Installing stainless steel frets; tools & techniques
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- Опубліковано 3 чер 2024
- Stainless steel frets are much harder than nickel frets. In this video I look at the tools that are needed to install SS frets and how installation techniques may differ from those used to install nickel frets.
David Kennett Flame Guitars London.
flameguitars.co.uk - Навчання та стиль
maybe just to add that we should all protect pickup(s) with masking tape during leveling frets. You don't want to deal with metal dust on your pickups. Thanks for the video!
The Stewmac fret cutter works better than the Stanley because of the longer handle, greater leverage = more force; simple physics. Excellent tutorial, keep them coming. Not everyone stresses the attention to detail that you do - which is the fundamental diference between a job well done and a bodge!
I love stainless frets. I had a Strat built by Todd Krause with stainless frets. I prefer the vintage (small) frets for playability, but they wear too quickly. With stainless you can run vintage size frets without them wearing down in your lifetime.
Agree 100%. I purchased a Suhr SSS with Stainless-steel frets and it's phenomenal.
Ooooh cover over those pickups when filing the frets!
Dust from filing is rather larger that they wont get airborne. Steel wool on the other hand.
@@0Imtheslime0 True, true.
Thanks for sharing sir, I like the way you are so polite you're the David Attenborough of the electric guitars. I enjoyed watching this (and all your videos). Keep the good work, never change.
I've been referred to as the Bob Ross of the luthier world, and now David Attenborough! Thanks for your comments
Just a few tips from my own experience: there's no need for a fall-away at the upper frets, if you have them leveled correctly that's the part where the action grows linearly at its highest, so it defeats the purpose, better save on the fret height as it's basically just a myth that it makes it play better. Also, u might want to cover the pickups when grinding on the frets, as all that metal powder will stick to the magnets and make it super messy to take off later on. And there's no point in checking the frets to be leveled after clamping them in, because as soon as you began nipping the ends off, you can clearly see how the rocking action of the pliers lifts those fret ends quite a bit, I can see it on video so imagine how big it is, so it's best to cut the ends first, do all the dressing for the ends and THEN once you're done messing with the frets in their slots (especially since you haven't glued them in), now you can push them in really good for the final level so that it's as minimal as possible. But great video!!!
Simply put, you sound inexperienced. My apologizes and best wishes.
@@oldmanofcotati absolutely, no harm done :)) keep on rocking :D
Stainless steel is non-magnetic. Don't worry about filings sticking to your pickups.
@@axlesuave6339 Not all stainless steel is nonmagnetic, some alloys are nonmagnetic while others are just some degree less magnetic compared to regular steel.
Fall away is not neccisary... but it does allow you to set the action lower than if it didn't have fall away.
Priceless, thank you!
I wish I lived closer to you.
But, I'm investing in re-fretting tools for sure. After 5 years, I already need a re-fret on my PRS. I guess I play too much? lol
Stainless is.... a pain haha
But worth it!
I have cutters that are just destroyed from working with stainless. And files that have been dulled.
I talk frequently with the man who taught me most of what I know about doing fretwork. He and I both agree on a few points to help the process. You seem to agree as well and I think you are already doing the same things.
One and maybe the most important is to absolutely nail the raidius of the fret before installing. With nickel there is some forgiveness on that. If the end of the fret is up, you can tap it down and it seems to stay well. Or if the middle is up, a few taps seat it. Stainless just seems unforgiving. It holds it's shape almost no matter what. I mean it *will* move but it just isn't as pliable as nickel wire. So getting the radius exactly before install seems to be the way to go.
Then, definitely pressing all the frets you can. He and I both agree on that as well. He's done a hand full of acoustic in stianless, which is very interesting, and you should experience that if you haven't, but the fingerboard extension typically can not be pressed and that complicates the issue and leads to some pretty crazy rigging with various blocks of wood to get the last several hammered in.
Neither of us, however, have ever thought to use a diamond stone to cut the ends!!!
