A downside of coir that you never mentioned has to do with its cation exchange capacity (CEC). In its unbuffered form, the cation exchange sites are chocked full of potassium and sodium, and the is virtually no calcium or magnesium in it. In this form, it has a strong affinity for the calcium and magnesium cations, and so when they are added, they are adsorbed at the cation exchange sites, releasing the sodium and potassium. This locks the calcium and magnesium in the coir, becoming unavailable to your plants, and the release of potassium can be significant enough to cause potassium toxicity to your plants, which ironically, can prevent magnesium uptake as well. So what can happen is you make a fresh soil mix with coir and put seedlings in it, and then you may notice yellowing of the older leaves, while new growth may be misshapen, flimsy, or discolored. So you hit it with Cal-Mag, but the coir consumes it all, and releases a potentially toxic amount of potassium in doing so. Instead of getting the Cal-Mag they need, your plants get a huge shock of potassium they don't want instead. Coir must be properly buffered before use! You can spend the extra money, and buy the premium brands that are already buffered (from hydroponic stores), or you can do it yourself easily enough. After you've rinsed out the coir, drain it, wring it out as best you can, then soak it in a double-strength batch of Cal-Mag for at least 15 minutes. After the time has expired, an equilibrium of cation exchange will have been established, and it will no longer have this affinity for sucking the calcium and magnesium out of the soil. Now you can drain the coir and use it with confidence, but reserve the solution it was soaking in as a potassium fertilizer for your flowering plants!
This is correct. I thought going into CEC in a video that is already realativly dense might start to loose people. So I had to pick and choose what to have as apart of the video.
I have a further point here. I live in the UK. Coco coir is imported from Africa where as peat is imported from Ireland. Sourcing peat does release a lot of co2 but importing cococoir from Africa is a giant carbon footprint! It seems like there is no real winner between the two on the environmental impact which is why I tend to use manure. I would like to do a side by side comparison of the US black cow manure vs British horse manure but can you imagine the carbon footprint of importing black cow manure to the UK? Manure does retain water and it has an npk value but as a professional gardener I do need peat in certain circumstances. It's actually going to be illegal here next year which has caused panic buying. I honestly recommend replacing peat in most circumstances with manure not coco coir.
I have found cow manure to have some npk value in my area to be about 3 2 1. In my region kf the US where I cow manure is easily atainable for very one in the community both in bulk and by the bag. Carbon footprint there makes it easy in that respect. The main issue I have with cow manure js it has a high salinity. Over use it and you increase high salinity high ph issues in soils so u would reccemkend using it sparingly. Me personally when I get horse or cow manure from my trusted source j let is compost for 6 months to a year to let the heat dissipate. I then run through my worms to further break down. It's much better in my opinion to do it this way. Or you could but buy worm compost but it's much more expensive then cow manure. Long story short. There are always positives and negatives to every fertilizer source. Ya do eat you can. I personally can have anything I basically want baring cost as I have no laws in my area restricting me. Not everyone is blessed with this option. They may use be restricted by laws and others so the negative they have is supply available to them either artificial due to restriction of laws and regulations or physical as sources are not available. Either way I wish you the best. I M currently working on other videos to help with fertilizer and benefits of each source hopefully that might be of some benefit to ya.
Great informative video, my application is vermicomposting. In my area which, and under our current 2022 inventory challenges. I am looking to switch from peatmoss, to coco coir. Budget friendly - but NO skimping on a quality bedding for my worms ( R. Wigglers, NENC, and ANC). Thanks for giving me publishing your video.
Then the plants your growing probably prefer a more neutral ph. Pete moss is better for plants in the rose family like raspberries and many berries. If your plants have more acidic needs pete moss is the better choice. Jfyi Marijuana loves neutrality if that's something that interests you so coconut husk is the better choice.
There's no coir that contains "no salt whatsoever". They differ in levels of salt, but they ALL contain SOME level of salt. Your comment is nothing more than a sales pitch. No one cares.
As I mentioned in your last video, it all depends on how acidic your plants like their medium. One isn't better than the other, they're just different for different ph needs.
