My process is different. Whenever brewing I'll do 1 extra gallon and, before my first hop addition I just put it in 2L mason jar calculating the dilution to get to 1.040. This is even cheaper.
Unfortunately pressure canning is not very common in Europe. But i did the same with a presure cooker. It can make 115°C, not 121°C like the canner, so I increase time to 60 minutes. Recently I do no chill a lot, so while the worth is cooling down over night, I use 2-3L of the same worth for the starter. Do cool down the starter worth in the sink.. that's even more convenient for me.
Very nice walkthrough. I’ve considered canning wort over the years but never bothered. My process nowadays is to skip starters entirely and use dry yeast instead.
I do a similar thing but since DME is kind of expensive here, I just either do a small BIAB mash or make an extra gallon of wort when brewing, repurpose some of that wort before the hops are added and pressure can it.
If the wort with the hops was run through a filter so the wort coming into the canning jars was filtered I don't see any issues with using this as a starter do you? Because I like your idea of just making some extra wort vs dealing with purchasing a ton of DME.
@@jamesp1979 I take the wort after the boil starts but before I add hops. I don't see a problem with using hopped wort if it's a lightly hopped beer but I'm not so sure about wort for an IPA since I wouldn't want the hop flavour to carry over. Putting a couple L of IPA wort into a light lager might change the flavour. Or maybe it wouldn't. I dunno.
White Labs is about $16 now. I have been having great luck pressure canning starters. Quart jars make larger starters with almost no cost! Harvesting and making my own starters is a huge savings.
What a well timed video! I'm making some when I go to my inlaws this weekend (they have a pressure canner I can use). I was already planning on following the homebrewnotes method but have a video breaking down the steps is always appreciated. I love the explanation on sterilization involved in the canning process, but it would've been good to mention why a pressure canner is needed over a regular canner people may have hanging around. You need the 15psi to reach ~250F and kill botulism spores. normal canning temp won't do that, and the spores could survive into the starter and into the final beer which would be very dangerous to consume.
You are apparently talking about the difference between a boiling bath CANER, which you are calling a "regular CANER", and a pressure CANER. Boiling bath CANER will not get hot enough. Electric pressure COOKERS will likely not reach 15psi. A mechanical pressure COOKER will. These are not designed for caning though. Put a trivet in the bottom.
I've been doing this, based on the same Homebrew Notes article, since I started whole grain brewing about three years ago. I use an electric pressure cooker so make sure I don't have the canned wort hanging round for ages. It works very well for me.
I give the grain bag (BIAB) a really hard squeeze to extract some extra wort and then transfer the wort to a PET bottle. I would then freeze the wort in a freezer. A day before making a starter, I'll take the bottle out and leave it at room temp. Then I proceed to boiling and cooling it before making a starter. I usually have a couple of frozen wort PET bottles lying around in my freezer at any moment ;)
I do press can starter wort as well... I have a post on my instagram of my process from February. But I usually make the wort from older base malts that I have kicking around, throw in some expired dry yeast in a short post mash boil with a pinch of hops. I do a short boil since I usually make more wort than I can pressure can in one round, so I want to keep the round 2 cans sanitized while waiting. It does make for a longer process, but cost of ingredients is lower, and I'm not dumping ingredients I otherwise wouldn't brew with. The canned wort tends to be lighter than DME too if that is important to you.
For a free yeast starter, when I hot-cube, I take the litre or so of wort left in the kettle, strain it, water it down to 1.040, boil it, and jar it. That way, my starter is pretty much the same as the wort I'll pitch it into, and I don't waste that little bit of leftover wort.
I loved this method because it allows you to make a starter easily well in advance. What I did in my last brewing was to take 2.5 liters of the wort (pre boil, até 1.040) straight to the Erlenmeyer, cooled and inoculated a sachet of yeast, letting it spinn for about 20 hours, time I leave the wort in the pan decanting before the transfer to the fermenter. Very cool to be able to store an extract on the shelf. Thanks for sharing
Where I live Goya Malta is available in the ethnic foods section of all the supermarkets for about 1.25 a bottle. It's a non-fermented malt drink. It is carbonated and has some sugar added, but I have found it makes a great starter. Mix a bottle of that with a little trub the day before brew day and by the time you need it, it will be nice and active. I just wish the amber bottles weren't twist-off.
I got rid of my pressure canner a few years ago when the canned wort came out. I don't feel it's worth the storage space premium, rather just keep a couple cans on hand from the brew shop. The canned stuff worked great for me, as does the canned wort.
