as a straight white male, my favorite thing is to come on line after a hard day at my white privilege minimum wage job to find out what problems i caused for rich white actresses today🥰, I'm amazed at my own prowess. Edit: Ok everyone, I appreciate the likes and the discourse, i feel.... privileged. but a reminder that this is the internet, and Hollywood doesn't matter...doesn't matter at all.
@@GIBBO4182It's a malicious Marxist concept. Complete BS. White countries sacrifice and build themselves up for generations and are "privileged" for enjoying the fruits of their labor? Piss off!
Hollywood is the only industry that chooses to openly insult it's customer base. And yet seem shocked when people would rather watch YT or TT vids for free based on their interests.
@@EwanCumia at least politicians wear masks and openly lie to get votes. Hollywood hates on its viewers openly before and especially upon failure, Hollywood has it's teeth sunken in with no fear of losing its customers, politicians have a slight chance of losing their position if they aren't careful
As a guy, I know the routine. A movie gets made. The producers say that the movie isn't for men. The movie is released. The movie flops. Men are blamed even though a lot of women didn't see the movie. Repeat this over and over. Thank you Hollywood for saving me a lot of money. I'm proud every time a movie I didn't watch absolutely flops. All the blame directed to me means absolutely nothing.
Not the producers, the actresses and (female) writers, who somehow manage to convince producers that this is a good investment (and at this point I am fairly certain there's sexual favours involved).
After years you tend to see the red flags immediatly, either by how they promote the movie, or how they talk about it. The buzzwords they think are positive immediatly tell you what it will be. Odd that humans who have brains that can detect patterns can put 2 and 2 together.
@@dubz2009 ...what fake quotes are you sick of? OP didn't give a quote, and the attitude they're referring to (and that they said they're sick of) is a very prevalent one on X among feminists and modern Hollywood actresses. Maybe stick to those Jon Oliver videos, thinking doesn't seem like your strong suit 😂
@@zeked4200 ah another “it doesn’t matter that the quote is fake”. Truth no longer matters. What you believe matters. Oh and you can’t comment on a video that is specifically discussing a (fake) quote and then claim you weren’t quoting anyone. That won’t wash.
Women also think we should watch the WNBA even though it's boring as hell. Granted, the trash defense and rules that suppress defense is making the NBA boring too, but still.
Yes. You are. Because wealthy American women are the most entitled people on earth. If you weigh how much they contribute vs their entitlement, they are by far the worst in history. At least Roman patricians actually achieved things.
This reminds me of jada being mad at the world, because Will sucked in the concussion movie . Great movie, really awful fit for Will , even a distraction to the great content. But according to jada “the academy was racist” . (So delusional)
Gen Z women demonstrated strong support for the Barbie movie, leading the percentages across all age groups. Conversely, men's interest in Oppenheimer was fairly consistent across all age groups. Let people enjoy what they like in their movie categories; we don't all have to like the same things, and that's okay.
Hollywood needs to make more lower budgeted fare that appeals to *separate* demographics rather than pour hundreds of millions into projects that try (and fail) to appeal to *all* demographics. The desire to chase billion dollars most of the time has been hurting studios.
Look at the marketing for the Barbie movie too. They partnered with makeup companies and fashion brands, all things women love. You didn't see them try to create Barbie power tools for the men in the audience.
Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson quote from “As Good As It Gets.” When asked how he writes women so well, Nicholson’s character, Melvin Udall, responds with: “I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability.”
Straight white female here!! 🙋🏻♀️ I used to go to every MCU movie, I didn't like birds of prey and the marvels, madame webb etc. because they sucked. The marketing to us is patronizing and insulting, so it's a lose lose situation
@@earthwalker7992I'm not the OP, but I'm a female fan, so I'll answer your question. If I see a single PR moment that leads with anything about "the Force is Female" or if they say the story is important simply because "representation" I'm not interested. Female fans want nothing different than male fans - compelling character, good writing, coherent story and good world building. If they lead with identity, it tells me THAT is what they focused on, and the rest will suffer as a result. 🤷🏾♀️ Just my opinion.
Rob getting sucked into General Hospital made me laugh. True story here, when I was in the Air Force back in the 80's I was stationed in Japan. General Hospital was one of the few American Shows that AFRTS (Armed Forces Radio and Television Service) aired daily. It came on at 2 pm and work in the squadron came to a halt as everyone gathered in the ready room to watch GH.
Haha. Every time I hear someone mention General Hospital, I think of watching AFN as an army brat in Germany in the 80's. I, actually, watched Guiding Light, but for the same reason.
That explains why Steve Burton, i.e. Jason Morgan, got handpicked to play Cloud from Final Fantasy 7. and I find it funny that General Hospital STILL comes on at 2 pm. I come from a military family and that was the one show that we bonded over.
As a straight white woman in her mid-thirties, I actually LOVE the concept of superheroes. But I also love me a good romance with equally capable men to women (someone definitely deserving of love and support), which is sorely lacking in this M-She-U. If Madame Web and the Marvels had some romance in it alongside its action, (and it helps if the man or men are good-looking as well), then I might have been tempted to see it. I don't need empowerment -- that's not why I watch movies. I need escapism, and for a majority of us women, that requires a sweet, developed romance with a hot, strong, protective guy.
Yes! I keep thinking along this line. I have always loved superhero movies, sci-fi, etc. I think I probably like them for different reasons than men do. If you consider Star Wars, Leia was feisty and headstrong, but there was also a romance with Han Solo. When it comes to Madame Web, if I trusted these new films, I probably could have been convinced to watch a scientist studying spiders in the forest, but since they all try to push some new ideology, I don't even try unless it gets a raving review.
She never said that. They fell and spreading fake news. Same as the comment section. Ryan Kinel made a video about it and thank God he decided to wait because it sounded sus to him.
I parked my car outside the cinema with 2 Madame Web tickets in the glove compartment when i came back it had been broken into and there were 6 Madame Web tickets in there
My 73 year old mother says - "If they want women to watch? Just put a shirtless Hemsworth in it. It doesn't even need to be good, if they put a shirtless Hemsworth in it." She also says, "a shirtless Hemsworth would work for all of your UA-cam channels as well."
Sorry to correct your old mother, but it's 'Helmsworth'. Hollywood Superstar Rich Evans, brother of Hollywood Megastar Chris Evans, will have you know.
Hollywood: *_" F°CK the customer, we do what we want. Not what THEY want. We are also much more morally superior to them too. Which is really all that matters. "_* Customers: °soothing cricket noises° Hollywood: *_" REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "_* 🤬
Thank you for mentioning all you did! It’s awful how scripted the behaviors of people in the entertainment industry are to blame sexism. I’m a woman, and didn’t care for any of these “female empowerment” films, because I found the writing and characters to be dull. I didn’t care if the characters are women or not. And just as you said, if a product is not interesting to women audiences, these women directors need to understand that. Sure, they’re women who enjoy comics, and I was one of them, but that doesn’t mean they should change the product. Wonder Woman used to be great because they wrote her as a character who dealt with the same issues any superhero would deal with regardless of their gender or sex. It didn’t used to be a political ad of real world women issues. Heck, I loved the Batman series and Cat Woman as a little girl growing up. I would not want the writers back then changing anything just because I happen to be a woman. I think they would get more women into comics if they focused on staying true to the products, rather than trying to remold it into another genre it wasn’t meant to be. And good point about anime or Japanese entertainment structure is completely different than the US. It’s like a convention with people making specific products for specific audiences, with clear boundaries between them. It allows every product to stand as its own thing. American entertainment structure used to be similar of it’s own ways, but now our entertainment including modern comics is like Walmart. They are trying to be universal for all, but with entertainment that doesn’t work. What happens is every product becomes confusion like who is this for? What is worse is nowadays every product of entertainment comics is trying to pander to political real world of women’s issues, when that isn’t what audiences (male, female, others or their fans) want. They also can’t argue products for women in entertainment doesn’t exist, because they have had for decades. It’s even a HUGE business in Asian countries, like BL and otomo series. Drama shows, etc. They could be working to design more products for women in the US expanding on that market that is still going. I hate Twilight, but I can’t ignore it was a financial success, which also shows there is an audience for them here in the states. Instead, they seek to hijack products designed and aimed at male audiences. They get angry that it only turns male audiences away, and ironically also the women who enjoy comics… It is all absurd, and proves in my viewpoint that these women directors really don’t care about their potential audiences out there. Now comic series I enjoy have to suffer for it.
