Hot take - As a F2p I'm parked at 1340 and doing horizontal content, the problem isn't the honing rate per say, I think it's fine to leave it at a low chance for now. The issue is just the severe lack of materials and ways to gather them, my main litterally farms it's dailies and funnels into lower tier Alts due to the amount I can gather on it being a minute amount (500guardian stones just ain't it) that's required in order to pursue Argos and beyond. What appears to happen is people that get over the hurdle of 1370 are getting drops and harpooning whales for 150k 100k accessories, while that'd take me 2 weeks to farm. With that cash injection they can then funnel more Alts into 1370. Which is extremely depressing sitting on the edge and watching people above me get richer and richer while I can't quite speed up my progress without spending money.
I am going to disagree, why should they be allowed to create an artifically shit low system of upgrading, why not instead support a system that never goes below say 50%. Why does it have to graduate to literal fuck your own ass with this dildo because you will fail 20 times on this one piece of gear? How is that a defense that anyone should support? Just make the amount of materials greater. Just like how a quests says kill some frogs, oh you killed 100 frogs, but only 40 had legs because fuck you bad design... Stop supporting shit design. Come on man, even more toxic games have better systems. the BoTW clone has BoTW game play graduated to amazing level, again downgraded by the shit waifu chest garbage and the Navi fucking loser anime weeb fairy, but game play alone is stellar. Why argue they should tank all of that to make you fail. If anything just make weapon upgrades a random chest that delivers them instead. It would be identical, but less defensible for players. Why because the system would shit on itself. Lost Ark can hide because this type of system where you are "LITERALLY" guaranteed to fail 10 times, then 50 times, then 100 times, the outcome is the same, perception is buried in fanboy metrics because both are shit systems for F2P games. You can argue it is less toxic overall, but that only argues it is toxic and fucking yourself with a dildo. You already lost, the game was fun enough, but flawed beyond reason, because F2P and 80 currencies because fuck you convolution so we can monetize it later. There is no reason for it to be like it. And to argue this is less toxic then what BDO, that game is literally crouch down and fuck yourself, that is not a game your should compare yourself to because you are still fucking yourself. Less sure, but still fucked metrics for no reason.
I still feel like we need the honing buff now rather than later. Even if you add more resources to the game im willing to bet its only going to come out to like 1-2 extra hones a day. rates get really abysmal by the time you are at 1350. its still going to take most ftp people months of diligent farming if they want to see argos anytime soon. We should have the “wall” be after the current highest ilvl required content, never before. Yes the bad honing rates existed for other regions when they had argos, but there was a reason they changed it. It was because people fucking hated it, and were quitting the game because of it. Buffing the honing rates in my opinion is really the best thing ags could do right now that would actually fix this stupid problem they created for themselves. I really dont think the band aid fix they announced is really enough. I could be wrong about that, but I highly doubt whatever extra mats made available by this will actually end up putting much of a dent into peoples progress towards 1370.
@@xxxfirefart The content we had WAS the highest content available, it just so happens now it's Argos. What you're suggesting is that there be almost no grinding involved and everytime new end game content is released everyone is caught up to the entry requirements. Which is just stupid. And if you're not suggesting that and you think they should only do it for Argos that's even more stupid because now you're setting a false standard which your players will rebel against. Also AFAIK the extra mats announced will be quite relevant. Probably enough to 1370 after a measley 2 weekly resets. Which is then going to lead to a content draught.
@@XBezerkerX why is that stupid? The grind shouldnt be for content access, it should be for people who want to juice their characters beyond what is required. Gating players behind months long grinds just to catch up to people that pay 300 dollars is stupid
@@XBezerkerX false dichotomy. Just because we want more people ready to play new endgame content doesn't mean that they should wait for everyone to be ready. When argos was released only whales and the top of the top f2p players were ready. This is not the case in other regions. Not everybody has to be ready but a decent percentage is what we're after.
The argument, that low honing chances are ok, because Argos was the complete endgame doesnt make sense for the west. They are pushing out content faster then back then, so the progression also should catch up. Plus the west has less content to gain materials in general, making the push to 1370 even worse. This decision unreasonable promotes paying for more materials way more then in the other regions. People will not stick to the game if they are behind 2-3 patches worth of content, when spending a lot of time on the game. I really want to like the game, but a LOT of decisions they did for the western release are bad at best. Not releasing all classes, suddenly revealing T3 instead of telling from the get-go, not having a lot of QoL features (e.g. the checklist and the positional markers), etc. make me and many other people actually leaving the game sooner rather then later. If they keep releasing more and more content faster then people are able to keep up without helping them, they will leave. If they can do the new and shiny content when it comes out people will be waaaay less annoyed about the honing chances and all the other stuff that rubs them the wrong way. Amazon has a very bad track record with publishing games, a lot of people left when the server issues happened in EU and we had no communication from them, a lot of people left now because they felt Amazon just wanting that quick cash and if that continues they will hurt LAs reputation and player base even more.
Another problem is that the players that do whale and are able to do not only Argos, but Oreha hardmode aswell gets alot of stuff that we are not even close enough to get. The rich gets richer kinda thing. My p2w friend sold a legendary accessorie for 80k gold on EU yesterday, this is absurd. And by the time we normal players are able to do Argos and Oreha HM theres almost no profit left for us cuz the people who wanted the accessories have it allready.
Good input over the current state of western release. I think what went wrong is the overlapping between no honing rates buffs and less materials income. Now the gap between those that spent money to get to Argos and those that are still early T3 or T2 will only widen and create resentment due to being unable to access the new content after 1 month of release.
Hey Ohbenji, Just wanted to drop by to thank you for your videos, it's a great perspective to see how end game looks when one eventually gets there and get tutored by someone who's been playing the game for years obviously. As for the whole death zone, personally unbothered, if you play grindy games, you know what you're signing up for. Nobody knew how to get to 60 ultra fast when wow released back in the day and many new players gave up on the grind as well. I guess the "gaming audience" and their expectations of a game have changed with time and people expect more gratification then what they're getting. Please don't stop your videos, they're very meaningful to a specific audience in the west that wants to learn the game from a veteran!
30 dollars per chance when you are just min-maxing gear is a lot different than spending that much when you are just trying to be able to get in the door of the raid.
@@skyr333 yes, and the fact is they want us to catch up to KR asap. So much content so fast will bleed players with the awful wall before 1370. The problem is not the honing rates. We are starving for materials. Like the OP said, 3% chance on your final piece of gear for the foreseeable future is entirely different. You can't expect people to feel okay with an extremely fast paced accelerated release schedule without giving materials to support this. I agree that the Naruni racing event is a good start to inject materials into the game for players. I think if we had PvP vendor this entire time, with the amount of materials that it gives, it wouldn't be this big of a problem.
@@shiningview If it was a single-player game or one with seasons then yeah sure take your time. But getting to 1370 gives you huge advantages when it comes to gear and economy. That is really important for some players. Personally, I'm not in a rush, I'm enjoying doing islands and getting alts geared up, I'll get to 1370 eventually. I also understand the frustration of people who have played this game for over 400 hrs. Grinded like crazy because they want to experience the bosses and raids, and even they can't enter the newest content without spending money. That seems like a slap in the face.
@@shiningview this comment tells me youre nowhere near even 1340. because that 1340-1370 has been dubbed the deadzone for a reason. the "theres no rush" crowd are oftens times sub 1325 players who hopelessly believe the content is enough. try being at 1340~1355 for weeks on end killing the same boss and doing the same chaos dungeon over and over. thats not content. all the "theres no rush" crowd does is virtue signal to other people and feel smug about the fact that theyre patient and are somehow proud of the fact that AGS/SG are egregiously content gating to milk whales. how dare we ask for a smoother and more fulfilling gaming experience, right? fuck outta here
I spent months researching the game before NA launch and pretty much universally from all sources I found, the barrier of ENTRY to get into content isn't pay 2 win gated at all. i.e If you play a decent amount with alt you can get multiple characters to the latest raid. Pushing the ilvl beyond that is a completely different topic ill leave separate. Point is that is not remotely the currently case at all, I can kinda see your point with current player skill not being up to par, but it's irrelevant since currently you cannot do the latest content without paying, which is not what I have been told Lost Ark is in any other regions.
This 100%. It feels to me, that Amazon wants to quickly cash out when its fresh and hyped. Ive had sooo many ppl i played with leave because they feel like its not worth their time, if they cant even enter the latest content and progress slower then "new" content gets pushed out. They either should have made the western catch up to KR slower or gave us more material sources if they truely wanted us to catch up. They have done soo many bad decisions... If this trend continues the Amazon Grim Reaper for Games meme will continue, and i dont want that, at least not for LA.
People always seem to forget the most important thing when talking about this topic - Our version released in T3 - No one and I repeat NO ONE has their foundation properly setup to farm T3. Even most whales dont have 5+ alts in T3 which are essential for ur progress in this game. Yes I do agree that they could have taken it a bit more chill with argos and release it 2-4 weeks later and that they should have given us at least one or two more sources of materials for now. But point remains - the game is all about having alts and not only about ur main. The whole ROSTER counts towards ur progression. It is very very time consuming to build that roster up and unreasonable for most people in the short time we had the EU/NA version. But the game isnt about going in and out in a matter of weeks like some other MMO's (Looking at you FFXIV & Wow) it's a long term entertainment source that will take up the majority of your gaming time for a time. For people that just wanna rush and push hard that is truly depressing to watch as you are either forced to spend time in the game besides vertical progression or you have to swipe - but that is essentially the whole point of the game to keep you in there for the long run. You either like it or you dont.
Amazon Games does not give a fack about Lost Ark as much as they did not give a fack with New World which they completely destroyed. All that they care about is money. And when Lost Ark is going to be done then they are going to find another gold money. That is how greedy peoples think.
But there are f2p players that are at or around 1370. You must have known that also f2p takes much longer to achieve same goals. So NA is not p2w only you can still access the content eventually. Lost ark being f2p friendly does not mean you will access the content at the same time as others.
The rates aren't the main problem. It's the lack of content to catch up to the whales doing argos early. They needed to add the heroic guardian raids and the lower gear score abyss dungeons.
The thing is you'll never catch up to them. Never ever. Cuz if the devs make more mats avaliable you don't think the whales won't take advantage of them just like you? Forget about the whales, they live in a different world and they won't impact your game as much as you think.
@@jamzbraz difference between whales in KR and whales in NA/EU is that in KR, they whale to min-max while in NA/EU, they whale to gain access to contents. I personally don't care what whales do however, I'm, and probably many others are simply screaming for more contents because honestly, there's not a single shit to do between 40-70 other than Igrexion and praying each hour hoping that there are many 1370s to help you kill Moake
@@jolga1507 You're already at the top 10% players RN if you're here with us trying to reach 1370. It's the game we got RN. We'll get to KR eventually, so just chill, maybe take a break? The content is coming, the world won't end, relaaaax. My problem is with people treating AGS as if it's the worst publisher in the world just because they rushed the hell out of the game and hit the content wall. It takes a ton of work to get content to work properly between regions.
@@jamzbraz a wall before argos is shit. A wall after argos while waiting for new content would be fine. Ags has a track record of being shit so people are worried for a reason.
@@shgalagalaa Both are fine. AGS is not even the developer here, Smilegate has a track record of not being shit. It's a game, if you're worried instead of having fun, just quit.
You have a really good point of view and I agree mostly with all you have talked about. I just want to point out that the honing % is not the problem here it is just the whole situation surrounding the release of Argos at the current time, the Ilvl increase for Oreha (hard) & night fox yoho from 1355 -> 1370 is super weird and questionable. I'm unsure how it was for KR/RU but I heard that before the Argos release there were a bunch of mat sources added to the game so people were able to do the raid on day 1 if they were focused & knew what they were doing. However besides that the biggest problem of all IMO is the complete and utter silence from AGS on this situation besides the common "we're working on it" & "This feedback is definitely being collected and shared with our partners" it's creating uncertainty and makes people come up with their own reasons & conspiracy theories. Also another thing is (and I'm guilty of this myself) everyone has little trust for AGS because of what happened with New World, even though we should not compare the two, I but cannot feel worried remembering how bad that situation got out of hand. In the end we all love Lost ark and want it to become the best version it can be, this is why we are extremely vocal about this & hope that this time will be different.
