to say, is also quite fabulous!)
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse
We appreciate your replies.
We have been chasing this up. Looking into toxic shame. Slowly. It is definitely relevant. Its a relief to know what that feeling is and why it impacts us so strong.
Its strange. I'm not avoidant of much introspection and healing-wise. I can dive into fear and grief and rage, happiness was terrifying but I'm getting that down, and hope and affection. All terrifying. But I can go for it.
Shame feels different. Its like it blocks itself. I don't recognise it as "shame" when it hits me and I feel so averse. Go so far as to say "afraid". Of feeling it, I'm giving myself time and accepting that's the way this is when looking into it (cause I got the sneaky little sob's number there at least). Its a challenging one. Spirals a lot. Bounces off itself and increases. Not a fan.
Your books helpful. We've been reading it. I'm curious to get to the chapter on shame.
I - and all of us. We appreciate that you checked out our channel, and what you said about it. I appreciate what you said.
Thank you.
It feels important to us too. What we're doing. We appreciate you seeing us.
- Vince
I forgot to mention that I was very affected by a Philip Larkin poem when young. A professor gave it to me after I handed in some (rather 'dark') work. The poem is 'Aubade'. Still one of my favorites. (I am assuming your handle is from the Larkin poem of the same name...)
Thank you!
You're welcome!
I ordered your book, reading it now. It brings so many things to light ...Thank you for the work you do!!!❤
Wonderful! And you're welcome!
Thank you for listing the signs in this video. That is very helpful. I screenshot them.
Thank you this was amazing and so helpful. Thank you for providing these amazing resources. 🎉❤
Glad it was helpful!
I could almost cry just hearing this again.youre up to # 6, so far i indenitfy with all except #2.
You may want to check out my resource list for FSA survivors - my book and my FSA survivor community are listed the top: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Thank you so much❤
You're welcome 😊 You may want to subscribe to my Substack for FSA survivors as well - More info' here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/about
Unsafe to express my feelings - relate!!
Great vid- on a side note can you do a vid on how a scapegoat can go about starting a family? As a scapegoat i have now idea how you would go about this with zero modelling of what a normal healthy family should look like. Heck you could probably write a whole book on this!
Thanks! Regarding 'normal' and 'healthy' family systems: This would be quite an undertaking, but what a worthy subject! As I have said to others here, I wish there were 10 of me. I'm still trying to get my FSA research data out (sigh). As a family systems therapist who has "seen it all," I can tell you there is no 'normal', but there can be 'healthy enough' family systems, meaning, a 'good enough' (not perfect) 'container' to raise a child in. What I can do at some point is some videos on what a 'healthy' (enough) family system looks like. Granted, these types of videos don't get very many views (one needs to include 'Narcissist' with lots of exclamation points to get that sort of attention) but again, it is a worthy subject and I appreciate the suggestion.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse thanks for your reply, and yes “normal” is a loaded word. Yea narcissist is all the rage right now. Somebody posts to many selfies, oh they are a narcissist. It annoys me because those of us who are truely affected by narcs are well aware of the damage inflicted upon us over somebody who likes taking pictures of themselves…..
@@TheDruzza Indeed. You'd never know that only 1 - 6% of the population worldwide would meet the required clinical criteria for NPD.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse That's amazing, considering the amount of damage that they inflict. And the number of organizations that they run.
America was built by narcissists, for the benefit of narcissists.
Interestingly (and not so surprisingly), the current data is the U.S. has 5 - 6% NPDs in the population, which is one of the highest in the world. This would include untested narcissists, and is an estimate, of course. With that said, as I mentioned in a recent video, dysfunctional family members with strong narcissistic traits can do their own good bit of damage in a family system, to the point where I would consider it to be a narcissistic family system more than a 'dysfunctional' one, if certain evidence revealed itself to me while working with a client.
My father abandoned three children before marrying my mom and having me. Is it possible that his feelings about my half-siblings and possible guilt/shame and fear of new responsibilities could result in a way of interacting with his new family that was toxic, not really wanting us, resenting being obligated again, etc.?