As Bill Burr says about the WNBA: "those stadiums should be packed to the rafters with feminists!". Instead it's 2:1 male:female, nearly the same as the viewership ratio for the NBA (just with like 10% of the total viewership)
Why are they "my team" because I'm female? It takes more than "look a girl" for me to like something. That's just insulting. Good writing, character development, story and world building make me want to see a movie. When they lead with talk of "representation" and "girl power" in the PR, it tells me THAT was their focus and the rest was not the priority. So I lose interest in seeing it. If your PR talks about story, character etc I'm going to be interested.
As a "privileged" white man who didn't even see the movie, my favorite part of *Madame Web* is gonna to be the plethora of Rule 34 art that the movie inspires.
No, it means we can recognize garbage and opt not to spend our hard earned money on said garbage. There are so many better movies with strong independent women.
There's actually been studies on court outcomes that show that female jury is more likely to convcit than a make jury. And a female jury is more likely to give women harsher sentences than men, and women are likely to give men harsher sentences than men. And that if a female juror is on a case about a woman defending herself with a gun they are more likely to recommend the harshest sentence when a male juror is likely to recommend the least or none for the same scenario. So yes women hate strong independent women.....who aren't them.
"So that means it's actually women that hold deep contempt for strong independent women" aka every female coworkers that I encountered when our boss/manager was a woman.
It's hard to view this industry as anything but socio-political propaganda at this point. Hollywood is producing work that attempts to manipulate the consumer, but when the consumer chooses to take their money elsewhere, then the machine strawmans sexism, misogyny, or racism as justification for their poor business model. I love what Robert said, "...they are trying to cater to an audience that isn't even there." and I love what Nerdrotic said about the commodification of virtue signaling...such a spot on diagnosis of what we are experiencing...just insanity.
You can tell manipulation is their goal, because when they fail, they don't say "Oh darn, we misread the room." They say "What the heck is wrong with these jerks who aren't swallowing what we put in front of them?" When a movie "for women" flops, they don't say "What did we do wrong" or "I guess the market wasn't there". They say "Hey! Those men whose job it is to buy our crap aren't playing along!" Both artists and businessmen would react differently than they're reacting. But they are reacting exactly how you'd expected, frustrated, entitled, propagandists to act..
Basically what Chapelle said about why the WNBA isn't as popular. Many blame men for not being interested, but he pointed out that women aren't into it as much as the Kardashians, which is what women are interested in.
Women like romance novels and hallmark movies. Theres nothing wrong with that. Now imagine taking both those genres and making them to attract male audiences.
I like whisky, my wife likes wine. My local distillery sells less whisky than the local Vinyard sells wine. The distillery does not blame the female gender for not turning out to drink their product or accuse them of toxic feminism for not embracing whisky as equally as they like wine. She tried whisky, didnt like it. Its a matter of preference and taste, those that like it will consume it. It's basic business. If the distillery wants her as a customer, make something she likes, not force her to like what they make.
Old Disney however was smart enough to have things in their movies - even those more targeted at females - that people in general and males liked. Values like Family or Love, and yes, at times even a little bit of heroism. So in your own way: Your distillery if it was old Disney would have a few bottles of wine to at least attract someone with different taste, and maybe they will try something and like it, or buy something for a loved one and get something for themselfs out of it. Maybe not the best wine and they might not have the same number of different ones to choose from but something they can at least enjoy. That would be good enough as a business strategy.
I feel you, Robert. I got sucked into the maelstrom of GH in the 80s too. My oldest son and his friends had a term for getting trapped into watching any Nicholas Sparks movie. They called it "getting Notebooked."
Manga has boys (shonen) and girls (shoujo) stories. And they arent ashamed of that. Shoujo is romance, magic with a more dramatic (relationship heavy) stories. Shonen is sports, action, and hero/power fantasies. You destroy that, you get stories aimed at no one. Hollywood needs to relearn this.
Yeah that's my huge revelatory takeaway from this. That was an astute observation. Manga have had female writers for generations now, whereas the comics in the U.S. are male dominated (que sera sera). But it definitely does paint the differences in the cultural differences, and I'll even say traditions, in those industries. Which is why Superman can't be bisexual, just because you want him to be. Hahaha
@clevergirlaah1251 manga is more of a medium. It can be about any topic: romance, superhero, regular school people, crime and the likes, while comics are genre specific like superheros. this is why manga has lots of female authors while comics don't, but we in the west DO have lots of female graphic novel authors (which would be our equivalent of manga). but your point still stands as comics themselves are and will always be male dominated. Edit: medium isn't the correct term, I couldn't think of a better word for it. I just mean that manga isn't genre specific like comics are (superheros).
@@saltyk9869 yup, and a great selection for any of those genres too AND with great female leads and diverse characters. I work in a bookstore and our manga is probably our biggest seller or at least in the top three. as for comics? not even top 5 or more. comics get stale very quickly but manga just keeps rising.
A piece of work can target a demographic, but still reach people outside of that target demographic. And that's what comic books and overall geek culture has been doing for a long time. Problem is when you try to market towards everyone, you're way more likely to lose everyone. Like the classic Disney princess movies were probably not aimed at young boys, but I still loved them as a kid. I watched Cinderella a couple dozen or even over a hundred times. Mulan is still my favorite of those movies. We had Beauty and the Beast on laserdisc, and it was awesome.
I actually talked to a friend from work, a woman friend from work. She told me once that her favorite superhero was Spider-Man, but didn't want to see Madame Web because it looked bad. Funny how these big superhero movies claim to cater to women, but a woman doesn't want to see it cause it doesn't appeal to her.
I have a female colleague who is into comics and superhero movies. I asked her about Madame Web and she said it "looks dumb and uninteresting" so she wasn't interested in going to see it yet she's the target demographic! How about Hollywood make a smart and interesting superhero movie we can all go and see?
If 70% of the action movie audience is male, than there is a substantial amount of women who love action movies. I'm one of those creatures. Why do I love action movies? Because I love seeing strong men on screen. Why doesn't anyone get that?
100% agree. Also, the same is true of guys wanting to see GENUINELY strong ladies on screen (not this fake nonsense that Hollywood seems to think represents "strong women" - spiteful, nasty, bitter female characters with overexaggerated power levels that doesn't really even have ANYTHING in common with reality). If they were SO bothered by the strength level thing, there ARE ways you could even out the odds in a fight (and as an action movie viewer, I'm pretty sure you'll pretty familiar with all the ways how smaller guys can successfully take on bigger, tougher, stronger guys - you could take those ideas over to female-led franchises AS well and it would STILL work pretty well there). Also, guys are NOT against female-led movies. Said as someone who watched (and is still watching) female-led movies going back even when I was kid. The only thing WE ask, is give us something even HALFWAY decent to watch and we'll watch it. Our favorite female heroines from the past is PROOF of this reality (unlike the illusions and lies some "journalists" would like to create).
@@sigmacademy I agree with you about the difference between 'strong women' and spiteful, nasty, bitter women. The moment in any trailer when I hear a woman say anything nasty or demeaning to a man, I am immediately turned off by it. I don't talk that way to the men in my life and I don't want to see it in movies.
Because the DEI hires are middle aged wine moms/spinsters that want the world to cater to them because they’re narcissistic weirdos who got jobs either thru connections or just quota hiring
My friend, a woman, suggested we watch Madame Web. I agreed, no sarcasm or malice. I'm a middle-aged white guy. I even promised not to riff the film in the (otherwise empty) theatre. After the movie started my friend, a female I will remind, started riffing the movie herself. After the movie, I came away with that this is a clumsy way to introduce a necessary Spider-verse character. The producers, directors and even some of the actors/actresses have failed their audiences. Not the audience.
That's what you can expect from people who believe every disparity is a symptom of systematic oppression, rather than just a reality of life. It couldn't possibly be that they failed, its always something else at fault.
I remember being in grade 12 (1998), and every day at 11am a bunch of us would cut class and watch Days of Our Lives in the student lounge. This speaks volumes about the quality of writing/characters because a show targeted at housewives had caught the interest of teenage boys. It didn't matter who the show was created for, but the fact it was engaging enough anyone could enjoy it.
General Hospital in the 80s was awesome. Modern day GH did the same thing super hero movies did. They threw away their existing audience to attract a new audience and it never happened. Now it has no audience.
