Nicholas Carr: The Shallows - What the Internet Is Doing to Our Brains
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- Опубліковано 9 вер 2012
- Technology commentator Nicholas Carr discusses his book, "The Shallows: What the Internet Is Doing to Our Brains," presented by Harvard Book Store. Is use of the Internet causing us to lose the ability to concentrate and think deeply? Drawing from philosophy, neuroscience, and history, "The Shallows" explores how the Internet may be rerouting neural pathways.
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after 2 hours I finally finished this 50min talk
One consequence of how the internet affects us I have noticed is that for some people sharing some event they are participating in (of witnessing) actually has a higher priority than the event itself. It's like tweeting/sharing has become the default action to perform whenever something happens around them instead of rationally evaluating the situation.
Noctumus Exactly. In concerts especially, it is hard to find people who are actually enjoying the experience as opposed to documenting it. But the tradeoff is that, they experience it at a very shallow level. I ask them the next day about the concert, and they hardly remember it. Whereas, I know many people from the 60's who remember events vividly that they experienced in concerts in the 70's and 80's. I think the reason is that in the latter case, it was a far more deeper engagement. Deep engagements have an impact on life.
I kid you not, there was this woman with whom I was in bed with, who was texting away. Needless to say, there was zero connection or positive memory associated with the event.
documenting things also allows of "deeper" analysis. The act of sharing affects the form and makes the document more understandable to the author himself. Thus you focus hard on tweeting only to reap benefits months or years later.
Noctumus I noticed the same thing. I call it "proxy living" the selfie of your birthday and the subsequent wave of likes, and comments give the individual more enjoyment than the event itself. It's pretty weird, someone is smiling and looking euphorically excited as they take their selfie or make a video cast, but then as they sit around later they're just a shell for a consciousness that is focused on outsiders and their reaction to their physical being at the event. They're physically there, but their mind and the point of enjoyment is clearly a world removed. I saw a funny twitter post related to this, it went: "Why do white girls go hiking? Instagram"
Very interesting comment/post. I notice this a lot with people I know:
The sharing, the advertising yourself to others, the projection of your image regarding an event is now more important than the event itself. It's like we have lost our personal space and personal identity. Our identities are all based on how others perceive us, or how we imagine others perceive us. We don't have a relation with ourselves.
Documenting things may allow deeper analysis. But documenting everything allows virtually zero analysis, and almost no experience.
"Thus you focus hard on tweeting only to reap benefits months or years later."
I can't tell if you're being serious with that. What benefits have you reaped from Tweets from years ago?
Well… this aged tremendously well
Yeah and it will only get worse :/
It's been over nine years since this video was posted. It has aged like a good French wine.
I do not say that gladly.
I used to be able to read for hours, when I was in my teens so many years ago...
The internet consumes entirely too much of my time, that much I do know.
Sounds like an interesting book. And I did read an article in the past about that study on multi-taskers over-exaggerating their actual abilities to multi-task effectively.
Glad to have taken the time to listen to this.
I highly recommend THE SHALLOWS. It is beautifully written and it's TRUE. One of my favorite books, and I have read a to of books If those who are commenting that they can't concentrate well enough to listen to Mr. Carr, then that's all the more reason that they must read his book.
what is it about?
Here is an old article that was the first thing I read that explains this situation of what happens when we use computers too much and inappropriately:
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/1997/07/the-computer-delusion/376899/
Nicholas Carr's book updates and expounds very clearly what Mr. Oppenheimer wrote about computers nearly two decades earlier. Reading it will be good preparation for your being able to complete and even appreciate Mr. Carr's book, which is not all that long anyway. Multi-tasking can be good but it can also make one less precise and more anxious and more likely to make mistakes. Why are we in such a hurry these days? Living life more deeply is much better than living hastily and superficially. One misses depth--in friendships, in seeing the beauty of our world, in learning, in being able to THINK. Try it; you'll like it. Good luck to you!
i watched a video on education by derek on veritasium who said some of the same things in that article. I will read the book when i can. thanks. Have you watched Neil Postman?
@@bpetersfaulk Why would you read it as opposed to Neil Postman who I find more thoughtful whose material has been stolen and used to less effect - mechanical time keeping is Neil Postman but he fucks it up. Neil Postman realises that those monks never intended humans to become automatons for Amazon to measure how long it takes to urinate so they can deprive employees of any human experience - this isn't about concentration its about destruction of what it is to be human and actually amusing ourselves to death is the least of its toxic effects.
