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Great show, even if got it wrong😅 should have been the BNW GS BUT in side note, how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout
Seeing as this is a world wide podcast, how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout
I’ve got a victory kingpin with the 100cubic inch motor and 6 speed I’ve got 30,000 miles and and it has never been opened plenty of power for a stock motor. And is super fast 6th gear is useless below 100 mph
Props to producer Chase for always popping the pics into the video every time (or whoever does it, I'm just assuming that's who is responsible). The quality of the pics you use and the frequency with which you put them up is really far and above what most productions of this nature do. It really adds context and improves the visual experience so much. It is much appreciated.
My thoughts exactly. I used to listen on Apple Podcasts but I love the visual references, and the ability to watch their body language so much that I just have to watch rather than listen. UA-cam is absolutely the best way to consume HSLS.
Ok so Patrick Garvin thinks the best touring engine is one that needs a ton of (very costly) mods to make it shine. To me that just sounds like a really dumb pick. Sorry.
Agreed. It should come from the factory ready to go. I can't ride cruisers, but if I bought a cruiser it would be an Indian that actually makes horsepower.
I think one might argue that it is dumb to take long trips with an engine you can’t maintain and repair in the field and without the knowledge to do so. 😁
@@LTVoyager fair enough, but seems like a very high bar to set for touring. The argument of Harley being preferable because there's a dealership everywhere in America also falls apart if you're just expected to rebuild your engines. I'd take my chances with my mediocre maintenance skills and a goldwing/bandit/vstrom :)
I think everyone is sleeping on the vmax 1700 v four engine. It has 200hp 125lbs or torque, 45k mile vavle checks, shaft drive. It's smooth but also has a pulse since it half counterbalanced, sounds awesome and can easily hold what ever speed strikes your fancy without stressing itself out. Also it looks great and has that vtwin look from the side view.
Hey guys Senior here! Just finished listening to this episode. Great great GREAT! Only one thing Im surprise nobody mentioned. The last question, "Which engine would rule all of these categories"? Junior, I agree with your original thought. The BMW Boxer 1250. But what nobody mentioned is............................................ BMW invented 3 out of 4 of these categories! The original R bikes, 750, 850, 900, 1000, were all considered touring bikes because of the drive shaft on a standard bike. The R 80 GS was the original Adventure styled bike. The R 90 s was BMW's first sport bike, (Not Original Sport Bike) The R 100 RS was the original Sport Touring styled bike. The R 100 RT picked up the mantle of the earlier standard bikes as a dedicated Tourer. So, Junior, I agree with you. The Boxer twin through all its iterations in the one engine to rule them all. Now if I could just get you off those silly looking Orange motorcycles. Senior
Some time ago, once a year I went a 1000 miles south on a 83 GL1100 and it did a great job on the hills of the Blue ridge Parkway. Didn't miss a beat. I miss that old battle horse.
Is this surprising? The service interval on these bikes is probably about 6-8k miles right, and you did a small fraction of that with no issue, not really a shocker when these bikes can exceed 100k miles just with basic maintenance.
In 2017 at age 52 I rode my 28,000 mile 1975 CB550 SuperSport 4700 miles round trip from Chicago to Colorado. Total time on 2 wheels was probably 10 days. I had vintage Shoie hard bags and a small windshield. Im not a small man, 6-4 and (at the time) about 240lbs. It cruised 80 across Nebraska. Ran without hesitation up over 11,000 ft. I had some hickuos along the way, but with some help from friends in the SOHC4 owner's club i made it home in one piece. You don't need a big powerful bike to have a great trip.
Triumph watercooled 1200cc twins are great for everything. Great reliability, excellent gas mileage, smooth and can pull gearing from 16/42 to 18/37 sprockets. As far as best touring engine I've seen over the years has to be the Goldwing and has gotten sweeter since 1976. I've owned BMW boxer engines are pretty good but I'd still have a 1200cc watercooled twinTriumph engine with what it does.
Had to be the BMW flat twin, after all the RT tourer, the RS sport tourer, the GS adventure tourer, and the R/R NineT inappropriate tourers are already in the showrooms. KTM second, because there is no RT equivalent.
Can we all agree to just call it the 8S, I think we can lol! Be careful guys Spurge is a Master Debater! I should think most of us wouldn't want to modify an engine ourselves and then go touring around the country with it, stick with the known. Don't know if the Thunderstoke is a good engine but it could be the coolest name for an engine ever! Every time it gets mentioned I hear AC/DC in my head. If Spurge can tour on his Bonneville you can tour on a Z650RS, get some throw over bags and good size backpack. So, Zack is into fitness? Zack "Yeah, fitness whole pizza in my mouth!" Would have been great if the guessing game engine had been from a Goldwing lol No idea again 0-6 this season oof! Not that you asked, but I think for the wedding you should go clean shaven. Good show old sports, see you in 2!
Seeing as this is a worldwide show , how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout Form a Brit who loves your show Another topic could be what bike the world get and USA don't and vice versus
I will take a V-Strom 650 to the ends of the Earth over the badass KTM 890 R, because I know it's going to get me there with probably zero trouble. The V-Strom 650 can run on UTI urine.
No one notices the suzuki 650 v engine, not many people will discuss it. But the truth is it'll be revving or purring till the end of time. In 4th gear you could be enjoying slow backroad riding, aggressively taking twisty roads or dealing with high density commuting. All that at amazing mpg. Perhaps it'll pop up in another category?!
Met a fellow two weeks ago with an 2013 650 Vstrom. I had had a pair of them. Had to say hello. He had Get this : 176,000 On the clock No issues Zero Maybe best engine I’ve had on a bike
Reliability, smoothness, low down torque, adequate horsepower, and fuel economy to an extent, would be important features (in that order?) for a great touring engine. I am not a BMW fan, but I think it's a better pick because of those requirements...
The Indian, Harley or any other Crusiers, Baggers is Good for what you Call the Grand America, But when it comes to TOURING THE WORLD My One R1250GSA is Enough.
Glad to you guys bring up touring on smaller displacement motorcycles. I love riding liter bikes, but I have a blast traveling on my Vstrom 650. Backroads, 2 lane, freeways, and interstates.The Vstrom 650 has tackled them all with my 200lb meat sack in the saddle. Keep up the great podcast!
I think a good way to break it down is The V-Twin is the ultimate touring engine. And currently the LC8 is the Apex of the engine type. To be honest there may never be a better V-Twin built given the time line we find ourselves. No one is out there working on a brand new V-Twin engine.