Sounds like you have insight and clarity. Hugs.
Hi Nancy, as I hold an active license, I can't comment directly on your situation, but I can say that in general, this could be possible, but having worked with hundreds of families and also individuals at this point in my career, these types of profound parental failures can be caused by so many things, including their own family-of-origin dysfunction, toxic shame, addiction, individual trauma, a personality disorder (including narcissisism), mental illness, selfishness, etc. I always had my grad students do a family genogram - so much more becomes clear once you lay out all that happened on both sides of one's family during the past 3 to 4 generations.
Thank you. Your help is deeply appreciated. It needs to reach as many people as possible.
@@nancybartley4610 Thank you - I've been told this by so many since publishing my book, it is one of the reasons I ended up here!
5 kids. 1 severe narcissist who has 2 flying monkey sisters and mother who gave up her parental authority decades ago. She allowed the scapegoating to begin and continue 65 years. I believe her issues are due to intergenerational trauma. The 5th child is the only male, therefore Golden (not his fault).
Question: Can you have BOTH a parent with intergenerational trauma AND a narcissist sibling running the show?
My 3 sisters and mother have scapegoated me since birth. My brother is my sole support. Tells me it's because I'm the Truthsayer, and they don't want to hear it.
The answer to your question is a definite "YES". It is quite common for there to be both a traumatized family system (including intergenerational truama) as well as narcissistic family members who scapegoat in a more intentional, conscious manner.
Wow, I can tick off probably half that list or more to some degree. Amazing insight.
Glad it was helpful!
9th January 2024
Dear Rebecca,
Thank you for sending me the link to this video here. I realise I have selective amnesia, mostly about the fact that I cannot remember my life before my fourteenth birthday.
This can definitely be trauma-based - I do hope you look into finding a competent trauma-informed therapist to work with. Most FSA adult survivors benefit from such work, as explained in my book, Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Dear Rebecca,
Thank you. Yes, I am in therapy now. I chose this therapist last late October and I've been working with her since. I currently have bronchitis which came on from chronic sinusitis. The bronchitis started on 27th December last year and I'm still in bed due to it. The doctors are treating me for it.
I'll be able to get back to working with my therapist, L, once I'm recovered.
I think that she is Masters trained in psychotherapy and family abuse. All is going well with the therapy. So far, so good. She's very professional in her work with me.
The NHS had me on their waiting list again but I'd been waiting for therapy since 2022 and I decided to find my own therapist and pay for it with my own money.
Her fees are affordable for me. It's online which suits me very well. Sometimes I go to her room if I choose to.
I'll speak the title of the abuse that you've named, FSA, Family Scapegoating Abuse, to appropriate people here in my experiences as I deem wise.
So, through your videos and your book which I have bought, I've learnt about what therapists in UK cannot name, FSA. So, a massive thank you to you, Rebecca C. Mandeville 😀🕊️🌷♥️
You're very welcome, Elizabeth. Many therapists are open to reading my book if their client invites them to and you can also go through the FSA Assessment form together in session, which can be very eye-opening and productive, based on what FSA adult survivors who write to me have shared. I wish you the very best in your recovery and healing process. Also, I'm linking you to a playlist I made for both survivors and therapists/clinicians on clinical considerations related to FSA recovery: ua-cam.com/play/PLXSLEoZOeKOEoeIx75TNU59TjSc2YHo7W.html&si=REvcczdDvtTn7bVH
I'm glad to watch one of your videos and this time not to relate to every single thing, but yes I was too trusting although I was always told I was paranoid. The two are opposites. All of the mistakes I made, I could have done with being less trusting. I do remember the thought passing through my head once "would I find that funny?", like I was analysing a part in a play. I should have just laughed, or not!
Or...analyzing a 'part' (!)
"Youre the oldest! Its up to you to know better!" Get over here! Get over my knee!"