Neil Postman's "Amusing Ourselves to Death" is also a great book. It's similar except focuses more on how technology changes the discourse of a culture.
during this video :
1) I checked my email multiple times
2) checked social media to see if anyone commented
3) wrote this comment
90% of people clicked off this video in the first 5 minutes.
1:35 his sotry
12:00 the internet
30:00 finishes then q&a
The book helps me to change my internet-surfing habit in a good way
My favourite author along with cal Newport. I always re read deep work and the shallows because it's easy to forget in todays social media age.
Let's face it, it's like societally acceptable heroin. If we were forced to engage intellectually with each other as opposed to use machines to communicate, we might find that society as a whole would benefit greatly.
I know it has been a long time, but the feeling of epiphanous coincidence I was struck with compelled me to write. As I watch this video my mind went to a friend. This friend will pick up his phone and just start scrolling in mid convo(quite annoying really) when it's just us two or in a group. As I listened to this I started to think about his behavior and how similar it was to the mindset I had as a heroin "user". I would just check out of life to go inside my own feel good bubble. Though the context is very different. The path and it's destination seem to be the same. Self exile to an island in the mind. I have been clean a long time, unfortunately I'm doomed to watch my friends and family, possibly the world, fall into the abyss adjacent to the one I escaped. So, I agree.
talking to people in real life? yuck! =)
Honestly i would but most of em are stupid as hell.
This video was posted 7 years ago and it seemed important then, think about how much more important it is now
Yes indeed and it will become even much more essential in the coming decades..as we all undergo a subtle change and silent evolution due to technological indoctrination and influences..
@@MrEmotional33 maybe "devolution"?
multitasking so hard while watching this
One of the shifts in my ability to concentrate for even more than minutes on a difficult subject that I've noticed recently is when watching my favorite UA-cam channel. That channel is called PBS Space Time and it's filled with ~20 minute videos about complex subjects from astrophysics explained to laymen. In the last year I noticed that I had to rewind the video countless times to get through it since I was constantly distracted. I just could not force myself to fully concentrate on what the host was saying.
Now when I'm at home, programming something for a little project I'm working on, I've got at least one video playing on a secondary monitor and I'm getting bombarded by messages and notifications from my phone. I've always been a slow reader (diagnosed with dyslexia), but I'm starting to believe that's not a result of some innate inability to read fast, but the fact that from a young age I've been exposed to an endless supply of content. I got diagnosed with ADD when I was 15 and received Ritalin for a few years, but chose to stop using it since I didn't want to be dependent on it. I don't think I have dyslexia. I don't think I've got ADD. I think I've got a mind conditioned by the internet.
But the problem isn't just one of utility. It's also a social problem. I've seen how focused younger children now are on social media and their social perception. Playing outside is not about having fun, it's about getting the right lighting at sundown for your next Instagram post. Everyone is fully aware of their own problems and how they look when they just wake up, but they're constantly comparing themselves with the filtered, best version of others. Previously success was measured locally. You look around and compare your accomplishments to the people in your city, since that was all you could compare to, and you'd feel pretty good about it. Now that same success is being measured globally and compared to that 20 year old who's making millions shilling beauty products you might feel like you've accomplished nothing at all.
This comment might be too long, didn't read, but these are some recent thoughts I've had and I've had no one to share them with.
Thank you for writing this. I believe you are correct in your analysis.
@@annjuurinen6553 Thank you Ann. It's nice to know I'm not alone in thinking this :-)
Another negative aspect of the internet is the fact that it can satisfy your desires in milliseconds. There is rarely any need for patience anymore as the medium becomes increasingly faster. Why is this bad? Because when an individual returns to the "real world" he no longer has this instant gratification which can make people impatient, anxious and intolerant toward others.
I tried to read his book but I couldn't concentrate on it.
+SMELLTHEBULL Which proves your brain is damaged, lol!
Vera Godly
It was a joke!
Vera Godly
Even if SmellTheBull wasn't joking, that does not prove his brain is or was damaged. It just means he adapted his brain to short-term focus.
My professor suggested it when I was googling the solution without giving much thought.
In this day and age, you will see people of all ages scrolling their 'smart phone' constantly checking their Facebook, Instagram... etc; instead of reading a book in public places like the old days. Social media has turned people into digital zombies.
PROFOUND work Nicholas. Greatly appreciated. I was just introduced to your work, to my delight. I look forward to reading the shallows. I pray your work continues to inspire others, greatly needed.
I watched this three times out of pure enjoyment.
the irony of listening to this while being distracted by literally everything he's been talking about
I had to listen to this twice :D
Thoughtful speaker. Liked his book, too .
