Makes for a good gift or could bail you out in a pinch when used by hand: amzn.to/3B91CNv It will take impact abuse, just not going to be transferring that impacting very dramatically as we showed. Either way, if you come out the other end not owning the ABS plastic model even my daughter could break, that's a win any way you look at it.
I realy don´t get this fixation on milwakee, there are many trades for which the high strenght is all the contrary to what they need, regarding precission, sensibilty and security features, there are better brands. and that makes me think of all this reviews channels..I donnou I wonder how many have "real people" behind, and how does it works that big brands knock on your door and tell you- hey would you like doing some promotion for us, easy money- most of any of all these channels are entirely focused on one single brand...and most of them mostly only talk about strenght... there are also all those channels making reviews with tons of tools behind and rolling on the table, anyone can see that these tools have never been used any single chance, the show only their hands never their faces, they never show those projects they used to work on, for which they need hundred different tools, or just look at their hands...those guys have never been to a contruction site haha, however they also have "the real worker version" too hahaha, they have all the salesman-client oriented videos possible.....youtube gets scarier day by day, plus the way the platform works, we realy do not watch what we want, but what the platform wants...that is, a hell ton of multinationals and lobbys cleaning their asses with youtube.. like I said, who knows, but...strange numbers and figures online and there is this thing of selfcloning and rebranding of products...well...numbers speak for themselves
I'd like to see you guys put a set of those torque limiting sticks on your rig. I've been curious about well they work with different strength impacts and how accurate they are.
I have the Tite-reach 'professional' model and an old Made-in-USA Bluepoint model. They've been absolutely handy for certain jobs. A definite time time-saver (and money-maker for the professional). I only use them on small fasteners though. Never seen an impact; only a cordless ratchet. Use a breaker bar/long ratchet to break the fastener loose, then use these tools to conveniently zip them off/on.
If the output end was made with a significantly larger sprocket to get a torque advantage, it would kind of defeat the purpose of being a tool for tight reach areas.
@@F0XD1E it could still be just as slim if they use a proper hobbed gear and not a sintered metal one. Haven't gotten to the teardown yet, so not sure on original construction
That would be such a fun tool to make the right way; roller bearings, high quality sprockets, a tensioner between sprockets to take up chain slack, straight chain path on driven side of sprockets, etc.
Roller bearings concentrate stress at single point loads, so those are definitely not the way to go if you want to build this impact tool the right way...
Not sure if you’re thinking of ball bearings… From google: “roller bearings, with their larger contact area, are ideal for applications with heavy radial loads….” Seems like a roller bearing is ideal for these tools. What am I missing?
Is a multi direction tool you would be putting load on your tensioning system going one of the ways either fwd or rev depending on how you engineered it
That was a fantastic video. I’ve been more curious about those more than any tool in the tool world. I’ve seen them used successfully, and myself have had one save my day, but never in a high torque, or heavy corrosion situation. You guys creating reliable measurements was highly informative, and now we all know their true capabilities. Thank you.
I’ve had the tite reach ones for about 2 years. I only ever use the 1/2” one. It kills the torque on your impact but they are great for motor mounts on fwd 4 cyl cars. You don’t need to do any twisting. So that bolt you’d have to drop the motor for because you can get a ratchet on but can’t turn, now can be removed. Also the 1/2” tite reach has seen quite a lot of impact use over 2 years and is still holding up. So they do last surprisingly
I'd go with the tight reach pro. As an engineer and being my own DIY mechanic, it is rare for me working on a car to need to apply over 50 to 60 left of force in such tight spaces. Wish you could've used a breaker bar to really test the torque figures under constant tension. It is very inefficient impacting one mechanism like this
I’ve been looking at these and trying to decide which one I want. Putting a transmission back in to it would have been perfect. This video was perfect timing. Thanks for doing what y’all do.
Just one thing I noticed is that the chain the Snap On uses is $48 for a 10ft roll, not for the amount that each tool uses. So estimating that each extender uses 24 inches of chain, that's $9.60 worth of chain per unit at retail. Also it's safe to assume that Snap On paid a lower price per foot because they likely bought thousands of feet of chain. While it's true that the Snap On performed the best its comical to pretend like it's fairly priced. I'd guess that those extenders cost them $10-$20 each to manufacture.
@@slasher9883 depends on how you use them. I still say they are king when it comes to hand tools. Ratchets, sockets, wrenches, hammers are all built to last, warranty is king, and the little things like Flank Drive Plus make it all worth it 👌🏻
Yeah look into the video showing a certain model fap off Jack which is the extract same as the Daytona from hobo freight and they were charging close to 3x as much
@@matthewolson9704 Public records show that the jack (s) in question were purchased from an overseas production facility by both Snap-on and Harbor Freight. Neither company copied the other as neither one actually produced or designed it. They were just marketed under two different names brands. Additionally, the lawsuit that Snap-on filed was tried and Snap-on lost.
I wonder how a chain tensioner on a thumb screw would affect the power transfer. Pre tensioning the chain might allow for better transfer especially as things wear and get sloppy.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m not sure if that would help. Theoretically one side of the chain will always be under tension ,and since you can’t push a chain, the tension of the other side doesn’t matter. Right?
@@adamhakimji6461 torque lost is impact torque. Any bit of play within the sprocket and chain will lose power. If you put a 1/8” shank in a 1/4” hole, there’s 1/8” of wiggle room that allows something like an impact to wiggle.
Impact guns will cause the sprocket to move in both directions. The slop in the chain then needs to be taken up on the next impact. Reducing this 'bounce' back and forth would improve transfer. These are already hugely inefficient tools in terms of transfer. I don't think the added friction of a tensioner would be worse than the increased mechanical connection from the tighter chain.