The eldest sibling also can be put in the position of being responsible for all of the younger siblings - and be punished for their actions for "allowing it to happen."
that was me@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse
One interesting note being diagnosed with this is I seem to even surprise myself often (not to mention others especially those in the psychiatric profession). In any case the other night I (?) Started baking pies. The odd thing (I) seemed to really know what (I) was doing like a professional baker, everything exactly perfect to a T. But then I can't ever remember baking a pie and my mom never showed me cause my childhood was so chaotic. So how did I do this ? There was an old man who helped raise me who used to bake so I must of learned it from watching him but compartmentalized it for 40 years then all the sudden I'm baking some tasty pies. Now tomorrow it may be something completely different. Also I agree with the pain thing. I wake or come to with bruises but have no idea how they came about. Sometimes life/things are so bazaar that (I) feel like (Im) not of this planet ? Can't be with all the oddities. In any case life is very interesting no the less. Have a blessed day.
Thank you for sharing your experiences. Dissociation indeed could account for this, btw.
Sounds like my world everyday.
Janina Fisher videos are ones to look at for understanding this aspect of our suffering
I agree. This is who I did my certification with as a trauma professional.
I'm watching this today for the second time.
My internalised rage and anger feels so close to the surface recently. One part of me needing to finally scream and shout against the injustices she experienced as a child and the other part of me desperately trying to cage the angry/raging part.
Do you have any other videos/content on anger and rage. I'm finding it so helpful and validating.
Yes, watch my video on 'injustice and righteous rage' (in the title) - And I have an article on this same subject on my blog, here's the link: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/2022/06/29/injustices-of-family-scapegoating-fsa/
My extension got caught in the snowblower- I see that as self- sabotage . I laughed 😂 then look after my inner child ....❤️🙏he was rebelling breaking things
That ‘rebel’ part has so much energy and life! It can also serve as energy for healing, once channeled in that direction…
I liked when you say "as the community grows", so glad to hear that :o) Next up was the part about the community container. Im having a little difficulty comprehending how a formal community container works, or functions. (But it sure sounds great!) What I am finding with forums and websites is often times a disclaimer saying to refrain from reaching out to other members. Is there a taboo about commiserating with fellow survivors? Does that not lead to also sharing strategies that work? I respect that some folks do not want to engage one on one, outside the groups and that needs to be respected by all means- but what if a there is a mutual desire to interact in real life, say through email or making a trustworthy acquaintance who one can share this journey with? Can anyone recommend how to actually socialise with other survivors in a healthy way? People estranged from extended relatives through smear campaigning can become isolated unfortunately. It would be so beneficial to engage with safe folks who are healing. thanks.
Groups can be very difficult for many FSA adult survivors, as it can unconsciously activate trauma from family-of-origin experiences; group members may also fall into their family-of-origin roles and behaviors as well. They are tricky and complex to properly facilitate as well. I intend to do a dedicated video on this subject as well. Great questions, thank you.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thanks for tackling that one, its been weighing on the mind in recent months. I think I am understanding what you mean.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse that does make sense
Thank you very much for your important work and videos for us - its a almost unbelievable, sad fact, that we clients over here - in Germany - can very hardly find a good therapist which is educated enough in narc childhood abuse - no trauma therapist or coach which is really able to help people with c-ptsd like me. I gave up my research in 2020, after the last psychiatrist who claimed on the phone he knows about narc abuse - and when I started to see him - he suddenly begun reading out of his bible for me?!
Made me quite angry and all he could answer me was that only his bible "GOD" could help people like me. There was a command in another video from another german guy who made same sad experiences over here in Germany. I did order your book but its only available in english language - not very easy to read and understand when I am not use to all those psychological terms in english.
You're very welcome. I spoke with my friend in Germany about helping me find someone who can properly translate it - there will be some challenges but haven't given up on this idea. Linking you to a list of resources I put together for FSA adult survivors - you might search for a trauma-informed therapist on Dr. Janina Fisher's site there: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/updated-fsa-recovery-resources-2023/
I totally agree. From Germany as well.