Outstanding book. Life changing!!
I've been using the internet for 13 years and the last 8 years daily for hours and I don't have trouble concentrating. Lately I read over 50 pages of a book without looking outside the book a single time. But maybe it's because I don't use social media.
I’ve been using the internet since the 90s. I’m fine I actually deactivated my Facebook about a year ago and haven’t missed it at all. Those people aren’t my friends. Realize you only have a few real friends those 1500 people on the friends list aren’t actually your friends.
"The computer screen bulldozes our doubts with its bounties and conveniences. It is so much our servant that it would seem churlish to notice that it is also our master."
This book answered my question as to why my memory and attention span were suffering.
Hope it is better now for you.
Thank you for this
Very interesting talk. I'm going to read his books.
Great Preformance by Nicholas Carr
Thank yoi
Great Book. Great blog writer. Thumbs up and liked!
"Reading is that fruitful miracle of a communication in the midst of a solitude"- Marcel Proust
The fact that I had to read that 4 times before I understood it is worrying for me :(
great lecture, went to my university.
Keep it up man.. you got it
Perhaps the greatest aspect homo sapiens is that we are adaptable; we have the ability to align ourselves to whatever technology we may be exposed to. If we choose to allow the internet to "future shock" our psyche then that is what will happen but that doesn't have to happen. As human beings we have the ability to choose what will affect us.
This is making me think of Adhd . Very intresting stuff
I like the book. I'm on chapter 5. I've never sat easily and read although I've read more than ever in the last 7 years. I read the collected works of C.G. Jung in my 20s. I bought a 286 in 1988 so I've been using computers and the Internet from the beginning. In-depth thinking requires work and the brain changes by working a lot. If a person has to work then they will do what is necessary. I don't believe the Internet changes that. It is getting easier to do in-depth thinking today because such trash is produced by mainstream media outlets. There is no bang for the buck so to speak and it is becoming more rewarding by producing your own interpretation of the world by working a little harder to get some meaning from it. I don't know, I'm a graduate student and have to write articles so what do I know. I like programming too. To me it seems that it is easier to write books than ever before and it also seems more likely that those books will never be read. Apple products always seemed to abuse me as a user and that is the only computer system that I never liked. I like open source solutions.
Nature has a calming rythm to it, and as man progresses to create the world in his image he distances himself from this. He surrounds himself with a new rythm of life, the rythm of technology. It began with the conquering of day and night with the invention of the lamp, humans broke a rythm that has existed since the dawn of time. People whent to sleep at night because it was not really possible to do anything and so man whent to sleep as nature dictated.
Mahatma Gandhi Quotes
There is more to life than increasing its speed.
I googled that whilst listening to this talk. I also ate breakfast. I also read the comments to this video sorted by date and then by popularity. I also commented on two other posts. And wrote this one.
What was I doing again? Oh yeah it’s Saturday and it’s 1pm and I still haven’t washed up the breakfast dishes.
To try to reconcile Carr's ideas with the incredible goodness that is the internet, I suggest the following. The trick is compartmentalization of attention. We need deep thought, and surfing the web is counter to that. But we also need the new info and lateral thinking provided by surfing. Thus, the trick is the do the deep thinking first, at the beginning of the day (email and cell phone off). Later, give yourself feedback on your deep thinking by following hyperlinks.
I feel like at first the internet is beneficial but we get so caught up in remembering where to google something instead of actually reading and retaining it actively.
King Dionysius: Used improperly, the internet can petrify the brain to stone. But used properly? Hundreds of years ago, painters had to travel Europe to study The Great Paintings, or make do with less-than-satisfactory copies and drawings. Now viewing any great painting is just a click away, and not some crappy copy. Can't find a special poem from your youth? AI and google make it a click away. Curious about a famous piece of Classical music, but pinching pennies and not sure if you should buy it? I felt that way about Mahler's reconstructed "Tenth" Symphony. I listened free online to Simon Rattle conduct the whole piece, and I Had To Have It. But the amount of those souls out there who.use the Internet properly, can be compared to a nucleus versus the rest of the atom.
It is possible with focus. One thing at a time, with full effort on the one thing, without distractions. Some researchers say it takes 15-20 min to get into the Zone, but it takes only a brief email alert to pull you out of the Zone. Multi-tasking is overrated.
One of Carr's book that was mentioned "Does it matter" is actually "Does IT matter". "IT" as in "Information Technology"
Is there a generalization of this? Knowing when a technology, or even habit, will change your habits over time and thus you can responsibly limit it in advance, or perhaps observe this in-action and make a change in your usage. What if the medium changes as you use it, starting off as a focused activity and becoming a distracting one? Do you ultimately just need constant vigilance 24/7?