I'd pick the BMW inline 6 over all others for the best touring engine...because I have ridden it, a Gold Wing, a GS, etc. and the BMW is so smooth I have to keep looking at the tach to make sure the bike was running AND it has VERY good power even when in a huge bike like the K-16. As for the "small" engine question...I do looong rides on a DRZ400 and I have it geared 16F/38R so the top speed is 102 mph on level ground. Great video and discussion, Thanks Guys.
Touring: Goldwing boxer 6 Sport touring: Honda st 1100 v4 Standard: bmw airheads Sport: Japanese inline 4 maybe the yam crossplane Cruiser: hd evo Honorable mentions: bmw brick, Honda interceptor v4, Ducati testa stretta
I've been lucky enough to own several Goldwings. Currently ride a '76 GL1000 and a '97 Valkyrie, and have owned in the past an '83 GL1100 (for a week) and an '84 GL1200. The engines in all of them are something special. My 1000 is quiet enough that I can't hear it over wind noise, so that bike is as close to flying as I can get. I took it down to The Dragon a couple years ago and it handled wonderfully. The 1200 I put into a ditch, but in all the years I owned it I never had to do a THING to the motor, even after skidding 100 feet down the road and landing in 6 inches of water. The Valkyrie is just tons of power, whenever you want it, however you want it. I can only imagine how awesome the 1800 motor is.
I agree that Harley likely has the most fleet miles, but I will bet if you look at average miles per engine that the Wing and the BMW opposed twins likely have higher per engine mileage numbers.
I haven't done any real touring, but my commute is >100 mi/day, so my research led me to buy a BMW boxer and I'm thoroughly pleased, and I'm expecting to ride it without needing major repairs for >100k miles. What I bought is an '11 R1200R, so a naked version of the touring R1200RT. My wife asked several times why I wasn't looking for a new bike instead, but I found mine with only 14k miles for less than half of its as-new price. If I had looked for a new bike in the same price range I would have been stuck with a much smaller engine which would be under much more stress and therefore not last nearly as long.
He’d own one in a heartbeat, if he could afford it. He talks about the 890 Adv being his most expensive bike. Listening to his financial perspectives from previous podcasts, he’ll be broke for some time to come.
I agree with Spurgeon about the 1290KTM torque. You have to go way up on the RPM's to get any torque. I have a 2019 Super Tenere ES and my buddy has a 2020 KTM1290 and I beat him off the line Every time up to 185KPH, then he catches me and passes me. His top speed is 250KPH, my top speed is 237KPH.
Pretty obscure choice, the chosen engine (no spoiler here) is a very small minority of touring bike engines produced. My assumption would be BMW or Harley, while Honda would have to be part of it, but those bikes are pretty heavy (Harleys are heavy too, but low slung). And if you’re going to be obscure, a transverse V4 is the best, only produced on the Honda ST bikes and the small production Motus bikes could be a choice
Dang, how could you guys ignore the Triumph Tiger-spec triples. I tried just about everything you guys mentioned and the triple just seemed the most "soulful". Bought my Tiger 800 and it's been serving up 13hr days for years now without a hiccup - and that raspy sound....
Great episode and I especially like the inappropriate bike to tour on. I couldn't agree more with touring on an inappropriate bike bringing the best memories. I did a 1200 mile tour through the PNW to visit a friend in September 21 on a Kymco Spade 150cc mini moto. It has to rank as one of the best tours I ever did. I dare say, one of the best vacations I had taken in a long time. This is coming from a guy knocking on the door of 50 years old. It really brings you back to what brought me to motorcycling in the first place. Pure and simple fun transportation and adventure. I'm also pleased with the mention of the DR650, which I bought last June. I've already put close to 9k miles on it and it's definitely a keeper.
I love the direct and immediate responsiveness of shaft drive. Not to mention lack of constant hassle of chain maintenance. ^ Owner of a BMW R and Yamaha Virago, fantasy-owner of a GL1000.
I off road jumped my 2006 Multistrada sDS. The 17" front wheel was the shortcoming offroad. Otherwise the bike was fab for travel in a sporty fashion. It was slow, alas.
Ok hear me out. Zack has some great voices(SPURGEON DUNBAR, German guy, etc.) the person that did the high side/low side comics has fodder for potentially VERY amusing voice over animation. Just sayin…… 😂 loved it as always! Thanks Revzilla and have a great week
This is long overdue, engines have taken a backseat to all of the tech laden on current bikes. The tech doesn't propel the bike, the engine does. I do like your choices, especially the VFR . . . A great engine. My choice, only because I have to try it, an M8 117. I do ride the DR650, VFR800 5TH Gen and a Triumph Speed Triple 1050. What I'd like to see, you guys take the Kawasaki H2 750 Triple and Suzuki GT550 and ride them on a Los Angeles to Hurricane, Utah and back trip.
moto guzzi v7. shaft drive. bugger all maintenance. those v twin vibes. perfect sitting at the table upright comfy position. 21ltr fuel tank. lacks wind protection and wont tear your arms off but has character for days. and the lineage is great too. but it fits the inappropriatte category, i agree the ktm engine deserves top spot
Three undeniable touring bikes as seen on UA-cam: Honda C90, Royal Enfield Himalayan 411, Honda CRF250/300. Any more engine power is an optional extra!
I had to look up that KTM Super Duke R ad. 100% agree w/ Spurge. at least until the shity dubstep kicked in. But the part in the bunker 100% that engine sounds amazing and I also want one.
I've got a couple of entries for inappropriate touring. A 1984 Honda 500 Interceptor from Chicago to SoCal and a 1978 HD XLCR cafe racer from Virginia to SoCal.
Of course you'd pick the orange motor that was never designed for touring. Meanwhile you can put a cup of water on a Goldwing engine, rev it and never lose a drop. The 1290 motor is a fun motor but I doubt any of them will be a million mile motor.
Loved the inappropriate touring section. I put 75K miles on a DR650 and have done a ton of touring on my Gen1 SV650 and many touring miles on Speed Triple 955i. Way back in the day I rode from Dallas to Charleston on a 1981 GPz 550. The inappropriateness of these bikes was integral to the fun.
Old GoldWing 4-cylinder models - I think that engine would give more people what they want. GL1100-1200 i think would fit all these categories if need be. and dead reliable.
