Shrinking OO/HO Model Trains Down To N Scale!?
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- Опубліковано 25 лип 2024
- An experiment to find out what happens if you scale down a OO scale model to N scale!
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0:00 Intro
2:35 Design
6:54 3D Printing Body
9:41 3D Printing Chassis
11:05 3D Printing Couplings
15:26 The Results - Авто та транспорт
Me, quietly waiting for Sam to get an N gauge layout: We're making Progress!!
GOOD JOB
Sam doing N Gauge, I'll second that!!
Just as I started looking at t gauge
I'm so much into the N scale! Is amazing because you're able to create such an amazing layout in such a small space!
That’s what I was thinking
Given what you achieved with the coupling, would you consider printing a number of modified couplings to give closer coupling in 00 gauge? It would take a bit of working out to ensure it could negotiate first radius curves but I feel it would be a worthwhile experiment. You could use the egg vans as test beds as part of their rehabilitation into reliable vehicles!
That could be interesting Allan - thanks for the idea! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Dapol has apparently done the opposite with one of their wagons you had tested here...
I have both OO/HO and N scale rolling stock (USA 1/160 and Japan 1/150) and the design difference is really visible.
Brand manufacturing both scales (Dapol in the UK, Roco with Fleischmann and Märklin with Minitrix) have two different conception bureaus for each scale. For the Hornby Group, the Arnold brand in N scale is a separate entity.
One experiment you can do : scale one of your UK wagon for the exact HO scale, and compare it to its OO counterpart. That might be interesting.
Ahh really? It does sound like something Dapol would've done a few years back, lol! Fortunately the bodgy nature of their models seems to have mostly subsided these days!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Aren't they the same though?
Really interesting, I'm into N scale. Would love to see you branch out into reviewing it after your O gauge adventure. Tempted to look into getting a 3D printer!
Thank you! I'd love to try N gauge one day - I'll definitely do it some time :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Honestly, that is amazing. The fact it actually kind of worked amazes me!
haha I know - these machines are very impressive :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
I didn’t think you could do it, but once again you have blown me away Sam. Great job.
Thank you!! It's those machines to praise this time - very impressive work from them!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Amazing, you said, quite correctly. Well done and thanks for sharing the information. I am also interested in the variety of 3D printers that you are using. Perhaps you could do a video showing the strengths and weaknesses of each.
Thanks so much Robert! Yeah sure, that could be an interesting video idea! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
I've had great success printing miniatures with a 0.2mm nozzle, which may be worth an experiment.
Sure! I'll probably try it one day! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Those look great Sam! I've been 3D printing some N scale 21T hopper wagons recently, it's been so much fun!
Thank you! Ahh fantastic - it really is great fun! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Funny enough, I design all my 3d prints in 1:1 then scale them all down heh
I do keep note that some details need to be exaggerated and the limitations of the scale, but otherwise with a more detailed printer you can get some fairly nice prints, but you do really need a resin printer for N Gauge.
But have been working on a panelled coach to print, and the first test prints are promising!
Ahh very interesting!! I can see that working on a resin printer for sure :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
That is what I use...
I think this may be the first time I watch a 3D printing video till the end... Amazing video Sam. :)
That's very good to hear - thanks a lot for the kind words! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Nice recreation from HO/OO to N scale! Looks like a perfect match!
Thank you! It worked out really well! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Another great video you done thanks for sharing.
I have downscaled from 00 to N and now scratch build to 1/285 scale Manx narrow gauge.
Keep up the good work
Ahh fantastic - sounds like a fantastic hobby! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
I have designed, printed, & am running Z scale passenger & freight cars on my layout. I’m using the Adventurer 3 Lite. I couldn’t do much detail, but I was able to print streamlined passenger cars with the fluting. So, yes, if you design for your scale/gauge you can print cars for your model railroad.
The issue with smaller nozzle sizes is that for every size you go down you basically double the print time. Smaller than 0.3 you might as well switch to resen printer which is going to give more consistent parts. IMO for HO and OO and anything smaller I'd be using resen over fdm.
Yeah that's very true - I've never really fancied trying it, but maybe one day! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
well I call this the start if a new era for Sam, I'm super exited !
As someone who only has space for N this is interesting, Great stuff Sam.