I read this book while watching the Leafs' hockey game. Oddly, the book made me cry, made me angry and made me lose hope. Go Leafs Go!
That is hilarious.
If you don't want your mind to be taken away by stream of the internet you can do a very simple thing. You focus on your breath, it is the most natural rythm we can access at all times, it brings you to the present moment and from that you can think more clearly.
Clicking more slowly and focusing on one tab while doing this is also great. Make a point out of doing only one thing, don't watch a youtube video while going back to a different website to read but stay with one thing wholely.
Not so easy. Visual media by itself is a nonstop stream of images, everything is here/now, which is totally different than how the brain works when reading where you have to hold the beginning of a sentence in your head till the end, the previous sentences/chapters in your head compared to what's being read now, and updating what you've previously read over the course of your life in light of what you're now reading. It's a totally different experience, people have to read and just stop being glued to screens, no way around it.
The nutritional value of content.
Content consumption:
READING BOOKS:
Positive Cognitive Impact:
Improves general knowledge
Improves vocabulary
Improves reflection/decreases impulsivity
Improves induction problem-solving Improves critical thinking Improves memory
Negative Cognitive Impact: NONE.
LISTENING TO SPEECH:
Positive Cognitive Impact:
Improves Imagination
Improves memory
Negative Cognitive Impact: NONE.
PLAYING VIDEOGAMES:
Positive Cognitive Impact:
Increases visuo-spatial ability
Increases hand-eye coordination
Increases divided attention
Negative Cognitive Impact:
Reduces attention span
Reduces reflection/increases impulsivity
ACCESSING INTERNET:
Positive Cognitive Impact:
Improves visuo-spatial ability
Increases divided attention
Negative Cognitive Impact:
Reduces attention span
Reduces concentration
Reduces filtering ability
Reduces working memory
WATCHING TELEVISION/INTERNET:
Positive Cognitive Impact:
Improves visuo-spatial ability
Negative Cognitive Impact:
Reduces attention
Reduces attention
Reduces reflection/increases impulsivity
Reduces inductive problem-solving
Reduces imagination
The dumbing down process can also be traced way back from starting from today to the mid-80s, 70s, 60s, 50s, 40s, 30s, 20s, 10, 1900 to 1800.
The proof is quite simple to see UNLESS SOME HAS SHARP EYES, SHARP MINDS, AND A SENSE OF ARCHIVING THEIR PERSONAL HISTORICAL EXPERIENCES BY SIMPLY LOOKING AT THE WAY HOUSES WERE BEING BUILT AND LIBRARIES WERE BEING BUILT, LOCATED, AND UPGRADED.
From 1800 to the mid-80s houses has at least 2 rooms which is the "LIBRARY ROOM, AND A STUDY ROOM THAT FUNCTIONS ALSO AS A LIBRARY ROOM. These 2 rooms are normally twice as big as the biggest room in any standard houses of those times so that they can have more than enough space, with the proper library styled interior infrastructure which is compact and totally accessible so that they can accommodate all the different kinds of books, encyclopedias, dictionaries, thesauruses, maps, calendars, leaflets, pamphlets, magazines, etc that will be accumulated over 2 to 3 generations and the other rooms and other spaces can also accommodate library cabinets that are modular, adjustable, scalable, and safe and protective of books.
And the owners of these houses, and that of their families must also have both the knowledge and the wisdom that BOOKS WHEN THEY BECOME OLD, THEY AUTOMATICALLY BECOME VALUABLE HISTORICAL ARCHIVES OF OLD KNOWLEDGE AND WISDOM ACCUMULATED THROUGH THE AGES THAT CAN BE USED AS CROSS REFERENCE SCIENTIFIC INTELLECTUAL PRINTED ARCHIVAL MATERIAL TO COUNTER-CHECK ANY NEW INCOMING KNOWLEDGE TO CHECK IF IT HAS BEEN ILLEGALLY AND UNLAWFULLY AND CRIMINALLY TAMPERED AND DUMBED-DOWN AGAINST YOUR RIGHTS TO TRUE UNCENSORED KNOWLEDGE AND WISDOM.