Robert is correct. I'm an old timer and the thing with girls and women being into comic books back in the day was extremely rare. And they were pretty much outcasts. Also, they were into the female aspects of the comic books. I'm a big LoSH fan and was so surprised to find a girl my age who was really into that title too. I soon discovered it was for very different reasons though... "Oh, I wonder if Timber Wolf is going to save Light Lass! Maybe they'll kiss!!" "Ultra Boy is so hot!" etc. Basically, the relationships between the super lads and lasses :)
And of course, the one aspect of these movies to majorly fail is the characters-both in making relatable characters and in having a story line that creates meaningful character relationships. So why would we females be interested? 😂
Beauty and the Beast (the original animated one) is an interesting example. In those days, did Disney chase an audience? Did they pander? No, they simply sat down and made awesome films, with great stories and characters. I vividly remember setting up a date with an old high school friend and when I asked her what she wanted to do she said she'd like to see Beauty and the Beast. Well, I had no interest at all in seeing a "cartoon," but I humored her . . . and watched one of the best films I've ever seen. I don't know anyone who didn't like Beauty and the Beast, men, women, whoever. The Pixar films from the 90s and early 2000s were more examples: very engaging grown-up films you could take your kids to. Did they use focus groups to figure out what to make? I doubt it. Everyone loved them.
Funny how its always men's fault when a girl power movie fails. No matter how much support it gets, no matter how much advertising it gets, and even if the majority of people who saw it were men, SOME HOW, SOME WAY, its always the men's fault.
I think I just figured out why they think that. It's the same deceptive thing as "Women CEOs don't make as much money." - They say "Our movie has a badass girl who pushes herself on unwilling men. She kicks ass. And there's never any paperwork about how much destruction of property. It's just like Nolan's Batman" (when really they just put a lesbian in it and make her lame) then cry foul. They literally cannot see the difference. Also they have to cover their asses because all the BS decisions are theirs... And it's their pinko staff-writers and sensitivity agents...
Sometimes I think they are all brainwashed by tiktok on purpose; so China can come around and promise to get rid of this craziness for us and bring order again.
I've had countless 'me obliterating the bad guys' fantasies. But I wouldn't want to watch a film based on them. I prefer the heroes to be men. I want my swooning fix! Modern 'strong independent woman' characters make me cringe.
Have none of these people heard of Ripley from the Alien franchise or Sarah Conner from Terminator (1 & 2)? I could go on but the point is, It’s got absolutely NOTHING to do with strong independent women…
I really don’t understand how Hollywood can’t grasp the concept of equality. As a woman, I miss men superheros. I don’t want every single project to be woman dominated. I want it EQUAL. Why is that so hard to do?
They don't believe in equality they believe in "equity". Not saying this about you personally, but a lot of women don't have principles. They support whatever gets them the best outcome. So when they fail when being held to the same standards as men, they blame men, not themselves for their lack of talent or work ethic.
the concept of equal is itself a lie. It isn't any more complex than that. Entertainment needs suspension of disbelief, but no one who walks in reality can suspend disbelief of that particular lie.
Disney stated to the press that the Marvel acquisition was largely to address their relative lack of a young male audience. I swear to God this happened.
Correct - much like Discovery acquiring WB and it's properties, Disney acquired Marvel and Star Wars because they had the female demographic locked with their existing properties but wanted to capture the male demographic. They then went and tried to force them to be female driven properties and expected the male demographic to still want to watch it, simply because of an established legacy. That's like a vegan restaurant acquiring a steakhouse, keeping the name of the steakhouse, but making every item on the menu vegan and then blaming the existing customer base for no longer wanting to eat there. As a marketing leader at one of the largest companies in the world, we literally use Disney as a case study of what NOT to do.
It was a good plan until identity politics took over the West. Money be dammed, Disney decided that inclusion was more important than the story and that boys would still watch bad superhero films pushing a message. It appears that if the story is bad, no amount of name calling will make a film popular.
Robert talking about General Hospital reminds me of my husband saying he actually started watching Days of Our Lives with his mom during the summer because of the supernatural elements in it 😂
My dad, my brother and I used to watch Passions together. It was so excessive in how ridiculous it was that it was just awesome. When we went back to school, our dad would record it for us and be talking/laughing about that day's episode when he picked us up.
It’s very much like George Lucas putting a child Anakin in the first Star Wars prequel. George, kids don’t want to be Anakin Skywalker the child! They want to be an adult Jedi! (Or maybe Darth Vader.) Putting an annoying kid in your film isn’t going to appeal to children! I’m many years too late, and if I weren’t he wouldn’t have listened to me because by then he was no longer taking advice from anyone.
The actress flat out denied making those comments and even called out the source. Ryan Kinel did some digging as well coming up empty with any credible source confirming the quote.
Actually, Isabelle Merced didn't say that. It was a rumor started on social media, attributing that quote to her. But she came out and publicly said that she did not say that, and she was disgusted that people online were claiming she said things that she didn't actually say.
Thank you, I came here to point out that the quote was made up, and of course Drinker and crew took the bait. There's a potentially lucrative business in making up stuff that one knows will get attention, clicks and views from a certain triggerable segment.
Disney needs to spend far more on Grrrl Power, feminist movies ! $1 Billion is the minimum in special effects, catering, costumes, make-up etc to properly showcase these strong, confident women.
These Women = "Our movie (show, book, comic, videogame, etc) WASN'T made for you Men. Don't like it, then DON'T watch (play) it." Same Women = "Why didn't Men show up to watch (play) our product?" "Its ALL Men's fault!"
Because these people want exclusivity. They want something that's "theirs" but still want that product to do well because a movie that bombs has no bragging rights
Like that you got RMB on your panel. Prevents this pow wow from becoming an echo chamber. Enjoyed the video! Not that I agree with his comments in general but I do appreciate his viewpoints.
Speaking of "General Hospital," I was recovering at home following some folly in SouthEast Asia in the 70s and got stuck on "Dark Shadows." Written for women but it had Vampires, pretty women, etc. so it was easy to get sucked in.
Straight female here who loves action movies. I grew up watching Schwarzenegger, Stalone, etc. To get the many other straight ladies to the theaters gives us hot manly men in tight outfits or shirtless kicking butt and taking names!
What Marvel and DC are saying is "This movie isn't for men! We hate men! Oh, by the way, men? We still expect you to go and watch our movies because women aren't watching in any significant numbers." They're taking every opportunity to alienate their core demographic, but still expect their core demographic to stick around as paying customers. Either these people don't understand how supply and demand work or they're actively trying to sink their franchises out of pure spite.
It's really less about making a particular genre of movie for a certain demographic than it is about just MAKING A GOOD MOVIE! Compelling characters! Unusual settings or premises! Interesting plots! Sharp dialogue! Stirring music! Risks and creativity! Most of the time, audiences will respond.
On that point towards the end, about forsaking the old audience for the perceived new one, this is one of those proverbial tales as old as time. Like the fable of the goatherd who neglected his domestic goats to the point of death, trying to tame a herd of mountain goats who left him anyway. "Neglect old friends for new, and you may end up losing both."
But for the topic at hand here, the ironic thing is that I personally like the concept of superheroines, and have fantasized about being one since I was a little girl. I don't care for pandering concepts, however, and even when it's hard to put it into words, deep down anyone can tell when something has been done for the sake of pandering. What I have always found most frustrating is that superheroines, as well as superheroes, seem to continue to reflect contemptuous societal double standards, right down to their tropes. The most immediate one I can dredge up is the one Drinker often points out, where they essentially reach Mary Sue status, while their male counterparts actually feel fleshed out. If they would just dial it back to a new movie every five or so years, tops, and try new things with character development and trope exploration, they could probably get around this.
I like Mauler's comment 'What do you mean Unfortunately' around the 2:25 minute mark, lol, Romantic/comedy movies are not bad, Women like them. Stop hating on what women generally gravitate too. Well put Robert Meyer, I love your analysis!!!
I was talking to a friend about this yesterday. We started talking about a pulp fiction novel series that was popular in Norway during the 80s and 90s. It was your typical housewife porn style stories - but with an occult and fantasy twist. Women loved it. It was 50 Shades of Twillight before vampires were cool. The fantasy-romance market seems to be quite appealing to women - but you can also make it decent for men if done right. This is where Hollywood and Streaming should look more. But! Don't set out to make the next GoT. Just make something good, market it well, and people WILL come watch.