I got the Fast Pitch when it was on sale for $65 for 24 cans. I doubt I'll ever see that price again so I'll likely switch over to your method next time! Thanks for the video. For some reason I had it in my head that I'd have to boil a concentrated dose, then put it in jars and pressurize. Simply adding DME and water is so much easier than I thought!!
Love this idea! I've never looked into canning my own wort. I have the Oktober SL1 canner, but I doubt that would have the same effect as you can't pressure seal it. I have plenty of mason jars and I store plenty of yeast to use for starters. Over the years, I've tried many ways to do starters...propper starter, mini-mashes, skimming wort from brew day, you name it. There are so many ways to make starters. I may have to give this a try.
Great video! Thanks for providing it! I have three questions: 1. When you put the Mason jars in the bath, should the lids be kept loose? Othrwise how can any pressure/steam get out? 2. How much air space should there be in the Mason jars? I assume that the wort will up bubble under heat and pressure? 3. Should the jars be be placed on some kind of stand to keep them away from the direct heat source? Thanks!
In episode 62 of the Bru Lab, Dr. Maria Moutsoglou stated that the optimal yeast propagation is 2°P or 1.008 SG with a high nitrogen to carbon ratio. Shouldn't we be building yeast starters to this instead of the 1.040 mentioned in this video?
I listened to that episode too! and following that logic make starters from the tail end of my sparging runoff. I then freeze the mason jar, and thaw it and sanitize before my next brew day.
My advice: Use 1 liter mason jars at 1.040. Put mason jars (7) in oven at 250F to pre-heat. Pre-boil 7 liters of water/DME in a large kettle while also heating up the canning water. Boil wort thru hot break in the kettle. This will prevent foam-overs/loss of wort during canning. Ladle boiled wort into pre-heated mason jars. Attach lids, then add jars to canner. Pressure can at 15 psi for about 10 minutes. Use one sterile jar of canned wort for a basic starter without adding non-sanitized water to it.
This is a great yeast starter hack! I personally just stick to the traditional boil 1L of water, add 100g of dme, boil for 15min, cool, and pitch yeast method. I don't mind it. 😃
I once read on a blog that you can add DME (stored in a freezer) to a sanitized flask and add freshly opened bottled water to it. The blog user claimed that the DME is sanitized because it was from the freezer and that the water is sanitized because it’s sanitized before its bottled. I have never tied it.
Thanks! Just did this and have a quick question - there's a lot of gunk in my jars (I assume it's hot break/trub). Do you pour that into the starter as well? I'm guessing it won't hurt the yeast at all and would just drop out of solution, but want to double check. Thanks Martin!
I am thinking that the nutrients would be denatured by the high temperature caning. I plan to add Fermaid O, for example, when I make my starter, just before pitching my yeast. I see instructions for using Fermaid O, during fermentation, at one third sugar depletion; so it is ok then to add nutrients without needing??? to be boiled. Anyway, seems to me that natural yeast nutrients may be denatured or destroyed by high temperatures. I think the yeast may prefer fresher food.
I just pour out some boiled wort into a jar, cool. then add in my yeast normally 5-8ml of kveik , leave over night then pitch it into my main wort in the stainless steel fermenter where the rest of the wort has cooled naturally over night. never had an issue. I keep the Kviek in test tubes that i sanitise and get about 8 x 15ml vials out of a kveik liquid pouch. Makes life easier and the yeast go a long way.
Thinking about it, would be good to do a video on: Does hot cubing beer actually make the beer taste different to one that's been rapidly cooled prior to pitching? Perfect science experiment for BRÜLOSOPHY to do!!
To what extent do the Maillard components produce untoward (or at least unexpected) flavors? Is it more critical to decant the starter prior to pitching using this technique? Even though the total starter supernate is small compared to the boil volume, MR components can have potent flavor in small amounts. Perhaps a Brulosophy experiment with a triangle test could explore this.