I tried it a few years earlier finding a trauma therapist with an emphasis on narcissistic abuse while additionally being high functioning autistic - but only late diagnosed at age 29, even though it's been obvious when I was a kid since I'm not an aspergers but actually I do have infantile autism; needed to research and go through old baby photos and videos were one can literally see ALL signs. Well, my family simply didn't want me to be autistic, so they used psychological violence to make me disconnect from my needs and from my own body sensations.
This had besides the narc abuse a horrible effect on my inner organization since I was forced to live various life's at once and I needed to understand things quickly for otherwise I'd loose my attachment to my family of origin.
Well, I looked for a therapist, I've visited several and to me it's been a horrific scenery that pictured itself due to these visitations.
Me, I was the one, explaining the therapist about what constitutes Borderline Personality Disorder in detail since, well, I'm autistic, when I need to research something, you can be sure I'll read a whole library about only one single sub-topic, besides as I also found out at the diagnosis when I've been 29 was that I was gifted, actually to a very a rare percentile - I believe this is it what made it possible to survive all that to a big part.
The therapist then was intimidated by me since I explained her her subject.
Another therapist told me right from the start that he will type shorter mails while the session and when the phone rings, he will take the call - for he is quite a demanded therapist generally. I asked him jokingly if this was a praxis trailblazing in narcissistic personality disorder - and the way the guy stared at me the second after, I simply knew what was going on and thanked him very much for his time, but I'd rather look for a therapist who is less busy sparing his valuablet time - moved out as fast as possible.
Another one was a professor, who was seriously frustrated about it that I knew so much and always wanted to talk to him eye to eye.
Another one when I said that I was autistic smiled and said "this is a trauma reaction. You've split your character to protect yourself. And you feel easier as a victim. That's why you made yourself believe you're autistic." and she said with such a conviction and faked empathy for this totally made up situation, that I asked her straight away, if she was somehow delusional - of course always with a certain gentleness and humour, not in a completely rude way. She then told me: "do you feel at times like things are actually different than they seem?", me I stared at her, but knew by that moment alreads that I can forget her as therapist and said like I was suddenly opening up about something more serious and I lowered my volume to gain more presence within her for she needed to activate her auditive senses more, meaning she was a bit forced out of her head by that, which I of course wanted since I know that reactive expressions are more pronounced when the presence is not in one's mind but directly in the bodily sense organs, well, I almost whispered: "absolutely, you see... Don't know how to tell you without that you might think I totally lost my mind... You know, but you're actually right. I believe you know about it as well for you asked me this question - this was the sign, wasn't it?.... You know, I believe, that some people use the psychological effect of mirroring and the transfer situation within a professional therapy setting itself for actually manipulating the client into their own believes.... You know." It took her whole three seconds until she literally understood it and just looked at me completely without any emotional expression, she must have felt really bad I guess.
The only thing I can do, is being a library myself. I read still simply all I can find about it, I then start to be my own therapist and develop models taken from Kohut, then a bit of Melanie Klein, then more the winnicot way.
It's a desaster anyways for exactly that again is not really identity spending, not quite sure if one says so in English. I do mean the German word "Identitätsstiftend". The additional problem is that I suffered later on several other forms of abuse, homelessness, crime and violence, drug addictions, excessive drinking - I solved all that but my nicotine addiction, it's just a self soothing behaviour I am simply not willing giving up, even though I know exactly why I am smoking and what it does for me. I can live with that.
I later then made it - due to my water like persona - into hedgefunds, in the finance industry in another country. But since I am truly autistic, even though I can simply be whoever I want to be, this causes immense pressure, specially when working in a high pressure environment - and doing everything always to a top niveau. But when it comes to values, it stops for me. So, in Finance most people have no values, many are borderline-organized or full blown narcs, I've even met several psychopaths - it's amazingly scary how highly good they're in pretending to be a normal human - for it took me some time finding out by analysing everyone constantly. It's good therefore that I do have an eidetic memory.
