STOP Using GPS Immediately. Do This Instead
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- Опубліковано 27 лип 2024
- There is a serious problem with the GPS readings on your running watch. This quick video will show you why (and what to use instead)
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#running #runningcoach #marathontraining - Спорт
I run the same route most days. My GPS shows distance to within couple steps almost every day and if it doesn't it usually is because I haven't given it enough time to get a good lock at the start. Thank you, 3 steps after 7k it is good enough for me.
Also, absolute precision probably doesn't matter as much as most people think. What matters is that you can compare your exercises to see if you are progressing and maybe to calculate your pace for your next marathon.
Absolute pace only matters when you race against other people and 99.9% runners only race against their past selves.
Think about it this way: even if your watch overestimates the distance by 10% (!!!), you still can use it to see if you get faster from month to month, you still can use it to plan your training and increase your distance at your planned rate. And if you calculate your pace during training and then apply it to racing but you use the same watch, those problems cancel out.
When it comes to pacing during race, the most important functionality of the watch is virtual pacer which helps me keep consistent pace and avoid overcooking it. As I run I compare what the pacer shows me and what the km markers tell me and I mentally correct for the virtual pacer indications.
So I wouldn't worry about the errors from GPS if I was anybody except for a super pro racing relatively short distances.
Mine Garmin is dead nutts accurate unless I'm indoors.
I've run several courses exactly as they are set up. Every time they are within metres of each other. 0.01km isn't anything to be worrying about over 5k.
If I run through a section that has trees etc... I just ignore the pacing over that section. When the satellite picks me up again after that section it autocorrects. Unless your entire run is in a forest this isn't a problem.
On my track sessions my watch clocks me exactly on every lap. Never had a problem. This episode seems to be a bit exaggerated or fictitious concern for 99% of the people watching this channel.
For most runners, I think GPS devices (watch or phone) do a great job. Of course there is a small error in the distance measurements. Is anyone really concerned about running at a pace to such a precision that a few seconds per km faster or slower is going to ruin their race? It seems doubtful. I find that my Coros Pace 2 gives reliable 1 km "lap times" because they are based on many data points, which smooths out the 'noise'. And, the longer distance you run, the smaller is the relative error. In the normal "run mode" on the Pace 2, the pace at a given time is delayed by few seconds, which tells me that the watch is averaging the GPS data points, giving a more reliable measurement.
I only take PRs from certified courses in a race. Plus, I use STRYD for distance.
Great video. I have seen quite different results in Strava and the watch. GPS devices are less accurate than people think, but I am impressed by the inaccuracy of Garmin, which is a GPS industry by default.
Just a point, GPS satellites work well in bad weather conditions (not as mentioned in the video); they are not affected by clouds, and that's one of the reasons aeroplanes can land down in any weather conditions.
You only do PRs in races. Not in training.
IDK I love going for PR's on strava segments. More fun than just doing strides imo
You only do World Records in races. You can get a PR with GPS because if 25 feet makes that much difference for you, you need to train for the Olympics. 😅 lol lol
@@Burps___ My 10 km PB is for example 38,21 minutes. Not a world record :-) It's an official timing, the course has been measured by a certain athletic standard. In my country they also add 1/1000 to the distance, so they add 10 meters, to a 10 km race. It's not some downhill run where my GPS can't find the signal and adds some distance. I even put uploaded the official result to my Strava profile for a personal best
But just because I like to view my personal bests in a certain, feel free to enjoy it when you get some notification on your watch. I have some strong views on this matter. But that doesn't mean they are correct.
@@jacobriis7859 You are precisely the person chip timing and measuring wheels were created for.
@@Burps___ They use bikes to measure the route. And they do it 3 times, If I remember correctly. It needs to be done in a certain way. Measuring wheels for a long distance run is impractical.