"I just want to point out that the honing % is not the problem here" it 100% is the number 1 problem. 10% chance to do Argos stage 1 is a massive problem. and 10% is by assuming you manage to pass the 15% in +12-14. when we have to do honing with these dog sh1 t rates obviously we will run our of mats before we realize where they went. eventually we will have to upgrade with lower than 10% cause +15 will not be enough to increase item level. are you gonna say that the problem is not the honing %? the problem is the dog sh1 t honing rates and if you think otherwise then you're just coping extremely hard.
I think for the Western release having the playerbase not be able to enter Argos the frame it comes out is fine. The issue right now is that many people have questions and AGS is on this desperate tyrade of being COMPLETELY radio silent towards the community and sharing NOTHING as to what the future brings. That's where the core of the frustration is coming from because AGS would rather the community revolt against each other rather than simply tell us what is going on.
they said that they miscalculated that the playerbase will not progress in item level so the roadmap will be delayed cause they will have to make adjustments. how exactly this is not satisfying you when it's 100% reasonable?
Benji, thank you for your honest opinion. Nice video as always! I am just wondering one thing. I am really looking forward to Destroyer (I mained him on RU). But why is he concidered a bad class or as some say 'meme' class? Thanks!
cause not all classes are good equally. some are top tier, others are in the middle, and others are in the bottom. some class will have to be last. Destroyer is that class.
Totally agree on this with you benji. This is why I think they need to change their aim and go for updating more new classes. This will not change whatsoever the gap between the casual and whales and will satisfy everyone whose benn waiting to play a specific unrelased class
Idk wtf Amazon/Smilegate is doing rn… very strange decision. I love the argos release but wtf… no extra mat sources? Or honing rate changes to go w Argos? Just a shitty experience for those f2p players at 1355 or 1360 who feel like they have to spend real money. For a game that wants to link all the updates and have all regions updates be all together… they sure are making it difficult to get to argos. Especially if they want Valtan in a month. Our version is not the other versions…. We are behind… we need to have the buffs and extra mat sources early af. If this game is going to succeed for a Western audience… people want to be able to do stuff when it comes out. Some ppl play all day and have multiple alts and thats still not enough. Stuck at 1350 or 1360 unless u try hard the market and get lucky. Big problem. Just comes off like a quick cash grab/ whale bait. It worked for sure.
There's supposed to be content at 1355 and challenge raid/abyss weekly to help to get to 1370, dunno if you know about that or not. Kinda dumb but oh well. Tera was worse.
@@bread66611 ik… thats what I meant by extra material sources. Idc about other games. Smilegate knew better cuz they did the same dumb shit with other versions. Why make the same mistake again? Amazon needs to put their big boy pants on and stop caving in to negativity. Still no response cuz every time they post on twitter the top comment is always negative.
Did a ton of people come in thinking it wouldn’t be a grind game? This is my first MMO and I knew that I wanted to be f2p coming in. I’m taking my time and about to hit t3. I’m going to wait until lvl 52 before I start an alt. There’s so much content for a free game not including the recent stuff. Overall I’m having a blast on the journey.
I don't understand why people want to reach max gear level and end content as soon as possible, this concept still boggles my mind. This is a mmorpg, the shelf life should be a long one, people shouldn't be concerned about burning the shit out of the game this fast, I for one am enjoying the game as slowly as I can because I want to have a long journey instead of a short burn out of the content. This isn't a race for gearing up, this is enjoying Lost Ark in all aspects.... For me at least.
I wouldn’t mind the low honing rates if we had all the 1340-1370 content korea does like south vern, etc. I think it’s pretty clearly bad game design that my only content to do for weeks as a (mostly) f2p player is igrexion, chaos dungeon, and oreha normal. I don’t mind the grind at all, there just isn’t that much content in this stage for me to even grind.
Having 1% people accessing content and making shit tons of gold affecting economy and jacking prices for t1 and t2 certainly isn't what SG imagined for west release? Because that is reality of NA/EU servers... Your analogy with black belt is weak, better analogy would be that Lost ark is martial art, you earn it through training and improving your skills... YOU DO NOT BUY YOUR WAY TO BLACK BELT...This isn't the case in the Lost Ark. Bosses and Raids aint that hard as many people think... yet only 1% can access latest raid just because they have paid money. Low gear level =/= Low player skill Another thing... don't KR new players start from T3? Don't KR and RU servers have more content to gain resources from? I don't understand how can any company say these things then act this way and still have people defend it. "When we look at this in couple of months it wont matter" yeah, why bother with an issue in a game now when it won't be an issue in some uncertain future...nice logic
Thanks for your opinion! I agree that a lot of stuck t1-2 players don’t need a slingshot this early as they’re still learning the game - I do think a nerf to guardian raid HP could smooth their gameplay loop though… understandable to be frustrated a 400h/mo player cannot keep up without spending money - between race event, pirate vendor, and hopefully pvp vendor I think one more weekly reset we will see most serious players at argos
Bruh I'm a noob and my alt just hit t3 yesterday..... They want us caught up to legion raids for retention and they want to release content extremely fast yet we have the worst version of the game in terms of materials available and honing rates...
I think you completely predicted their response based fr their latest post. More tokens for exchanging and More mats & indirect honing upgrades thru books rather than giving a direct honing buffs.
i laugh so hard when i read "more mats". the grand prix event gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. for +9 i have to spend 475 red stones. at +12 and +13 i will need more than 500. the 500 red stones are 1 upgrade for the entire week or not even 1 if you're above +10. for the duration of the event we get like 4 upgrades or less depending your upgrade number. i'm gonna thrown a huge party. these events are a total joke. also, these trash events will not last forever. they will end eventually. then what? back to 0. we need the honing buff cause these events are not the solution when we get 1 upgrade for the entire week. and this is for 1 character. there's not enough for even 1 alt. it's not enough even for 1. they also said that the majority of playerbase are not even in the beginning of t3. the majority are in t1 and t2. if they want to make them progress the only solution is the honing buff. otherwise forget about Valtan legion raid. the majority won't even be ready for Argos stage 1. they have to release the honing buff.
and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation.
Thank you for this video! Seeing a different perspective is very refreshing and made me rethink the issue… However, it would be much better if Amazon said something, gave us some statistics about people who are still behind, just something! Better communication and some explanation. The biggest distaste is that it seems like Argos exposed the company for their greediness to make people push for ilvl and spend money and that, I think, makes people the most angry and worry for the future
Today they just posted a message to the players in the forum. Seems like communication is getting better. Was very happy to see this, Communication is the key
the grand prix event is an absolute trash straight for the garbage bin. it gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. for +9 i have to spend 475 red stones. at +12 and +13 i will need more than 500. the 500 red stones are 1 upgrade for the entire week or not even 1 if you're above +10. for the duration of the event we get like 4 upgrades or less depending your upgrade number. i'm gonna thrown a huge party. these events are a total joke but people get excited cause "more materials" but they don't know that these materials are nothing but scraps. it's like me saying i will pay you more money but i give you $1. what you're gonna say? "are you fucking around with me?". this is exactly what these events are but people are excited cause they said "more materials" and they think that these materials are enough for several upgrades per day while in reality it's 1 per week for the weapon and if your upgrade is below +10. the main issue in t3 is the dog sh1 t honing rates. when you are at +2 obviously it's fine, but then you face the 15% and 10% rates. then the rates are not fine. with these rates you will fail again and again and again so your mats run out before you realize where they went. and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 and even above 1400 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation. if we didn't have Argos the whales would cap at 1370 cause there's no point to go above +15 when you know you will get new gear and gear transfer and go down to 60% rates. then we wouldn't need the honing buff. but now that they released Argos and whales can do it and go above 1370 and 1400 we need it.
it's not amazing. the event is trash and will not solve the problem for EU/NA = Argos release. the event gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. i need 475 to hone for +9. this means 1 upgrade per week while i'm below +10. when i pass +10 500 won't be enough even for 1 try. and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 and even above 1400 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation. if we didn't have Argos the whales would cap at 1370 cause there's no point to go above +15 when you know you will get new gear and gear transfer and go down to 60% rates. then we wouldn't need the honing buff. but now that they released Argos and whales can do it and go above 1370 and 1400 we need it asap.
what i read up on that they try to release content that is doable day 1 for most active playerbase ?, but argos got released when just a handful of f2p players and whales could do it so i think thats the main frustration for people
Thank you for this in depth look into this issue. Its really nice to hear from someone who has experience and knows what they are talking about. Great video!
Your misunderstanding the issue of argos release. Right now in the western release whales and people who flip the market are getting a rich get richer scheme. There are a lot of players that are 1365 or something that are really good at the game but they can only get accessories that are worth 100-1000 gold. But the whales who spent a few hundred to few thousand dollars are getting accessories that are worth 50k-100k gold. Which if converted to usd in royal crystals is hundreds of dollars while the f2p guy that has 400 hours in the game and got unlucky and didn't reach argos only gets weekly accessories that are worth less than leapstones. It also doesn't help that whales and lucky players get weekly lockout legendary gear to get even farther ahead in gear. My problem isn't f2p not getting access to argos or the gear. It's the fact that by the time f2p get to 1370 the whales will already be so far ahead in gold because they just spent a couple hundred dollars and got a few thousand dollars in gold from drops
I undetstand in korea whales spend 100k to millions right now. In the west release you can only spend a thousand a day or something but it doesn't invalidate that the gear gap is causing a gold gap which is not fair when in the other regions a guy with 400 hours in 4 weeks wouldn't be ilevel locked to the newest raids
Totally agree. Coming from 1 of the players still in T2. My main is 990 and the other alts still in T1 almost got 1 to T2. I am full time worker/daddy and I don't play much (maybe 10-12hrs per week). I see LOADS of people in T1 content that have no clue still what they're doing and some in T2 as well although a lot less
Hows arcana? Im maining gunslinger atm and im thinking of switching to arcana when it release im 1352 atm and i dont know if i should save mats for arcana or just gear up my gs to 1385
My main issue is we didn't had time to level up alts and store mats, it was an extreme rush from 0 to 1370. I've been playing for 400h and got my main paladin at 1350 and my deathblade at 1325 and other alts are in T2, but if maybe we had a month to prepare for Argos, I could push my bard to T3 as well (she's 1000 right now) and farm on my T3 characters and easily be able to F2P Argos. Thing is, on this schedule we had, the deadzone wouldn't be so hard if we had the time to prepare to go from 0 to 1370.
You do have time to level up your alts, you don't need to get to 1370. Argos is not important compared to Legion Raids. Enjoy the game and play your alts slowly, it's not a race at all. I promise you if you play this game like an ARPG and not an MMORPG you will enjoy it way more than you think. People at 1370+ are people who have spent a shit ton of money or were extremely lucky/efficient with their planning. Enjoy the game at your pace.
@@naktheseal489 Exactly. I have no idea what is the rush. The game is fun no doubt. I have over 400h as well and I'm only 850 lol. I'm also leveling some alts and having fun doing that. I'm in no rush at all to get to the top end boss or raid. I mean for what. To just end up and do nothing left. That is the problem with western gamers. They want hard content but then complain that it is to hard. They want endless content. They get it but want to rush it in weeks not months. I would just say ENJOY THE GAME. THERE IS NO RUSH PERIOD. I mean unless you are as streamer and get money out of this, what is the purpose.
@@nopa9478 I'm enjoying the game. I'm in no rush at all to get to end game. I'm not running around doing nothing. I'm also leveling up alts and like i said enjoying the game.
I made it up to 1355 and just stopped, its only been out a month and already blocked by paywall. How can you release accelerated content path but leave old rates that were designed for end game? You cant compare to KR because players had many geared alts and other sources by the time they reach this point. Already game population down 70%
It is not Honing rate it is mainly material...many player left because there is no other way to get materials in order to retry. Steam stats show a lost of 127 K players. Most in the forum complain not from the honing rate, but mainly lack of mat. For sure, expectation of player were a bit high pertaining there are certain class that they saw in Korea and want to play them. Most of those that left are those who did not want to wait for that long.