@@markluxton3402thanks for the reply! I’m a bit confused because the manufacturer says to put it 10min before the end of the boil. So I don’t know what’s best, risking to kill the nutrients or infecting the wort? 😅
@@loicbourrit518 Many nutrients get denatured when boiled. I have watched many brewers add nutrients at the end of the wort boil, or flame out. This makes sense to me, to get the nutrient powder dissolved, without overly boiling it, and denaturing the nutrients you just spent good money on ;-) The yeast, like us, enjoy good health if our nutrients are fresh. Sooooo.......It also makes sense to me, that putting said nutrients into a jar of caned wort, is even hotter than boiling, and for 10 minutes, 15, 20 ?, by the time the caner cools, and the jars stop boiling. See my point? I plan to add nutrients to my yeast "starter", as follows... I will use: caned concentrated wort(DME & water), and (sterile corrected/prepared) water, and yeast. and fresh nutrients! I will add the nutrients in straight away though, if I am going to warm the starter. I am actually a bit new to this, so I am not sure, if the purchased powdered nutrients, like Fermaid o, or Go-Ferm(for using a dry yeast), NEED to be hot, to dissolve well??? BUT, even if I do need to heat some liquid, to get the nutrients well dissolved, and as fresh as I can, I'll try heating a just small amount, of the caned wort and water, maybe a cup, just enough to get good dissolution; then I will add this to the starter. Yeast, when the starter temperature is correct/ideal. I'm no expert, just have learned a bit about nutrition. Happy yeast makes happy beer ;-)
@@loicbourrit518 I get that the powdered nutrients may not be entirely sterile. I feel ok with this since, if I have kept everything else sterile and ideal to start my yeast, whatever may come along with the nutrients is getting eaten and soon poisoned with alcohol. A fast start of your yeast, at ideal temp and conditions, gives your yeast such an advantage, it will conqueror all; I hope lol
Might have missed it, but are you tightening the lids fully when you put the jars in the pressure cooker? I do starters the "traditional" method and overbuild then in the process (the brulosophy way!). I like the option of dialing exactly my volume of starter to do so to try to control pitch rate and guesstimate how much yeast I overbuild. Cheers and thanks for the great content!
Nice video, I just tried it and I have a question. I get a lot of hot break material in the jar, when doing the starter m I suppose to put everything from the jar into my erlenmeyer, hot break material included ?
Great video. I did my first batch of this a few months ago. Didn't do any research, but i've been canning food for years, so it just made sense to me. Saves a ton of time and effort. Note: If you don't have a pressure canner, you can just do a water bath; put your jars in a pot, fill with water to just barely cover the top of cans, then boil. This usually requires longer processing time.
Can I do this by just doing the boil-mason-jars-in-a-pot method? That is: no pressure-rated pot, but still boiling the jars and contents the same way I'd can, say tomatoes or other foods?
In Europe we generally can without pressure canners, so it definitely can be done on the stovetope in a pot of boiling water. It'll just require more time to sterilize.
I just pour boiling wort into a canning jar and let it cool. Boiling water is enough to fully sanitize. Don’t need any canning equipment. Plus as it cools it forms the same seal you get when canning!!
Maybe rethink what you’re doing. In order to kill the bacteria that can actually kill you; the water has to reach 254 degrees. Boiling water only reaches 212 degrees. Do not confuse “Water bath” method with “Pressure Canning”. Hopefully this will help you stay healthy 🙏
@@haywardstewart2825 what bacteria is in DME and water that survives 212 F that can kill you? I store beer for a year plus that hasn’t reached 254 degrees. If the wort jars don’t maintain a seal then they’re compromised. I don’t understand where the danger lies. I’m not canning bear meat.
I've gotten lazy and just stayed with dry yeast. Much easier to store and no starter and canner required. If I time my batches close enough, I can also pitch on the yeast cake of a previous batch.
Hi there, when canning your yeast starters, instead of using a pressure cooker, would it do the same thing to use a vacuum sealer after sanitizing everything of course??
Nice video. I don't have a pressure canner. I do have a water bath canner and an Instant Pot . Could those work in a pinch? Did you shake your cards to dissolve the dry malt extract or just let it sit with the water when you placed in the canner?
Why do you need pressure? If thought putting the glasses in boiling water for 15-30 minutes would kill all microbes. Anyway, very good presentation of the method
Pro tip for heating glassware. Don't heat on a direct flame, search for "Wire mesh ceramic Bunsen Burner" and rest the flask on the wire mesh to spread the heat. Or, heat your wort in a cooking pan, which is better at avoiding boil overs, and pour the hot liquid into your flask. The heat will sanitise the glass. In case the flask breaks, add the hot wort with the flaks in the sink or in a cooking pot. That will contain leaks and avoid scolding yourself.
It's because of something called a Maillard reaction. That's a reaction between reducing sugars and amino acids and is responsible for the umami flavor in grilled meats/onions/... This reaction only happens when high temperatures are held for some time as when pressure canning/frying/grilling/... So by doing that, you will actively change the chemical composition of your wort. I work in a microbiology lab and for us, it is common practice to heat sterilize media components separately and then combine them later under sterile conditions to not run into this reaction.