THE DOUBLE FUNCTION STUDY ROOM AND OFFICE ROOM SHOULD HAD BEEN IMPROVED BY USE OF THE UPGRADED VERSION OF THE MICROFILM TECHNOLOGY KNOWN AS MEMEX WHERE ALL KNOWLEDGE HAS BEEN STORED IN ARCHIVAL MICROFILM AND IS VERY CONVENIENT TO ACCESS ANYTIME WHEN NEEDED INSTANTANEOUSLY. THEY NEGLECTED TO KEEP ON UPGRADING IT TO NEWER VERSIONS THAT ARE FAR MORE FLEXIBLY VERSATILE THAT WILL ALLOW YOU TO BE ABLE TO GET A SIMULTANEOUS VIEW INSTANTLY OF ALL WHAT IS STORED IN MICROFILM BY MEANS OF MECHANICALLY AUTOMATED ANALOG OPTICAL-MECHANICAL SYSTEMS.
THE ADVENT OF SUPERMICROFILMING THROUGH THE USE OF IRREVERSIBLE PHOTOCHROMIC GLASS CERAMICS BASED-INORGANIC GRAIN FREE DYES CAN REDUCE ALL PRINTED MATERIAL STORED IN RUSSIA, BRITAIN, JAPAN, EUROPE, SOUTH KOREA, SINGAPORE, AMERICA, CANADA, AUSTRALIA, NEW ZEALAND INTO A SMALL LIBRARY.
THE AIM IS THAT ALL HOUSES MUST BE DESIGNED AND EQUIPPED BASED ON THIS BASIC ENGINEERING DESIGN AND PRINCIPLE TO PREVENT ANY MASS DUMBING DOWN.
FORTUNATELY FOR RUSSIA, WE DID JUST THAT FOR THE KGB-GRU/FSB AND TOP MILITARY FACILITIES NEEDS FOR THEIR PERSONNEL AND FAMILIES INVOLVED WITH THE COC PROGRAM STARTED BY JOSEPH STALIN. COC PROGRAM STANDS FOR "CONTINUITY OF CIVILIZATION". THE USE OF HYBRID SUPERMICROFILMING WITH ANALOG COMPUTERS USING ANALOG TRANSISTORS AND ELECTRO-OPTICS AND ELECTRO-MECHANICALS CAN CREATE A HYBRID IRREVERSIBLE SUPERMICROFILM-BASED COMPUTER SYSTEM EQUIPPED WITH BOOK OR ANY PRINTED MATERIAL TO MICROFILM WRITER ARCHIVER EQUIPMENT AND WITH A REPRINT FROM MICROFILM PRINT-ON-DEMAND INSTANTANEOUS BOOK MAKING EQUIPMENT.
BUT THE REPRINTS FROM MICROFILMS WILL BE IN THE FORM OF ARCHIVAL INK ON ARCHIVAL PAPER PAPERBACK VERSIONS WITHOUT MISSING ANY DETAILS. THE PUBLIC LIBRARIES SHOULD HAD BEEN DESIGNED TO MEET FUTURE SPACE NEEDS FOR EXPANSION STORAGE PURPOSES AND FOR ARCHIVING EQUIPMENT AND TO ACCOMMODATE NEWER BOOKS WITHOUT REMOVING THE OLDER BOOKS.
AND ALL OF THESE LIBRARIES MUST HAVE A POLICY THAT ALL INCOMING BOOKS MUST BE MICROFILMED AND ALL OLD BOOKS MUST BE MICROFILMED FOR FUTURE REFERENCE AND CROSS-REFERENCING AND FOR ARCHIVING PURPOSES AND FOR MULTIPLE DUPLICATION FOR THE UPGRADED HYBRID HYBRID SUPERMICROFILMING WITH ANALOG COMPUTERS USING ANALOG TRANSISTORS AND ELECTRO-OPTICS AND ELECTRO-MECHANICALS CAN CREATE A HYBRID IRREVERSIBLE SUPERMICROFILM-BASED COMPUTER SYSTEM.
darthvader5300 damn
A change in our ability to think deeply/ focus will and is hampering our ability to solve novel problems as individuals and as a society. It is CERTAINLY a problem and its markers are an increase in attention disorders, a continued drop in test ranking, a decrease in the depth/ richness of relationships... We should all be extremely aware of this and manage our unplugging of web devices.
Interestingly enough, not longer after this speech ebook sales increased but then quickly plateaued and now have been on decline. Counterintuitively, the sale of print books have increased.
How come I couldn't find this video in the last 8 years ?.... Because the 'Algorithm' kept me engaged in other videos.
