USA can support a 40-team league. Split into two tiers: MLS Premier and MLS 2 East expansion: Milwaukee, Detroit, Pittsburgh, Tampa, Louisville West expansion: Phoenix, Las Vegas, Albuquerque, San Antonio, Calgary Honorable mentions: El Paso & Sacramento
That's not what we do. Our Major League sports are 30 to 32 teams. The whole MLS1 and MLS2 40-team scenario is the WORST of both worlds. Not an "open" system, and all the negatives of "Relegation". Awful idea.
I mostly agree but Calgary wouldn't happen because travel times are already long enough in MLS, and Milwaukee is too close to Chicago In the West I'd like to see Vegas, Phoenix, OKC, Albuquerque, and San Antonio In the East I'd like to see Indy, Detroit, NOLA, Tampa, and Louisville (though the region around Louisville would be pretty saturated already) I also think MLS could have 40 clubs without pro rel. People act like pro rel is essential but there's a snowball's chance in hell MLS would ever do it
MLS will probaly force this on the American public: Western Conference Northwest - Vancouver, Seattle, Portland, San Jose Pacific - San Diego, LAFC, LA Galaxy, Las Vegas Southwest - Houston, Austin, Colorado, Salt Lake Midwest - Minnesota, Saint Louis, Kansas City, Dallas East Southeast - Miami, Oralndo, Atlanta, Nashville Atlantic - NY Red Bulls, NYCFC, DC United, Charlotte Northeast - Philadelphia, Toronto, Montreal, New England Central - Chicago, Columbus, Cincinnati, Indianapolis
I hear some people saying "bring promotion and relegation". The popularity and passion of the game in the us isnt at the level that europe is at; the us cant afford that. Now considering how the us has a higher population than most countries, the us can afford a abnormally higher major league team count. It still should all be major league though, because minor leagues have significantly less support when we need more support to grow the sport in america. A 36 team system is abnormally large to european standards, but the US can support this with its large population. Divide the league into 2 divisions of 18. Play everyone in your division twice. 34 games. There wouldnt even be a problem with rivalry because, like i said, the passion isnt on the same level as europe. And this would cut travel as well. Edit: i'll even add on to this by adding what i think the 6 expansion cities should be. Las Vegas, Phoenix, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, Richmond, and Buffalo.
I could see MLS as two 20 team leagues - East and West. Each plays a balanced schedule within their league and a playoff between the leagues determiners a champion - similar to what baseball used to be with American and National leagues.
The Midwest market is the most alluring regional market in the MLS due to geographic proximity. Chicago, Nashville, Cbus, Cincy make a great core. Detroit, Indy, and Pittsburgh are coming. Love that those clubs feel like MLS should be courting them and not the other way around. Hope they stay defiant and negotiate favorable terms for their cities and fans. MLS biggest competitive advantage is the average ticket price is sooo much less then the NFL and NBA and MLB. Fans can actually come to games.
Charlie’s idea of “growing the game” is championing MLS monopolizing football by piggybacking on USL’s years of market-building and stunting the rest of the league pyramid and pro/rel potential as a result.
Pro/Rel could work in this country. If Forward Madison could win promotion up the leagues to the top that would be awesome! As it stands now MLS teams can’t spend and some won’t spend, and it doesn’t matter. If pro rel was a thing teams would find ways to get the best players here not post prime but in their prime. Imagine an MLS team with a mix of prime European, African, Asian and American (all of America not just USA) the MLS would be the best.
Indy has wanted an MLS team for a long long time. They would sell... Indianapolis Indians are top 5 in triple A average attendance... An MLS team would do well no question... Also indy has a bigger population than Vegas and many of the places that already have MLS teams like Cinci, Charlotte, ect ect...
Even if there’s not an MLS 1 & 2 you could just have separate MLS East and West. Champions of each league play for the championship. You could also do 3 conferences, East, West, and Central with 13 teams each (maybe one has 14 if there’s 40 teams). Ideally I do like MLS 1 & 2 but I doubt owners would want to be in a second division even if it is MLS branded.
First of he's not submitting an MLS bid, he's trying to gather a group of investors together. Second, it doesn't include Indy Eleven. MLS doesn't want Eleven's ownership because he's not a billionaire.
Because fans like nice things. And it's the only thing they need to join MLS. Also, stadium size is the only thing holding USL from becoming D1 in general.
lol promotion and relegation will never work in USA. People do not watch minor leagues or anything that isn’t the best. People watch college sports but that is different and still considered elite. It’s called D1 which is top tear college sport.
People don't watch lower divisions because they can't go up, so there's no reason to be invested. If you ask a baseball fan if their local minor league baseball team could be promoted they would 100% follow them more. And people watch college sports because it's the most local connection and may be the highest tier* of sport their city has.
@@bradenhazle4378 Oh gawd. Yeah, MLB needs "relegation" LOL. We love College Football and Basketball as is, no "relegation" needed to create interest. The question SHOULD BE why don't people support College Soccer? The toxic Soccer snobs actually mock College Soccer.
