The Maelzel Canon: Beethoven's secret Metronome Manual!
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- Опубліковано 2 кві 2024
- Beethoven's metronome marks are among the greatest mysteries of the last century. Many musicians have given up on achieving his metronome marks simply because they seem to be ridiculously fast. Often people go search for a solution where there is none. The solution is right in front of us.
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What Mr W. doesn't want to see, is that this is all a coincidence.
Whoever wrote the canon did not choose an eight-note in the m.m to get a specific relation to the sixtheen-note "ta ta".
An eight-note is the ONLY option that makes sense at that tempo.
You don't mark an Allegretto with a sixtheen- note, and a quarter is to slow.
When you realise that, you also understand that " ta ta ta are the strokes of the pendulum" is just an explanation of the "words" - nothing else.
I remember watching a similar video you have about this cannon but, to my surprise, it seems that this piece of evidence wasn't paid that much attention. I remember that all my doubts about WBMP were gone with such conclusive piece of evidence. Thank you for your work!
This is pretty compelling in two different ways. It's good evidence for Whole Beat counting, and good evidence that the public didn't like slow tempos.
Yes, the sixteenth notes describe the ticking of the metronome.
But that isn't necessairly "the ticking of the pulse of this actual piece". It just mocks a metronome - and that metronome, in this case, ticks TWO times per beat. Beethoven wanted a faster ticking metronome than the actual pulse of the music, and chose two ticks per beat.
The tempo marking is very clear: 72 eights per minute. That makes it in itself a very slow allegretto..., but then, it lightens up by the ticking sixteenth notes. And he changed it to 88, when it was to be played in the symphony, and not sung, which is also understandable.
Taken at half of THAT speed, it loses all its wit, and becomes a total snooze.
Being from Belgium, I always thought of you more like an Hercule Poirot.
He is missing the moustache.
More like a mature Tintin 😄
Thank you for this wonderful and enlightening research. It is greatly needed.
Wonderful video this is one of my favourite pieces of evidence
The solution is very convincing to me!
I don't understand why a canon that's inspired by the sound of a ticking metronome has to literally correspond with ticks of the metronome. Do the birdcalls in the 6th symphony literally exactly sound like birds? The music is *imitating* at the end of the day. Schindler saying the ta ta ta are ticks of the metronome is just saying that's where the imitation and inspiration of the metronome is. It's also important to bring up the topic of Maelzel as he clearly states how to use his metronome in the September 1821 issue of the Allgemeine musikalische Zeitung. Maelzel writes "Achtzig halbe Noten nenne ich geschwind, weil im 4/4 Tackte 40 Takte auf eine Minute fielen." To translate, I call half note 80 fast because in a 4/4 bar, 40 bars fell in one minute. Then he goes on to faster tempi and says the same stuff which further solidifies the point.
It doesn't have to, but in this case it's explicitly written, that the "Ta-Ta-Ta" syllables are the Schläge=Ticks of the Metronome.
Don't these people ever test their theories at the keyboard before they issue them?
Forgetting WB for a moment how do you determine the correct tempo for a piece of music? Recently I've been studying Beethoven Op33 no 5 tempo marking, Allegro ma non troppo. So far I haven't found one performance on UA-cam that takes any notice of the ma non troppo. Secondly, how fast is Allegro? Allegro should not sound like e.g. Allegro con brio or Allegro molto and yet, all too often that is what we get, not a proper Allegro meaning lively or cheerful.
quite interesting, certainly it sounds much more musical, at the same time I believe that the musicality can also be achieved in different other ways, that are not necessarily because of the art piece author original intentions but rather because of this "magical harmony" that surrounds music.
In a way someone could say "if it sounds good, it sounds good", to put it in a few words. I am also very aware that this characteristics can be appreciated differently according one own's perspective, mostly nowadays it seems to be the case that "speed" only leads to the utmost level of musical proficiency according many.
This piece sounds much better played slowly no doubt.
Another interesting fact is that "taste" can be acquired and not necessarily something natural.
Most young people will likely not find the appealing in music played at slower tempos, because of the idea of what "beauty" is. Most will aim to become the faster player only, even their hearing might adapt to that goal as they grow as musicians.
This videos are great, since I learn lots from them. I would hardly have access to this quality information elsewhere.