@@toyorover1313 agreed that it would keep the chain slap down between impact blows. When using it with hand tools or a cordless ratchet I think it would matter much less. A small Delrin block with a pair of springs behind it would be all you'd need
Thanks guys! I was really tempted to buy a Tite-Reach last year but I bought and Milwaukee M12 extended reach ratchet instead. I'm glad I did! If I do buy one in the future, I'd buy the Mac Tools/Facom one as a KMC chain is very easy to source and replace.
I have the tite-reach ones, both the standard and pro, got them years ago. The pro came in handy changing the plugs on my friend's Ford pickup. I almost never use them to break things loose, if I can fit the tite-reach I can usually fit a breaker to do that. After the initial break, the tite-reach makes it super-easy (barely an inconvenience) to spin the fastener all the way off in hard-to-reach places.
You answered my question. You can use it to start the bolt in hard to reach places plus remove them if you just use just a ratchet after you loosen them with a stronger tool first. I just ordered mine today. Thank you.
Enjoyable video. I had no idea these tools existed. My choice? A long handle ratchet end wrench box end wrench. Unless one has to take out lots of bolts only these things can access every day, they just aren't worth it for the torque one can apply. One might use the hobby one with some sticky grease to hold a bolt for starting in an almost impossible situation, use it to rotate it until snug, then get out the afore mentioned hand ratchet wrench to tighten it up.
I think I might pick up a Snap-On. The shape of the unit looks like the chain makes a straight path from gear to gear resulting in less friction points to rob the torque and prevent a bunch of wear when spinning at higher speeds like when a bold head breaks off. Thanks again for another great video.
Just bought the 1/2" Mac yesterday and used it to spin off an input shaft nut on a t870 today then the puller for the pulley. I've had to use a 3/4 gun to spin some of these off so I'm pretty impressed with the transfer. Used a IR 2235ptimax
I have the Mac tools in 1/2, got it on special probably 4? years ago and I've used it maybe 3 or 4 times. I'm a truck and trailer mechanic, for all sizes and engine types. The mac works when I need it for the applications I've needed it to. I don't like Mac tools (I'm a bit of a snap-on fanboy) but I do like the tool.
In all honesty, I thought those extenders used a gear train to transmit power. I wonder how a gear set extender would compare to chain driven one, if they exist out there.
Given the width of the wrench, you'd be looking at 5 or 6 gears, at least. The lash in the gear chain would transmit but a small fraction of the power from an impact wrench. If you're using it with a torque wrench (which applies a lot more smooth, even torque), it'd probably be OK.
The other day I saw some UA-cam video on the snap on one , never used it before and was interested in it but instantly thought “ would be cool to see the torque test channel test this tool”
Awesome video as always! As a professional auto tech by trade I find it funny watching the ads for these things. Most ads show these being used in areas that absolutely do not need one of these and in my opinion using one would only make the job harder. That said though I’m sure this is likely the case for advertising because if they were being used where they’re really needed you couldn’t see much.
A lot of years ago there was a similar tool that had a shaft drive, that was strong and didn't suck. The shaft was tubular steel and was attached to a worm gear at one end and a 3/8 drive at the other. the tool was two feet long. It was slow but it got you out of a jam.
I had too much money on the snap on truck one day and saw that apparatus and bought it. I call it my "secret weapon" jokingly mostly.. it's good for a few things though.. good to see it doesn't suck comparatively.
Love this video, but yes, I agree - even without watching - I'd have never wasted money on these - I get a lot more use out of extra long handled ratchet wrenches.
Thanks for saving me some coin. I’d been considering picking one of these up for a while, but to answer your question, my choice will be my cordless ratchet. If I just have to have one, I’ll build one myself as these don’t seem to show any advantage on some junk I could cook up with spare parts. I do wonder how a transfer case style chain/sprocket would perform in this application.
I had no idea these existed and now need to purchase one. Would have come in real handy for my last water pump replacement on my tribute. Even if I couldn't use it for final torque, it would have saved a lot of time running the long bolts in.
Being a mechanic and based off this video I’d would go with the Mac, but knowing the warranty and knowing a snap on is made better I would definitely go with the snap on one. Thanks for another great video!
I bought the 1/2 Mac. I knew its gonna come with a substantial torque loss and, that chain will break pretty quick for what I planned on using it for (5/8 frame and suspension bolts). The tool has way more torque loss than I expected but, it did not break. My expectations were quite high but my Mac salesman assured me it’ll work. All in all it’s a pretty slick and cost effective tool to substitute a 1/2 electric or pneumatic ratchet if you already own a good impact gun.
I think the point of these are to make hard to reach bolts easier to get in and out not to torque down. That's how i will be using them, time is currency.
This would probably work better with a series of gears rather than a chain and sprockets. Once you take out all the backlash in the gears there is a lot less stretching and lost torque. You could even have some gear reduction by making the output gear slightly larger.
What a great video. I always wondered how good those things are, they would come in handy in my line of work. One thing, I haven’t looked: are there other manufacturers out there that make these things? Maybe some will be geared and not chain driven?? Live confidently and peacefully
It's mind blowing to me that all of these manufacturers went with a chain as the force transfer medium. There are a lot of variables inherent in the chain to negatively impact the effectiveness. The best way I think this could've been designed would be with gears. It would obviously increase the weight. It would definitely increase the price point on the cheaper ones. However, the more expensive high end tools would likely have a substantial increase of efficiency, and a small negative impact on the manufacturers profit margins or a slight price increase. I personally wouldn't mind paying an extra $20-$30 on a $200+ tool that is substantially more effective at its intended job. Using gears would also allow for better torque by simply optimizing the ratio during the R&D of the tool.