Some products are used universally in gardening like peat moss and coco coir. However they do have slightly better advantages for individual situations. This is true. If could come down to what you can get, if you can get it as well based on location. Mileage may very. That is the great thing about gardening. Some things may work better then others, however there is normally more then one successful way to accomplish the task at hand.
there are several different ways I know of to buffer coco coir. depending on yiur individual water parameters you deal with ph it will change. whatever your ph parameters rinse out to help get rid of salt. then after that you can use ph up or down depending on circumstance yo buffer and cal mag as a nutrient supplement rather then a ph buffer. or similar based water soluble fertilizers depending on individual nutrient requirements.
Sphagnum peat moss and moss are interchange and are basically the same thing. A horse is a horse but an Arabian is a specific type of horse. Same with peat moss. As long as the bag says peat moss your good. Just depends on how specific you want to get with it
I find it to be a high quality mixture for most things you want to grow I'm potting mixes.some items though you can't beat the cost efficiency of native soils improved over time as well.
coco coir is commonly used for growing mushrooms. one common way in commercial setting is rehydrating it and putting it in a clear plastic bag for growing it. Coco coir peat brick and coco coir are the same thing. Coco coir peat brick refers to it as dried and compressed into a brick where as the coco coir is the same material simply rehydrated and as a loose material rather then in a dehydrated compressed form.
Dude handle your sound issues!! Why do you need that type of ambient sound such as high-pressure water hitting a bucket or the crumpling of thick paper ?!
A little while ago I shared a whole video on the potential sustainability of peat moss. ua-cam.com/video/V8ChpENl5FA/v-deo.html whether or not peat moss is sustainable I find is not based on if another product is popular or not. It entirely depends on if the said product can be produced and the same rate of consumption or produced more then said rate of consumption. Im sure there are locations that are not sustainably mined. But other locations i most definitely believe are sustainably mined.
unfortunately I dont know of any sure way to tell if it has high salt content or not. I just assume it has high salt content. When I use coco coir i go ahead and rinse it out before I use it after hydrating it. Yes you can use it for house plants. The main question is what is the percentage of coco coir you use as apart of soil mixture. How much you use in your potting mix entirely depends on what type of plants your growing as each plant has very different soil media requirements and so must be looked at on a plant by plant basis.
Some people use Poole noodle cut in slices that can be pressed to hold the plant in place. Commonly used is ceramic or clay balls that can be used. Another product is Rockwood as well.
@@ewellacres Thanks, but I'm aiming for coconut hairs. If not, I may try straw cut to fit my cups.Or pine needles. Not sure what that'll do to the ph though
I personally used both coconut coir and peatmoss both. Unless using coco coir in a solid woven matt, it has been my experience to just fall through the small cracks. In nft statems the flow of water pushed out rhe fiber and in dwc the air bubbles pushed the fibers out as well however not as quickly. The end result being it clogs filters surrounding pumps. For this reason most commercial operations you see opt to use Rockwool to reduce labor on cleaning out clogged filters. That is if they are nit clogging the pumps all together
@@ewellacres I make my net cups from "pet screen" the holes are only something in the order of 3/32". Most seeds won't fit through it. But I'd like something substantial for a foundation. Something to get ahold of vs that thin screen.
many manufactures of coco coir do use chemicals combined with mechanical separation to help process the coir. what exactly those chemical are or if they are toxic i could not tell you what they are.
That is one of the things that works great about the two is they both have their negatives and positives that can affect the personal choice of which one you end up using
I would agree on that depending on where you live. I live in a cold region of north America and so have large supply of peat moss near by. It is a little harder to acquire coco coir in my neck of the woods.
It has a little value in some nutrients but they are so miner they have no real world value. Essentially it is just dead plant material that is many years old. It is for all in tense in purposes stringy straw.
sphagnum is like the first so many inches down and is sustainable, peat is deeper and took many many years and is not sustainable. When they harvest peat they dig huge trenches to drain the wet land to get to the peat. It destroys those wetlands. There was a documentary about it though I can't remember who put it out. Of course the industry is going to say what everyone wants to hear so they can keep selling it. You also pronounce sphagnum incorrectly.