Well, values clashed. I was fired since I didn't want to do conduct things which were unethical.
Well, now I'm here.
Having still identity issues even though I know about them, that's the most horrible about it. I can explain to it myself and can be aware of how my psyche organizes "the world", but there is no constant around me since I usually am the one realizing the necessary illusions others are participating in for being able holding up their "personality" as rigid as they appear. While me I can see through it, which people also sense somehow. So, usually alot of people are "liking" me, who want to be seen, simply because I can just truly "see" them. So, alot of traumatised women are coming towards me, alot of abused people, cognitive dissonant people, borderliners like me as well - well, narcissistically organized people do not like me at all, since I see that they are a shell and they do sense that as well. You know who is not magically drawn to me? Normal people.
But when I then actually meet normal people, I realize that nornal people are caught in their "normal sphere", I can't truly be myself with them either for I'd start talking about highly complex matters, would challenge their belovies and actually - not in any mean sense - but they're held "stupid" by their cage of normalcy.
What I needed was someone smart, who was able of seeing the full range of my personality, which is highly fluid and thereby almost "all" characters you can imagine.
Who is one, who can be whoever he wants to be?
Well, I always refer only thereto that I'm only defined by values. They are the only constants I do have.
It may sound like not too big of an issue, but trust me, when you suddenly dissociate or feel like there was no core, you get a good understanding of how borderliners, narcissistic people, schizoid people and so on must feel for I am able of perceiving this emotion as well. But it's actually not the truth for my core is simply water-like. I can shape accidentally into this state, but then I can shift again out of it.
Simultaneously it's not schizophrenic for I'm never disconnected from different ego-states, but am always capable of valid reality testing.
By sharing this, I actually did not overshare simply because I've nothing else to do, but because somewhen someone will read this comment, who knows about this from personal experience and feels relieved that he or she isn't alone with that. Besides, if anyone has any idea about it and a new idea how to approach this situation, feel free commenting.
And to go full circle: forget therapy in Germany in case you do not want to get more confused than you already are by cptsd.
Thanks for reading. Have a good one.
Agree totally Germany is full of educated brainwashed Fachidoten!!!!
I'm curious, Rebecca, if you've noticed an increase in isolation and distrust symptoms since the pandemic. I know personally, my level of societal trust has been significantly reduced over the last few years. It also upped the ante with my FSA, as my once cautious family "doesn't do covid anymore," and my continuing to be careful due to a health condition is called "crazy."
Also, I see that "stuckness" as a legitimate defense mechanism sometimes. For instance, when I've taken steps forward in my career, some family members and my ex (in league together) have gone out of their way to try to sabotage my progress, making me hesitant to do anything publicly in the future. I'm constantly weighing the benefits of moving ahead with the possibility of them causing real damage -- damage that's hard to get out in front of without looking like I'm the problem, not them. (Smear campaigns, "Oh, we're so worried about her mental health," etc.)
Yes, I do see this (in regard to your first question). And, your point in your second paragraph is accurate and deserves a dedicated video - How the FSA adult survivor holds themselves back from success and thriving in life as a defense mechanism. This can indeed occur. I'll add it to my list of future videos I plan to make, thank you.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thank you, that would be much appreciated!
Thank You
You're welcome.
Thank you for really helping me to understand what is wrong with me,. have learned, she was a
Sorry, I'm not used to responding to online forums or any such thing and inadvertently sent before finishing my thoughts so anyway the cookie continues to crumble....i am in quite a state. Four years ago i had no choice but to leave my flat and my job in Vernon BC during the month that covid hit {March 15 2020} Every joint in my body began to become inflamed after a bout with a nasty flu in December 2019 while i was home visiting family north of Calgary. It has taken me 4 years to sort my health. It turns oust that I am suffering from inflammation to every joint. I have Rheumatoid, advanced osteo and severe problems with my lumbar spine.