Excellent. This conversion is "college level" truth about the differences in people (and yes we know that woke administrators have destroyed all the universities). Robert's comment on "The Notebook" is a great example, however, as a baby-boomer, I watch the movie for James Garner and Gena Rowlands (and I keep forgetting Gosling's name). Except for Star Wars' debut being before our marriage, my wife and I attended all the SciFi - super hero movies being together. Had we not been married, it's likely she would have not bothered with the movie theatre for these genres at all.
I’m not a true nerd outside of being fully obsessed with all things LOTR, but this channel makes me feel sane. I can’t stand being called a bigot and a POS for not liking what’s being spoon fed to us by current day Hollywood.
Bill Burr NAILED IT in his explanation of the failure of WNBA's lack of popularity. "WHERE WERE ALL THE FEMINISTS??!THAT PLACE SHOULD BE PACKED WITH FEMINISTS, SCREECHING AND HOLLERING LIKE WE DO!!"But no,women didn't show up for that.And they do the same thing that they always do, place the blame for their failure on anyone else but themselves..I pity you younger movie and tv audiences of this generation..Back in the day of iconic films (mostly which are rebooted,or "modern audience" reimaginings NOW),If a film sucked, it just sucked, and everyone,including the studios,filmmakers and actors moved on..I mean,when Pirrhana II:The Spawning got 5-13% from numerous critics and audiences,the director who just happened to be James Cameron,didn't blame us for the failure of his directorial debut, he went on to make some of the greatest films between the 80's and NOW.
A friend and I went to the first avenger movie a while ago with his wife and 2 teenage daughters. He elbows me to look over. All three women were asleep in the middle of a big action scene. They said they were bored afterwards. Need I say more 😂
Never heard of robert meyer burnett before but I really like his comments, nuanced and thoughtful, he's absolutely right. Need more commentators like him around.
My partner was the driving force to see most of the MCU - I was brought along to explain characters/stories and compare to their comic book counterparts.
Meanwhile, there are tons of stories with female MCs. "Island on the Sea of Time" has a black, lesbian ship captain. "Honor Harrington" books: the Queen of Manticore is black, and many inspiring characters, including the MC, are female. Ky Vatta from Vatta's War, Paksenarrion from "Sheep farmer's daughter", Ia from "Their's Not to Reason Why" series, Aida from "On Silver Wings". Tons of female characters in "Axis of Time" This list took me a couple of minutes to create. It consists of very simple stories with great imagery that are easy to translate from a book to a screen.
The whole issue that’s been going on in the mainstream entertainment world is that there has been an inversion of the normal flow of interaction between the consumers and the producers of the entertainment. The way it’s supposed to work is: they do something we don’t like, we tell them, they fix it.-- The way it’s actually been working: we tell them we don’t like it/want it, they say too bad, double down, and try to shame you publicly. What has happened essentially is that women act and operate differently than men, and what we’re seeing is what happens when women get to have the final say (this is what has been happening all around the world in the past 5 years).
I can't make it to the theaters right now because of work, I really hope they bring the movie back for at least a couple of weeks so I get a chance to watch it on the big screen. Tried do keep away from spoilers so far, but from what I've heard it definitely seems to be one of the movies of all time. It's webbin time lads!
The Dolph Lundgren Punisher is a brilliant film. Just my opinion but he was the most brutal Punisher on screen so far, I did like the Netflix and Warzone but Dolph still rules, the way he cuts out bullets and cauterized the wound whilst talking to god, it's the reason I love the Punisher
As a woman, I kinda always preferred movies more directed at men cause I have no patience for drama or nonsense romance. I also like, or used to like, animated Disney movies with princess and such. Main thing is, if a movie or show is good more people are gonna like it even if it's not what they usually watch, but if it's crap no one will like it no matter how much pandering studios do.
as a straight white male, my favorite thing is to come on line after a hard day at my white privilege minimum wage job to find out what problems i caused for rich white actresses today🥰, I'm amazed at my own prowess.
Edit: Ok everyone, I appreciate the likes and the discourse, i feel.... privileged. but a reminder that this is the internet, and Hollywood doesn't matter...doesn't matter at all.
When exactly does the privilege kick in? Does anyone know?
Well, someone's to blame who certainly isn't them.
@@GIBBO4182It's a malicious Marxist concept. Complete BS. White countries sacrifice and build themselves up for generations and are "privileged" for enjoying the fruits of their labor? Piss off!
YOU MY FREIND ARE A GOD!!!! 😋
@@GIBBO4182Enjoying the fruits of your ancestor's sacrifice and hard work isn't "privilege".
Hollywood is the only industry that chooses to openly insult it's customer base. And yet seem shocked when people would rather watch YT or TT vids for free based on their interests.
Politicians hold contempt for their voters too.
Comic books and video games also insult their audiences. Funnily enough, it works about as well as you'd expect in those industries too.
It's not the only one. Not even one of the few, that's actually pretty common.
More so left wingers@@EwanCumia
@@EwanCumia at least politicians wear masks and openly lie to get votes. Hollywood hates on its viewers openly before and especially upon failure, Hollywood has it's teeth sunken in with no fear of losing its customers, politicians have a slight chance of losing their position if they aren't careful
As a guy, I know the routine. A movie gets made. The producers say that the movie isn't for men. The movie is released. The movie flops. Men are blamed even though a lot of women didn't see the movie. Repeat this over and over. Thank you Hollywood for saving me a lot of money. I'm proud every time a movie I didn't watch absolutely flops. All the blame directed to me means absolutely nothing.
Not the producers, the actresses and (female) writers, who somehow manage to convince producers that this is a good investment (and at this point I am fairly certain there's sexual favours involved).
After years you tend to see the red flags immediatly, either by how they promote the movie, or how they talk about it.
The buzzwords they think are positive immediatly tell you what it will be.
Odd that humans who have brains that can detect patterns can put 2 and 2 together.
they can't be fired if they insist the problem is someone else
I'm a woman and I have no interest in these movies "made for women". I preferred Marvel when it was for men cause apparently men get better stories.
I take the money I didn’t spend at the box office and use it to support my favorite bar
So sick of sexists saying men are evil for not liking something.
I’m sick of people believing fake quotes
@@dubz2009 ...what fake quotes are you sick of? OP didn't give a quote, and the attitude they're referring to (and that they said they're sick of) is a very prevalent one on X among feminists and modern Hollywood actresses.
Maybe stick to those Jon Oliver videos, thinking doesn't seem like your strong suit 😂
@@zeked4200 ah another “it doesn’t matter that the quote is fake”. Truth no longer matters. What you believe matters. Oh and you can’t comment on a video that is specifically discussing a (fake) quote and then claim you weren’t quoting anyone. That won’t wash.
@@dubz2009Standard leftist just making up shit in the comments.
@@TheClintonio not left. Or right. Just smart enough to check facts. Clearly you’re not 😂
Are men supposed to go see movies that they have no interest in, just to keep these women happy?
Someone explain the logic.
Surely you've met women before 😂
Hence the romcom date movies....
Women also think we should watch the WNBA even though it's boring as hell. Granted, the trash defense and rules that suppress defense is making the NBA boring too, but still.
The logic is that women love making men miserable. It's a biological, evolved instinct.
Yes. You are. Because wealthy American women are the most entitled people on earth. If you weigh how much they contribute vs their entitlement, they are by far the worst in history. At least Roman patricians actually achieved things.
Of course. It always the fault of the audience you DIDN'T make the film for. Makes so much sense.
Notice how they stopped saying "it's not for you." They are gasping for life.
The progressive mind is allergic to personal responsibility.
This reminds me of jada being mad at the world, because Will sucked in the concussion movie . Great movie, really awful fit for Will , even a distraction to the great content. But according to jada “the academy was racist” . (So delusional)
If women were the main supporters of super hero movies?? But , its not even a significant figure.
Exactly.
The Barbie doll didn't need boys to be successful.
It's like turning Barbie into GI Joe and blaming little girls for not liking it.
Gen Z women demonstrated strong support for the Barbie movie, leading the percentages across all age groups. Conversely, men's interest in Oppenheimer was fairly consistent across all age groups. Let people enjoy what they like in their movie categories; we don't all have to like the same things, and that's okay.
Hollywood needs to make more lower budgeted fare that appeals to *separate* demographics rather than pour hundreds of millions into projects that try (and fail) to appeal to *all* demographics. The desire to chase billion dollars most of the time has been hurting studios.
Look at the marketing for the Barbie movie too. They partnered with makeup companies and fashion brands, all things women love. You didn't see them try to create Barbie power tools for the men in the audience.