As an European, the one thing I never understand about canning, is how the jar do not blow up. You seem to be sealing it and then heat it to boil. How the pressure can escape if you screw on the lid.
When you put the lids on, you do not tighten them up hard. Just enough to barely seal. This takes a bit of finesse. There are "tricks" to getting this just right. I watched a caning video...of an old Italian cook using a pressure caner, maybe the first time; and she got a man to really tighten down the lids for her lol Clearly she had not read ANY instructions. As the jars get hot the pressure escapes. By the time you remove the jars they should already be vacuum sealed, but will seal even tighter as they cool. Sometimes when you open the caner, the jars will still be boiling and air being pushed out, because the liquid in the jars is still above normal boiling temperature. Leave them be till they stop boiling. If you bought new jars with lids on them, there is a good chance the seals are indented. Put the lids in boiling water for a few minutes and the seals will smooth out, making sure you get a good seal.
Made 4 jars in a pressure cooker(15psi capable). There is a lot of separation of materials in my jars. The DME dropped out material and the liquid cleared like fermented wort appears.??? Still hot as yet. Does not look like yours at all. FYI Electric pressure COOKERS are not capable of enough pressure(temp.) for CANING. My mechanical stainless steel pressure COOKER does reach 15psi. Though not meant for caning either, it will work for small jars. Fit 4 500ml jars. Pressure CANERS all will reach 15psi, as they ARE designed for CANING.
I've been doing basically this for over a year now, works great. The only difference is I don't use a pressure canner (don't want to own a piece of equipment just to do this) but instead put the jars in a water bath in my oven set to about 90°C for a couple of hours, sure this won't steralize the wort but it should pasturize it well which is good enough for me as I don't keep these for years.
You didn't need to do 9 measurements. Just make a batch and fill jars. BTW Your caner weight does not work as a regulator, not exactly. With the US version of this caner you regulate the pressure using the gauge and controlling the temperature. The Canadian versions do not have a temperature gauge, and has a three piece pressure regulator. You still control the burner temperature to get a proper dance of the regulator, but you remove a section(weight) for lower than 15 PSI. I bought the US version because I got a better deal. $100 can less. Then Presto noted that I live in Canada and sent me the three piece regulator, for free. Why the difference? Glad you asked. In Canada we don't have a service that tests the pressure gauges, which can/will go out of calibration over time. The three piece weight regulator can't go out of calibration. I also purchased a spare pressure gauge. SHTF soon.
I hope you resuspended the DME before putting it in the pressure cooker. Maillard reaction seems to be a problem in your process. I usually make my sugar solution like this for bottling and if I didn't resuspend proberly or heated for too long it gets brown and I actually make it new because some part of the sugar is ruined. One would want to cool quickly after cooking by cooling it with water in the sink to not ruin the vitamins. Sterilizing "medium" at home is not easy, but as long as it worked for you, it's good enough. ;-)
When you're making a starter using DME, you're effectively inheriting some kind of standard base water profile from whatever company made the DME since obviously they aren't making DME with RO water.
My process is different. Whenever brewing I'll do 1 extra gallon and, before my first hop addition I just put it in 2L mason jar calculating the dilution to get to 1.040. This is even cheaper.
Unfortunately pressure canning is not very common in Europe. But i did the same with a presure cooker. It can make 115°C, not 121°C like the canner, so I increase time to 60 minutes.
Recently I do no chill a lot, so while the worth is cooling down over night, I use 2-3L of the same worth for the starter. Do cool down the starter worth in the sink.. that's even more convenient for me.
Very nice walkthrough. I’ve considered canning wort over the years but never bothered. My process nowadays is to skip starters entirely and use dry yeast instead.
Maybe add Go-Ferm along with your dry yeast.
Great video again, as always. I go the quick and easy route and use Proper Starter for every liquid yeast propagation.
I do a similar thing but since DME is kind of expensive here, I just either do a small BIAB mash or make an extra gallon of wort when brewing, repurpose some of that wort before the hops are added and pressure can it.
I did that years ago before the canned wort became popular! It works great and is way cheaper than DME
If the wort with the hops was run through a filter so the wort coming into the canning jars was filtered I don't see any issues with using this as a starter do you? Because I like your idea of just making some extra wort vs dealing with purchasing a ton of DME.
@@jamesp1979 I take the wort after the boil starts but before I add hops. I don't see a problem with using hopped wort if it's a lightly hopped beer but I'm not so sure about wort for an IPA since I wouldn't want the hop flavour to carry over. Putting a couple L of IPA wort into a light lager might change the flavour. Or maybe it wouldn't. I dunno.