From my personal experience, owning 43 different bikes over 50 years, The best engine that I have ever encountered, for a Cross-Country tour, is the Triumph Rocket 3 engine - incredible torque, and butter smooth at cruise. Decent fuel economy too. There has never been a Harley engine that can compete with the fantastic triple in the touring world. HD's too often require "McGivering" at the side of the road. No thanks, I would prefer a reliable cross country mount. That eliminates Harley from consideration. And every single and twin that I have ridden are just not the right kind of power for touring, or vibrated too much for comfort. I have not ridden the 6 cylinder BMW yet, but I can say from Gold Wing use, 6 cylinders are smooth! Canadian Honda Goldwing Trike rider Glenn Turple has clocked up one million miles (1.6 million kilometres), on his stock, original engine, but that's not nearly the highest odometer reading. Honda likely has the world record for most distance on stock, original engines. Media reports literally dozens of riders that have passed the million mile mark on their Honda Gold Wings.
@@SpurgeonDunbar Everyday on the drive to school listing to those two tell me about Car-Bu-Ra-tors and now being about to shre that a bit with my kids with you brings the modern dad feels. Also Click and Clack being in the cars movies was a pretty awesome "easter egg".
I love you inappropriate touring segment. I just got home from a 400 mile trip with a fully loaded CRF300L Rally. I have to say my tush hurt greatly but I would do it again. In my twenty's I put 200 miles on a Honda 175 SL witch was a parallel twin and I continued to vibrate for hours after I stopped. Great episode as usual.
The moment Spurg mentioned that the engine needs to rule all the categories I expected it to be the GS engine.... but I found the ad for duke and I understand :D
I’ve toured on my KTM 690 Enduro for a few years now and it’s been brilliant on highways and single track. Not what most might see as a “touring bike,” but it works for me.
I thought it was odd that the SV650 was ranked higher than the 8S. It sounded like the past history of the SV650 became a significant part of the ranking rather than its current performance. Also, looking at the comments, a lot of people seem to think that Zack didn't think very much of the new 8S.
I think when it comes to buying one today after market support is important along with knowledge of the bike. With the SV650 you can find info on it easy and people alreay know its a solid bike, where the 8S still needs to prove its self. Also the SV has more parts for it to make it do what you need compared to something new. That's why it won over the other bike. If the 8S sticks around and parts are made then it will take over at some point.
The leaderboard proves it; just because it's new doesn't make it better. Any of the newer bikes, engines can provide great memories. Going touring is all about the memories to me. YMMV!
I think you missed a mark during the inappropriate touring section by not up the Honda cb/cbr/crf300l motor. Itchy Boots has shown that an untraditional choice can be the perfect touring bike for certain people.
My choice for inappropriate touring would be my 2019 Yamaha Xmax 300. The only thing that can go wrong with those are the CVT belt and injector. But it can carry spares under the seat, including 1-2 weeks of clothes. With a topbox it can carry more than I really need. It's amazing on gas and can do 85 mph all day long. Perfect for the European highways.
I was listening to your stories. Like about riding across the USA. Two weeks ago. In Arizona. I met up w a pair of true road warriors. One said check out my odometer. 176,000 miles. About a 2013 Suzuki Vstrom. Engine had not been touched. I had two 2012 Vstroms. And I believe him. Is that there room for that on your Rushmore ? I have five bikes from one to 6 cylinders right now. So many good Hondas 1500 boxer 6, a couple V4s. All bikes I’ve mentioned are so good it’s ridiculous. Riding 3 cylinder triumph today. Growls. Reminds me of Cummins diesels . Only four faces ? Still gotta mention that VStrom 650. One more time. 176 k!!! And don’t forget. An engine you WANT to keep riding to get to 176. Original seat by the way
Twins are the most fun! Didn't hear any mention of a Moto Guzzi V85tt... but, looks like we are talking about high speed touring here aren't we! Gotta luv the twins! They don't usually have annoying vibrations and provide good predictable power bands - if not a little respite for a tired or just lazy right throttle hand!
For a small displacement engine? - In 1981, I quit racing as I prepared to get married that fall, so I sold all my race bikes, and bought a Race Developed 350 Liquid Cooled Yamaha 2 stroke twin(RD350LC). Then I rode it coast to coast in Canada - 12,900 kms, in 3 weeks. I would do it again tomorrow! Many, many hundreds kilometres at over 150 kph - the only issue encountered was terrible fuel economy. It was not well suited to the long highway miles, but came alive in the twisties.
One thing I'd like to point out is a lot of big bikes mentioned also weight a lot. Once you start factoring in weight of the motorcycle itself, by looking at HP/Weight and Peak Torque/Weight numbers, you can sort of start to normalize across segments of bikes. And you can clearly differentiate a small bike that punches above its weight class and a big bike that does the same. FJR 1300, ST1300, GS1250 all do this. They produce a lot of HP and Torque in relation to their weight.
For sport touring I would pick BMW R1250RS. BMW invented the category but aside from that I think it's important to consider weight range and protection from the weather and I think BMW RS and RT are probably still the best in the category.
I’ve owned a Concours, a Vulcan, a Versys 1000, a K16, a Bandit, a Boulevard, a Ninja, and a 500 LTD(1984). Best touring bike was the BMW, too bad it’s outrageous to get service done in a timely manner. Connie was the the best on the dragon. Versys was the most practical.
On a side note. The Yamaha TDM 900 parallel twin is so much better than any of these engines. It will never even rate, or be given a chance in your conversation. It's not even an afterthought, but as a touring bike engine? Economy, versatility, reliability, weight, repairability, simplicity. Hands down it's twice as good for this category as any of the engines you discussed.
Everybody loves horsepower and horsepower is great but we don't see bodybuilders running marathons and I think you guys need to consider range fuel efficiency and what it costs in maintenance or service and how much rider energy it takes to cover miles. The kid who rode his 125 cross country probably wouldn't have gotten very far on a Gold Wing because he probably wouldn't have been able to pay for the gasoline.. I think the Honda nc750x deserves consideration. It is low maintenance and has adequate power it's very reliable and you can put your Chinese takeout in the gas tank.
What about touring two-up? That consideration probably would not have affected your consensus. However, a pillion and luggage changes the COG of the touring motorcycle. Don't you wonder what percentage of touring is two-up? That could sway the decision toward the BMW boxer engine. My pillion is at least 75 percent of my touring concern and responsibility. Where did you reach the stereotype conclusion that Harley baggers and Honda Gold wings are for the super slab? My ElectraGlide has 100K clicks on the odi and at least 80K of those are on back roads and two-up. OK, US 50 is straight, if not flat, but what are you gonna do to cross the desert (unless you're Zack and Ari)? This was a fantastic episode!