That's an excellent idea that I will probably be trying in a few days. I have a 300/1000 stone already for roughing in my chisels. The 300 would be good for the side file I think. My regular files, engineers files you are calling them, tend to shave off tiny shreds of metal and I swear I can not get through a single stainless job without bleeding!! And the tiny shavings get all over my hands, its like having tiny splinters all over my hands!! Maybe... I just get too into it.
I will also be implementing a "precheck" and trying to tap a few to seat them better as you were showing. ANYTHING to reduce the amount of crowning on stainless is to be taken seriously and implemented. In the past, I've always pressed, glued, and just went at it with the leveling. My thinking has been... "Well, this is going to pian aggrevating. Let's just get at it..." But it's probably worth it to try an eleminate extra work on stainless. And maybe any fret work. And I feel like a few taps could save 5 to 10 mins of filing each time!
I try to constantly evolve. I'm just old enough that I leanred fretwork BEFORE the internet was huge. I'm in my 30s. And I'm realizing as with everyhing else, there is so much information available now.... you have to constantly update your knowledge and techniques.
Playability, he and I, and it seems you, all agree as well. Stainless plays smoother and overall feels really great. Bends are smoother. I think it's from the material being very hard, and then also, basically forever, you are able to play off that very very fine top edge which renains very small. Whereas with nickel, that very fine string contact point quickly grows larger and the bending friction is quickly doubled and even tripled as the fret becomes more and more flat on top from play wear.
On tone.... if anything maybe it adds brightness. But that's hard to say. Almost always, the guitar getting new frets needs them badly anyway. So maybe the change in tone is just from fresh frets?? Of course it sounds better after the new frets.
But that slick feeling the stainless has is really unrivaled. And as you said.... lasting!! You are not kidding when you say that 5 years later, the guitar will pretty much feel exactly the same. His main gigging guitar is fretted in stianless. I have several in stianless as well, and they are my preferred instruments heading out the door. Once you become accustomed to playing off stianless, it sort of feels like a downgrade when you have to play on nickel.
Also excellent video production! I have about 30 videos over 5 or 6 years and have never really worked out the production quality issue. I'm working on it more recently. Maybe one day I'll get there.
Also, I've worked the gold wire, feels like working nickel to me. Definitely nothing like stianless as far as filing goes. But... I don't think I've ever worked with JUMBO gold... that might make me feel differently.
Excellent content here. Thanks for posting your thoughts! Your ideas will soon be implemented all the way in the southern United States!
I've had half a dozen guitars refretted with stainless steel and they really are the very best. My main Strat and Tele are guitars I've owned for 30+ years so I really know how they used to play and how they play now and the stainless steel frets are far better than nickel.
Super job! Lovely playing and great tone to boot. Thanks for sharing.
Everything about this video is smooth.... 5/5. Gives me courage to refret my Jaguar AVRI 2005 with stainless.
I don't even have a guitar, but it's always nice to see someone take so much care over their work. Do you enjoy your cameo appearances on The Repair Shop?
Sounds beautiful guy! Wonderful instruction and a joy to watch from beginning to end.
Thank you for this video! For fret cutters that work great on Stainless frets, may I recommend the Hosco TL-FC28S. They look like little miniature bolt cutters, with the same type of hinge, and they work fantastically. I just used them on super jumbo (Jescar 58118) stainless frets, and they work with almost no effort; I could easily cut them one-handed, and there's no wear on the tool at all.
Thanks I'll have a look at those
I first use a black Sharpie and mark the 4th fret. Then I apply 8 to 10 layers of blue painter’s tape on the 5th fret and let my leveling beam rest on those layers. I put 8” of sandpaper on the other end of the beam and sand until the black line on the 14th fret is gone. I found that this technique eliminates that annoying “boing” of the 3rd string below the 12th fret on most Fender guitars. It gives me the correct amount of fall off from the 14th fret to the end of the fretboard.
Thank yo so much! Great info, very detailed, straight to the point and easy to watch.
Welcome back its been much too long...great episode!....