YOU'RE TELLING ME MEN AND WOMEN LIKE DIFFERENT THINGS TYPICALLY?! 😱
tbh oppenheimer wasnt that great.
@@Wendydarling420it really wasn’t. Einstein was the best part of the film and he had less than 10 minutes total run time
Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson quote from “As Good As It Gets.” When asked how he writes women so well, Nicholson’s character, Melvin Udall, responds with:
“I think of a man and I take away reason and accountability.”
LMFAO!
HOLLYWOOD: THESE MOVIES ARE NOT FOR YOU, MEN!
HOLLYWOOD: THESE MOVIES FAILED BECAUSE MEN REFUSED TO WATCH THEM!
Straight white female here!! 🙋🏻♀️ I used to go to every MCU movie, I didn't like birds of prey and the marvels, madame webb etc. because they sucked. The marketing to us is patronizing and insulting, so it's a lose lose situation
Any one with a non biased opinion also gets shot down saddly. All I wanted was comics on the big screen 😅
I would be interested to get your opinion as a female comic movie nerd. What did you like about the old films? What do you dislike about the new ones?
@@earthwalker7992 the amount of marvel films being released has resulted in a predictable loss of quality..
Completely patronizing. They think so little of women, that they think all we need is crappy writing with a female lead. How insulting and shallow.
@@earthwalker7992I'm not the OP, but I'm a female fan, so I'll answer your question. If I see a single PR moment that leads with anything about "the Force is Female" or if they say the story is important simply because "representation" I'm not interested. Female fans want nothing different than male fans - compelling character, good writing, coherent story and good world building. If they lead with identity, it tells me THAT is what they focused on, and the rest will suffer as a result. 🤷🏾♀️ Just my opinion.
Rob getting sucked into General Hospital made me laugh. True story here, when I was in the Air Force back in the 80's I was stationed in Japan. General Hospital was one of the few American Shows that AFRTS (Armed Forces Radio and Television Service) aired daily. It came on at 2 pm and work in the squadron came to a halt as everyone gathered in the ready room to watch GH.
Haha. Every time I hear someone mention General Hospital, I think of watching AFN as an army brat in Germany in the 80's. I, actually, watched Guiding Light, but for the same reason.
That explains why Steve Burton, i.e. Jason Morgan, got handpicked to play Cloud from Final Fantasy 7. and I find it funny that General Hospital STILL comes on at 2 pm. I come from a military family and that was the one show that we bonded over.
As a straight white woman in her mid-thirties, I actually LOVE the concept of superheroes. But I also love me a good romance with equally capable men to women (someone definitely deserving of love and support), which is sorely lacking in this M-She-U. If Madame Web and the Marvels had some romance in it alongside its action, (and it helps if the man or men are good-looking as well), then I might have been tempted to see it. I don't need empowerment -- that's not why I watch movies. I need escapism, and for a majority of us women, that requires a sweet, developed romance with a hot, strong, protective guy.
Yes! I keep thinking along this line. I have always loved superhero movies, sci-fi, etc. I think I probably like them for different reasons than men do. If you consider Star Wars, Leia was feisty and headstrong, but there was also a romance with Han Solo. When it comes to Madame Web, if I trusted these new films, I probably could have been convinced to watch a scientist studying spiders in the forest, but since they all try to push some new ideology, I don't even try unless it gets a raving review.
"Let's blame the audience, that's a neat trick!"
Not all the audience, just a specific section of it…usually white, always male
Now this is pod racing
She never said that. They fell and spreading fake news. Same as the comment section. Ryan Kinel made a video about it and thank God he decided to wait because it sounded sus to him.
@@alfredocornelio4329 it was a star wars reference, if you were a fan you'd get that.
"Bold strategy Cotton"
I parked my car outside the cinema with 2 Madame Web tickets in the glove compartment when i came back it had been broken into and there were 6 Madame Web tickets in there
There's more creativity in this single comment than in the last five years of the MCU.
Hahahahah!! Good one.
Love this. Funny as. Made me laugh out load. Doesnt happen often unfortunately.
I wish we could go back to admitting the reality that men and women are different (including having different strengths and weaknesses).
Good point! Goth women lost their minds when Netflix turned Death into a bland black women in the Sandman series.
Goth male here, also lost mind, as did the goth wife.
@@MoontownMoss I guess there don't understand if you change a character to be more "diverse", you're taking away from others.
My 73 year old mother says - "If they want women to watch? Just put a shirtless Hemsworth in it. It doesn't even need to be good, if they put a shirtless Hemsworth in it." She also says, "a shirtless Hemsworth would work for all of your UA-cam channels as well."
I don't think even a shirtless Hemsworth will be enough to get people interested in the next Witcher series I'm afraid, but we'll see.
Sorry to correct your old mother, but it's 'Helmsworth'. Hollywood Superstar Rich Evans, brother of Hollywood Megastar Chris Evans, will have you know.
@@0bzen22 lol no one said I could spell.
@@12crows1it's Hemsworth. Chris Evans have a brother who can't spell.
I have to say, I respect your mother. She knows what she likes, knows what she wants, and doesn't mince words.
Hollywood: *_" F°CK the customer, we do what we want. Not what THEY want. We are also much more morally superior to them too. Which is really all that matters. "_*
Customers: °soothing cricket noises°
Hollywood: *_" REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "_* 🤬
Jeez, cringe af
😂
@@SubZero-hs9xc
Not nearly as cringe as you having 100+ comments on this channel. Go find someone else to glaze
@@SubZero-hs9xcWomen? Indeed they love being cringe these days.
I'm starting to believe that the woke are just asylum escapees.
Thank you for mentioning all you did!
It’s awful how scripted the behaviors of people in the entertainment industry are to blame sexism. I’m a woman, and didn’t care for any of these “female empowerment” films, because I found the writing and characters to be dull. I didn’t care if the characters are women or not.
And just as you said, if a product is not interesting to women audiences, these women directors need to understand that. Sure, they’re women who enjoy comics, and I was one of them, but that doesn’t mean they should change the product. Wonder Woman used to be great because they wrote her as a character who dealt with the same issues any superhero would deal with regardless of their gender or sex. It didn’t used to be a political ad of real world women issues. Heck, I loved the Batman series and Cat Woman as a little girl growing up. I would not want the writers back then changing anything just because I happen to be a woman.
I think they would get more women into comics if they focused on staying true to the products, rather than trying to remold it into another genre it wasn’t meant to be.
And good point about anime or Japanese entertainment structure is completely different than the US. It’s like a convention with people making specific products for specific audiences, with clear boundaries between them. It allows every product to stand as its own thing. American entertainment structure used to be similar of it’s own ways, but now our entertainment including modern comics is like Walmart. They are trying to be universal for all, but with entertainment that doesn’t work. What happens is every product becomes confusion like who is this for? What is worse is nowadays every product of entertainment comics is trying to pander to political real world of women’s issues, when that isn’t what audiences (male, female, others or their fans) want.
They also can’t argue products for women in entertainment doesn’t exist, because they have had for decades. It’s even a HUGE business in Asian countries, like BL and otomo series. Drama shows, etc. They could be working to design more products for women in the US expanding on that market that is still going. I hate Twilight, but I can’t ignore it was a financial success, which also shows there is an audience for them here in the states.
Instead, they seek to hijack products designed and aimed at male audiences. They get angry that it only turns male audiences away, and ironically also the women who enjoy comics… It is all absurd, and proves in my viewpoint that these women directors really don’t care about their potential audiences out there. Now comic series I enjoy have to suffer for it.
So, much like the WNBA, men have to financially carry female lead movies since women don't show up to support their team.
Yeah, it's almost like people don't prefer movies or basketball based solely on the type of genitals the participants have.
As Bill Burr says about the WNBA: "those stadiums should be packed to the rafters with feminists!". Instead it's 2:1 male:female, nearly the same as the viewership ratio for the NBA (just with like 10% of the total viewership)
Why are they "my team" because I'm female? It takes more than "look a girl" for me to like something. That's just insulting. Good writing, character development, story and world building make me want to see a movie. When they lead with talk of "representation" and "girl power" in the PR, it tells me THAT was their focus and the rest was not the priority. So I lose interest in seeing it. If your PR talks about story, character etc I'm going to be interested.
@@redshed2020 That's fine if you don't claim them. But I imagine women that are a part of the "representation matters" team might claim them
As a "privileged" white man who didn't even see the movie, my favorite part of *Madame Web* is gonna to be the plethora of Rule 34 art that the movie inspires.
