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SWIVEL TOOLHOLDER MOD
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- Опубліковано 19 лип 2016
- Modifying a standard 35 degree profiling insert toolholder to have a swivel with 22.5 degree increments of position. Method of making a indexing face coupling using balls. Radius grinding on the surface grinder. Grinding conical relief on carbide inserts to allow small diameter facial plunge cuts.
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I am "robinrenzetti" Instagram lots more content there!
Great video synopsis by brs_workshop
"Shop Notes"*
• Overview of project and discrete design elements
• Shars toolholder used (3/4" SVJBR12-3B for VBMT 33x inserts):
www.shars.com/3...
This particular holder isn't common but would need to be specially selected for the application anyway.
• Grinding the tool holder to 5/8" (aka SVBJR10-3B but those are even harder to find)
• Tease of wheel dresser @ 3m20s: • SWIVEL TOOLHOLDER MOD
• Here's Deschner's Kinechek page (TL;DR: It's an extremely accurate, tuneable, constant velocity damper):
deschner.com/pr...
• Glimpse of electronic depth gage base on Mitutoyo digital caliper
• Hacksawing the tool body. It seems that Starrett stopped making Red-Stripe (solid HSS) hand-hack blades. They still make them for power hacksaws but those are thicker and deeper.
Bahco still makes a HSS all-hard blade but good luck finding them in the US.
• Tempering the tool holder.
• Milling and drilling the ball detent pattern with the bolt pattern function
• Grinding a radius handheld. Reminiscent of Tom Lipton's handheld radius milling: • Monday Night Meatloaf 6
• Assembling the joint
• Using Loctite 648 to retain the balls in the detents:
McMasterCarr: www.mcmaster.c...
Amazon: www.amazon.com...
KBC Tool: www.kbctools.c...
Loctite page (648): www.na.henkel-a...
Loctite page (retaining range): na.henkel-adhes...
• Blue Moly links:
McMasterCarr: www.mcmaster.c...
Amazon: www.amazon.com...
• Relieving the tool holder using a rotary table setup at an angle in a grinding vise.
• The tool in use creating grind reliefs.
*Not affiliated with any manufacturer or distributor. Links for reference.
Robin, the logarithmic growth of your channel is a testament to the stunning presentation of your life long experiences and solutions, and the passion of your craft. Every few seconds another golden nugget of information is revealed. Thanks so much for sharing. Joel....
Thanks for the very kind words Joel. Thanks for commenting and watching!
Very, very cool grinder setups, enjoyed watching it, thanks for sharing :)
Thanks Stefan, glad you found something useful. and thanks for commenting and watching!
just a machinist is an understatement .
Only recently found this channel, but it has become one of my favourites.
Thanks Geir and thanks for commenting and watching!
You are wrong on the just a machinist part Robert. You are about one of the finest most meticulous Master Toolsmiths I have ever seen.
Thanks Sean for the very kind words and thanks for commenting and watching!
More awesomeness!! It's the first time I see someone who literally has their balls in a vise.
Thanks Scott
THANKS Robin . I would never have thought you could plunge grind that deep a cut , I really liked the ball detents and all of your masterful grinder setups thanks for Sharing
YOU sir, are the encouragement. I was a machinist/fabricator at a race shop in Harrisburg until Covid... Had to take a job as a mechanic and I miss building things in the shop. Your videos keep my head in the game. Thanks!
Glad to help
"I'm just a machinist...", no definitely not "just a" and an interesting one too. I really enjoyed watching and learning from someone with that much experience. I still occasionally feel that sharp pain in my head (see my comment on your caliper customization), but thats fine... maybe I shall look for my wrench. ;)
Your videos are educational, detailed, very interesting and clearly structured (as far as an ape can tell) and the effort and time you are putting into those is well understood and greatly appreciated, of that you can be sure!
I myself can hardly wait for the next video... no pressure here at all... please keep sharing your amazing work! ;)
Thanks yet again Frank for your very generous comments!
Robin
Your vids have given me a whole new level of appreciation for the capabilities of a surface grinder in the hands of someone skilled in the art of its use. Many thanks for the education.
Thanks rengecko, I am glad you are finding them usefull. Thanks for commenting and watching!