Honing Chances are fine, the biggest issue is that we got no other content like you said. If we would have get atleast the PvP Vendor + PvP Season with the Argos release - there would not so many complains (still a lot, but not so much) I'm sitting at 1349 because my luck is terrible, i get every Item to 70-100% pity (i dont mind) where other ppl are more lucky. 🤷♂
the only thing that is missing for me at the moment is hard content. It is super fun for me to do a dj with my guild that is challenging but the game does not have that at the moment. The underwater abysall dj was fun when we did it on lvl but it only took like a few tries. i would like content that takes more time and practice to complete.
how are you ? I'm waiting for destroyer to come out in na since from the first moment it was the one that attracted me to play, you could make a complete guide of it as soon as you have time to know what resources I should start gathering I know that the destroyer is not in a good moment but I'm going to play what I think is great ;)
I agree that naruni race vendor should be buffed, but what happens when the event is gone? All players that reach the T3 wall after the event are screwed? Or is that when they implement honing buffs?
if there is SS tier then Paladin and Bard are SS tier. they are the most wanted classes in everything. i don't know about Artist(the 3rd support class) but if it's like Paladin and bard then it's also SS tier.
I believe a big problem with the western release was the islands. People got EXTREMELY entitled with the ease of progression till T3 on their first character, which made everyone "zoom" to T3 expecting to find some sort of closure which evidently we aren't even close to. We'll see what happens, interesting take on the matter none the less benji!
Reminds me of a guildmate of mine spending a little cash (200+) just to reach 1370 only to realize it's not worth it and he's still lost 20k worth of gold for trying to push so hard which he hasn't get back yet since he is unlucky not to get a good loot of accs on Argos P1.
People in the west (where I come from as well) complaining about low honing rates... I dont really get them and dont feel that. I dont have any problem with low honing rates in an mmo. I mean I dont have to rush and be maxed out in a month after release. I've met some people expecting to finish the game a month after release but a mmo is not a game you can "finish" like a campaign single player game. I have no problem not to be the player with the highest GS on my server, my focus is pvp anyway and in pvp there is absolutely nothing I can complain since everyone is equal to each other. Im waiting for rankeds, cant wait for it. Thanks for your opinion, I appreciate that and your honesty. I also didnt like the Nerfs that were made in the western version. The guardians were too easy in my opinion, I dont know how they could be too hard for so many people. I also agree with you on your arguments in this video.
when the honing rates reach 10% and even below 10% and reach 1% then i have a problem and i'm not the only one. trust me. i read lots of comments that quit at t2 without even touching 15% and 10% rates in t3. the majority of the playerbase are not even in the beginning of t3. the majority are still in t1 and t2 so those you say want to reach endgame in 1 months are the nonexistent minority so who cares about the minority? the majority of the playerbase are not even in t3(not mid t3 neither late t3. not even beginning of t3) cause they do exploring, etc and not increase item level to reach end game in 1 month like you said. the majority of the playerbase are not rushers. it's the exact opposite. the developers even found out that the majority of players don't have alts. not even 1.
@@SapiaNt0mata I know that people complain at much higher honing rates than I do. I am at 10% at the moment and everything failed for the last 6 Days, I bought like 6000 Guardian Stone Crystals and still everything failed. I am at iLvl 1356,6 right now. I understand when it frustrates people and also understand when the honing rates getting a buff. Its better for the game since most people have a problem with the rates. That I dont have problems with it doesnt mean I dont understand that it is better for the playerbase in general to get the rates buffed. The only thing I dont get is that people expect everything to be finished super fast. I saw a person in chat that was upset because a equipment part failed 2 times at a rate of 90%. I mean what does he expect? I will also not have a problem with like 3% success rate, my problem is that getting the materials is pretty fucked up at the moment since we have almost no source for them compared to KR/RU. If I wouldnt make my gold with the auction house I wouldnt even be able to up that many times I did in the last few days. So the arguments are different but point at the same problem, its too hard for people getting their gear upgraded for new content like argos. With T1 and T2 Buffrates I have btw absolutely no problem. at the beginning I thought "wow, for what did I do the research in the stronghold then" but now I just think its fair and I dont really mind. Catchup Mechanics arent something bad and I agree with that. But honing rates in higher iLvL's should stay low and it should always be a good feeling to successfully upgrade something rather than "how can I skip the animation I know its a success anyway". But we have to get more resources tho. sorry for the novel and thanks for your opinion !
@@loyalitaeter the majority of playerbase are not even in t3. a few people want to finish things fast doesn't represent everyone. if we focus on the minority instead of the majority then everyone on the planet are murderers cause murderers exist. in Lost Ark the majority are not in t3 and don't rush so our focus should be them and not those that want to rush = minority. to not fail 2 times with 90%? you may not have problem with 3% hone rates but when people rage quit for failing 5+ times in row in t2 when the lowest hone rate is 30% for +15 that you can go to t3 what you think will happen with 3% hone rates? you know very well. the issue is not the resources to get materials. it's the low hone rates that require to farm several thousands of materials to fail. you said it yourself "I am at 10% at the moment and everything failed for the last 6 Days, I bought like 6000 Guardian Stone Crystals and still everything failed". the problem is the hone rates that make you need several thousands of mats. you fail so you need to get several thousands of mats again. what should be done when the price of gas in the gas station is expensive just to be expensive and rip off the consumers? lower the prices. the hone rates should be increased. this is the solution. do you know why the hone rates are low? cause whales will swipe. look how much money they spend for Argos. just to rip off the minority they screw up the majority. do you think that this is ok? and it's not like hone rate is not mandatory. content is locked behind item level so you have to go through honing which is designed to milk the whales and punish those that don't pay. and later in t3(legion raids) the hone rates will reach 5%. and they will add 2 more legion raid with even higher item level requirement and most likely we will need to go below 5%. do you think the game has a chance to survive in the West with these hone rates? nope. "a good feeling to successfully upgrade something" i disagree cause new content is locked behind item level. i don't give a sh1 t about succeeding in honing. i want to do Argos. when i kill Argos this is where i'll get the good feeling of succeeded in something. the only reason that the average player cares about is to reach item level to do new content. not that they succeeded in honing. if you want "a good feeling to successfully upgrade something" then try to reach +20 full gear which is the max for now and later it's +25 with 0.5% chance to succeed. if you don't reach the max there's no feel of success. if you reach 75% on a race and stop do you feel a success of wining? nope. you didn't even finish the race even if you finished last. i never said to have 100% hone rates and every click you make is a success. just to buff the hone rate to a reasonable number that won't make players to quit. later in legion raids we have to upgrade with 5% hone rates. i don't say to make it 100% but with 5% hone rates the average player will quit. if they manage to survive the 10%. with 5% you will need 5-10 alts cause the amount of mats you need to burn until you get 1 successful honing is utterly absurd and since the content is gated to daily-weekly the resources of materials or gold with 1 character are limited. some players in the Korean version have 20 alts and no-life with 10+ hours so that they don't swipe. this is how they fight the low hone rates. do you think that the Westerners that are used to play with 1 character will stay for long with these hone rates + not making alts cause they're not used to? nope. i never think about myself cause this is not a single player game. you can say that 3% hone rate is perfectly fine if you have resources to farm. can you say that the majority of playerbase are also fine with this? no you can't. and there's no way that the average Westerner is gonna be ok with 3% chance cause there's 97% chance to fail
People really approach honing with the wrong mindset. Most people see the honing system and somehow still fail to manage their expectations. Ever planning around honings succeeding even if the chances are high is just setting yourself up for disappointment. At the end of the day it's rng and it only gets worse so if you can't handle that you should probably look for another game. Even with the honing buffs people talk about you still have these 1% chances at end game and if you plan to play this game for you to reach that point you better be prepared to accept that it is that way.
I think you misunderstood the problem NA/EU players are facing. 1340-1370 isn't just a honing rate issue. It's the fact that we run the *same* content between those levels for several weeks. All the 1355 content got pushed to 1370 without an explanation.
imagine at 15% and 10% or below 10%. i laugh when people think that this game will last as long as WoW and FF 14 in the West with these rates. players rage quit at t1 and t2 before they even touch 30% rate. imagine with 10% or lower. and they said(Amazon or Smilegate): "no honing buff. here are some cosmetics. have fun". t3 without honing buff will be epic when players quit at t1 and t2. Valtan with 1415 item level? 😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁 Kakul-Saydon with higher item level than Valtan? 😀😀😀😀😀😀 Vykas? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 Brealshaza? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 and there's 2 more legion raids that will have higher item level than Brelshaza. when we reach Brelshaza the playerbase in the West will be around 1k concurrent players. maybe 5k since it's NA/SA/EU. most likely it will be at Vykas.
Exactly! I agree that honing rates shouldn't be buffed. I have friends in T2 still who are struggling to fight even easiest guardian raids, one of friends who is about to reach T3 just skips all raids, she skips abyssals, she skips guardians and only does the turtle on occasionally because its the easiest. And someone like that is about to enter T3! Instead of boosting her through those bosses, I hopped on my alt so that I can run it at rec ilvl with her, but she didn't want that. And I know that if I just carry her, I'd be doing her a disservice so I don't do that. Anyway, we need more mats in T3 because our version lacks about 50-60% of ways to get mats, that KR/RU had at release of Argos. I don't want honing to get easier, I just don't want to work with 40% of the mats that I should've had.
If they were so worried about t1 and t2 players catching up with t3 players then why would they even release argos right now. All of the players playing on NA/EU now need to catch up to pay to win players cause they can clear argos and further boost their Item level leaving everyone under 1370 behind. You wouldn't need to worry about honing chances if argos wasn't available and t3 players would not have to deal with the honing rates. They don't need to buff honing rates, the big problem here is abyss raids and who are able to actually clear the content and how much they are rewarded for doing so.
cause they didn't calculate that the majority will do islands, etc. they made an announcement and said it. they had calculated that players will progress in item level and be ready to do stage 1 for Argos and then work for the other stages. this is how it's made in Korea. they tried the same but our players didn't go for item level but exploration, etc. now that they know what's going on they said that Valtan legion raid that would be released next month will be delayed indefinitely until they see that players are ready to do it. yes they do need to buff honing rates cause in t3 it's a nightmare. when you have to upgrade with 10% obviously you will fail. you run out of materials cause with 10% you will fail again and again. also, they said that the majority of playerbase are not even in t3. they're still in t1 and t2. giving more mats will not speed up their progression cause of the honing rates at t3. they have to release the honing buff. if they hadn't released Argos now they wouldn't need to release the honing buff, but now they have to otherwise the whales will progress while the majority are not even in t3.
the only problem is the legendary gear makes honing so much easier... so the people who get to 1370 get WAY further ahead. people are already 1400+ This isnt even counting the amount of gold they can make from accessories
@@bread66611 once you get the legendary set from argos or oreha hard you transfer your +15 onto it and it goes back to +6 but stays at 1570 ilvl, this means honing rates go back up to 60%
I respectfully think you are wrong. You seem to share a sentiment of keeping the playerbase grouped together, so you argue we shouldn’t have honing rate increases, but the same argument of keeping the playerbase together would be able to be used to say Argos shouldn’t be out yet, and especially Valtan shouldn’t be coming out in about 3 weeks
So basically, the problem stems from players who go so fast that think that released content should be tackled right away, and from players who are so slow collecting mokokos . The developer wants most players to be on the same middle ground but apparently here in the west we have an imbalance. There is definitely a problem with the release and the dead zone but it is undeniable that part of the problem is with the players themselves.
I agree, I think people are feeling like they HAVE to spend money to get to argos when imo missing a 1,2, or even 3 weeks of argos won’t be the end of the world. I’m 1355 ilvl with no money spent and I’m fine waiting until I get there without spending on gear
Destroyer in a bad place? I thought they used to be king of PvE. Was this never the case, or did something happen? Yes, the egregious honing rates coupled with starved mat generation is a recipe for disaster. Honestly, the biggest problem is the psychological experience of being told you're a failure X times a day. It certainly doesn't feel good seeing all your efforts go down the RNG hole and seeing FAIL, FAIL, FAIL. Many games operate in the same fashion: grind content to reach endgame activities. It's the conveyance of information that fundamentally changes the reaction from the crowd. I draw parallels to, say, Diablo 2 (for example). In D2, you farm boss after boss after boss for the chance of an upgrade. This can take days, weeks or longer for one piece of gear that's an upgrade. The difference is they don't shove failure in your face every chance they get. After you kill the boss, the item does or doesn't drop. The progression effort and time can be similar, but the way the game delivers the information is insanely different. Just something to think about. It's a well documented phenomenon that there's actual _regression_ in brain development when even arbitrarily being told you've failed. This has been documented in the animal kingdom and not just in humans. The cocktail of chemicals released in negative experiences is deleterious to healthy life. The two are not congruent. I am not saying that we should just win-or feel like we win-all the time; that's silly. What I _am_ saying is the vehicle for information is flawed, which is further suggested by player feedback and retention. Lost Ark is not for everyone-I knew that moving into our long awaited western release. I've watched all but two of my friends stop playing because of what LA is and isn't. The endgame really feels more like a gambler's addiction sim and idk what that says about myself that is still playing. Real weird because I don't like gambling.