Already a fair amount out there.
Hey I betcha pornhub will have a parody video with all the girls in costume and it'll get more watch time than the actual movie.
50 shades of webbing
With how they got mad with that one artwork of big tiddy Rei, I look forward to it
To be fair, I dont think it is popular enough. The original madame web will probably have more r34, and shes a granny.
Well according to WDWPro more men saw it than women. So that means it's actually women that hold deep contempt for strong independent women.
Just like Kathleen Kennedy does.
No, it means we can recognize garbage and opt not to spend our hard earned money on said garbage. There are so many better movies with strong independent women.
@@ardillachica9037This!
There's actually been studies on court outcomes that show that female jury is more likely to convcit than a make jury. And a female jury is more likely to give women harsher sentences than men, and women are likely to give men harsher sentences than men. And that if a female juror is on a case about a woman defending herself with a gun they are more likely to recommend the harshest sentence when a male juror is likely to recommend the least or none for the same scenario. So yes women hate strong independent women.....who aren't them.
"So that means it's actually women that hold deep contempt for strong independent women" aka every female coworkers that I encountered when our boss/manager was a woman.
“Madame web is a movie that is out” is the best description
It's hard to view this industry as anything but socio-political propaganda at this point. Hollywood is producing work that attempts to manipulate the consumer, but when the consumer chooses to take their money elsewhere, then the machine strawmans sexism, misogyny, or racism as justification for their poor business model. I love what Robert said, "...they are trying to cater to an audience that isn't even there." and I love what Nerdrotic said about the commodification of virtue signaling...such a spot on diagnosis of what we are experiencing...just insanity.
You can tell manipulation is their goal, because when they fail, they don't say "Oh darn, we misread the room." They say "What the heck is wrong with these jerks who aren't swallowing what we put in front of them?" When a movie "for women" flops, they don't say "What did we do wrong" or "I guess the market wasn't there". They say "Hey! Those men whose job it is to buy our crap aren't playing along!" Both artists and businessmen would react differently than they're reacting. But they are reacting exactly how you'd expected, frustrated, entitled, propagandists to act..
Basically what Chapelle said about why the WNBA isn't as popular. Many blame men for not being interested, but he pointed out that women aren't into it as much as the Kardashians, which is what women are interested in.
I think it was Bill Burr, but the point remains the same
That was Bill Burr live at Redrock.
That was Burr, but your point stands.
That is something that I know certain weirdos on Twitter/X and Threads that loves to slander are awfully quiet on.
Women like romance novels and hallmark movies. Theres nothing wrong with that. Now imagine taking both those genres and making them to attract male audiences.
I like whisky, my wife likes wine. My local distillery sells less whisky than the local Vinyard sells wine. The distillery does not blame the female gender for not turning out to drink their product or accuse them of toxic feminism for not embracing whisky as equally as they like wine. She tried whisky, didnt like it. Its a matter of preference and taste, those that like it will consume it. It's basic business. If the distillery wants her as a customer, make something she likes, not force her to like what they make.
Old Disney however was smart enough to have things in their movies - even those more targeted at females - that people in general and males liked. Values like Family or Love, and yes, at times even a little bit of heroism.
So in your own way:
Your distillery if it was old Disney would have a few bottles of wine to at least attract someone with different taste, and maybe they will try something and like it, or buy something for a loved one and get something for themselfs out of it. Maybe not the best wine and they might not have the same number of different ones to choose from but something they can at least enjoy. That would be good enough as a business strategy.
@@Rakshiir Exactly 💯
Wow! This analogy should be bolted to the front doors of every Hollywood studio and form part of all contracts. Succinctly succinct my friend 👌🏻
I feel you, Robert. I got sucked into the maelstrom of GH in the 80s too. My oldest son and his friends had a term for getting trapped into watching any Nicholas Sparks movie. They called it "getting Notebooked."
I am glad this film has generated so much discussion for you so I can keep seeing these thumbnails.
"56% of the audience was male."
Without a Dundee Test, we will never know for sure.
"That Sheila was a bloke!"
Manga has boys (shonen) and girls (shoujo) stories. And they arent ashamed of that. Shoujo is romance, magic with a more dramatic (relationship heavy) stories. Shonen is sports, action, and hero/power fantasies. You destroy that, you get stories aimed at no one. Hollywood needs to relearn this.
Yeah that's my huge revelatory takeaway from this. That was an astute observation. Manga have had female writers for generations now, whereas the comics in the U.S. are male dominated (que sera sera). But it definitely does paint the differences in the cultural differences, and I'll even say traditions, in those industries. Which is why Superman can't be bisexual, just because you want him to be. Hahaha
Well said
@clevergirlaah1251 manga is more of a medium. It can be about any topic: romance, superhero, regular school people, crime and the likes, while comics are genre specific like superheros. this is why manga has lots of female authors while comics don't, but we in the west DO have lots of female graphic novel authors (which would be our equivalent of manga). but your point still stands as comics themselves are and will always be male dominated.
Edit: medium isn't the correct term, I couldn't think of a better word for it. I just mean that manga isn't genre specific like comics are (superheros).
@@resurrectionevil6581 This was my thought on that point. Manga has everything from action to slice of life and comedy series. Even horror.
@@saltyk9869 yup, and a great selection for any of those genres too AND with great female leads and diverse characters. I work in a bookstore and our manga is probably our biggest seller or at least in the top three. as for comics? not even top 5 or more. comics get stale very quickly but manga just keeps rising.
A piece of work can target a demographic, but still reach people outside of that target demographic. And that's what comic books and overall geek culture has been doing for a long time. Problem is when you try to market towards everyone, you're way more likely to lose everyone.
Like the classic Disney princess movies were probably not aimed at young boys, but I still loved them as a kid. I watched Cinderella a couple dozen or even over a hundred times. Mulan is still my favorite of those movies. We had Beauty and the Beast on laserdisc, and it was awesome.
Makes a superhero movie directed towards women.
No women show up, but blame men for not seeing movie.
Woke Hollywood in a nutshell.
I actually talked to a friend from work, a woman friend from work.
She told me once that her favorite superhero was Spider-Man, but didn't want to see Madame Web because it looked bad.
Funny how these big superhero movies claim to cater to women, but a woman doesn't want to see it cause it doesn't appeal to her.
I have a female colleague who is into comics and superhero movies. I asked her about Madame Web and she said it "looks dumb and uninteresting" so she wasn't interested in going to see it yet she's the target demographic! How about Hollywood make a smart and interesting superhero movie we can all go and see?
If 70% of the action movie audience is male, than there is a substantial amount of women who love action movies. I'm one of those creatures. Why do I love action movies? Because I love seeing strong men on screen. Why doesn't anyone get that?
There are some cool guys in my superhero fanfiction. Feel free to read it.
100% agree. Also, the same is true of guys wanting to see GENUINELY strong ladies on screen (not this fake nonsense that Hollywood seems to think represents "strong women" - spiteful, nasty, bitter female characters with overexaggerated power levels that doesn't really even have ANYTHING in common with reality). If they were SO bothered by the strength level thing, there ARE ways you could even out the odds in a fight (and as an action movie viewer, I'm pretty sure you'll pretty familiar with all the ways how smaller guys can successfully take on bigger, tougher, stronger guys - you could take those ideas over to female-led franchises AS well and it would STILL work pretty well there).
Also, guys are NOT against female-led movies. Said as someone who watched (and is still watching) female-led movies going back even when I was kid. The only thing WE ask, is give us something even HALFWAY decent to watch and we'll watch it. Our favorite female heroines from the past is PROOF of this reality (unlike the illusions and lies some "journalists" would like to create).
@@sigmacademy I agree with you about the difference between 'strong women' and spiteful, nasty, bitter women. The moment in any trailer when I hear a woman say anything nasty or demeaning to a man, I am immediately turned off by it. I don't talk that way to the men in my life and I don't want to see it in movies.
Because the DEI hires are middle aged wine moms/spinsters that want the world to cater to them because they’re narcissistic weirdos who got jobs either thru connections or just quota hiring
I'm sorry, you need to be not straight to enjoy these films as a woman.
My friend, a woman, suggested we watch Madame Web. I agreed, no sarcasm or malice. I'm a middle-aged white guy. I even promised not to riff the film in the (otherwise empty) theatre. After the movie started my friend, a female I will remind, started riffing the movie herself. After the movie, I came away with that this is a clumsy way to introduce a necessary Spider-verse character. The producers, directors and even some of the actors/actresses have failed their audiences. Not the audience.