The motorcycle mechanics I speak with do not say the LC-8 1290cc KTM donk is reliable for long distance touring. Happily the current crop of Harley & Indian donks are. Of course the BMW GS is considered supremely reliable and only second to the Honda Wing. For characterful riding "mystical bond of man and machine" touring in the groove I think the Harley & Indian bikes win, although the BMW inline 6 with six separate pipes has the most sublime chortle....and is wonderfully reliable too of course.
I’m surprised at your choice, which I can’t find represented hardly at all in any IronButt rosters. I mean if you want to find the ultimate touring package for putting miles on, go see what those guys ride. FJR’s, ST1300’s (v4), Goldwings and BMW’s.
A lot of people hate the Harleys... But I love their touring bikes. Torque for days, comfortable, MASSIVE aftermarket, tons of character, and easy to work on with a HUGE dealer network when on the road. I'm no fanboy... I love all kinds of motorcycles, but i think a lot of people have a weird unnecessary hatred for Harleys.
A reliable, powerful engine is an innovation in and of itself. In the automotive space, the most prolific engine is the gen I small block Chevy. In the motorcycle space, its the honda cub. I absolutely look for length of production and commonality of powerplant because parts are cheaper the more prolific an engine.
People often confuse the words “can’t” and “shouldn’t” you CAN tour on the battle toad in its current form from the $1000 track day bikes. It is physically possible. Should you? Maaaaaaybe….
Ya.. lost me in the end. Boxer, and I don't currently own one. I've had a 950 adventure and GS' ... My preference which wasn't even in the discussion. Guzzi 1200 8v. If ya know ya know.
I agree with Patrick, the KTM is the best motorcycle in production right now. I think the Revolution Max 1250 is second. I chose the Pan America because it's more road oriented than the KTM. And shaft drive is a turnoff for me.
I think this show would probably be more successful if they replaced Zack with Ari. It's not a knock on Zack, it's just what sells. There needs to be more conflict, and it's Zack's nature to extinguish any possible conflict immediately. Ari appears to be happy to engage. People want to see some action between hosts, with the ability to not take it too far, and be able to mend fences successfully due to mutual respect. Not sure this is possible because I don't know these folks that well. But, if you want this show to flourish it's time to mix things up, and add some spice. Kumbaya is good at work, for the most part, it's not incredibly entertaining though...
Sorry guys, but I think you have lost your collective minds. I test rode the 2018 1290 Duke GT it is a beast of an engine and seemed to have power everywhere...but that thing had the most violent and persistent vibration of any engine I have ever experienced. When I think about spending that kind of money for a 'touring' bike the main thing I expect is refinement. If only they could make the engine as smooth as the fantastic electronic suspension I would be sold.
The elephant in the room is not just the engine whether u take a pillion, lots of luggage, road off-road, weather protection, age ergonomics of rider . Ride what u can afford and like . If I was rich I have ten different bikes for different rides
I agree ☝️ with Zac “ Other Countries don’t “ worship Harleys like the US does “ and I off the top of my head could think 🤔 off loads of other better “ in my option engines “ So is this a Harley episode “ , does it have to be a new bike ? , the Victory Cross Country is a fantastic engine IF YOUR INTO CRUISERS . Also most Countries don’t have the big motorways like the US , If I was going to ride from One ☝️end off Australia to another - very similar in size to US, Heaps of other bikes I could think off that meet the following criteria; 1. Big gas range 2. Shaft drive 3. Cruise control 4. Comfort obviously 5. Load Capacity Your guest is JUST all about power and performance not real world 🌍 for the masses touring . You should have him on the show when you talk about performance bikes etc .
What it is with you all (americans?) obsession with big engines, big ponies? There are many of us using anything with two wheels and ANY engine to make us happy and cruise/travel where ever we want and need.
Fellas. No rocket 3 engine for category one American open road touring? You had good picks but the rocket trumps them all! By simple extension of the fact it trumps every motor 😂
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Did you just take 2 hrs to say gold wing?…. I kid… great show.
Great show, even if got it wrong😅 should have been the BNW GS
BUT in side note, how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout
Seeing as this is a world wide podcast, how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout
I’ve got a victory kingpin with the 100cubic inch motor and 6 speed I’ve got 30,000 miles and and it has never been opened plenty of power for a stock motor. And is super fast 6th gear is useless below 100 mph
What about the Hondas Vfr’s
Props to producer Chase for always popping the pics into the video every time (or whoever does it, I'm just assuming that's who is responsible). The quality of the pics you use and the frequency with which you put them up is really far and above what most productions of this nature do. It really adds context and improves the visual experience so much. It is much appreciated.
My thoughts exactly. I used to listen on Apple Podcasts but I love the visual references, and the ability to watch their body language so much that I just have to watch rather than listen. UA-cam is absolutely the best way to consume HSLS.
Appreciate you fellas, thanks for what you do.
I recently sent in a request for an episode geared towards two-up luxury touring and while this isn’t that, it is a step in the right direction. 😁
I was actually thinking the same thing. The answer is going to be "Goldwing" or "Road King".
@@lovelessissimo TTSE
@@funk-n-groovin6779 what?
46:07 I can’t wait for the hyper naked from CFMoto using the KTM 1290 to make it to production
I will say 1250 and then the M8.
The 1250 comes in first because of ease of service. None of that 3 hole crap. It also has more power than an M8.
Ok so Patrick Garvin thinks the best touring engine is one that needs a ton of (very costly) mods to make it shine. To me that just sounds like a really dumb pick. Sorry.
Agreed. It should come from the factory ready to go.
I can't ride cruisers, but if I bought a cruiser it would be an Indian that actually makes horsepower.
It will also be illegal to ride on public roads in many countries, which defeats the whole point of a touring bike.
Also it would void the warranty and reduce the long term reliability which is bad in a touring engine.
I think one might argue that it is dumb to take long trips with an engine you can’t maintain and repair in the field and without the knowledge to do so. 😁
@@LTVoyager fair enough, but seems like a very high bar to set for touring. The argument of Harley being preferable because there's a dealership everywhere in America also falls apart if you're just expected to rebuild your engines. I'd take my chances with my mediocre maintenance skills and a goldwing/bandit/vstrom :)
I think everyone is sleeping on the vmax 1700 v four engine. It has 200hp 125lbs or torque, 45k mile vavle checks, shaft drive. It's smooth but also has a pulse since it half counterbalanced, sounds awesome and can easily hold what ever speed strikes your fancy without stressing itself out. Also it looks great and has that vtwin look from the side view.
Hey guys Senior here! Just finished listening to this episode. Great great GREAT!
Only one thing Im surprise nobody mentioned. The last question, "Which engine
would rule all of these categories"? Junior, I agree with your original thought. The
BMW Boxer 1250. But what nobody mentioned is............................................