Some products are used universally in gardening like peat moss and coco coir. However they do have slightly better advantages for individual situations. This is true. If could come down to what you can get, if you can get it as well based on location. Mileage may very. That is the great thing about gardening. Some things may work better then others, however there is normally more then one successful way to accomplish the task at hand.
I was able to find peat moss for $16 at my local plant nursery in however that was at the time of posting the video pre covid inflation. At current costs at my local plant nursery it is now $21 at my local plant nursery. Overall it is still a very cost effetive soil amendment to use.
I have found the mom and pop nurseries or farm and feed stores are often half the price then your big box stores. At least they are on the region of united States where I live which is the intermountian west and the desert region. There are many agricultural stores that compete with one another in cowboy country where I live. It helps to keep costs low by having lots of competition. Best of luck for you in potentially finding cheaper options. Best places I would reccomend is farm and ranch stores or local plant nurseries
@@ewellacres I will keep searching. Coco coir is about the same price as the walmart delivered peat. I tried Tractor Suppy company for peat. I would rather support small business anyway. If I don't find it cheaper I might stick with coco coir, supposed to be better for the enviroment but thats debatable I suppose ✌️
Coco coir is a great option and works well Many people use it and find great luck with it. If you want to take a look at the environmental capability of peat moss I have a video about it.m.ua-cam.com/video/V8ChpENl5FA/v-deo.html I have not made a video on it yet. But I do like to take things with a grain of salt to try and be balanced across the board. When people talk about the sustainability of coxo coir often it is not talked about the rain forests that are cut down in order to plant a mono culture crop of coconut trees in which coco coir Comes from. In my personal view point peat moss and and coco coir are about sixes in sustainability when you account for cutting of rainforest to plant the coconut groves verse harvesting peat out of the bogs.
Here are several scientific journal articles explaining how coconut trees are native to areas with high salinity water. By nature they have adapted to live in areas near alot of salt. i.e. ocean water. Because of this the plants naturally soak up alot of sodium and potasium. Making them ideal to help filter water, as well as the salt gets retained in the plant and the fruit of the plant. Therefore the coconut itself has alot of water. No matter where it is grown, near the ocean or in the high deserts the the middle of america they are going to naturally soak up more sodium and potassium of the plant of similar size and weight. Meaning salt in coco coir. Hettiarachchi, Eshani, et al. "Activated coconut coir for removal of sodium and magnesium ions from saline water." Desalination and water treatment 57.47 (2016): 22341-22352. www.deswater.com/DWT_articles/vol_66_papers/66_2017_103.pdf www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/12/16/6577
A downside of coir that you never mentioned has to do with its cation exchange capacity (CEC). In its unbuffered form, the cation exchange sites are chocked full of potassium and sodium, and the is virtually no calcium or magnesium in it. In this form, it has a strong affinity for the calcium and magnesium cations, and so when they are added, they are adsorbed at the cation exchange sites, releasing the sodium and potassium. This locks the calcium and magnesium in the coir, becoming unavailable to your plants, and the release of potassium can be significant enough to cause potassium toxicity to your plants, which ironically, can prevent magnesium uptake as well. So what can happen is you make a fresh soil mix with coir and put seedlings in it, and then you may notice yellowing of the older leaves, while new growth may be misshapen, flimsy, or discolored. So you hit it with Cal-Mag, but the coir consumes it all, and releases a potentially toxic amount of potassium in doing so. Instead of getting the Cal-Mag they need, your plants get a huge shock of potassium they don't want instead.
Coir must be properly buffered before use! You can spend the extra money, and buy the premium brands that are already buffered (from hydroponic stores), or you can do it yourself easily enough.
After you've rinsed out the coir, drain it, wring it out as best you can, then soak it in a double-strength batch of Cal-Mag for at least 15 minutes. After the time has expired, an equilibrium of cation exchange will have been established, and it will no longer have this affinity for sucking the calcium and magnesium out of the soil. Now you can drain the coir and use it with confidence, but reserve the solution it was soaking in as a potassium fertilizer for your flowering plants!