Glad you found us, Hardeep. Please subscribe to our channel to see more. We record lectures in Boston and publish them every week. You can also browse by topic, speaker or organization on our website: forum-network.org/
0:58 he called it "The Shadows"
Damn it!! He talks about having a low amount of patience and interest and reading and then makes a book that I have to f@!king read for my college composition class!!! But honestly this book seems pretty simple to understand even with out totally reading it before the test. So hopefully I do good on it!🙏🏻
After the conquering of light his sleeping pattern became ever more erratic and it is this tampering that (in my opinon) birthed the condition known as insomnia. This and ofcourse the influx of information, when man's sense perceptions are bombarded by constant stimuli his brain begins to function in a way that can keep up with it. It needs some non active time to come back to a restfull state, some people are anxious and they will keep their own brains active resulting in a difficulty to sleep.
I couldn't concentrate before we had the internet! I completely understood the whole point but this was hard to listen to. I also thought it was 30 minutes too long.
true
Listened to this video at 2 times speed, combed my hair, flossed, read UA-cam comments, wrote one, played with stupid nick naks, got myself water, figured out what video I’ll watch next.
OMG he totally looks like BEAVIS! (don't get me wrong, he's a great, great writer and lecturer anyway...)
The exact same thing happened to me and I'm in my 30s, so I doubt it's "middle-age mindrot".
This reminds me of Dune by Frank Herbert. "The Mentats" basically human computers capable of deep concentration and calculations.
I just want to ask Mr.Nicholas that how should we use internet? Coz young lads like Us needs internet for studying too and gathering informations and projects. I am not into social media but still how to use internet and not getting distracted as mentioned by you?
It's not likely that Mr. Nicholas will answer your question here, but you can be smart without that by asking Postman questions: ua-cam.com/video/uglSCuG31P4/v-deo.html Find sources that you don't understand at first, at second, ... but still want to see, listen or read again. Always look for the hard and less popular ones with passionate guys talking about their own work. Even UA-cam may help you and show up relevant sources in your topic. _You can be distracted only if you don't respect your own time and let others waste it..._ ;-) Good luck!
Read: Digital Minimalism by Cal Newport
All of the tools we use, does some work on us.
I've listened to the book via audiobook performance. One of the subjects addressed in the book is the issue of " devices " allowing us to deviate from the creative/imaginational portion of our brains. Carr also claims that these " devices " are, basically, slowing our brain performances which could result in impatient or even impartial behaviors. But I would argue that one cannot totally blame devices for slowing us down or even changing our behaviors. For example, if we were to look at this in a realistic setting, we would have to conclude that ALL devices in our lives could potentially be altering our behavior. President Richard Nixon used to LOVE playing the piano ( with his favorite device being the piano ). His favorite music? The Tango--AND he could perform such music on the piano in an entertaining manner. BUT. . .does this mean we must blame the piano or even Tango music for his behavior during the Watergate Crisis? Same examples could be made from other people. The current President LOVES to Tweet. Should we blame Twitter ( or the President's love of Twitter/usage of his personal phone ) for the set of un-Presidential like behaviors he has displayed in 2018? We would love to find BLAME as a starting point for many of the human behaviors we have exhibited over these last 10,000 years or so. However, human behavior is still a relatively NEW science, one that will continue to elude us. And finding a starting point shouldn't be examined with maps, the alphabet, the internet, devices or anything electrical. It should start with CHOICE, the choice to evolve.
This is a bunch of feelings & emotions. No science or philosophy presented. Just desires. Exactly what is being warned against.
🙌🏽🇬🇧
this man has a very nice complexion.
I even have trouble concentrating on people are saying to me anymore :c
He says that the internet is more bad than good, but I think this only really applies to people who have mobile internet and smartphones. I see a smartphone as a useful tool, but I don't think it's cost is really worth it's usefulness. Also the somewhat new mobile internet along with these phones means that you will almost never be disconnected to your internet connection. This turns family outings and camping into the same thing as being at home rather than an escape from distractions. I myself love the internet and didn't really understand the point of the roundabout writings in Carr's book, but I do understand what he means overall. Technology isn't bad, but our human obsession of always using our technology all the time is truly a problem. That's why I am grateful to my family for taking me camping growing up and to the Boy Scouts of America for showing me the wonders of nature.
***** No, this applies equally to laptops and desktops. Granted, the interaction on mobile devices is even shallower. But desktops are equally distracting. The internet by its very nature is content rich, and inundated with an endless number of things which can catch your attention. The only hope is to disconnect.
This is REALLY dated now. I’m curious to hear new things from Nicholas Carr about social media and politics. Amongst other things.