BMW invented 3 out of 4 of these categories!
The original R bikes, 750, 850, 900, 1000, were all considered touring bikes because of
the drive shaft on a standard bike.
The R 80 GS was the original Adventure styled bike.
The R 90 s was BMW's first sport bike, (Not Original Sport Bike)
The R 100 RS was the original Sport Touring styled bike.
The R 100 RT picked up the mantle of the earlier standard bikes as a dedicated Tourer.
So, Junior, I agree with you.
The Boxer twin through all its iterations in the one engine to rule them all.
Now if I could just get you off those silly looking Orange motorcycles.
Senior
Agree, R100/7 with a RS fairing was my first big bike. Come to find out that it weighed less than most new bikes over 700cc today…
Thanks for chiming in there, Popster! Good comments !
Yup, the coming 2 hours are by now reserved.
KTM is the winner.....BUT what about its reliability?
Does it measure to the others in terms of reliability?
Yea let's be honest. A boxer is going to live forever. A KTM you can't guarantee that.
Yamaha FJR1300 for me... A great sport tourer!
Some time ago, once a year I went a 1000 miles south on a 83 GL1100 and it did a great job on the hills of the Blue ridge Parkway. Didn't miss a beat. I miss that old battle horse.
Is this surprising? The service interval on these bikes is probably about 6-8k miles right, and you did a small fraction of that with no issue, not really a shocker when these bikes can exceed 100k miles just with basic maintenance.
In 2017 at age 52 I rode my 28,000 mile 1975 CB550 SuperSport 4700 miles round trip from Chicago to Colorado. Total time on 2 wheels was probably 10 days. I had vintage Shoie hard bags and a small windshield. Im not a small man, 6-4 and (at the time) about 240lbs. It cruised 80 across Nebraska. Ran without hesitation up over 11,000 ft. I had some hickuos along the way, but with some help from friends in the SOHC4 owner's club i made it home in one piece. You don't need a big powerful bike to have a great trip.
Triumph watercooled 1200cc twins are great for everything. Great reliability, excellent gas mileage, smooth and can pull gearing from 16/42 to 18/37 sprockets.
As far as best touring engine I've seen over the years has to be the Goldwing and has gotten sweeter since 1976. I've owned BMW boxer engines are pretty good but I'd still have a 1200cc watercooled twinTriumph engine with what it does.
Had to be the BMW flat twin, after all the RT tourer, the RS sport tourer, the GS adventure tourer, and the R/R NineT inappropriate tourers are already in the showrooms. KTM second, because there is no RT equivalent.
Can we all agree to just call it the 8S, I think we can lol! Be careful guys Spurge is a Master Debater! I should think most of us wouldn't want to modify an engine ourselves and then go touring around the country with it, stick with the known. Don't know if the Thunderstoke is a good engine but it could be the coolest name for an engine ever! Every time it gets mentioned I hear AC/DC in my head. If Spurge can tour on his Bonneville you can tour on a Z650RS, get some throw over bags and good size backpack. So, Zack is into fitness? Zack "Yeah, fitness whole pizza in my mouth!" Would have been great if the guessing game engine had been from a Goldwing lol No idea again 0-6 this season oof! Not that you asked, but I think for the wedding you should go clean shaven. Good show old sports, see you in 2!
Seeing as this is a worldwide show , how about asking a European to join you for the sport bike engine. Michael Neeves is your man, give him a shout
Form a Brit who loves your show
Another topic could be what bike the world get and USA don't and vice versus
Is the third time the charm?
You own the Internet for today!
@@LTVoyager Oops didnt mean to take over
I will take a V-Strom 650 to the ends of the Earth over the badass KTM 890 R, because I know it's going to get me there with probably zero trouble. The V-Strom 650 can run on UTI urine.
No one notices the suzuki 650 v engine, not many people will discuss it. But the truth is it'll be revving or purring till the end of time. In 4th gear you could be enjoying slow backroad riding, aggressively taking twisty roads or dealing with high density commuting.
All that at amazing mpg.
Perhaps it'll pop up in another category?!
Met a fellow two weeks ago with an 2013 650 Vstrom. I had had a pair of them. Had to say hello. He had
Get this :
176,000
On the clock
No issues
Zero
Maybe best engine
I’ve had on a bike
Reliability, smoothness, low down torque, adequate horsepower, and fuel economy to an extent, would be important features (in that order?) for a great touring engine.
I am not a BMW fan, but I think it's a better pick because of those requirements...
The Indian, Harley or any other Crusiers, Baggers is Good for what you Call the Grand America, But when it comes to TOURING THE WORLD My One R1250GSA is Enough.
Glad to you guys bring up touring on smaller displacement motorcycles. I love riding liter bikes, but I have a blast traveling on my Vstrom 650. Backroads, 2 lane, freeways, and interstates.The Vstrom 650 has tackled them all with my 200lb meat sack in the saddle. Keep up the great podcast!
It's a great engine with proper lineage too
Agree I really enjoy mine, does everything I ask it to do.
Although mostly used for back and forth to work
I think a good way to break it down is The V-Twin is the ultimate touring engine. And currently the LC8 is the Apex of the engine type. To be honest there may never be a better V-Twin built given the time line we find ourselves. No one is out there working on a brand new V-Twin engine.
I'd pick the BMW inline 6 over all others for the best touring engine...because I have ridden it, a Gold Wing, a GS, etc. and the BMW is so smooth I have to keep looking at the tach to make sure the bike was running AND it has VERY good power even when in a huge bike like the K-16. As for the "small" engine question...I do looong rides on a DRZ400 and I have it geared 16F/38R so the top speed is 102 mph on level ground. Great video and discussion, Thanks Guys.
Touring: Goldwing boxer 6
Sport touring: Honda st 1100 v4
Standard: bmw airheads
Sport: Japanese inline 4 maybe the yam crossplane
Cruiser: hd evo
Honorable mentions: bmw brick, Honda interceptor v4, Ducati testa stretta
I've been lucky enough to own several Goldwings. Currently ride a '76 GL1000 and a '97 Valkyrie, and have owned in the past an '83 GL1100 (for a week) and an '84 GL1200. The engines in all of them are something special.
My 1000 is quiet enough that I can't hear it over wind noise, so that bike is as close to flying as I can get. I took it down to The Dragon a couple years ago and it handled wonderfully. The 1200 I put into a ditch, but in all the years I owned it I never had to do a THING to the motor, even after skidding 100 feet down the road and landing in 6 inches of water. The Valkyrie is just tons of power, whenever you want it, however you want it. I can only imagine how awesome the 1800 motor is.