This is correct. I thought going into CEC in a video that is already realativly dense might start to loose people. So I had to pick and choose what to have as apart of the video.
I have a further point here. I live in the UK. Coco coir is imported from Africa where as peat is imported from Ireland. Sourcing peat does release a lot of co2 but importing cococoir from Africa is a giant carbon footprint!
It seems like there is no real winner between the two on the environmental impact which is why I tend to use manure. I would like to do a side by side comparison of the US black cow manure vs British horse manure but can you imagine the carbon footprint of importing black cow manure to the UK?
Manure does retain water and it has an npk value but as a professional gardener I do need peat in certain circumstances. It's actually going to be illegal here next year which has caused panic buying. I honestly recommend replacing peat in most circumstances with manure not coco coir.
I have found cow manure to have some npk value in my area to be about 3 2 1.
In my region kf the US where I cow manure is easily atainable for very one in the community both in bulk and by the bag.
Carbon footprint there makes it easy in that respect. The main issue I have with cow manure js it has a high salinity. Over use it and you increase high salinity high ph issues in soils so u would reccemkend using it sparingly.
Me personally when I get horse or cow manure from my trusted source j let is compost for 6 months to a year to let the heat dissipate. I then run through my worms to further break down. It's much better in my opinion to do it this way.
Or you could but buy worm compost but it's much more expensive then cow manure.
Long story short. There are always positives and negatives to every fertilizer source. Ya do eat you can.
I personally can have anything I basically want baring cost as I have no laws in my area restricting me.
Not everyone is blessed with this option. They may use be restricted by laws and others so the negative they have is supply available to them either artificial due to restriction of laws and regulations or physical as sources are not available.
Either way I wish you the best. I M currently working on other videos to help with fertilizer and benefits of each source hopefully that might be of some benefit to ya.
Great informative video, my application is vermicomposting. In my area which, and under our current 2022 inventory challenges. I am looking to switch from peatmoss, to coco coir. Budget friendly - but NO skimping on a quality bedding for my worms ( R. Wigglers, NENC, and ANC). Thanks for giving me publishing your video.
Coco peat substrate from Sri Lanka that I produce and use in my son’s poly tunnels business has no salt whatsoever and is neutral. Inquiries welcome.
Thanks for the comparison and as with almost everything I use in the garden or on the lawn I actually use both.
Thank You! Your video was very informative
I prefer Coir, you may have to feed more but I get faster growth in coir
Then the plants your growing probably prefer a more neutral ph. Pete moss is better for plants in the rose family like raspberries and many berries. If your plants have more acidic needs pete moss is the better choice. Jfyi Marijuana loves neutrality if that's something that interests you so coconut husk is the better choice.
I prefer coir for hydroponic vertical tower systems............it was excellent for the tomatoes we planted here in Medellin Colombia.
I find that both work well in different circumstances and the biggest thing is your location and availability of the two.
Coco peat substrate from Sri Lanka that I produce and use in my son’s poly tunnels has no salt whatsoever and is neutral. Inquiries welcome.
There's no coir that contains "no salt whatsoever". They differ in levels of salt, but they ALL contain SOME level of salt. Your comment is nothing more than a sales pitch. No one cares.
@@jobolitz5753 I meant “Sri Lanka coco peat we use has no salt ….” for we wash them with clean fresh water. Sorry
If you have found a source that is higher quality hold on to it that is worth its weight in gold.
I’m new on using the coconut coir, thank you for sharing! It is very helpful.
I'm new now 6 months later how is it going mine great so far fast growth
?
@@wascopI Can I use Coconut Coir mix?
As I mentioned in your last video, it all depends on how acidic your plants like their medium. One isn't better than the other, they're just different for different ph needs.
Some products are used universally in gardening like peat moss and coco coir. However they do have slightly better advantages for individual situations. This is true. If could come down to what you can get, if you can get it as well based on location. Mileage may very. That is the great thing about gardening. Some things may work better then others, however there is normally more then one successful way to accomplish the task at hand.
Personally I prefer coco coir. The seeds have no problem coming up especially onion seeds and lettuce.
coco coir is more cheaper, peat moss more expensive and also environmental concern
Was the Coco used, buffered with CalMag?.