Funny how GPS being off by 0.05 miles bothers runners, yet HR is affected by *everything* (sleep, full bladder, nutrition, hydration, humidity, mental stress, etc) and yet runners stress on it like it’s written in stone 😂 😂 “What an awful run, my avg HR was 5 beats too high” lol😅
My son ran the Brussels 20km a couple of weeks ago, which is measured by a wheel at 20.1km. His Garmin measured it at 19.9km. The other factor is that most courses are measured along the shortest line possible (often a blue line) and unless your right at the front of the race or at the front of one of the packs that form, it is very difficult to run along the blue line because of the other runners around you. Most of the marathons I have run come out at around 42.5-42.7km. As you suggest, environmental factors also influence their accuracy. There are a couple of sectors on my usual course where my lap pace slows by as much as 10-15sec per km, not because I slow down, although there are a couple of rough sections and a road crossing which do slow me down a bit, but mostly because of very dense tree cover. In the end, these are regarded as recreational devices and a guide only. I try to run my TTs on the same course, thus giving me a reasonably accurate guide to my progress. Having said all this, not all races are measured accurately, the 2 local Parkruns can vary significantly from the claimed 5km, even from one week to the next. These are not measured every week, but the various turn around points are roughly known, but can be 4 or 5m out on any week, depending on who sets the course up. They are just a guide.
On a completely different point, what an exciting finish to the Comrades Marathon on Sunday, just 2sec between 1st and 2nd.
You make a good point about the way races are measured - it is the shortest possible route. So if folks are running to avoid other runners, they will not be following the shortest possible route. As you imply, best to allow an extra 250m-500m to get to the finish live. That is not device GPS inaccuracy, that is the runner's "shortest possible route" inaccuracy.
The reason that races use shortest possible route is because if they do not, any records set on them will not be internationally recognised - indeed, a few "World Records" have been disqualified because a route was just a bit short. Long? not the same WR problem (just less likely to get a WR).
What? No comments about various governing bodies on certified measurements of road courses? A USATF certified 10k course is 10,010 meters using their “Short Course Prevention Factor”. Courses must be measured using the shortest possible route…that is…cutting the tangents. In each turn the official measurer needs to be 30 cm from the inside of the turn….which has to be marked before measuring the course. So let’s throw this into the mix for further complications…
That being said, I live and die by the GPS in training and on race day--no regrets ever. I’ve used the GPS so much on courses measured by the wheel, USATF courses, you name it….and I know the error of my watch when I have a wide open sky. Talk downtown buildings are difficult, but that has mostly been a combo of watch and “feel” from using the watch in training. Point blank: figure out the error of your watch and also know that certified courses are 1 meter long per 1000 meters. And don’t trust the mile markers in a race….or even the pacing mats….I’ve found races that have their mats 100 yards before or after the actual “real” mile marker.
Also have to remember that you’ll likely run more than the specified distance if you’re dodging around a lot of people at more popular events! This is the reason some large events will paint the measured line on the road so you have so,etching to aim for if this sort of thing bothers you.
I just don't set myself a goal that I just can barely make. That way I'm not frustrated if I miss my mark by a few seconds. Like, for my first HM, I planned that I would be happy to finish under 1h45, I knew I could certainly do it. Come race day, the weather was perfect, I was well-prepared and rested, and I finished in 1h39:40. I was super happy and I had a blast during the whole race. But if I had set my goal to run under 1h40, I would have run under pressure, and the stress alone could have slowed me down.
Use Stryd footpod for distance and gps for drawing maps 😉
Measuring distance using GPS is a handy feature...but it's a little like measuring your height by substracting the distance between your head and the moon from the distance between your feet and the moon. It can be done but if you really want accuracy you should just measure the distance between your head and your feet.
My garmin gives very accurate distance. Vertical gain and loss and hr on the other hand are not and I don’t rely on a watch for those. Then again if you want to rely on gps when it is blocked from satellites like in between tall buildings or in a tunnel it’s not the watches fault. The measurement of a race is the course distance not your travel distance. Unless you are starting in the front and have 100% perfect line and no side to side movement at all your gps distance will be more than the linear distance of the race.
I have the same experience. The vertical gain on mine is way off, and HR is usually reasonably accurate within a few beats on training runs but occasionally it'll have my recovery efforts in zone 4, while threshold runs where I'm starting to burn toward the end will have it nearly entirely in zone 2. I look at the data for my amusement but during the run I pay zero attention to it and go by RPE. When it comes to distance, I have a few routes I alternate between, and it is extremely consistent in the mile markers to the point that I know now exactly when I'm going to reach them. Whether it's 100% accurate I wouldn't know since I haven't measured, but it's at least 100% consistent and would be easy to adjust to if I find out later that I'm actually faster than I think and am running further than the watch says, or if I'm actually slower than I think and running not as far as the watch says. It'd just be a matter of adjusting the paces to scale.