Exactly what I was going to say. I have a non-impact-rated DeWalt that hasn't given up the ghost even after some pretty stuck bolts. And it's been an absolute lifesaver for control arm bolts (I don't live in the rust belt, thank goodness)
Seems like if you're going to need one of these on a regular basis or not & have the extra money spend the Snap On is the clear tool to have. I may purchase one myself & use it when necessary on my own vehicles just to make the jobs easier.
Was hoping you would include the facom version in your tests, i recently bought the 1/2" version and used it with a 5:1 ratio torque multiplier on some suspension bolts and i would go as far as saying it made very light work of undoing those bolts and worked like a charm, it has a 1-1.7 gear ratio and had no problem holding up to the job in hand, i dont have an impact driver to test it with though.
Impact guns amplify torque by reciprocating back and forth. When you put a chain drive between the driver and the fastener, that soaks up the vibration and very little makes it to the socket and the fastener.
I was trying to get the crank pulley bolt out of a 16yo Subaru. There wasn't room in front to put an impact on, without removing the radiator and AC condenser; I struggled with it by hand for over an hour and got nowhere. A mechanic buddy loaned me a ridiculous nuclear-powered SnapOn impact (rated I have no idea, but a LOT) and the MAC tight-reach tested here. I drove home, and ten minutes later I was back at his shop, handing him his tools, with the crank bolt in my pocket.
@@johncoops6897 Well if you're so freakin' smart, why didn't you tell me this in July??? 😂 I understand exactly what you're saying, and yes, that very well might have worked. I did try hitting the breaker bar with a hammer, but it wasn't particularly effective, and definitely didn't deliver the kind of direct shock & vibration the bolt needed. Thanks for the tip - TIL.
sell a lot of the mac ones and I only fixed one in all the time we have been selling them. hard to get but work and hold up well. mac has a bogo on them also once or twice a year and sells all 3 drives also
I had the tight reach back in the day when they were blue and realized how useful they were on certain areas of a Peterbilt where you could get a ratchet but not turn it. This was until they broke. Then I saw the Mac ones in 3/8” and 1/2”. If I had known Snap-on made them I would have bought them instead. They really are an invaluable tool that can save time and your hands. I need to see if either Mac or Snap-on make a 1/4 drive now. Those were handy too.
I think this sort of extender is meant to be used with a long leverage bar/extender. I think it can transfer the force of that not really a vibrating action you get from an impact wrench.
You know, this actually seems like something you could make a better version of without an insane amount of work. Enclosed body made from squaretube like the snapon, using hefty shafts on good bearings, and off-the-shelf motorcycle parts. Even standard 525 chain is rated for 9220lbs tensile strength, almost 4x the snapon's chain rating. If you wanted to go even further, you could have custom sintered sprockets made with a beefier profile for maximum engagement and minimum drivetrain lash.
If anyone ever cleans/rebuilds these I'd recommend chain wax instead of traditional chain oil/lube. The wax will stick on the chain rather than get flung off or drip off and eventually leak out.
Sometimes the old saying is correct . You get what you pay for. I enjoy cheaper options especially if they work well and have a warranty, like some Pittsburgh stuff. But anything I've bought from Snap on has been top quality with no issues. They still set the standard for hand tools imo. As shown here sometimes it makes sense to just buy the best one first . Might pick up the snap on tite reach soon as it looks really handy for bolts between frame rails and for places you cant swing a ratchet .
Tight Reach I think is good for that one bolt you can break loose with an wrench or ratchet but will spend too long getting it out with one of them like if you only get a “click” of clearance. But really only for the home user.
I've got the Mac pair, seem ok. It's output is like 1/5 of the gun. I use them when doing rack & pinion swaps. Blue Point used to make one, it was handy to use during radiator swaps. I wore that one out. Now I just grab my flex head impact.
I have had the tite reach version for a couple of years now...granted I don't use impacts on them, I do like them very much. They are great for those once in awhile hard to get at fasteners
The snap-on looks nicest, but at that price, I’ll never own it. The Facom, sorry, Mac one, is more in my price range and also more easily available to me, shame about the warranty though. Hummed and hahhhed over getting one, but this test for science has proven they are capable of withstanding and producing torque (though reduced). Thank you as always, and great to see you all mentioned by AvE, you’ve entered a certain circle (no pun intended), and vouched for, welcome to the family 😂.
For those of you who are profession wrench throwers, using the DIY model for blower fans, air door actuators, and other general interior hvac or similar tiny size screws.
Wow 35 ft/lbs when I was younger I would have broken that so many times and would probably still unintentionally break that thing using a 3/8" ratchet maybe even a 1/4". Thanks for saving me some money because they looked plausibly useful.
To test the max torque I would get a very long breaker bar, position the extender tool a few degrees to one side of vertical, and put the breaker bar 90 degrees to the opposite side so the leverage is over center. Then apply force downward on it with everything you've got and see where or if it fails. I'd say it's pretty safe bet the Snap On with all steel construction and heavier chain will take the most strain. As far as transmitting power from the impact gun, that is inherently limited by the vibration of all the mechanical clearances in the tool vibrating.
I think that in order to get full torque transfer the extender casing must be rigidly connected to the gearcase of the impact driver. Clearly any rotation allowed between the cases reduces power though the chain, and is impossible to stop by hand. Even more torque is lost by the same effect on the fastener end, the torque again will be spent on the path of least resistance which is definitely moving the tool before one can react to prevent it. (of course as offered there is no provision on either product to connect them together, but no doubt if it was made part of the drivers case, and the extender end rigidly supported on the workpeice, much more impressive performance would be gained. I enjoyed your video and knowledge gained from it.