It's good to know that work of this caliber hasn't been lost with time. I am 25 and have thought about a career in machining, mostly manual/ toolroom stuff, I just don't want to jump from the frying pan into the fire(I work in the newspaper industry). I don't know if that will ever come to fruition but it is inspiring to see a craftsman like you and good to know that work like this is still being accomplished, and is still economically viable.
There are lots of people out there doing what you see me doing and way beyond. They just are not videoing their work and showing it to the world.
My only regret is that I didn't find this channel sooner! Always a boost to see a new ROBRENZ vid on the subs feed.
Thanks James, I am glad you are enjoying them and thanks for commenting and watching!
Perhaps the greatest thing about UA-cam is that we get to look over the shoulder of a master at work. Thank you for going to the effort to record and share your projects.
FULL ! OF ! B.S ! YOU ! TUBE !! REALLY !! IS !!
Those compounded angles are always something to think over a couple of times before taking the first cut...
Still great learning here... ;)
MORE.... lol
Thanks!
Thanks Pierre and thanks for commenting and watching!
Interesting project, Robin. I really enjoy these video articles from guys like you who are not only master craftsmen but who also present their content in a clear, concise manner. That's a talent in itself. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for you very encouraging comments Richard!
These videos are even more important and relevant today. True artist and great production of the videos. You’re not just a machinist but something more. Thanks so much.
I appreciate that!
Your a mite lucky guy to have a Hardinge HLVH lathe. I think they are the most versatile and easiest lathes to run in the world!!! The threading feature is the fastest and simplest to use, except for a CNC lathe or maybe the old French Cridan threading lathe.!
I actually feel sorry for all the machinist who never had the opportunity to make parts on the Hardinge equipment!!!! I was lucky to have used them for over 50+ years. You do very interesting and challenging jobs all the time. Thanks for your fantastic videos!
Thanks again for your time posting your machine work. Look forward to the next project. Learning something every video.
Thanks Brian I am glad to help and thanks for commenting and watching!
Very nice. This tool holder is very similar to my Aloris that uses triangle inserts that swivel indexes. It isn't any good for heavy hogging as it is not rigid enough but it is awesome for doing various angles and getting into tight spots.
Thanks bcblock02 I remember seeing the Aloris unit when I was an apprentice long ago. Thanks for commenting and watching!
Nice job Robin. I would not have thought the shars tool holder would be that hard.
Thanks Bill and that toolholder is very high quality. Thanks for commenting and watching!
Mind blowing content ! Thanks for sharing Robin 👍🏼
Thanks Dave and thanks for commenting and watching!
Learned a lot from this one and your previous videos. Thankyou for taking the time teach your craft.
Thanks Jim and thanks for commenting and watching!
I ENJOYED YOUR LATHE TOOL. I WAS A MACHINIST FOR 30 YEARS. I NEVER HAD TIME TO MAKE VERY MANY PERSONAL TOOLS. I CAN APPRECIATE THAT DESIGN, VERY ELEGANT. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE ANY OTHER TOOLS YOU HAVE MADE.THANKS DOUG.
Thanks Doug, I plan on showing it all eventually. Thanks for commenting and watching!
Robin
Thanks for sharing Robin, your work is awesome. I just wish I understood more of the technical side of what you talk about. Keep up the fantastic videos! Regards Max
Thanks Maxi77 and thanks for commenting and subscribing!
The Technical side ! Only ! MAKES ! B.S.Bs !! Of EVERYONE !! AND THING ! KNOWN !!
Outstanding, this is one of those videos I need to watch several time so as not to miss anything. Thank you for sharing this!
Thanks Glenn and thanks for commenting and watching!
Outstanding work. Ball setting was spot on. Thanks for sharing
Thanks Terry and thanks for commenting and watching!
Please don't stop what you have been doing. I'm just getting into this field what you spent a lift to learn. I'm just starting out at 70.
Might have to go back to your Old ! Job !!.
Robin, love watching people do work like this at a high level and your videos are some of the best.
Thanks, and thanks for watching and commenting!
I always learn a lot from watching you work thanks
Thanks Brett and thanks for commenting and watching!