Another very interesting and informative video. I have a 1975 Telecaster that probably do with a refret but will probably go for good old nickel silver when I get around to it’s the current frets are the originals and have lasted for over 45 years.
I want to thank you for doing this video. There isn't many reputable luthiers/technicians here in my city so I'm still a little worried at trying to refret my guitar
Thank you for your informative video. I am one of those who claim to be able to hear the difference between SS and NS frets. Many say SS frets sound brighter and I agree, but those high end notes sound very differently to NS high end notes. The SS high end is blunt, like all harmonics are suddenly gone: It's difficult to explain with words. I find the tones with NS frets to sound much RICHER. This is very apparent with a great guitar plugged into a great tube amp. I have found the EVO Gold frets to be the perfect middle ground, if one can live with that golden hue. They are easier to work with than SS frets and they sound great. From the utility point of view, the big guitar companies should offer the choice of SS or NS frets and charge accordingly. If they can offer different neck profiles, they should offer different fret options as well.
I do a lot of SS refrets now and I am always interested in whether people can tell the difference between the new and old frets. Very few customers claim to hear any difference, other than the refret gives the guitar greater clarity and sustain. But this would also be true for a good NS refret. Most customers are more interested in having frets that stay bright and don't wear. That said, I did have a customer who asked me to take out the SS frets on his Ibanez and refret with NS.
Might hear a tiny difference unplugged, but once you plug in. Who cares. Put the tone knob to 9 and voila.. NS frets brightness.
I know one guy, a luthier and player. To him is not as much as to the tone, but he absolute dislike the "feel" of them under his fingers.
This was so immensely helpful! Thank you for taking such pride in your work. My 'au man' once told me that he didn't care whether I dug ditches or scrubbed toilets like he did, "Take pride in your work, as though it were for The Almighty". Your work is exemplary and declares that you came from 'good stock' as well!
I have a reissue '62 Mary Kaye Strat made in 1989 that I need to refret after extensive fondling. I thank you once again, immensely. Best Regards.
Thanks that's very kind of you
Nice to see at 14.10 using part of the Technofret Advanced Levelling System. I purchased the complete system from the designer in Edinburgh some 15 years ago and always use the 3 pivot blocks supporting a straight edge to obtain a perfectly straight neck. Such a clever idea. I have found that the rest of the system designed for levelling frets with strings on although very accurate to be too fiddly and time consuming to use most of the time, although the neck jig that came with the system is the only way I know to keep a neck with up-bow with trussrod loose completely straight while levelling frets.
Damn now I understand why I never had to do fret work on my almost 10 years old guitar played 4/5 hours daily. With the others that have nickel I had to do some re levelling after a couple of years.
I absolutely love SS frets on MY personal gear.
I hate doing the job on others gear. No matter what they pay for it, it always makes me feel it is somehow not enough.😁 Great video on the task.
I know that feeling. Less so now. 75% of my refrets now use SS fretwire. So I am more comfortably with the whole process. But I can't pretend that my heart doesn't sink a little when the request is for big, jumbo frets.
@@flameguitars5770 I just started playing an ESP LTD guitar with XJ ss frets. It’s so smooth! Now I definitely want all my other gear shod with ss frets. Need not be XJ size as my heavy hand won’t wear them down. 🤘🏻
Thank you for this video.
Getting ready to do my first re-fretting. Nice show
There is no fret end smoothing work in this video.
Well done, enjoyed and made perfect sense. Doubtfull anything new will improve your process
Upload more videos !! It’s so much interesting !!
Great video, would’ve liked to see you crowning the frets that needed it, just to see how you do it compared to others.
Very impressive work! I wish you were nearer me.