I've had the plastic one for some time, great tool for tight spots to make fast work on >12mm bolts or crack loose larger bolts off the old way then take them off with a battery powered impact. My only issue was that it's build to large for what's inside, so i designed myself a new casing making it 2/3 as thick and about 20% smaller head. Now it's got far less slop, making the use of a hand wrench easier and far better for even tighter spots ;-)
To transfer it would need gears instead of chains. Absorbing gear to start with on the impact end transferring gear following that which actually impacts instead of just trying to pull with a pulling force it needs a driving force delivered as well. To be able to transfer the energy of the impact directly through the tool to the object..
Yes yes I absolutely agree that first one is definitely not torque capable and if you weigh more than a hundred pounds I do not suggest you purchase this item ever hopefully around to two will be better as 200 ft lb would be acceptable for light duty.
I'd like to see one of those made with the car timing chain types that have 4-5 side plates per link. And some UHMW tensioning plates either side to take the slack out, as I guess that's where most of the torque disappears to.
Love the video u guys always do a great job. I wouldn't waste money on amy of them.... I would think a redesign is in order with some pinion gears and a shaft could get u much closer to real torque transfer.
Just finished using one while swapping headers and pulleys, it was soooooo much easier. I can’t believe I actually worked on a car without an extension lmao.
We have the MAC versions at work and using 1/2 inch guns being fed 175 PSI through 1/2 inch lines and 3/8 fittings, they blow out the the sides of the housing with almost concerning regularity.
Motorcycle chain designs use a composite material as a chain guide and buffer material. If Mac tools adopted a similar approach to it's internal mechanism, and the end user kept it lubricated, having an aluminum body wouldn't be such an issue. I would choose the snap-on based on result and the fact it has a good warranty.
This is interesting to me because I had never heard of this tool before and independently a few months back made a rough drawing for one of these after getting annoyed at the limitations of a right angle bit
Interesting and helpful video, I’ve seen these things online and was curious to see how much they’d Rob from an impact wrench. Kind of a bummer was hoping something like this would allow me to use my big plug in el-cheapo impact in tighter confines where my 3/8s one doesn’t have enough power. By the time a home gamer like me looks at one of those tool truck tite wrenches it’s cheaper to buy that Milwaukee 3/8s.
These extenders I've seen and always Wondered how they would work. What comes to mind is the top mount bolts for airbags on bulker super b trailers. Cant even see them let alone fit a wrench. The best way usually is to snap the studs out but you can't even fit a stubby impact.
If the drive side sprocket is larger that's actually a mechanical disadvantage (reducing torque but increasing speed). This actually matches the Mac website stating "Optimized gear ratio designed to reduce fastener removal time". Kind of strange, in my opinion you need more torque than speed to remove fastener.
Makes for a good gift or could bail you out in a pinch when used by hand: amzn.to/3B91CNv It will take impact abuse, just not going to be transferring that impacting very dramatically as we showed. Either way, if you come out the other end not owning the ABS plastic model even my daughter could break, that's a win any way you look at it.
Congrats guys !! You know you have made it when AvE mentions you :) ua-cam.com/video/uxTYcOXJORk/v-deo.html
Would a torque multipler work better on these tools to reach higher torque transfer?
I'd rather own a set of ratchet wrenches.
I realy don´t get this fixation on milwakee, there are many trades for which the high strenght is all the contrary to what they need, regarding precission, sensibilty and security features, there are better brands.
and that makes me think of all this reviews channels..I donnou I wonder how many have "real people" behind, and how does it works that big brands knock on your door and tell you- hey would you like doing some promotion for us, easy money- most of any of all these channels are entirely focused on one single brand...and most of them mostly only talk about strenght...
there are also all those channels making reviews with tons of tools behind and rolling on the table, anyone can see that these tools have never been used any single chance, the show only their hands never their faces, they never show those projects they used to work on, for which they need hundred different tools, or just look at their hands...those guys have never been to a contruction site haha, however they also have "the real worker version" too hahaha, they have all the salesman-client oriented videos possible.....youtube gets scarier day by day, plus the way the platform works, we realy do not watch what we want, but what the platform wants...that is, a hell ton of multinationals and lobbys cleaning their asses with youtube..
like I said, who knows, but...strange numbers and figures online
and there is this thing of selfcloning and rebranding of products...well...numbers speak for themselves
I want t say, however, in this case, the model of this channel very clever for promoting milwakee
I'd like to see you guys put a set of those torque limiting sticks on your rig. I've been curious about well they work with different strength impacts and how accurate they are.
Agreed
I think he mentioned that their accuracy depends/ changes on a few factors, in one of the first few episodes
@@freddym.1489 It would be good to see how it changes and what the factors are.
Workin on it
I find torque sticks underperform at my current shop. We have air delivery issues. At our old shop the were far more accurate.
Your test earned Mac Tools a sale, was going to go cheaper but your video helped me make a more informed purchase. Thank you!!
I have the Tite-reach 'professional' model and an old Made-in-USA Bluepoint model. They've been absolutely handy for certain jobs. A definite time time-saver (and money-maker for the professional). I only use them on small fasteners though. Never seen an impact; only a cordless ratchet.
Use a breaker bar/long ratchet to break the fastener loose, then use these tools to conveniently zip them off/on.
If course I find this video 2 days to late I would have loved to have one of these for the upper control arm bolts on the trailblazer I was working on
Thanks, I appreciate your comment.
That’s how I would use it also.
I've always wondered why they don't make one with a larger and smaller gear for some torque multiplication since they absorb the impact blows so well.
They do, the mac? One was mentioned in the tear down with having different gear sizes for some mechanical advantage
@@bend7668 I believe on the Mac that the drive gear is bigger than the output gear, which would actually lead to decrease in torque but higher rpm.
If the output end was made with a significantly larger sprocket to get a torque advantage, it would kind of defeat the purpose of being a tool for tight reach areas.