This has all come about as a result, I believe, I have been just trying to survive my entire life. All encompassing worthlessness, my entire life. Many things I could say of
my experiences. I now know and realized while seeking treatment that my body is not happy with the insidious self sabotage and the way that i disgust myself. I feel invisible, hollow and numb. I feel as if
I am invisible. Thank you for all you do Rebecca
I appreciate your taking the time to comment. My FSA research supports your hypothesis, unfortunately - Many FSA adult survivors suffer from chronic illnesses. I discuss scapegoating and chronic illness in this video - BTW, releasing anger, rage, and the heavy burden of toxic shame can be very healing: ua-cam.com/video/ytSdn8nQCBg/v-deo.html
Everything you mentioned is me. Started in infancy when my dad left my schizophrenic mom and left me with her. I am forever checking in with myself and a clenched jaw and its become natural now. Another thing I do is drive without the radio on as it seems to help me process my thoughts and doesn't interrupt that process like the radio or having a 2nd person in the vehicle speaking would. Another thing I've been doing is making poems about my experiences and I'm finding the wordsmithing and the end result so rewarding. Would you like me to share one?
Yes, feel free to share!
Does chronic maladaptive day dreaming count as a symptom?
Yes - this can be a form of the 'flight' trauma response. It also can be a means of creating what I call 'repair fantasies' (which I did a video on a while back) or envisioning a better life or future - so it is good to be curious about the content of the day-dreams. Dr Carl Jung called this 'Active Imagination', btw, and highly creative people can engage in this as well so we don't want to throw the baby out with the bath water.
That's me chronic daydreaming at school....never present...due to verbal abuse I received from a very young age..
@@kellygarland1624 You also might explore whether psycho-emotional ('invisible') abuse was also something you received - they typically go together.
I always felt like being sensitive had a lot to do with this.
Per my research on FSA, it often does. I wrote a chapter on Empaths and scapegoating abuse in my book, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed'. You might also check out this related video: ua-cam.com/video/j2lhgSMiTQw/v-deo.html
Interested to understand when it comes to “parts”, which one would manifest or be driven by shame/blame - fawn, freeze or submit? Or would shame/blame fuel them all?
It is possible for 'toxic shame' to drive any type of 'survival' trauma response, including the ones you list, depending on how one is subconsciously reacting to a sense if profound vulnerability and helplessness.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thank you so much for this. Hope you’re very well - so pleased to see your work reaching far and wide!
Thank you, Tammy! Slowly but surely...(!)
Can't wait for my sister to hopefully get her wakeup call.
Curious: How do you imagine this would change things for you in regard to healing from this form of abuse (FSA)?
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I would get validation for my experience and some sort of closure.
Understood. Finding closure is so painfully difficult when dealing with FSA. Most FSA adult survivors discover they will need to find closure in a manner that does not involve something happening or not happening with abusive family members. I talk a bit about the recovery path in my Clinical playlist here (for survivors and clinicians - it is on this channel’s home page), as well as my book, ‘Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed’.
don't count on it. My sister finally , I thought had a realization with my mother. She sought counseling, called her mentally ill etc and was no contact for a while. She confided in me saying, "it was never you" etc. Fast foward to recently. It all changed again. From what I see and actually told my family, it's just survival mechanisms. After all the talks etc she went back to that dynamic and imploded on me that I was wrong lol. It's just crazy. Take care of you and dont expect nothing from the others.
Unfortunately I believe our family of origin may never get a wake up or whatever you want to call it. They Truly believe what they are saying ( their negative, twisted or fabricated) narrative around us.
6:17 wow ..yup.. o saw this play out with my cousin's family. I lived with them for a while and I was always very to myself i didn't really talk a lot. I would petty much watch the family run. while unknowingly taking notes, only as things they did was strange to me or that just did not make sense to me because it was extra drama that wasn't appropriate or necessary.
'Noticing' is a critical aspect of trauma recovery. It sounds like you have been cultivating the ability to 'notice' for a long time!