Stainless steel frets must be perfectly leveled AND polished, then they are a joy! Any scratches or imperfections translates to noises and bad vibrato, because the do not budge to the string! Great video :-)
Doesnt that also apply to all fret materials though lol
@@justaamateur6533 in princip yes, but when it comes to metal the stronger wins, meaning steel will not wear from nickel, normal fretwire will be worn by steel strings, so over time the softer fret will be smoothed out by playing. That is not the case with SS frets. Of course softer frets Should be perfect from the get go, but they are just more forgiving over time, and loose the serration/sanding marks. FWIW
@@justaamateur6533 He is leveling frets the wrong way here to my experience. unless he uses very high grit paper, which will take ages for SS frets to level. For SS, you need coarse paper so they make any "damage" the the hard Stainless. When you level up and down, you get sanding burs that are in the worst direction possible. These burs needs tons of fine sanding and polish. If you level frets side to side, you avoid the worst because sanding line from the paper now goes the correct way. Most burs will go away on crowning but the top will need tons of after sanding to get them smooth. I do not use any machine when refretting, all is done by hand. I spend a whole day and a half on a SS refret easily. There have been a couple of times i had to go a second round and re-sand and polish frets because they feel too raspy on bends.
On NS frets, you are done in a few hours with the whole thing.
Hi David, Many thanks for posting, since you last saw my Les Paul the wear to the frets has in crested, so it looks like it might be time for that refret.
I will speak with you in the new year.
Happy to do so. Happy New Year
Definitely learned a thing or two. I think it's worth the effort to pre address high frets, like the use of diamond plates. Am more interested in learning about rounding over edges. Personally I go to nearest Plek machine to level and crown my frets. Just believe more in the engineering and accuracy it than I could do myself. But I have to agree with an air to caution about masking off pickups. I use copper foil, twist wires and typically high end pickups. Noticed when I get the guitars back from pleking their is a little unusual 60 cycle hum or pickup noise. Not sure if it is a static electricity from the machine or metal shavings sticking to the magnets. But in the future I am just going to bring the guitars in for pleking without electronics
Great tutorial! Thank you!
Fret guards are also useful to help keep the wood from chipping when pulling frets.
I really enjoyed your presentation, very professional and intuitive...Thank you and I subscribed also!
Thank you
Thanks a lot for sharing this!
I was considering stainless frets. I do remember drilling & cutting stainless in my job. We treated it much like titanium(very slow drilling etc). I'm curious about the Evo gold, so I'll check your video. I was going to do my refret myself, but I don't have the proper tools, any more. I may have Guitar Center do it, before they go out of business. Once again you do beautiful work, the tangs were my biggest concern, I have an unbound rosewood fretboard as well. I'll make my decision after watching your Evo installation video. Love your work quite informative. Plus it's nice to watch a craftsman ply his trade.
I need to do a follow up video on Evo Gold. Since I made that video I have installed Evo in lots of guitars. I like it very much
Was waiting for a new video. Thank you :)
Really great video. Is ot possible to have a video about the neck jig? It looks homemade and I'd really like to know how you made it
Thanks David! That was just great!
Thanks
I'd love to see you do a video on refretting a maple fretboard and the different challenges on doing a finished fretboard.
If you check the channel he's already done one on a maple board strat I believe
@@pierrederesistance Ah, you are correct sir! I just want him to do more videos. lol
Thanks for this vid. I have done a couple of nickel fret necks previously and thought they were relatively easy. Recently, I had to level a stainless steel fret neck, it was a bear to get the frets to a point where the bends won't feel gritty. It was a learning experience. I'm planning on re-fretting a Fender neck using stainless; it will be better the next go-around.
Next time, level the frets from side to side. Never level SS going up and down.
Believe me, polishing will be easier if you do the side to side.
Need a full length beam for that way of leveling.
great video! thanks
Love the video… Thank you
One thing i never do is leveling SS frets up and down the board.But side to side.
That is, if you are using sandpaper only. Since you are using a diamond stone, it might not get the rough top.
For anyone leveling with sandpaper beam, always for side to side. not up and down. Or else you will spend many hours sanding away those burs on top.SS needs to be 99% smooth if not it will feel raspy to bend on.
But totally worth to check high frets and try and hammer down those tall ones. The less leveling the better.
Great info cheers
Great! THANKS SO MUCH!