@@F0XD1E it could still be just as slim if they use a proper hobbed gear and not a sintered metal one. Haven't gotten to the teardown yet, so not sure on original construction
I was thinking the same
That would be such a fun tool to make the right way; roller bearings, high quality sprockets, a tensioner between sprockets to take up chain slack, straight chain path on driven side of sprockets, etc.
I would make it for 3/4" air impacts 🤣
Roller bearings concentrate stress at single point loads, so those are definitely not the way to go if you want to build this impact tool the right way...
Not sure if you’re thinking of ball bearings…
From google: “roller bearings, with their larger contact area, are ideal for applications with heavy radial loads….”
Seems like a roller bearing is ideal for these tools. What am I missing?
Is a multi direction tool you would be putting load on your tensioning system going one of the ways either fwd or rev depending on how you engineered it
@@RedShiftedDollari believe semi axles use tapered roller bearings correct me if im wrong i think they could handle the power of a impact
That was a fantastic video. I’ve been more curious about those more than any tool in the tool world. I’ve seen them used successfully, and myself have had one save my day, but never in a high torque, or heavy corrosion situation. You guys creating reliable measurements was highly informative, and now we all know their true capabilities. Thank you.
Super interesting, good to see you guys testing more than just electric tools, keep up the good work
I’ve had the tite reach ones for about 2 years. I only ever use the 1/2” one. It kills the torque on your impact but they are great for motor mounts on fwd 4 cyl cars. You don’t need to do any twisting. So that bolt you’d have to drop the motor for because you can get a ratchet on but can’t turn, now can be removed. Also the 1/2” tite reach has seen quite a lot of impact use over 2 years and is still holding up. So they do last surprisingly
You have save me and a lot of other people money by avoiding purchasing that plastic one! Thank you!
I'd go with the tight reach pro. As an engineer and being my own DIY mechanic, it is rare for me working on a car to need to apply over 50 to 60 left of force in such tight spaces. Wish you could've used a breaker bar to really test the torque figures under constant tension. It is very inefficient impacting one mechanism like this
Same
Same
I agree
You obviously don’t live in the rust belt and needed to do suspension work then.
I’ve been looking at these and trying to decide which one I want. Putting a transmission back in to it would have been perfect. This video was perfect timing. Thanks for doing what y’all do.
Just one thing I noticed is that the chain the Snap On uses is $48 for a 10ft roll, not for the amount that each tool uses. So estimating that each extender uses 24 inches of chain, that's $9.60 worth of chain per unit at retail. Also it's safe to assume that Snap On paid a lower price per foot because they likely bought thousands of feet of chain. While it's true that the Snap On performed the best its comical to pretend like it's fairly priced. I'd guess that those extenders cost them $10-$20 each to manufacture.
Pretty much the case with all Snap-on tools. Good tools but not that good that they justify their ridiculous pricing,
@@slasher9883 depends on how you use them. I still say they are king when it comes to hand tools. Ratchets, sockets, wrenches, hammers are all built to last, warranty is king, and the little things like Flank Drive Plus make it all worth it 👌🏻
Yeah look into the video showing a certain model fap off Jack which is the extract same as the Daytona from hobo freight and they were charging close to 3x as much
@@Wesleystewart78 you mean the one that was copied by HFT which lead to a lawsuit? 🤣
@@matthewolson9704 Public records show that the jack (s) in question were purchased from an overseas production facility by both Snap-on and Harbor Freight. Neither company copied the other as neither one actually produced or designed it. They were just marketed under two different names brands. Additionally, the lawsuit that Snap-on filed was tried and Snap-on lost.
I wonder how a chain tensioner on a thumb screw would affect the power transfer. Pre tensioning the chain might allow for better transfer especially as things wear and get sloppy.
Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m not sure if that would help. Theoretically one side of the chain will always be under tension ,and since you can’t push a chain, the tension of the other side doesn’t matter. Right?
@@adamhakimji6461 torque lost is impact torque. Any bit of play within the sprocket and chain will lose power. If you put a 1/8” shank in a 1/4” hole, there’s 1/8” of wiggle room that allows something like an impact to wiggle.
Impact guns will cause the sprocket to move in both directions. The slop in the chain then needs to be taken up on the next impact. Reducing this 'bounce' back and forth would improve transfer. These are already hugely inefficient tools in terms of transfer. I don't think the added friction of a tensioner would be worse than the increased mechanical connection from the tighter chain.
@@toyorover1313 agreed that it would keep the chain slap down between impact blows. When using it with hand tools or a cordless ratchet I think it would matter much less. A small Delrin block with a pair of springs behind it would be all you'd need
Thanks guys! I was really tempted to buy a Tite-Reach last year but I bought and Milwaukee M12 extended reach ratchet instead. I'm glad I did! If I do buy one in the future, I'd buy the Mac Tools/Facom one as a KMC chain is very easy to source and replace.
I have the tite-reach ones, both the standard and pro, got them years ago. The pro came in handy changing the plugs on my friend's Ford pickup. I almost never use them to break things loose, if I can fit the tite-reach I can usually fit a breaker to do that. After the initial break, the tite-reach makes it super-easy (barely an inconvenience) to spin the fastener all the way off in hard-to-reach places.
You answered my question. You can use it to start the bolt in hard to reach places plus remove them if you just use just a ratchet after you loosen them with a stronger tool first. I just ordered mine today. Thank you.
Enjoyable video. I had no idea these tools existed. My choice? A long handle ratchet end wrench box end wrench. Unless one has to take out lots of bolts only these things can access every day, they just aren't worth it for the torque one can apply. One might use the hobby one with some sticky grease to hold a bolt for starting in an almost impossible situation, use it to rotate it until snug, then get out the afore mentioned hand ratchet wrench to tighten it up.