Awesome video! I found that where I live my Garmin loses about .25 miles for every 4 miles where live. From your other video I use Peter’s Pace pro to keep track of my pace when training over known courses!! Thanks again for everything
In the old days, runners used to wear a little paper slip on their wrist with handwritten pace/milestone details. Strange that this video does not mention it. If your plan is to cover a certain number of REAL kilometres (say, every 5) in a certain time, write those target times down, and "wear" them.
Just as important as the 8m/km, or whatever, watch variability is that "serious" courses are measured on the shortest possible route (so that "National" and "International" Distance Records are valid). Unless a runner hugs every corner and runs dead straight from one to the next, the runner will be running extra anyway (even if they are NOT even wearing a watch).
So ... best to allow for a couple of hundred metres extra at the end when training - because those "extra" metres will probably mysteriously appear on Race Day, even if your watch was 100% exact about your position.🤣
Can you suggest what metrics on your watch would you suggest on race day? Thanks for the tips, keep the great content
I run many wheel measured (allegedly) 5K and 10K races and more often than not my watch is spot on to the distance!
There's inaccuracies from the GPS, but there's also differences from how you run the course compared to how it was measured. Generally, GPS accuracy is extremely accurate and the real difference from not running the course the same as it was measured.
Love your channel and content! Unfortunately, the measured accuracy of some of my local 5K’s borders on pure guesswork, especially those 5K’s for charity. I’ve found the only way to be certain I’m running the proper pace is to go by heartrate. And I have to use a chest strap as the optical wrist monitor is not accurate for me. I will display both heart rate and average pace and only trust the ave pace when it matches what I know the hr should be.
Which models did you guys use? Watches from 5 years ago are not going to be as accurate as the newer Garmin watches.
The Garmin 255, was the GPS set to multiband? Unless you are under a bridge, Garmin's new multiband GPS is extremely accurate, even putting you on the right side of the road. Also, with the exception to sprint intervals, the pacing is extremely accurate. For tracks, there is track mode to give you to give you accuracy within the meter.
Got caught out on Sydney 1/2... My Garmin told me I was 1.5km ahead from where I was.... I had left some in the tank for the last 3km.... Horror of horrors when i lifted my head and realised that I still had 3km (formal sign) to go when Garmin was approaching 20km....
Yeah, inaccuracy on my Polar Grit X pro caused me a problem in the Dublin marathon last year. I started it just after I crossed the starting line and stopped it when the finish line was in sight (circa 400m) but my Polar told me I did 47.93km. Similar in Vienna for half marathon, not as bad but still 23km. My solution, use the course distance markers and write on my arm!
Thank you I noticed that on my Combrade race I nearly thought this is not my race only thing help me look at road indication but affected me
I use Soweto Marathon route as my long run route , infact ran 51 of them before Comrades all done in 3hr 30 -3hr33 , I'm getting all my times accurately.
How about multi-band GPS...any better for races. Also, what about lap mode (for some Garmin and Coros watches)...those autocorrect for a given running 400m track?
I use the Coros pod2, I trust it.
I just ran a 10 mile road race in Colorado. My Garmin said I ran 9.99 miles. Even in road 1/2 marathons, my garmin is never off by more than 6/100's of a mile. I think the technology and the gps signals are getting better.
My watch is generally off about .1 miles for every 5 miles I run on the road. On the trails with a lot of tree cover it can be almost a quarter mile off PER MILE.
Let him be man, he said you gps is lying to you and then he said imma use Strava on my phone 💀
What is your opinion on Stryd's accuracy when it comes to distance?
I'm using Stryd on auto-calibration mode. While it might not be accurate to the meter, the readings are highly consistent (for similar shoes). I'm more curious when you zigzag through the crowd. The lateral movements add to the distance covered too. Ultimately, I use running power for pacing, and use the physical distance markers to validate my split times.
This is really interesting. I bought a Garmin watch because I figured it was slightly more accurate then my phone. I think there are just too many variables for electronics to be 100% accurate.
The reason I use Stryd, is to get much quicker and accurate change in speed. Distance isn’t so important.
I've got about 15 measured courses which I always run. I measure them myself - easy as a cartographer using accurate orthophotos of my routes. Strava almost never gets it right, but Mapmyrun, Fetcheveryone, and SmashRun allows me to edit the total distance and time. Yes, mid-run my watch isn't going to be accurate.
