Why Certain Clone Tactics were so RARE to see on a Battlefield
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- Опубліковано 3 чер 2024
- Doom's guys just had shields cuz they were cool tbh
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![Standard Clone Trooper Tactics vs Standard CIS Tactics [Visualised]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/DKldUbdpJww/mqdefault.jpg)
![Standard Clone Trooper Tactics vs Standard CIS Tactics [Visualised]](/img/tr.png)
Punching a droid is also a rare tactic
You sure? There was an entire division that did it, it can't be THAT rare
I mean hell it happens first episode of clone wars, to much less effect butttt we aren't talking about that one
@@jarekbutler8649 I was actually going to say something similar, forget that clone. He was "a waste of genetic material." -Boss of Delta Squad
@@jarekbutler8649 that's only because the clones who failed at punching Droids tended to be weeded out rather quickly.
I wonder why...
@@Mikalent survival of the fittest is an extremely important aspect of the clone wars i would assume, how effective do you think the clones would have been with Droid numbers and zero training, simply a figure it out! If it works you won't die and you'll be able to do it again!
Republic Military: Can we get shields?
The Senate: Yes, but also no
Commander Doom: So I get shields cause I’m only in one episode
LOL
We also saw the 65th riot troops use em in tcw
@@nebcyt-notenoughbraincells419 does that mean that there are at least 64 other riot corps? Wow, the Republic sure are in a terrible state.
Hello again
@@malarkey5323 hello there 👋
Clone Commander: So the Geonosians don't know we're coming. Let's give them an orbital bombardment and ambush after rescuing the hostages.
Yoda: No! Face them head on, you must.
Clone Commander: Um.. why?
Yoda: Looks good on the silver screen, it will.
I believe Dooku was down there at the time, at least for all the clones knew, and it's possible the clones' ultimate loyalty was secretly to the Sith the whole time.
@@theinvisibleskulk4563 nah, yoda is spot on : It looks good. PLUS: It was the FIRST battle in over 100 years fought, so errors are normal. PLUS: Bombardment even later on is rarely done, there are things like planetary shields preventing it, plus, acclamators have weapons to do so? I dont think so. The MK2 yes, the upgraded one Delta Squad found? Absolutely. Early production ones? Nope!
@@christianresel8051
No, they had weapons just not many to be considered for proper frontline combat.
They did not have venetors at this point to do this and even if they did that, anti-air would destroy a sizable bunch of them, it would not be a bright move.
@@aleksandersokal5279
Acclamators still had basic weaponry on them including Turbolasers
AA would never touched space faring vehicles.
Because the famous “Warcrime fake surrender” was such an effective tactic.
Hol up.
Why is it a war crime to fake surrender? The most famous line in military history is "all Warfare is based in deception" so why would this particular deceit be any worse than others? Is it a war crime if I surrender earnestly and then reinforcements arrive and blast my enemies out of the water before it can be finalized, completely out of mine or anyone else's control?
I don't know, just seems like a rule that was implemented cause someone got salty after they fell for it.
@@user-th9jt4es5i because then no surrender from either side will be accepted lmao, that means the war is gonna go on much longer and people will fight much harder. you don't want your enemy fighting much harder because they think you're not gonna accept a surrender from them, even in an obviously losing situation
you really didn't think that one through
Clones: Sir we need to use better tactics!
Jedi: Oh yeah... it’s War Crime time!
Most underused clone tactic: deploying the lancer battalion
Yeah, that didn't catch on as the early days waned...
Probably because its complete suicide bringing melee focused non force sensitives into combat against the droid army.
@@samuelbishop3316 depends on how. That unit is highly specialized. Theyd been better off if the Kaminoans and GAR insisted on having them as a foot unit. With almost blaster proof but still light enough to move armor. An then train the hell outta then so it didnt matter if was a CIS Droid force or a Sep organic army if they got close enough with all sorts of melee weapons they were very well trained with theyd butcher their enemies and itd been a very different story. Much like the Magna Droids why not counter with literal Clone Ninja divisions tearing their way through everything that gets in their way. Just a proper choice of where and when to sick them on the enemy would be key. Bottlenecks or ambushes in the right spots where Droids cant spray an pray or can only stuff so many though choke points an sensitive areas thag cant be shot up due to importance. Them sorta things
If we're thinking about tactics, I'm thinking about the Clone Commandos.
We need an IMPERIAL COMMANDO game!
@@geetslys yes we need our sequel
@@geetslys alternatively, a separatist/rebel commando.
In the former, you would play at the commando droid or some other specialized unit, and in the latter, you'd play as highly trained rebel soldiers.
@@pennyforyourthots In the latter, I can see a quasi-spinoff mission where you play as one of the rebels on Scariff (you see but don't play as the named characters, of course).
Both an Imperial Commando and Rebel Commando game were planned during the initial release of Republic Commando, but both were scrapped as Republic Commando hit the shelves, as projected profits for the game were low.
Imperial Commando would've seen you playing as an Imperial era Delta Squad without Sev in the Galactic Empire, and Rebel Commando would've seen you play as Sev in the Rebel Alliance.
A slave to destiny, they were.
A slave that thinks for themselves, dangerous they are considered to be.
"A man chooses, a slave obeys"
Andrew Ryan, Bioshock
Republic: "Why are we losing clones so fast? We don't have enough to keep this up!"
Jedi: "Let's just use a tactic from over a thousand years ago that requires charging in which would be suicide for anyone else!"