Honing rates past 1370 are much higher so people who got to 1070 will now go even higher quickly than newer players stuck in early parts of t3. Everyone's complaining about Argos release being rushed and pushing people stuck in 1350-1365 to spend money to catch up.
Unpopular opinion as well, but i'm also kinda glad that there is "wall" here. I've been playing from day 1 for about 8~10 hours a day and playing multiple classes as I was finding out what to main. So in my effort to find a class to main I had to switch classes a few times at t2 and also once at the start of t3. Because of that, compared to my other friends who had only played 1 character from start to t3, they were pretty far ahead from me. But because of this wall, I could somewhat catch up to them in terms of content and at this moment, I'm currently about a few days away from Argos P1 whereas my friends have only done Argos p1 one time. Also i'm not too worried about doing Argos on day 1 anymore since Valtan raid is being delayed I don't believe there is reason to rush anymore besides maybe trying to make bank on the whales who are buying 1370 accs for insane amounts of gold that will become moot once Valtan releases.
The problem is there is nothing to really do at 1340. I can literally only run 2 dungeons that is it. Maybe if the game released with all characters from the start, I would work on an alt. Also you have to understand that perception matters, people wont give the game a second chance that easily. It took No Mans Sky years of good updates to reverse the fuckup at the release. While you have 2% honing chances, you can at least do all the content, we have to pay or get extremely lucky to do content in the first place.
Not saying there isn’t anything wrong with honing rates etc. But “maybe if the game released with all characters from the start, I would work on an alt.” Well the game did release with more than 1 class. It released with quite a few. And “nothing to do at 1340 other than 2 dungeons”. I HIGHLY doubt you have even came close to finishing adventure tome, island souls, moko seeds, etc. There is plenty to do and play. Everyone has to complain about something I guess but you didn’t make very good points…
Don't forget the accelerated release schedule here compared to KR. The dead zone really has no purpose here if what Gold River said is true about wanting to catch NA up to RU and KR quickly. The future of the game will be fine in the west assuming they can rectify the dead zone issue quickly - look at Black Desert as an example. BDO is a grind, that's all it is, and it is one of the most played MMO's in the west right now. Low success rates do scare some people away, however as long as there is a way to push through them that is not severely limited by time gating mechanics people will generally be ok with it. Introducing the missing resource-gaining activities, and maybe making the infinite chaos grind a bit less harsh per purchase would go a very long way in solving the issue. I'm not sure that an enhancement rate increase is really the solution, 15% to succeed is a huge number compared to TET to PEN attempts in BDO, I think it's good training for the severe % rate drop that is to come. The issue is the resource starvation that has stalled so many people out, including myself (1360) and the lack of any meaningful progression between 1340 and 1370.
I'll do the content eventually. It might be next month or next year - don't care. I'm still leveling up in late T1. The only gripe I have is the class I want to play isn't even released so I have to start over completely anyway.
Thank you very much for addressing this. The West seems to have a completely different idea of what "standard gaming" is among the population and also they seem to have the completely wrong idea when approaching honing which has led to this outcry in the international base. I also think a lot of them are just trying to cover for the fact they aren't playing nearly enough, refuse to make/play alts, and have been selling their T3 mats for 2 or even 3 weeks now and think "there's not enough" when they just aren't willing to wait or farm for even 1 week to earn it. That being said, we really do need more bound mats and avenues to get more taps at those lower chances (please PLEASE no more tradeable, bots are going nuts right now) if they wanted to accelerate us up to KR server current status. I still have no idea how the outcry is both "speed us up to KR' and "slow down the ilevels are too fast" at the same time. People gotta pick one or the other, can't be both.
Tbh I don't like how hard it is to get access to Argos atm, on one hand Argos right now is our endgame and it should be somewhat hard to get into, but on the other hand whales are just gonna buy their way into 1370+ and start making tons of gold, and also having to pay to access content in the first place feels pretty bad. I honestly don't care too much, I'm just gonna get all my characters to 1340 and sit there until the new rates and heroic raids and stuff are added, but I do think Argos was added too quickly, I straight up would've preferred no patches at all for another month lmao
The way how it is going on in the West the game is actually start to die if you exclude those player base coming from bot. Maybe in a month or 2, this will fall sub 100 K player. MMO players in the west are less forgiving compare to other regions. It always blow my mind that they know from experience the Argos patch was a deadzone but still release it. It is like McDonald going to India to sell beef burger knowing full well the cultural difference won't be taking with a warm welcome. Why do it if past data already suggest Argos is a bad patch ?
problem is there is nothing new to do post 1340 until 1370, yoho is now 1370 and also hard oreha, as opposed to before where they were 1355 content. As a result the push doesnt feel rewarding at all, low upgrade chance or not. IMO
The catch up mechanic in KR is designed for new players to get caught up to T3 content. What's the difference in the West if we'll be getting the same content a lot sooner and we are also new players. I understand you when you talked about how you basically bled your way and suffered to get upgraded before they implemented the catch up mechanics but it sounds to me like you want the West to suffer the same way Korea suffered with the low honing rates for so long. TLDR - Korea and West will be on the same content. Catch up mechanics in Korea but not West? Make it make sense. The game economy is fucked rn because of it
Personally I don't mind the honing rates or slow pace. I do mind how blatantly obvious of a cashgrab is the Argos release in the West. It's content exclusive to whales and the most hardcore of veterans. They could have easily delayed the release and give players time to build more infrastructure in t3. But nope, it's whale milk time. I'm sure they made 100s of thousands of $, but the p2w stigma is a death sentence of s Western pc game.
Gold River said argos would release 1 month after launch. We all knew it was coming in March. Not an issue. What makes it a cash grab is no honing rate buffs or extra mat sources like heroic raids and what not. THATS the issue. Also if they wouldve gave us a date for argos and pushed it a week or 2 later. Allowing players to at least know exactly when. Not a 1 day notice. We are playing catch up to KR
Lol p2w stigna is a death sentence huh? What is the most played MMO in the WEST??? a p2w trash game developed by trashier developers, ring any bell? The only reason why LA wont succeed is because of its Korean/Asian stigma. NA is big time racist and prejudiced af. They will be the biggest hypocrites, trash on LA for being p2w and will simply go and play another p2w 'western' game. Not saying LA isn't p2w, it is. NA gamers dont have the patience for anything and they give in to the FOMO. Any good business would obviously take advantage of that
@@HouseofGausss ig but it should still do fine. Ppl still playing BDO. Thats the most p2w game on the market imo. Lost ark is fun af and a good game. Amazon/smilegate need to respond quick.
I don't think some f2p players in western understands the f2p business model in the first place. They demand everything rechable as soon as the content release without spending dime. It is not even that it is extremely hard to do the contents as f2p player, it just takes a bit longer compared to people who swipe. It is kind of obvious in the sense of f2p mmo business model. I do agree that there should had been more honing material source between 1340~1370 with the argos release but the amount of whiners in lost ark is getting almost absurd at this point.
@@jaylee7279 cuz we arent other regions. If they wanna push us to legion raids as soon as possible then add the other mats in the game and give honing rate changes…no reason for them not to be in game other than whale bait. They made hella money thats for sure lol. Suck dick playing hella hours a day and still not making it. Ur losing gold every week by not doing argos. Imagine playing multiple characters and grinding f2p and being stuck at 1360 or 1350. Just a horrible experience. If u play the game a lot and be efficient you shouldve made it to argos period. Should have…if there were more mat sources and buffed rates. But the fact is u makenit to argos ONLY if ur lucky as fuck…swiped…or played the market.
The thing is, KR had way more honing material sources from the get go. Right now, playtime does not matter because you get all your daily mats in 30 minutes of gameplay. Anything you do after that doesn't matter. This means that people in the top 1% gearscore wise, who played over 400 hours, are still nowhere near Argos. The ONLY way to be there right now is to spend a lot of money and that's why players are frustrated. The problem isn't the honing rates, it's that they removed content on purpose to force people to whale. This isn't reducing the gap between players, this puts a huge paywall between the top 0.1% and everyone else.
I agree that in general low honing chances aren't a bad thing they have their purpose but what is annoying compared to the KR server is that we do not have the chance to get enough materials to brute force the honing we get enough for like 1 chance per day at these rates when people who spend money can easily reach 1370+ where 95% of f2p players have to wait and wait and wait to get enough stuff to then fail because of the chances, that's why I think that they should either release the missing content (Challenge Abyss, Guardian & PvP Vendors) or increase the chance because the people who don't know about the later content will quit simply because it currently seems way to pay2win to what people told them because we currently don't have the content in NA/EU that makes f2p more enjoyable for the broader mass of people due to lack of honing materials and low chances. Sorry if it reads weird English isn't my first language and I'm on phone :)
Yeah the issue is we have all of the bad things at the same time, Not only are the rates lower but the costs are higher AND the amount of resources are more scarce.. I wouldn't mind the current rates if we had either: reduces honing costs or all available content, We don't need ALL the things at the same time just give us something..
I also don't mind p2w games if people can just use it to skip content, Even if they can reroll and catch up to everyone else in a day i don't care. My issue is when people spending thousands are literally twice as far as the rest of us
In the end the biggest issue is the absolute lack of communication other than "we are working on it", For example the shop has been down all week on EU and no one is mentioning anything. Event timers in compass are still broken even though they were "fixed"
Hot take - As a F2p I'm parked at 1340 and doing horizontal content, the problem isn't the honing rate per say, I think it's fine to leave it at a low chance for now. The issue is just the severe lack of materials and ways to gather them, my main litterally farms it's dailies and funnels into lower tier Alts due to the amount I can gather on it being a minute amount (500guardian stones just ain't it) that's required in order to pursue Argos and beyond.
What appears to happen is people that get over the hurdle of 1370 are getting drops and harpooning whales for 150k 100k accessories, while that'd take me 2 weeks to farm.
With that cash injection they can then funnel more Alts into 1370.
Which is extremely depressing sitting on the edge and watching people above me get richer and richer while I can't quite speed up my progress without spending money.
I am going to disagree, why should they be allowed to create an artifically shit low system of upgrading, why not instead support a system that never goes below say 50%. Why does it have to graduate to literal fuck your own ass with this dildo because you will fail 20 times on this one piece of gear? How is that a defense that anyone should support? Just make the amount of materials greater. Just like how a quests says kill some frogs, oh you killed 100 frogs, but only 40 had legs because fuck you bad design... Stop supporting shit design.
Come on man, even more toxic games have better systems. the BoTW clone has BoTW game play graduated to amazing level, again downgraded by the shit waifu chest garbage and the Navi fucking loser anime weeb fairy, but game play alone is stellar. Why argue they should tank all of that to make you fail. If anything just make weapon upgrades a random chest that delivers them instead. It would be identical, but less defensible for players. Why because the system would shit on itself. Lost Ark can hide because this type of system where you are "LITERALLY" guaranteed to fail 10 times, then 50 times, then 100 times, the outcome is the same, perception is buried in fanboy metrics because both are shit systems for F2P games. You can argue it is less toxic overall, but that only argues it is toxic and fucking yourself with a dildo. You already lost, the game was fun enough, but flawed beyond reason, because F2P and 80 currencies because fuck you convolution so we can monetize it later. There is no reason for it to be like it. And to argue this is less toxic then what BDO, that game is literally crouch down and fuck yourself, that is not a game your should compare yourself to because you are still fucking yourself. Less sure, but still fucked metrics for no reason.
I still feel like we need the honing buff now rather than later. Even if you add more resources to the game im willing to bet its only going to come out to like 1-2 extra hones a day. rates get really abysmal by the time you are at 1350. its still going to take most ftp people months of diligent farming if they want to see argos anytime soon.
We should have the “wall” be after the current highest ilvl required content, never before. Yes the bad honing rates existed for other regions when they had argos, but there was a reason they changed it. It was because people fucking hated it, and were quitting the game because of it.
Buffing the honing rates in my opinion is really the best thing ags could do right now that would actually fix this stupid problem they created for themselves. I really dont think the band aid fix they announced is really enough. I could be wrong about that, but I highly doubt whatever extra mats made available by this will actually end up putting much of a dent into peoples progress towards 1370.