I think I might pick up a Snap-On. The shape of the unit looks like the chain makes a straight path from gear to gear resulting in less friction points to rob the torque and prevent a bunch of wear when spinning at higher speeds like when a bold head breaks off. Thanks again for another great video.
The testing I didn’t know I needed but am very happy to have! 😍😍😍
Mac is neat value, snap on is best overall , the other two I would steer clear of.
Just bought the 1/2" Mac yesterday and used it to spin off an input shaft nut on a t870 today then the puller for the pulley. I've had to use a 3/4 gun to spin some of these off so I'm pretty impressed with the transfer. Used a IR 2235ptimax
I designed something like this 20 years ago, but couldn't find anyone to build it.
I have the Mac tools in 1/2, got it on special probably 4? years ago and I've used it maybe 3 or 4 times. I'm a truck and trailer mechanic, for all sizes and engine types. The mac works when I need it for the applications I've needed it to. I don't like Mac tools (I'm a bit of a snap-on fanboy) but I do like the tool.
In all honesty, I thought those extenders used a gear train to transmit power. I wonder how a gear set extender would compare to chain driven one, if they exist out there.
Given the width of the wrench, you'd be looking at 5 or 6 gears, at least. The lash in the gear chain would transmit but a small fraction of the power from an impact wrench. If you're using it with a torque wrench (which applies a lot more smooth, even torque), it'd probably be OK.
Gear train would less efficient and weaker. A chain is capable of engaging multiple teeth at a time. A gear set only full engages 1 tooth.
Chain is fine, it just needs some sort of tensioner
You would have a severe loss of torque with gears.
A worm gear drive would be the best
The other day I saw some UA-cam video on the snap on one , never used it before and was interested in it but instantly thought “ would be cool to see the torque test channel test this tool”
Awesome video as always! As a professional auto tech by trade I find it funny watching the ads for these things. Most ads show these being used in areas that absolutely do not need one of these and in my opinion using one would only make the job harder. That said though I’m sure this is likely the case for advertising because if they were being used where they’re really needed you couldn’t see much.
A lot of years ago there was a similar tool that had a shaft drive, that was strong and didn't suck. The shaft was tubular steel and was attached to a worm gear at one end and a 3/8 drive at the other. the tool was two feet long. It was slow but it got you out of a jam.
I had too much money on the snap on truck one day and saw that apparatus and bought it. I call it my "secret weapon" jokingly mostly.. it's good for a few things though.. good to see it doesn't suck comparatively.
Love this video, but yes, I agree - even without watching - I'd have never wasted money on these - I get a lot more use out of extra long handled ratchet wrenches.
But throw a strong cordless ratchet on one of these and you've got a money maker 👌🏻
Thanks for saving me some coin. I’d been considering picking one of these up for a while, but to answer your question, my choice will be my cordless ratchet. If I just have to have one, I’ll build one myself as these don’t seem to show any advantage on some junk I could cook up with spare parts. I do wonder how a transfer case style chain/sprocket would perform in this application.
Interesting timing. UA-cam recommended a "BEST Tools of SEMA" video this morning and it had a stop at the Tite Reach booth.
I had no idea these existed and now need to purchase one. Would have come in real handy for my last water pump replacement on my tribute. Even if I couldn't use it for final torque, it would have saved a lot of time running the long bolts in.
Always worth a watch. Like the spinup sounds on hand drive. Good sense of humor
That's actually In all of his videos it comes up with the like and subscribe self promo thing
Being a mechanic and based off this video I’d would go with the Mac, but knowing the warranty and knowing a snap on is made better I would definitely go with the snap on one. Thanks for another great video!
I bought the 1/2 Mac. I knew its gonna come with a substantial torque loss and, that chain will break pretty quick for what I planned on using it for (5/8 frame and suspension bolts). The tool has way more torque loss than I expected but, it did not break. My expectations were quite high but my Mac salesman assured me it’ll work. All in all it’s a pretty slick and cost effective tool to substitute a 1/2 electric or pneumatic ratchet if you already own a good impact gun.
I think the point of these are to make hard to reach bolts easier to get in and out not to torque down. That's how i will be using them, time is currency.
This would probably work better with a series of gears rather than a chain and sprockets. Once you take out all the backlash in the gears there is a lot less stretching and lost torque. You could even have some gear reduction by making the output gear slightly larger.
What a great video. I always wondered how good those things are, they would come in handy in my line of work. One thing, I haven’t looked: are there other manufacturers out there that make these things? Maybe some will be geared and not chain driven?? Live confidently and peacefully
I'm a new subscriber after I heard AvE mention you guys. Can't believe I just found this channel
Chains on drill tech drill rig I used to own/operate were made for impacting. Air rotary hammer bits, 25k pound casing driver impacts.
It's mind blowing to me that all of these manufacturers went with a chain as the force transfer medium. There are a lot of variables inherent in the chain to negatively impact the effectiveness. The best way I think this could've been designed would be with gears. It would obviously increase the weight. It would definitely increase the price point on the cheaper ones. However, the more expensive high end tools would likely have a substantial increase of efficiency, and a small negative impact on the manufacturers profit margins or a slight price increase. I personally wouldn't mind paying an extra $20-$30 on a $200+ tool that is substantially more effective at its intended job. Using gears would also allow for better torque by simply optimizing the ratio during the R&D of the tool.
would be interesting to see those 90 degree adapters for impact drivers get this same treatment, great video
Exactly what I was going to say. I have a non-impact-rated DeWalt that hasn't given up the ghost even after some pretty stuck bolts. And it's been an absolute lifesaver for control arm bolts (I don't live in the rust belt, thank goodness)
Would love to see a strictly gear driven version. I imagine the flexibility of the chain kills the torque transfer.