Yoda: "MHMHMHM! Agreeable this tactic is." Proceeds to snort up more Ketamine
Skywalker me Anakin!! I have overdosed on death sticks, and I’m going to die! Argargargargarg-
@@ramenbomberdeluxe4958 wrong character lol
@@vladtheimpalerofficial Bold of you to assume I meant Yoda there >_>
Jokes aside, it’s Obi Wan referring to Anakin
The shields ONLY worked on RIngo Vinda because it wasn't an open battlefield. It was a closed space with lots of hallways and corridors. The Clone Army didn't have to worry about being flanked from the sides. The French tried the same tactic in World War 1 with big shields, and it went horribly wrong. Shields were heavy, slow, and the people carrying them got tired very fast. And the biggest flaw was that shield operators could only use one hand. They couldn't reload their guns with one hand, while holding the shield.
@SaracenGamer - But then they would have to worry about re-charging the Droid (since carry the heavy shield drains so much power), and protecting the droid from enemy fire coming in from the sides.
Really weird seeing a Jedi, let alone Kenobi, utilizing a shield.
Jedi their light sabers did have. What use for a shield have they.
@@matthewjames6826 Exactly.
@@michaelandreipalon359 aside from Kenobi going full paladin mode.
Because the war was never meant to be won by any side, just to keep going on untill the clones could kill the jedi
No, its because the showrunners/writers were incompetent and Geetsly spent an entire video pulling theories out of his ass to justify a pothole which is what this is, why wouldn't a greatly outnumbered force use every possible advantage at their disposal? Imagine using the fact that rocket launchers have limited ammo as a reason for not using them in war even though they are very useful. Shit based on that logic every modern military out there should stop using Rpgs, Javelins or disposable rocket launchers that only fire one shot like the M136 AT4 rocket launcher, which is widely used by the US military. Its more likely that the showrunner didnt want to spend extra scenes showing diverse weapons and tactics since most of the show revolves around the Jedi and its easier to show copy and paste clone rifleman charging behind a jedi, then clones taking cover in bubble shields in the background, clone snipers shooting in the distance, clone mortar teams and antitank units firing rocket launchers everywhere. Even when it comes to armor the only armor type you generally see in the clone wars is the ATTE, even though we know the republic has a diverse arsenal, we also know that the Clones weren't the only ones who fought for the Republic, every Republic world had their own standing army yet how often do we see them in the show? Just because it doesn't appear in the media doesn't mean it didnt happen or that the Republic wasn't using those weapons/tactics. The Driods usually deployed a lot of armor in their columns the notion that the clones didnt have Anti tank units in bulk defies reason.
The Rotary Cannon probably wasn't used in large numbers because it burned ammo too quickly. Lots of battles during the Clone Wars have the Clones isolated on alien worlds without resupply for several weeks or more. They had to make their supplies last as long as possible. They gave the Rotary Cannon to Clones (like Heavy) who proved they could be trusted to make every shot count. Same issue with Rockets. They were powerful but expensive to make, and limited ammo. So only trained Rocket Clones could be trusted to use them well.
Geetslys:"Exclusive use of clone weapon specialists and arc troopers."
Me: I'm something of a clone weapon specialist myself.
Time to write a fanfic about a clone legion that uses nothing but a shield phalanx and rotary cannons
Yeah that argument of there being no good targets is complete bullshit. Snipers aren’t designed to just take out officers and specialists but just about any infantry threat. Given the existence of the B2’s, Commando Droids, and Droidekas being common on most battlefields. Snipers have plenty of targets to deal with. This is especially true as a support roll with other squads where they could deal with the worst threats for forward units.
This isn’t even mentioning when the GAR was in offensives against Seperatist strong points where you have many emplacements, turrets, and defenses with manned personnel. Snipers could pick those manning the defenses at best and serve as suppression at worst.
Now as for the other stuff...Shields are only good in close quarters and would be hit with heavy firepower in open areas. Rotary cannons and Rocket Launchers don’t need to be with every squad but maybe a specialist few, plus you have the clones use a side arm to supplement the weapons. And the Ray shield expansion bubble was likely resource intensive as it probably needed a lot of energy, plus guards to prevent anyone from sneaking behind and destroying it. Honestly the ray shield bubble is kinda stupid if you think about it.
Some my thoughts too. They shoulda MASS PRODUCED A crap ton of rockets an made their training common at least to a basic competent level. Upgraded their gattlings to be easily reloadable. Mass produced shields to present entire phalanxes that could mass march and then temporarily break open to allow others to spend few seconds attacking an then have Snipers basically EVERY damn WHERE with orders to shoot every enemy droid and organic alike not smart enough to stay in cover. Make them paranoid an realize its probably best not to give GAR snipers plenty or target practice an combat experience. Just these little things could a made even a majorly outnumbered GAR more then capable of curb stomping a ridiculous amount of Droid armies. Enough that even with massive numbers the Seps still would had to have been more careful and not send them so openly charging all the time. All the Droidkas and B2s arent a lot of good if in your one little area handful of snipers keep blasting their heads off an a few gattling guns an a pair of rockets or so keep mowing down everything else.