Coco is reusable, so that goes to cost.
there are several different ways I know of to buffer coco coir. depending on yiur individual water parameters you deal with ph it will change.
whatever your ph parameters rinse out to help get rid of salt. then after that you can use ph up or down depending on circumstance yo buffer and cal mag as a nutrient supplement rather then a ph buffer. or similar based water soluble fertilizers depending on individual nutrient requirements.
Good job brother. I like the video
So what's the difference between peat moss and sphagnum peat moss and which one of those do I want to use in my vegetable garden?
Sphagnum peat moss and moss are interchange and are basically the same thing.
A horse is a horse but an Arabian is a specific type of horse.
Same with peat moss.
As long as the bag says peat moss your good. Just depends on how specific you want to get with it
PH is soooooo important
makes the difference between life and death.
that's why some said to rinse the coco coir before use.
and peat moss is difficult to hydrate.
This is true
Using peat moss ,compost ,cocoa coir ,perlite and vermiculite isn't that the super soil you want.
I find it to be a high quality mixture for most things you want to grow I'm potting mixes.some items though you can't beat the cost efficiency of native soils improved over time as well.
can it be used for mushroom growth?
and is coco peat brick and coco coir are same?
coco coir is commonly used for growing mushrooms. one common way in commercial setting is rehydrating it and putting it in a clear plastic bag for growing it.
Coco coir peat brick and coco coir are the same thing. Coco coir peat brick refers to it as dried and compressed into a brick where as the coco coir is the same material simply rehydrated and as a loose material rather then in a dehydrated compressed form.
Dude handle your sound issues!! Why do you need that type of ambient sound such as high-pressure water hitting a bucket or the crumpling of thick paper ?!
thankyou for the feedback I do appreciate it. I am always looking for ways to improve my videos
well, now that coco coir is getting more popular, peat moss now can be sustainable.
A little while ago I shared a whole video on the potential sustainability of peat moss.
ua-cam.com/video/V8ChpENl5FA/v-deo.html
whether or not peat moss is sustainable I find is not based on if another product is popular or not. It entirely depends on if the said product can be produced and the same rate of consumption or produced more then said rate of consumption. Im sure there are locations that are not sustainably mined. But other locations i most definitely believe are sustainably mined.
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how do I find out if it has salt ? and is it good for indoor plants Coir? thanks
unfortunately I dont know of any sure way to tell if it has high salt content or not. I just assume it has high salt content. When I use coco coir i go ahead and rinse it out before I use it after hydrating it.
Yes you can use it for house plants. The main question is what is the percentage of coco coir you use as apart of soil mixture. How much you use in your potting mix entirely depends on what type of plants your growing as each plant has very different soil media requirements and so must be looked at on a plant by plant basis.
I'm searching for "coarse" material for my homemade net cups / aquaponic garden
Some people use Poole noodle cut in slices that can be pressed to hold the plant in place.
Commonly used is ceramic or clay balls that can be used.
Another product is Rockwood as well.
@@ewellacres Thanks, but I'm aiming for coconut hairs. If not, I may try straw cut to fit my cups.Or pine needles. Not sure what that'll do to the ph though
I personally used both coconut coir and peatmoss both.
Unless using coco coir in a solid woven matt, it has been my experience to just fall through the small cracks.
In nft statems the flow of water pushed out rhe fiber and in dwc the air bubbles pushed the fibers out as well however not as quickly.
The end result being it clogs filters surrounding pumps.
For this reason most commercial operations you see opt to use Rockwool to reduce labor on cleaning out clogged filters. That is if they are nit clogging the pumps all together
Or maybe a medium bark mulch so large it won't fall through the cracks that's worked for me.
@@ewellacres I make my net cups from "pet screen" the holes are only something in the order of 3/32". Most seeds won't fit through it. But I'd like something substantial for a foundation. Something to get ahold of vs that thin screen.
Do they use chemicals in the treating of coco cuir ?
many manufactures of coco coir do use chemicals combined with mechanical separation to help process the coir. what exactly those chemical are or if they are toxic i could not tell you what they are.