I agree that Harley likely has the most fleet miles, but I will bet if you look at average miles per engine that the Wing and the BMW opposed twins likely have higher per engine mileage numbers.
I haven't done any real touring, but my commute is >100 mi/day, so my research led me to buy a BMW boxer and I'm thoroughly pleased, and I'm expecting to ride it without needing major repairs for >100k miles.
What I bought is an '11 R1200R, so a naked version of the touring R1200RT. My wife asked several times why I wasn't looking for a new bike instead, but I found mine with only 14k miles for less than half of its as-new price. If I had looked for a new bike in the same price range I would have been stuck with a much smaller engine which would be under much more stress and therefore not last nearly as long.
What about that 3 cylinder 2500cc Triumph Rocket 3 engine???
Mt Rushmore of touring engines?
Big twin evo, GL1200, xr650 and insert any other Japanese engine lol
Gotta love Spurg's Freudian slip about the "CVO shit." It's not my cup of tea either. 🤣
He’d own one in a heartbeat, if he could afford it. He talks about the 890 Adv being his most expensive bike. Listening to his financial perspectives from previous podcasts, he’ll be broke for some time to come.
@@freebehindbars8654 Highly doubt it. He never says it out loud, but he's not into large, heavy tourers.
Well, all episodes can't be winners I guess. Better luck next time guys.
What a totally disappointing podcast - I feel like I just wasted 2 hours of my life...
A man with an experience is not subject to a man with an opinion!👍 Run what you brung
No offense, but some of the folks in the comment section made more sense than the commenters. No foul language please
I agree with Spurgeon about the 1290KTM torque. You have to go way up on the RPM's to get any torque.
I have a 2019 Super Tenere ES and my buddy has a 2020 KTM1290 and I beat him off the line Every time up to 185KPH, then he catches me and passes me.
His top speed is 250KPH, my top speed is 237KPH.
I will give a thumbs up to anyone that agrees with me. Thanks for listening!
Pretty obscure choice, the chosen engine (no spoiler here) is a very small minority of touring bike engines produced. My assumption would be BMW or Harley, while Honda would have to be part of it, but those bikes are pretty heavy (Harleys are heavy too, but low slung). And if you’re going to be obscure, a transverse V4 is the best, only produced on the Honda ST bikes and the small production Motus bikes could be a choice
Nice
Honda v4 great
Feels almost electric
Dang, how could you guys ignore the Triumph Tiger-spec triples. I tried just about everything you guys mentioned and the triple just seemed the most "soulful". Bought my Tiger 800 and it's been serving up 13hr days for years now without a hiccup - and that raspy sound....
Yea that triumph 900 triple is a great engine. They really dialed out all the little kinks they had and now is a bread and butter engine.
Great episode and I especially like the inappropriate bike to tour on. I couldn't agree more with touring on an inappropriate bike bringing the best memories.
I did a 1200 mile tour through the PNW to visit a friend in September 21 on a Kymco Spade 150cc mini moto. It has to rank as one of the best tours I ever did. I dare say, one of the best vacations I had taken in a long time. This is coming from a guy knocking on the door of 50 years old. It really brings you back to what brought me to motorcycling in the first place. Pure and simple fun transportation and adventure.
I'm also pleased with the mention of the DR650, which I bought last June. I've already put close to 9k miles on it and it's definitely a keeper.
BMW 1250 for me and shaft drive is a positive not a negative but different strokes I suppose.
Goldwings are shaft too, and yes Shaft drive every time
I love the direct and immediate responsiveness of shaft drive. Not to mention lack of constant hassle of chain maintenance.
^ Owner of a BMW R and Yamaha Virago, fantasy-owner of a GL1000.
I off road jumped my 2006 Multistrada sDS. The 17" front wheel was the shortcoming offroad. Otherwise the bike was fab for travel in a sporty fashion. It was slow, alas.
Ok hear me out. Zack has some great voices(SPURGEON DUNBAR, German guy, etc.) the person that did the high side/low side comics has fodder for potentially VERY amusing voice over animation. Just sayin…… 😂 loved it as always! Thanks Revzilla and have a great week
The first motor you mention is a Harley. A motor that is only good because you can modify it? I couldn't watch anymore after that.
Agree
This is long overdue, engines have taken a backseat to all of the tech laden on current bikes. The tech doesn't propel the bike, the engine does. I do like your choices, especially the VFR . . . A great engine. My choice, only because I have to try it, an M8 117. I do ride the DR650, VFR800 5TH Gen and a Triumph Speed Triple 1050. What I'd like to see, you guys take the Kawasaki H2 750 Triple and Suzuki GT550 and ride them on a Los Angeles to Hurricane, Utah and back trip.
in fact DS for the Ducati back in early 00's stood for Dual Spark. The DS moniker was also used on the 1100 SuperSport of around 2005 Model Year
moto guzzi v7. shaft drive. bugger all maintenance. those v twin vibes. perfect sitting at the table upright comfy position. 21ltr fuel tank. lacks wind protection and wont tear your arms off but has character for days. and the lineage is great too. but it fits the inappropriatte category, i agree the ktm engine deserves top spot
Blue Highway, I have that book. The guy drives around the country in a van👍
Three undeniable touring bikes as seen on UA-cam: Honda C90, Royal Enfield Himalayan 411, Honda CRF250/300. Any more engine power is an optional extra!
Agree, really like my RE Himalayan.
Started my work day. Now ill be set for two hours.
Thanks to (lowers voice 4 octaves)
SPURGEON DUNBAR, LOG SLAMMER. and Zack.
I had to look up that KTM Super Duke R ad. 100% agree w/ Spurge. at least until the shity dubstep kicked in. But the part in the bunker 100% that engine sounds amazing and I also want one.
My 1290 SDR did NOT like to be lugged. Strangely. The boxers, etc. are much more flexible.
I've got a couple of entries for inappropriate touring. A 1984 Honda 500 Interceptor from Chicago to SoCal and a 1978 HD XLCR cafe racer from Virginia to SoCal.
Of course you'd pick the orange motor that was never designed for touring. Meanwhile you can put a cup of water on a Goldwing engine, rev it and never lose a drop. The 1290 motor is a fun motor but I doubt any of them will be a million mile motor.
My wife refuses to use any highways. You can get around without highways & enjoy your self.
Loved the inappropriate touring section. I put 75K miles on a DR650 and have done a ton of touring on my Gen1 SV650 and many touring miles on Speed Triple 955i. Way back in the day I rode from Dallas to Charleston on a 1981 GPz 550. The inappropriateness of these bikes was integral to the fun.