I reckon shield as part of a ships anti-boarding compliment would have helped, saw it far too often that clones would get slaughtered due to a lack of cover in the halls of venators and other ships, e.g on the concordia or with green company where speed of trooper didnt matter but would offer a stronger defence
@@robertagu5533 Those Phalanxes would get demolished by Tanks, Air Support and Artillery
@@nobleman9393 obviously yes by themselves but for alot of the open areas neither side usually ONLY had just 1 of something an of course its just an extra tactic that would be used was thinking for very specific scenarios in the places itd be most effective an useful like any other tactic. If theyd done something like that at the VERY start of the war till they was right on the Droids and then split into the usual tactics theyd nearly destroyed most the CIS forces when all the Clone Air an artillery and armor... Which waa also crushing the Droids was working with them. That or just stuck with it an strait ran the Droid army over.. Just 1 possible scenario
I think the same a lot
On the weight of the Z6, it was probably a bit heavy, but we did see Thorne use his to beat the tar out of quite a few droids, so I can't imagine it being that heavy.
I was about to say the same thing. Also, when Hevy picks up the Z6 at the armory for the first time, he acts like he has used the blaster since the dawn of time. He likely would have had trouble with the weight, especially if he was a shiny.
@@nathandowney6481 Funny, because it was his main weapon during his training as a cadet in "clone cadets"
which happened Chronologically before "rookies"
hence why he has experience with it kekw
Well technically speaking each battalion of clones that are breed in kamino have a few predetermined roles that’s more than likely set up by the cloners to have different classes of troops on the ground. So hevy was a preprogrammed heavy gunner as was Thorn for example. But on the occasions when clones that excell in a different area than their preassinged roles will have the wit and tactics of that preassinged role but would be moved into a role that best suited them. The best example that’s been documented are pilots and the regular clone being promoted to a role he wasn’t originally created for like arc trooper or any sort of rank ie Captain Rex to commander Rex in season 7. It’s also another reason in a sense why the commandos and proper arcs never really got newer clones of the same type to fill their rank. The only thing that made them more like a proper person is from the Jedi encouraging individuality between all of them. When order 66 is activated the chips affect their minds altering memories into bad ones which is why they have a hole personality shift. As a side effect of the reprogramming of memories they’re perception is hindered severely and they are reduced in their combat abilities which leads to erectile dysfunction like state in the sense that they can’t perform like they used to in the past. Which can drive them to insanity ie, crosshair in the bad batch is the best example of this. This insanity is a risk because clones cost a lot of money if one where to seppku themselves it would be extremely expensive to replace which is the main reason clones are phased out for conscripts
@Guy_With_No_Name Oh right...completely forgot about that episode...
I think that it’s pretty heavy. Heavy managed to knock down two droids, which weight several hundred pounds apiece, by lobbing it at them, which took a lot of strength as you can see him contort his body for maximum torque, and even then the Z-6 didn’t go far.
Yeah tactics like waving a flag that says shoot me are unsurprisingly rare
the rotary cannons would need to be paired up to be effective. one to fire, the other to cover fire while reloading. Since the main enemy during the war was droids, they did not care about being mowed down if it shuts down a rotary cannon, making the previous plan weak.
the Z6 is so massive and is looking like its such a front heavy and unwieldy block of fast rotating metal. There is a reason why there are no real handheld miniguns in combat usage.
The reason hand held miniguns are rare is expense. More than utility problems. Also they are effing complex too. With many intricate parts. That would likely make them easily jammed up. By dirt and such out in the field. Imagine the disastrous torque. A spinning set of barrels would cause. If they suddenly got jammed to a stop. Gah the HORROR!
@@matthewjames6826 I disagree. In the military, there are field deployed miniguns (actually the name minigun refers to the M134, but that is the weapon I am talking about) that are mounted on trucks and helicopters. I think it’s less about maintenance and more about shear weight as one of those weighs 85lbs without ammo.
@@prestonlee9965 Lightweight mods exist but even those are over 40lbs.
With the Z6 rortary-canon and the rocket launchers, it makes negative sense to not use them. The GRA is modeled after WW2 fighting forces like USA, UK and Germany. They all had roughly 9-10 guys per platoon wiht 1 lmg (an eqivalent of the Z6 rortary).In addition most companaies (rouglhy 3 platoons) had heavy weapon teams with rocket-launchers and small mortars. Sure all the big players in WW2 had troubles from time to time supplying these "specialised" equipmenst, but they all did it from start to finish, so these things surley had to be worth it.
The only reason the GRA doesnt use stuff like the Z6, is because when the GRA was first shown, the creators werent big military geeks and didnt know better. Now thats just how the GRA works and looks like, regardless how stupid it is. The creators of new shows probably just dont want their GRA to look too diffrent. This means a few extra bits for an episode is ok, but the main structure stays the same.
(also i think the arty the GRA used on Christophses wasnt utelized often enough. It looks small enough to be a 1 or 2 gunship job. The guns were so effective in that battle, that like 4 or 5 of them decided the winner. The GRA should have been using more arty. Especialy when going back to the WW2 analogy. Arty was the main killer, and one of the most important weapons of the whole war)
actually you're wrong, the USA did not have LMGs in their infantry squads but in separate weapons squads which were often in their own platoons.
rocket launchers wereuseually in the platoon level and even teh squad level in certain german units (panzer lehr division had a panzerschreck and 2 lmgs in every panzergrenadier squad, aswell as a number of panzerfausts).
weapons platoons in companies and battalions were useually mortars, medium machine guns and anti-tank guns (AT guns later replaced in korea with recoiless rifles and then replaced again after vietnam with heavy missiles like TOWs)
There was probably another reason why the shields weren’t used: flanking. Think about it. If you got a droid behind/ to the side of the wall of clones, they would be absolutely massacred. The French tried the shield tactic in World War 1, and ended up with the same problems, as well as having to manually pull back the bolts on their rifles. The republic probably should have invested in SMG-like blasters instead of shields.