I just put aside left over sparge water, freeze it,heat it to 73 degrees for a minute, cool it to pitching temperature, job done.
White Labs is about $16 now. I have been having great luck pressure canning starters. Quart jars make larger starters with almost no cost! Harvesting and making my own starters is a huge savings.
What a well timed video! I'm making some when I go to my inlaws this weekend (they have a pressure canner I can use). I was already planning on following the homebrewnotes method but have a video breaking down the steps is always appreciated.
I love the explanation on sterilization involved in the canning process, but it would've been good to mention why a pressure canner is needed over a regular canner people may have hanging around. You need the 15psi to reach ~250F and kill botulism spores. normal canning temp won't do that, and the spores could survive into the starter and into the final beer which would be very dangerous to consume.
You are apparently talking about the difference between a boiling bath CANER, which you are calling a "regular CANER", and a pressure CANER. Boiling bath CANER will not get hot enough.
Electric pressure COOKERS will likely not reach 15psi. A mechanical pressure COOKER will. These are not designed for caning though. Put a trivet in the bottom.
I've been doing this, based on the same Homebrew Notes article, since I started whole grain brewing about three years ago. I use an electric pressure cooker so make sure I don't have the canned wort hanging round for ages. It works very well for me.
I also have an electric pressure cooker, but I'm unsure of the settings. I don't seem to have full manual control. How do you do it?
I also would like to know.
I give the grain bag (BIAB) a really hard squeeze to extract some extra wort and then transfer the wort to a PET bottle. I would then freeze the wort in a freezer. A day before making a starter, I'll take the bottle out and leave it at room temp. Then I proceed to boiling and cooling it before making a starter. I usually have a couple of frozen wort PET bottles lying around in my freezer at any moment ;)
I do press can starter wort as well... I have a post on my instagram of my process from February. But I usually make the wort from older base malts that I have kicking around, throw in some expired dry yeast in a short post mash boil with a pinch of hops. I do a short boil since I usually make more wort than I can pressure can in one round, so I want to keep the round 2 cans sanitized while waiting. It does make for a longer process, but cost of ingredients is lower, and I'm not dumping ingredients I otherwise wouldn't brew with. The canned wort tends to be lighter than DME too if that is important to you.
For a free yeast starter, when I hot-cube, I take the litre or so of wort left in the kettle, strain it, water it down to 1.040, boil it, and jar it. That way, my starter is pretty much the same as the wort I'll pitch it into, and I don't waste that little bit of leftover wort.
I transfer my malt pipe from my braumeister into a bucket and use the unsparged run off from the grains as the base for a starter
I loved this method because it allows you to make a starter easily well in advance.
What I did in my last brewing was to take 2.5 liters of the wort (pre boil, até 1.040) straight to the Erlenmeyer, cooled and inoculated a sachet of yeast, letting it spinn for about 20 hours, time I leave the wort in the pan decanting before the transfer to the fermenter.
Very cool to be able to store an extract on the shelf. Thanks for sharing
Where I live Goya Malta is available in the ethnic foods section of all the supermarkets for about 1.25 a bottle. It's a non-fermented malt drink. It is carbonated and has some sugar added, but I have found it makes a great starter. Mix a bottle of that with a little trub the day before brew day and by the time you need it, it will be nice and active. I just wish the amber bottles weren't twist-off.
I got rid of my pressure canner a few years ago when the canned wort came out. I don't feel it's worth the storage space premium, rather just keep a couple cans on hand from the brew shop. The canned stuff worked great for me, as does the canned wort.
I just fill up a one liter jar when I brew 15 min in to the boil and put the top on, after cooling it seals perfectly.
I got the Fast Pitch when it was on sale for $65 for 24 cans. I doubt I'll ever see that price again so I'll likely switch over to your method next time! Thanks for the video. For some reason I had it in my head that I'd have to boil a concentrated dose, then put it in jars and pressurize. Simply adding DME and water is so much easier than I thought!!
Love this idea! I've never looked into canning my own wort. I have the Oktober SL1 canner, but I doubt that would have the same effect as you can't pressure seal it. I have plenty of mason jars and I store plenty of yeast to use for starters. Over the years, I've tried many ways to do starters...propper starter, mini-mashes, skimming wort from brew day, you name it. There are so many ways to make starters. I may have to give this a try.
Great video! Thanks for providing it!