Seems like if you're going to need one of these on a regular basis or not & have the extra money spend the Snap On is the clear tool to have. I may purchase one myself & use it when necessary on my own vehicles just to make the jobs easier.
Was hoping you would include the facom version in your tests, i recently bought the 1/2" version and used it with a 5:1 ratio torque multiplier on some suspension bolts and i would go as far as saying it made very light work of undoing those bolts and worked like a charm, it has a 1-1.7 gear ratio and had no problem holding up to the job in hand, i dont have an impact driver to test it with though.
The Facom is the Mac, same design and both owned by Stanley Black and Decker. Both have the gear ratio advantage inside
Impact guns amplify torque by reciprocating back and forth. When you put a chain drive between the driver and the fastener, that soaks up the vibration and very little makes it to the socket and the fastener.
I have both the Macs and still didn’t think they would go as high as you had them. Great video Now I know
Impeccable timing, I was just thinking about buying the Mac version of one of these yesterday!
I was trying to get the crank pulley bolt out of a 16yo Subaru. There wasn't room in front to put an impact on, without removing the radiator and AC condenser; I struggled with it by hand for over an hour and got nowhere. A mechanic buddy loaned me a ridiculous nuclear-powered SnapOn impact (rated I have no idea, but a LOT) and the MAC tight-reach tested here. I drove home, and ten minutes later I was back at his shop, handing him his tools, with the crank bolt in my pocket.
@@johncoops6897 Breaker bar with a pipe on it wouldn't break it loose. I suppose I could have found a longer pipe.
@@johncoops6897 Well if you're so freakin' smart, why didn't you tell me this in July??? 😂 I understand exactly what you're saying, and yes, that very well might have worked. I did try hitting the breaker bar with a hammer, but it wasn't particularly effective, and definitely didn't deliver the kind of direct shock & vibration the bolt needed. Thanks for the tip - TIL.
sell a lot of the mac ones and I only fixed one in all the time we have been selling them. hard to get but work and hold up well. mac has a bogo on them also once or twice a year and sells all 3 drives also
When do they tend to run their bogo? Any particular holiday or time of year?
@@meme5887 last time was early 2021. they just came back into stock so maybe first qtr 2022??
I had the tight reach back in the day when they were blue and realized how useful they were on certain areas of a Peterbilt where you could get a ratchet but not turn it. This was until they broke. Then I saw the Mac ones in 3/8” and 1/2”. If I had known Snap-on made them I would have bought them instead. They really are an invaluable tool that can save time and your hands. I need to see if either Mac or Snap-on make a 1/4 drive now. Those were handy too.
Mac does M9EPSW
I think this sort of extender is meant to be used with a long leverage bar/extender. I think it can transfer the force of that not really a vibrating action you get from an impact wrench.
You know, this actually seems like something you could make a better version of without an insane amount of work.
Enclosed body made from squaretube like the snapon, using hefty shafts on good bearings, and off-the-shelf motorcycle parts. Even standard 525 chain is rated for 9220lbs tensile strength, almost 4x the snapon's chain rating.
If you wanted to go even further, you could have custom sintered sprockets made with a beefier profile for maximum engagement and minimum drivetrain lash.
Bearings, that's the first thing I thought. That simple Snap-On with some good bearings would be really nice.
“You could make this without an insane amount of work” he says. Then follows that up with “custom sintered sprockets”.
@@alphazuluz Here, you dropped this: "If you wanted to go even further"
If anyone ever cleans/rebuilds these I'd recommend chain wax instead of traditional chain oil/lube. The wax will stick on the chain rather than get flung off or drip off and eventually leak out.
There should be a shaft drive with bevel gears version that multiplies torque at the fastener end
I am a bicycle mechanic amd kmc is probably by far the best chains. We mainly use it with the e bikes.
Sometimes the old saying is correct . You get what you pay for. I enjoy cheaper options especially if they work well and have a warranty, like some Pittsburgh stuff. But anything I've bought from Snap on has been top quality with no issues. They still set the standard for hand tools imo. As shown here sometimes it makes sense to just buy the best one first . Might pick up the snap on tite reach soon as it looks really handy for bolts between frame rails and for places you cant swing a ratchet .
You guys got a nice mention from AvE! He seems to approve of your channel! High praise, to be sure
Tight Reach I think is good for that one bolt you can break loose with an wrench or ratchet but will spend too long getting it out with one of them like if you only get a “click” of clearance. But really only for the home user.
I've got the Mac pair, seem ok. It's output is like 1/5 of the gun. I use them when doing rack & pinion swaps. Blue Point used to make one, it was handy to use during radiator swaps. I wore that one out. Now I just grab my flex head impact.
I own the titereach... in practice it works okay. The snapon would be my choice if I was to buy today. That warranty is worth it
AvE gave you a little shout-out while looking to get into a little torque testing again 👍
I have had the tite reach version for a couple of years now...granted I don't use impacts on them, I do like them very much. They are great for those once in awhile hard to get at fasteners
The snap-on looks nicest, but at that price, I’ll never own it. The Facom, sorry, Mac one, is more in my price range and also more easily available to me, shame about the warranty though. Hummed and hahhhed over getting one, but this test for science has proven they are capable of withstanding and producing torque (though reduced). Thank you as always, and great to see you all mentioned by AvE, you’ve entered a certain circle (no pun intended), and vouched for, welcome to the family 😂.
I have the snap on unit. That little thing has been impressive the few times I've needed.
For those of you who are profession wrench throwers, using the DIY model for blower fans, air door actuators, and other general interior hvac or similar tiny size screws.