Hello from Los Angeles California.
Question : would you post the name and description of the recommended hand tools that
Will allow for the refret ?
And possibly the source of said tools.
I can not find any guitar repair
In the area that will use stainless steal.
I would like to order as much of the tools from stew-mac.
Thank you for your valuable time and you're interest in this request
I noticed after installing the evo gold fretwire it feels really nice and feels smoother. I also noticed that my hand was a bit sore after cutting them all lol
There's no getting around the fact that Evo fretwork (and even more so SS frets) is hard on tools and hands.
I did my first stainless steel fret job the other day. I now am going to buy better/new tools. They chewed up what I had.
Yes I'm afraid you need specialist tools if you want to regularly work with SS frets.
I don't think I want to put my Les Paul R8 through that process. 🤔 The risk of damage to the guitar seems too high?
Thankyou your sharing. It is very practically helpful for fretting ! on guitar !
May I ask... What kind (or type) of fret you are using for classical guitar ??
Thanks
I very rarely get asked to refret a nylon string guitar. The strings don't really wear the frets. Nickel will be fine on classical guitars.
@@flameguitars5770 Thanks for your reply. In case of Classical guitar, which size of fret is mostly suitable ? Thanks
Which Fret-end dressing file do you recommend for Stainless Steel Frets? Appreciate any input. Enjoyed your informative video. Great work.
I have a small file I bought from StewMac some years ago that I use for fret ends. It still seems to work just fine on SS frets
Thanks. Appreciate your input. @@flameguitars5770
David, if you don’t mind me asking would lemon oil be suitable for use on a Granadillo fretboard?
Yes, lemon oil will work just fine
@@flameguitars5770 Thanks for that.
I have a question!
Is it possible to install stainless steel frets on a Fender neck and not have to do any sanding or filing. I notice you checked for a rocking motion!
Question is? Are they not all leveled when there's no rocking' motion so why do you sand and file?
Btw... That piece you play sounds perfectly in tune!
Thank you so much!
That's a good point. If you want the frets to be perfectly level then I dont think the rocking check alone is sufficient. That said, I am just kissing the top of the frets and taking off very little of the height, particularly in the frets 1 to 12 area. But even if I didn't level the frets I would still polish them
Good sir you need knipex pliers from Germany, as a millwright they are the only pliers in my eyes now.
I think ss is brighter than nickel, but yes, nicely polished ss play smooth like glass :)
Brighter tone wise I mean
At 15:24, even though these are stainless steel, why would you not cover the pickups? Or cover the fingerboard when sanding the fret ends?
8:04 You say be careful not to over-radius. The fretboard is 9.5 and you bent the wire to 7. Are you supposed to make the radius of the wire more curved than the fretboard or have it be the same radius? I'm re-fretting a guitar with a 14 radius. Should I bend my wire to 14 or a lower number? Thanks
Generally I would say that the flatter the radius the closer to that radius I would pre-bend the frets. So for a 14" radius I would pre-radius the frets to around 12".
@@flameguitars5770 Ok I will do 12! Thanks for the quick reply.
It is sufficient to just slightly over-radius them. Just by very small amount. No need to go as much as he do. But since he has very "fresh" slots, they will go in, and they will hold. I would also not do any glue.
This is such an informative video.
I wanted to know the specs of your new fret wire.
I want to refret my stratocaster with stainless stell frets.
I have my eyes on frets with 0.51 inch crown height
And width 0.114 inches.
Detailed specs-
Tang Height: 1.7mm (0.067 inch)
Tang Width: 0.6mm (0.024 inch)
Stud Width: 0.95mm (0.037 inch)
Stud Space: 2.5mm (0.098 inch)
This is unlike the Fender medium Jumbo (. 106″ width x . 036″ height).
Would I be able to refret my guitar wih nee stainless steel frets with the above mentioned specs?
Please do help.