I have three questions:
1. When you put the Mason jars in the bath, should the lids be kept loose? Othrwise how can any pressure/steam get out?
2. How much air space should there be in the Mason jars? I assume that the wort will up bubble under heat and pressure?
3. Should the jars be be placed on some kind of stand to keep them away from the direct heat source?
Thanks!
That's brilliant Martin. Wonder if I could use my instant pot...
In episode 62 of the Bru Lab, Dr. Maria Moutsoglou stated that the optimal yeast propagation is 2°P or 1.008 SG with a high nitrogen to carbon ratio. Shouldn't we be building yeast starters to this instead of the 1.040 mentioned in this video?
I listened to that episode too! and following that logic make starters from the tail end of my sparging runoff. I then freeze the mason jar, and thaw it and sanitize before my next brew day.
My advice: Use 1 liter mason jars at 1.040. Put mason jars (7) in oven at 250F to pre-heat. Pre-boil 7 liters of water/DME in a large kettle while also heating up the canning water. Boil wort thru hot break in the kettle. This will prevent foam-overs/loss of wort during canning. Ladle boiled wort into pre-heated mason jars. Attach lids, then add jars to canner. Pressure can at 15 psi for about 10 minutes. Use one sterile jar of canned wort for a basic starter without adding non-sanitized water to it.
This is a great yeast starter hack!
I personally just stick to the traditional boil 1L of water, add 100g of dme, boil for 15min, cool, and pitch yeast method. I don't mind it. 😃
I once read on a blog that you can add DME (stored in a freezer) to a sanitized flask and add freshly opened bottled water to it. The blog user claimed that the DME is sanitized because it was from the freezer and that the water is sanitized because it’s sanitized before its bottled. I have never tied it.
Thanks! Just did this and have a quick question - there's a lot of gunk in my jars (I assume it's hot break/trub). Do you pour that into the starter as well? I'm guessing it won't hurt the yeast at all and would just drop out of solution, but want to double check. Thanks Martin!
Yup it all goes in!
I do no-chill overnight. but boil and cool a small pot a wort on brewday and make a starter from that so its ready for pitching in the morning.
How do you store the finished yeast starter - in the fridge or in the cellar? How long will it last unrefrigerated?
I am thinking that the nutrients would be denatured by the high temperature caning.
I plan to add Fermaid O, for example, when I make my starter, just before pitching my yeast. I see instructions for using Fermaid O, during fermentation, at one third sugar depletion; so it is ok then to add nutrients without needing??? to be boiled.
Anyway, seems to me that natural yeast nutrients may be denatured or destroyed by high temperatures.
I think the yeast may prefer fresher food.
Did you mix or shake up the DME and water in the jars before canning?
I just pour out some boiled wort into a jar, cool. then add in my yeast normally 5-8ml of kveik , leave over night then pitch it into my main wort in the stainless steel fermenter where the rest of the wort has cooled naturally over night. never had an issue. I keep the Kviek in test tubes that i sanitise and get about 8 x 15ml vials out of a kveik liquid pouch. Makes life easier and the yeast go a long way.
Thinking about it, would be good to do a video on: Does hot cubing beer actually make the beer taste different to one that's been rapidly cooled prior to pitching? Perfect science experiment for BRÜLOSOPHY to do!!
To what extent do the Maillard components produce untoward (or at least unexpected) flavors? Is it more critical to decant the starter prior to pitching using this technique? Even though the total starter supernate is small compared to the boil volume, MR components can have potent flavor in small amounts. Perhaps a Brulosophy experiment with a triangle test could explore this.
Great video :) thank you
Are you sure the nutrients / vitamins survive the canning process?
Good question. Maybe add the yeast nutrients later on when the starter is made, just before adding the yeast.
@@markluxton3402thanks for the reply! I’m a bit confused because the manufacturer says to put it 10min before the end of the boil. So I don’t know what’s best, risking to kill the nutrients or infecting the wort? 😅
@@loicbourrit518 Many nutrients get denatured when boiled. I have watched many brewers add nutrients at the end of the wort boil, or flame out. This makes sense to me, to get the nutrient powder dissolved, without overly boiling it, and denaturing the nutrients you just spent good money on ;-)
The yeast, like us, enjoy good health if our nutrients are fresh.
Sooooo.......It also makes sense to me, that putting said nutrients into a jar of caned wort, is even hotter than boiling, and for 10 minutes, 15, 20 ?, by the time the caner cools, and the jars stop boiling. See my point?
I plan to add nutrients to my yeast "starter", as follows...