There's an updated version of the book as of 2020, with an updated afterword. Adds another 30 pages, but it probably didn't warrant much more since the underlying dynamic is the same. The major difference with social media is that it's just exacerbated narcissism on our culture, even with people not posting photos of their boobs, dinner or vacations - something I've seen with time is people, once open to genuine thoughtful discussions, have clumped into unthinking groups that engage in similar shallow engagements. That many people feel better in shallow engagement, in being agreed with, rather than being more creative or seeking, is strange. I think it's symptomatic of something pathological within human nature, rather than pathological to the internet.
A diminished or weak will is more likely to be overcome by technology and distract themselves, whereas those who are deep thinkers, will use the available technology for higher purposes, rather than being distracted by porn, cat videos, or empty socialization. It's up to each individual how they use these tools.
Where are the questions!!
you want your mind compartmentalized? Is this possible?
He may be right.
Ladders are for staff use only. Please ask for assistance.
The distracted mind :)
Thinking while we read is thinking while we read; what follows depends on our brain's reconfigurable buffers & parsers. (No, I'm not a tecchie, I just worked at DEC as a writer.)
- Bill Costley 1-408-247-1943
The Medium is the Massage.
Whydja wanna reed a book for?
Absolutely right but new technology always impresses humans and after long time humans know it's bad effects then it becomes normal.....
It is a very long way to say that being an idiot in the modern world is a rare blessing. Those who are blessed with it will rule the world of tomorrow.
So..
Solitary focused thinking is our access to nuanced and more critical thought, and perhaps even progressive types of empathy outside of our base primal reactions.
Does it not seem relevant then to to draw any correlation with the rise of internet and digital media usage in the western world with the current politics such as Brexit and the U.S election.
With democratisation of content publication the traditional gate keeping of critically judged content has been neutered. Within the digital environment of streams and posts bitesized snappy content excels where considered and longer forms of content that take time to consume have become a shrinking niche. Not only do simplified structures of debate find more traction through digital consumption, but its possible that nature of digital consumption is recalibrating the brain in a way that might be effecting its capacity for deeper slower thought processes that might extend to empathy for groups outside of primal identification.
This all sounds conducive for a rise in populism and a more tribal political sensibility.
Reading , writing and books existed 5000 years ago. The Vedic literature existing during that time. So it is not true that books came into existence 500 years ago. However other parts appear logical.
So true. I would use the word "rational" not "logical". Logic is a subset of language. Language, is far more able to ascertain and communicate our perceptions of reality. Language is how we got here. Much of what is in the Vedic literature is fascinating especially the descriptions of the cosmos.
Every one thinks they know everything because they can look it up on google.. You must remember though.. Information is not knowledge!
Using information and combining your experiences with a open mind is wisdom.
All of these are talked about in a lot more depth and gusto in Amusing Ourselves to Death by Professor Neil Postman in 1985!!! And somehow this new guy forgets completely to mention him or other folks who have said the same things.
So Huxley was right. We will be self destroyed by our own pleasures.
Half amazing tool, half drug.
Let's face it, people under a certain age are simply crippled by their inability to remember life before smartphones and the internet. They will forever be addicted and looking for ways to justify all the negative side effects.
Ahh- but oral understanding can be very deep and rich!
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Brought to you by Carls Jr.
Societal fraud,regaining ones own thoughts,essential to your sanity
This is a very derivative take on Feynman's observations in O Americano.
None of what he says is original or particularly deep. am very surprised that he made no mention at all of Neil Postman and "Amusing Ourselves to Death" (one of Postman's many books). The idea of distraction, fragmentation, of the power of the medium to shape the mind are all there -- well presented and researched. Carr's talk or ideas are nothing new or original, nor deep.
I'm the real Nicholas Carr! Have you ever seen The One starring Jet Li? Well this is like that... There can only be one, when I defeat you in combat and absorb your power, there will be only one!
I think multi taking is a myth
So much going on behind that shiny forehead
QqQ
Obviously he read Neil Postman, cant hear him acknowledging that.
At this rate,by 2030 there will be a dock on top of the neck instead of a brain.
I can’t listen to anyone on the board of the WEF.. I’ll read Neil Postman.
qq
phone bad
This guy is wrong - spaces between words are at least 2000 years old - u can see it in the dead sea scrolls.
Yeah, that part confused me too. Perhaps he meant word spacing specifically for the Latin script? Because both Hebrew and Arabic had them for far longer than 1000 years.
i think he is exaggerating the negatives of the internet.
any specific example of the exaggeration?