Love Robert on this stream! its always amazing! Love the video
That's what you can expect from people who believe every disparity is a symptom of systematic oppression, rather than just a reality of life. It couldn't possibly be that they failed, its always something else at fault.
Social media and our society have made narcissistic females the norm unfortunately.
I remember being in grade 12 (1998), and every day at 11am a bunch of us would cut class and watch Days of Our Lives in the student lounge. This speaks volumes about the quality of writing/characters because a show targeted at housewives had caught the interest of teenage boys. It didn't matter who the show was created for, but the fact it was engaging enough anyone could enjoy it.
Teenage Boys AND Gregory House 😂
dont forget prisoner cell block H
Was that before or after Marlena was possessed by the Devil?
@MonsterKidCory omg 🤣
That might be the main storyline from that era. Imagine trying to binge watch a show like Days now?
@@the6ig6adwolf yeah, Days of our Lives went feral there for a while 😆
General Hospital in the 80s was awesome. Modern day GH did the same thing super hero movies did. They threw away their existing audience to attract a new audience and it never happened. Now it has no audience.
And it has terrible acting, writing, and directing for the last few years. Even Lucky Gold couldn't help
Robert is correct. I'm an old timer and the thing with girls and women being into comic books back in the day was extremely rare. And they were pretty much outcasts. Also, they were into the female aspects of the comic books. I'm a big LoSH fan and was so surprised to find a girl my age who was really into that title too. I soon discovered it was for very different reasons though... "Oh, I wonder if Timber Wolf is going to save Light Lass! Maybe they'll kiss!!" "Ultra Boy is so hot!" etc. Basically, the relationships between the super lads and lasses :)
And of course, the one aspect of these movies to majorly fail is the characters-both in making relatable characters and in having a story line that creates meaningful character relationships. So why would we females be interested? 😂
Beauty and the Beast (the original animated one) is an interesting example. In those days, did Disney chase an audience? Did they pander? No, they simply sat down and made awesome films, with great stories and characters.
I vividly remember setting up a date with an old high school friend and when I asked her what she wanted to do she said she'd like to see Beauty and the Beast. Well, I had no interest at all in seeing a "cartoon," but I humored her . . . and watched one of the best films I've ever seen. I don't know anyone who didn't like Beauty and the Beast, men, women, whoever.
The Pixar films from the 90s and early 2000s were more examples: very engaging grown-up films you could take your kids to. Did they use focus groups to figure out what to make? I doubt it. Everyone loved them.
Funny how its always men's fault when a girl power movie fails. No matter how much support it gets, no matter how much advertising it gets, and even if the majority of people who saw it were men, SOME HOW, SOME WAY, its always the men's fault.
I think I just figured out why they think that. It's the same deceptive thing as "Women CEOs don't make as much money." - They say "Our movie has a badass girl who pushes herself on unwilling men. She kicks ass. And there's never any paperwork about how much destruction of property. It's just like Nolan's Batman" (when really they just put a lesbian in it and make her lame) then cry foul.
They literally cannot see the difference.
Also they have to cover their asses because all the BS decisions are theirs... And it's their pinko staff-writers and sensitivity agents...
It's insane that they're men in the media who defend people who insult them.
Sometimes I think they are all brainwashed by tiktok on purpose; so China can come around and promise to get rid of this craziness for us and bring order again.
I've had countless 'me obliterating the bad guys' fantasies. But I wouldn't want to watch a film based on them. I prefer the heroes to be men. I want my swooning fix! Modern 'strong independent woman' characters make me cringe.
Muh structural sexism or something 🤷🏻♂️
I like how you started with a chris stuck man review 'it's a film, that came out'.
Have none of these people heard of Ripley from the Alien franchise or Sarah Conner from Terminator (1 & 2)? I could go on but the point is, It’s got absolutely NOTHING to do with strong independent women…
These characters do not build the antagonism against men which is these activists main agenda
I really don’t understand how Hollywood can’t grasp the concept of equality. As a woman, I miss men superheros. I don’t want every single project to be woman dominated. I want it EQUAL. Why is that so hard to do?
They don't believe in equality they believe in "equity". Not saying this about you personally, but a lot of women don't have principles. They support whatever gets them the best outcome. So when they fail when being held to the same standards as men, they blame men, not themselves for their lack of talent or work ethic.
There is people who are more interested in superiority than equality.
Because the endgame of feminism is gender superiority, not equality. Never was and never will be.
Because feminism is marxist and has nothing to do with equality or reality. That's why.
the concept of equal is itself a lie. It isn't any more complex than that. Entertainment needs suspension of disbelief, but no one who walks in reality can suspend disbelief of that particular lie.
Blaming men [x]
Blaming fans [x]
Blaming everyone except themselves [x]
checklist complete
Still very much a bold strategy, we'll see how this one plays out, sooner or later it's got to work out just right.
Right?
I got hooked on watching General Hospital in 1979 as an eleven year old because of another neighbor's kids I was friends with.
I'm white but identify as a black, transgender lesbian, with dyslexia. So...THE STRUGGLE IS REAL ✊️
Same
My wife doesn’t like female superheroes she likes male superheroes!
She's clearly a gender traitor and a keeper.
Disney stated to the press that the Marvel acquisition was largely to address their relative lack of a young male audience. I swear to God this happened.
Correct - much like Discovery acquiring WB and it's properties, Disney acquired Marvel and Star Wars because they had the female demographic locked with their existing properties but wanted to capture the male demographic. They then went and tried to force them to be female driven properties and expected the male demographic to still want to watch it, simply because of an established legacy. That's like a vegan restaurant acquiring a steakhouse, keeping the name of the steakhouse, but making every item on the menu vegan and then blaming the existing customer base for no longer wanting to eat there. As a marketing leader at one of the largest companies in the world, we literally use Disney as a case study of what NOT to do.
It was a good plan until identity politics took over the West. Money be dammed, Disney decided that inclusion was more important than the story and that boys would still watch bad superhero films pushing a message. It appears that if the story is bad, no amount of name calling will make a film popular.
Robert talking about General Hospital reminds me of my husband saying he actually started watching Days of Our Lives with his mom during the summer because of the supernatural elements in it 😂
My dad, my brother and I used to watch Passions together. It was so excessive in how ridiculous it was that it was just awesome. When we went back to school, our dad would record it for us and be talking/laughing about that day's episode when he picked us up.
Breaking news women like watching good looking and fit men, they dont want to watch other women on the big screen.
It’s very much like George Lucas putting a child Anakin in the first Star Wars prequel. George, kids don’t want to be Anakin Skywalker the child! They want to be an adult Jedi! (Or maybe Darth Vader.) Putting an annoying kid in your film isn’t going to appeal to children!
I’m many years too late, and if I weren’t he wouldn’t have listened to me because by then he was no longer taking advice from anyone.
Yeah thats subjective af
Absolutely. I really don't understand why this is a difficult concept.
What if they mostly just like good movies and not shitty ones ?
It's the same with women's soccer. They make a big deal about it and women don't bother to watch it.
Women football is pain for the eyes, cringe for the body and not healthy for the mental state when I see them how useless they are.
I'm so glad that she puts those out for me to see. ❤
The actress flat out denied making those comments and even called out the source. Ryan Kinel did some digging as well coming up empty with any credible source confirming the quote.
Jordan Peterson says:
"Men want to GO on an adventure,
women want to be TAKEN on an adventure."
Japan still gets that.
Men want to kill the monster, women want to be saved from it.
... Not true for everyone
@@SubZero-hs9xcwhat’s your point? Everything needs to be changed for the few over the many?
@@SubZero-hs9xc No need to state the obvious.
@@JayM928 You sound like " 'Men are trash' obviously doesn't mean all men are trash"…
Actually, Isabelle Merced didn't say that. It was a rumor started on social media, attributing that quote to her. But she came out and publicly said that she did not say that, and she was disgusted that people online were claiming she said things that she didn't actually say.
Thank you, I came here to point out that the quote was made up, and of course Drinker and crew took the bait. There's a potentially lucrative business in making up stuff that one knows will get attention, clicks and views from a certain triggerable segment.
Source? I'm guessing she clarified this on her social media accounts?
So many good points made. I am baffled as to how they still make these types of films.
Disney needs to spend far more on Grrrl Power, feminist movies !