I will use: caned concentrated wort(DME & water), and (sterile corrected/prepared) water, and yeast.
and fresh nutrients! I will add the nutrients in straight away though, if I am going to warm the starter.
I am actually a bit new to this, so I am not sure, if the purchased powdered nutrients, like Fermaid o, or Go-Ferm(for using a dry yeast), NEED to be hot, to dissolve well???
BUT, even if I do need to heat some liquid, to get the nutrients well dissolved, and as fresh as I can, I'll try heating a just small amount, of the caned wort and water, maybe a cup, just enough to get good dissolution; then I will add this to the starter.
Yeast, when the starter temperature is correct/ideal.
I'm no expert, just have learned a bit about nutrition. Happy yeast makes happy beer ;-)
@@loicbourrit518 I get that the powdered nutrients may not be entirely sterile. I feel ok with this since, if I have kept everything else sterile and ideal to start my yeast, whatever may come along with the nutrients is getting eaten and soon poisoned with alcohol.
A fast start of your yeast, at ideal temp and conditions, gives your yeast such an advantage, it will conqueror all; I hope lol
Might have missed it, but are you tightening the lids fully when you put the jars in the pressure cooker?
I do starters the "traditional" method and overbuild then in the process (the brulosophy way!). I like the option of dialing exactly my volume of starter to do so to try to control pitch rate and guesstimate how much yeast I overbuild.
Cheers and thanks for the great content!
I'm looking for that same answer for tightening the lids all the way. Did you ever find out?
Nice video, I just tried it and I have a question. I get a lot of hot break material in the jar, when doing the starter m I suppose to put everything from the jar into my erlenmeyer, hot break material included ?
Great video. I did my first batch of this a few months ago. Didn't do any research, but i've been canning food for years, so it just made sense to me. Saves a ton of time and effort. Note: If you don't have a pressure canner, you can just do a water bath; put your jars in a pot, fill with water to just barely cover the top of cans, then boil. This usually requires longer processing time.
Actually the reason you have to can wort at 15 psi is to prevent botulism. At regular pressure with wort there is no guarantee
@@jbaisch that's right because unfermented wort is technically a low acid food. You could lower the pH to 4.5 if you want to water bath can safely.
Can I do this by just doing the boil-mason-jars-in-a-pot method? That is: no pressure-rated pot, but still boiling the jars and contents the same way I'd can, say tomatoes or other foods?
In Europe we generally can without pressure canners, so it definitely can be done on the stovetope in a pot of boiling water. It'll just require more time to sterilize.
How do you extract the extra yeast that you get from your erlenmayer?
In the south, we call that weight, “The Jiggler.” Awesome video
I just pour boiling wort into a canning jar and let it cool.
Boiling water is enough to fully sanitize. Don’t need any canning equipment. Plus as it cools it forms the same seal you get when canning!!
Maybe rethink what you’re doing. In order to kill the bacteria that can actually kill you; the water has to reach 254 degrees. Boiling water only reaches 212 degrees. Do not confuse “Water bath” method with “Pressure Canning”. Hopefully this will help you stay healthy 🙏
@@haywardstewart2825 what bacteria is in DME and water that survives 212 F that can kill you? I store beer for a year plus that hasn’t reached 254 degrees. If the wort jars don’t maintain a seal then they’re compromised.
I don’t understand where the danger lies. I’m not canning bear meat.
I've gotten lazy and just stayed with dry yeast. Much easier to store and no starter and canner required. If I time my batches close enough, I can also pitch on the yeast cake of a previous batch.
I am going to try this
Hi there, when canning your yeast starters, instead of using a pressure cooker, would it do the same thing to use a vacuum sealer after sanitizing everything of course??
You could boil the bags after to ensure sterile?
Great job. Thanks!
Nice video. I don't have a pressure canner. I do have a water bath canner and an Instant Pot . Could those work in a pinch?
Did you shake your cards to dissolve the dry malt extract or just let it sit with the water when you placed in the canner?
I just saw a comment below that the water bath method doesn't kill botulism spores.
So good there.
How about using an Instant Pot?
Why do you need pressure? If thought putting the glasses in boiling water for 15-30 minutes would kill all microbes. Anyway, very good presentation of the method
Cool idea
Does the can wort change the colour of you beer when you use it?
Pro tip for heating glassware. Don't heat on a direct flame, search for "Wire mesh ceramic Bunsen Burner" and rest the flask on the wire mesh to spread the heat. Or, heat your wort in a cooking pan, which is better at avoiding boil overs, and pour the hot liquid into your flask. The heat will sanitise the glass. In case the flask breaks, add the hot wort with the flaks in the sink or in a cooking pot. That will contain leaks and avoid scolding yourself.