Peat moss is better, Coconut coir if not careful fungus love coconut husk and coir
That is one of the things that works great about the two is they both have their negatives and positives that can affect the personal choice of which one you end up using
When you take the amount of fossil fuel it takes to ship coco coir to you peat is better for the earth
I would agree on that depending on where you live. I live in a cold region of north America and so have large supply of peat moss near by. It is a little harder to acquire coco coir in my neck of the woods.
Coco is reusable. Peat isn’t.
It seems as thought peat moss would have more nutritional value.
It has a little value in some nutrients but they are so miner they have no real world value. Essentially it is just dead plant material that is many years old. It is for all in tense in purposes stringy straw.
sphagnum is like the first so many inches down and is sustainable, peat is deeper and took many many years and is not sustainable. When they harvest peat they dig huge trenches to drain the wet land to get to the peat. It destroys those wetlands. There was a documentary about it though I can't remember who put it out. Of course the industry is going to say what everyone wants to hear so they can keep selling it.
You also pronounce sphagnum incorrectly.
In reply to this I made a whole video on it. here is a link for the argument why it is sustainable.
ua-cam.com/video/V8ChpENl5FA/v-deo.html
They don't work equally well lol. They work better for different things
Some products are used universally in gardening like peat moss and coco coir. However they do have slightly better advantages for individual situations. This is true. If could come down to what you can get, if you can get it as well based on location. Mileage may very. That is the great thing about gardening. Some things may work better then others, however there is normally more then one successful way to accomplish the task at hand.
Where do you get 3 cu ft of peat for $16??
I was able to find peat moss for $16 at my local plant nursery in however that was at the time of posting the video pre covid inflation. At current costs at my local plant nursery it is now $21 at my local plant nursery. Overall it is still a very cost effetive soil amendment to use.
@@ewellacres Best I have found so far is 2.2 cu ft from walmart delivered for $36
I have found the mom and pop nurseries or farm and feed stores are often half the price then your big box stores. At least they are on the region of united States where I live which is the intermountian west and the desert region. There are many agricultural stores that compete with one another in cowboy country where I live. It helps to keep costs low by having lots of competition. Best of luck for you in potentially finding cheaper options. Best places I would reccomend is farm and ranch stores or local plant nurseries
@@ewellacres I will keep searching. Coco coir is about the same price as the walmart delivered peat. I tried Tractor Suppy company for peat. I would rather support small business anyway. If I don't find it cheaper I might stick with coco coir, supposed to be better for the enviroment but thats debatable I suppose ✌️
Coco coir is a great option and works well Many people use it and find great luck with it. If you want to take a look at the environmental capability of peat moss I have a video about it.m.ua-cam.com/video/V8ChpENl5FA/v-deo.html
I have not made a video on it yet. But I do like to take things with a grain of salt to try and be balanced across the board. When people talk about the sustainability of coxo coir often it is not talked about the rain forests that are cut down in order to plant a mono culture crop of coconut trees in which coco coir Comes from. In my personal view point peat moss and and coco coir are about sixes in sustainability when you account for cutting of rainforest to plant the coconut groves verse harvesting peat out of the bogs.
Fake news. It's not salty because it's already processed. In thailand it wasn't grown on seaside.
Here are several scientific journal articles explaining how coconut trees are native to areas with high salinity water.
By nature they have adapted to live in areas near alot of salt. i.e. ocean water. Because of this the plants naturally soak up alot of sodium and potasium. Making them ideal to help filter water, as well as the salt gets retained in the plant and the fruit of the plant.
Therefore the coconut itself has alot of water. No matter where it is grown, near the ocean or in the high deserts the the middle of america they are going to naturally soak up more sodium and potassium of the plant of similar size and weight.
Meaning salt in coco coir.
Hettiarachchi, Eshani, et al. "Activated coconut coir for removal of sodium and magnesium ions from saline water." Desalination and water treatment 57.47 (2016): 22341-22352.
www.deswater.com/DWT_articles/vol_66_papers/66_2017_103.pdf
www.mdpi.com/2071-1050/12/16/6577