Wow 35 ft/lbs when I was younger I would have broken that so many times and would probably still unintentionally break that thing using a 3/8" ratchet maybe even a 1/4". Thanks for saving me some money because they looked plausibly useful.
To test the max torque I would get a very long breaker bar, position the extender tool a few degrees to one side of vertical, and put the breaker bar 90 degrees to the opposite side so the leverage is over center. Then apply force downward on it with everything you've got and see where or if it fails. I'd say it's pretty safe bet the Snap On with all steel construction and heavier chain will take the most strain. As far as transmitting power from the impact gun, that is inherently limited by the vibration of all the mechanical clearances in the tool vibrating.
Finished watching the video - all of these 'tools' are going to be hard passes. Thanks for the review.
I think that in order to get full torque transfer the extender casing must be rigidly connected to the gearcase of the impact driver. Clearly any rotation allowed between the cases reduces power though the chain, and is impossible to stop by hand. Even more torque is lost by the same effect on the fastener end, the torque again will be spent on the path of least resistance which is definitely moving the tool before one can react to prevent it. (of course as offered there is no provision on either product to connect them together, but no doubt if it was made part of the drivers case, and the extender end rigidly supported on the workpeice, much more impressive performance would be gained. I enjoyed your video and knowledge gained from it.
I have the Mac one and it's awesome. Bailed us out here at the bus garage.
I would use Super Lube in the MAC & call it good .
Most performance for the money & serviceable too .
I've had the plastic one for some time, great tool for tight spots to make fast work on >12mm bolts or crack loose larger bolts off the old way then take them off with a battery powered impact. My only issue was that it's build to large for what's inside, so i designed myself a new casing making it 2/3 as thick and about 20% smaller head. Now it's got far less slop, making the use of a hand wrench easier and far better for even tighter spots ;-)
Incorrect usage of math signs; you mean
@@Vicus_of_Utrecht I meant "smaller than 12mm"
@@MrHeHim
Yes I understood, but you had to be corrected.
To transfer it would need gears instead of chains. Absorbing gear to start with on the impact end transferring gear following that which actually impacts instead of just trying to pull with a pulling force it needs a driving force delivered as well. To be able to transfer the energy of the impact directly through the tool to the object..
A fantastic comparison. Thank you very much for saving me some money. I will be going with the Snap On in the near future.
Would be cool to see these tested with a breaker bar!
Yes yes I absolutely agree that first one is definitely not torque capable and if you weigh more than a hundred pounds I do not suggest you purchase this item ever hopefully around to two will be better as 200 ft lb would be acceptable for light duty.
Glad to see this
Wasn't impressed with any of them
I can find other ways to get in there and get that fastener
May hurt but I'll get it
Would love to see you test some of the right angle non impact ratchets, specifically the newest Milwaukee 1/2
They've already said the don't have a good way to test those....
I'd like to see one of those made with the car timing chain types that have 4-5 side plates per link. And some UHMW tensioning plates either side to take the slack out, as I guess that's where most of the torque disappears to.
As always a very informative and detailed video, thank you for this as i am considering buying the snap on one.
Love the video u guys always do a great job. I wouldn't waste money on amy of them.... I would think a redesign is in order with some pinion gears and a shaft could get u much closer to real torque transfer.
I wish you would have opened them up before and after and compare the wear on them. Great video
4:18 ...why ya gotta remind me like that...😂
How'd you read my mind, interesting video! I bought xc4.0 from your link, love it, thanks!
Great idea! Make a better more compact version! Same principle as a rear axle, minus center differential and have them at either end!
dude this is the video i needed thank you!
I didn’t even know these existed till this video.
My life could’ve been so much easier this whole time..
Just finished using one while swapping headers and pulleys, it was soooooo much easier.
I can’t believe I actually worked on a car without an extension lmao.
You did a great job with these test. Thank you.
wow always thought those were a gimick but they kinda actually bring the frijoles. very nice work!.
We have the MAC versions at work and using 1/2 inch guns being fed 175 PSI through 1/2 inch lines and 3/8 fittings, they blow out the the sides of the housing with almost concerning regularity.
Motorcycle chain designs use a composite material as a chain guide and buffer material.
If Mac tools adopted a similar approach to it's internal mechanism, and the end user kept it lubricated, having an aluminum body wouldn't be such an issue.
I would choose the snap-on based on result and the fact it has a good warranty.
This is interesting to me because I had never heard of this tool before and independently a few months back made a rough drawing for one of these after getting annoyed at the limitations of a right angle bit
Since craftsman went to China, snap on been my go to now
"Hand tool driven action Which coincidently what I refer to my early 20's as a period of."
Awkward teen humor never gets old.
Lmao
I had to scroll through the comments to make sure nobody failed to mention this gem
Interesting and helpful video, I’ve seen these things online and was curious to see how much they’d Rob from an impact wrench. Kind of a bummer was hoping something like this would allow me to use my big plug in el-cheapo impact in tighter confines where my 3/8s one doesn’t have enough power. By the time a home gamer like me looks at one of those tool truck tite wrenches it’s cheaper to buy that Milwaukee 3/8s.
These extenders I've seen and always Wondered how they would work. What comes to mind is the top mount bolts for airbags on bulker super b trailers. Cant even see them let alone fit a wrench. The best way usually is to snap the studs out but you can't even fit a stubby impact.
If the drive side sprocket is larger that's actually a mechanical disadvantage (reducing torque but increasing speed). This actually matches the Mac website stating "Optimized gear ratio designed to reduce fastener removal time". Kind of strange, in my opinion you need more torque than speed to remove fastener.
Hello again Torque Test Channel
Thank you for another Great Video.
Great video. I just saw a FB add for a cheap knockoff and thought I'd research, found the tite-reach and then this video. Mac for the win.