Awesome! Give it a go some time - it's great fun if nothing else! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
It’s funny you make this video now because I recently scaled down an On30 carriage to 009 scale for my resin printer, and apart from some slightly flimsy walls everything went well
Intereting experiment there mate, how about trying something in 00-9, would make for an interesting halfway house project, and narrow gauage rolling stock does tend to be a bit more'rougher' built than mainline stuff, so compromose coud be made.
It sure would Jon - maybe some day I will try that! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
You should get an N scale train set to review next and run your 3D printed wagon on it.
I agree! I'd love to try an N set some time :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains if you don't have an N scale track, I can highly recommend the M1 Kato Unitrack starter set of N scale track. It's a simple snap together oval track with a DC controller and sells for about £50 is you order from Plaza Japan, so excellent service and quick shipping. I bought one to test locos on and it's great because I can put it together and break it down again on the kitchen table very easily.
Very interesting demonstration and exercise Sam. Scaling in terms of human perception and sheer practicality as well, is indeed quite an interesting phenomenon. Even scaling back from 1 : 1 does already present a bag of shenanigans. Very typically; try to scale a BoBo coach back to HO/OO length and see if it can negotiate the relatively tight model curves. Or try to scale down every little detail of a loco… Doesn’t actually work that well. So, yeah, a big part of professional modelling is finding compromises that work for the eye and as a functioning model construction as well. Impressive that this more or less worked, but yeah each scale does require its own framework I suppose.
Really cool. I’m already into n scale and it’s cool to see you make a model for n scale at last. Def should do more n scale cause it’s a cool gauge. Maybe even try 009 gauge
Thank you David! N scale is definitely a cool gauge... I'd love to do more! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Really impressed sam, I thought like you that wouldn't work more please, how about making the 0 Gage next
Thank you!! Very surprised this worked as well as it did! :O
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Nice video now you have to print a o and oo9 model
That came out way better than I thought it would!
If you'd reduced the nozzle size and layer height it would have probably been even better.
Now I'm going to have to try it on my old FDM printer :)
Nice Job!
I thought so too Gerry! Good luck - hopefully you get interesting results!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Pretty good result which with some fettling will work fine. Triang did TT tension lock couplers, so why not in N ?
Get yourself a few lengths of Peco N flexi track, use the finer nozzle for the chassis and make up two or more with pinpoint steel axles and give it a try. If you can get an N scale tension lock coupling to work you could be onto a winner. You need to do an uncoupling ramp too. It’ll open up a load of operating possibilities in N which are unimaginable with the standard « Elsie » N gauge couplers. Well done mate!
Thanks a lot Robin - yeah I think so too - particularly with some proper wheels! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains
Tbh the useless couplings we’re the main thing that put me off getting into N gauge. I like shunting which is pretty much impossible without some sort of automatic coupling, so I stuck to 00. Just as well really now I’m older and need glasses! But if there’d been an N gauge tension lock things might well have been different. It’ll be brilliant to see how a rake of them performs but you’ll need a converter wagon like the old Triang / Hornby Dublo ones to run them with a proprietary N gauge locomotive. Looking forward to seeing where you go with this.
This Is wonderful work Sam
Cheers Jasper & Willow
Thank you so much! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
cool vid sam on your channel looks good thanks lee
I would live to see all your N couplings changed to the new one. To see how good or bad it might look.
That's a very interesting idea Stephen!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
In the name of science, you should try to print a full scale one.
Or at least just a gigantic coupler.
haha that would be hilarious! I have thought about doing a giant coupling! ;D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains XD
"The Return of the Giant NEM Coupling". Halloween special.
the Chassis is the quality I expected from the whole project and then that reveal with the actual box on it blew me away. I really think if you wanted you definitely could get a decent model out of fdm at N scale if you really were intentional with your modeling choices during the designing process.
Would love to have the files for the chassis and upper sections as I'm useless at any form of autocad. Brilliant job and loved the video, cheers.
Hey sir I recent bought me a new train set. And well be setting up a new layout soon. My question is how did you wire your layout so that you have power all over the truck. Thanks sam
A fascinating experiment. The result is irrestibly wee.
How about trying to create some '009' narrow-gauge railway equipment? The engines and rolling stock are 00 scale, but run on N gauge track.
Very interesting experiment, great job!
Is this Sam's first attempt to cover more on N gauge?