Very much enjoyed seeing the whole process and the final result. I'm with you about keeping the tool post dialed in to the axis and never moving it. One reason that I really like the multifix tool holders for getting the occasional angle without losing my zero. I would very much like to see your wheel dressing setup. Sounds very interesting.
I too would like to see more details about the dressing arrangement (-8
Thanks Rambozo the dresser is on the long list. Thanks for commenting and watching!
A guy who knows the proper use of the word; "Brinell" has just got a new sub. I used to be tasked with checking ball slides for just such an occurrence during shipment so as to provide incoming inspection reports before accepting them.☺
We appreciate you sharing your love with the world!
Thanks bucketsnort and thanks for commenting and watching!
I really like the ball detente idea. Very creative. I have actually seen one of those grinding wheels explode. I did PM in a big tool room/machine shop at a large factory. A new machinist had just been hired. No one is sure what he did but all of a sudden there was a loud screeching noise and a bang like a big firecracker and the pieces of the wheel went everywhere. Luckily the guy was wearing a face shield but he still took some of it in the chest/waist area and had to go to the hospital. Wrecked the magnetic chuck and broke the wheel enclosure too. We had to send the chuck for a regrind and I had to take it apart to inspect the spindle for damage. I was finding pieces of that wheel all over the tool room for a couple of weeks, even stuck in the sheet rock next to the machine lol. Great video keep them comin.
Thanks joe, that is a scary story. Thanks for watching and commenting!
Scary story Joe I'm glad the guy wasn't to seriously injured, but Rob said he'd never seen one just explode "for the fun of it" meaning without being misused, abused or crashed. I'm betting the new guy crashed the wheel somehow. Not to say that it would be impossible for a wheel to explode without crashing it, but if it did it would more than likely be because of a manufacturing defect. That's why you should always at minimum do a "ring test" to a new grinding wheel.
I feel your pain hack-sawing!! I've been "blessed" to take on a few wire EDM machines in my dept. They work great for cutting hard crap.
I love how well thought out your processes are. Thank you.
Thanks and thanks for watching and commenting.
Hey Robin,
Nice work. I might have missed it but were the ball seats sized for a press fit or was the locktite doing the retention? You hit the nail on the head about comments and interest in the work being a motivator. Hope fully we wont scare you off too soon.
All the best,
Tom
Hi Tom,
The ball seats were just the same ball mill going .010" past the centerline of the ball. It was closer to metal to metal than a press so I thought the Loctite would help the balls stay on one side. The bottom of that side had the .059 drill relief in the bottom also so the balls could deform the pockets to get some elastic averaging and be rotationally rigid.All the best,
Robin
PS: Congratulations on passing 50000 The quantity and quality of your content deserves much more than that!
Hi Rob, "I'm just a machinist" at the being of the video. A bit like saying a Ferrari is just a car. :-) Yeah there's machinists then there's a much smaller number of MACHINISTS. I'll never be good enough to fit the first description but would like to think I might know enough to tell the difference.
I'm real happy about Tom Lipton giving your channel a mention awhile ago since I hadn't known of it earlier. Congratulations on the 3k subs but I'm positive your channel will really hit some big numbers once word gets around a bit more.
When I first saw your insert holder I was figuring it was maybe done using face gears for the index points like Moore shows in one of there books for rotary table indexing. Never even thought of using the ball bearings idea. Very clever and certainly one I need to remember. You sure get into some unusual and more than interesting tool making. Learned a great deal during those grinding set ups as well. Many thanks for the time and effort to show at least some of what your doing.
Thanks Turning Point its good to hear the work is appreciated.
Robin
Wholeheartedly agree with your opening two paragraphs!
Well said...
The First Paragraph !? WHAT!! A !! LYING ! SWINE !! YOU !! REALLY !! ARE !!
finaly a machinist channel for experimented machinist. I love your videos. Can wait to see that india stone grinding video.
Thanks, it is on the list
I've been checking your channel every day since your last vid!! Those grinding setups were very interesting. Thanks for showing the tool in use at the end too. I think you're becoming the ball detent guy! Haha
Thanks Danny for commenting and watching!
yet another absolutely amazing video! Thank you very much Robin, can't tell you how much I look forward to each and everyone of these that you make.