Regards,
Leo
Fretwire width and height is a matter of personal choice. There is really no "wrong" fretwire to install. I think the fretwire used in this video was the same width but slightly taller than than the fretwire you you are thinking of using. You say 0.51 inch. I guess you mean 0.051 (1.3mm) That gives you plenty of height
@@flameguitars5770 yes sir. 0.051, or even 0.057.
Thanks a ton.❤️
I was replacing my guitar frets on my Taylor every two years it would be unplayable on the b and g-string yes I play a lot but I have other acoustic guitars I had for 30 years never been refreeted don't need refretting I love Taylor's they sound great but they really need to do something about that soft fretwire they use so I heard negative comments about stainless in acoustic guitars well mine sounds great goodbye nickel silver forever
No crowning the frets?
I've once made the mistake to get a guitar refretted with stainless steel frets. It added pretty unpleasant highs and the whole guitar sounded shrill after the refret. After a month I decided to get the stainless steel frets replaced with nickel silver frets and everything was good again
Interesting. About 70% of the refrets I do now use SS frets. I always ask customers whether they can hear any tonal differences. Most cant. And if they do, it is not a worse sound. That said, a few months ago I was asked to take SS frets out of an Ibanez and fit nickel.
Great video ,should you not have those pickup s masked up?
What kind of fret hammer. Is it hard plastic end or rubber or brass or what?
It is what is called a 'dead blow' hammer. I use the plastic end for frets.
Can you explain to me why when you were leveling the frets with the beam and the stone, You didn't cover the pick ups, wouldn't the small specs of metal get in them.
Probably worth taping over open humbuckers, but not covered single coil pickups.
Stainless frets are not magnetic.. If any, barely. No threat to pickups.
Only steel wool is the stuff you should be careful with.
What is device you are using to press the frets in is it an alternative to an arbor press ?
I've got an arbor press but I don't use it any more. Prefer this tool
It is a Record Power drill press that I have had for 20 years. It is cast iron, very stable and has a spring action. The weight and long lever gives good pressing power.
I would have masked off the pickups when doing the final levelling with neck installed. Magnets and steel is a volatile combo and can easily destroy the pickups.
Stainless frets are barely magnetic and pose no threat to pickups. Steel wool on the other hand... cover em up.
I said it many times...if you want high end guitars for life(and cheap)...learn to install frets and cut nuts on guitars...when it comes to SS frets...they are the shit.Slick as hell bending and vibrato and perfect frets for life.I seriously doubt you ever need to dress those things in a lifetime let alone replace them.All my guitars,even the bullets and the affinities have big jescar SS frets on them...nowadays i prefer to get a budget guitar and install perfect frets on it versus buy the "real thing" that most likely has soft nickel silver frets anyway and i have paid an arm and a leg for it.....learn your fretwork gents....thats what elevates the guitar from decent to great...perfect frets,well cut nut,rolled fingerboard..and it can be done on any guitar regardless of price....
20:30 that last little bit of compound to our left of the fourth fret was bugging me ;)
levelnig frets without covering pickups ... what abt stainless steel dust that gets stuck on the pulpeices and insid the pickups
Stainless alloy used in frets are barely magnetic. Its steel wool you need to worry about.
oh crips...i am sitting here, very carefully, dressing the fret ends with an angle grinder. ( my first stainless steel fret job )
i am going to try my fixed mound disk sander tomorrow....i can't afford those tools.
"honst" Ron Lira always charged the same for SS as he did NS. as he put it i hate doing refrets. and if i can upgrade you to SS and never have to do that guitar again its worth it. and on the tool side, he would just say dont buy cheep stewmac tools. buy harbor freight.
how bad to stainless steel frets sound?
I hear 0 difference.
They last forever.. So they say..
Maybe you needs superglue that frets, to make sure it doesnt move in the future
you guitar make subjat. I join llik you . I am sri lankan .
No zoom.....
You din.t tap over the pickups
i fell asleep13:18
I just clamp the fret wire to a non mar vice and I use my dremel with a big cut off wheel and cut it that way but I agree the stu mac fret wire cutter works pretty damm good.