$1 Billion is the minimum in special effects, catering, costumes, make-up etc
to properly showcase these strong, confident women.
These Women = "Our movie (show, book, comic, videogame, etc) WASN'T made for you Men. Don't like it, then DON'T watch (play) it."
Same Women = "Why didn't Men show up to watch (play) our product?" "Its ALL Men's fault!"
Because these people want exclusivity. They want something that's "theirs" but still want that product to do well because a movie that bombs has no bragging rights
Like that you got RMB on your panel. Prevents this pow wow from becoming an echo chamber. Enjoyed the video! Not that I agree with his comments in general but I do appreciate his viewpoints.
I don't always destroy franchises, but when I do, I make sure they're pushing *THE MESSAGE.*
Speaking of "General Hospital," I was recovering at home following some folly in SouthEast Asia in the 70s and got stuck on "Dark Shadows." Written for women but it had Vampires, pretty women, etc. so it was easy to get sucked in.
Straight female here who loves action movies. I grew up watching Schwarzenegger, Stalone, etc. To get the many other straight ladies to the theaters gives us hot manly men in tight outfits or shirtless kicking butt and taking names!
What Marvel and DC are saying is "This movie isn't for men! We hate men! Oh, by the way, men? We still expect you to go and watch our movies because women aren't watching in any significant numbers."
They're taking every opportunity to alienate their core demographic, but still expect their core demographic to stick around as paying customers. Either these people don't understand how supply and demand work or they're actively trying to sink their franchises out of pure spite.
It's really less about making a particular genre of movie for a certain demographic than it is about just MAKING A GOOD MOVIE! Compelling characters! Unusual settings or premises! Interesting plots! Sharp dialogue! Stirring music! Risks and creativity! Most of the time, audiences will respond.
Great truths. Good show.
On that point towards the end, about forsaking the old audience for the perceived new one, this is one of those proverbial tales as old as time. Like the fable of the goatherd who neglected his domestic goats to the point of death, trying to tame a herd of mountain goats who left him anyway. "Neglect old friends for new, and you may end up losing both."
But for the topic at hand here, the ironic thing is that I personally like the concept of superheroines, and have fantasized about being one since I was a little girl. I don't care for pandering concepts, however, and even when it's hard to put it into words, deep down anyone can tell when something has been done for the sake of pandering.
What I have always found most frustrating is that superheroines, as well as superheroes, seem to continue to reflect contemptuous societal double standards, right down to their tropes. The most immediate one I can dredge up is the one Drinker often points out, where they essentially reach Mary Sue status, while their male counterparts actually feel fleshed out. If they would just dial it back to a new movie every five or so years, tops, and try new things with character development and trope exploration, they could probably get around this.
They think that they are to big to fail....Let them learn their lesson...
I like Mauler's comment 'What do you mean Unfortunately' around the 2:25 minute mark, lol, Romantic/comedy movies are not bad, Women like them. Stop hating on what women generally gravitate too.
Well put Robert Meyer, I love your analysis!!!
I was talking to a friend about this yesterday. We started talking about a pulp fiction novel series that was popular in Norway during the 80s and 90s. It was your typical housewife porn style stories - but with an occult and fantasy twist. Women loved it. It was 50 Shades of Twillight before vampires were cool.
The fantasy-romance market seems to be quite appealing to women - but you can also make it decent for men if done right.
This is where Hollywood and Streaming should look more. But! Don't set out to make the next GoT. Just make something good, market it well, and people WILL come watch.
Guys want to win against the bad guy. Women want to win the hero.
Excellent. This conversion is "college level" truth about the differences in people (and yes we know that woke administrators have destroyed all the universities). Robert's comment on "The Notebook" is a great example, however, as a baby-boomer, I watch the movie for James Garner and Gena Rowlands (and I keep forgetting Gosling's name). Except for Star Wars' debut being before our marriage, my wife and I attended all the SciFi - super hero movies being together. Had we not been married, it's likely she would have not bothered with the movie theatre for these genres at all.
I’m not a true nerd outside of being fully obsessed with all things LOTR, but this channel makes me feel sane. I can’t stand being called a bigot and a POS for not liking what’s being spoon fed to us by current day Hollywood.
“This movie isn’t for you!”
“Ok I won’t watch”
“Men are why this movie failed!”
Love seeing RMB; love this episode gonna go watch the whole stream now
It’s wild that others would cast blame when Dakota, and Sydney are even panning it themselves, and good on them for speaking up about it.
There's nothing i love more than listening to men talk about how to market to women ❤
More people tuned into the premier to see THAT DRESS than saw the film….
Bill Burr NAILED IT in his explanation of the failure of WNBA's lack of popularity.
"WHERE WERE ALL THE FEMINISTS??!THAT PLACE SHOULD BE PACKED WITH FEMINISTS, SCREECHING AND HOLLERING LIKE WE DO!!"But no,women didn't show up for that.And they do the same thing that they always do, place the blame for their failure on anyone else but themselves..I pity you younger movie and tv audiences of this generation..Back in the day of iconic films (mostly which are rebooted,or "modern audience" reimaginings NOW),If a film sucked, it just sucked, and everyone,including the studios,filmmakers and actors moved on..I mean,when Pirrhana II:The Spawning got 5-13% from numerous critics and audiences,the director who just happened to be James Cameron,didn't blame us for the failure of his directorial debut, he went on to make some of the greatest films between the 80's and NOW.
I still find it really funny how disney approached this Issue like: "we are on a great course, our movies making billions, let's change that" 😂😂😂
Robert Meyer Burnett, the voice of reason. I agree with everything he said.
Robert gets it. I mean, they all do, but Robert is 100% onto it.
A friend and I went to the first avenger movie a while ago with his wife and 2 teenage daughters. He elbows me to look over. All three women were asleep in the middle of a big action scene. They said they were bored afterwards. Need I say more 😂
Never heard of robert meyer burnett before but I really like his comments, nuanced and thoughtful, he's absolutely right. Need more commentators like him around.
“How many times do we have to teach you this lesson, old woman??”
Movie makers were burning dollars trying to chase pennies.
I love the dig against Chris Stuckman right at the start😆😆
My partner was the driving force to see most of the MCU - I was brought along to explain characters/stories and compare to their comic book counterparts.
Meanwhile, there are tons of stories with female MCs.
"Island on the Sea of Time" has a black, lesbian ship captain.
"Honor Harrington" books: the Queen of Manticore is black, and many inspiring characters, including the MC, are female.
Ky Vatta from Vatta's War,
Paksenarrion from "Sheep farmer's daughter",
Ia from "Their's Not to Reason Why" series,
Aida from "On Silver Wings".
Tons of female characters in "Axis of Time"
This list took me a couple of minutes to create. It consists of very simple stories with great imagery that are easy to translate from a book to a screen.
Love seeing Rob in these forums. 👍🏽
Robert always making good points
The whole issue that’s been going on in the mainstream entertainment world is that there has been an inversion of the normal flow of interaction between the consumers and the producers of the entertainment. The way it’s supposed to work is: they do something we don’t like, we tell them, they fix it.-- The way it’s actually been working: we tell them we don’t like it/want it, they say too bad, double down, and try to shame you publicly. What has happened essentially is that women act and operate differently than men, and what we’re seeing is what happens when women get to have the final say (this is what has been happening all around the world in the past 5 years).
I can't make it to the theaters right now because of work, I really hope they bring the movie back for at least a couple of weeks so I get a chance to watch it on the big screen.
Tried do keep away from spoilers so far, but from what I've heard it definitely seems to be one of the movies of all time. It's webbin time lads!
The Dolph Lundgren Punisher is a brilliant film. Just my opinion but he was the most brutal Punisher on screen so far, I did like the Netflix and Warzone but Dolph still rules, the way he cuts out bullets and cauterized the wound whilst talking to god, it's the reason I love the Punisher
Heh. I worked with an ex-star of "General Hospital" for a few shorts and feature-lengths. He was on for over 20 years.
"If you don't like it, don't watch it. Peace!" - Frosk
As a woman, I kinda always preferred movies more directed at men cause I have no patience for drama or nonsense romance. I also like, or used to like, animated Disney movies with princess and such.
Main thing is, if a movie or show is good more people are gonna like it even if it's not what they usually watch, but if it's crap no one will like it no matter how much pandering studios do.
7:45 my mom got me into watching the Golden Girls and I absolutely love it
They can blame men all they want to. We save our money for worthwhile movies.