Thanks bo and thanks for watching and commenting!
Just when I thought I found all the good machinists on youtube, I found your channel, I love your work!
Thanks Aaron and thanks for commenting and watching! Please share with your friends.
Good ! Machinests ! NEVER ! USE ! CRAPPY !! TUBE ! to SHOW !! ZOMMBEEESS !!CLOWN !! CLONES !!! LIKE !! YOU !! HOW ! TO ! DO !! SOMETHING !! DICK !! H !!
Very nicely done, as always. I can really appreciate the covers on your grinder (and the dust mask!) having struggled with that a lot myself. I would be very interested in finding out more about the wheel dresser you mentioned.
Thanks!
Marc
Thanks Marc a video on the dresser will turn up sometime. Thanks for commenting and watching!
Excellent once again. Please keep them coming
love the ball detent set up very cool
Thanks Waffenschmiedin, this video of mine ua-cam.com/video/LWUHlyi-8Mc/v-deo.html shows another use for the ball detents in my camera arm.
thanks ill check it out
Nice Job. I do not have a surface grinder in my home shop. I always used one at work. I am retired now, and seeing this video reminds me of how much I miss not having one.
Thanks and thanks for watching and commenting.
Another great video sir! I for one would love to see more on your custom wheel dresser!
Me too!! I paused the video there and am quite curious!
Thanks Steve, it is on the long list. Thanks for commenting and watching!
@@ROBRENZ ITS ! SAD !! THAT !. YOU ! TUBE !. IDIOTS ! WANT !! THINGS ! FROM !! YOU !! TO !! BE !! JUST !!!PLAIN !! THIEVES !!!
Great work You're a true toolmaker
Thanks Peter and thanks for commenting and watching!
Hello I must say I have never seen this approach done before on any level ! well done !
my hats off to you.
Glad you liked it!
Could have used this tool thousands of times. Must make one now. Robin, you could call it the Wowie - Zowie Swivel Tool! fabulous.
Thanks, I didn't invent this style of tool. Aloris has had a turning tool like this for over 40 years. I just showed the ball method of making a face coupling.
Loved the ball detent design. Thanks for sharing Robin!
Thanks Thomas and thanks for stopping back!
I aspire to achieve real precision and your videos provide the expert advice I need to get me there (one day). More metrology and of the same. I can't wait for the next instalment. Based on the caliper series I have just bought a Tesa electronic comparator....arrives tomorrow. I will be looking out for more super precision comparator work.Thanks Rob.
Thanks Rupert, glad I can be some help and thanks for commenting and watching!
I have an Enco holder where both ends of the holder are adjustable. It was fairly expensive back about 20 years ago, about $130, I think it was. Great holder. By the time I decided to buy a second, they had discontinued it. I seem to remember that Aloris has a one ended version. But it’s even more, at least in today’s dollars.
Neat my monarch 10ees original quick change tool holder has indexable tooling like that but instead of ball bearings it uses radial splines. Nice video
Dave
Thanks The Mechanist and thanks for watching and commenting!
Heh, cut down an eBayed lathe toolholder recently and did not expect it to be as tough as it was - never really put two and two together that it was hardened tool steel. Let's hear it for carbide end mills.
That's a super cool tool holder - not sure why someone hasn't put one like that on the market.
Jim Nelson They have put one out very similar. Look at the Aloris catalog.
WOW what a great looking and functioning tool. I can see endless uses for this tool. Tell Tom he better step up his game. lol
Thanks Douglas and thanks for watching and commenting!
Have that same hacksaw!! My favorite one ever
Very nice. I can see that you are a real pro.
Thanks tompas11 and thanks for commenting and watching!
"Thanks for Watching"
Thanks for sharing, Robin!
My pleasure!
Great video! You have such a wealth of information and experience. Can't wait to see what else you'll share with us.
Thanks, and thanks for watching and commenting!
Nice tool . I could really use one like that for chamfering . Keep up the good work
Thanks and thanks for commenting and watching!
Enjoyed the video. Thanks for sharing
Thanks Asaad and thanks for commenting and watching!
Robin, very nice!! Your videos are awesome!