@@xxxfirefart The content we had WAS the highest content available, it just so happens now it's Argos. What you're suggesting is that there be almost no grinding involved and everytime new end game content is released everyone is caught up to the entry requirements.
Which is just stupid.
And if you're not suggesting that and you think they should only do it for Argos that's even more stupid because now you're setting a false standard which your players will rebel against.
Also AFAIK the extra mats announced will be quite relevant. Probably enough to 1370 after a measley 2 weekly resets. Which is then going to lead to a content draught.
@@XBezerkerX why is that stupid? The grind shouldnt be for content access, it should be for people who want to juice their characters beyond what is required.
Gating players behind months long grinds just to catch up to people that pay 300 dollars is stupid
@@XBezerkerX false dichotomy. Just because we want more people ready to play new endgame content doesn't mean that they should wait for everyone to be ready.
When argos was released only whales and the top of the top f2p players were ready. This is not the case in other regions. Not everybody has to be ready but a decent percentage is what we're after.
The argument, that low honing chances are ok, because Argos was the complete endgame doesnt make sense for the west. They are pushing out content faster then back then, so the progression also should catch up. Plus the west has less content to gain materials in general, making the push to 1370 even worse. This decision unreasonable promotes paying for more materials way more then in the other regions. People will not stick to the game if they are behind 2-3 patches worth of content, when spending a lot of time on the game. I really want to like the game, but a LOT of decisions they did for the western release are bad at best. Not releasing all classes, suddenly revealing T3 instead of telling from the get-go, not having a lot of QoL features (e.g. the checklist and the positional markers), etc. make me and many other people actually leaving the game sooner rather then later.
If they keep releasing more and more content faster then people are able to keep up without helping them, they will leave. If they can do the new and shiny content when it comes out people will be waaaay less annoyed about the honing chances and all the other stuff that rubs them the wrong way. Amazon has a very bad track record with publishing games, a lot of people left when the server issues happened in EU and we had no communication from them, a lot of people left now because they felt Amazon just wanting that quick cash and if that continues they will hurt LAs reputation and player base even more.
That’s why I think a road map would be super helpful to budget people expectations. But that might be counter to amazons intentions of making $$$
I agree. Our version is diff from others. WE are playing catch up. The game has been out. We need the QOL stuff from the jump
He literally says they should buff the hell out of the material rewards from the Naruni racing event in the video.
@@charlesswe2152 thats not the issue. We need the extra content and honing rate buffs. Period. They thought this event was gnna make this ok. It isnt.
Another problem is that the players that do whale and are able to do not only Argos, but Oreha hardmode aswell gets alot of stuff that we are not even close enough to get. The rich gets richer kinda thing. My p2w friend sold a legendary accessorie for 80k gold on EU yesterday, this is absurd. And by the time we normal players are able to do Argos and Oreha HM theres almost no profit left for us cuz the people who wanted the accessories have it allready.
Good input over the current state of western release. I think what went wrong is the overlapping between no honing rates buffs and less materials income. Now the gap between those that spent money to get to Argos and those that are still early T3 or T2 will only widen and create resentment due to being unable to access the new content after 1 month of release.
Hey Ohbenji,
Just wanted to drop by to thank you for your videos, it's a great perspective to see how end game looks when one eventually gets there and get tutored by someone who's been playing the game for years obviously.
As for the whole death zone, personally unbothered, if you play grindy games, you know what you're signing up for.
Nobody knew how to get to 60 ultra fast when wow released back in the day and many new players gave up on the grind as well. I guess the "gaming audience" and their expectations of a game have changed with time and people expect more gratification then what they're getting.
Please don't stop your videos, they're very meaningful to a specific audience in the west that wants to learn the game from a veteran!
30 dollars per chance when you are just min-maxing gear is a lot different than spending that much when you are just trying to be able to get in the door of the raid.
a end game raid in a month old game people is really crazy for a catch up so early
@@skyr333 yes, and the fact is they want us to catch up to KR asap. So much content so fast will bleed players with the awful wall before 1370. The problem is not the honing rates. We are starving for materials. Like the OP said, 3% chance on your final piece of gear for the foreseeable future is entirely different. You can't expect people to feel okay with an extremely fast paced accelerated release schedule without giving materials to support this.
I agree that the Naruni racing event is a good start to inject materials into the game for players. I think if we had PvP vendor this entire time, with the amount of materials that it gives, it wouldn't be this big of a problem.
I dont understand why people want to rush. Why should I care about 1400 if there is SO MUCH CONTENT in this game on the way to 1400?
@@shiningview If it was a single-player game or one with seasons then yeah sure take your time. But getting to 1370 gives you huge advantages when it comes to gear and economy. That is really important for some players. Personally, I'm not in a rush, I'm enjoying doing islands and getting alts geared up, I'll get to 1370 eventually. I also understand the frustration of people who have played this game for over 400 hrs. Grinded like crazy because they want to experience the bosses and raids, and even they can't enter the newest content without spending money. That seems like a slap in the face.
@@shiningview this comment tells me youre nowhere near even 1340. because that 1340-1370 has been dubbed the deadzone for a reason. the "theres no rush" crowd are oftens times sub 1325 players who hopelessly believe the content is enough. try being at 1340~1355 for weeks on end killing the same boss and doing the same chaos dungeon over and over. thats not content. all the "theres no rush" crowd does is virtue signal to other people and feel smug about the fact that theyre patient and are somehow proud of the fact that AGS/SG are egregiously content gating to milk whales. how dare we ask for a smoother and more fulfilling gaming experience, right? fuck outta here
I spent months researching the game before NA launch and pretty much universally from all sources I found, the barrier of ENTRY to get into content isn't pay 2 win gated at all. i.e If you play a decent amount with alt you can get multiple characters to the latest raid. Pushing the ilvl beyond that is a completely different topic ill leave separate.
Point is that is not remotely the currently case at all, I can kinda see your point with current player skill not being up to par, but it's irrelevant since currently you cannot do the latest content without paying, which is not what I have been told Lost Ark is in any other regions.
This 100%. It feels to me, that Amazon wants to quickly cash out when its fresh and hyped. Ive had sooo many ppl i played with leave because they feel like its not worth their time, if they cant even enter the latest content and progress slower then "new" content gets pushed out. They either should have made the western catch up to KR slower or gave us more material sources if they truely wanted us to catch up. They have done soo many bad decisions... If this trend continues the Amazon Grim Reaper for Games meme will continue, and i dont want that, at least not for LA.
People always seem to forget the most important thing when talking about this topic - Our version released in T3 - No one and I repeat NO ONE has their foundation properly setup to farm T3. Even most whales dont have 5+ alts in T3 which are essential for ur progress in this game.
Yes I do agree that they could have taken it a bit more chill with argos and release it 2-4 weeks later and that they should have given us at least one or two more sources of materials for now.
But point remains - the game is all about having alts and not only about ur main. The whole ROSTER counts towards ur progression. It is very very time consuming to build that roster up and unreasonable for most people in the short time we had the EU/NA version. But the game isnt about going in and out in a matter of weeks like some other MMO's (Looking at you FFXIV & Wow) it's a long term entertainment source that will take up the majority of your gaming time for a time.
For people that just wanna rush and push hard that is truly depressing to watch as you are either forced to spend time in the game besides vertical progression or you have to swipe - but that is essentially the whole point of the game to keep you in there for the long run. You either like it or you dont.
@@irritatedsock7221 speak for yourself LMAO I got 4 alts t3
Amazon Games does not give a fack about Lost Ark as much as they did not give a fack with New World which they completely destroyed. All that they care about is money. And when Lost Ark is going to be done then they are going to find another gold money. That is how greedy peoples think.
But there are f2p players that are at or around 1370. You must have known that also f2p takes much longer to achieve same goals. So NA is not p2w only you can still access the content eventually. Lost ark being f2p friendly does not mean you will access the content at the same time as others.
The rates aren't the main problem. It's the lack of content to catch up to the whales doing argos early. They needed to add the heroic guardian raids and the lower gear score abyss dungeons.
The thing is you'll never catch up to them. Never ever. Cuz if the devs make more mats avaliable you don't think the whales won't take advantage of them just like you? Forget about the whales, they live in a different world and they won't impact your game as much as you think.
@@jamzbraz difference between whales in KR and whales in NA/EU is that in KR, they whale to min-max while in NA/EU, they whale to gain access to contents.
I personally don't care what whales do however, I'm, and probably many others are simply screaming for more contents because honestly, there's not a single shit to do between 40-70 other than Igrexion and praying each hour hoping that there are many 1370s to help you kill Moake
@@jolga1507 You're already at the top 10% players RN if you're here with us trying to reach 1370. It's the game we got RN. We'll get to KR eventually, so just chill, maybe take a break? The content is coming, the world won't end, relaaaax. My problem is with people treating AGS as if it's the worst publisher in the world just because they rushed the hell out of the game and hit the content wall. It takes a ton of work to get content to work properly between regions.
@@jamzbraz a wall before argos is shit. A wall after argos while waiting for new content would be fine. Ags has a track record of being shit so people are worried for a reason.
@@shgalagalaa Both are fine. AGS is not even the developer here, Smilegate has a track record of not being shit. It's a game, if you're worried instead of having fun, just quit.
You have a really good point of view and I agree mostly with all you have talked about.
I just want to point out that the honing % is not the problem here it is just the whole situation surrounding the release of Argos at the current time, the Ilvl increase for Oreha (hard) & night fox yoho from 1355 -> 1370 is super weird and questionable. I'm unsure how it was for KR/RU but I heard that before the Argos release there were a bunch of mat sources added to the game so people were able to do the raid on day 1 if they were focused & knew what they were doing.
However besides that the biggest problem of all IMO is the complete and utter silence from AGS on this situation besides the common "we're working on it" & "This feedback is definitely being collected and shared with our partners" it's creating uncertainty and makes people come up with their own reasons & conspiracy theories.
Also another thing is (and I'm guilty of this myself) everyone has little trust for AGS because of what happened with New World, even though we should not compare the two, I but cannot feel worried remembering how bad that situation got out of hand.
In the end we all love Lost ark and want it to become the best version it can be, this is why we are extremely vocal about this & hope that this time will be different.
"I just want to point out that the honing % is not the problem here" it 100% is the number 1 problem. 10% chance to do Argos stage 1 is a massive problem. and 10% is by assuming you manage to pass the 15% in +12-14. when we have to do honing with these dog sh1 t rates obviously we will run our of mats before we realize where they went. eventually we will have to upgrade with lower than 10% cause +15 will not be enough to increase item level. are you gonna say that the problem is not the honing %? the problem is the dog sh1 t honing rates and if you think otherwise then you're just coping extremely hard.
@@SapiaNt0mata No the honing % is not the problem, if you are given enough mats the honing rates are irrelevant.
I think for the Western release having the playerbase not be able to enter Argos the frame it comes out is fine. The issue right now is that many people have questions and AGS is on this desperate tyrade of being COMPLETELY radio silent towards the community and sharing NOTHING as to what the future brings. That's where the core of the frustration is coming from because AGS would rather the community revolt against each other rather than simply tell us what is going on.
they said that they miscalculated that the playerbase will not progress in item level so the roadmap will be delayed cause they will have to make adjustments. how exactly this is not satisfying you when it's 100% reasonable?
I don't think anyone would complain about 1370 if there was no way to swipe to get it.
Benji, thank you for your honest opinion. Nice video as always! I am just wondering one thing. I am really looking forward to Destroyer (I mained him on RU). But why is he concidered a bad class or as some say 'meme' class? Thanks!
cause not all classes are good equally. some are top tier, others are in the middle, and others are in the bottom. some class will have to be last. Destroyer is that class.
Totally agree on this with you benji. This is why I think they need to change their aim and go for updating more new classes. This will not change whatsoever the gap between the casual and whales and will satisfy everyone whose benn waiting to play a specific unrelased class
lmao that deathblade is running sight focus! glad to see meme engravings being used in high level content!