Rifles can do good just the same actually. Not as ergonomic as SMGs but you can still be fast with a Assault Rifle. Clones can still use their DC-15's to great effect and also the small carbine thingie that they have occasionally as well.
But, Yeah. GAR should've done flanking.
Uh, about that bolt-pulling stuff: everyone had to do it.
France was already seriously exploring the development of semi-automatic rifles before the war; a step ahead of every other country that was involved.
@@grugmangaming5152 The small carbines are also DC-15-series rifles, they’re the 15S model. The 15S’s larger cousin is the 15A.
I’m a tank crewmen in the army, the lack of maneuver warfare and constant combined arms of armor, infantry and air assets bothers me. The blind charges annoy me
Go real military! Especially US military the services rock! For all their hard work and the sacrifices they have done! To protect us here at home and abroad.
Because Jedi are poor tacticians
This comment was sponsored by the Admiral Tarkin.
*proceeds to built death star instead of funding the tie defender program*
That comment is probably true to a certain extent. But the jedi had the force to guide them. Also some great tacticians and strategists though rare. Probably also got to shine because of the war. Who otherwise would never have gotten noticed otherwise.
@@LCM-vo1rj *Proceeds to make SEVERAL tactical blunders in the coming years*
@@samuelbishop3316 To be fair, he was not a big fan of the Death Star and was on the verge of canceling the project several times. The only reason that he did not fund the TIE Defender program is that Thrawn made and lost a bet with Director Krennic while Governor Price blew up the factory with an AT-AT.
@@samuelbishop3316 Tarkin was right, but he wasn’t a good tactician either. Poor TIE Defender.
The shields might've been useful as mobile cover, if they were fitted with a "foot", so they could be placed on the ground, take 3 or more of them, and place them in a half circle and you have a baricade.
Shieldbearers should be armed with, of course, a shield, a DC-17 in hand and a DC-15s on their back - Their main tactics, advance while covered by the shield, using the DC-17 to attack, then place the shields at choke points and switching to the DC-15s.
While they would be slow, because of the weight, in hall ways and urban areas, they should be able to easily block off routes, almost "labyrinth board game" style (google it if you don't know it)
If I was in a star wars universe, I would start getting some clone army. Start a few clones and slowly grow big. So I can have a town with income to build more clones and then start advancing whatever technology I can get my hands on.
Clubbing general grievous was a super rare tactic.
As there was a zero percent chance of survival.
The Galactic Republic’s Grand Army couldn’t used for two major reasons, one is the situational of battles like camouflage or specialized gear like winter gear, and second is usually costs of using said tactics whether in credits and clones.
Actually the blast shield showed up in the episodes where the dutchess was sneaking around.The corasaunt gaurd had them
That were probably Riot shields and not combat shields
@@trustnot5793 thats true but looked similar
The big shields( kinda like irl riot shields) would be kinda bulky and heavy meaning that they would be hard to use in larger battle fields were maneuverability would be extremely important, and in larger battle fields there would be heavier weapon firing like rockets, this is important because the shields or best used in large groups meaning there would be clones stacked on top of each other meaning one cannon and a whole squad would be gone
Even for the case of Weight in episodes like when Grevious Boards Kenobi's Cruiser the presence of Blast shields would've still been useful in preserving clone lives while they fell back to the Escape pods
The rotary cannon and rocket launchers could actually work as frontline weapons if you implemented the Shield tactic mentioned earlier in the video. If you had an alternating fire rate, you could keep up a near constant barrage that, while not utilizing it's full fire rate capacity, does allow for a much more sustained assault. All you'd really have to do is just have less clones fire and have their bros cover them when they reload behind the shields. It's definitely slow, but it seems like it'd work.
Until they get flanked or massacred by CIS artillery and/or Snipers. Rocket launcher B2s would also probably work given the armor/firepower combo.
well the snipers could be used as scouts locate enemy positions and movements.
Or mass ambush where clones are not always face to face. You could also rapidly cut enemy supplies, mainly power leaving the battlefield with thousands of sleeping droids.
Could’ve been different shields, but as I recall didn’t the coruscant guard use shields?
So what I'm getting from all of this is if I used Doom and his Legion of Clone Chad's in a fanfic, say on New Plympto, that Doom and his team wouldn't be rocking a lot of Blaster Sheilds?
Also, I always thought the reason we only ever saw a Mobile Ray Sheild in the Battle of Christophsis was because most Sheilds weren't designed to move and those that were would no doubly consume a lot of power given how far they would have to project.
the lances from the OG one were some of my favorite. future tech and spaceships? better call in our
LANCE TROOPS ON SPEEDER BIKES
The picture of Obi-wan using both his lightsaber and a blast shield on the cover, looks so dang BADASS!!!!!
Your star wars are so freaking cool and beautiful to watch This is one of my favorite videos you made so far
Thank you so much 😀
I've only heard of three Clone snipers. That being Crosshairs, Sev, and the underrated Cooker.
There's something very cool about a clone ARC trooper going full paladin at the droids.
the Z-6's ammunition issue is demonstrated well in the episode where Hevy sacrificed himself (i dont remember the name). he was in 1 fight that didn't last very long and ran out of ammo and resorted to yeeting his cannon
I believe it is called "rookies"
@@theoverpreparerlamenters3r436 oh boy how did i forget that one lol
Non being flexible almost cost the GAR the war. They didnt have the numbers to be TOO rigid. Rushing often ISNT the ONLY OR best tactic. You can make quick offensives in your space Blitzkrieg and still not make a suicidal bayonet charge without the bayonet. Its kinda a "blunt object" style tactic to an Elite Clone Army of an Elite Commando/Bounty Hunter of an Elite warrior race all of whom WAS trained in diverse skills and tactics.