Old GoldWing 4-cylinder models - I think that engine would give more people what they want. GL1100-1200 i think would fit all these categories if need be. and dead reliable.
Came here to say this. Th 11- or 1200 ticks all the boxes they talked about: balanced power, serviceable, compact enough to go in any chassis....
Honda CB500X can make one hell of an inappropriate touring bike with a solid p-twin engine
@57:40 - Spurg and Zack are both idiots (only kidding... the create great content)!😂
From my personal experience, owning 43 different bikes over 50 years, The best engine that I have ever encountered, for a Cross-Country tour, is the Triumph Rocket 3 engine - incredible torque, and butter smooth at cruise. Decent fuel economy too. There has never been a Harley engine that can compete with the fantastic triple in the touring world. HD's too often require "McGivering" at the side of the road. No thanks, I would prefer a reliable cross country mount. That eliminates Harley from consideration. And every single and twin that I have ridden are just not the right kind of power for touring, or vibrated too much for comfort. I have not ridden the 6 cylinder BMW yet, but I can say from Gold Wing use, 6 cylinders are smooth! Canadian Honda Goldwing Trike rider Glenn Turple has clocked up one million miles (1.6 million kilometres), on his stock, original engine, but that's not nearly the highest odometer reading. Honda likely has the world record for most distance on stock, original engines. Media reports literally dozens of riders that have passed the million mile mark on their Honda Gold Wings.
McGivering!
Nice
I watched half this
Went for a ride
Saw a pair along
The road doing the McGivering thing
I learned a new word !
I wish Suzuki would make a full-on touring bike with a retuned Hayabusa engine.
Yes you can tour on anything. I rode a 110cc Yamaha scooter 2000km from Saigon to Hanoi
6 cylinders is best, and that leaves pretty much all but the Gold Wing out. That said I'd go with a V4 Honda from the ST.
Courts and Dunbar the Click and Clack of two wheels.
As someone who listened to Click and Clack from the back seat of my dad's truck growing up, this is all I could ever hope to achieve...
@@SpurgeonDunbar Everyday on the drive to school listing to those two tell me about Car-Bu-Ra-tors and now being about to shre that a bit with my kids with you brings the modern dad feels. Also Click and Clack being in the cars movies was a pretty awesome "easter egg".
Love you Guy's, I watch all your videos, more than once sometimes... But you keep showing the wrong VFR, that's a 6th gen. :)
5th gen forever.
So, will we also get a sport, dirt, and commuting edition?
I love you inappropriate touring segment. I just got home from a 400 mile trip with a fully loaded CRF300L Rally. I have to say my tush hurt greatly but I would do it again. In my twenty's I put 200 miles on a Honda 175 SL witch was a parallel twin and I continued to vibrate for hours after I stopped. Great episode as usual.
Seat concepts seat is amazing if you still have the stock seat. Worth the price.
The moment Spurg mentioned that the engine needs to rule all the categories I expected it to be the GS engine.... but I found the ad for duke and I understand :D
For me they are so close in two of the three categories. But for sport touring the KTM is just so much better it wins.
For its time back in 2004, the Vulcan 2,053cc was one of the best of all time! PC, air kit and pipe and it made 110hp and 140tq to the tire!
The M8 is a phenomenal engine. As is. No Mods NECESSARY, but mods make it sou d the way i want it to
I’ve toured on my KTM 690 Enduro for a few years now and it’s been brilliant on highways and single track. Not what most might see as a “touring bike,” but it works for me.
@@IRLtrolls I'm not there yet, but so far, so good.
Funny that the vstroms were not mentioned?
I thought it was odd that the SV650 was ranked higher than the 8S. It sounded like the past history of the SV650 became a significant part of the ranking rather than its current performance. Also, looking at the comments, a lot of people seem to think that Zack didn't think very much of the new 8S.
I think when it comes to buying one today after market support is important along with knowledge of the bike. With the SV650 you can find info on it easy and people alreay know its a solid bike, where the 8S still needs to prove its self. Also the SV has more parts for it to make it do what you need compared to something new. That's why it won over the other bike.
If the 8S sticks around and parts are made then it will take over at some point.
The leaderboard proves it; just because it's new doesn't make it better.
Any of the newer bikes, engines can provide great memories. Going touring is all about the memories to me. YMMV!
I think you missed a mark during the inappropriate touring section by not up the Honda cb/cbr/crf300l motor. Itchy Boots has shown that an untraditional choice can be the perfect touring bike for certain people.
You got that right!
Tunes.... can you please do an episode on ECU flash tunes and tunes in general? Maybe a The Shop Manual?
Ari's gotcha already: ua-cam.com/video/dKoTbkkoo_I/v-deo.html
@Spurgeon Dunbar well .... And also, thank you.
Hayabusa engine is goated 🙌
Itchy Boots did Mexico to Prudho Bay on a Honda 300
Exactly, once you add all the gear the weight of the bike needs to be low. Harleys? Got to be kidding…
My choice for inappropriate touring would be my 2019 Yamaha Xmax 300.
The only thing that can go wrong with those are the CVT belt and injector. But it can carry spares under the seat, including 1-2 weeks of clothes.
With a topbox it can carry more than I really need.
It's amazing on gas and can do 85 mph all day long. Perfect for the European highways.
I was listening to your stories. Like about riding across the USA. Two weeks ago. In Arizona. I met up w a pair of true road warriors. One said check out my odometer. 176,000 miles. About a 2013 Suzuki Vstrom. Engine had not been touched. I had two 2012 Vstroms.
And I believe him. Is that there room for that on your Rushmore ? I have five bikes from one to 6 cylinders right now. So many good Hondas 1500 boxer 6, a couple V4s. All bikes I’ve mentioned are so good it’s ridiculous. Riding 3 cylinder triumph today. Growls. Reminds me of Cummins diesels .
Only four faces ? Still gotta mention that
VStrom 650. One more time. 176 k!!! And don’t forget. An engine you WANT to keep riding to get to 176. Original seat by the way
Twins are the most fun! Didn't hear any mention of a Moto Guzzi V85tt... but, looks like we are talking about high speed touring here aren't we! Gotta luv the twins! They don't usually have annoying vibrations and provide good predictable power bands - if not a little respite for a tired or just lazy right throttle hand!