Idk wtf Amazon/Smilegate is doing rn… very strange decision. I love the argos release but wtf… no extra mat sources? Or honing rate changes to go w Argos? Just a shitty experience for those f2p players at 1355 or 1360 who feel like they have to spend real money. For a game that wants to link all the updates and have all regions updates be all together… they sure are making it difficult to get to argos. Especially if they want Valtan in a month. Our version is not the other versions…. We are behind… we need to have the buffs and extra mat sources early af. If this game is going to succeed for a Western audience… people want to be able to do stuff when it comes out. Some ppl play all day and have multiple alts and thats still not enough. Stuck at 1350 or 1360 unless u try hard the market and get lucky. Big problem. Just comes off like a quick cash grab/ whale bait. It worked for sure.
There's supposed to be content at 1355 and challenge raid/abyss weekly to help to get to 1370, dunno if you know about that or not. Kinda dumb but oh well. Tera was worse.
@@bread66611 ik… thats what I meant by extra material sources. Idc about other games. Smilegate knew better cuz they did the same dumb shit with other versions. Why make the same mistake again? Amazon needs to put their big boy pants on and stop caving in to negativity. Still no response cuz every time they post on twitter the top comment is always negative.
Did a ton of people come in thinking it wouldn’t be a grind game? This is my first MMO and I knew that I wanted to be f2p coming in. I’m taking my time and about to hit t3. I’m going to wait until lvl 52 before I start an alt. There’s so much content for a free game not including the recent stuff. Overall I’m having a blast on the journey.
I don't understand why people want to reach max gear level and end content as soon as possible, this concept still boggles my mind. This is a mmorpg, the shelf life should be a long one, people shouldn't be concerned about burning the shit out of the game this fast, I for one am enjoying the game as slowly as I can because I want to have a long journey instead of a short burn out of the content. This isn't a race for gearing up, this is enjoying Lost Ark in all aspects.... For me at least.
스마일게이트가 이문제를 알고도 같은 패치를 했다는건 그 늦은 후발주자를 위함이였다는 설명도 가능하네요. 이게 사실이면 스마일게이트는 서양유저들이 이정도로 적극적이였다는 건 예상하지 못한거네요. 좋은 영상 감사합니다.
Thanks for the perspective!
I wouldn’t mind the low honing rates if we had all the 1340-1370 content korea does like south vern, etc. I think it’s pretty clearly bad game design that my only content to do for weeks as a (mostly) f2p player is igrexion, chaos dungeon, and oreha normal. I don’t mind the grind at all, there just isn’t that much content in this stage for me to even grind.
make alts
Bruh he just explained it in the video why some of those contents are locked and why it may be problematic to release them now.
Having 1% people accessing content and making shit tons of gold affecting economy and jacking prices for t1 and t2 certainly isn't what SG imagined for west release?
Because that is reality of NA/EU servers...
Your analogy with black belt is weak, better analogy would be that Lost ark is martial art, you earn it through training and improving your skills... YOU DO NOT BUY YOUR WAY TO BLACK BELT...This isn't the case in the Lost Ark. Bosses and Raids aint that hard as many people think... yet only 1% can access latest raid just because they have paid money.
Low gear level =/= Low player skill
Another thing... don't KR new players start from T3? Don't KR and RU servers have more content to gain resources from?
I don't understand how can any company say these things then act this way and still have people defend it.
"When we look at this in couple of months it wont matter" yeah, why bother with an issue in a game now when it won't be an issue in some uncertain future...nice logic
Glad theres some content on a different view point and your arguments were all clear and well done. Good video keep up the content :D
Thanks for your opinion! I agree that a lot of stuck t1-2 players don’t need a slingshot this early as they’re still learning the game - I do think a nerf to guardian raid HP could smooth their gameplay loop though… understandable to be frustrated a 400h/mo player cannot keep up without spending money - between race event, pirate vendor, and hopefully pvp vendor I think one more weekly reset we will see most serious players at argos
Bruh I'm a noob and my alt just hit t3 yesterday.....
They want us caught up to legion raids for retention and they want to release content extremely fast yet we have the worst version of the game in terms of materials available and honing rates...
NA [noobie] player here, I really appreciate your perspective/videos. Thank you!
I think you completely predicted their response based fr their latest post. More tokens for exchanging and More mats & indirect honing upgrades thru books rather than giving a direct honing buffs.
i laugh so hard when i read "more mats". the grand prix event gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. for +9 i have to spend 475 red stones. at +12 and +13 i will need more than 500. the 500 red stones are 1 upgrade for the entire week or not even 1 if you're above +10. for the duration of the event we get like 4 upgrades or less depending your upgrade number. i'm gonna thrown a huge party. these events are a total joke. also, these trash events will not last forever. they will end eventually. then what? back to 0. we need the honing buff cause these events are not the solution when we get 1 upgrade for the entire week. and this is for 1 character. there's not enough for even 1 alt. it's not enough even for 1. they also said that the majority of playerbase are not even in the beginning of t3. the majority are in t1 and t2. if they want to make them progress the only solution is the honing buff. otherwise forget about Valtan legion raid. the majority won't even be ready for Argos stage 1. they have to release the honing buff.
and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation.
Thank you for the video
Thank you for this video! Seeing a different perspective is very refreshing and made me rethink the issue… However, it would be much better if Amazon said something, gave us some statistics about people who are still behind, just something! Better communication and some explanation.
The biggest distaste is that it seems like Argos exposed the company for their greediness to make people push for ilvl and spend money and that, I think, makes people the most angry and worry for the future
It’s Amazon they don’t care
Today they just posted a message to the players in the forum. Seems like communication is getting better. Was very happy to see this, Communication is the key
@@Tenebris8444 give amazon your personal cellphone number so they can personally hit you up, i did that and changed my life
The main issue at t3 is the ways you get the materials. It's a good thing they released the grand prix event or else it would've been worse position.
the grand prix event is an absolute trash straight for the garbage bin. it gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. for +9 i have to spend 475 red stones. at +12 and +13 i will need more than 500. the 500 red stones are 1 upgrade for the entire week or not even 1 if you're above +10. for the duration of the event we get like 4 upgrades or less depending your upgrade number. i'm gonna thrown a huge party. these events are a total joke but people get excited cause "more materials" but they don't know that these materials are nothing but scraps. it's like me saying i will pay you more money but i give you $1. what you're gonna say? "are you fucking around with me?". this is exactly what these events are but people are excited cause they said "more materials" and they think that these materials are enough for several upgrades per day while in reality it's 1 per week for the weapon and if your upgrade is below +10.
the main issue in t3 is the dog sh1 t honing rates. when you are at +2 obviously it's fine, but then you face the 15% and 10% rates. then the rates are not fine. with these rates you will fail again and again and again so your mats run out before you realize where they went. and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 and even above 1400 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation. if we didn't have Argos the whales would cap at 1370 cause there's no point to go above +15 when you know you will get new gear and gear transfer and go down to 60% rates. then we wouldn't need the honing buff. but now that they released Argos and whales can do it and go above 1370 and 1400 we need it.
Your prediction of upcoming updates and Smilegate's intentions in this video was exactly right! It was proved today. It's so amazing!!
it's not amazing. the event is trash and will not solve the problem for EU/NA = Argos release. the event gives 500 red stones. not per day. per week. i need 475 to hone for +9. this means 1 upgrade per week while i'm below +10. when i pass +10 500 won't be enough even for 1 try. and now that whales have reached Argos and can transfer their +15 with Argos gear and go back to 60% rates and increase their item level above 1370 and even above 1400 the gap of those that pay vs those that don't pay will increase even more. more mats from these trash events is not enough. now only the honing buff can save the situation. if we didn't have Argos the whales would cap at 1370 cause there's no point to go above +15 when you know you will get new gear and gear transfer and go down to 60% rates. then we wouldn't need the honing buff. but now that they released Argos and whales can do it and go above 1370 and 1400 we need it asap.
oh great one, Benji the messiah. please forgive our transgressions
Thank you for the video, great opinion
what i read up on that they try to release content that is doable day 1 for most active playerbase ?, but argos got released when just a handful of f2p players and whales could do it so i think thats the main frustration for people
OHBENJI GIGACHAD DESTROYER ENJOYER WE LOVE YOU MAN, GLAD I FOUND YOUR CHANNEL
Thank you for this in depth look into this issue. Its really nice to hear from someone who has experience and knows what they are talking about. Great video!
Worst part about this low rates is that there is no content between 1340 and 1370
The only thing i fear is if they decide to drip feed skins and CLASSES to us. 1skin and 1class every 2/3months would be a big oof
wait...that's literally every game. The only difference is that we know what we're gonna get and the west is impatient as fuck.
Your misunderstanding the issue of argos release. Right now in the western release whales and people who flip the market are getting a rich get richer scheme. There are a lot of players that are 1365 or something that are really good at the game but they can only get accessories that are worth 100-1000 gold. But the whales who spent a few hundred to few thousand dollars are getting accessories that are worth 50k-100k gold. Which if converted to usd in royal crystals is hundreds of dollars while the f2p guy that has 400 hours in the game and got unlucky and didn't reach argos only gets weekly accessories that are worth less than leapstones. It also doesn't help that whales and lucky players get weekly lockout legendary gear to get even farther ahead in gear.
My problem isn't f2p not getting access to argos or the gear. It's the fact that by the time f2p get to 1370 the whales will already be so far ahead in gold because they just spent a couple hundred dollars and got a few thousand dollars in gold from drops
I undetstand in korea whales spend 100k to millions right now. In the west release you can only spend a thousand a day or something but it doesn't invalidate that the gear gap is causing a gold gap which is not fair when in the other regions a guy with 400 hours in 4 weeks wouldn't be ilevel locked to the newest raids
Looks like smilegate and Amazon are fixing the honing material issue next week so the game is saved in the west from pay to win
Totally agree. Coming from 1 of the players still in T2. My main is 990 and the other alts still in T1 almost got 1 to T2. I am full time worker/daddy and I don't play much (maybe 10-12hrs per week). I see LOADS of people in T1 content that have no clue still what they're doing and some in T2 as well although a lot less
the difference is that +24 weapons are super endgame and afaik aren't a requirement to do raids on release the way 1370 is for argos on eu rn.
Hows arcana? Im maining gunslinger atm and im thinking of switching to arcana when it release im 1352 atm and i dont know if i should save mats for arcana or just gear up my gs to 1385
My main issue is we didn't had time to level up alts and store mats, it was an extreme rush from 0 to 1370. I've been playing for 400h and got my main paladin at 1350 and my deathblade at 1325 and other alts are in T2, but if maybe we had a month to prepare for Argos, I could push my bard to T3 as well (she's 1000 right now) and farm on my T3 characters and easily be able to F2P Argos. Thing is, on this schedule we had, the deadzone wouldn't be so hard if we had the time to prepare to go from 0 to 1370.
You do have time to level up your alts, you don't need to get to 1370. Argos is not important compared to Legion Raids. Enjoy the game and play your alts slowly, it's not a race at all. I promise you if you play this game like an ARPG and not an MMORPG you will enjoy it way more than you think. People at 1370+ are people who have spent a shit ton of money or were extremely lucky/efficient with their planning. Enjoy the game at your pace.
@@naktheseal489 Exactly. I have no idea what is the rush. The game is fun no doubt. I have over 400h as well and I'm only 850 lol. I'm also leveling some alts and having fun doing that. I'm in no rush at all to get to the top end boss or raid. I mean for what. To just end up and do nothing left. That is the problem with western gamers. They want hard content but then complain that it is to hard. They want endless content. They get it but want to rush it in weeks not months. I would just say ENJOY THE GAME. THERE IS NO RUSH PERIOD. I mean unless you are as streamer and get money out of this, what is the purpose.
Yeah, same. I got almost 400 hours and I'm 1360, with 5 tier 2 alts. If even hardcore players can't join the raid then it's a problem
@@arod077 no shot your 850 ilvl with 400 hr what do you do run around and do nothing?
@@nopa9478 I'm enjoying the game. I'm in no rush at all to get to end game. I'm not running around doing nothing. I'm also leveling up alts and like i said enjoying the game.
The madlad actually called it lmao
Thanks for you input on the game, btw why does UA-cam think this is Diablo 3? xD
I made it up to 1355 and just stopped, its only been out a month and already blocked by paywall. How can you release accelerated content path but leave old rates that were designed for end game? You cant compare to KR because players had many geared alts and other sources by the time they reach this point. Already game population down 70%
It is not Honing rate it is mainly material...many player left because there is no other way to get materials in order to retry. Steam stats show a lost of 127 K players. Most in the forum complain not from the honing rate, but mainly lack of mat. For sure, expectation of player were a bit high pertaining there are certain class that they saw in Korea and want to play them. Most of those that left are those who did not want to wait for that long.