An was it REALLY so hard to make a gattling gun that was reloadable or carried a crap ton of rounds like their real life counterparts??
An is there a reason an energy version of a Rocket or Grenade Launcher cant be used...
An Snipers??? ID have had a TON of them and spread them out EVERYWHERE... All of these putting out more fire then you can shake a lightsaber at. At least with the snipers anyways. Sure even the most perceptive Sith or Jedi cant block multiple sniper rounds comin at them from multiple directions at same time AND watch out for EVERYTHING else on the battlefield as well
Your grammar was bad, but I understand. The army was too dang small to not be flexible.
The shields in that episode appeared to take both arms to carry, meaning someone had to continually rely on others to shoot while they blocked (like the jedi sword&shield tactics but more literal) and this only workes when facing enemies in one direction like the hallways aboard the factory or possibly in ship boardings
I thought this would be about all of Anakin and Obi Wan's war crimes.
I attempt doing the exact same tactics when playing Tiberium Wars. Only difference is I can build a base right next to the enemy’s. XD
Would of been good to see the Clones call in a Orbital Bombardment from some Venators on any Droid Forces without organic or tactical hostages, especially as its what the US Army did with they're Navy against the Viet Cong which was a major influence for Lucas in the original trilogy
using cover and doing anything but banzai charging are also extremely rare tactics
To be fair, the Jedi use a very effective tactic that was seriously underrated....WARCRIMES
Very nice video my dude! Always love hearing more about the clones
Glad you enjoyed!
both the republic and CIS suffer from a lack of special and heavy weapons in the infantry.
if you look at real life armies, a squad of 6-12 men will have 1-3 LMGS (or SAWs), a number of disposable 1-shot rockets (useually 1-2 per man), a number of grenade launchers or rifle grenades (1-6 useually), and often 1 or 2 multi-shot rocket launchers/recoiless rifles (and/or a number of guided missiles), and often 1-3 marksmen.
and then you have weapons platoons at company and battalion level (etc) for crew served weapons like tri-pod machine guns, mortars, heavy missiles, etc.
this is especially true of the battle droids, the Ryloth arc showed that B1s are roughly double the strength of a clone, meaning they can carry double the weight in weapons and ammo compaired to very fitt humans. one of the biggest advantages to useing humnaoid droids without built in weapons is the ability to switch weapons in combat, so if the squad marksman goes down, another droid can pick up said weapon and continue sniping, or if the repeater blaster goes down andother droid can pick up and continue laying down a high volume of fire, etc. and the effects of sniping, supressing fre from automatic weapons and bombardments from mortars and artillery are going to be very effective against organics like the clones and even jedi.
That about true artillery like the one seen in the clone wars movie during the battle of Cristosis and the second battle of Geonosis, as as well as the AT unit seen being destroyed during the final battle of Mygetto in EP 3.
I think you're forgetting about Palpatine too, just like he hindered the Separatists in some ways to drag the horrible war on, he'd want to do the same to the Republic and cause more casualties.
I would like to know more about the AV-7 Antivehicle Cannon.
There is a solution to the drawback of the z-6, if the clones have a second line of them behind the frontline group they can switch out when they need to reload the guns
Better solution: Roman testudo shield formation, open the shields just enough to poke a line of Z-6's out, barrage the enemy and then withdraw back into the formation once they run out, close the shields while troops switch positions, open again with the second line of Z-6's, rinse and repeat until the enemy is destroyed, then once everyone is done reloading, move in formation to the next assault stage
Well the Rotary Blaster Cannon was actually really easy to reload in its first iteration. If you look at the ones from the original Clone Wars show, the 15 minutes apiece episodes from Cartoon Network you will notice a "drum" magazine like thing just behind the barrels. That was exactly what I was. Once depleted you pulled it just like real world drum magazines and replaced it. But once the New Clone Wars show came out they changed it. The gold "pod" at the end of the gun, that last 1/3, is the gas magazine. The rear handle and firing mechanism would drop out of the way and you can then pull out the depleted gas pod and then add a new one. Takes about 10 seconds to do for either version of the Rotary Cannon.
Maneuver warfare, especially if you are a smaller, more elite, force is the go to option. If you give your soldiers portable heavy cover, they are incentivized to move slower and are thus prone to getting outmaneuvered themselves.
I think I remember reading the Z-6 Rotary cannon was about the same weight as it's real life counterpart, the M134D lightweight mod at about 19Kilograms or around 41lbs.
Which wouldn't seem all that heavy at first but if you're traveling and need to be fast then that's basically a 41lb weight you have to lug around and fire without a stable base to help with recoil. Certain clones would probably have had to undergo more rigorous strength training for proper handling of a weapon of that size.
For a frame of reference that's almost double what a loaded M249 weighs and about 50% larger than most general purpose machine guns like the M240 or MG5.
The answer to the problem of transporting Blast Shields, z-6s and Grenade launchers are combat vehicles. Heavily armored Gunships with shields could transport weapons and energy packs instead of troops. Speeder bikes could transport weapons or explosives. Light combat vehicles could transport heavy troopers with their weapons on a battlefield. Lastly droids designed specifically for defensive purposes. Shield droids have both a blast shields and a energy shield and can roll in front of troopers to soak up blaster fire.