***** The fact that it's commonly used as a way to kill boredom and quickly jump from topic to topic doesn't mean you can't have deep thoughts or commit information to long term memory. It also isn't the only way we use the internet. We can stay in one place and actively focus on a topic just like a book if we choose to. Repetition is pretty much the only tried and true way to commit information to long term memory. Focus alone isn't enough although I'm sure it helps.
The internet is being used more and more like a way day dream. However, instead of driving your own dream you are being guided by an outside force. Most Eureka moments probably happen when you're day dreaming or at least not actively focusing on the problem. These are moments of deep thought and conceptual thinking and usually have zero focus/attention. I don' feel like the internet and using it as quick distractions prevents this from happening. In fact being exposed to more information that what you can think up in your own head might actually increase our ability to have deep thoughts and conceptual thinking.
***** your being unjustifiably critical. I re-read his post and understood it well enough. I think it's a biot ridiculous to determine the mental state of a person from the way they construct sentences on a youtube comment; maybe the language used would suggest the type of person but your being unnecessarily nit-picky. I use my pc for like 7-10 hours most days and I'm not some drooling unfocused dunce.
Unlike watching television like a pacified zombie I am having an interactive stimulating experience. Gaming, youtube, writing etc. all stimulate the brain. I'm sure a study was done that found higher pc use correlated strongly with higher intelligence.
Yeah, it's not healthy for your body to sit on your ass all day. It's not good for your eyes and not good for your social self but these things are a product of misuse. The internet is a wonderful tool but the difference between medicine and poison is in the dose.
...
so suck a big black dick you filthily pig fucker.
***** I'm not convinced at all with the argument that I'm unfocused because of my internet use. I also find it laughable to be labeled an "aggressive addict". You realize my last line was a joke right?
Gaming in almost any form increases some form of intellect be it understanding the psychology of your enemies in Battlefield4 or more directly completing a puzzle game. Engaging with an interactive fiction helps us exhibit agency and is empowering...
Stimulating your brain is not exclusive of maintaining and promoting a healthy brain. When I said stimulation I meant intellectual and emotional stimulation, I shouldn't have to explain this, yet again your nit-picking...
Yes, the internet really is a wonderful tool. For communication and display of ideas, it's a wonderful tool. Just like a hammer is a wonderful tool if used correctly, for example, banging you on the head; I jest.
The internet enables us to do things we couldn't otherwise do, it's done a lot of good for society and I don't have to argue that point.
Your experience of the internet solely relies on what sites you visit. I think saying that the internet is having a bad effect on society is misguided and incoherent.
The internet is just an immaterial concept, it's an invisible connection of websites. The internet is an effective portal for communication and access to media, it's the best thing ever, literally, for those who use it for self-betterment.
If your going to go on herp-a-derp celebrity sites and just fap to midgit porn all day, then it's not my fault your stuck in a self destructive rut, and I suggest that these types of people would have been doing the exact same things if the internet had not existed except they'd be using VHS for the porn and Magazines for the celeb shite.
tl/dr
your a cunt.
***** How is it hard to understand that the internet allowed humans to communicate much easier and that this has lead to some very positive outcomes? the internet has made access to information easier, it has made media more free and accessible, all good things. Do I really need to explain to you why these are good things? seriously?
And what is intellect to you? for me it is what we know and how we think, more so how we think... isn't it obvious that the quick access to information and tangential learning provided from the internet facilitates a healthy mind? Without this access to information it is easier to get lost down a rabbit hole of logical fallacy or be converted to the bias of the locals around you.
Ok, so your saying my claims are unsubstantiated. What claims specifically are you having trouble with? do you want me to spend the 5 minutes it takes to get some research for you?
And what's hard about my statements about the internet? The internet is just all websites hyperlinked together like a galaxy is just a bunch of stars and planets lumped together. The internet, like the galaxy, is just a concept, like everything. But I'm not wanting to get hung up on that argument.
Yes it's the best tool for information acquisition ever! the best facilitation of media ever! what's religious about this? It's the interactive free market of ideas that the internet provides that makes it better than any other form of media. It's better because it's a combination of them all. The internet is inherently good because of this, it expands our positive abilities.
I'm not being faith based, I am providing logical arguments. Stop throwing out ridiculous statements like "your just like the westbro baptist church" and just address my points or fuck off. You don't need to quote a study to make a valid point. what exactly am I saying that is wrong?
Your last paragraph is ridiculous. I'm a moral relativist, the opposite of the moral absolutist religious. To tell me I don't know where my beliefs come from is a bit dull since my whole post is explaining to you why I think the internet is good.
Your argument about the flying-spag-mon doesn't even make sense.