What a great idea…. Now to get a pressure canner
You used light DME. Why does the starter look so dark?
I was wondering the exact same question
It's because of something called a Maillard reaction. That's a reaction between reducing sugars and amino acids and is responsible for the umami flavor in grilled meats/onions/... This reaction only happens when high temperatures are held for some time as when pressure canning/frying/grilling/... So by doing that, you will actively change the chemical composition of your wort. I work in a microbiology lab and for us, it is common practice to heat sterilize media components separately and then combine them later under sterile conditions to not run into this reaction.
@@christophkoppl4137 all you had to say was Maillard reaction.
Thanks for the detailed explanation. Helps me remember so I don’t freak our
As an European, the one thing I never understand about canning, is how the jar do not blow up. You seem to be sealing it and then heat it to boil. How the pressure can escape if you screw on the lid.
When you put the lids on, you do not tighten them up hard. Just enough to barely seal. This takes a bit of finesse. There are "tricks" to getting this just right.
I watched a caning video...of an old Italian cook using a pressure caner, maybe the first time; and she got a man to really tighten down the lids for her lol Clearly she had not read ANY instructions.
As the jars get hot the pressure escapes. By the time you remove the jars they should already be vacuum sealed, but will seal even tighter as they cool. Sometimes when you open the caner, the jars will still be boiling and air being pushed out, because the liquid in the jars is still above normal boiling temperature. Leave them be till they stop boiling.
If you bought new jars with lids on them, there is a good chance the seals are indented. Put the lids in boiling water for a few minutes and the seals will smooth out, making sure you get a good seal.
Made 4 jars in a pressure cooker(15psi capable). There is a lot of separation of materials in my jars. The DME dropped out material and the liquid cleared like fermented wort appears.???
Still hot as yet. Does not look like yours at all.
FYI Electric pressure COOKERS are not capable of enough pressure(temp.) for CANING. My mechanical stainless steel pressure COOKER does reach 15psi. Though not meant for caning either, it will work for small jars. Fit 4 500ml jars.
Pressure CANERS all will reach 15psi, as they ARE designed for CANING.
I've been doing basically this for over a year now, works great. The only difference is I don't use a pressure canner (don't want to own a piece of equipment just to do this) but instead put the jars in a water bath in my oven set to about 90°C for a couple of hours, sure this won't steralize the wort but it should pasturize it well which is good enough for me as I don't keep these for years.
I heard the split lids for mason jars are single use and shouldn't be reused for canning. Anyone who has experience care to comment?
He is referencing the threaded ring when he stated you can use it again. You are correct, the sealing lid is a one time use item.
i have some liquid dme that i dont know what to do with, I do now 👍
Time to get me a pressure cooker. I can convince the misses around the ROI
You didn't need to do 9 measurements. Just make a batch and fill jars.
BTW Your caner weight does not work as a regulator, not exactly. With the US version of this caner you regulate the pressure using the gauge and controlling the temperature.
The Canadian versions do not have a temperature gauge, and has a three piece pressure regulator. You still control the burner temperature to get a proper dance of the regulator, but you remove a section(weight) for lower than 15 PSI.
I bought the US version because I got a better deal. $100 can less. Then Presto noted that I live in Canada and sent me the three piece regulator, for free.
Why the difference? Glad you asked. In Canada we don't have a service that tests the pressure gauges, which can/will go out of calibration over time. The three piece weight regulator can't go out of calibration. I also purchased a spare pressure gauge. SHTF soon.
I hope you resuspended the DME before putting it in the pressure cooker. Maillard reaction seems to be a problem in your process. I usually make my sugar solution like this for bottling and if I didn't resuspend proberly or heated for too long it gets brown and I actually make it new because some part of the sugar is ruined. One would want to cool quickly after cooking by cooling it with water in the sink to not ruin the vitamins.
Sterilizing "medium" at home is not easy, but as long as it worked for you, it's good enough. ;-)
I hear that ro water is not good for a starter. It creates a higher osmotic pressure ( if I remember correctly) and it can harm the yeast.
When you're making a starter using DME, you're effectively inheriting some kind of standard base water profile from whatever company made the DME since obviously they aren't making DME with RO water.
Ok to use RO water if using min BIAB instead of DME ? I buy 2 row by the sack so way cheaper
3 min advert and 2x 1 min adverts b4 start, this better be a good video