Another note about Doom's tactics on Ringo Vinda. That particular formation is extremely easily flanked. While it is a very effective tactic when applied properly in the correct context, there aren't a lot of applications for that. Since the space station corridors were quite tight, this worked beautifully, but in most other scenarios it would've just been way too vulnerable. Sure, they could try a Roman turtle formation to counter the side flanking problem, but that's incredibly slow and an easy target for heavy artillery.
Standard earth militaried deploy saw's and rocket launchers regularily.
The extra ammo for the saw and spare rockets are split between the troops.
As far as the shield goes it could also because unlike that one moment where there in a corridor the fights usually take place in large open fields where they do have to move a lot and while blaster fire is one thing I doubt they can take artillery fire, so being a closed knit formation relying on blast shields might not work as well and same as to why individual ones wouldn't be as effective not just because of weight slowing them down, but it'll also make it hard to aim, and as far as rotary cannons and rocket launchers weren't just put up front since as soon as they die then the means to destroy armored vehicles and mow doen enemies is pretty much gone that tactic with Doom's squad actually made more sense and was really smart since it was in a hallway with already limited space to simply move which is also why it was smart using those rotary cannons with blast shields
I think that I found a solution to the problem with the z-6 and the rocket launcher. If their weight is the problem, then why didn't they attach them to vehicles? If there were spacial parts of AT-TE that those weapons could easily attach to and detach from, it will solve the problem and those guns could be used extancively throughout the war.
And, it could solve the ammunition problem as well. The AT-TE could carry a large amount of ammo.
If that was the case, I think that the kaminoans would agree to train larger quantities of heavy weapons troopers.
I wish to know everything about Yoda's hut. What it's made of, what's in it, what he eats, tools, everything.
Another problem I see with using sharpshooters in battle was that there was no guarantee that the area where the battles were being held had the terrain to make a sniper more useful! Take the battle of Umbara for example, most of the terrain the battles were fought on was (for the most part) relatively flat besides the odd tree or two! And the fact that there was so much flora on Umbara that the use of sharpshooters was more situational or obsolete!
Regarding snipers, probably the best use the GAR could put them to is over-watch and scouting. Scouting is the most obvious, move covertly under cover ahead of the main army to feed back intel on enemy formations. Overwatch is similar but typically the sniper finds a vantage point close to the main action and keeps the troops appraised of the wider situation and pending threats. Both provide the opportunity for targets of opportunity, if the sniper locates an enemy commander or communications specialist then they can kill them to disrupt the line of command, if they spot a column of vehicles or reinforcements incoming they can call in an artillery or air strike to make sure they don’t reach the combat.
We know this works, as it’s a big part of how snipers operate in our armies.
Me who is in the arma 3 501st legion unit: haha we used all these gadgets and weapons regularly!
Also, at least in the case of shields, they are heavy and impractical. Perhaps having a utility in the context of "urban" (read ship interior) warfare, but the GRA engaged in larger amounts of open field battles where such tactics would be absurd. Similarly for ray shield, getting on top of a unit position is a great way to get lots of things killed. Great when your losses are 1:1, but you're loosing B1s, bad if the enemy is the one loosing B1s.
Of course, that isn't to say ray shielded movement wouldn't be useful as a logistic or positioning tool, but it is to say that using them hyper aggressively is not playing to the GAR's far longer engagement range than your average B1.
You onl;y want to hop on top of a unit if doing so makes your losses less than a long ranged engagement or where long range simply isn't a viable option.
9:20 tbh that explanation for why the republic didn't use snipers isn't quite finished yet imo. Because (and this comes from someone who as played a shit ton of GRB as a sniper) there are basically three ways to use snipers, that I can think of. Firstly there is the obvious one which you mentioned, which is to use snipers to eliminate high profile targets. But with multiple snipers there is also another highly effective tactic to use them for. That is taking out enemies from so far away, that they effectively can't shoot back. Imagine the GAR must hold a defensive position like Christophsis. Multiple high buildings in the area and the droids are marching in a straight line to the republic lines. This is pure sniper heaven. Like put around 20-30 Snipers on one building and they can pick of droids like it's nothing because they have the DC-15 which can turn a battledroid into scrap metal from kilometers away. And the droids can't really do anything about it. Good luck Super battledroid with your blaster on your hand to try to hit a clone 1 kilometer or more away who's about to shoot you. Another thing snipers are great for are ambushes. Like same scenario, but the seperatists have already come into a city and the GAR must hold a defensive perimeter in that urban area. Just place again 20-30 or even more clones with DC-15s (and maybe even with magnifying scopes) on top of buildings that are on the side of the path the droids are taking and boom the snipers can peek over the cover and pick of the battledroids in the hundreds with every salvo they decide to shoot. And when the droids try to shoot back, well they can just duck into cover. And you also have a crossfire, because the clones holding the line can shoot at the droids too. So yeah there aren't any high profile targets clone snipers could elimnate, but tbh that doesn't really explain why the GAR didn't use them more especially as they always try to outmaneuver the droid army and snipers are able to almost perfectly fit that role, as they can always switch their position and keep the droids guessing where they'll get shot from the next time, especially as the droids weren't the brightest candles on the chandelier.