Would love to see reviews of the beautiful Dapol and Graham Farish models! :)
Don't forget Kato! There 800's are fantastic
haha maybe it is! More N gauge would be awesome to cover one day! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
thats amazeing thanks keep it up
As someone who's running on N scale I gotta say this is incredibly impressive. Like the body looks excellent, but the chassis looks a bit wonky but hey as first try this looks amazing and that it's standing and rolling around its pretty good. Especially the coupling blew me away it's amazingly fragile. I suggest you use the regular N scale coupling next time and you could purposely design n scale wagons I would buy them. Speaking of which how about starting with n scale all together ? I mean you did it with O scale so why not n scale? Great video, Sam 👍
Thank you so much! The close up lens is pretty cruel... but it looks surprisingly good given how it was made! Totally - a regular N coupling would definitely be smarter if doing this for real!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Once I finally get myself settled somewhere and comfortable again, I really want start N-Scale scenery/layouts and have a joyous experiment into dioramas/wargaming tables.
When this happens is beyond prediction xD
Your video from a while back, regarding eBay wagons/coaches joblots really inspired me for this idea.
That sounds wonderful - I've seen some amazing N scale setups :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains No worries chap, thank you for creating such fantastic content.
Also, I have to ask, Yorkshire based?
N scale is the same width as OO9 scale, however, the difference is that N scale is for tiny standard gauge, and OO9 scale is the Narrow gauge companion to OO scale.
Sam great video so interesting. I can’t believe you were able to shrink down a 00 scale wagon to N gauge . I have some N gauge trains so I am interested congratulations.
Thanks Louis! It's a fascinating concept isn't it?! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
It was quite common at one time for 00-scale models to be shrunk to TT and released commercially in both scales. Tri-ang's Brush A1A-A1A diesel is a famous example.
That's true! Though TT is quite close to OO - so probably easier to do! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Minitrix models in the 1960s came with tension lock couplers. I have one, so it could couple to it. 😁
Well that turned out ok in the end. Always intersted to see your 3d printed models.
Thanks a lot Mike - it sure is a lot of fun! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
what I'm planning on doing is making an n-scale Deutsche Bundesbahn railroad, so I'd be designing and printing my own models from scratch, and I think I'd rather use premade wheels and couplings just for the sake of simplicity and reliability. the chassis and body, though, I can totally make myself with a bit of practice
but it's very pleasing to know that I can in fact make my own decently detailed vans using a 3d printer at home
That was really interesting. Those baby NEM couplings!
Interested to see an O guage version.
Thanks again, much more entertaining than the TV.
haha the NEM couplings were my favourite part of this! I may do an O gauge wagon some time :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains Is there a run-down of all those model couplings? It's hard to keep them straight.
I actually tried printing some n scale hoppers cars (with printed wheels) and they worked quite decently. Though i had some problems with derailing at first but some weights mostly solved it.
Very awesome!! And glad the weights sorted out your problems :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Hi Sam. Careful now, you've just stepped onto the slippery, slippery slope to building an N gauge layout! If you fancy going to the next step, you could try fitting the wagon body to an existing N gauge chassis. If you would really like to try some N gauge track, I have a short length of Kato display track I could send you.
Sam I love your channel mate it is superb and I love the very honest reviews that you do for all the models. Would love if you could review of the newly tooled bachmann class 47 and when it’s released the accurascale class 31. Two of my favourite classes of diesel. I have watched your channel for many years but always felt uncomfortable asking for a review of a diesel model as I know you’d more into stream which is fine as they are beautiful pieces of engineering.
I need advice with trains what shout u get a hornby 3f jinty or hornby 2022 class 37 37116?
Great Video i have now had my Flashforge Adventurer 4 Printer now for 5 months no issues and easy to use i see you struggle with quality with your printer why is this do you play with the setting much as the quality of small parts I get is awesome .
Well keep up the good work it was because of your videos is why I got a printer myself I just wish I the design smarts that you have
Hi Sam trains I have a question? I want to get a stream engine from Bachman but I don't know which one to get. What do you recommend?
Awesome video today Sam so interesting
Thank you James - really glad you enjoyed it! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Very interesting Sam 👍🏻 and I have a suggestion could you buy a Bachmann Chuggington train? and make a video/review of it?