Honing Chances are fine, the biggest issue is that we got no other content like you said.
If we would have get atleast the PvP Vendor + PvP Season with the Argos release - there would not so many complains (still a lot, but not so much)
I'm sitting at 1349 because my luck is terrible, i get every Item to 70-100% pity (i dont mind) where other ppl are more lucky. 🤷♂
the only thing that is missing for me at the moment is hard content. It is super fun for me to do a dj with my guild that is challenging but the game does not have that at the moment. The underwater abysall dj was fun when we did it on lvl but it only took like a few tries. i would like content that takes more time and practice to complete.
OHBENJI GIGACHAD
how are you ? I'm waiting for destroyer to come out in na since from the first moment it was the one that attracted me to play, you could make a complete guide of it as soon as you have time to know what resources I should start gathering
I know that the destroyer is not in a good moment but I'm going to play what I think is great ;)
i just saw you in my feed. i totally agree with you.
also, congrats on the weapon upgrade !
do gems count in the new guardian raids?
I agree that naruni race vendor should be buffed, but what happens when the event is gone? All players that reach the T3 wall after the event are screwed? Or is that when they implement honing buffs?
After the event, the next event will start again.
just curious but in the KR version, are SS class really rare too? would be they be welcome for late raids like this?
if there is SS tier then Paladin and Bard are SS tier. they are the most wanted classes in everything. i don't know about Artist(the 3rd support class) but if it's like Paladin and bard then it's also SS tier.
@@SapiaNt0mata SS= Sharp Shooter class
I believe a big problem with the western release was the islands. People got EXTREMELY entitled with the ease of progression till T3 on their first character, which made everyone "zoom" to T3 expecting to find some sort of closure which evidently we aren't even close to. We'll see what happens, interesting take on the matter none the less benji!
Reminds me of a guildmate of mine spending a little cash (200+) just to reach 1370 only to realize it's not worth it and he's still lost 20k worth of gold for trying to push so hard which he hasn't get back yet since he is unlucky not to get a good loot of accs on Argos P1.
People in the west (where I come from as well) complaining about low honing rates... I dont really get them and dont feel that. I dont have any problem with low honing rates in an mmo. I mean I dont have to rush and be maxed out in a month after release. I've met some people expecting to finish the game a month after release but a mmo is not a game you can "finish" like a campaign single player game. I have no problem not to be the player with the highest GS on my server, my focus is pvp anyway and in pvp there is absolutely nothing I can complain since everyone is equal to each other. Im waiting for rankeds, cant wait for it. Thanks for your opinion, I appreciate that and your honesty.
I also didnt like the Nerfs that were made in the western version. The guardians were too easy in my opinion, I dont know how they could be too hard for so many people.
I also agree with you on your arguments in this video.
when the honing rates reach 10% and even below 10% and reach 1% then i have a problem and i'm not the only one. trust me. i read lots of comments that quit at t2 without even touching 15% and 10% rates in t3.
the majority of the playerbase are not even in the beginning of t3. the majority are still in t1 and t2 so those you say want to reach endgame in 1 months are the nonexistent minority so who cares about the minority?
the majority of the playerbase are not even in t3(not mid t3 neither late t3. not even beginning of t3) cause they do exploring, etc and not increase item level to reach end game in 1 month like you said. the majority of the playerbase are not rushers. it's the exact opposite. the developers even found out that the majority of players don't have alts. not even 1.
@@SapiaNt0mata I know that people complain at much higher honing rates than I do. I am at 10% at the moment and everything failed for the last 6 Days, I bought like 6000 Guardian Stone Crystals and still everything failed. I am at iLvl 1356,6 right now. I understand when it frustrates people and also understand when the honing rates getting a buff. Its better for the game since most people have a problem with the rates. That I dont have problems with it doesnt mean I dont understand that it is better for the playerbase in general to get the rates buffed. The only thing I dont get is that people expect everything to be finished super fast. I saw a person in chat that was upset because a equipment part failed 2 times at a rate of 90%. I mean what does he expect? I will also not have a problem with like 3% success rate, my problem is that getting the materials is pretty fucked up at the moment since we have almost no source for them compared to KR/RU. If I wouldnt make my gold with the auction house I wouldnt even be able to up that many times I did in the last few days. So the arguments are different but point at the same problem, its too hard for people getting their gear upgraded for new content like argos. With T1 and T2 Buffrates I have btw absolutely no problem. at the beginning I thought "wow, for what did I do the research in the stronghold then" but now I just think its fair and I dont really mind. Catchup Mechanics arent something bad and I agree with that. But honing rates in higher iLvL's should stay low and it should always be a good feeling to successfully upgrade something rather than "how can I skip the animation I know its a success anyway". But we have to get more resources tho.
sorry for the novel and thanks for your opinion !
@@loyalitaeter the majority of playerbase are not even in t3. a few people want to finish things fast doesn't represent everyone. if we focus on the minority instead of the majority then everyone on the planet are murderers cause murderers exist. in Lost Ark the majority are not in t3 and don't rush so our focus should be them and not those that want to rush = minority.
to not fail 2 times with 90%?
you may not have problem with 3% hone rates but when people rage quit for failing 5+ times in row in t2 when the lowest hone rate is 30% for +15 that you can go to t3 what you think will happen with 3% hone rates? you know very well.
the issue is not the resources to get materials. it's the low hone rates that require to farm several thousands of materials to fail. you said it yourself "I am at 10% at the moment and everything failed for the last 6 Days, I bought like 6000 Guardian Stone Crystals and still everything failed". the problem is the hone rates that make you need several thousands of mats. you fail so you need to get several thousands of mats again. what should be done when the price of gas in the gas station is expensive just to be expensive and rip off the consumers? lower the prices. the hone rates should be increased. this is the solution. do you know why the hone rates are low? cause whales will swipe. look how much money they spend for Argos. just to rip off the minority they screw up the majority. do you think that this is ok? and it's not like hone rate is not mandatory. content is locked behind item level so you have to go through honing which is designed to milk the whales and punish those that don't pay.
and later in t3(legion raids) the hone rates will reach 5%. and they will add 2 more legion raid with even higher item level requirement and most likely we will need to go below 5%. do you think the game has a chance to survive in the West with these hone rates? nope.
"a good feeling to successfully upgrade something" i disagree cause new content is locked behind item level. i don't give a sh1 t about succeeding in honing. i want to do Argos. when i kill Argos this is where i'll get the good feeling of succeeded in something. the only reason that the average player cares about is to reach item level to do new content. not that they succeeded in honing. if you want "a good feeling to successfully upgrade something" then try to reach +20 full gear which is the max for now and later it's +25 with 0.5% chance to succeed. if you don't reach the max there's no feel of success. if you reach 75% on a race and stop do you feel a success of wining? nope. you didn't even finish the race even if you finished last.
i never said to have 100% hone rates and every click you make is a success. just to buff the hone rate to a reasonable number that won't make players to quit. later in legion raids we have to upgrade with 5% hone rates. i don't say to make it 100% but with 5% hone rates the average player will quit. if they manage to survive the 10%. with 5% you will need 5-10 alts cause the amount of mats you need to burn until you get 1 successful honing is utterly absurd and since the content is gated to daily-weekly the resources of materials or gold with 1 character are limited. some players in the Korean version have 20 alts and no-life with 10+ hours so that they don't swipe. this is how they fight the low hone rates. do you think that the Westerners that are used to play with 1 character will stay for long with these hone rates + not making alts cause they're not used to? nope.
i never think about myself cause this is not a single player game. you can say that 3% hone rate is perfectly fine if you have resources to farm. can you say that the majority of playerbase are also fine with this? no you can't. and there's no way that the average Westerner is gonna be ok with 3% chance cause there's 97% chance to fail
exactly what ive been thinking...people r just rushing for no reason and comparing themselves to others...its more of a life lesson they need to learn
We just needed like 10% honing increase and 1-2 more weeks
Thank you
I’ll be pushing 1370 once I get my fourth T3.
Just been parked at 1340 on my Gunslinger while doing collectables and raising alts.
People really approach honing with the wrong mindset. Most people see the honing system and somehow still fail to manage their expectations. Ever planning around honings succeeding even if the chances are high is just setting yourself up for disappointment. At the end of the day it's rng and it only gets worse so if you can't handle that you should probably look for another game. Even with the honing buffs people talk about you still have these 1% chances at end game and if you plan to play this game for you to reach that point you better be prepared to accept that it is that way.
I think you misunderstood the problem NA/EU players are facing. 1340-1370 isn't just a honing rate issue. It's the fact that we run the *same* content between those levels for several weeks. All the 1355 content got pushed to 1370 without an explanation.
I have the same fear about people quitting when the game gets harder if they're now raging because 50% chances, actually crazy
imagine at 15% and 10% or below 10%. i laugh when people think that this game will last as long as WoW and FF 14 in the West with these rates. players rage quit at t1 and t2 before they even touch 30% rate. imagine with 10% or lower. and they said(Amazon or Smilegate): "no honing buff. here are some cosmetics. have fun". t3 without honing buff will be epic when players quit at t1 and t2. Valtan with 1415 item level? 😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁
Kakul-Saydon with higher item level than Valtan? 😀😀😀😀😀😀
Vykas? 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Brealshaza? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
and there's 2 more legion raids that will have higher item level than Brelshaza. when we reach Brelshaza the playerbase in the West will be around 1k concurrent players. maybe 5k since it's NA/SA/EU. most likely it will be at Vykas.
Exactly! I agree that honing rates shouldn't be buffed. I have friends in T2 still who are struggling to fight even easiest guardian raids, one of friends who is about to reach T3 just skips all raids, she skips abyssals, she skips guardians and only does the turtle on occasionally because its the easiest. And someone like that is about to enter T3!
Instead of boosting her through those bosses, I hopped on my alt so that I can run it at rec ilvl with her, but she didn't want that. And I know that if I just carry her, I'd be doing her a disservice so I don't do that.
Anyway, we need more mats in T3 because our version lacks about 50-60% of ways to get mats, that KR/RU had at release of Argos. I don't want honing to get easier, I just don't want to work with 40% of the mats that I should've had.
praise ohbenji
If they were so worried about t1 and t2 players catching up with t3 players then why would they even release argos right now. All of the players playing on NA/EU now need to catch up to pay to win players cause they can clear argos and further boost their Item level leaving everyone under 1370 behind. You wouldn't need to worry about honing chances if argos wasn't available and t3 players would not have to deal with the honing rates. They don't need to buff honing rates, the big problem here is abyss raids and who are able to actually clear the content and how much they are rewarded for doing so.
cause they didn't calculate that the majority will do islands, etc. they made an announcement and said it. they had calculated that players will progress in item level and be ready to do stage 1 for Argos and then work for the other stages. this is how it's made in Korea. they tried the same but our players didn't go for item level but exploration, etc. now that they know what's going on they said that Valtan legion raid that would be released next month will be delayed indefinitely until they see that players are ready to do it.
yes they do need to buff honing rates cause in t3 it's a nightmare. when you have to upgrade with 10% obviously you will fail. you run out of materials cause with 10% you will fail again and again. also, they said that the majority of playerbase are not even in t3. they're still in t1 and t2. giving more mats will not speed up their progression cause of the honing rates at t3. they have to release the honing buff. if they hadn't released Argos now they wouldn't need to release the honing buff, but now they have to otherwise the whales will progress while the majority are not even in t3.
I have no idea what's going on here.
I just have so much fun playing this game and really don't care :D
Great video!
good old benji doing his thing, ur the man bro
can you share you build for lancemaster, pretty please?
the only problem is the legendary gear makes honing so much easier... so the people who get to 1370 get WAY further ahead. people are already 1400+
This isnt even counting the amount of gold they can make from accessories
How's legendary gear easier to hone? I am sitting at 1340 for now, curious how it becomes "easier" though as it's already easy.
@@bread66611 it resets to 60% after you transfer
@@bread66611 once you get the legendary set from argos or oreha hard you transfer your +15 onto it and it goes back to +6 but stays at 1570 ilvl, this means honing rates go back up to 60%
I respectfully think you are wrong. You seem to share a sentiment of keeping the playerbase grouped together, so you argue we shouldn’t have honing rate increases, but the same argument of keeping the playerbase together would be able to be used to say Argos shouldn’t be out yet, and especially Valtan shouldn’t be coming out in about 3 weeks
I dont know if a casual player with only 1 character can keep up with this game 😔
So basically, the problem stems from players who go so fast that think that released content should be tackled right away, and from players who are so slow collecting mokokos . The developer wants most players to be on the same middle ground but apparently here in the west we have an imbalance. There is definitely a problem with the release and the dead zone but it is undeniable that part of the problem is with the players themselves.