It's called combined arms warfare. Using air/sea/space whatever in order to accomplish your mission. Lets start with the shield and rotary canon. Okay I'm with you they may be heavy, but this is what they can do. Have the shield carriers a few guys or more act as cover for the one or two rotary canon guys so when they have to reload they get in front with their shield to protect and fire back with their rifles. And when the rotary canon is ready they break apart and it;s at it again mowing down rows and whole units of robots. This weapon is a heavy weapon and is used in conjuction with the regular rifle troops as support. So when a larger unit of droids or special droits (Drodika and rocket droids) come into play and hard to take down in one or two shots from a regular rifle. You have the rotary canon do the damage and take them all out and protects the other units from being overran.
The reason they didn't use it was because it didn't look heroic aka for the big screen. Also you have to remember one thing about the rest of the galaxy besides one planet. The galaxy as a whole is stagnant in their development of technology and using tech that is thousands of years old. From droids to blasters those where reversed engineered from Rakatan technology from their infinite empire. The only planet that broke the mold was Umbara, remember they had tech that was decades ahead of the republic if not more. Ray shielding using it on the offensive and defensive is smart from the confederacy, but if the republic wasn't and the rest of the galaxy except a few planets weren't so myopic in their thinking and technology. They would have used artillery shells to get through the ray shields (they aren't designed for solid objects) and their shells would have destroyed their forces if used in mass.
Essentially the Star Wars galaxy is a low tech and high tech society that in some ways rival our planet earth from droids to AI to nanotechnology (or they say nano droids) and massive infrastructure. But yet they use blasters that as one persons channel pointed out is slower than a regular bullet from our guns (much much slower) and their biological sciences haven't progressed much because they used Bacta and it's equivalent to take care of wounds and such and so they didn't truly get into research of biology as much as in our world.
I know it might not make sense seeing a Jedi using a shield, but honestly that thumbnail is pretty badass to me
The reason I think shields weren’t used much was because they were pretty heavy and could only protect you from one side, this was something you would usually only have the corridor of a ship where battles were very rarely held.
Snipers are used to take out key targets but they are also used for recon, holding a position, cover fire (which is very important because they can see danger before there teammates thus reducing casualties.) Just because there wasn't always a key target to shoot (there are still key droids you would want taken out before the weak pawns) doesn't mean they wouldn't have been effective because they do so much more.
Ngl, I'm surprised you were actually able to find decent justifications for those tactical decisions...
Well, another reason why we don't see some of these items used is because it was a TV show. You pull out the 'good stuff' when you want high action. Anti-tank specialists (rocket troopers) would be in every platoon if using conventional unit composition for dedicated weaponry. As would two to four rotary cannons per company if we were to equate them to LMG's for weapon composition. As for the shield tactics. While it seems 'simple' it's only even used a handful of times by the Separatists and in locations where they had the ability to POWER that kind of shield generator. When you don't have to re-charge 200k droids in a command zone, you just don't have that supply of power to push what could be a normal base shield into offensive capabilities. And yes the blast shields are certainly very situationally specific, though I imagine every ship has a spot in the armory for them. As at the least they'd be good in making Barricades or moving defensive/offensive areas at key areas and hall/deck junctions.
The mandalorian police had the riot shields also
A backpack and grenades is like 10-15 lbs. Rotary is 50plus
Avg weight of a servicemans gear is 80lbs. Funny enough same as plate armor for knights
Clones: HOW DO WE WIN?!?!
Jedi: Geneva convention prepared to be ignored.
The weapon system in the clone commando game. Would be a neet weapon to cover. If it actually existed that is. It allowed you to switch from weapon to weapon. With three modes rifle (base weapon), sniper rifle, and rocket launcher. Though these may have been commando only?
I still love the clone who shit grevious in the elevator and blew all that back blast into sidious's face lol he was a legend and didn't even know it
What I rank to be the most important to least important
1 rocket launcher: It is a massive force multiplier that every clone should have a degree of proficiency in using. It can destroy armour, emplayed positions and maybe even aircraft. 10 out of 10 must have 1 per a sqaud.
2 blast shields vital for ship boarding and a lot of applications in urban cqc.
3 Sniper rifles 1 per a platoon it used as a skirmishing tool and an ability to scout ahead of unit would be quite good. Bike mounted sqauds going to areas of high ground would do disproportionate damage to the seps
4 rotary cannon personally i think a lmg/dmr with a bipod would be more practical. Probably very expensive for what it is. Also question how much more effective it is than a blaster. But when it shines it, shines. Would use it in urban cqc and ship boarding.
5 ray shields probably expensive, probably gets overwhelmed with firepower. Makes the unit hiding in its shield an obvious target. Negates the clones long range firepower for close range.
Probably some limited applications. Probably good to have a few per an army.
It is probably because these tactics weren’t necessary. Carrying heavy shields around doesn’t make any sense on the battle field, it makes it easy for the enemy to flank you, and hard to advance on the enemy. The French tried different variations during WW1 with no success. As for the Gatling Gun like blaster, it is nothing but a waste of ammo if you just pull the trigger and let it rip. Heavy machine guns are used to lay down suppressing fire, most often being used in pairs. They shoot alternating short burst in a crossing field of fire to allow riflemen to advance, or sometimes to retreat. A squad automatic weapon is also used for suppressing fire. In modern warfare, you won’t see any troops being armed with heavy machine guns or rocket launchers until you reach a platoon level. At that point you will have 2 heavy machine guns and 2 close combat missile teams with Javelin missiles. As for snipers, most are used as surveillance to cover for teams on the ground. They can either relay positions to the teams, or eliminate the threat themselves. There are still recon and special forces sniper teams that are deployed to scout for targets of opportunity, or sent to eliminate specific targets. But snipers are not generally embedded with other forces on the ground.