Scaling 4mm down to 2mm is more than making something half as big. A box, such as this wagon basically is, will actually be 1/8 of the overall volume in 2mm of its 4mm brother 12.5%). Each individual side is only 1/4 of the larger scale (25%). When viewed like this then getting things to be strong, accurate and detailed enough is even more difficult.
Having now seen the whole video you should be pleased with yourself Sam, that came out really well, a proper design of chassis in n gauge and your away!
Yeah absolutely, as you're scaling in 3 dimensions, so the volume would cube when the scale doubles - very true! Appreciate it anyway - it was a fun experiment!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
000 gauge, the precursor to N gauge, used tension lock couplings. As I discovered when visiting an antiques shop in Leicester and saw some for the first time.
An interesting project that seemed to go well. Next up, 0 gauge?
I was just gonna say that it really reminds me of the 000 box wagons, particularly because of the couplings!
Fascinating!! So the OOO couplings were literally like OO but scaled down?!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains yep exactly that! Not quite as small as yours but still pretty impressive!
You should build a small n scale circuit and review n scale locos. I’m sure you will be blown away!
Sam, please (now that you have started in N scale) could you review Bachmann Skarloey, Rheneas and Rusty (as well as Sir Handel and Peter Sam when they are released)
Hey Sam thanks for another good video, quick question, I live in the U.S. and just got my first Hornby locomotive a LNER B12 any advice on how I converted it to use the Kadee type couplings we use here as opposed to the stock couplings that come with it?
Ahh that's interesting - is there such a thing as NEM Kadee couplings? Something like that would be awesome!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains I think something like that exists here I’ll have to visit my local model railroad store and ask if they have them, thank you so much
Hey same I took your advice for my B12 And was able to find some coupling adapters and oh my gosh my engine looks great now pulling my rolling stock thank you for the help
Really interesting.All my Ho/oo stuff is packed away at the moment (lack of space) so my N scale layout gets all my attention.I think the printer did a decent job considering.I haven’t purchased a 3D printer yet but I have always wondered how fine the detail can get.Next up Z scale!!!
Thanks a lot Alan! Z scale would be crazy... but maybe possible?!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
GOOD JOB.
That was awesome. Could you do a video where you show how you scanned the model into your 3D software. It just appeared!
Thanks John! The model was designed from scratch in software - I did a video showing how that's done here: ua-cam.com/video/Cbn8DFVSYEw/v-deo.html
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
How do you know exactly how much to click and drag shrink the 3D model?
I just did the calculations before hand and typed the scale value!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Can confirm - I tried scaling a 1/72 scale plane down to 1/144 and it didn't really work. The parts were too small and fragile having been optimised for the larger version - a small scale version would have needed thicker walls and things in it to allow it to print properly
Yes this rings true for me as well, I've found you can get away with shrinking a design to 75%, but at 50% things tend to go wrong. I've been really pleased with the N scale bits I've printed recently!
An fdm printer can only do so much even with a .2mm nozzle there's a good chance filament can get jammed or start leaking from the boden tube however no one's saying it will always fail
Well Sam, it was worth ago at trying to half reduce the scale to make an N gauge model. The thing for me about this video is that you have 3x 3D printers. I wouldn't be surprised either, that you have a resin one ordered to rerun this test again. Now how good would one of those printers be for a Z gauge test of the box van, LOL.
That was worth a try. With some refinement, I think it could work. Martin. (Thailand)
What is the website where you download the printed buildings? I'm too lazy to rewatch the livestream thanks.
It used to be the Wordsworth Model Railway!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Maybe a 0.2mm nozzle would do finer work than the 0.4mm they printers come with?
Mind you, I am always quite amazed at the detail my Ender 5 can produce with the 0.4mm nozzle, and it is no where near as accurate as the printers you use.
Maybe you could do your own line of N Gauge models, just modifying the coupling to suit more common N Gauge couplings? There are quite a number of people who don't really have room for a proper OO / HO scale layout who would likely be able to do amazing N scale layouts.
One huge gap in the n gauge market is for era 4 so called “heritage “ coaches which despite their being plenty of suitable engines available can’t be got anywhere … produce those Sam and you will make a fortune!
I would love to get a Sam's Trains "N" scale (HOO) and see if it runs on my layout or a small circular track setup
haha! I'd need to fix the wheels/couplings first - but maybe some day! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains keep the couplings, just design a way to attach it to a peco repeater coupling and maybe check your local hobby shop for some wheels like your OO ones
My printer is not the best one (Creality Ender 3) it’s still good but needs some tweaking, but I managed to print an N gauge Jukebox and it came out great!-Das Mann
This is cool but wat happened to the narrow gauge engines Skarloey and Renars?