I agree, I think people are feeling like they HAVE to spend money to get to argos when imo missing a 1,2, or even 3 weeks of argos won’t be the end of the world. I’m 1355 ilvl with no money spent and I’m fine waiting until I get there without spending on gear
The question is, can you get to 1370 from 1355 in 3 weeks?
The unpopular opinion predicted the future. You were right Benji. That's why we watch you
Destroyer in a bad place? I thought they used to be king of PvE. Was this never the case, or did something happen?
Yes, the egregious honing rates coupled with starved mat generation is a recipe for disaster. Honestly, the biggest problem is the psychological experience of being told you're a failure X times a day. It certainly doesn't feel good seeing all your efforts go down the RNG hole and seeing FAIL, FAIL, FAIL. Many games operate in the same fashion: grind content to reach endgame activities. It's the conveyance of information that fundamentally changes the reaction from the crowd. I draw parallels to, say, Diablo 2 (for example). In D2, you farm boss after boss after boss for the chance of an upgrade. This can take days, weeks or longer for one piece of gear that's an upgrade. The difference is they don't shove failure in your face every chance they get. After you kill the boss, the item does or doesn't drop. The progression effort and time can be similar, but the way the game delivers the information is insanely different.
Just something to think about. It's a well documented phenomenon that there's actual _regression_ in brain development when even arbitrarily being told you've failed. This has been documented in the animal kingdom and not just in humans. The cocktail of chemicals released in negative experiences is deleterious to healthy life. The two are not congruent.
I am not saying that we should just win-or feel like we win-all the time; that's silly. What I _am_ saying is the vehicle for information is flawed, which is further suggested by player feedback and retention.
Lost Ark is not for everyone-I knew that moving into our long awaited western release. I've watched all but two of my friends stop playing because of what LA is and isn't. The endgame really feels more like a gambler's addiction sim and idk what that says about myself that is still playing. Real weird because I don't like gambling.
Honing rates past 1370 are much higher so people who got to 1070 will now go even higher quickly than newer players stuck in early parts of t3. Everyone's complaining about Argos release being rushed and pushing people stuck in 1350-1365 to spend money to catch up.
Unpopular opinion as well, but i'm also kinda glad that there is "wall" here. I've been playing from day 1 for about 8~10 hours a day and playing multiple classes as I was finding out what to main. So in my effort to find a class to main I had to switch classes a few times at t2 and also once at the start of t3. Because of that, compared to my other friends who had only played 1 character from start to t3, they were pretty far ahead from me. But because of this wall, I could somewhat catch up to them in terms of content and at this moment, I'm currently about a few days away from Argos P1 whereas my friends have only done Argos p1 one time.
Also i'm not too worried about doing Argos on day 1 anymore since Valtan raid is being delayed I don't believe there is reason to rush anymore besides maybe trying to make bank on the whales who are buying 1370 accs for insane amounts of gold that will become moot once Valtan releases.
the transition at 11:14 was clean
The problem is there is nothing to really do at 1340. I can literally only run 2 dungeons that is it. Maybe if the game released with all characters from the start, I would work on an alt.
Also you have to understand that perception matters, people wont give the game a second chance that easily. It took No Mans Sky years of good updates to reverse the fuckup at the release.
While you have 2% honing chances, you can at least do all the content, we have to pay or get extremely lucky to do content in the first place.
I sell gold at 1340 lol, there's nothing else to do in game really
Not saying there isn’t anything wrong with honing rates etc. But “maybe if the game released with all characters from the start, I would work on an alt.” Well the game did release with more than 1 class. It released with quite a few. And “nothing to do at 1340 other than 2 dungeons”. I HIGHLY doubt you have even came close to finishing adventure tome, island souls, moko seeds, etc.
There is plenty to do and play. Everyone has to complain about something I guess but you didn’t make very good points…
To be fair if you’re in the mindset that the gameplay loop at 1340-1370 is “nothing to do” you’d be disappointed with the current loop at 1370+
@@ianhenderson685 it did but come on almost all the fancy classes didnt release we know that
Im at 1340 too but for me there is so much to do even after i play it for 7 hours a day.
Don't forget the accelerated release schedule here compared to KR. The dead zone really has no purpose here if what Gold River said is true about wanting to catch NA up to RU and KR quickly. The future of the game will be fine in the west assuming they can rectify the dead zone issue quickly - look at Black Desert as an example. BDO is a grind, that's all it is, and it is one of the most played MMO's in the west right now. Low success rates do scare some people away, however as long as there is a way to push through them that is not severely limited by time gating mechanics people will generally be ok with it. Introducing the missing resource-gaining activities, and maybe making the infinite chaos grind a bit less harsh per purchase would go a very long way in solving the issue. I'm not sure that an enhancement rate increase is really the solution, 15% to succeed is a huge number compared to TET to PEN attempts in BDO, I think it's good training for the severe % rate drop that is to come. The issue is the resource starvation that has stalled so many people out, including myself (1360) and the lack of any meaningful progression between 1340 and 1370.
The problem is not % honning, it's about the artificial lock to Milk whales and forced others to paid, the lack of content to gather materials...
I'll do the content eventually. It might be next month or next year - don't care. I'm still leveling up in late T1. The only gripe I have is the class I want to play isn't even released so I have to start over completely anyway.
Thank you very much for addressing this. The West seems to have a completely different idea of what "standard gaming" is among the population and also they seem to have the completely wrong idea when approaching honing which has led to this outcry in the international base.
I also think a lot of them are just trying to cover for the fact they aren't playing nearly enough, refuse to make/play alts, and have been selling their T3 mats for 2 or even 3 weeks now and think "there's not enough" when they just aren't willing to wait or farm for even 1 week to earn it.
That being said, we really do need more bound mats and avenues to get more taps at those lower chances (please PLEASE no more tradeable, bots are going nuts right now) if they wanted to accelerate us up to KR server current status. I still have no idea how the outcry is both "speed us up to KR' and "slow down the ilevels are too fast" at the same time. People gotta pick one or the other, can't be both.
yeah youre right , keeo honing chances (im1357 and had to pity another piece to 13 few mins ago) would like more ways to earn mats tho
디붕이 ㅠ Sadge
Tbh I don't like how hard it is to get access to Argos atm, on one hand Argos right now is our endgame and it should be somewhat hard to get into, but on the other hand whales are just gonna buy their way into 1370+ and start making tons of gold, and also having to pay to access content in the first place feels pretty bad.
I honestly don't care too much, I'm just gonna get all my characters to 1340 and sit there until the new rates and heroic raids and stuff are added, but I do think Argos was added too quickly, I straight up would've preferred no patches at all for another month lmao
The way how it is going on in the West the game is actually start to die if you exclude those player base coming from bot. Maybe in a month or 2, this will fall sub 100 K player. MMO players in the west are less forgiving compare to other regions. It always blow my mind that they know from experience the Argos patch was a deadzone but still release it. It is like McDonald going to India to sell beef burger knowing full well the cultural difference won't be taking with a warm welcome. Why do it if past data already suggest Argos is a bad patch ?
problem is there is nothing new to do post 1340 until 1370, yoho is now 1370 and also hard oreha, as opposed to before where they were 1355 content. As a result the push doesnt feel rewarding at all, low upgrade chance or not. IMO
The catch up mechanic in KR is designed for new players to get caught up to T3 content. What's the difference in the West if we'll be getting the same content a lot sooner and we are also new players. I understand you when you talked about how you basically bled your way and suffered to get upgraded before they implemented the catch up mechanics but it sounds to me like you want the West to suffer the same way Korea suffered with the low honing rates for so long. TLDR - Korea and West will be on the same content. Catch up mechanics in Korea but not West? Make it make sense. The game economy is fucked rn because of it
100% agree
Personally I don't mind the honing rates or slow pace.
I do mind how blatantly obvious of a cashgrab is the Argos release in the West. It's content exclusive to whales and the most hardcore of veterans.
They could have easily delayed the release and give players time to build more infrastructure in t3. But nope, it's whale milk time. I'm sure they made 100s of thousands of $, but the p2w stigma is a death sentence of s Western pc game.
Gold River said argos would release 1 month after launch. We all knew it was coming in March. Not an issue. What makes it a cash grab is no honing rate buffs or extra mat sources like heroic raids and what not. THATS the issue. Also if they wouldve gave us a date for argos and pushed it a week or 2 later. Allowing players to at least know exactly when. Not a 1 day notice. We are playing catch up to KR
Lol p2w stigna is a death sentence huh? What is the most played MMO in the WEST??? a p2w trash game developed by trashier developers, ring any bell? The only reason why LA wont succeed is because of its Korean/Asian stigma. NA is big time racist and prejudiced af. They will be the biggest hypocrites, trash on LA for being p2w and will simply go and play another p2w 'western' game.
Not saying LA isn't p2w, it is. NA gamers dont have the patience for anything and they give in to the FOMO. Any good business would obviously take advantage of that
@@HouseofGausss ig but it should still do fine. Ppl still playing BDO. Thats the most p2w game on the market imo. Lost ark is fun af and a good game. Amazon/smilegate need to respond quick.
I don't think some f2p players in western understands the f2p business model in the first place. They demand everything rechable as soon as the content release without spending dime. It is not even that it is extremely hard to do the contents as f2p player, it just takes a bit longer compared to people who swipe. It is kind of obvious in the sense of f2p mmo business model. I do agree that there should had been more honing material source between 1340~1370 with the argos release but the amount of whiners in lost ark is getting almost absurd at this point.
@@jaylee7279 cuz we arent other regions. If they wanna push us to legion raids as soon as possible then add the other mats in the game and give honing rate changes…no reason for them not to be in game other than whale bait. They made hella money thats for sure lol. Suck dick playing hella hours a day and still not making it. Ur losing gold every week by not doing argos. Imagine playing multiple characters and grinding f2p and being stuck at 1360 or 1350. Just a horrible experience. If u play the game a lot and be efficient you shouldve made it to argos period. Should have…if there were more mat sources and buffed rates. But the fact is u makenit to argos ONLY if ur lucky as fuck…swiped…or played the market.
💯💯💯
The thing is, KR had way more honing material sources from the get go.
Right now, playtime does not matter because you get all your daily mats in 30 minutes of gameplay. Anything you do after that doesn't matter. This means that people in the top 1% gearscore wise, who played over 400 hours, are still nowhere near Argos. The ONLY way to be there right now is to spend a lot of money and that's why players are frustrated.
The problem isn't the honing rates, it's that they removed content on purpose to force people to whale.
This isn't reducing the gap between players, this puts a huge paywall between the top 0.1% and everyone else.
Keep up the good fight
I agree that in general low honing chances aren't a bad thing they have their purpose but what is annoying compared to the KR server is that we do not have the chance to get enough materials to brute force the honing we get enough for like 1 chance per day at these rates when people who spend money can easily reach 1370+ where 95% of f2p players have to wait and wait and wait to get enough stuff to then fail because of the chances, that's why I think that they should either release the missing content (Challenge Abyss, Guardian & PvP Vendors) or increase the chance because the people who don't know about the later content will quit simply because it currently seems way to pay2win to what people told them because we currently don't have the content in NA/EU that makes f2p more enjoyable for the broader mass of people due to lack of honing materials and low chances. Sorry if it reads weird English isn't my first language and I'm on phone :)
Yeah the issue is we have all of the bad things at the same time, Not only are the rates lower but the costs are higher AND the amount of resources are more scarce..
I wouldn't mind the current rates if we had either: reduces honing costs or all available content, We don't need ALL the things at the same time just give us something..
I also don't mind p2w games if people can just use it to skip content, Even if they can reroll and catch up to everyone else in a day i don't care. My issue is when people spending thousands are literally twice as far as the rest of us
In the end the biggest issue is the absolute lack of communication other than "we are working on it", For example the shop has been down all week on EU and no one is mentioning anything. Event timers in compass are still broken even though they were "fixed"
I like this take, thanks for your effort and opinion
My pov (f2p): argos too early, lack of T3 resources, but the hon rate is not too much of a big deal