Those shields worked situationally over ringo venda because they formed a shield wall and were pushing forward down corridors where it was nearly impossible to get behind or beside them. Those shields would be too heavy for a rapid advance and are totally useless if the enemy were to hit you from anywhere other than directly in front of you which makes them more or less dead weight. Plus since they need to bunch up in a Phalanx or shield wall to be effective mines and other explosives would wipe out units instead of 1-3 men.
There's another word to describe a military profession that involves rapid strike response force to clear out area in preparation for invasion. "Marines".
Some points to why they didnt make use of shields more often would be, just like real life, they're cumbersome and heavy. As well as having a squad of 9 troopers bunched together in a shield wall would be extremely vunerable to the CIS' heavier units like the AAT or Spider droids, with an AAT taking out an entire squad in 1 hit, compared to maybe 1 or 2 if they were spaced out. Shields would be extremely effective in boarding actions though, but the heavy and cubersome weight of it comes around again, and it might be better to seek cover in the reinforcing structures of a ships hull (As we see in the clone wars) Rather than leaving yourself vunerable to grenades and weapons with an area of effect.
For the Ray shield they probably didnt use this tactic as it would require the setting up of a large shield generator, as well as confining troops to a single area, reducing their mobility for flanking actions against the enemy and also gives away your position.
And lastly, for the lack of use with the Z6, that could simply come down to other weapons doing its job better. The Z6 when we do see it, is rather inaccurate at range, which gives to its role as an assault cannon, where it should be used to lead an assault, firing from the hip to suppress and then to flush your enemy out of their entrenchments with automatic fire (Think of the B.A.R during WW1/2). The regular weapons like the DC-15A Rifle and DC-15S Carbine can fulfill this role, with a simple tactical bound being utilised by the clones as we also see in the clone wars. It would seem very familiar to tactics used early in WW1, where a platoon would form a spread out line and fire torwards the enemy, whilst another platoon advances forward under the cover of their comrades. The rifles would outclass the Z6 in thise role, and once in close enough range, the carbine and grenades can be brought to bear on the enemy.
At the end of the day, the GAR was using rather advanced tactics that were used in both WW1 and WW2, tanks support infantry by targetting large enemy formations and CIS heavy units, whilst the infantry flush out entrenchments and speeder/AT-RT forces target command centres and enemy artillery.
I have a potential video idea. Why didn't the Outer Rim form a militia of their own? And could they have taken part in the Clone Wars?
Disobeying the Jedi council’s orders is also a great tactic
To be fair, how often do you see a sniper anyways. That is kinda the point.
Those blast shields that Doom used should've been used more often. Mainly in hallway battles in Separatist bases.
9:37 my favorite tactic
Please discuss 104th and 327th tactics.
Clone platoons and how the stacked up against there droid counter part
Honestly, pretty much every reason for failed tactics in the clone wars came down to 4 words "We don't do that."... Didn't matter who was saying it, ultimately it's the same reason why we forgo equally advantageous opportunities in our world (and in our daily lives even). Identity rules over pretty much all sentient life (even defining sentient life in most cases), but the weaker that identity is the less willing the bearer is to adapt (more resources are attributed to trying to protect the identity than are attributed to achieve the goals of or even protect the bearer of said identity).
Tactics that makes sense are like protected star destroyer bridges. Sure it’s more practical, but it’s probably not as cinematic
love ur vids Geetsly's, watch em all the time, even in class,
What about the shields that the Commando droids use at the citadel, mixingin the ray shield and bulky shield. And being able to fire through it
Commando droids use sniper rifles as well and B2 super battle droids usually had rocket launchers.
I'm assuming that the blaster shields are fairly expensive hence why we dont see thier use all that much
The Kaminoans wanted the clones to rush into battle so that would be a high causality rate and the Republic would have to buy more clones. This is called planned obsolescence.
The 3D renditions of Frodo was fuckn cool
Im missing in the clonewars show actual hit&run tactics. Lets say the speeders with a rocket (or gatling - or both at one time) sidecar would do a pretty good in some terrain. In heavier, but still not cramped terrain, the clones could use the mandalorian jetpacks for quick movement between hardly (to not at all) accessable defence possition, from where they would lay down long range firing support. I mean, the snipers were not utilized for sniping individuals, but if the weapon used for sniping is able to affect an AREA by explosion, or EMP, the droids could be oneshot erased in platoon strenght. Another point i do not understand, is, why Grand army of Republic did not utilize ANY droids in frontline duty. I mean - small reconosance flying droid, size of granade could be extremely hepfull in the fog of war... Or similary big EMP kamikaze droid... Could not harm an organic (meatbag) even if it wanted, but could help erase the droids in swathes (or help overwhelm separatist armoured units). Or if you want something extra - droid airplane, the size of bigger RC model (similar size as the bazooka), acting as a small EMP bomber, capeting the droids by EMP granades REPEATEDLY and capable to do that in the area of footbal field...
Spray and pray works at sniper ranges.
All rounds of the blaster have that reach
How does that work. Do they travel as fast as bullets or does gravity give it a free pass?
@@tarektechmarine8209 blaster bolts from the clone troopers tifle are said to have 2km of reach.
That applies regardless whetjer its fired in spray and pray or in single acurate shots.
@@tarektechmarine8209 appatantly blaster bolts have no drop.
They are slower than bullets though
In fairness: the Jedi’s morality held the GAR back so much. If they had been removed or allowed things such as ray shields more often they likely wouldn’t have faced the losses they did. Though Palpatine was still palpatine the war like a cheap fiddle