Uh that is interesting for me I am an N scale guy!
I have done the opposite and re scaled some of my designs to TT scale for some of my TT scale collecting friends.
I recon you can scale that wagon to N with no problems if you used an SLA printer and not a filament printer.
does that mean you getting a new n gauge railway layout to do some reviews!!
Those 3D prints look good
This video is really informative. I'm an N gauge modeller, and I didn't think it would be worth getting a 3D printer because the pieces would be too small to handle by any 3D printer I could afford. Also, as is the case generally, N gauge is a poor cousin to OO in terms of availability of things... including 3D models.
It's given me something to think about. Thanks.
I really thought the same thing too! It's going to be much more of a challenge in N scale... but this shows that you can do it! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Excelente video abrazo grande
My guess is for RTR models the manufacturers can use the same measurements and just shrink down the main body with some minor amendments to the finer details, but the mechanism will have to be different?
Yeah that's right - all the same drawings/dimensions can be used - it's just the detailing that would have to change!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Can the wagons you have designed be reduced just a little to say TT scale, and offer them up as OO9 wagons for those who model narrow gauge.
interesting video, I hope one day I can get a hornby black 5 here in America one day.
Thank you! Fingers crossed for you :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Nicely done Sam, now time to try it in O gauge? :)
Definitely! Though O gauge takes a lot longer to print... so I'd probably want to design something properly for O gauge!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Great video there Sam I have heard that this is what manufacturers actually do when making things small, I have heard that a manufacturer may start out with a product in OO then after the OO version has been sold and the production is finished they then look at doing it in smaller sizes like N scale, whether this is right or not I don’t know because this is something I heard off another person.
Thanks a lot David! Maybe some bad manufacturers would do that - but the good ones will always design things for a specific scale!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
@@SamsTrains that’s not what I meant Sam I’m afraid, what I meant was the designs for each product are separate but normally what happens is a OO scale version of something is made first then after the OO one is finished they will make an N scale version of the product.
Hope you can try out a UV resin printer some time, they're better suited to these smaller finely detailed models. Even the cheaper options like the photon mono have 4x to 5x the resolution of the i-mates, been using one to make N gauge locomotive bodies
I hope so too - I just couldn't use one in my loft as there's no ventilation - hopefully one day though!
Thanks for watching, Sam :)
Now that you've got the N scale layout and a resin printer, any plans for follow up?
I had this idea for a tender compatible tank engine. A saddle tank with coal bunkers in front of the cab, and an opening in the back for a tender.
Print one in 1:64 scale. Hold it in your hand. The S bug will bite and you’ll be hooked.
“A Tiny Itty Bitty Teeny Smol Van on Earth”
- Ffarquhar (2022)
Get some N scale track and see if it’s fit for purpose.
So cool
Thanks Justin! :D
Awesome 🚂😎👍👍👍
I think Sam should get a 'n-guage' set
Well, for 0.4mm nozzle I'm keeping minimal details of my models at 0.45mm, otherwise the slicer sometimes removes 0.4 mm details.
Can you take it up to O guage?
Finally something in my scale
i print my trains in n scale on ender 3
abs , cut into flat secyions making all recesed details as close to straight lines as possible and i i only ise 0,2mm nozzles
and small details like window frames, doors and other small things that stand out are usually theyre own things also
some assembly required, and flat surfaces need extra padding for sanding smooth later
after paint you can't even tell a passanger car that is some 18mm wide ,and high and arouns 130mm long doesn't look that much worse than the oryginal models
hey sam could you review Bachmann's new sound value ALCO RS3 switcher
oh this is the video you told me about!
Next are we going to see the same model scaled up to O?
I thought switching to the 0.2 mm nozzle was going to be your trick. That printer did well enough with the 0.4 mm one though.
I haven't done any N-scale but I have tried printing a few OO9 models (which are technically N gauge if you pick the right definitions for everything...). Some were great, some need work.
haha yeah - I thought about it, but really don't fancy it! Great to hear you've had a go too - 009 is something I'd love to try printing too! :D
Thanks for watching, Sam :)