Checking out Strava friends' data after the London Marathon i noticed pretty much everyone putting in a gnarly km30, a 3hr45 finisher putting in a 3min/km after 3/4 of the race for instance. Where is km30? Roughly the City Of London (financial district).
Can you guys boost the volume on your final audio mix before uploading. Very hard to hear what you are saying.
*runs a route completely shaded by trees
THIS IS WHY GPS DOESN'T WORK
I think everyone with a running watch already knew this if they run trails or in heavily shaded areas
I'm used to my GPS being +200m or 400m off from the distance markers
I have a solution for this. I run with a virtual pacer showing my desired pace. As I pass distance markers, I make a mental note of the difference between the pacer and the distance marker. So if VP is 10s behind (meaning GPS shows Xkm but I have to run 10 more seconds to reach Xkm marker), I will aim to correct to be 10s ahead for the next marker and so on. This way you can run the race very precisely even if GPS calculates the marathon 300m longer.
@@leonardmilcin7798 Oh my word this is genius 👌🏾👌🏾👌🏾 it absolutely makes sense
This seems like clickbait. Incorrect look at the comments, so many people use GPS with no issues, this is 2023 not back 10 years ago when some watches had interior GPS sensors. Obviously in heavily treed areas, under bridges or cities you may experience issues. I have a new Garmin 965 and it doesn't miss a beat!
I haven't heard a single person report what you've described, or experienced it myself in any of the contexts you've listed. Yeah there might be issues with instantaneous speed, but it averages quite well. This entire video is nonsense.
Research helps and to corroborate your stance. Try to remain respectful even if you are angry.
@@goitsemangmathebula683 Why would I be angry at a video about watch tracking? lol..
8 metre per km doesn't sound that bad to me
5k is 40 metres
10k 80 metres
22k 180 metres
Now it LOOKS a bigger number
BUT
how will this impact your AVERAGE PACE is minimal.
Look it like that, you ran 21900 metres with an average pace of 6, and for the variability factor of 180 metres you ran at 7
The overall average pace will still be a lot closer to 6.
And i mean A LOT.
So a machine is deliberately stating what it knows not to be the case, in order to gain an advantage? AI has come a long way!
I hate it when content makers make ridiculous CLICK-BAIT titles. So misleading, sure the GPS is not perfect it is still a perfectly usable tool. WRONG!! WRONG!! WRONG!! You can still use your GPS to pace, you just have to be smart about it!
So basically, its fine for pace. We just have to accept that the absolute distance may be a bit off (maybe a few % or so). I can live with that. Clickbait title or what?
Assuming that the watch’s timer is accurate, if the distance is wrong then it’s calculation of pace will be equally wrong.
@@derekrawlings1289 true but 8m per km is less than 1%, so I don't know about you but 1% pace error is in the noise for me
100%. I’m not disagreeing that this ‘problem’ isn’t actually a problem at all. My Garmin is accurate enough for me and I find it very useful. I was only commenting on the maths of pace being accurate whilst distance isn’t.
Lol. Useless advice. Your then choise is long 45km roller. Sure GPS has some deviance, but by few meter especially high end devices.
During the race your track already marked.
My goodness. Has your Davlin been at the beer? Sorry to break it to you, but I'm afraid you need to look the part. Apart from that, I totally agree about using tech in a race. In training by all means, knock yourself out. I am total advocate for doing the race distance in training. If a 10km for example, twice a month, a marathon, once a month. Its a race right? Are you doing the times to challenge for a top 10 finish? Winning it even??? If not, how else are you going to know for sure? If not, I am afraid you are only 'taking part'. If you throw back at me "aaah, but a full distance in training takes a lot out of you ......" Sorry, but nobody forced anybody to be mad and go for a stupid ultra marathon. You have to die for your art ..... or don't bother. I am talking racing here btw, not 'taking part'.
Honestly, you could/should have kept that first bit to yourself.
Regardless of personal sentiment, these professionals are trying to help folks in every corner of the globe. No need to 💩 on any of them for that. Just something to consider.
You never know what someone is going through.
Not even my Apple Watch series 4 was so awful that it was unsable, let alone Garmins or these other sport watches.
Best fitness/running channel on the web, period. Thanks Coach Parry team. 🫡💜
strava on my phone 🤡