Thanks Ruben and thanks for commenting and watching!
man !! you are a very good machinist. I thought some other guys were good but you do very precise work.
Thank you for sharing its making me think more LOL
Manny
Thanks Manuel and thanks for watching and commenting!
Excellent video Robin, thanks for sharing. This is the 7th video that I have watched and have been quite impressed with the clarity of your communication, and the impeccable quality of your work. Keep up the great work, and keep the videos coming! Very much looking forward to all future work from you. Be Well.
Thanks and thanks for watching and commenting.
Didn't Artisan Makes want !.your ! Site ! Too !??
Another great video!!
Thanks for sharing...More please!! :)
Thanks Neil and thanks for commenting and watching!
keep them coming brother I really enjoy you expertise! sure would like to see a video on some air bearing spindle design and work.
Thanks TheSageBen. I have some ball spindle designs that will be stiffer than air spindles and have sub 10 microinch trueness of rotation that will probably show up as a video series down the road. I design/make diamond rotary dresser spindles for a living and many of those are sub 5 micro inch tir using class 7/9 angular contact bearings.
Thanks for commenting and watching!
Robin
Now that one I'll be really waiting for Robin. If it's not already done can you go into a bit of detail about how to keep the bearings in the truest alignment possible? There seems to be fairly limited amount of information available at least in the books I happen to own right now about just how it's done for high precision spindles.
really interesting Rob enjoyed it , keep up the good work.Alan.
Thanks Alan and thanks for commenting and watching!
Awesome work/explanation/demonstration.....very cool on the surface grinder set ups
ATB
Chuck
Thanks Chuck and thanks for commenting and watching! Much more to come. But I don't have a cool dog like Howie :(
ATB,
Robin
Nice work thanks for sharing it!
Thanks Rob and thanks for commenting and watching!
Hello Robin,
Sorry to bother you... I was wondering as the video made in 2016 has the tool stood the test of time? have you made any further modifications?
Take care.
Paul,,
Amazing Videos, I really enjoy watching your passion! You rock!
Hi Robin, beautiful work, and well thought out commentary. I have a small shop in the garage and have been thinking about getting a surface grinder. I'm still thinking about what size would suit my space and project requirements! I rebuilt my 1935 sb 9" , and my no date step pulley Cincinnati horizontal Miller with a Bridgeport j head. Love your channel! Keep the videos coming!
Love the content. Can not get enough. Please show us the depth mic and any other special tools to make grind life easier. I have soo many questions for you.
Sounds like ! Boredom ! Gets the Better ! Of you ! Here !.
Hi Robin, watched this for the second time now...
Thanks for the many good tips , I especially liked the ball trick for indexing.
I use a Mulifix B tool post on my Weiler lathe dowelpinned fixed to the lathe. Really like this system, it´s very rigid and can still be indexed in 9 degrees steps similar in function to Your design even if the base is pinned down. Have also free handed trepaning tools from DNMG inserts, but will steal Your method on the grinder next time... Grinding the DNMG inserts was facilitated by the insert overhanging the holder by about 0.1¨ so that the holder could be mostly left alone.
Thanks for watching and commenting.
Love the idea and the manufacture. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks Randy and thanks for commenting and watching!
Wow, 300 likes and 163 comments in two days. You are moving up, quite deservedly! OK, I promised to watch all the videos in your machining playlist, and I have done that, happily. Where should I look next? In the meantime "WE WANT MORE! (stomp stomp), WE WANT MORE! (stomp stomp)... 8^)
Hi Bob, I am glad I didn't steer you wrong. Much more to come and editing one on a large ID lap build and lapping some large D2 tool steel mold parts
Thanks for your support!
Robin
very useful information professor! lol. great video as always
Thanks Travis and thanks for commenting and watching!
very nice and interesting jobs you're doing out there ! congrats from France !
Thanks, glad you are finding the content useful. Thanks for watching and commenting!
I have always just hand ground the insert releaf . You are correct in that, you do not want to upset the edge geometry. The insert will always chip, and/or break at the worst moment. When in doubt, change it out. Especially if you have ground the insert. In the last 10 years, I have ground thousands of inserts. I can see spending the time to modify the tool, but not the insert.
thanks for another great video. i feel like ive learned a lot
Thanks Emmas and thanks for commenting and watching!