Is that why Cincinnati averaged over 20k for a D3 team? Indy gets 9k, Louisville, New Mexico and Sacramento get 10k. The USL would be huge right now if MLS hadn't poached several of their teams.
@@davidt3956 Austin Bold --> Austin FC... Nashville FC --> Nashville SC... Saint Louis fc? --> St Louis City... Miami Fc? --> Inter Miami.... Get the picture?
@@davidt3956 Or... Seattle Sounders, FC Cincinnati, Portland Timbers, Orlando City, Vancouver Whitecaps, et al...all in MLS now, up from lower leagues.
@@davidday2373 While others have been put out of business. However, you're point is also part of the proof of monopoly. They find competitive markets and then either buy the teams or put them out of business. Another example is how it controlled the USSF. The national federation should have demoted them if they chose not to fully participate in the Open Cup. Because of MLS's power, they forced the USSF into submission.
@@isaacgogna9856 It's true. The team stinks, the stadium they play at now stinks. Why put all the money into a usl team when win lose or draw the turnout and infrastructure for an MLS team would be better.
USA can support a 40-team league. Split into two tiers: MLS Premier and MLS 2
East expansion: Milwaukee, Detroit, Pittsburgh, Tampa, Louisville
West expansion: Phoenix, Las Vegas, Albuquerque, San Antonio, Calgary
Honorable mentions: El Paso & Sacramento
That's not what we do. Our Major League sports are 30 to 32 teams. The whole MLS1 and MLS2 40-team scenario is the WORST of both worlds. Not an "open" system, and all the negatives of "Relegation". Awful idea.
I mostly agree but Calgary wouldn't happen because travel times are already long enough in MLS, and Milwaukee is too close to Chicago
In the West I'd like to see Vegas, Phoenix, OKC, Albuquerque, and San Antonio
In the East I'd like to see Indy, Detroit, NOLA, Tampa, and Louisville (though the region around Louisville would be pretty saturated already)
I also think MLS could have 40 clubs without pro rel. People act like pro rel is essential but there's a snowball's chance in hell MLS would ever do it
There will never be an open system in America.
@davidday2373
MLS Premier and MLS Championship...
MLS will probaly force this on the American public:
Western Conference
Northwest - Vancouver, Seattle, Portland, San Jose
Pacific - San Diego, LAFC, LA Galaxy, Las Vegas
Southwest - Houston, Austin, Colorado, Salt Lake
Midwest - Minnesota, Saint Louis, Kansas City, Dallas
East
Southeast - Miami, Oralndo, Atlanta, Nashville
Atlantic - NY Red Bulls, NYCFC, DC United, Charlotte
Northeast - Philadelphia, Toronto, Montreal, New England
Central - Chicago, Columbus, Cincinnati, Indianapolis
That look about right
I hear some people saying "bring promotion and relegation". The popularity and passion of the game in the us isnt at the level that europe is at; the us cant afford that. Now considering how the us has a higher population than most countries, the us can afford a abnormally higher major league team count. It still should all be major league though, because minor leagues have significantly less support when we need more support to grow the sport in america. A 36 team system is abnormally large to european standards, but the US can support this with its large population. Divide the league into 2 divisions of 18. Play everyone in your division twice. 34 games. There wouldnt even be a problem with rivalry because, like i said, the passion isnt on the same level as europe. And this would cut travel as well.
Edit: i'll even add on to this by adding what i think the 6 expansion cities should be. Las Vegas, Phoenix, Tampa Bay, Indianapolis, Richmond, and Buffalo.
Bring back Hollywood Heath Pearce!!!
I could see MLS as two 20 team leagues - East and West. Each plays a balanced schedule within their league and a playoff between the leagues determiners a champion - similar to what baseball used to be with American and National leagues.
The Midwest market is the most alluring regional market in the MLS due to geographic proximity. Chicago, Nashville, Cbus, Cincy make a great core. Detroit, Indy, and Pittsburgh are coming. Love that those clubs feel like MLS should be courting them and not the other way around. Hope they stay defiant and negotiate favorable terms for their cities and fans.
MLS biggest competitive advantage is the average ticket price is sooo much less then the NFL and NBA and MLB. Fans can actually come to games.
Charlie’s idea of “growing the game” is championing MLS monopolizing football by piggybacking on USL’s years of market-building and stunting the rest of the league pyramid and pro/rel potential as a result.
Pro/Rel could work in this country. If Forward Madison could win promotion up the leagues to the top that would be awesome! As it stands now MLS teams can’t spend and some won’t spend, and it doesn’t matter. If pro rel was a thing teams would find ways to get the best players here not post prime but in their prime.
Imagine an MLS team with a mix of prime European, African, Asian and American (all of America not just USA) the MLS would be the best.
Sacramento is going to get that 31 MLS Expansion spot
I would prefer us to call off ourselves Indianapolis Broncos, or come up with another horse thing.