For a small displacement engine? - In 1981, I quit racing as I prepared to get married that fall, so I sold all my race bikes, and bought a Race Developed 350 Liquid Cooled Yamaha 2 stroke twin(RD350LC). Then I rode it coast to coast in Canada - 12,900 kms, in 3 weeks. I would do it again tomorrow! Many, many hundreds kilometres at over 150 kph - the only issue encountered was terrible fuel economy. It was not well suited to the long highway miles, but came alive in the twisties.
One thing I'd like to point out is a lot of big bikes mentioned also weight a lot. Once you start factoring in weight of the motorcycle itself, by looking at HP/Weight and Peak Torque/Weight numbers, you can sort of start to normalize across segments of bikes. And you can clearly differentiate a small bike that punches above its weight class and a big bike that does the same. FJR 1300, ST1300, GS1250 all do this. They produce a lot of HP and Torque in relation to their weight.
For sport touring I would pick BMW R1250RS. BMW invented the category but aside from that I think it's important to consider weight range and protection from the weather and I think BMW RS and RT are probably still the best in the category.
I’ve owned a Concours, a Vulcan, a Versys 1000, a K16, a Bandit, a Boulevard, a Ninja, and a 500 LTD(1984). Best touring bike was the BMW, too bad it’s outrageous to get service done in a timely manner. Connie was the the best on the dragon. Versys was the most practical.
On a side note. The Yamaha TDM 900 parallel twin is so much better than any of these engines. It will never even rate, or be given a chance in your conversation. It's not even an afterthought, but as a touring bike engine? Economy, versatility, reliability, weight, repairability, simplicity. Hands down it's twice as good for this category as any of the engines you discussed.
Everybody loves horsepower and horsepower is great but we don't see bodybuilders running marathons and I think you guys need to consider range fuel efficiency and what it costs in maintenance or service and how much rider energy it takes to cover miles. The kid who rode his 125 cross country probably wouldn't have gotten very far on a Gold Wing because he probably wouldn't have been able to pay for the gasoline.. I think the Honda nc750x deserves consideration. It is low maintenance and has adequate power it's very reliable and you can put your Chinese takeout in the gas tank.
What about touring two-up? That consideration probably would not have affected your consensus. However, a pillion and luggage changes the COG of the touring motorcycle. Don't you wonder what percentage of touring is two-up? That could sway the decision toward the BMW boxer engine. My pillion is at least 75 percent of my touring concern and responsibility. Where did you reach the stereotype conclusion that Harley baggers and Honda Gold wings are for the super slab? My ElectraGlide has 100K clicks on the odi and at least 80K of those are on back roads and two-up. OK, US 50 is straight, if not flat, but what are you gonna do to cross the desert (unless you're Zack and Ari)? This was a fantastic episode!
The motorcycle mechanics I speak with do not say the LC-8 1290cc KTM donk is reliable for long distance touring.
Happily the current crop of Harley & Indian donks are. Of course the BMW GS is considered supremely reliable and only second to the Honda Wing.
For characterful riding "mystical bond of man and machine" touring in the groove I think the Harley & Indian bikes win, although the BMW inline 6 with six separate pipes has the most sublime chortle....and is wonderfully reliable too of course.
I’m surprised at your choice, which I can’t find represented hardly at all in any IronButt rosters. I mean if you want to find the ultimate touring package for putting miles on, go see what those guys ride. FJR’s, ST1300’s (v4), Goldwings and BMW’s.
A lot of people hate the Harleys... But I love their touring bikes. Torque for days, comfortable, MASSIVE aftermarket, tons of character, and easy to work on with a HUGE dealer network when on the road. I'm no fanboy... I love all kinds of motorcycles, but i think a lot of people have a weird unnecessary hatred for Harleys.
A reliable, powerful engine is an innovation in and of itself. In the automotive space, the most prolific engine is the gen I small block Chevy. In the motorcycle space, its the honda cub. I absolutely look for length of production and commonality of powerplant because parts are cheaper the more prolific an engine.
People often confuse the words “can’t” and “shouldn’t” you CAN tour on the battle toad in its current form from the $1000 track day bikes. It is physically possible. Should you? Maaaaaaybe….
Ya.. lost me in the end. Boxer, and I don't currently own one. I've had a 950 adventure and GS' ... My preference which wasn't even in the discussion. Guzzi 1200 8v. If ya know ya know.
I agree with Patrick, the KTM is the best motorcycle in production right now. I think the Revolution Max 1250 is second. I chose the Pan America because it's more road oriented than the KTM. And shaft drive is a turnoff for me.
I think this show would probably be more successful if they replaced Zack with Ari. It's not a knock on Zack, it's just what sells. There needs to be more conflict, and it's Zack's nature to extinguish any possible conflict immediately. Ari appears to be happy to engage. People want to see some action between hosts, with the ability to not take it too far, and be able to mend fences successfully due to mutual respect.
Not sure this is possible because I don't know these folks that well. But, if you want this show to flourish it's time to mix things up, and add some spice. Kumbaya is good at work, for the most part, it's not incredibly entertaining though...
Sorry guys, but I think you have lost your collective minds. I test rode the 2018 1290 Duke GT it is a beast of an engine and seemed to have power everywhere...but that thing had the most violent and persistent vibration of any engine I have ever experienced. When I think about spending that kind of money for a 'touring' bike the main thing I expect is refinement. If only they could make the engine as smooth as the fantastic electronic suspension I would be sold.
Good discussion! The idea seemed boring, but you guys executed it well.
The elephant in the room is not just the engine whether u take a pillion, lots of luggage, road off-road, weather protection, age ergonomics of rider . Ride what u can afford and like . If I was rich I have ten different bikes for different rides
I agree ☝️ with Zac “ Other Countries don’t “ worship Harleys like the US does “ and I off the top of my head could think 🤔 off loads of other better “ in my option engines “ So is this a Harley episode “ , does it have to be a new bike ? , the Victory Cross Country is a fantastic engine IF YOUR INTO CRUISERS . Also most Countries don’t have the big motorways like the US , If I was going to ride from One ☝️end off Australia to another - very similar in size to US, Heaps of other bikes I could think off that meet the following criteria;
1. Big gas range
2. Shaft drive
3. Cruise control
4. Comfort obviously
5. Load Capacity
Your guest is JUST all about power and performance not real world 🌍 for the masses touring . You should have him on the show when you talk about performance bikes etc .
What it is with you all (americans?) obsession with big engines, big ponies? There are many of us using anything with two wheels and ANY engine to make us happy and cruise/travel where ever we want and need.
Fellas. No rocket 3 engine for category one American open road touring? You had good picks but the rocket trumps them all! By simple extension of the fact it trumps every motor 😂