Thanks for showing some innovation in tool bit holding. It makes me want to build one, not as well defined as yous though.
Great Video, Great Project, Rob!!! I know its a lot of work. I definitely want to make one! (or two - you can always use a backup, or if you're like me you have about 8 lathes.... )
Eight Lathes Too MANY !
Awesome little tool mod! It would reduce loosening my quick change post to reposition 10 fold. Did you choose to seat the tool on the balls only for accuracy or have you found that a flat face mount and spring detent tend to slip? Keep sharing your great work.
Awesome to be able to learn from masters such as yourself. Thank you for sharing this with the world!
What you effectively did was eliminated most of the rigidity from the toolholder. With hss it wouldn't matter, but with carbide you most assuredly decreased tool life. Just something to keep in mind, perhaps convenience outweighs tool life for you.
It Doesn't Matter ! Anyway !
Superb!
Thanks William and thanks for commenting and watching!
I love this little fussy work, just wish I could see better to do it! Your channel has great content, hope to see more. Just a quick question, and you can tell me its none of my business. Is this your home shop or are you filming at work?
Thanks Stan, lots more to come and the answer to both questions is yes.
Ha ha .. home and work .. well equipped shop you have. :)
You are very precise, you are in the same school as me!
Whatever that school is?
AN ! ACCO !! NERD !!
what a fantastic idea
if only I had the time to make one
Thanks Simon, and thanks for commenting and watching!
ATB, Robin
Man, you do nice work!
Thanks Richard and thanks for watching and commenting!
GREAT VIDEO !!!
DITTO ON "MOLY" --- USED ON " LITTLE-BOY'S " BARREL .
Hi Robin. Awesome work as always!
I am assuming that this was a necessary build due to the fact that your tool post is fixed and can't rotate??? I want to remove the compound on my lathe as you did, but I think I will allow the tool post to be rotated. I don't need the precision you do, and I think it will still be a great improvement in rigidity.
Thanks so much for your great work!
Regards
Question: did you use a rotary table or something else to establish your ball dented recesses for this job?
Awesome video by the way. No own else is doing this kind of coverage on UA-cam. I mean there are a lot of good machining channels, but what you are doing here is not for the garden variety. Thanks
I think he just layed out a bolt hole pattern on the DRO :)
Great video, and quality work. Forgive my ignorance but what is the benefit of swivelling the end of the tool holder over simply turning the tool post?
My toolpost is locked straight to the ways.
Maybe you can help with a necking tool holder for grind reliefs that go into the face. I need a 35 deg diamond that can plunge into the face and O.D. at a 45 deg angle for a grind relief. Most of the off the shelf stuff are not cleared properly and I have to diamond wheel the inserts.
You tha man!
Best machining videos, keep up the good work!
Thanks hevi and thanks for commenting and watching!
Us old guys just used to grind a HSS tool bit for that and throw it in the box for them next time
Hi Robin: Excellent work all around and very useful tool for many purposes. I happen to have exactly the same holder from SARS and intend to build a duplicate. I noticed how hard the holder steel is and I' ll anneal the bar before cutting and machining.. Did you temper or treated the bar after machining? I also noticed how close you come to the edge on the sides of the bar. I estimated .050" more or less given the width of the bar, and OD of indents. When I finish the project, I'll send you a picture and report.
Regards
Jorge
Thanks George, IMO you don't want to soften the tool pocket at all. That is why I grabbed it in the vise with aluminum jaws so it would not get tempered back all. You could temper back the whole shank except for the tool pocket so sawing and machining would be easier. Since I only tempered the areas to a slightly softer state there is no need to do any other heat treatment after machining. I will look forward to your pictures.
Thanks for commenting and watching.
Robin
Nicely done!
Thanks Dick, Thanks for commenting and watching!
ATB, Robin
Wow! Nice work. Can I ask the reason for all the plastic covering on the grinder? New to surface grinding myself so I want to understand the reason. Thanks in advance.
Thanks Pete, Grinding creates a lot of dust and even with a dust extractor it gets everywhere. So the plastic just helps keep things cleaner. Thanks for commenting and watching!