INDIANAPOLIS MENTIONED IN FOOTBALL!!!!! WTF IS A HOOSIER?!?!????
Indy has wanted an MLS team for a long long time. They would sell... Indianapolis Indians are top 5 in triple A average attendance... An MLS team would do well no question... Also indy has a bigger population than Vegas and many of the places that already have MLS teams like Cinci, Charlotte, ect ect...
Indy Eleven had 3rd highest average attendance in 2023 as well, they would most definitely sell.
Indy loves sports
You don't realize that Indy is 1/4 Hispanic.
Im so done with MLS. Us Open Cup issue was the final nail in the coffin.
Hope USL can begin an open system. These guys just bootlick MLS
Buzz off.
USL has refused any Pro/Rel.. Your dream is dead on arrival
@@davidday2373stop meat riding everything about pro-MLS in every video bro holy why are you everywhere defending Garber like you’re being paid 😂
Even if there’s not an MLS 1 & 2 you could just have separate MLS East and West. Champions of each league play for the championship. You could also do 3 conferences, East, West, and Central with 13 teams each (maybe one has 14 if there’s 40 teams). Ideally I do like MLS 1 & 2 but I doubt owners would want to be in a second division even if it is MLS branded.
Indy Eleven first has to win one championship
Did Cincinnati win a championship?
Who's paying $500 million to put a team in Indianapolis? Why screw over the team tat's already trying to build a new stadium?
The owner of Sweetwater Sound and his business group. They guy is a billionaire.
Detroit is another large market without a team
Why wouldn't Indy Eleven be the team that joins MLS? The mayor is submitting an MLS bid, but does that mean it wouldn't be Indy Eleven?
First of he's not submitting an MLS bid, he's trying to gather a group of investors together.
Second, it doesn't include Indy Eleven. MLS doesn't want Eleven's ownership because he's not a billionaire.
@@FAITHandLOGIC FC Cincinnati moved up, Orlando City did too, were they owned by billionaires at the time?
Keystone couldn’t hold up their end in the stadium deal.
pro/rel is not good for soccer...it doesn't really even work for other leagues...
I am so tired of MLS.
MLS may need pro/rel if they get too big.
Why spend so much on a USL team stadium? LOL
Because fans like nice things. And it's the only thing they need to join MLS. Also, stadium size is the only thing holding USL from becoming D1 in general.
@@bradenhazle4378Not entirely true. D1 classification also requires the ownership to be worth a certain amount of money.
@@FAITHandLOGIC Yes....and USLC teams have that. Like I said the only requirement holding them back is stadium size.
lol promotion and relegation will never work in USA. People do not watch minor leagues or anything that isn’t the best. People watch college sports but that is different and still considered elite. It’s called D1 which is top tear college sport.
People don't watch lower divisions because they can't go up, so there's no reason to be invested. If you ask a baseball fan if their local minor league baseball team could be promoted they would 100% follow them more. And people watch college sports because it's the most local connection and may be the highest tier* of sport their city has.
College sports elite? Lol
Plus, its Soccer. We just barely getting US sports fans into the sport. To add some weird "relegation" thing would hamper MLS's and Soccer's growth.
@@bradenhazle4378 Oh gawd. Yeah, MLB needs "relegation" LOL. We love College Football and Basketball as is, no "relegation" needed to create interest. The question SHOULD BE why don't people support College Soccer? The toxic Soccer snobs actually mock College Soccer.
Is that why Cincinnati averaged over 20k for a D3 team?
Indy gets 9k, Louisville, New Mexico and Sacramento get 10k.
The USL would be huge right now if MLS hadn't poached several of their teams.
If there was pro-rel, it would solve this problem, but the MLS works hard to abuse their monopoly power.
You're clueless.
@@davidday2373 Brilliant retort, full of a point by point counter argument. Oh, puppy, give it another try.
@@davidt3956 Austin Bold --> Austin FC... Nashville FC --> Nashville SC... Saint Louis fc? --> St Louis City... Miami Fc? --> Inter Miami.... Get the picture?
@@davidt3956 Or... Seattle Sounders, FC Cincinnati, Portland Timbers, Orlando City, Vancouver Whitecaps, et al...all in MLS now, up from lower leagues.
@@davidday2373 While others have been put out of business. However, you're point is also part of the proof of monopoly. They find competitive markets and then either buy the teams or put them out of business.
Another example is how it controlled the USSF. The national federation should have demoted them if they chose not to fully participate in the Open Cup. Because of MLS's power, they forced the USSF into submission.
We need one because Indy Eleven Suck and you might as well scrap them and make an MLS team.
Smallest iq take I’ve ever heard
@@CoreyYoungbloodSays the guy who just made stuff up in that little hollow coccnut of his 😂.
I disliked this comment
@@isaacgogna9856 It's true. The team stinks, the stadium they play at now stinks. Why put all the money into a usl team when win lose or draw the turnout and infrastructure for an MLS team would be better.
Didn't they win the USL championship in 2023??