Ahhh, another fun example of Schindler being discredited as he wanted to influence things his in own way. 😆
I like my own theory on Beethoven’s crazy tempo markings: We know he was grumpy and depressed, so he was just trolling us with his wild MM numbers. 🤣
Complimenti per il lavoro accurato!
I'm fascinated by your work and want to thank you for your tireless efforts in sharing your research. I do wander, though ... there must be some moment in history where the changeover in the use of the metronome occurred. What point in historical musical time did this changeover occur and why? Is there any written evidence of using the metronome the way we use it today? Great youtube channel, you always keep me thinking about the way I perform music from the Baroque to Romantic time period. 🙂
Wilhelm Furtwängler recordings... Amazing. Almost in WB. Since I discovered him I could no longer listen to other conductors such as Zander... (no offense to this great conductor). Clearly he knew something
I don't think Sherlock would be impressed by this.
He would ask if Mr. W doesn't notice that when the canon is performed in whole beat, the sixtheen note "ta ta's" become eightnotes and line up with the notevalue in the m.m.
The result is - single beat ticks.
Not very good if you want to show a whole beat metronome, is it?
Sherlock would also say that Mr. W is lucky that the tempo of the canon makes an eightnote the natural choice in the m.m.
If it was faster it could have been a quarternote and he would end up "proving" quadruple beat.
Sherlock would read the whole text more carefully and understand that what Schindler says about "the tempo of the Allegretto" and "the ta ta ta's" are two seperate statements, each of them connected to things mentioned earlier.
Both the Allegretto and the "text" have already been mentioned.
Wim tries not to use clickbait challenge (impossible)
Charles Bluett tries not to take things too personally (impossible)
Beethoven had 2 different size Metronomes, (7 inch and 12 inch) given to him by Maezel…One could presume logically that the latter (Maezel) would have shown the former (Beethoven) how the Metronome worked in order to promote the acceptance by the Viennese music public. Likewise, two metronomes debunk the “broken metronome” hypothesis; Beethoven could always use one to check the other…Unless all the apologists explanations base their arguments on an assumption that Beethoven was a complete idiot,crazy, as Beethoven counted 61 coffee beans to make a cup of coffee, immersed his head completely in water to stay awake, or quote a manuscript copy about a song where he said the metronome couldn’t do more than establishing a tempo…yet he was obsessive about the MM for all his Symphonies as being important…
A musician should perform music as they respond to it. They will find their tempo. We don't need metronomes.
The point is that the composers took a lot of time to metronomise their works. So it must have mattered to them. At least during a snapshot of a moment in history.
well then certainily at the end of the 1st measure, the last two 32nd notes should also be one per metronome tick (since they both have the 'ta' syllable). if your theory would have been the case, then the metronome should have had to only tick once in the two movements (i.e. only tick when moving leftwards or only tick when moving rightwards). this makes 0 sense. i am still baffled how you think this works when your whole system breaks down when playing any triple metronomic marking (e.g. dotted quarter note in a 6/8 time signature). the ear cannot help but hear two perfectly equally loud beats and perceive them as separate.
you bring up physicists and their readings of the pendulum. i find this comparison tangential at best (considering some things that physicists had to say about music). either way, i read my clock with every tick being a second, maybe i should start counting seconds every two ticks?
It doesn’t break down in ternary time…
He has a video explaining ternary, plus one recording of waltzes that really feel like waltzes. Please, don't search for the 5th cat's leg, meaning that it's obvious that the 'ta' refers to the 16th because that is the rythm at the start of the piece, it's so self explanatory... How would you match the explanation to the piece of music then? In other words, which theory better portrays the description of how the 'ta' go with the tick of the metronome: SBMP or WBMP? It's so clear
@@dorette-hi4jthe obsession of the romantics with the cross rhythms of three against two gains sense with that metronomic logic.
I think there is a parallel with the Covid p(L)andemic. The world view of a lot of people would collapse if they would admit that the were fooled by the MSM and their politicians.
I think that in your case fellow musicians also experience cognitive dissonance when they have to admit that the way they play the pieces they've studied, twice to fast.
sure there is a parallel as you say, if you are an idiot to believe conspiracy theories.
Bored 😢
“There are no uninteresting things, only uninterested people.”